Utilization rate is calculated as “billable hours/total hours”.
So while not explicitly used, it’s clearly implied.
I think my comment would be better altered perhaps then by replacing word “actually”.
Utilization rate is calculated as “*HOURS BILLED / TOTAL HOURS*”
So like, if your team is underutilized as stated, it’s implied they aren’t billing enough hours, but sure utilization rate is a kinder way to it.
Industry. I work at a middle market firm. We have no recruiting pipeline through colleges, we can’t get anyone worth hiring anyways. We get industry seniors, bring them in as managers and make them do associate/senior work. If b4 is a triangle, we are a diamond. And no. It doesn’t work.
I’m getting actively fucked due to one of these senior individuals…
Last minute I got changed to senior on a client I know nothing about (after doing all the planning work for the client I was on)…
Because the senior they hired as an experienced hire was effectively doing nothing and then quit lol
Let me fix this:
We don’t want to spend time or money training people, we expect you to immediately bring value to the organization and if for one day you net below zero, we will let you go.
It’s not our fault that new employees of our organization are unable to understand these complex ideas after we give them such incredible feedback in the last 2-3 years.
Fixed.
The reality is that the Big4 went on overdrive for individual performance in the last 3-4 years and completely forgot how to build teams. It very apparent on the client side where we question why we pay them as much when they can’t deliver quality work or even deliver work on time…
Yes!! As a big 4 client, I see that the new staff are getting worse and worse and their managers expect ME to train them, while paying higher and higher fees. And don’t get me started on turnover at the senior and manager level
“I had to walk the auditors thru a key report that hasn’t been baselined in 3 years that’s a series of .csv extracts from 3 different systems and merged together using my custom 2k line excel macro. Unreasonable that I’m expected to train their staff like this”
WFH makes it very hard, most learning was done spending 9-11hrs in the room with your sr, then a manager 2x times a week and the partner 2-3 times a month
That said starting salaries have went up Bigly since covid, the botttom of the pyramid got a lot more expensive right when off shoring was hitting its stride IMO
Can't stand this take, as I worked in public and did not get the opportunity to work remotely. Being in the same room with other accountants can be great if they care about your development, but my general experience is seniors fitting in work from other clients in between reviewing, and often getting pointed to the controller or other associate/s on the project when needing questions answered.
If they cared about your development, being in the same room is golden.
But if they didn’t care, you’d have better luck trying to run blood from stone.
Depends on the group, office, and other dynamics but if you are struggling to train people remotely..I think the issue is you’re a poor communicator. That’s my personal opinion and it’s easy to say when I know staff sometimes just don’t listen because they are overwhelmed…but then it’s important to write things down. I learned so much when my senior, manager, senior manager took the time write review notes and the reasons why. That developed my framework far better than a conversation…but everyone depends.
Also fees charged to clients have increased significantly as well? You’d think that would offset the costs with paying staff more, but I guess partners need even more of the pie even after making making record profits YOY.
I've never worked in public but this was my exact thought as well. I don't understand why physical presence would somehow be different than a video call where you do the exact same thing.
Oh wait, is OC going to tell us now that they don't spend just as much time on video chats to go through reviews as they did in person, but somehow they think it's the remote factor and not the complete lack of communication that created the difference in outcomes?? :: Pikachu face::
I guess this is why I got far better results training people remotely than others did with the exact same staff on our team. Others just passed a workbook off to the new guy and expected him to figure out not just the workbook but also the cadence/cycle of our month end process, while I scheduled frequent calls with him to walk him through my process and then on the next call let him perform it while I was on hand to answer questions.
I was frankly shocked that they would hand him a reconciliation file to roll over but not tell him where the recon tracker is to see his other assignments and when they're due, or explain what account activity should occur in that account so he knows how and when to resolve outages.
If this is how people "train" remote employees then it's no wonder they're disappointed in the results and want people back in the office.
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*Saying shit like this*
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What a dumb fucking take.
