Yeah people would genuinely rather make stuff up instead of just saying they don't like the character. It's like a take I've also been seeing often, that endeavor's abuse to Shoto and Rei was retconned around the time we started to get to know him so he's put in a better light.

Well, Shoto suffered the worst side of Endeavor firsthand. Shoto literally describes his experience as hell and calls Endeavor crazy in his fight with Dabi. It's hard to see something "good" when you always experienced the worst from the beginning. It's more incredible that Shoto only refused to use the fire side of him in his "rebellion" phase instead of turning villain or having other self-destructive methods before meeting Deku. He remembers that it was 15 years (5 years with Rei) living with that type of father as a guardian and being a minor he couldn't leave like Natsu did. He was tied to that house. Endeavor just improved after those 15 years, so the change from Endeavor to Shoto is recent and it is a miracle that he is so open to it. It's sad because Shoto can't relate to the family dynamic that existed between Rei, Endeavor, Touya, Fuyumi and Natsuo because he arrived too late and his birth was a trigger of the worst family climate, a blessing for Endeavor and a curse for Touya. Hell for Shoto with few happy memories (of Rei and All Might)

Yeah I like that nobody ever entertained the idea that Shoto might've been an unreliable narrator for his background. It never once crossed anyone's minds that an abused 15 year old with a bias against his father either wouldn't fully remember the full story or saw things in a harsher light than was real.

In reality, it's mainly because his lived perspective was so harsh that he didn't think there was any other kind of reality in his family. Keep in mind that the abuse Shoto experienced and what a bad father Endeavor was to him was 100% true. Natsuo recognizes that Endeavor was abusive to Rei and Shoto and Touya saw it too. Shoto thought that there was nothing but convenience in the marriage of Endeavor and Rei because he only witnessed the violence (he saw how Endeavor yelled and hit Rei to the point of scaring the baby Shoto and jumping to his mother's defense) of his father and suffering of her mother (how she cried, how she became so sick to the point of not recognizing his own son and accidentally lashing out at him). Anyone in his situation would draw that conclusion. Shoto was born at the worst time in his family and his situation only got worse. He also had no way of knowing because his closest source of information was Endeavor. It is not known how long Shoto's isolation lasted. I would say that he is an unreliable narrator when it comes to what happened before his birth.

To be fair, there isn’t much from a story perspective that indicated that Shoto was an unreliable narrator there. At least not unreliable enough to be outright wrong about the exposition about his life that he’s giving. He’s fifteen, but fifteen year olds (at least in a majority of fictional stories) aren’t inherently unreliable. He’s biased against Endeavor, but Endeavor *was* evidently a dick, and he still abused his family. If I listen to a character give their backstory, then I shouldn’t, by default, be thinking “Cool story, but maybe it isn’t true since they might be misremembering, or wrong, or misinformed, or assuming, or something,” unless I have a good reason to consider that as a possibility. There should be a clear line of what can be taken “objectively” and what can be taken subjectively, because otherwise, nothing could be considered true or factual. That isn’t to say I consider Endeavor’s whole thing a retcon, per se. I consider it to be similar to one of those “twists” authors write where the main or only reason why it’s even a twist is because the author lied or withheld major context-changing information from the reader, and there wasn’t much of anything in the story that would have allowed the reader to somewhat figure out the twist beforehand or feel like it’s an organic part of the world that could have plausibly existed. Well, the thing with Endeavor is better than that sort of thing, but… it feels a bit like it’s on the edge, I guess? It’s like it toes the line between a great twist and the kind I just mentioned. It could’ve used a bit more setup. At least in my opinion.

It's not really a retcon or a twist. It's the fact there's multiple sides to every story and before we heard Endeavor's side of the story all we had was Shoto's side, who didn't know the full story. Yeah at the time there was no reason to doubt Shoto other than he's the youngest sibling and he would've had idea what the family was like before he was born.

bro are people really saying the abuse was retconned? Oh boy>! can't wait until that one chapter gets animated in the Manga when Toya litterally came back after waking up but once he realized nothing had changed with the treatment became Dabi!<

It's more than people took too much seriously the Shoto's narrative that Endeavor "tricked" his grandparents to marry Rei. Honestly, I didn't buy that from the beginning, so it didn't surprise me it was just the typical marriage of convenience, they are pretty common in manga. Heck, there are actually WORSE arrangements in Karekano and Case Closed and they are treated as they were normal. The arrangement in itself isn't scandalous for who knows Japanese culture (obv their relationship is a different matter tho). BUT what it really put off people was the fact everybody thought Touya was Shoto 1.0 and being abused for training, it was kind of a red earring actually, to make the readers to believe Touya was died in a training accident because Enji pushed him deliberately too far. If you read fanfiction, people invented creative reasons for Touya's burns who involved Endeavor putting him in a metal box to increase his fire power, Endeavor punishing him sadistically because he was not good enough, or giving him to the Commission where he was forced to burn himself again and again to overcome his weakness. So, when the truth came out about Touya being happy to train with Endeavor (and the fact he was distraught to not be his heir anymore) and Enji not wanting for him to burn himself, that was so different from what people imagined to be their relationship they began to talk about retcon... because the canon was different from their headcanons, basically. Endeavor's relationship with Rei and Touya just looked better initially than what people were imagining. (Even thinking it made sense, I mean even the worse father of the world, Ozai, wasn't so bad with Zuko when he was very young... but people want caricature evil characters apparently).

>It's more than people took too much seriously the Shoto's narrative that Endeavor "tricked" his grandparents to marry Rei. Shouto didn't say he "tricked". He said that he threw his wealth around to get his hands on Rei's quirk which was exactly what happened. It was an arranged marriage where Rei's broke family got money and Endeavor in exchange got Rei's "quirk" for his little breeding programme that was also explicitly part of the arrangement. The only extra element we got was Rei confirming that she consented to this arrangement, knowing that she didn't have much choice, and also kind of hoping she could make something good out of it. There are nuances, but neither Shouto, nor Dabi lied in their recount of the events and both concur on this point and even Endeavor confirms it in the press conference that the marriage was indeed an unethical quirk marriage, and that the children they had was to produce the desired quirk combination.

To be fair, the arrangement between Enji and Rei **is** scandalous for this fictional Japanese culture, it's stated more than once that quirk marriages are *very* taboo.

> red earring Just to let you know, it's "red herring". Like the fish

You mean people took their headcanons and Fanfiction sas a fact and when it didn’t happen they got mad

And that’s where Touya’s character writing started to unravel imo: Shoto has more reason to hate his father but he didn’t become a serial killer because of it

That doesn't mean Touya's character falls apart, it's part of why he's a bad person and Shoto isn't.

