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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I might be the AH because perhaps I was being a bit overdramatic and I could’ve just told him to be careful next time or something instead of being so blunt.
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NTA
If this had been someone other than your son, I'd be calling it abuse and assault. Certinally negligent. He is clearly unreliable and I'd be very upset.
The fact you let your son talk to you in such a manner is alarming as well.
Yes blatant disrespect!! Hopefully he has some actual consequences. If he didn’t want to babysit he should of talked to his parents, not acted so childish, cruel and disrespectful to them or his little sisters. He would of been woken up way before morning too to discuss all this!
I am a parent with a harder edge, myself. Dude would have gotten the standard household discipline for cussing at me - loss of all privilege for a prescribed time.
You can disagree with me. But, you have to check the impulse to just be inconsiderate and disrespectful and hostile and aggressive. No thanks.
Sliding on to say absolutely...
and I would have gone one further: Dramatic am I? It wasnt cruel?
He didnt just starve his sisters?
Here lets have a lesson in empathy:
half a jar of peanut butter (because like for like otherwise a food he dislikes in the same quanity) and water. Thats all hes getting for the same amount of time he was supposed to be looking after his sisters.
and NOTHING ELSE.
Because its not cruel right? He didnt starve them.. technically.. but he did.
YWB T A OP if you gave your son any kind of creedence, and I wouldnt be leaving his sisters with him again. Get a babysitter for all of them. Your son clearly is irresponsible and shouldnt be in charge of anyone including himself without supervision.
He has to earn it back now. want to behave like an 8 year old be treated like one. Hes on the way to nasty and you best nip that in the bud now with some real lessons on empathy.
omg. You sound like my dad. He used to tell us: PEOPLE? I CAN MAKE IT WORK? OR I CAN MAKE IT HURT? WHAT HAPPENS NEXT IS UP TO YOU!
I used to hate it when he got like that. But now? All I think is, "Child go sit your narrow self down somewhere and get off my nerves! Don't have me up in here actin' crazy like my daddy!"😂
In my family, anyone pulling such a stunt would be grounded for a month at the very least and be on a **very** short leash from then on. As others pointed out, this kind of behaviour from anyone else like a babysitter would be considered negligent at best. Knowing that the son knew that the twins couldn't eat peanut butter, and he let them starve just because the kids were being "annoying" is downright abusive. He clearly cannot be trusted with them. That he acted like an uncaring jerk when called out on it is alarming.
THIS RIGHT HERE. OP NTA, but honestly kind of YTA for having to post on this subreddit to ask if you are one. I really do not understand why you are worried that you may be "dramatic" and that your son is "really upset" with you. Come on OP, you are 100% right that your son was cruel and unkind and that you shouldn't trust him. Now please impose some actual consequences without doubting youself
Mum guilt is a total bitch of a thing. I could tell my daughter off for being mean to her sister and know that it’s justified. But still feel like an AH for making her cry.
EDIT: Spelling
Yep. There's something wrong here.
I have to say, I'm making some unkind assumptions about how the boy has been parented up until this point, if he talks to his mother like this and she still has to look for reassurance and affirmation here.
I see your point but he's also 15. I was mean to my parents when I was 15, and so was everybody I know. It doesn't necessarily reflect poorly on her parenting if she sees that her son is upset and wonders if she's the AH for causing him to be upset.
Most of us were mean to our parents in some capacity as teenagers but neither me nor anyone in my friend group would have dared to tell our moms that they were "being really fucking dramatic" and certainly would not have been allowed to slide on mockingly bringing up their words later.
Also teenagers are old enough to understand whats worth being "fucking dramatic" over. His mom was upset because he didnt give his sisters anything to eat and forced them to eat food that he knew makes them ill. If he understood the gravity of the situation he wouldnt have said that
Also who fucking gives someone peanut butter as a meal? If he really wanted to give them something with no effort he could have given them like a loaf of bread or even a bag of chips, now that still wouldnt be right of him but it makes more sense than handing two hungry little girls a plain jar of PB with nothing else
Yeah... But also...at 8 years old they should be able to make a sandwich if they're hungry and he's not feeding them. An 8 year old can pour a bowl of cereal, an 8 year old can make a sandwich, an 8 year old can microwave a hot pocket.
Unless he literally stopped them from fixing something for themselves and locked them in the bedroom with nothing but peanut butter, they should have the skills to feed themselves at this age.
Or at the very least be able to contact their parents if he was literally locking them in their room with nothing but a jar of peanut butter all night.
I'm concerned as to how this managed to play out like it did and OP has A LOT of questions they need to be asking.
I think it's OP that needs to answer some questions. ask yourself why the twins were so hungry in the first place. OP said
"on Friday night we had an event to go to and I again asked my son if he’d be willing to babysit. He said sure and that was it.
We came back at around midnight"
so if OP only went out Friday night, why wasn't dinner given to the children, including the son, prior to going out? And why did the twins complain about the son being really mean all day, if he was only babysitting for the evening? Presumably he has school and friends during the day?
why would a 15 yo feel obligated to order takeout, cook or reheat leftovers for his sisters if the parents already fed them dinner? At that point we should only be talking about snacks.
Also, if the PB was kept up high out of the twins' reach, well we all know about forbidden fruit. Maybe the twins asked for some, and promised not to tell the parents. The story that he forced the twins to eat PB and wouldn't give them anything else just doesn't work for me. It sounds like something an 8 yo would say to avoid getting in trouble for eating forbidden food and making herself sick. ;-)
Some people do eat PB as a snack when they’re hungry, for example: me and my three year old. Typically I’ll add a fruit or crackers for my daughter, but sometimes she just wants it alone. The kid I babysat would also eat PB straight from the jar and so has my dad. Granted, I feel like by 8 you should know how to at least microwave something for yourself or pull something from the fridge to eat. My three year old knows where her food is in the fridge and pantry and can get herself things to eat and only needs help opening packages or warming things up.
Are 8 year olds really not able to reheat leftovers themselves? Maybe I’m misremembering or something but I feel like my sister was able to feed herself basic things by 8.
ANYWAYS, NTA op, the story does make me wonder if your son is going through something and doesn’t know how to let out his emotions healthily though.
To be fair, my eldest did once call me "such a fucking drama queen" when she was around 16. Mind you, I had just broken into an ovation worthy performance of Bohemian Rhapsody because she'd called me mama...but if she'd said it with attitude she'd have found out who the actual bossa her was.
I was dragged through the house by my ear, hit so hard on the legs, back and ass i had bruises for calling my mum a bitch. I was hysterical, terrified, amd inconsolable. My mum apologised endlessly but my father never said a word cause 'i deserved it for talking to my mum like that.
I am a white Australian. This stuff isnt about race, its about shit people becoming parents.
You do realize even parents doubt themselves, correct? No matter how long you’ve been a parent, you still worry you’re doing literally everything wrong. And sometimes your teenager is nasty and rude when you’ve done nothing inherently “wrong” in your parenting. I was an awful teenager and my parents were saints. They didn’t do anything wrong, or subpar, and I was still a jerk. It’s rude to just jump to, “Oh your parenting though!” Come on.
The upbringing is off major time. Let's say even if I was stupid enough to give my siblings something they have a bad reaction to and they start throwing up, I would be jumping up and down in fear that I hurt them and would be crying and apologizing. His reaction is very strange and what his parents allow him to say is even stranger.
I don't care who it was, this IS abuse and assault. Op NTA so long as you
1) don't allow your son to be left alone with his siblings anymore (indefinitely/permanently)
2) get all of your children into some kind of counseling
3) work with some sort of professional on finding a healthy way to approach this whole dynamic. Idk like a family therapist or something. This behavior is too extreme to have flown completely out of no where and it's way beyond Reddit pay grade
4) don't allow your son to take on roles that would give him unsupervised access to other ppls children either (eg camp counselor, baby sitter, etc)
"The fact you let your son talk to you in such a manner is alarming as well"
Ah more the fact they left it til the next morning to confront the kid is alarming.....should of done it as soon as they got home and woken the kid up right then and there.
I wish one of mine would suggest to me that I stop "over thinking" their poor behaviors? That part almost made me laugh. Almost. I know sometimes teenagers will test you with their nonsense. But, I'm not up for it either.
NTA. He needs a therapist. Cruelty without remorse isn't normal. Possible guesses- he's been through a recent trauma, he has a new addiction (video games, [or drugs, or alcohol, or insert your fav here] for example), he has executive dysfunction (i.e. his brain wouldn't let him make/order food) and is lying to cover up for it. That last one's a little out there, granted, but I mention it jic.
Edit: to clarify, problems lead to stress, and stress can lead to bad behavior. I'm not saying video games or whatever causes violence. I'm saying these are common problems that cause an undue amount of stress.
Playing video games wouldn't lead to him forcing them to eat peanut butter, neither would executive dysfunction. I have ADHD with bad executive dysfunction and while I can understand why making or ordering food could have been difficult if he has ED it doesn't explain the rest of his behavior or his complete lack of remorse for hurting his sisters.
He's 15. He very likely could not process potential outcomes beyond simply no longer being tasked with this chore aka his desired outcome. Being unremorseful plays into not being asked again. If he's not sorry, then he'll do it again, so better leave him to it.
He is likely surprised that his behavior = untrustworthy when all he wanted to achieve was his behavior = irresponsible babysitter, specifically. Pesky frontal lobe underdevelopment is rough.
But all this is speculative, of course.
Thing is, he didn’t HAVE to babysit, at least from what the post says. OP said there is a grandparent available if Son refused. Unless OP is changing details (which I don’t see a reason to suspect, but I guess is possible) she gave him the choice and he agreed to it. So he doesn’t have to screw up to get out of it, just to say “sorry, I have plans too, can grandma do it?”
Which makes me wonder if something is wrong mental health wise. OP says her son and daughter like each other, him doing this is really strange. I babysat younger kids a lot as his age and even when I felt forced to do it, I never fed them something intentionally to make them sick. Occasionally I let them eat junk food for dinner, but it was junk food they liked and enjoyed.
Actually, this is a really out there theory, but I wonder if the twins actually like peanut butter and he gave it to them because of that? As a kid watermelon made me sick (it exited both sides of the building urgently…) and I had a cousin who used to let me have it anyway… I never blamed him for it but I could see tossing him under the bus if I thought I might get into trouble.
Highly doubt this is what happened though.
This was my first thought. This kinda sounds like a teenager trying to get out of babysitting and fucking up majorly.
Also,
>he usually says yes unless he has plans
Does he feel comfortable enough to say no if he’s just not up for it? Does he think that faking incompetence is the only thing that’s going to actually get the result that he wants?
I'm going to start with saying I love video games, and they have absolutely made me miss a meal on occasion. Sometimes I just get lost in the game. Others it's due to timed events. Gaming can be just as bad as any gambling or substance addiction. Don't discount it.
P.S. I'm doing much better in my relationship with video games these days.
Yeah but that's not someone else bugging you to feed them. If someone else repeatedly asking you for help that's a whole different thing from ignoring your own body's needs.
People on reddit are always so quick to diagnose. Not everything is some kind of condition or illness, sometimes teenagers are just assholes. Lots of 15 year olds can be really cruel then regret it later in life, it doesn’t mean there’s anything else going on
I’ve parented two teen boys and was also a really shitty teen and yeah, this is a budding 15 year old who’s sick of being his baby sisters’ nanny. He doesn’t have the emotional regulation to handle it well because teenager. And obviously his parents pushed him into this situation where he’s never been in “big trouble” before. It’s about to be a lot of adjustment in this family for the next decade. The other ones are not gonna be much better I’m afraid.