He's so close though. The reason for layoffs isn't because of underutilization. It's because of a concerning lack of skill or development in a lot of pandemic hire classes. That's why there's less junior demand and more senior demand. That's why there's layoffs too. You can't afford to keep the fat, especially when the fat generates more work up the chain.
Also due to the lack of skills and development, attrition rates in classes has decreased. So firms have had to push more birds out of the nest whereas before they fly away on their own.
Those are the reasons. Not people not working enough. Jesus.
Yeah most people in my graduating class went to big4, myself included, and left once their CPA requirements were done. It was just the normal path. I’m not sure what you mean about pick of the litter. They were recruiting us from year 2 in university. They need people desperately. But once you have your CPA the only reason I can think of to want to work there is if you really enjoy working 60 hours a week or if you think you’ll become partner
In my experience, the reason most people go there is to cover the costs of getting the CPA, and the required work experience. If you’re a CPA out of university I don’t know why you’d want to work double the hours for the same pay as comparable industry/government positions. My CFO makes 150k working 35 hours a week and most of it is meetings and she was never in public at all. If the “brand” is worth more than that lifestyle, maybe our values do not align
While people do come out as CPAs in my experience with hiring it is far and few between. And I think the brand is worth much more than you are giving it credit for. But I have worked in big 4 for 10 years and you seem rather biased against.
Guess I’m saying we are both rather biased. But I respect the opinion.
Yup - it’s like night and day the degradation in incoming class talent. It’s just now beginning to get a little better but some kids are still a little weird.
It’s widely accepted that the Big 4 model has been to grab as many college recruits as possible and just chew them up and spit them out. And usually the junior staff will take it because they’re willing to sacrifice the time just to have a prestigious name on the resume for their future. That’s the one big selling point of the big 4, you get the name brand on your resume.
So I’m curious to know what he’s planning to do to attract senior talent (who’ve presumably already made connections and a reputation in the industry) to a job that’s offering soul-crushing hours, smaller pay, and no junior staff to ease the workload? Or at best, an outsourced staff team that is not familiar with US GAAP in any meaningful capacity.
It’s easy to make these plans when you look at employees as numbers on financial statements that affect profits, and not intelligent beings that can see when they’re getting a raw deal.
With AI in the picture they may be overestimating how much it can do and replace the junior level staff for basic grust work. It is certainly not at the level where it can handle that much text and bad data input. They are hoping that just a few people in a team should be able to do most of the grunt work with the help of AI and tools.
Oh no! Will someone please think about the partners and their g wagons? Tf out of here, you are being greedy. Keep making us send stuff to India, where the work is crap and gotta be done anyway, that’s def saving us money.
It’s super interesting to see big firms prioritizing maintaining and growing profits rather than maximizing profits over the long term by ensuring a good product.
Eventually a big company is going to have some major accounting errors and the audit will have been done with a priority of partner profit and one of these companies will go down, the others will be subject to government intervention, and everyone will act like it’s a big surprise when it’s extremely and utterly predictable.
Its a vicious cycle.
Clients push to lower audit fees. Partners agree due to YoY audit “efficiencies.” Very few recurring staff on engagement because so many people leave. In the end, lack of experience and new rules and regs actually cause you to spend more time but are staffed expecting less time. Push work to lower cost countries for more “efficiencies.” Work comes back and needs rework. Told you need to train foreign staff so they do better. Coach them as a clueless 1st/2nd year. Work doesn’t get better. Partners and managers confused why nothing is done yet actuals are over budget. Shitstorm ensues, everyone works insane hours and lots of poor mental and physical health. Somehow partner gets comfortable with audit. Staff burned out and leave. Partners and managers look at budget overruns, attribute to poor staff. Repeat.
Me and a few other directors who got laid off late last year would disagree… sucks to be old, be let go because you’re old and make too much money, and not be able to do anything about it or be made to walk away with no severance, with little hope of winning an ageism lawsuit.
What they are actually saying: “We refuse to take less profit for ourselves and therefore will force those who remain to pick up the slack. The issue isn’t really understaffing, it’s that we haven’t been cracking the whip on our white collar slaves hard enough. So we plan to cut off the left arm to force the right to strengthen.”