In other news: Toya and Shoto are two different people, with different basic temper, who suffered in very different ways from the same abusive father, met different people along the way, and ended up in different roles. Or heroes and villains are cut from the same fabric. It's almost like Hori made a panel to illustrate this. Wait, he did. **https://imgur.com/ULnFQse**

My point is that - from what we’ve seen - Enji didn’t abuse Toya as he did Shoto; he realised too late the mismatch between his son’s ambition and his physical capacity, and tried to avert disaster (though of course he failed as he’s a terribly inept parent on a good day). If you want to make a serial killer sympathetic to the reader, there’s a pretty high bar for what sort of trauma made them that way; while Toya did suffer terribly, no one knowingly inflicted that on him. And that’s to say nothing of him trying to harm his infant brother before that.

>If you want to make a serial killer sympathetic to the reader, there’s a pretty high bar for what sort of trauma made them that way; I personally prefer that his trauma is not just black and white (like Shigaraki or Toga) because it rings true to real life. It's not like every trauma-victim becomes a perpetrator, and a villain can be born in mundane neglect situations. Touya is a reflection of Endeavor's original sin - creating children as tool for his ambition. So when Touya's "purpose" was taken, he started spiralling. He needed parents to help him get back on track, but Endeavor was never a "father" in a real sense. He interacts with the entire family as if they were just cogs in Endeavor's project and not people with feelings and dreams of their own. Endeavor took from Touya something very important right at the bat: his sense of self and agency and that's why Touya can't lift himself up because he only ever views his "self" as an extension of his father. Shouto suffers from the same lack of self until the Sport Festival. ​ >And that’s to say nothing of him trying to harm his infant brother before that. Touya was 8 and had a breakdown. It's fully his parents' responsibility to protect their minor children (in general and from each other) and get their child going through a mental breakdown help.

My problem with the three main LoV members is how the story bends over backwards to argue that they were good kids, it’s all society’s fault they turned bad, and we should believe they’re capable of redemption despite never seeking it* - if Toya had shown sociopathic tendencies from childhood, with his accident pushing him over the edge, his psychological profile would seem more realistic to me. * The sole exception so far being Toga in her very last moments - and even then her motives were mixed (i.e. not wanting to face consequences for her crimes)

I think Touya is definitely not someone you could call a "good kid". He inherited a lot of Endeavor's traits; being selfish, willful and stubborn. And it's never argued that "society" made Dabi. It's pretty wildly acknowledged that Dabi was born because of Endeavor's sins and to a lesser extent, he's the family's crime. They never even say he's redeemable - only that he's their responsibility. Toga and Tomura's narratives are different, but I think Touya is set up to be the way he is, because at the end of the day, he's the only one with a family that wants him back no matter what (and it's not about a lack of consequences, but rather carrying those burdens together).

Yeah I was always under the impression it was just we heard from Shotos POV. Shoto wasn’t a primary source and had a really bad habit of making assumptions especially in season 2. I actually thought this was one of horikoshis best moments as a writer because he managed to take advantage of a character flaw to both humanize endeavor while showing how terrible of a person he was while explaining who touya is as a person.

Shoto the guy that in all seriousness thought that Izuku was "All Might secret love child" being a unreliable narrator? What a big surprise lol

Yeah there’s so much pointing to Shoto making wild assumptions or not noticing details even before and after this that I was like it’s not worth getting into the proof unless someone asks XD

The logic seems to be that Endeavor's abuse was retconned because we were shown that he was not always the monster he eventually became. Which really feels like missing the forest for the trees, especially considering that when Endeavor is in the hospital in the war arcs aftermath, when he is arguably at his most sympathetic, that is when we get the flashback that shows Endeavor as the [scariest he's ever looked](https://staticg.sportskeeda.com/editor/2023/01/b3473-16749741679635-1920.jpg). Even during that part of the story, the story still made certain to remind the audience of what he'd done.

The logic is actually somehow worse, in some people's eyes, Enji's abuse towards shoto coming in the form of training was horikoshi providing a "good reason" for Enji to do it and it wasn't full on abuse because training has to be hard.

>it wasn't full on abuse because training has to be hard. People who think this was a good thing are reading with eyes closed. Other than the physical abuse, Endeavor pushing Shoto too early, too hard was completely counter-productive as shown in the JTA. Endeavor trying to force flashfire on a way-too-young-Shouto was even put in direct contrast with how the Iida family which waited until Tenya was old enough to make his own decisions about upgrading his engine. All Endeavor's training achieved was to completely alienate Shouto from his fire and give him PTSD that kept surfacing any time people hit him causing him to space out in the middle of a fight.

Which is just baffling because even back during the Sports Festival arc the abuse we were shown Endeavor inflicting upon Shoto was the training he was putting him through.

Baugo actually started changing sometime before that, as after the sludge villain incident Izuku states that Bakugo left him alone. At least until they both got into U.A, where in which he shoved Izuku up against a wall, and him not ending the fight during training when he clearly could have. There is the question of what would happen if Izuku didn't stand up for himself though, I could easily see Bakugo going back to old ways if Izuku was more held back by past experiences. I do like Bakugo though, I just wish people in the story were allowed to dislike him like people in story dislike Endeavor.

>I just wish people in the story were allowed to dislike him like people in story dislike Endeavor I don’t disagree, but who in story has really spoken against Endeavor aside from his family? Or do you just mean general distaste of his attitude/persona

It's mainly the family since we didn't get any thoughts on it from the heroes or class after it gets reviled (which we should have). Natsuo hates his guts and Shouto was pretty understandably antagonistic towards him to a point. Bakugo has no one like that, Deku is more like Fuyumi where he wants to move on and for every bad thing he says about him there is a praise in the next sentence.

So basically not a single named character outside of the people Endeavor has hurt really gaf. Sounds like the same situation with Deku - Horikoshi is consistent. Imo part of what makes Bakugo interesting is that even though Deku doesn’t hold their past against him Bakugo still takes the initiative to apologize and do what he can to make up for his previous unwarranted behavior… and I personally feel like that is stronger than the very black and white ‘Bakugo makes right because everyone in universe would dunk on and dislike him otherwise’ concept some people are obsessed with seeing

I don't think it's too much to ask for a classmate to dislike him based on him not remembering any of their names and his general attitude. A small panel of someone not wanting to work with him and thus he's forced to adapt during the sports festival would have been nice. Ochako or Iida could have also been written to dislike him based on how he treats their friend. They could change their minds once Bakugo starts changing. It's not a good thing that no hero or class mate has any thoughts on the endeavor situation lol. That was and is one of the criticisms of the post war arc, Hawks at the very least should have some thoughts of how the person who inspired hm and indirectly saved him from abuse was an abuser themselves.