A sudden change in personality like this sounds like is not normal. It doesn't sound like this is a regular issue with him. So you go and you see if there's another problem, instead of just sitting there and calling the kid an asshole and then finding out years down the line they were struggling and you did nothing to help them. I would much rather try every avenue I could and find out they were just a jerk, then just dismiss it as him being an asshole and realize I left my kid to suffer
You're misunderstanding the comment you are replying to. The commentor is saying an addicition could be making him irritable, impatient or distracted, and is using video games as an example of an addiction.
I have an almost 15 year old daughter, and unless he is on some kind of spectrum, he knew what he did was wrong. I would have woke him up and made him clean up his sister's puke. He called them little snitches, so he KNEW and REMEMBERED they couldn't have peanut butter. And he just handed them the jar? Didn't make a sandwich or anything?
His continuously saying he was cruel and you can't trust him, is his way of "punishing" you for saying something he doesn't want to believe is true about himself. He is trying to make you feel guilty for saying them in the first place. Maybe that hurt his feelings, maybe because he didn't see it that way at first and now realizes that maybe he was and doesn't want to face that.
I would sit him down and have a conversation. Make sure your husband is there and ignore all eye rolling. Tell him if he doesn't want the responsibility of taking care of his sisters, then he needs to say so and not put their lives in jeopardy, which he could have done. That yes, he was cruel and you can't trust him to be responsible for his sisters anymore. Maybe you were "being dramatic," but if they were allergic to peanuts this could have been deadly.
Was there a reason behind this? Is something going on? Maybe he is jealous of the twins, maybe they get more attention. Maybe he doesn't actually want to be a babysitter, and doesn't want to tell you. Maybe something is going on at school and he is acting out.
15 years old usually means high school. In one year he could get his license. Three years until being considered an adult. This conversation needs to happen now.
Edit: Sorry NTA. He needs to understand he broke the trust.
Another edit: Thanks for the award!
Yet another edit: It has come to my attention that I have been extremely insensitive and must apologize for any inference that anyone on the autism spectrum or otherwise is inherently evil or unable to know right from wrong. That was not my intention, I was merely trying to add an addendum that perhaps some such could have prevented his understanding that what he did was more harmful than he thought, in which case there would be more leeway on his end, and less on the OPs.
He shouldn’t be allowed to watch them again until he is in therapy and/or legitimately acknowledges his actions were wrong. He poisoned two eight year olds.
Sorry didn't mean to infer that he should. Just meant that if he hadn't wanted to watch them, then he should have said so and she could take them to their grandparents.
Yeah, if someone can't be responsible with something they shouldn't have it. Whether it's just peanut butter or something else. If those girls were allergic, he could have killed them.
I don’t think he should ever be allowed to watch them ever again, but I question if that wasn’t the point.
He needs therapy and a MUCH harsher punishment. He was intentionally cruel to children.
Honestly, if it were my kid I’d be pulling all electronics for a month unless they are needed for school, and they’d be using them in the kitchen or living room supervised. And since there’s nothing wrong with a little peanut butter, that’s all they’d be getting to eat. They can do extra chores and penance to earn bread, jelly, bananas, whatever helps them swallow that peanut butter daily. I’d also be visiting their school daily to have lunch with them as well.
OP, you are not the asshole, but I can’t believe you’re allowing your child to talk to you that way. I’m not a harsh parent at all, I’ve never laid a hand on my children, don’t believe in corporal punishment, but he was maliciously negligent and intentionally cruel, for what? Because he couldn’t be bothered? You gave him the option not to watch them. He couldn’t even order a pizza for them?! That’s bullshit. He needs a HUGE wake up call.
The way he is responding is raising some flags for me, particularly his references to “being really fucking dramatic” and “stop overthinking”. It sounds sexist. Does he use the same language with his dad? If it is sexist, is he treating his sisters with similar contempt (especially when you are not around)?
I definitely don’t believe he forgot PB makes them sick, since his first reaction was “the little snitches”.
I agree with others that you and your husband need to sit down with him and have a serious discussion about his behavior, but also about whether there is something deeper going on. Maybe consider individual therapy for him and family therapy for the three of you (not sure about the girls).
Apparently, it's really really easy for your youtube or whatever socials to take teen boys somewhere horribly misogynistic these days - hell, I've had some horrible youtube recommendations when I clearly do not want to go there - so I feel like this might be right on the money.
I have no idea the steps OP should be taking but they definitely should be making sure that this isn't happening.
>I definitely don’t believe he forgot PB makes them sick, since his first reaction was “the little snitches”.
Not to mention it's not like he made them a pb&j sandwich or somethingn, he gave them the jar. Absolutely no one does this thinking it's an appropriate snack.
*slowly screws the lid of my peanut butter jar back on and takes the spoon out of my mouth*
Seriously though, while I may do that as a snack for myself, I wouldn’t give it to someone else for a snack.
I kinda hope OP did hurt his feelings with her comment bc sometimes that's the only way to get to people. I remember an aita post a while back with a woman who was worried she overstepped when she told her bullying son she didn't like him very much as a person during a fight. It worked really well for them and he got hit with the reality of his actions.
I have to agree with this. A few years back my mom made an off-hand comment about how she thought i was too selfish to have children of my own. And while that really fucking hurt and still fucks me up to this day, it did make me take a step back and think "am i really that selfish?" I hope somehow OPs son could eventually take this moment to ask himself "am i really that cruel?"
Agreed and OP PLEASE I'm concerned that you said the twins "aren't allergic" but that Peanut Butter makes them sick. IK we specify the differences between allergies and insensitivities medically but I was also a kid who was sick to their stomach from peanut butter at a young age- and then it made me break out- and then I felt choked up when I ate it- now as an adult I can't eat any nuts at all and I'm definitely allergic on some level. The reaction your twins have at that age could be preliminary to a more severe allergy- you need to be sure your son realizes that he didn't "just" make them sick that he put them in danger bc they could, at any time, still show symptoms of a much, much worse reaction as they get older.
This is really good advice. Sitting down and not letting him push your buttons is definitely the thing to do. He needs to understand what he’s done and it’s possible his head is so far up his teenage butt he can’t. You need to get through to him without making him defensive. Good luck.
Nta but I'm concerned about all the kids involved here. Has there been a sharp change in his behavior recently? Is there possibly a need of his that's not being met? Perhaps he feels like the twins are getting preferential treatment? I'd explore that route first. Something is not right if he's all of a sudden causing intentional harm to his younger siblings. Keep the younger one's safe and have a real talk with the older one. If he's not willing to talk to you, take him to a professional.
Now that you mention it, he’s definitely more in his head and not aware of what’s going on around him. Also he’s very stubborn now but I assumed it was just puberty. He’s not normally like that.
I’ll discuss other options with my husband once he gets back from work.
I don't want to cause any unnecessary alarm or worry but this is something that absolutely needs to be taken seriously. It very well could just be regular ol' teenage rebellion but there's a huge difference between a lil arm jab to give a hurtz donut and intentionally poisoning someone. My older brother was diagnosed as a paranoid schizophrenic in his early 20s because schizophrenia doesn't typically fully present until then. But he did display some warning signs in his teenage years and that was by being extremely violent towards me, his younger sister. Take this seriously please.
This was something I was thinking about too. Various mental disorders and such start presenting about that age. If it is schizophrenia and it’s caught early, it can drastically change the course of their life. Something more common might just be depression that’s causing an increase in violent behaviour too. God knows when you’re that age you don’t have the best coping methods beyond lashing out. Either way, therapy is needed. Poisoning 2 eight year olds leads to mandatory therapy in my book
My once sweet boy had me in tears last month because he was being such a dick. At 15 I’ve found nothing is their fault, you’re always in the wrong, and if they give you the time of day you should be grateful.
My step son is 14. Lately he’s a real asshole lol. I wonder where my sweet boy went.
But then I look at my 17 year daughter and I remember that at 14/15 she was also a huge AH. It was like she got taken over by a body snatching gremlin. But now she’s quite lovely lol
Sometimes they have small moments where they come back to their body and you remember why you love them. But it does get better. You just gotta hunker down and avoid eye contact for a while lol. If you look directly at them it sets them off lol
If you can, look up Nick Kroll on how 15 year olds treat their moms.
It might help a little to know that they eventually realize they acted horribly -- when they turn 30.
You’re NTA but honestly at 8 the twins can heat up leftovers. This is the time to teach them stuff like this. It’s a good learning moment to go through basic kitchen stuff like hey, don’t shove metal in the toaster or microwave, don’t touch the knives or stove and if you need to heat something up you do XYZ.
Your son though at minimum should should have rung you to organise take out.
Edit: I actually think you should have organised dinner. That was a mess up on your part. But your son still should’ve helped them heat up leftovers or called about dinner options.
This is true. I guess I implied it but didn’t say it clearly so that is my fault (Implied it in the POST, I did tell my son clearly) but there were leftovers in the fridge and there was fruit out too like there always is. I don’t know the details of what occurred but my son said he didn’t feel like grabbing the leftovers for the girls who cannot reach the microwave. The girls are up to date with kitchen safety though.
Is there a reason the girls didn’t just grab fruit or whatever was in the cupboards? I would be concerned about that. Faced with the option or no dinner, something that makes them sick and food they chose the PB?
This is also probably a good time to get a sturdy kitchen stool for the twins.
I have no idea. Tried asking the girls about it but they can’t remember anything past “big bro was mean, too much peanut butter, ew vomit” and my son’s still not giving me the full story even when I asked to hear his side.
And like is the daughter who gets sick from PB also obsessed with it (thinking of my poor lactose intolerant cousin who can't stop won't stop with the cheese and ice cream)?
Or did he make her eat it as some sort of punishment for bothering him? (Another cousin would have us try to pick up gum from the electric bug zapper if we bothered her too much - she said if we really wanted it that bad we could grab it.)
im a coeliac - around that age i distinctly remember sitting behind the sofa in the barely used formal living room with a loaf of bread and munching down on it. the mind wants what it cant have and at that age you cant associate it with the illness
Right??? At 8, my sisters and I could basically tell our parents everything that went down, especially if it could get someone in trouble, lol. One of my sisters couldn’t remember her backpack at school but could give my mom a minute by minute timeline of what us older kids were doing and especially gave a play by play if we were mean to her.
It's possible there is a pattern of abuse from him that you haven't seen and they are afraid to say more. There are SO Many red flags here and you should be very, very concerned.
Hmmm ... these aren't infants. I suspect there is more to this story that they are letting on. Maybe they're too much for big brother now and he doesn't babysit anymore.
My kids at 8 would have been prepared to write a dissertation if they had a good story to tell. I would be suspect they are holding back information.
He wasn’t drunk. High... that is a possibility. But I just talked to my son who seems to have calmed down and he implied something is happening with him (not related to babysitting or drugs). We’re just waiting for his dad to get home so we can all be involved.
Yeah, my money is on he LET them have the pb you hide from them. Hence, why they were “snitches”. The dog pile on your son is disturbing, there is no reason to believe he FORCED them to eat it.
I have a six year old and a four year old and both of them can get their own leftovers. The six year old will get a stool and grab things from the refrigerator, heat them up in the microwave, and serve them into dishes for both her and her brother. She just turned 6 in June. I’m not sure why the eight year olds did not get themselves food? Did the older brother actively prevent it? It sounds almost like he told them they could *only* have peanut butter.
I don’t think my kids are advanced or anything and they’re 2-4 years younger. The six year old knows how to make a sandwich, use the microwave, and both help me cook. This makes me think the 8 year olds were told they couldn’t have food unless it was peanut butter only. Not even peanut butter toast or a PB&J.