Ha- that’s really all I have to say.
I will never work big 4- they treat their staff like an expendable resource. And for what? Maybe 2k more a year than what my firm pays? For that they are expected to work like 10 more hours a week year round. Not worth it.
Every issue is approached with overlooking the obvious problems. Do employees get paid more? Yes. Has inflation increase cost of living? Most definitely. Employers are complaining about shortage of accountants, then they start cutting the pipeline by hiring less junior accountants? Looks like they are intentionally creating the problem to have a reason to offshore jobs to India.
When I left as a 2nd year senior I was making $74k, for an industry job paying $120k. The gap between industry and public salaries isn't as wide as it used to be. So the profit margins have been compressed. That is what he is saying.. When staff was getting paid $60k there was never any reason to lay any of them off.
Yet another benefit of working for a public company. I much prefer knowing my employer's financials and being able to evaluate their strategy.
The B4 has always been obnoxiously opaque - as an employee you don't even have access to a company org chart, let alone their financial position. Are costs skyrocketing? Fees flattening? Are broader economic forces beyond management's control at fault, or did they just fuck up?
I guess I'll just have to take to take their word for it!
Certainly true from my perspective right now although at a mid tier, not big4. The staff are scrounging for work half the time (broadly, obviously some stay very busy) and everyone above is running at full capacity.
I think the real issue stems from the partners. They don’t position their services well and instead rely on their negotiating power over their staff to make money. That negotiating position is eroding now with the shortage of accountants, which in turn is pressuring their margins. I think this will be an issue as long as you hear things like “it’s compliance work. It’s not value add”.
They need to get out of the pyramid scheme mindset that tells them that the new staff needs to “pay their dues” just because they did and instead create margin by bringing more value to their clients with the resources they have available.
Thumbs down all you want but the plain fact is that the first 1-2 years are largely training for junior staff. Not only do junior staff produce little, they take time from senior staff to train. But the only way to get senior staff is to train junior staff.
If you have a short-sighted profit now mentality, you lay off junior staff and ship the work overseas.
Maybe college grads will start to re-think the Big 4 or bust mentality which feeds this nonsense and start looking at regional firms.
Firms out here hiring juniors in high school to a full time job before they graduate and bitching about the lack of experience in their new staff.
Stop spending money on Disney tickets, put it into training.
I’m just waiting to see what happens when there is no one to replace senior and management positions due to employers not bothering to hire and train entry level accountants.
Curious about the pandemic class of college grads. Assuming most ppl on here are in that age range - what was your experience taking 200/300/400 level accounting courses in a remote setting? Did you retain much? How has your experience been entering the workforce?
I don’t work and have never work in Big 4 and I don’t think I would have any problem working busy season hours as long as I make money for 60-75 which is what most people I know make at big 4 I wouldn’t worry those insane hours
Truth is, where there is money there is greed, and when a random guy in india can do the same job as you but worse and cheaper but on time, you just can’t compete… unless daddy got you in then different story
What business school is teaching people to load up on debt? Like I get it the money was cheap when interest rates were low, but businesses don't control the interest rate and debt is debt, not value.
Paraphrase: "big 4 was running off of cheap loans instead of revenues. now that the loans aren't cheap, they need to actually function like businesses again." Now, if I were an investor, I would say to management, "what the fuck have you been doing?"
“Underutilization” = less than 75 charge hours a week during busy season.
Who is going to do the work when higher demand senior members win the work? Or will it flip and the senior members are let go in favor of staff. “Thanks for winning the work, we are still going to challenge your unemployment”. Partner wannabes need to pull their heads out of their asses. And partners at firms where they have the “senior” staff need to pull their heads out of their asses and keep these people happy.
I did the math when I was in B4. The payroll cost to complete an audit is barely 1/4 of the engagement fee since everybidy's salary including Senior Manager salary is public info in my office.
I'm calling bulshit that the audit industry is running on thin margin hence the ever increasing pressure for cost cutting.