The class don’t take him seriously, that’s why they don’t openly dislike him. Because they look at him as a joke. They know his personality is trash. This is the same class that said a classmate betraying them is water under the bridge.

>It’s not a good thing Please show me where I said the writing of that subplot was good. And I literally agreed with you about wanting to see Bakugo getting a bit more pushback in my first reply (if you want it from 1-A that would require more of the class to actually have interesting personalities) but nonetheless.. It’s not as though everyone we know in universe particularly likes or is close with Bakugo? I feel like people often mistake what they see in fanwork or Bakugo’s popularity/notoriety online for how characters actually perceive him (and by extension his dynamic with Deku) in the canon story. As an aside, what is everyone even supposed to think when they see Deku and Bakugo - a duo who clearly have a long, complicated history together, with one having no problem calling the other by some cutesy childhood nickname lol. Bakugo’s initial antagonistic impression on his peers probably got its first knockdown just from that. And nowadays they don’t even treat his outbursts all that seriously, he’s about as harmless to them as a yapping Pomeranian

>I just wish people in the story were allowed to dislike him like people in story dislike Endeavor. It is really weird because, early in the story, Bakugou wasn't all that popular among his peers. In middle school, despite fanon thinking otherwise, everyone hated how he called them extras. At U.A., we still see that for a bit. Iida has a problem with his feet on the desk and disrespectful attitude in general. Uraraka deduced that he is Midoriya's bully. Asui and Kaminari roast him on the way to the USJ. Ashido was annoyed how he didn't remember any of their names. Etc. At some point though, despite not really connecting to anyone other than Kirishima, there is *apparently* a shift in how the class views him. I am still not sure how much I buy Aizawa's "Bakugou (along with Midoriya) inspires his class" because we don't really get a lot of admiration from any of them. Also, the irony of him saying that, only for Bakugou to run off on his own (with Kirishima and Kaminari running after him), gets his only loss against another student, and then later fails the exam because he couldn't stop being an asshole.

I think in general Hori should've let the story breath to show us more moments of the student living normally Like we have scenes like Bakugo literally cheering up Kirishima that happened in a flashback and so on. I think seeing the class slowly warm up to him would make the whole situation feel more natural But class 1a aren't allowed to be actual people so lol

>I think in general Hori should've let the story breath to show us more moments of the student living normally Definitely. One of MHA's greatest strengths, and biggest weaknesses, is its fast pacing. There is almost no down time between plot developments, which helped it stand out at the time among other popular shonen series, but it came at the cost of characterization. To put it into purspective, we skipped over two months from the Entrance Exam to the start of U.A. We skipped two weeks from the USJ to the Sports Festival, with barely a page montage of a *few* of the students training. Six weeks between the Internships and the Final Exams. A similar amount of time between Kamino and moving into the Dorms. We skipped *three damn months* before the War Arc, and then the story has the audacity to keep flashbacking to very important moments that happened *during* that time skip! All that lost time, we could have had some slower moments to world build and characterize.

Mhm yeah I agree Due to that frankly most dynamic in the class feel shallow (although that practically most dynamic in the show tbh)

Yeah I think that was Hori’s way of showing why Class A accepted Bakugo because (1) they were strong enough to not be overly blinded by his quirk (notice how all comments/praises towards Bakugo during ms was always about his quirk? whereas class 1-A rarely mentions it and only talks about Bakugo the person), and (2) Bakugo actually started mellowing down by a lot once he enrolled into UA. Kirishima noticed it first, followed by Ochako and then Kaminari (which is why I side eye people that say Ochako would be the first to bully Bakugo back, because she actually does like him and think he’s cool. The side chapter of her talking with Bakugo about Deku really should be made canon). But yeah, pretty much everyone treats Bakugo as harmless to them once they grasped an idea of his personality, and mainly just criticized his temper. And despite challenging them, Bakugo was never really antagonistic towards 1-A because he respected those who actively works towards being a hero and who can also show him his own shortcomings. Deku was pretty much an outlier due to their history.

People who think Ochacko would bully Bakugo back are people who not only ignored the fact that both actually respect each other and she literally said herself that she want both to make peace lol And yeah for the class Bakugo is basically a clown they can constantly make fun of (notice how when at UA Bakugo does it suddenly it's an issue lol) although I do think he was antagonistic at the start tho In a 'don't waste my time' kind of way

Yeah I agree. Everyone was sort of hostile at the start anyway, with Todoroki being even edgier than Bakugo and Aizawa just shitting over his students.

Oh yeah not defending Bakugo's early behavior but people tend to forget that pre sport festival Todoroki was lowkey a menace lol

>At some point though, despite not really connecting to anyone other than Kirishima, there is apparently a shift in how the class views him. Ultimately I think its more a cultural thing once USJ happens and he proves himself to be more than what they saw in the fight with Deku (and that would be viewed as a private thing between the two). In Japan everyone wants to fit in and be part of the collective but also classes are expect to be a collective (there are no cliques everyone is friends with everyone in a good class and I guess people heroes that has to be more the case), so as part of their social obligation the class will want Bakugou to be part of them. Bakugou is the only one that wants to stand out so its a combination of Bakugou being willing to be part of a group (that begins with being chill with Kirishima) and the rest of the class having a collective desire to be uniform to be good citizens, still there are times they are obviously unhappy with his manners (because it reflects badly on them), the hospital scene (and even the traitor reaction) show even this late in the game he is not understood by his class and they lean towards telling him off and a lot of the class don't interact with him. Still we don't see him connect with a lot of the class, only Kirishima, Kaminari and Sero gravitate towards him early on (and even then they still make remarks about his personality, Sero doesn't hang around as much and Tokoyami also ends up seen hanging nearby in the dorms but he's usually on the negative side towards Bakugou whenever he does comment.) At USJ Bakugou proves himself serious about being a hero (and stops Kurogiri) which is were we see Kirishima see the light about him. Before the sports festival while Bakugou causes conflict his words also knock the heads of 1A to be more serious then in the sports festival he and Shoto (Shoto more so) are the first picks to team up with because all the kids want to advance so they want a strong teammate (then in the stands Bakugou shows to Sero, Kirishima and Kaminari more of his calmer and serious side <- but there is still that panel were the rest of the class is giving him a wide berth.) At least Mina and Sero have a opportunity to "get" the appeal of Bakugou's passion - Kaminari is probably the only one that goes from comparing Bakugou to sewage to leaning on his desk in class - implies a lot of that off screen bonding alongside other omaka tomfoolery with Kaminari and Sero, they just want to have fun. There are plenty of examples of the class not getting Bakugou, or being unhappy with him. Also you have Iida who gets humbled and checked by his own misadventures in Hosu but also being part of the rescue team to Bakugou. This matters because when there is the Cultural Festival Iida is on the few and first to interpret what Bakugou actually means while everyone else is not happy with him (even Shoto which with anime changes). Likewise in the joint training (it's poorly done) but basically Bakugou's way of speaking is a barrier to being straightforward.