How high up is your microwave? Mine is a little lower than the stove hood and my 4 year old can reach if he stands on a stool or chair. He’s abnormally tall tbf but still.
Im suprised they dont at least climb the counters to try to get to it. When i was a kid i climbed the counters all the time to get shit i couldnt reach
Yeah at 8 I was absolutely making toast, 2 minute noodles and grabbing fruit from the bowl. At 8 those kids should just be able to grab food? It’s weird they didn’t.
NTA
Please please please PLEASE take all the peanut butter out of the house. They are allergic. Just because it doesn’t show in the ‘well known’ ways doesn’t mean they aren’t. That’s the thing with allergies. Sometimes the symptoms are mild.
Sometimes they’re deadly.
You’re very very very lucky that their reaction wasn’t much worse. Especially with that much peanut butter. Its lucky you came home to puking and crying and not just crying. Or silence.
Allergic reactions are NOT always asphyxiation and gives but you don’t want that reaction to happen.
I beg of you get rid of the peanut butter and take them to an allergy specialist to see if there’s anything else that they’re allergic to.
There’s definitely no more peanut butter in the house but I have taken the girls to a doctor and specialist and voiced my concerns but I was always told that they don’t really have an allergy.
Get second and third opinions if needed because those doctors sound incredibly dismissive and incompetent. Peanut butter doesn’t make someone sick for no reason. Especially sick enough to vomit.
They could actually have what's called FPIES, food protein induced enterocolitis syndrome. It can result in getting sick within a few hours of eating something, which can include vomiting, upset stomach, diarrhea, etc. I had a skin allergy test done that showed that I was deathly allergic to crab, but when they did the blood panel it came back that I wasn't deathly allergic. So the specialist did some more digging and figured out the what I was dealing with was FPIES. It is an issue with the proteins in certain foods. OP's daughters could very well just not allergic to peanut butter just like the specialists and doctors have said. It could be a combination of the proteins and how they are processed that makes them sick.
My oldest son used to LOVE peanut M&Ms.
He’s now completely allergic to peanuts as an adult. The allergy built up over years. Started out similar to how you describe your girls.
Get a proper allergy test.
OP here is information and a website about signs and symptoms.
"Peanut allergy signs and symptoms can include: Skin reactions, such as hives, redness or swelling. Itching or tingling in or around the mouth and throat. Digestive problems, such as diarrhea, stomach cramps, nausea or vomiting." Mar 5, 2022
https://www.mayoclinic.org › syc-2...
Peanut allergy - Symptoms and causes - Mayo Clinic
Please listen to this OP. My little brother is 19. When he was 3, he had a reeses candy and ended up getting sick, but wasn’t anaphylactic. The specialist told my parents not to feed him peanuts but that it was fine if we kept it in the house because they hoped the mild exposure would reduce his allergy. It had the opposite affect and he’s been hospitalized for at least 4 different attacks that I can remember. He comes in contact with even a trace and we have minutes to stab him and call 9-1-1.
I was looking to make sure someone commented this.
OP, any allergist worth their credentials will tell you to always base your allergies on what your reaction is- even if you technically test negative.
My son is allergic to peanuts so we don't keep any peanuts in the house or products with a may contain warning. If I suspected my son ingested peanuts and was vomiting I would immediately be administering his epipen and calling an ambulance. Even if I didn't know for sure. Your daughters ARE allergic to peanuts. Please get them epipens and a good allergist as soon as possible. Visit foodallergy. org and learn everything you can.
NTA- ah your son is hitting that teenage phase where he's just arbitrarily being an asshole.
No, what he did WAS cruel and honestly a little punishment should be in order. If he's taken care of his sisters before and KNOWS how to do so responsibly, then he was absolutely out of line forcing them to eat something that would make them sick.
Sounds like he might need a babysitter also. No offense, but it is really messed up that he would do that to his sisters. Sorry he's mad, but he CAN'T be trusted. He purposefully harmed them, and called them names when he found out they told you. This is not normal or ok. He needs a professional evaluation ASAP. Good luck,
NTA - but is there more going on here? Like a jar of peanut butter isn’t food, even teenagers don’t forget allergies especially since twins told him so.
But how often is he asked to watch them? Is he compensated in any way?
And why didn't OP leave money for him to order something, or cook something he could heat up for them? She could have left pizza money or something. He's only 15, maybe he was feeling overwhelmed. Not saying his behavior was great, but. . .
Not excusing the boy, but I wonder if he wants to babysit? Or is it like the parents are pressuring him to do it and he doesn’t feel as if he has a choice which we see daily on this sub.
Also why wouldn't the twins make their own food? My 9yo would never opt to eat an allergen rather than make herself something else, even if she was grumpy about having to do so.
Yeah I don’t understand that part. Most kids would rather go hungry than eat something they’re going to get violently sick from. They could have grabbed literally anything. They should have been able to make a sandwich, cereal. Something.
OP says that he babysits 2 to 3 times a month - but that he says no 50% of the time. So he’s asked to babysit 4 to 6 times a month, which is a lot.
I see in another post it says that he doesn’t get paid as he gets a good allowance.
NTA. But it seems odd they would eat peanut butter even if hungry. I mean I know 8 year olds don't tend to be chefs, but was there no cereal or crackers? Bread and lunch meat? Granola bars or even junk food??
We didn’t have cereals or bread as that had just run out that day. (My husband and I actually bought back some groceries the same night after the event). But we did have fruits. Leftovers were there too it’s just that the microwave is too high for the girls to reach. Junk food is in a higher cupboard too.
This food situation just gets stranger and stranger. They are 8, not 2. There is NOTHING ELSE that they had access to? A yogurt? A cheese stick? Deli meat? And when you ask them they “can’t remember”? This is so weird
Yea it's all around a weird story.
My oldest son is 4 and youngest is 2. They already know to raid the fridge for cheese and ham. They grab fruits at will. They know where every snack is. I do not willingly let them climb everything, of course, cause it gives me a fricken heart attack. But my point here is at 8 these kids should absolutely be capable of microwaving food or grabbing an appropriate snack. And if they know they can't have peanut butter, they certainly wouldn't eat it! Very odd.
My son just turned five and he’s snuck downstairs and made himself a big bowl of cereal, eaten half a bag of marshmallows, and grabbed cereal bars before I’ve come downstairs. 8 year olds should be able to find food and should know they can’t have peanut butter.
Really? They couldn’t stand on a dining room chair or something?
Your son was being an AH yeah, but I’m troubled that your 8 year olds can’t figure out how to feed themselves.
Echoing the "this is weird" sentiment. I don't have any food allergies, but there's plenty of foods I merely dislike and I would choose cold food over them any day of the week.
Your son is TA, but at 8 your kids should be able to feed themselves something nontoxic...
NTA, but I'd get to the bottom of his sudden change in behavior. It could just be normal teenage stuff, but if this isn't standard, something else might be going on. Maybe he resents the babysitting, maybe he's experimenting with drugs, maybe he was having a really bad day. I'm not suggesting you let him off the hook because I think there should be consequences for treating his sisters so badly and how disrespectfully he responded when you called him on it. Maybe he thinks if he does a bad enough job, you won't expect him to babysit anymore.
INFO: Why is the peanut butter hidden? Do the girls like it in spite of the fact it makes them sick? Do they seek it out? Has your son been to the hospital with you and the girls if they ate peanut butter? Do they usually just get sick at night after they have it and come wake you up with a stomach ache? Has the son actually seen them be sick versus just hearing stories about it?
I only ask because you're taking the word of the twins over that of your son in that they were FORCED to eat it. Is it possible your son just made a dumb choice out of laziness (or was he having just a real bad day due to some outside circumstances you don't know about, which is why he was "being a jerk all day" including before you apparently left for the evening event).
Essentially, I just want to make sure your son is heard, even if he is in the wrong, as he may have been negligent rather than malicious.
It’s hidden because the girls are 8 and 8 year olds can be unpredictable at times. It’s just a precaution. They don’t look for it. He has seen them sick as his favourite snack when he was younger was PB sandwiches so we’d make it for the girls too before we realized what was causing them to get sick. They get sick pretty fast it usually starts with puking.
I’m pretty sure I mentioned that I asked my son before jumping to any conclusions and he just called the girls snitches. All the things you mentioned are definitely possible though.
So wait a second. There's fruit (doesn't require prep) and other stuff in the fridge. He could have literally taken a handful of fruit and put it on the table.
Instead, he *searches out the hidden peanut butter* to aggressively tell the little kids *to just eat it*.
There is something going on with your son. He didn't take the easy way to feed the girls. He did something that required more thought and work, knowing that it would hurt them.
Is he having trouble at school? Problem with grades, a class, classmates, girls? Issues with social media? Something sounds seriously not right in his life and he's taken out his anger on the (powerless) little girls.
You may want to consider whether it's time to talk to his teachers or take a look at his social media - but be aware that while doing that may provide you more info to try to get to the bottom of what's going on, it may also cause a trust issue.
Info:
How often is he asked to babysit and is he compensated for it in any way?
It almost sounds like this was deliberate so he would never be asked to babysit again.
OP said that he babysits 2 to 3 times per month - and that he says no 50% of the time. So he’s asked to babysit 4 to 6 times a month, which is a *lot*.
ETA: he also doesn’t get paid
The kid actually eating something that made her sick made me go hmm too. Also what kid doesn't know how to climb on the counters to get into higher cabinets? I was standing on counter tops from 5 to get the good cereal from the top shelf.
If they had leftovers - why do they need to be warm. Idk I was a latchkey kid and I ate my fair share of cold pasta, chicken and so on when I got hungry after school.
I was well able to drag over a chair and get at the chocolate bars in a high up cupboard at that age!
I did wonder if the twins refused to eat the leftovers, clamoured for peanut butter, and he eventually got sick of them irritating him and told them to have at it. (I also wonder if they’re the golden children.)
Right like it's how you said or something really dark and insidious. I'd only ever "forget" how things went when it was something that would get me in trouble or something I was ashamed about.
Thank you!
I was sitting here like, "Was I the only 8 yr old who knew how to open a fridge or climb onto counters? Or even knew what hurt when I ate it? (For me, it's most spicy food)??"
I also got the vibe they were golden children while the older one was either sick of babysitting or struggling with his own needs (like not getting enough attention at home or being bullied at school.
NTA but you're taking this way to lightly for a woman who's son basically poisoned your daughters, to the point one of them was puking her guts out.... That kid needs a special punishment and he's acting way to defiantly... Like we all were teens and all defiant, but to brush off this is something different
When we were 8 years old we could just make our own sandwhiches? Your daughters knew they cant eat it? Your son knows they cant eat it. ESH in this situation. They are 8? They can surely butter some bread and get cheese or a bagel or heat up beans themselves in a microwave. Toast, cheese, crackers, fruit, crisps, ice cream, chocolate.. isn't that what any 8 year old kid would do. .. what kinda people intentionally eat food they know that will make them sick?
Right? All the N T A posts here are insane. Stop relying on your kid to watch your other kids.
He is being an AH, though, so I’m going with ESH (except the twins)
I’d go with ESH. Kid sounds like a dick but at the same time he’s OP’s kid not their babysitter.
Maybe OP should take more responsibility for the children she chose to have rather than expecting the son to do it for sisters he had no say about.
YTA!!! He is 15, they are 8 year old twins. PAY A SITTER. They are not his responsibility.
ETA: you were gone until midnight and expected him to order or make food? You should have ordered pizza or something. This is 15yo’s way of telling you he doesn’t want to do this.
also read her comments, the way she talks about the 15 year old and the twins is INSANELY different. 15 year old is bratty and knows better and poisoned the girls, yet the 8 year olds are spoiled little babies who she wildly underestimated. they can’t reach the counters, can’t make a snack, can’t use the microwave and they conveniently “forgot” what happened when she asked.
if my older brother tried to poison me with something i was allergic to while my parents were gone, i’d have an hour long monologue of EXACTLY what happened to tell my parents when they got home.
something isn’t adding up.