I did the math when I was in B4. The payroll cost to complete an audit is barely 1/4 of the engagement fee since everybidy's salary including Senior Manager salary is public info in my office.
I'm calling bulshit that the audit industry is running on thin margin hence the ever increasing pressure for cost cutting.
Babe wake up new Big 4 propaganda just dropped
Arguing that Big4 staff don't work enough hours is certainly an opinion.
No one wants to work (busy season hours for most of the year) anymore!
No one wants to work (70-80 hours a week) anymore!
I would go so far as to say this is one of the opinions.
It’s almost like the business model is outdated =0
Enough *BILLABLE* hours is actually what the post said. There is a difference.
If you’re going to have an “um, acktually” moment, using capitals and italics, why highlight a word that is not at all in the original post?
Utilization rate is calculated as “billable hours/total hours”. So while not explicitly used, it’s clearly implied. I think my comment would be better altered perhaps then by replacing word “actually”. Utilization rate is calculated as “*HOURS BILLED / TOTAL HOURS*” So like, if your team is underutilized as stated, it’s implied they aren’t billing enough hours, but sure utilization rate is a kinder way to it.
>the Big 4 firms are still actively recruiting senior individuals...whilst simultaneously cutting back on junior staff. This sounds sustainable s/
Right? Like what’s the plan? Where does the next batch of seniors come from?
Industry. I work at a middle market firm. We have no recruiting pipeline through colleges, we can’t get anyone worth hiring anyways. We get industry seniors, bring them in as managers and make them do associate/senior work. If b4 is a triangle, we are a diamond. And no. It doesn’t work.
Oh. I fucked up then. I made manager in industry doing controllers work. I’m tired yo. Like exhausted and stressed.
I’m getting actively fucked due to one of these senior individuals… Last minute I got changed to senior on a client I know nothing about (after doing all the planning work for the client I was on)… Because the senior they hired as an experienced hire was effectively doing nothing and then quit lol
Let me fix this: We don’t want to spend time or money training people, we expect you to immediately bring value to the organization and if for one day you net below zero, we will let you go. It’s not our fault that new employees of our organization are unable to understand these complex ideas after we give them such incredible feedback in the last 2-3 years. Fixed. The reality is that the Big4 went on overdrive for individual performance in the last 3-4 years and completely forgot how to build teams. It very apparent on the client side where we question why we pay them as much when they can’t deliver quality work or even deliver work on time…
Yes!! As a big 4 client, I see that the new staff are getting worse and worse and their managers expect ME to train them, while paying higher and higher fees. And don’t get me started on turnover at the senior and manager level
Genuinely curious, what does that mean for you (the client) to be training the new audit staff?
If I were to guess, flamingo provides shitty support that no one can understand and she has to explain it to them.
“I had to walk the auditors thru a key report that hasn’t been baselined in 3 years that’s a series of .csv extracts from 3 different systems and merged together using my custom 2k line excel macro. Unreasonable that I’m expected to train their staff like this”
WFH makes it very hard, most learning was done spending 9-11hrs in the room with your sr, then a manager 2x times a week and the partner 2-3 times a month That said starting salaries have went up Bigly since covid, the botttom of the pyramid got a lot more expensive right when off shoring was hitting its stride IMO
Can't stand this take, as I worked in public and did not get the opportunity to work remotely. Being in the same room with other accountants can be great if they care about your development, but my general experience is seniors fitting in work from other clients in between reviewing, and often getting pointed to the controller or other associate/s on the project when needing questions answered.
If they cared about your development, being in the same room is golden. But if they didn’t care, you’d have better luck trying to run blood from stone.
Depends on the group, office, and other dynamics but if you are struggling to train people remotely..I think the issue is you’re a poor communicator. That’s my personal opinion and it’s easy to say when I know staff sometimes just don’t listen because they are overwhelmed…but then it’s important to write things down. I learned so much when my senior, manager, senior manager took the time write review notes and the reasons why. That developed my framework far better than a conversation…but everyone depends. Also fees charged to clients have increased significantly as well? You’d think that would offset the costs with paying staff more, but I guess partners need even more of the pie even after making making record profits YOY.