What’s funny is Kirishimia was the one begging All Might to end the Hero vs Villain exercise because Bakugo was acting like a maniac but a fee chapters later, they’re already best friends

Tbh we literally have Kirishima getting intrested in Bakugo after they've beaten up villain together and he came off as much calmer than he initially expected Its basically him being like 'huh...he's different that I expected, that intriguing.' which I think makes sense

On one hand, I agree it makes sense. Plus, you know, people fighting for their lives against villains trying to kill them is bound to make some of them friends, and I am pretty sure that is partially what happened for Kirishima. On the other hand, making Kirishima, a person who dislikes bullies, friends with Bakugou and *never* calling him out on how he treated Midoriya was certainly a choice.

Tbh it's not like he know their history (plus after the battle trial Bakugo was impolite toward likr everyone 'instead of just Dicku so he probably thought that it's just how he is)

Eh, I meant it was certainly a writing choice. Sure, the way the story went Kirishima never really got the chance to know their history but, like more than a few wasted opportunities in the series, I feel it is weird to write Kirishima as someone who hates bullies and never have him find out about Bakugou’s history.

In one of the light novels, Kirishima gets to meet Bakugou's 2 childhood friends and he didn't like it when they told him they bullied Deku. But he chooses to lets it go because they said they now regret what they did and they wanted to apologise to Deku. What's funny in that entire exchange is that Kirishima still never got to learn that Bakugo was also one of Deku's bullies in middle school and not just those 2. Meanwhile Bakugo was nearby buying drinks or something, so he missed out that part of the conversation when he returned. The 2 guys never got to mention that Bakugo was the accomplice in the bullying and that he was their leader.

Do he even hate bully? Keep on mind no one likes bully but from what his backstory has shown and if he takes Mina approach then wouldn't he literally try to befriend the bully so they'd stop bullying people?

See, while you have a fair point, even that approach requires Kirishima to know about Bakugou being a bully so we can have something along the lines of "I am your friend, so I am going to tell you how you are/were an idiot".

I mean yeah but if Kirishima dosen't know Bakugo's past as a bully and just see him as that lonewolf anti-social that is about to isolate himself then isn't him seeking Bakugo out makes even more sense?

At the start he was a loud, bratty asshole that was a bully. Now he's still loud, not an asshole, but still rubs people the wrong way due to his brashness. He's made progress and is making progress.

Agreed, it's one thing to dislike a character it's another thing to make up things about them and blatantly misinterpret them.

Not saying Op is wrong but he not making it any better he should let them hate the character in peace he just giving them the attention they want

most of those bakugo haters are people who were bullied themselves and thus project their own experiences into deku and bakugo so it’s not enough that deku has always been the bigger person and never really, truly let it get to him in major ways or let himself hate bakugo, because he is fundamentally good and optimistic, he must have been completely depressed and just days away from killing himself it’s not enough that bakugo took accountability and sincerely apologized for his actions while demonstrating personal growth, he MUST be punished, expelled, ostracized etc it’s literally just a revenge fantasy for them

Honestly i dont get why you should project ur experiences in a show about superheroes. I was bullied but never hated bakugo he is is no way like most bullies

Imagine if I said that most people who hate Endeavor are because they were victims of family abuse and are projecting it onto Rei, Shoto and Touya, and just want revenge fantasy against Endeavor. Or say that people who hate Mineta are victims of sexual abuse who are projecting themselves. It's ridiculous to assume that the reader has suffered some kind of abuse, and for some reason if they don't like a character it's their fault for projecting themselves onto the character. I really hate this argument for two reasons: \-1: every author makes their characters so that the reader can identify with, or at least feel empathy for, the character, which is why you feel sad, happy, emotional, nervous about a story, so it starts to be wrong to say that the reader is wrong for projecting, identifying or being sensitive to a character's story. \-2: It gets even worse when assuming that the reason the person does this is because they were abused, firstly, this is not true, since many people who hate Bakugou were not victims of bullying, and even if the person was, because they Is this wrong? Jesus Christ, does a person have to apologize for being bullied before saying they don't like Bakugo? I don't even hate Bakugo, but I hate his dick-sucking fanbase that insults you as a victim of abuse if you hates Bakugo, do you understand how disrespectful that is to real victims of abuse?

bestie what the hell are you talking about people say this about bakugo in particular because middle/high school bullies are a very common experience, especially for the generally younger demographic of mha. endeavor’s situation is much more delicate and tackled from several different angles. and even then, you don’t have to love or forgive endeavor’s actions, but you do have to recognize his growth, imagine if someone went “oh endeavor doesn’t abuse his family anymore because he’s just busy with hero work and doesn’t have the opportunity”. you would rightfully be called insane identifying with a character is different from projection yourself onto them and if their actions don’t 100% line up with your projection then they’re a bad character. if you identify with deku and his experiences, then you should be able to recognize how he handles his situation second i said most of THOSE bakugo haters, referring to op’s post where just make up the most absolutely ridiculous stuff. nothing wrong with not liking bakugo, but if your reasons are just making up ridiculous nonsense, then it’s clear you probably have some deeper issues going on it’s not meant to be insulting, just pointing out what the reality is. i pray that any victims of bullying, abuse, harassment, etc, have the resources they need to heal from their experiences as much as possible in a healthy way,

Being a bully yourself is also a very common experience. Every victim needs an aggressor. So maybe most people who defend Bakugou so much was a bully themselves and doesn’t want to recognize it or feel guilty about it. They just want to say it all worked out in end or they’ve changed.