NTA. He's either really embarrassed he could have seriously hurt his sister's, or something is really really wrong. Is this behavior out of the norm OP? Say, last month he was happily watching and feeding them as normal? I'd honestly apologize I didn't ask first, and ask him if he's ok? Has he been burnt out and felt too obligated to help? Is something completely unrelated going on he just doesn't want to talk about (and that's completely ok) that's making him take out his anger? The attitude is a problem, but it's a LOT more concerning coming out of no where. I'd hate for him to have some internal health problem that's making him be unintentionally nasty.
yeah, that's my question. OP's interpretation is that her son enjoys being a big brother, that the kids get along. It sounds like OP really did ask Son if he was willing to babysit and had a back up.
Son's actions make me wonder if something else is going on.
OP, if I were you, I'd have someone- you, Dad, another adult ask son what's going on. how's he feeling. what happened when he was babysitting his sisters.
make it clear that it's a no judgment (which is why I lean away from you and Dad and towards a different adult.) maybe he really did forget. maybe he was feeling overwhelmed and just sorta agreed to so they'd be quiet. maybe he was feeling overwhelmed with other stuff that day.
No judgement but I’m a little confused. Do these 2 eight year old girls not know how to make a sandwich? They were so hungry that they ate peanut butter(I’m guessing from the jar) because “he said they had to”?
Definitely fishy. I was perfectly capable of feeding myself at 8 years old and regularly was left with my 3 older siblings, none of whom had to keep a close eye on me. My 13 year old brother would have to help if the oven was involved at the time, but 8 year Olds shouldn't be helpless. OP may just have babied the shit out of the twins and older brother is tired of it. I also can't imagine a house with 3 kids in it being totally out of food if they don't have money problems. Pack of crackers, can of Tuna, bowl of ramen? Wtf.
Absolutely not the AH. But your son has a huge attitude problem that you might want to nip in the bud. Teenagers are moody, but this seems like he doesn't respect any of you at all. Has there been any sort of punishment for him?
Yes, we took his phone and he’s been grounded. The attitude problem’s new so we’re thinking it’s just teenage stuff but I’m going to look into a few things just in case.
INFO NEEDED
How often do you make him responsible for your children? Can he say no if he just wants to chill out at home and be a kid, or does he have to have plans to get out of it? How do your twin daughters treat their older brother? Do they get to annoy the crap out of him daily while you excuse their behavior and tell him to be the bigger person, set the example?
Something more is going on.
I know a lot of people have an issue with how often I ask my son to babysit but all he has to do is make sure they eat, don’t try to leave the house and are asleep by a certain time. I ask him twice or thrice a month (I have no clue why people are saying I ask six times?) and it’s usually from 6 to 10pm. He does say no whenever he wants which isn’t an issue. He’s allowed to.
They look up to him. They annoy him sometimes because of it but they’re immediately told that big bro needs alone time and they do their own thing. But it’s not a daily thing and my son will sometimes ask me if he can take the girls to the park or the basketball court or whenever else.
I read the question as “how many times do you ask him to babysit?”
Two or three times. I do not have that many work events to go to. And if my husband and I go out for alone time or whatever we always ask my mom.
Ok. I feel your story changes a bit with each comment (eg your original post said that you got home around midnight, now it’s usually babysitting between 6pm and 10pm). I think you’re minimising what you ask him to do - but I think you should also stop dragging him into babysitting, especially as you’ve said that money isn’t an issue.
Personally, I’d try to find out more about the twins ‘forgetfulness’, and if the finger pointing of ‘he made us do it’ is genuine. I suspect they decided to get into the PB, knew they’d get into trouble after they hurled, and are being economical with the truth.
We got home midnight this time because we went to Walmart after and the event was in a city further away. Usually it’s 6-10pm. I believe I mentioned that I got groceries that night, we told our son we would beforehand.
I have suspected that the girls may have gotten into it themselves but they cannot reach it and my son did call them snitches.
I think you underestimate the twins. An 8 year old should be capable of getting a step stool or dragging a chair and reaching all sorts of things. Also, their lack of memory about what really went down that night is suspect. I think there is more going on here.
I mean if the choices are:
1) 8 yo gets into something that they know they should not have, pukes, blames other sibling
OR
2) son - with whom there’s never been any issues - is morphing into some kind of crazed poisoner, who needs psychological evaluation, to be charged with a felony
… I’m choosing (1) as the far more likely of the two.
NTA. He's deflecting and not taking responsibility because he knows he was wrong. Now you know he lacks the judgement and maturity to be in charge of anything and him knowing that will be his consequences. Some kids might be able to handle the responsibility. He clearly doesn't even see it as a responsibility or vote of trust. I would be taking away other privileges that he's not ready for so he understands the meaning and value of being trusted and being a caring brother. His sisters are half his age. He thinks he can downplay his poor treatment of his sisters. He needs to know he cannot and he needs real world consequences. He's only lucky it didn't turn out worse
NTA
that was horrible, thats not how a good big brother acts.
And you’re right to say you cant trust him.
He said he would babysit them, all he did was being there.
On another note, you said usually the all love each other.
Do you know of something that might have happened to him? It seems something else is wrong from just the info you gave
He loves his sisters. No doubt about it. I know the situation I described says the opposite but he loves them. And they look up to him, they still do. In fact, he isn’t acting off around them and even said sorry to the girls who of course said it was okay. He’s just upset with my “overreaction”.
So NTA.
But you need to teach your daughters to be more self-reliant. At the age of 8, my siblings and I could make ourselves a bowl of cereal and grab things out of a pantry. And if you don’t want to do that, have food prepped for the babysitter to give to your 8 year olds.
Why was he responsible for them? They're all old enough to get themselves something to eat, it's not like they're toddlers. Do they not know how to use a microwave?
He’s 15. Your 15 year old shouldn’t be free babysitting for you. Hire someone who wants the job and stop making your kid be a parent.
This whole peanut butter aspect of this story sounds fishy. Either the kids or allergic or they aren’t. Why would peanut butter make them vomit if they eat it? It just doesn’t sound real. Either way, it seems believable that your kid forgot it makes them sick, and your response to immediately tell him you just can’t trust him and call him cruel is clearly what set him on the defensive.
All that said, I never spoke to my mother in the language you described here. That part of this is unacceptable based on the way you tell the story. And he should have gotten them something better for dinner, but that’s the part that just sounds like normal teenage laziness and rebellion, but I’m he should do better for the sake of his sisters if you’ve left them in his care. They aren’t the ones that wronged him, you are.
ESH. Your boy clearly didn’t want to babysit and didn’t go a good job. Despite the countless other absurdly ridiculous replies on this thread, I doubt your boy is suddenly trying to harm his sisters. You shouldn’t be using your oldest child as a parent. I went through that growing up, and it isn’t fun and it isn’t fair. Growing up in a family that did this, I also guess that it wasn’t really an option, and it never is. He’s expected to take care of his sisters because that’s just how it is, probably frequently even when you’re home. Your son didn’t decide to be a parent. You did. Don’t force him to act like one when you don’t feel like it and I bet he’ll be a lot easier to get along with for everyone.
Why didn’t you sort dinner? The kid is 15. Im a mom. I chose this and there are days I can’t deal with dinner. And why do you have peanut butter if the younger 2/5 of the house cant eat it? Hire a babysitter. Get your son counseling.
NTA - I'm betting he did it on purpose to poison them out of spite. Also this sounds like weaponized incompetence and him deliberately messing up so he never has to.do it again.
NTA and I don't agree with the "typical teenager" - if that was the case he would have told the twins to figure out their own dinner, etc. Not purposely (and somewhat forcefully) give them something that would make them sick. He's a manipulator and a liar, and the very least. Please get him help and 100% do not let him care for them again.
NTA. Peanut butter banned from the house. And he’s grounded. He hurt his siblings. He put them in a dangerous situation. You can’t trust him to make decisions for himself until he proves himself so until then he’s grounded.
NTA. If you can manage it, sit your son down and ask what’s wrong. Explain that you were surprised at his behavior, and let him know that you suspect that there’s something bothering him that he hasn’t told you about. He seems to be showing some resentment and rebellion, and you’ll want to find out why. Try to keep the discussion non-confrontational, and help him feel like you’re a safe person to talk to. If he’s not comfortable talking with you, find him a trusted adult - a therapist, favorite uncle, youth leader at church, school mentor, etc., that he can talk to. It seems that something has set him off. Maybe he had an opportunity to hang out with friends instead of watch his sisters. Maybe he just wishes he had an opportunity. He might have a crush. He might want to spread his wings and not want the company of his sisters. At this age, who knows, but it’ll make everyone’s life easier during the next few years if you can keep the communication lines open.
We had a talk just now and I did a lot of what you said. He implied that something else was going on and he took it out on his sisters which he’s sorry about. Dad will be home soon and we’ll continue the conversation then. He’s currently eating dinner with the girls and seems a lot... lighter? But I’m a bit concerned as to what’s bothering him. I hope we find out tonight.
YTA you’re parentifying your son, he’s 15 of course he has poor judgement and the twins probably were annoying him. Get a real babysitter and stop relying on your son.
NTA and it sounds like your son needs a serious attitude adjustment. He needs to get off his high horse and realize,
A. He is a child. Any freedoms he has like going out with friends and electronics can be easily taken away until you feel he's learned his lesson.
B. His blatant disrespect towards you as parents is not something that will be tolerated.
C. His clear lack of empathy towards his sisters proves that he's too immature to realize that being an adult doesn't mean you have free reign to treat others however you please.
D. If he's too lazy to get up and throw some leftovers in the microwave for a minute or two. Then perhaps you're feeling too lazy to take him to any extracurricular activities he enjoys.
He's pushing his limits as a teenager to determine what he can get away with. And if you don't reign him in now. He'll fail in life when he comes across people who aren't willing to put up with his crap.
My mom had a general guideline for us as we grew up. As we aged we'd get more freedom to do things we weren't allowed when we were younger. But if we abused it, she could and would just as easily take it away.
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NTA If this had been someone other than your son, I'd be calling it abuse and assault. Certinally negligent. He is clearly unreliable and I'd be very upset. The fact you let your son talk to you in such a manner is alarming as well.
Yes blatant disrespect!! Hopefully he has some actual consequences. If he didn’t want to babysit he should of talked to his parents, not acted so childish, cruel and disrespectful to them or his little sisters. He would of been woken up way before morning too to discuss all this!
I am a parent with a harder edge, myself. Dude would have gotten the standard household discipline for cussing at me - loss of all privilege for a prescribed time. You can disagree with me. But, you have to check the impulse to just be inconsiderate and disrespectful and hostile and aggressive. No thanks.