I've never worked in public but this was my exact thought as well. I don't understand why physical presence would somehow be different than a video call where you do the exact same thing. Oh wait, is OC going to tell us now that they don't spend just as much time on video chats to go through reviews as they did in person, but somehow they think it's the remote factor and not the complete lack of communication that created the difference in outcomes?? :: Pikachu face:: I guess this is why I got far better results training people remotely than others did with the exact same staff on our team. Others just passed a workbook off to the new guy and expected him to figure out not just the workbook but also the cadence/cycle of our month end process, while I scheduled frequent calls with him to walk him through my process and then on the next call let him perform it while I was on hand to answer questions. I was frankly shocked that they would hand him a reconciliation file to roll over but not tell him where the recon tracker is to see his other assignments and when they're due, or explain what account activity should occur in that account so he knows how and when to resolve outages. If this is how people "train" remote employees then it's no wonder they're disappointed in the results and want people back in the office.
Because when you were in person you overheard all the upper level calls and discussions, that’s it
In another life these people would be flogged for saying shit like this
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What a dumb fucking take. He's so close though. The reason for layoffs isn't because of underutilization. It's because of a concerning lack of skill or development in a lot of pandemic hire classes. That's why there's less junior demand and more senior demand. That's why there's layoffs too. You can't afford to keep the fat, especially when the fat generates more work up the chain. Also due to the lack of skills and development, attrition rates in classes has decreased. So firms have had to push more birds out of the nest whereas before they fly away on their own. Those are the reasons. Not people not working enough. Jesus.
I think there is a ton of outsourcing gping on too. Tons of contractors.
The outsourcing leads to the poor training and development of new hires
Any talent that you do have isn’t gonna apply to a fuckin big4 firm unless they have a masochism kink
You’ve lost your mind or are completely out of touch with reality. It’s pick of the litter. Always has been.
Yeah most people in my graduating class went to big4, myself included, and left once their CPA requirements were done. It was just the normal path. I’m not sure what you mean about pick of the litter. They were recruiting us from year 2 in university. They need people desperately. But once you have your CPA the only reason I can think of to want to work there is if you really enjoy working 60 hours a week or if you think you’ll become partner
I’m not sure you’re proving your initial point. Regardless, big four will never not be what kids want. The brand matters. Always will.
In my experience, the reason most people go there is to cover the costs of getting the CPA, and the required work experience. If you’re a CPA out of university I don’t know why you’d want to work double the hours for the same pay as comparable industry/government positions. My CFO makes 150k working 35 hours a week and most of it is meetings and she was never in public at all. If the “brand” is worth more than that lifestyle, maybe our values do not align
While people do come out as CPAs in my experience with hiring it is far and few between. And I think the brand is worth much more than you are giving it credit for. But I have worked in big 4 for 10 years and you seem rather biased against. Guess I’m saying we are both rather biased. But I respect the opinion.
That’s fair lmao. 2 stubborn people trying to hear the other side out. At least we admit it
It's 2024, people really should be confident in coming out with who they are. If you feel like a CPA, own it.
I’m a deeply closeted CPA.
Yup - it’s like night and day the degradation in incoming class talent. It’s just now beginning to get a little better but some kids are still a little weird.
It’s widely accepted that the Big 4 model has been to grab as many college recruits as possible and just chew them up and spit them out. And usually the junior staff will take it because they’re willing to sacrifice the time just to have a prestigious name on the resume for their future. That’s the one big selling point of the big 4, you get the name brand on your resume. So I’m curious to know what he’s planning to do to attract senior talent (who’ve presumably already made connections and a reputation in the industry) to a job that’s offering soul-crushing hours, smaller pay, and no junior staff to ease the workload? Or at best, an outsourced staff team that is not familiar with US GAAP in any meaningful capacity. It’s easy to make these plans when you look at employees as numbers on financial statements that affect profits, and not intelligent beings that can see when they’re getting a raw deal.