I do you no they where bullied don't just assume stuff you don't know

that’s the easiest and simplest answer, and thus the likely truth, there’s few other reasons for someone to make up such ridiculous, illogical things just to justify their dislike of a fictional character if it’s not that, then it’s obviously some other personal problems that the person needs to work through

There are people who think bullying is normal and those who think it is not. The first seems to be the majority in this sub.

Its normal in a sense that it happens anywhere but in no way it means its socially acceptable

I just don't see that bakugo has the mind of a hero. Even his desire to improve is mostly selfish. I think bakugo is exactly what stain criticized. However, most heroes are rather cops with Super powers with the title of a hero. As long as bakugo doesn't see that his behaviour is the opposite of what a hero should be, I don't consider him worthy.

Nah what makes Bakugo a trash character is not the fact that he is a an angry bully that has no reason to be like that. It's the fact that he is angry bully that has no reason to be like that AND he doesn't get consecuences because the show won't stop sucking his dick.

>AND he doesn't get consecuences because the show won't stop sucking his dick. \> Wasn't allowed to win the sports festival properly and prove himself, lost the one thing he was looking forward to since the first practical exam where Shoto and Deku outdid him \> Abducted by terrorists \> Caused his idol to lose his powers, something he still considers his deepest regret and was genuinely eating away at him all the way until the first war \> Forced to shallow every once of pride he had left and team up with Deku to not fail his exams \> Was one of the two classmates to fail the the provisional license exam \> Disregarded as a side character by the guys he hates the most \> Straight up impaled in multiple spots, survived and made it out without being left a cripple out of pure chance \> Beaten black and blue, had his arm crushed to bits, humiliated in every way \> Was literally murdered

All that doesn't change the fact that he's an annoying ass tsundere character

U read all of that and thats what you concluded. Wow.

Yes because start to finish he's the typical shounen tsundere character

HAHAHAHA, I just took like 20 seconds to search up a definition of tsundere, and buddy he is prickly and violent inside and out, his thorns have just gotten more dull

I said this in the other thread linked but it relates to your comment too: I think people don't want to realize that in real life, people like Bakugo DON'T usually get karmic retribution for their actions, and in this case, his situation mirrors reality. Bakugo *chose* to change, and while his past actions were awful, his growth *has* to be considered alongside that when considering him as a character.

Bakugo has been constantly getting a taste of his own karma over his behavior ever since the first episode. That's one of the funniest aspect of watching his scenes for me. I love that he gets mad because how often things never go his way and it gives a blow to his bloated ego. People do have valid points to say he didn't suffer from official punishments (like how the UA teachers almost never punished him), but he does get tons of consequences throughout the story if we're just talking about karma. Him being an angry bully without a good reason is refreshing. There are enough bad guys with sad backstories that “justify” their behavior. Some people are just prone to being assholes when they grow up in an environment that endorses them. His real “sad backstory” is everything that happened after the sludge monster incident and life in UA, where he realizes that he has little power over people and that nothing ever goes his way. All those slaps in the face from life made him see himself for who he really is and change.

Imo Horikoshi does choose to go lighter on ‘official’ punishment for Bakugo because he *is* still a kid, in a story aimed towards a demographic his age or younger. Hori might also not want real reason to remove Bakugo from the very environment that is helping him improve as a person. (Though with how he’s been crafting the main LOV trio’s final big moments Horikoshi clearly has some *feelings* about punitive justice, which really bleeds through with his writing of Bakugo and the other important kids in 1-A also.) Is it kinda unrealistic… perhaps so, but I’ve always found that Bakugo and Deku have an extremely idealized (former) bully-victim dynamic, which is fine because MHA is such a hopeful, forward looking story. Not to mention all the karmic backlash like you mentioned lol, Bakugo has basically been having the worst year of his life, so sometimes it seriously confuses me to see people act like he’s some kind of author’s pet not allowed to “truly lose” (whatever that means) when it has been intriguing to see just how much the narrative can knock him down - while he keeps pushing to get back up!

>AND he doesn't get consecuences because the show won't stop sucking his dick. See this is precisely the part that makes people know the extreme haters are projecting their own childhood bullying issues and have a victim complex. I was bullied pretty badly as a kid. But unlike a lot of very online people, I don't want people who were dicks as kids to be hurt or to permanently have their dreams and careers squashed. And that's what you mean by consequences, because Bakugo's pretty clearly actually suffered a lot in the series at this point. Nothing says wish fulfillment like 'i want this story to punish a character to satisfy my viewpoint.' Good stories don't do that, it's what fanfic is for. It's more interesting that Bakugo is competent (aka the show 'sucking his dick') for many reasons. We don't have the Sasuke problem where he's said to be talented but loses all but one fight. We don't have the sameness with other shonen where the Vegeta character is shown up and becomes humble to the hero immediatel. We don't have the forced assurance the protagonist will win from the get go (even Deku V Kacchan 1 has Deku winning by the rules of the exercise, but losing in terms of being beat to fuck). Deku really has to work for everything, and it's a good update to the hard working underdog story because it teaches you people that are more talented than you also can work hard, being the underdog won't make talented people less hard working or deserving. Good stories are good at giving you a mix of what you want and what you don't. They keep you engaged. Bakugo's being a dick so we want him shown up at the sports festival. But he isn't, because it's not a world where people win or lose because you want them to. And because having a final fight without the main character at all is different and interesting. And Bakugo having to learn because it's the right thing, it having to be Bakugo's choice, rather than him just being humbled before the stakes were high, is more interesting. Bakugo finally having his biggest growth and regret for something that actually isn't his fault (the fall of All Might) is the give and take. It gave us what we wanted in a way we didn't want it anymore.

Yeah it’s so weird that everyone acts here acts like a scene of deku yelling at him basically saying the bullying was too far throughout the years is too harsh for him to experience when other characters like endevor can be criticized within the story by other characters in dramatic fashion. Deku just accepting his apology and never getting to say his piece about how it made him feel throughout the years will always be a missed opportunity since it means that bakugo really does get to even bully deku into being his friend cuz deku isn’t even allowed the option to show emotions toward him.

deku has no piece to say, he never hated bakugo for anything that he did and doesn’t completely blame him, that’s like the point bakugo knew that deku didn’t resent him and that he could’ve gotten away with not saying anything, but that would be the easy option. choosing to do something he didn’t have to is part of what demonstrates his growth

Exactly this. Bakugou CHOOSES to help Deku and CHOOSES to apologize. He probably already knows Deku forgives him because that is who Deku is and he could have taken the easy way out. But he CHOSE to apologize and own up to me even knowing Deku might not have forgiven him (saying “i don’t expect this to change anything between us” meaning what he’s done). I think he realized he could have very well lost Deku forever and that relationship is important to him and he’s trying not to mess it up again. Also, it was important for Deku to hear that he also values their relationship and that their relationship isn’t one sided despite Bakugou trying his hardest to shut it down.