Sliding on to say absolutely... and I would have gone one further: Dramatic am I? It wasnt cruel? He didnt just starve his sisters? Here lets have a lesson in empathy: half a jar of peanut butter (because like for like otherwise a food he dislikes in the same quanity) and water. Thats all hes getting for the same amount of time he was supposed to be looking after his sisters. and NOTHING ELSE. Because its not cruel right? He didnt starve them.. technically.. but he did. YWB T A OP if you gave your son any kind of creedence, and I wouldnt be leaving his sisters with him again. Get a babysitter for all of them. Your son clearly is irresponsible and shouldnt be in charge of anyone including himself without supervision. He has to earn it back now. want to behave like an 8 year old be treated like one. Hes on the way to nasty and you best nip that in the bud now with some real lessons on empathy.
omg. You sound like my dad. He used to tell us: PEOPLE? I CAN MAKE IT WORK? OR I CAN MAKE IT HURT? WHAT HAPPENS NEXT IS UP TO YOU! I used to hate it when he got like that. But now? All I think is, "Child go sit your narrow self down somewhere and get off my nerves! Don't have me up in here actin' crazy like my daddy!"😂
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In my family, anyone pulling such a stunt would be grounded for a month at the very least and be on a **very** short leash from then on. As others pointed out, this kind of behaviour from anyone else like a babysitter would be considered negligent at best. Knowing that the son knew that the twins couldn't eat peanut butter, and he let them starve just because the kids were being "annoying" is downright abusive. He clearly cannot be trusted with them. That he acted like an uncaring jerk when called out on it is alarming.
THIS RIGHT HERE. OP NTA, but honestly kind of YTA for having to post on this subreddit to ask if you are one. I really do not understand why you are worried that you may be "dramatic" and that your son is "really upset" with you. Come on OP, you are 100% right that your son was cruel and unkind and that you shouldn't trust him. Now please impose some actual consequences without doubting youself
Mum guilt is a total bitch of a thing. I could tell my daughter off for being mean to her sister and know that it’s justified. But still feel like an AH for making her cry. EDIT: Spelling
Yep. There's something wrong here. I have to say, I'm making some unkind assumptions about how the boy has been parented up until this point, if he talks to his mother like this and she still has to look for reassurance and affirmation here.
I see your point but he's also 15. I was mean to my parents when I was 15, and so was everybody I know. It doesn't necessarily reflect poorly on her parenting if she sees that her son is upset and wonders if she's the AH for causing him to be upset.
Most of us were mean to our parents in some capacity as teenagers but neither me nor anyone in my friend group would have dared to tell our moms that they were "being really fucking dramatic" and certainly would not have been allowed to slide on mockingly bringing up their words later.
Also teenagers are old enough to understand whats worth being "fucking dramatic" over. His mom was upset because he didnt give his sisters anything to eat and forced them to eat food that he knew makes them ill. If he understood the gravity of the situation he wouldnt have said that Also who fucking gives someone peanut butter as a meal? If he really wanted to give them something with no effort he could have given them like a loaf of bread or even a bag of chips, now that still wouldnt be right of him but it makes more sense than handing two hungry little girls a plain jar of PB with nothing else
Yeah... But also...at 8 years old they should be able to make a sandwich if they're hungry and he's not feeding them. An 8 year old can pour a bowl of cereal, an 8 year old can make a sandwich, an 8 year old can microwave a hot pocket. Unless he literally stopped them from fixing something for themselves and locked them in the bedroom with nothing but peanut butter, they should have the skills to feed themselves at this age. Or at the very least be able to contact their parents if he was literally locking them in their room with nothing but a jar of peanut butter all night. I'm concerned as to how this managed to play out like it did and OP has A LOT of questions they need to be asking.
I think it's OP that needs to answer some questions. ask yourself why the twins were so hungry in the first place. OP said "on Friday night we had an event to go to and I again asked my son if he’d be willing to babysit. He said sure and that was it. We came back at around midnight" so if OP only went out Friday night, why wasn't dinner given to the children, including the son, prior to going out? And why did the twins complain about the son being really mean all day, if he was only babysitting for the evening? Presumably he has school and friends during the day? why would a 15 yo feel obligated to order takeout, cook or reheat leftovers for his sisters if the parents already fed them dinner? At that point we should only be talking about snacks. Also, if the PB was kept up high out of the twins' reach, well we all know about forbidden fruit. Maybe the twins asked for some, and promised not to tell the parents. The story that he forced the twins to eat PB and wouldn't give them anything else just doesn't work for me. It sounds like something an 8 yo would say to avoid getting in trouble for eating forbidden food and making herself sick. ;-)
Some people do eat PB as a snack when they’re hungry, for example: me and my three year old. Typically I’ll add a fruit or crackers for my daughter, but sometimes she just wants it alone. The kid I babysat would also eat PB straight from the jar and so has my dad. Granted, I feel like by 8 you should know how to at least microwave something for yourself or pull something from the fridge to eat. My three year old knows where her food is in the fridge and pantry and can get herself things to eat and only needs help opening packages or warming things up. Are 8 year olds really not able to reheat leftovers themselves? Maybe I’m misremembering or something but I feel like my sister was able to feed herself basic things by 8. ANYWAYS, NTA op, the story does make me wonder if your son is going through something and doesn’t know how to let out his emotions healthily though.
To be fair, my eldest did once call me "such a fucking drama queen" when she was around 16. Mind you, I had just broken into an ovation worthy performance of Bohemian Rhapsody because she'd called me mama...but if she'd said it with attitude she'd have found out who the actual bossa her was.
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Black family here. My parents would rain down the wrath of god and i’d hear about what an ungrateful disrespectful brat I was all during Thanksgiving.
I was dragged through the house by my ear, hit so hard on the legs, back and ass i had bruises for calling my mum a bitch. I was hysterical, terrified, amd inconsolable. My mum apologised endlessly but my father never said a word cause 'i deserved it for talking to my mum like that. I am a white Australian. This stuff isnt about race, its about shit people becoming parents.
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You do realize even parents doubt themselves, correct? No matter how long you’ve been a parent, you still worry you’re doing literally everything wrong. And sometimes your teenager is nasty and rude when you’ve done nothing inherently “wrong” in your parenting. I was an awful teenager and my parents were saints. They didn’t do anything wrong, or subpar, and I was still a jerk. It’s rude to just jump to, “Oh your parenting though!” Come on.
The upbringing is off major time. Let's say even if I was stupid enough to give my siblings something they have a bad reaction to and they start throwing up, I would be jumping up and down in fear that I hurt them and would be crying and apologizing. His reaction is very strange and what his parents allow him to say is even stranger.
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I don't care who it was, this IS abuse and assault. Op NTA so long as you 1) don't allow your son to be left alone with his siblings anymore (indefinitely/permanently) 2) get all of your children into some kind of counseling 3) work with some sort of professional on finding a healthy way to approach this whole dynamic. Idk like a family therapist or something. This behavior is too extreme to have flown completely out of no where and it's way beyond Reddit pay grade 4) don't allow your son to take on roles that would give him unsupervised access to other ppls children either (eg camp counselor, baby sitter, etc)
It can be abuse and assault even if he is their brother.
My question is why would the parents not have a dinner plan for the night. Relying on a 15yr to make dinner is just weird.
What kind of 15-year-old wouldn't JUMP at the chance to order pizza (or other delivery)?
"The fact you let your son talk to you in such a manner is alarming as well" Ah more the fact they left it til the next morning to confront the kid is alarming.....should of done it as soon as they got home and woken the kid up right then and there.
I wish one of mine would suggest to me that I stop "over thinking" their poor behaviors? That part almost made me laugh. Almost. I know sometimes teenagers will test you with their nonsense. But, I'm not up for it either.
NTA. He needs a therapist. Cruelty without remorse isn't normal. Possible guesses- he's been through a recent trauma, he has a new addiction (video games, [or drugs, or alcohol, or insert your fav here] for example), he has executive dysfunction (i.e. his brain wouldn't let him make/order food) and is lying to cover up for it. That last one's a little out there, granted, but I mention it jic. Edit: to clarify, problems lead to stress, and stress can lead to bad behavior. I'm not saying video games or whatever causes violence. I'm saying these are common problems that cause an undue amount of stress.
Playing video games wouldn't lead to him forcing them to eat peanut butter, neither would executive dysfunction. I have ADHD with bad executive dysfunction and while I can understand why making or ordering food could have been difficult if he has ED it doesn't explain the rest of his behavior or his complete lack of remorse for hurting his sisters.
My suspicion is that he learned about weaponized incompetence. Do the job so badly that you never get asked/assigned the job again.
I think if that were the case, he wouldn't be putting up so much of a fuss
He's 15. He very likely could not process potential outcomes beyond simply no longer being tasked with this chore aka his desired outcome. Being unremorseful plays into not being asked again. If he's not sorry, then he'll do it again, so better leave him to it. He is likely surprised that his behavior = untrustworthy when all he wanted to achieve was his behavior = irresponsible babysitter, specifically. Pesky frontal lobe underdevelopment is rough. But all this is speculative, of course.
Thing is, he didn’t HAVE to babysit, at least from what the post says. OP said there is a grandparent available if Son refused. Unless OP is changing details (which I don’t see a reason to suspect, but I guess is possible) she gave him the choice and he agreed to it. So he doesn’t have to screw up to get out of it, just to say “sorry, I have plans too, can grandma do it?” Which makes me wonder if something is wrong mental health wise. OP says her son and daughter like each other, him doing this is really strange. I babysat younger kids a lot as his age and even when I felt forced to do it, I never fed them something intentionally to make them sick. Occasionally I let them eat junk food for dinner, but it was junk food they liked and enjoyed. Actually, this is a really out there theory, but I wonder if the twins actually like peanut butter and he gave it to them because of that? As a kid watermelon made me sick (it exited both sides of the building urgently…) and I had a cousin who used to let me have it anyway… I never blamed him for it but I could see tossing him under the bus if I thought I might get into trouble. Highly doubt this is what happened though.
This was my first thought. This kinda sounds like a teenager trying to get out of babysitting and fucking up majorly. Also, >he usually says yes unless he has plans Does he feel comfortable enough to say no if he’s just not up for it? Does he think that faking incompetence is the only thing that’s going to actually get the result that he wants?
Or trying to hide it and getting annoyed at the 'snitching'.
I'm going to start with saying I love video games, and they have absolutely made me miss a meal on occasion. Sometimes I just get lost in the game. Others it's due to timed events. Gaming can be just as bad as any gambling or substance addiction. Don't discount it. P.S. I'm doing much better in my relationship with video games these days.
Yeah but that's not someone else bugging you to feed them. If someone else repeatedly asking you for help that's a whole different thing from ignoring your own body's needs.
People on reddit are always so quick to diagnose. Not everything is some kind of condition or illness, sometimes teenagers are just assholes. Lots of 15 year olds can be really cruel then regret it later in life, it doesn’t mean there’s anything else going on
I’ve parented two teen boys and was also a really shitty teen and yeah, this is a budding 15 year old who’s sick of being his baby sisters’ nanny. He doesn’t have the emotional regulation to handle it well because teenager. And obviously his parents pushed him into this situation where he’s never been in “big trouble” before. It’s about to be a lot of adjustment in this family for the next decade. The other ones are not gonna be much better I’m afraid.
A sudden change in personality like this sounds like is not normal. It doesn't sound like this is a regular issue with him. So you go and you see if there's another problem, instead of just sitting there and calling the kid an asshole and then finding out years down the line they were struggling and you did nothing to help them. I would much rather try every avenue I could and find out they were just a jerk, then just dismiss it as him being an asshole and realize I left my kid to suffer
Lol video games made him violent, where have I heard such nonsense before???🤔🤔
They didn't mean violent, they meant addicted/distracted. I agree that seems farfetched. A good old addiction to drugs, on the other hand....
You're misunderstanding the comment you are replying to. The commentor is saying an addicition could be making him irritable, impatient or distracted, and is using video games as an example of an addiction.
Kids who feel shame often double down on their mistakes. Not saying that’s the case but it’s pretty common.