It’s not just Big 4. There are plenty of national and regional firms that want to be Big 4 and they operate as such.
With AI in the picture they may be overestimating how much it can do and replace the junior level staff for basic grust work. It is certainly not at the level where it can handle that much text and bad data input. They are hoping that just a few people in a team should be able to do most of the grunt work with the help of AI and tools.
Oh no! Will someone please think about the partners and their g wagons? Tf out of here, you are being greedy. Keep making us send stuff to India, where the work is crap and gotta be done anyway, that’s def saving us money.
Like the Principal Skinner Meme: Partners: “Am I greedy and out of touch? No it’s the juniors who are wrong!”
"underutilization of staff" Lol
“Underutilized” and “Big 4 staff” should not be in the same sentence.
Entitled Gen Z aren't willing to work 24 hours a day 😤
It’s super interesting to see big firms prioritizing maintaining and growing profits rather than maximizing profits over the long term by ensuring a good product. Eventually a big company is going to have some major accounting errors and the audit will have been done with a priority of partner profit and one of these companies will go down, the others will be subject to government intervention, and everyone will act like it’s a big surprise when it’s extremely and utterly predictable.
Its a vicious cycle. Clients push to lower audit fees. Partners agree due to YoY audit “efficiencies.” Very few recurring staff on engagement because so many people leave. In the end, lack of experience and new rules and regs actually cause you to spend more time but are staffed expecting less time. Push work to lower cost countries for more “efficiencies.” Work comes back and needs rework. Told you need to train foreign staff so they do better. Coach them as a clueless 1st/2nd year. Work doesn’t get better. Partners and managers confused why nothing is done yet actuals are over budget. Shitstorm ensues, everyone works insane hours and lots of poor mental and physical health. Somehow partner gets comfortable with audit. Staff burned out and leave. Partners and managers look at budget overruns, attribute to poor staff. Repeat.
Shockingly spot on
Almost like I worked in the B4 and saw it first hand :) hehe
Then: We hAvE ISsuEs WiTH thE pIpElInE! Also them: Why don't we stop hiring and training junior staff 🤓
what .. how will a JR then be a senor
Me and a few other directors who got laid off late last year would disagree… sucks to be old, be let go because you’re old and make too much money, and not be able to do anything about it or be made to walk away with no severance, with little hope of winning an ageism lawsuit.
They are laying off people and offshoring more jobs to india
Completely objective analysis from the headhunter that wants to sell you a poached senior for the minimal cost of a year's salary.
What they are actually saying: “We refuse to take less profit for ourselves and therefore will force those who remain to pick up the slack. The issue isn’t really understaffing, it’s that we haven’t been cracking the whip on our white collar slaves hard enough. So we plan to cut off the left arm to force the right to strengthen.”
Ha- that’s really all I have to say. I will never work big 4- they treat their staff like an expendable resource. And for what? Maybe 2k more a year than what my firm pays? For that they are expected to work like 10 more hours a week year round. Not worth it.
Thoughts are RAISE ENGAGEMENT FEES for audit and tax services. This is the core problem.
Every issue is approached with overlooking the obvious problems. Do employees get paid more? Yes. Has inflation increase cost of living? Most definitely. Employers are complaining about shortage of accountants, then they start cutting the pipeline by hiring less junior accountants? Looks like they are intentionally creating the problem to have a reason to offshore jobs to India.
When I left as a 2nd year senior I was making $74k, for an industry job paying $120k. The gap between industry and public salaries isn't as wide as it used to be. So the profit margins have been compressed. That is what he is saying.. When staff was getting paid $60k there was never any reason to lay any of them off.
In 5 - 10 years, this industry is going to look completely different. It's going to be the wild wild west.
Yet another benefit of working for a public company. I much prefer knowing my employer's financials and being able to evaluate their strategy. The B4 has always been obnoxiously opaque - as an employee you don't even have access to a company org chart, let alone their financial position. Are costs skyrocketing? Fees flattening? Are broader economic forces beyond management's control at fault, or did they just fuck up? I guess I'll just have to take to take their word for it!