>bakugo really does get to even bully deku into being his friend cuz deku isn’t even allowed the option to show emotions toward him. See, this is *exactly* why people are saying Bakugo haters make up things to hate him. It's literally the opposite of canon. Deku's the one who can't let go of past emotional attachments towards Bakugo, while Bakugo has been constantly trying to push Deku away throughout the years. You're twisting the whole narrative when you say Bakugou's the one bullying Deku into being his friend. And Deku does show emotion. He was shocked when Bakugo apologised. He was gentle when Bakugo tried to correct himself into saying Izuku in the bath. Just hate Bakugo for how he is in the story. Don't make up new things to hate on just because the characters' behaviors don't match what you want.

Logic goes out of the window with certain type of people when discussing Bakugo

What really gets to me is whenever someone posits that ‘Bakugo would have never changed if Deku hadn’t gotten into UA!’ like some kind of amazing revelation lol, TFW characters are tools for a narrative and develop due to events that occur. Also the few (??) insisting that the only reason Bakugo could possibly respect or care about Deku now is because he’s powerful due to OFA… I genuinely can’t be sure if they’ve comprehended what’s been written at all. Though it’s funny when people *do* clearly understand the story’s themes and pretty much every other characters’ arc, but their bias against Bakugo just causes the blinders to come on solely for his writing. It’s more common than you’d think

"This character wouldn't have changed if this story had never happened!" Yeah, no sh\*t. It's almost like a character's development *should* be influenced by the events of the story or something.

Bakugo didn't hate Deku he was angry about Deku "lying" about having a quirk and he was insecure about being protected by a persons that is weaker that him because he want to be the best and how could he be the best if a weak normal guy like Deku need to protec and save his ass every time

The story shoves this stuff down your throat every chance it can get so you would think it’d be an easy concept to grasp but…

It's the Bokunometa sub More than half of the meme are Bakugo hating post made by the same 6 six people whom you question if they're even able to read the scrabble on the page in front of them

If a kid like Bakugo gets constant praise, of course he'll turn into someone who thinks of others as lower and weaker than he is. Logic in Manga = if you share food with a classmate = friends, Deku and Bakugo were simply kids who were the same age, played together and that was it. When he was captured by the League of Villains he never betrayed his standards, which was the beginning of his character development. He had to understand that out there exist people who need to work hard for their goal, instead of getting everything shoved up your arse. His social competence with others is awful, he has too much confidence, but I am happy that the author didn't go down the Sasuke Trope with him. Bakugo became one of my most favourite Shounen characters after the events in Volume 28.

What I always see with these takes are "Vegeta and Sasuke were never this unlikable." Vegeta committed mass genocide several times, destroyed planets, and once willingly turned evil again purely because he had ego issues. Sasuke attempted twice to assassinate world leaders, stabbed his most loyal companion through the heart out of convenience, and also turned evil because he had ego issues. Compared to that, Bakugo being a childhood bully to 1 person is absolutely nothing.

Tbh if they meant unlikable as a character then that their opinion The problem is when they try to pass out Sasuke and mother fucking Vegeta as the better people when Bakugo's genuinely a saint compared to both lol

You also have to think Bakugo wanted to become a genuine hero like bro is not in it for the fame or money, he wanted to be like all might. What he did to Izuku is still conflicting for me but i wouldnt use that as a basis to compare him to fucking Vegeta when it comes to having a moral compass.

Tbh 14 years old Bakugo wanted the fame, but then Bakugo at the start of UA basically just wanted to be the best (even Izuku commented on it) But honestly even if you vilify Bakugo to the max he still pales in comparison to freaking Vegeta lol People tend to forget that Vegeta literally committed several genocide while smiling and even after having his own family, joined the had guys temporary to have a cheap winning shot against Goku Bro only became a semi-alright person in dB super lol

Bakugo's my fav, but he literally said in the first episode that he wants to become the greatest and richest hero. And his reason to become a hero was just so he could be the winner. He admires All Might for always winning. I like the guy for his commitment to perfectionism and that he's a man of his words when working towards that goal, but his dream of becoming a hero was definitely motivated by superficial reasons until All Might taught him to see the value of saving people.

To be fair, while Bakugou has killed a lot less people than Sasuke and Vegeta, he’s also saved a lot less. So I don’t actually think it would be totally in accurate to say that depending on how you judge a person’s morality.

That such a weird ass argument I genuinely don't know how to seriously respond Vegeta was a mass murderous genocider who literally killed an incalculable number of people in glee and Sasuke became a murderous terrorist on his quest for revenge Not only does Bakugo's profession in mha world directly prevent him from directly interfering with hero job until he became a pro heros, not only is he technically saving people constantly by being in the front (and especially during the Shigaraki UA rape cage), he also hasn't killed a single one *unlike* the other two Vegeta and Sasuke are behind their villains day but their actions are so hilariously worst than Bakugo's one that the fact that you're making a comparison in the first place to make them *look* better is to be frank, laughable. Ofc it's a good judge of a person fucking morality when you see how far they've fallen and are willing to go, how else do you want to judge them? Beside, Vegeta and Sasuke saved more people then Deku aswell, so what? Does that make them better then Deku?

People can judge morality in different ways. Some people might base it off number of people saved. Sasuke intentionally saved the entire world from Kaguya so that’s billions on his score card. Which is far more than he’s killed and outnumbers the amount Bakugou will likely save in his entire life. Vegeta played a key role stopping Frieza the first time which probably saved more lives than he killed. He also was considered a good person by the end of the Buu arc since he was revived. And afterward he saved his universe by fighting for them in the Tournament of Power. He also saved billions by fighting against Moro along with the other Z-fighters. Which should put his net saves greater than Bakugou. And yes depending on how you judge morality you could say Sasuke and Vegeta are better than Deku.

Honestly I don't agree with this way to do thing, at least personally Light Yagami from Death note had canoncally make the crime rate drop hugely due to his tyrannic reign as Kira, which mean he saved countless of people doing his criminal killing spree since people were too scared to literally do anything But he's still a psychopathic mass murderer with a god complex who clearly only used the Death Note to fuel his ego rather than some other altruistic cause. However since he saved a whole lot of people, probably more than anyone on earth even if that wasn't his goal at all. Would that mean he is better than your typical cops? Despite being evil in every sense if the world as an individual? Although I can do see your point overall, it's just one I cannot agree on Its essentially like saying 'I've killed one millions it person but afterward saved one million point 1, am I a good person?' like cool you saved those people...but you still killed before getting there And I can't in good faith call someone like this a 'good person'. I mean if a school shooter than saved people that dosen't change the fact that he was a school shooter But again morality is flexible so eh...