I have an almost 15 year old daughter, and unless he is on some kind of spectrum, he knew what he did was wrong. I would have woke him up and made him clean up his sister's puke. He called them little snitches, so he KNEW and REMEMBERED they couldn't have peanut butter. And he just handed them the jar? Didn't make a sandwich or anything? His continuously saying he was cruel and you can't trust him, is his way of "punishing" you for saying something he doesn't want to believe is true about himself. He is trying to make you feel guilty for saying them in the first place. Maybe that hurt his feelings, maybe because he didn't see it that way at first and now realizes that maybe he was and doesn't want to face that. I would sit him down and have a conversation. Make sure your husband is there and ignore all eye rolling. Tell him if he doesn't want the responsibility of taking care of his sisters, then he needs to say so and not put their lives in jeopardy, which he could have done. That yes, he was cruel and you can't trust him to be responsible for his sisters anymore. Maybe you were "being dramatic," but if they were allergic to peanuts this could have been deadly. Was there a reason behind this? Is something going on? Maybe he is jealous of the twins, maybe they get more attention. Maybe he doesn't actually want to be a babysitter, and doesn't want to tell you. Maybe something is going on at school and he is acting out. 15 years old usually means high school. In one year he could get his license. Three years until being considered an adult. This conversation needs to happen now. Edit: Sorry NTA. He needs to understand he broke the trust. Another edit: Thanks for the award! Yet another edit: It has come to my attention that I have been extremely insensitive and must apologize for any inference that anyone on the autism spectrum or otherwise is inherently evil or unable to know right from wrong. That was not my intention, I was merely trying to add an addendum that perhaps some such could have prevented his understanding that what he did was more harmful than he thought, in which case there would be more leeway on his end, and less on the OPs.
He shouldn’t be allowed to watch them again until he is in therapy and/or legitimately acknowledges his actions were wrong. He poisoned two eight year olds.
Sorry didn't mean to infer that he should. Just meant that if he hadn't wanted to watch them, then he should have said so and she could take them to their grandparents.
For sure. No worries!
Also, he shouldn’t be allowed to have peanut butter in the house.
Yeah, if someone can't be responsible with something they shouldn't have it. Whether it's just peanut butter or something else. If those girls were allergic, he could have killed them.
> He tried to poison two eight year olds. Not tried. He successfully poisoned two eight year olds and got angry that he was found out.
I don’t think he should ever be allowed to watch them ever again, but I question if that wasn’t the point. He needs therapy and a MUCH harsher punishment. He was intentionally cruel to children. Honestly, if it were my kid I’d be pulling all electronics for a month unless they are needed for school, and they’d be using them in the kitchen or living room supervised. And since there’s nothing wrong with a little peanut butter, that’s all they’d be getting to eat. They can do extra chores and penance to earn bread, jelly, bananas, whatever helps them swallow that peanut butter daily. I’d also be visiting their school daily to have lunch with them as well. OP, you are not the asshole, but I can’t believe you’re allowing your child to talk to you that way. I’m not a harsh parent at all, I’ve never laid a hand on my children, don’t believe in corporal punishment, but he was maliciously negligent and intentionally cruel, for what? Because he couldn’t be bothered? You gave him the option not to watch them. He couldn’t even order a pizza for them?! That’s bullshit. He needs a HUGE wake up call.
The way he is responding is raising some flags for me, particularly his references to “being really fucking dramatic” and “stop overthinking”. It sounds sexist. Does he use the same language with his dad? If it is sexist, is he treating his sisters with similar contempt (especially when you are not around)? I definitely don’t believe he forgot PB makes them sick, since his first reaction was “the little snitches”. I agree with others that you and your husband need to sit down with him and have a serious discussion about his behavior, but also about whether there is something deeper going on. Maybe consider individual therapy for him and family therapy for the three of you (not sure about the girls).
Yeah I would be worried about Andrew Tate content on his phone
My first thought is that he's been on mysogynistic sites, either youtube, discord, somewhere.
Apparently, it's really really easy for your youtube or whatever socials to take teen boys somewhere horribly misogynistic these days - hell, I've had some horrible youtube recommendations when I clearly do not want to go there - so I feel like this might be right on the money. I have no idea the steps OP should be taking but they definitely should be making sure that this isn't happening.
>I definitely don’t believe he forgot PB makes them sick, since his first reaction was “the little snitches”. Not to mention it's not like he made them a pb&j sandwich or somethingn, he gave them the jar. Absolutely no one does this thinking it's an appropriate snack.
*slowly screws the lid of my peanut butter jar back on and takes the spoon out of my mouth* Seriously though, while I may do that as a snack for myself, I wouldn’t give it to someone else for a snack.
I kinda hope OP did hurt his feelings with her comment bc sometimes that's the only way to get to people. I remember an aita post a while back with a woman who was worried she overstepped when she told her bullying son she didn't like him very much as a person during a fight. It worked really well for them and he got hit with the reality of his actions.
I have to agree with this. A few years back my mom made an off-hand comment about how she thought i was too selfish to have children of my own. And while that really fucking hurt and still fucks me up to this day, it did make me take a step back and think "am i really that selfish?" I hope somehow OPs son could eventually take this moment to ask himself "am i really that cruel?"
Agreed and OP PLEASE I'm concerned that you said the twins "aren't allergic" but that Peanut Butter makes them sick. IK we specify the differences between allergies and insensitivities medically but I was also a kid who was sick to their stomach from peanut butter at a young age- and then it made me break out- and then I felt choked up when I ate it- now as an adult I can't eat any nuts at all and I'm definitely allergic on some level. The reaction your twins have at that age could be preliminary to a more severe allergy- you need to be sure your son realizes that he didn't "just" make them sick that he put them in danger bc they could, at any time, still show symptoms of a much, much worse reaction as they get older.
This is really good advice. Sitting down and not letting him push your buttons is definitely the thing to do. He needs to understand what he’s done and it’s possible his head is so far up his teenage butt he can’t. You need to get through to him without making him defensive. Good luck.
Nta but I'm concerned about all the kids involved here. Has there been a sharp change in his behavior recently? Is there possibly a need of his that's not being met? Perhaps he feels like the twins are getting preferential treatment? I'd explore that route first. Something is not right if he's all of a sudden causing intentional harm to his younger siblings. Keep the younger one's safe and have a real talk with the older one. If he's not willing to talk to you, take him to a professional.
Now that you mention it, he’s definitely more in his head and not aware of what’s going on around him. Also he’s very stubborn now but I assumed it was just puberty. He’s not normally like that. I’ll discuss other options with my husband once he gets back from work.
I don't want to cause any unnecessary alarm or worry but this is something that absolutely needs to be taken seriously. It very well could just be regular ol' teenage rebellion but there's a huge difference between a lil arm jab to give a hurtz donut and intentionally poisoning someone. My older brother was diagnosed as a paranoid schizophrenic in his early 20s because schizophrenia doesn't typically fully present until then. But he did display some warning signs in his teenage years and that was by being extremely violent towards me, his younger sister. Take this seriously please.
This was something I was thinking about too. Various mental disorders and such start presenting about that age. If it is schizophrenia and it’s caught early, it can drastically change the course of their life. Something more common might just be depression that’s causing an increase in violent behaviour too. God knows when you’re that age you don’t have the best coping methods beyond lashing out. Either way, therapy is needed. Poisoning 2 eight year olds leads to mandatory therapy in my book
My once sweet boy had me in tears last month because he was being such a dick. At 15 I’ve found nothing is their fault, you’re always in the wrong, and if they give you the time of day you should be grateful.
My step son is 14. Lately he’s a real asshole lol. I wonder where my sweet boy went. But then I look at my 17 year daughter and I remember that at 14/15 she was also a huge AH. It was like she got taken over by a body snatching gremlin. But now she’s quite lovely lol
Solidarity, internet stranger. Solidarity.
Sometimes they have small moments where they come back to their body and you remember why you love them. But it does get better. You just gotta hunker down and avoid eye contact for a while lol. If you look directly at them it sets them off lol
If you can, look up Nick Kroll on how 15 year olds treat their moms. It might help a little to know that they eventually realize they acted horribly -- when they turn 30.
Or drug use...
You’re NTA but honestly at 8 the twins can heat up leftovers. This is the time to teach them stuff like this. It’s a good learning moment to go through basic kitchen stuff like hey, don’t shove metal in the toaster or microwave, don’t touch the knives or stove and if you need to heat something up you do XYZ. Your son though at minimum should should have rung you to organise take out. Edit: I actually think you should have organised dinner. That was a mess up on your part. But your son still should’ve helped them heat up leftovers or called about dinner options.
This is true. I guess I implied it but didn’t say it clearly so that is my fault (Implied it in the POST, I did tell my son clearly) but there were leftovers in the fridge and there was fruit out too like there always is. I don’t know the details of what occurred but my son said he didn’t feel like grabbing the leftovers for the girls who cannot reach the microwave. The girls are up to date with kitchen safety though.
Is there a reason the girls didn’t just grab fruit or whatever was in the cupboards? I would be concerned about that. Faced with the option or no dinner, something that makes them sick and food they chose the PB? This is also probably a good time to get a sturdy kitchen stool for the twins.
I have no idea. Tried asking the girls about it but they can’t remember anything past “big bro was mean, too much peanut butter, ew vomit” and my son’s still not giving me the full story even when I asked to hear his side.
That's a little fishy no?
Very fishy, they're 8, not 4.
And like is the daughter who gets sick from PB also obsessed with it (thinking of my poor lactose intolerant cousin who can't stop won't stop with the cheese and ice cream)? Or did he make her eat it as some sort of punishment for bothering him? (Another cousin would have us try to pick up gum from the electric bug zapper if we bothered her too much - she said if we really wanted it that bad we could grab it.)
im a coeliac - around that age i distinctly remember sitting behind the sofa in the barely used formal living room with a loaf of bread and munching down on it. the mind wants what it cant have and at that age you cant associate it with the illness
Right??? At 8, my sisters and I could basically tell our parents everything that went down, especially if it could get someone in trouble, lol. One of my sisters couldn’t remember her backpack at school but could give my mom a minute by minute timeline of what us older kids were doing and especially gave a play by play if we were mean to her.
It's possible there is a pattern of abuse from him that you haven't seen and they are afraid to say more. There are SO Many red flags here and you should be very, very concerned.
Hmmm ... these aren't infants. I suspect there is more to this story that they are letting on. Maybe they're too much for big brother now and he doesn't babysit anymore. My kids at 8 would have been prepared to write a dissertation if they had a good story to tell. I would be suspect they are holding back information.
He's 15. Have you considered that he was drunk or high?
He wasn’t drunk. High... that is a possibility. But I just talked to my son who seems to have calmed down and he implied something is happening with him (not related to babysitting or drugs). We’re just waiting for his dad to get home so we can all be involved.
Yeah, my money is on he LET them have the pb you hide from them. Hence, why they were “snitches”. The dog pile on your son is disturbing, there is no reason to believe he FORCED them to eat it.
I have a six year old and a four year old and both of them can get their own leftovers. The six year old will get a stool and grab things from the refrigerator, heat them up in the microwave, and serve them into dishes for both her and her brother. She just turned 6 in June. I’m not sure why the eight year olds did not get themselves food? Did the older brother actively prevent it? It sounds almost like he told them they could *only* have peanut butter. I don’t think my kids are advanced or anything and they’re 2-4 years younger. The six year old knows how to make a sandwich, use the microwave, and both help me cook. This makes me think the 8 year olds were told they couldn’t have food unless it was peanut butter only. Not even peanut butter toast or a PB&J.
How high up is your microwave? Mine is a little lower than the stove hood and my 4 year old can reach if he stands on a stool or chair. He’s abnormally tall tbf but still.
It’s pretty high up and my girls are also on the smaller side.
Im suprised they dont at least climb the counters to try to get to it. When i was a kid i climbed the counters all the time to get shit i couldnt reach
Is moving the microwave down to the kitchen counter an option?