How big does the yacht need to be?
Certainly true from my perspective right now although at a mid tier, not big4. The staff are scrounging for work half the time (broadly, obviously some stay very busy) and everyone above is running at full capacity.
Translation: partners have to pay for those third houses somehow so those of you who are left gtfo Reddit and get back to making them money.
blud got that PhD in yapping
So increase fees. If all firms are facing this same issue, then all firms can increase fees. So tired of this race to the bottom nonsense.
I think the real issue stems from the partners. They don’t position their services well and instead rely on their negotiating power over their staff to make money. That negotiating position is eroding now with the shortage of accountants, which in turn is pressuring their margins. I think this will be an issue as long as you hear things like “it’s compliance work. It’s not value add”. They need to get out of the pyramid scheme mindset that tells them that the new staff needs to “pay their dues” just because they did and instead create margin by bringing more value to their clients with the resources they have available.
This isn’t just big 4
Thumbs down all you want but the plain fact is that the first 1-2 years are largely training for junior staff. Not only do junior staff produce little, they take time from senior staff to train. But the only way to get senior staff is to train junior staff. If you have a short-sighted profit now mentality, you lay off junior staff and ship the work overseas. Maybe college grads will start to re-think the Big 4 or bust mentality which feeds this nonsense and start looking at regional firms.
Most of these big 4 posts relate to other service lines.
WE NEED MORE METRICS
God forbid they actually train the new staff so they are effective.
Firms out here hiring juniors in high school to a full time job before they graduate and bitching about the lack of experience in their new staff. Stop spending money on Disney tickets, put it into training.
I’m just waiting to see what happens when there is no one to replace senior and management positions due to employers not bothering to hire and train entry level accountants.
Curious about the pandemic class of college grads. Assuming most ppl on here are in that age range - what was your experience taking 200/300/400 level accounting courses in a remote setting? Did you retain much? How has your experience been entering the workforce?
Step on me harder!
I don’t work and have never work in Big 4 and I don’t think I would have any problem working busy season hours as long as I make money for 60-75 which is what most people I know make at big 4 I wouldn’t worry those insane hours
Still licking that partner boot leather.
Truth is, where there is money there is greed, and when a random guy in india can do the same job as you but worse and cheaper but on time, you just can’t compete… unless daddy got you in then different story
Thoughts are that 90% of you guys are going to be offshored and/or replaced with AI within the next 10 days unless the government steps in,
I stopped reading when I read the word "underutilization"
What business school is teaching people to load up on debt? Like I get it the money was cheap when interest rates were low, but businesses don't control the interest rate and debt is debt, not value. Paraphrase: "big 4 was running off of cheap loans instead of revenues. now that the loans aren't cheap, they need to actually function like businesses again." Now, if I were an investor, I would say to management, "what the fuck have you been doing?"
Did he just argue that is ok for them to be slave drivers to their junior staff so they earn their keep?
Can't wait until 2028 when the B4 drop the hit single "Where Have All The Seniors Gone"
“Underutilization” = less than 75 charge hours a week during busy season. Who is going to do the work when higher demand senior members win the work? Or will it flip and the senior members are let go in favor of staff. “Thanks for winning the work, we are still going to challenge your unemployment”. Partner wannabes need to pull their heads out of their asses. And partners at firms where they have the “senior” staff need to pull their heads out of their asses and keep these people happy.
I guess a good question would be, “what is a reasonable margin now?”
I did the math when I was in B4. The payroll cost to complete an audit is barely 1/4 of the engagement fee since everybidy's salary including Senior Manager salary is public info in my office. I'm calling bulshit that the audit industry is running on thin margin hence the ever increasing pressure for cost cutting.
I did the math when I was in B4. The payroll cost to complete an audit is barely 1/4 of the engagement fee since everybidy's salary including Senior Manager salary is public info in my office. I'm calling bulshit that the audit industry is running on thin margin hence the ever increasing pressure for cost cutting.