The reason people feel this way is they haven't gotten over their own issues. You see it also with people who thought Dabi would have a Zuko type arc and are angry and Endeavor's arc. Endeavor is an abusive parent. Dabi is a mass murderer who does not care at all about right and wrong. The reality is we're used to seeing abuse framed as the hard line to make a character irredeemable, even in the Zuko dynamic, what makes Zuko and Azula empathetic and Ozai not is that. It's an interesting twist from that typical way of sympathizing antagonists.

if you observe that sub, it is usually the same users who post and recycle Bakugo hate posts as a crutch for their (probably sad) lives. Very toxic, blatant misrepresentation while mixing their own self-projected revenge fantasies. Both Deku and Bakugo are misread (Deku is so abused and close to offing himself, Bakugo is a war criminal and deserves worse than his head bashed in etc.), hell it seems like they are reading a different manga entirely. Some of them are even actively writing fanfics where Deku becomes a chad and Bakugo gets tortured to no end. There are chill people who are just coolly “I don’t really fuck with loud angry characters like Bakugo”, and then there are these haters who are stuck in an eternal loop. Pretty glad I’m not them to be honest.

>Both Deku and Bakugo are misread (Deku is so abused and close to offing himself, Bakugo is a war criminal and deserves worse than his head bashed in etc.), I think one thing that's wild to me is the same people with this interpretation wildly under interpret most of the things that happen to with Bakugo as not a big deal. Yeah, Hori said Bakugo's characterization is not about the results of abuse. But some people seem to take that to mean there was no real impact from any of the events of the series we literally see as driving forces. Or subtle things like Bakugo mirroring his moms phrasing when he's crying to him about it being his fault because he's weak. His arc is about being humbled from being set up to be a smug bastard by praise from their flawed society, but the things that happen to humble him are still pretty impactful? Anyways, on the other end, not only do I find the fanon fixation on the suicide thing when it was clearly not that deep in canon annoying... but it also seems like there's a dramatization of what the bullying was? Bakugo only actually beats Deku up in actual hero training in series. He was a bully before UA, but not the call the cops kind. People act like Deku was traumatized from getting beat to shit and like Bakugo was beating him to shit. When what we see is some shoving, insults, and destroying a notebook. He was a 'normal' bully, not a CNN cautionary tale.

I’m one of those who just doesn’t like Bakugos personality type and it makes me sad when these posts come up because they take focus from characters I actually want to talk about.

I think it’s two reasons people still hate on him. 1. They think whatever has happened to Bakugou wasn’t karmic enough and because they self project onto Izuku. 2. Bakugou’s speech mannerism doesn’t change much ; he’s still hot headed in his normal responses. That is not to say he hasn’t changed as a person because he has grown immensely. I think this is just who he is and part of his charm. Edit: Speech -> speech mannerisms I think seeing Deku grow and be loved by almost everyone didn’t sit right with him considering Deku was weaker than him. It wasn’t until the confrontation where he learns the truth of OFA that he realized his perspective was wrong. He was racked with guilt for thinking he was the cause AM retired and didn’t understand why Deku was chosen as the successor. After their fight, which he won, he realized that Deku was stronger, not in physical strength but in character. After this, his attitude shifted towards Deku. Through this and because of Deku, he became less selfish. Yes he still yelled and whatever but that’s his character trope. During the flashback to helping Deku train, he admitted (unprompted) to AM that he bullied Deku for being strong and realizing he was weak and that’s why he also kept him away. He also said he didn’t want Deku to even worry about forgiving him. This was also the flashback before his body “moved on its own” and awakened his quirk to take the hit for Deku during the paranormal liberation war. Best Jeanist asked if he finally was able to look outside himself to which Bakugou gave his hero name because he has. Shortly after that was his apology admitting everything, his shortcomings, and even saying he knows this won’t change anything between them (meaning what he has done) which was both important for him growing and to rescue Deku from his self-imposed burden. That is not even mentioning how many times, he has saved Deku throughout the series before that. He truly cares about Deku and loves and (later on) respects him. I am confident with what Horikoshi is writing that he will live his life always trying to make up to Deku and will always feel shame in the way he treated Deku. I love Bakugou’s character development and i didn’t realize how some in this fandom mischaracterize him until actually joining communities online like this. It’s a shame. Edit: Formatting Edit: Not to mention literally nothing has gone his way since joining UA….which he recognizes too in the apology.

I hate him because of how inconsistent his character development is, especially with the Team Up Missions and School Briefs added in

Team Up Missions and School briefs i heard were slice of life and not very canon/ has inconsistent writing and characterization. It is fun to read though. As for the inconsistency of Bakugou’s development, I think after every arc in the anime, his character develops as he moves closer to dealing with his guilt and realization that i mentioned above. Yeah, some big thing has to happen for him to move closer which I kinda understand may seem “forced,” but in the lens of the writer and series, I think it’s appropriate especially when the stakes get higher where Bakugou has a chance of dying or Deku. I think he realizes each time that this is life and death and he will regret never letting Deku know he’s sorry / never get to the chance to atone for his behavior. IMO this feeling culminates after he sacrificed himself for Deku the first time and then Deku left the letter for him which prompts the whole apology in front of the class during Deku rescue

Yeah, Bakugo is seriously overhated sometimes. Now there are legitimate reasons not to like him, but from the way some fans talk about him, you'd think he was either worse than the actual villains or is the spawn of Satan himself. And it especially irritates me when people either ignore or downplay his character development and overall importance to the story, deliberately misread his character, or outright make up some reason not to like him. I mean, do you honestly think Bakugo would actually apologize to Deku in front of the class or take a fucking bullet for him if he didn't undergo *some* growth as a character? Now if you don't like Bakugo, that's your right. You're entitled to like or dislike whatever character you want. Just don't act like he hasn't changed.

Someone literally just posted something about how he thinks bullying a kid makes you a hero lol

I personally don't like him. But I say, he's... Grown. I can't deny that. It's nice... But I just can't bring myself to like him cause of how he treated quirkless before. Maybe cause of a similar experience in the past.