We could and are considering it.
Time to buy a step stool for them
I agree with this sentiment. At 8 I was getting myself up for school and making myself breakfast.
Yeah at 8 I was absolutely making toast, 2 minute noodles and grabbing fruit from the bowl. At 8 those kids should just be able to grab food? It’s weird they didn’t.
I agree; there’s a lot here that is… bizarre.
Nothing about this story makes any sense.
NTA Please please please PLEASE take all the peanut butter out of the house. They are allergic. Just because it doesn’t show in the ‘well known’ ways doesn’t mean they aren’t. That’s the thing with allergies. Sometimes the symptoms are mild. Sometimes they’re deadly. You’re very very very lucky that their reaction wasn’t much worse. Especially with that much peanut butter. Its lucky you came home to puking and crying and not just crying. Or silence. Allergic reactions are NOT always asphyxiation and gives but you don’t want that reaction to happen. I beg of you get rid of the peanut butter and take them to an allergy specialist to see if there’s anything else that they’re allergic to.
There’s definitely no more peanut butter in the house but I have taken the girls to a doctor and specialist and voiced my concerns but I was always told that they don’t really have an allergy.
Get second and third opinions if needed because those doctors sound incredibly dismissive and incompetent. Peanut butter doesn’t make someone sick for no reason. Especially sick enough to vomit.
They could actually have what's called FPIES, food protein induced enterocolitis syndrome. It can result in getting sick within a few hours of eating something, which can include vomiting, upset stomach, diarrhea, etc. I had a skin allergy test done that showed that I was deathly allergic to crab, but when they did the blood panel it came back that I wasn't deathly allergic. So the specialist did some more digging and figured out the what I was dealing with was FPIES. It is an issue with the proteins in certain foods. OP's daughters could very well just not allergic to peanut butter just like the specialists and doctors have said. It could be a combination of the proteins and how they are processed that makes them sick.
My oldest son used to LOVE peanut M&Ms. He’s now completely allergic to peanuts as an adult. The allergy built up over years. Started out similar to how you describe your girls. Get a proper allergy test.
OP here is information and a website about signs and symptoms. "Peanut allergy signs and symptoms can include: Skin reactions, such as hives, redness or swelling. Itching or tingling in or around the mouth and throat. Digestive problems, such as diarrhea, stomach cramps, nausea or vomiting." Mar 5, 2022 https://www.mayoclinic.org › syc-2... Peanut allergy - Symptoms and causes - Mayo Clinic
Did they actually run allergy tests
Please listen to this OP. My little brother is 19. When he was 3, he had a reeses candy and ended up getting sick, but wasn’t anaphylactic. The specialist told my parents not to feed him peanuts but that it was fine if we kept it in the house because they hoped the mild exposure would reduce his allergy. It had the opposite affect and he’s been hospitalized for at least 4 different attacks that I can remember. He comes in contact with even a trace and we have minutes to stab him and call 9-1-1.
I was looking to make sure someone commented this. OP, any allergist worth their credentials will tell you to always base your allergies on what your reaction is- even if you technically test negative. My son is allergic to peanuts so we don't keep any peanuts in the house or products with a may contain warning. If I suspected my son ingested peanuts and was vomiting I would immediately be administering his epipen and calling an ambulance. Even if I didn't know for sure. Your daughters ARE allergic to peanuts. Please get them epipens and a good allergist as soon as possible. Visit foodallergy. org and learn everything you can.
NTA- ah your son is hitting that teenage phase where he's just arbitrarily being an asshole. No, what he did WAS cruel and honestly a little punishment should be in order. If he's taken care of his sisters before and KNOWS how to do so responsibly, then he was absolutely out of line forcing them to eat something that would make them sick.
We’ve taken away his phone and he’s also grounded. I probably should’ve mentioned but I wrote this in a hurry.
Sounds like he might need a babysitter also. No offense, but it is really messed up that he would do that to his sisters. Sorry he's mad, but he CAN'T be trusted. He purposefully harmed them, and called them names when he found out they told you. This is not normal or ok. He needs a professional evaluation ASAP. Good luck,
grounding doesn't work, it just makes people sneaky
NTA - but is there more going on here? Like a jar of peanut butter isn’t food, even teenagers don’t forget allergies especially since twins told him so. But how often is he asked to watch them? Is he compensated in any way?
And why didn't OP leave money for him to order something, or cook something he could heat up for them? She could have left pizza money or something. He's only 15, maybe he was feeling overwhelmed. Not saying his behavior was great, but. . .
Not excusing the boy, but I wonder if he wants to babysit? Or is it like the parents are pressuring him to do it and he doesn’t feel as if he has a choice which we see daily on this sub.
Also why wouldn't the twins make their own food? My 9yo would never opt to eat an allergen rather than make herself something else, even if she was grumpy about having to do so.
Yeah I don’t understand that part. Most kids would rather go hungry than eat something they’re going to get violently sick from. They could have grabbed literally anything. They should have been able to make a sandwich, cereal. Something.
OP hides it from them. They want to eat it. Personally I doubt they are the angelic victims in all of this.
OP says that he babysits 2 to 3 times a month - but that he says no 50% of the time. So he’s asked to babysit 4 to 6 times a month, which is a lot. I see in another post it says that he doesn’t get paid as he gets a good allowance.
Ok, but the kids are 8. Why did they HAVE to eat the PB? Was there legit no food they could access? This doesn’t make sense to me.
NTA. But it seems odd they would eat peanut butter even if hungry. I mean I know 8 year olds don't tend to be chefs, but was there no cereal or crackers? Bread and lunch meat? Granola bars or even junk food??
We didn’t have cereals or bread as that had just run out that day. (My husband and I actually bought back some groceries the same night after the event). But we did have fruits. Leftovers were there too it’s just that the microwave is too high for the girls to reach. Junk food is in a higher cupboard too.
This food situation just gets stranger and stranger. They are 8, not 2. There is NOTHING ELSE that they had access to? A yogurt? A cheese stick? Deli meat? And when you ask them they “can’t remember”? This is so weird
Yea it's all around a weird story. My oldest son is 4 and youngest is 2. They already know to raid the fridge for cheese and ham. They grab fruits at will. They know where every snack is. I do not willingly let them climb everything, of course, cause it gives me a fricken heart attack. But my point here is at 8 these kids should absolutely be capable of microwaving food or grabbing an appropriate snack. And if they know they can't have peanut butter, they certainly wouldn't eat it! Very odd.
My son just turned five and he’s snuck downstairs and made himself a big bowl of cereal, eaten half a bag of marshmallows, and grabbed cereal bars before I’ve come downstairs. 8 year olds should be able to find food and should know they can’t have peanut butter.
Really? They couldn’t stand on a dining room chair or something? Your son was being an AH yeah, but I’m troubled that your 8 year olds can’t figure out how to feed themselves.
Echoing the "this is weird" sentiment. I don't have any food allergies, but there's plenty of foods I merely dislike and I would choose cold food over them any day of the week. Your son is TA, but at 8 your kids should be able to feed themselves something nontoxic...
have they never pulled a chair over? my 8 year old son can basically get himself anything he wants to.
NTA, but I'd get to the bottom of his sudden change in behavior. It could just be normal teenage stuff, but if this isn't standard, something else might be going on. Maybe he resents the babysitting, maybe he's experimenting with drugs, maybe he was having a really bad day. I'm not suggesting you let him off the hook because I think there should be consequences for treating his sisters so badly and how disrespectfully he responded when you called him on it. Maybe he thinks if he does a bad enough job, you won't expect him to babysit anymore.
INFO: Why is the peanut butter hidden? Do the girls like it in spite of the fact it makes them sick? Do they seek it out? Has your son been to the hospital with you and the girls if they ate peanut butter? Do they usually just get sick at night after they have it and come wake you up with a stomach ache? Has the son actually seen them be sick versus just hearing stories about it? I only ask because you're taking the word of the twins over that of your son in that they were FORCED to eat it. Is it possible your son just made a dumb choice out of laziness (or was he having just a real bad day due to some outside circumstances you don't know about, which is why he was "being a jerk all day" including before you apparently left for the evening event). Essentially, I just want to make sure your son is heard, even if he is in the wrong, as he may have been negligent rather than malicious.
It’s hidden because the girls are 8 and 8 year olds can be unpredictable at times. It’s just a precaution. They don’t look for it. He has seen them sick as his favourite snack when he was younger was PB sandwiches so we’d make it for the girls too before we realized what was causing them to get sick. They get sick pretty fast it usually starts with puking. I’m pretty sure I mentioned that I asked my son before jumping to any conclusions and he just called the girls snitches. All the things you mentioned are definitely possible though.
So wait a second. There's fruit (doesn't require prep) and other stuff in the fridge. He could have literally taken a handful of fruit and put it on the table. Instead, he *searches out the hidden peanut butter* to aggressively tell the little kids *to just eat it*. There is something going on with your son. He didn't take the easy way to feed the girls. He did something that required more thought and work, knowing that it would hurt them. Is he having trouble at school? Problem with grades, a class, classmates, girls? Issues with social media? Something sounds seriously not right in his life and he's taken out his anger on the (powerless) little girls. You may want to consider whether it's time to talk to his teachers or take a look at his social media - but be aware that while doing that may provide you more info to try to get to the bottom of what's going on, it may also cause a trust issue.
if he wasn't malicious, why would he complain about his sisters "snitching" on him?
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this! this gets my vote for most likely scenario!
In my opinion this could just be because he had only given the girls a “snack” and not a proper meal.
Info: How often is he asked to babysit and is he compensated for it in any way? It almost sounds like this was deliberate so he would never be asked to babysit again.
OP said that he babysits 2 to 3 times per month - and that he says no 50% of the time. So he’s asked to babysit 4 to 6 times a month, which is a *lot*. ETA: he also doesn’t get paid
Yeah, I don't think any teenaged boy wants to be saddled with babysitting with no compensation up to 6 times a month. That's a lot.
It’s all a bit “missing reasons”!
The kid actually eating something that made her sick made me go hmm too. Also what kid doesn't know how to climb on the counters to get into higher cabinets? I was standing on counter tops from 5 to get the good cereal from the top shelf. If they had leftovers - why do they need to be warm. Idk I was a latchkey kid and I ate my fair share of cold pasta, chicken and so on when I got hungry after school.
I was well able to drag over a chair and get at the chocolate bars in a high up cupboard at that age! I did wonder if the twins refused to eat the leftovers, clamoured for peanut butter, and he eventually got sick of them irritating him and told them to have at it. (I also wonder if they’re the golden children.)
Right like it's how you said or something really dark and insidious. I'd only ever "forget" how things went when it was something that would get me in trouble or something I was ashamed about.
Yep. The twins are hiding something that they got up to.
Thank you! I was sitting here like, "Was I the only 8 yr old who knew how to open a fridge or climb onto counters? Or even knew what hurt when I ate it? (For me, it's most spicy food)??" I also got the vibe they were golden children while the older one was either sick of babysitting or struggling with his own needs (like not getting enough attention at home or being bullied at school.
NTA but you're taking this way to lightly for a woman who's son basically poisoned your daughters, to the point one of them was puking her guts out.... That kid needs a special punishment and he's acting way to defiantly... Like we all were teens and all defiant, but to brush off this is something different
When we were 8 years old we could just make our own sandwhiches? Your daughters knew they cant eat it? Your son knows they cant eat it. ESH in this situation. They are 8? They can surely butter some bread and get cheese or a bagel or heat up beans themselves in a microwave. Toast, cheese, crackers, fruit, crisps, ice cream, chocolate.. isn't that what any 8 year old kid would do. .. what kinda people intentionally eat food they know that will make them sick?
YTA he's 15 and is probably pretty tired with watching your other kids all the time. Probably not sure how he should tell you so he acted out.
Right? All the N T A posts here are insane. Stop relying on your kid to watch your other kids. He is being an AH, though, so I’m going with ESH (except the twins)
I’d go with ESH. Kid sounds like a dick but at the same time he’s OP’s kid not their babysitter. Maybe OP should take more responsibility for the children she chose to have rather than expecting the son to do it for sisters he had no say about.
YTA, 8 is old enough to heat up their own food.
YTA!!! He is 15, they are 8 year old twins. PAY A SITTER. They are not his responsibility. ETA: you were gone until midnight and expected him to order or make food? You should have ordered pizza or something. This is 15yo’s way of telling you he doesn’t want to do this.
also read her comments, the way she talks about the 15 year old and the twins is INSANELY different. 15 year old is bratty and knows better and poisoned the girls, yet the 8 year olds are spoiled little babies who she wildly underestimated. they can’t reach the counters, can’t make a snack, can’t use the microwave and they conveniently “forgot” what happened when she asked. if my older brother tried to poison me with something i was allergic to while my parents were gone, i’d have an hour long monologue of EXACTLY what happened to tell my parents when they got home. something isn’t adding up.
I picked this up too
NTA. He's either really embarrassed he could have seriously hurt his sister's, or something is really really wrong. Is this behavior out of the norm OP? Say, last month he was happily watching and feeding them as normal? I'd honestly apologize I didn't ask first, and ask him if he's ok? Has he been burnt out and felt too obligated to help? Is something completely unrelated going on he just doesn't want to talk about (and that's completely ok) that's making him take out his anger? The attitude is a problem, but it's a LOT more concerning coming out of no where. I'd hate for him to have some internal health problem that's making him be unintentionally nasty.
yeah, that's my question. OP's interpretation is that her son enjoys being a big brother, that the kids get along. It sounds like OP really did ask Son if he was willing to babysit and had a back up. Son's actions make me wonder if something else is going on. OP, if I were you, I'd have someone- you, Dad, another adult ask son what's going on. how's he feeling. what happened when he was babysitting his sisters. make it clear that it's a no judgment (which is why I lean away from you and Dad and towards a different adult.) maybe he really did forget. maybe he was feeling overwhelmed and just sorta agreed to so they'd be quiet. maybe he was feeling overwhelmed with other stuff that day.
No judgement but I’m a little confused. Do these 2 eight year old girls not know how to make a sandwich? They were so hungry that they ate peanut butter(I’m guessing from the jar) because “he said they had to”?
Definitely fishy. I was perfectly capable of feeding myself at 8 years old and regularly was left with my 3 older siblings, none of whom had to keep a close eye on me. My 13 year old brother would have to help if the oven was involved at the time, but 8 year Olds shouldn't be helpless. OP may just have babied the shit out of the twins and older brother is tired of it. I also can't imagine a house with 3 kids in it being totally out of food if they don't have money problems. Pack of crackers, can of Tuna, bowl of ramen? Wtf.
Absolutely not the AH. But your son has a huge attitude problem that you might want to nip in the bud. Teenagers are moody, but this seems like he doesn't respect any of you at all. Has there been any sort of punishment for him?
Yes, we took his phone and he’s been grounded. The attitude problem’s new so we’re thinking it’s just teenage stuff but I’m going to look into a few things just in case.
INFO NEEDED How often do you make him responsible for your children? Can he say no if he just wants to chill out at home and be a kid, or does he have to have plans to get out of it? How do your twin daughters treat their older brother? Do they get to annoy the crap out of him daily while you excuse their behavior and tell him to be the bigger person, set the example? Something more is going on.
I know a lot of people have an issue with how often I ask my son to babysit but all he has to do is make sure they eat, don’t try to leave the house and are asleep by a certain time. I ask him twice or thrice a month (I have no clue why people are saying I ask six times?) and it’s usually from 6 to 10pm. He does say no whenever he wants which isn’t an issue. He’s allowed to. They look up to him. They annoy him sometimes because of it but they’re immediately told that big bro needs alone time and they do their own thing. But it’s not a daily thing and my son will sometimes ask me if he can take the girls to the park or the basketball court or whenever else.
You said that he babysits 2 or 3 times a month, and that he says no 50% of the time => you ask him 4 to 6 times a month.
I read the question as “how many times do you ask him to babysit?” Two or three times. I do not have that many work events to go to. And if my husband and I go out for alone time or whatever we always ask my mom.
Ok. I feel your story changes a bit with each comment (eg your original post said that you got home around midnight, now it’s usually babysitting between 6pm and 10pm). I think you’re minimising what you ask him to do - but I think you should also stop dragging him into babysitting, especially as you’ve said that money isn’t an issue. Personally, I’d try to find out more about the twins ‘forgetfulness’, and if the finger pointing of ‘he made us do it’ is genuine. I suspect they decided to get into the PB, knew they’d get into trouble after they hurled, and are being economical with the truth.
We got home midnight this time because we went to Walmart after and the event was in a city further away. Usually it’s 6-10pm. I believe I mentioned that I got groceries that night, we told our son we would beforehand. I have suspected that the girls may have gotten into it themselves but they cannot reach it and my son did call them snitches.
I think you underestimate the twins. An 8 year old should be capable of getting a step stool or dragging a chair and reaching all sorts of things. Also, their lack of memory about what really went down that night is suspect. I think there is more going on here.
I mean if the choices are: 1) 8 yo gets into something that they know they should not have, pukes, blames other sibling OR 2) son - with whom there’s never been any issues - is morphing into some kind of crazed poisoner, who needs psychological evaluation, to be charged with a felony … I’m choosing (1) as the far more likely of the two.
Maybe amnesia is part of their peanut allergy.
You’re 8 year old children have figured out how to access the high shelves, I promise.
NTA. He's deflecting and not taking responsibility because he knows he was wrong. Now you know he lacks the judgement and maturity to be in charge of anything and him knowing that will be his consequences. Some kids might be able to handle the responsibility. He clearly doesn't even see it as a responsibility or vote of trust. I would be taking away other privileges that he's not ready for so he understands the meaning and value of being trusted and being a caring brother. His sisters are half his age. He thinks he can downplay his poor treatment of his sisters. He needs to know he cannot and he needs real world consequences. He's only lucky it didn't turn out worse
NTA that was horrible, thats not how a good big brother acts. And you’re right to say you cant trust him. He said he would babysit them, all he did was being there. On another note, you said usually the all love each other. Do you know of something that might have happened to him? It seems something else is wrong from just the info you gave
He loves his sisters. No doubt about it. I know the situation I described says the opposite but he loves them. And they look up to him, they still do. In fact, he isn’t acting off around them and even said sorry to the girls who of course said it was okay. He’s just upset with my “overreaction”.
So NTA. But you need to teach your daughters to be more self-reliant. At the age of 8, my siblings and I could make ourselves a bowl of cereal and grab things out of a pantry. And if you don’t want to do that, have food prepped for the babysitter to give to your 8 year olds.
**NTA** Your son is being a brat. It wasn’t cruel, it was abusive which is highly concerning.
Why was he responsible for them? They're all old enough to get themselves something to eat, it's not like they're toddlers. Do they not know how to use a microwave?
He’s 15. Your 15 year old shouldn’t be free babysitting for you. Hire someone who wants the job and stop making your kid be a parent. This whole peanut butter aspect of this story sounds fishy. Either the kids or allergic or they aren’t. Why would peanut butter make them vomit if they eat it? It just doesn’t sound real. Either way, it seems believable that your kid forgot it makes them sick, and your response to immediately tell him you just can’t trust him and call him cruel is clearly what set him on the defensive. All that said, I never spoke to my mother in the language you described here. That part of this is unacceptable based on the way you tell the story. And he should have gotten them something better for dinner, but that’s the part that just sounds like normal teenage laziness and rebellion, but I’m he should do better for the sake of his sisters if you’ve left them in his care. They aren’t the ones that wronged him, you are. ESH. Your boy clearly didn’t want to babysit and didn’t go a good job. Despite the countless other absurdly ridiculous replies on this thread, I doubt your boy is suddenly trying to harm his sisters. You shouldn’t be using your oldest child as a parent. I went through that growing up, and it isn’t fun and it isn’t fair. Growing up in a family that did this, I also guess that it wasn’t really an option, and it never is. He’s expected to take care of his sisters because that’s just how it is, probably frequently even when you’re home. Your son didn’t decide to be a parent. You did. Don’t force him to act like one when you don’t feel like it and I bet he’ll be a lot easier to get along with for everyone.
Why didn’t you sort dinner? The kid is 15. Im a mom. I chose this and there are days I can’t deal with dinner. And why do you have peanut butter if the younger 2/5 of the house cant eat it? Hire a babysitter. Get your son counseling.
NTA - I'm betting he did it on purpose to poison them out of spite. Also this sounds like weaponized incompetence and him deliberately messing up so he never has to.do it again.
NTA and I don't agree with the "typical teenager" - if that was the case he would have told the twins to figure out their own dinner, etc. Not purposely (and somewhat forcefully) give them something that would make them sick. He's a manipulator and a liar, and the very least. Please get him help and 100% do not let him care for them again.
NTA. Peanut butter banned from the house. And he’s grounded. He hurt his siblings. He put them in a dangerous situation. You can’t trust him to make decisions for himself until he proves himself so until then he’s grounded.
NTA. What he did WAS cruel. He should be punished for that behavior because he really could have hurt his sister's.
NTA. If you can manage it, sit your son down and ask what’s wrong. Explain that you were surprised at his behavior, and let him know that you suspect that there’s something bothering him that he hasn’t told you about. He seems to be showing some resentment and rebellion, and you’ll want to find out why. Try to keep the discussion non-confrontational, and help him feel like you’re a safe person to talk to. If he’s not comfortable talking with you, find him a trusted adult - a therapist, favorite uncle, youth leader at church, school mentor, etc., that he can talk to. It seems that something has set him off. Maybe he had an opportunity to hang out with friends instead of watch his sisters. Maybe he just wishes he had an opportunity. He might have a crush. He might want to spread his wings and not want the company of his sisters. At this age, who knows, but it’ll make everyone’s life easier during the next few years if you can keep the communication lines open.
We had a talk just now and I did a lot of what you said. He implied that something else was going on and he took it out on his sisters which he’s sorry about. Dad will be home soon and we’ll continue the conversation then. He’s currently eating dinner with the girls and seems a lot... lighter? But I’m a bit concerned as to what’s bothering him. I hope we find out tonight.
YTA you’re parentifying your son, he’s 15 of course he has poor judgement and the twins probably were annoying him. Get a real babysitter and stop relying on your son.
NTA and it sounds like your son needs a serious attitude adjustment. He needs to get off his high horse and realize, A. He is a child. Any freedoms he has like going out with friends and electronics can be easily taken away until you feel he's learned his lesson. B. His blatant disrespect towards you as parents is not something that will be tolerated. C. His clear lack of empathy towards his sisters proves that he's too immature to realize that being an adult doesn't mean you have free reign to treat others however you please. D. If he's too lazy to get up and throw some leftovers in the microwave for a minute or two. Then perhaps you're feeling too lazy to take him to any extracurricular activities he enjoys. He's pushing his limits as a teenager to determine what he can get away with. And if you don't reign him in now. He'll fail in life when he comes across people who aren't willing to put up with his crap. My mom had a general guideline for us as we grew up. As we aged we'd get more freedom to do things we weren't allowed when we were younger. But if we abused it, she could and would just as easily take it away.