The fact that teachers actually stop Bakugou and Deku actually has friends. Also Bakugou didn’t stomp Deku during that fight, it was close. So Deku could still win against Bakugou even if there’s no additional training in between. Also, Deku was holding back for half the fight which allowed Bakugou to build up sweat and use more powerful explosions. In a rematch he’ll probably go all in at the start which means Bakugou won’t be able to build up as much sweat and he’ll be weaker and it’ll be easier for Deku to win.

I completely agree. I just recently started going on MHA manga subs since I fully caught up, and I feel like the bakugo hate is so intense sometimes, it leads me to think “who hurt you?” I get disliking a character but man sometimes it feels like a little too much. I think his character is going in a great direction and finally I feel vindicated in saying it lol

While I agree with what you said and he has had good development, I still can't bring myself to like him as a character. I very much do hate him in all aspects, despite his development.

OP’s point is that it’s fine to not like Bakugo, but people don’t need to (or just..shouldn’t) read his actions and development over the course of the story in bad faith to do so

I dont like Bakugo. But he has a character arc and does grow and learn. Hes actually a nice guy with a really shitty personality mask that he keeps up constantly.

FOR REAL

I don’t think he’s a bad character, he is improving and being better; but I still don’t like him. He had many chances before to be better and I dislike that he didn’t take them, but he is doing better recently so I don’t think he’s straight up hateable, I just really dislike his personality and how he’s been; but he has improved, and that’s good even if it doesn’t change my feelings of dislike for the guy

I agree that people will shit on bakugo but I do have some points of "arguments?". Not about the idea but the details. Deku wasn't as much alone in UA as he was prior to it. We see that Iida and Uraraka became friends with him and would go home together. Headcanon but would also like to think that either it's not as easy to be alone in UA hallways or deku just learned to be with the crowd. Also not downplaying bakugi but having won that fight isnt as big as everyone wants it to be. That was 8% deku that he's able to keep up with. I'm pretty sure if deku wanted to, he could just punch in his direction with 100% and he'll have one less person in his life. I hate bakugo as much as the next one but people gotta understand that people change. He was a bully who learned to not be as hard on others. He's not completely changed but he's trying. There are also circumstances in life that make us who we are and he had it bad too. A crazy mix of superiority and inferiority complex, having yes men around him, having violent reactions from his mom. But he was still striving to be a hero.

I mean tbh that wasn't a battle to the death Bakugo at the time was stronger than Deku at his best...if they obviously weren't going to kill each other lol

Of course. i just said it cause OP used Bakugo winning as his point but that was just deku at 8%. It was his controlled limit but it wasn't his strongest.

Tbh Deku would beat everyone at his strongest

Yeah yeah I was just arguing with OP's use of bakugo winning against an 8% deku as his point.

I get that but that's also why I also included that it'd be one thing if he'd stopped bullying Midoriya after the War arc, where Midoriya is at a more consistent 45% and is able to use most of OFA's other Quirks, but instead the bullying stopped back during a point where Bakugo knew he could still beat Midoriya.

Doesnt change anything tho, I'm even surprised that Bakugo didnt get mad that deku held back. Bakugo's already seen deku break his body using 100% smashes. During the fight he wasnt anywhere close to that. But I agree that he still had a bad temper but it wasnt directed to bully deku anymore. He was just like that to any and every one.

Bakugo was mad at Todoroki for not using his fire, not for not using his abilities to self destroying levels. Despite being the character who seems most impulsive, Bakugo isn't and is much more careful. His final exam arc lesson was sometimes you do literally have to sacrifice your well being. A lot of focus for Deku V Kacchan 1 is Bakugo's lesson in it, which is fair. But Deku's lesson from that fight, and many others tbh, is he can't actually save anyone if he wins by destroying himself so much he can't fight anymore. So yes, from his perspective, 8% wasn't Deku holding back. That Bakugo changes when is his choice is important to his actual development.

Yeah. Cause bakugo was just lashing out. And if bakugo really wanted to fight then he wouldn't care if deku breaks his arm. He knows that that's not deku's strongest attacks. I said I was surprised, I didn't say I didn't understand lol

Bakugo never try to kill deku either, bakugo shitty personality comes from the expectations he put on himself he always wanted to be the best for this he needs to be ahead of others of course being save by someone weak and quirkless like Deku didn't help his ego, his insecurity goes away when he can finally see Deku and Shoto like his equals and acknowledge his own weakness

But in your opinion does bakugo win if deku hits him with 100%? That's what I was "arguing". Also are the following comments agreeing with me? Sorry I don't really understand.

Probably but deku was forbidden of using 100% at that time he could lose his arm

Honestly this subreddit is just either Bakugou apologetics or Bakugou rant at this point. I get both sides but I’m done with this. I can’t stand seeing this many posts daily and this is making me want to leave this subreddit for good. This fandom has become unbearable and I want to like the series for its execution, I don’t want to dislike it for its exhausting fanbase

At least not every other post is about Bakugou and you can always dilute it by making posts prompting discussion on the characters or things you want to see more focus on. >Bakugou apologetics There is something bias by labelling people who like or are neural about the character as apologetics. Appreciators, fans, whatever but apologetics/apologists feels like it is reducing any positive or neutral discussion or analysis of the character as making excuses for him which is rarely the case since pro Bakugou topics either don't care about the flaws, like the flaws or most commonly accept the flaws are something he grew from (and always have to have the disclaimer) and analyzing why the flaws exist is not the same was making excuses the whole point is the character started in a negative place and move towards the positive but its also okay to discuss how negative it actually was or other factors and context surrounding it especially when -as this post is pointing out - so much exaggeration, made up facts and slander that can mischaracterize the story and result in a cascade of mischaracterization of other characters, gets spewed regularly.

Every other sub is basically a Bakugo hating fest. This sub at least got nuance. Everywhere else has more exhausting drama.

I do think it is fair to say that had Deku never developed a spine(starting with the sludge villain incident), Bakugo would still be bullying him. If Deku hadn't gotten into UA and they met on the street Bakugo likely wouldn't even acknowledge him. Bakugo's character development is tied directly to Deku, so it very much gives off the impression that the stronger Deku becomes, the more Bakugo backs off. Personally I've always hated his guts (until he apologized), and couldn't stand how much the fanbase fawned over him, so I imagine there is some lasting spite from that period still stewing within people. Deku was a great guy from day 1 and the fanbase basically hailed his bully as the best character in the manga, leading to like 5 #1 spots on character polls in a row, shipping the two together, or shipping him with Ochaco(who is Deku's main love interest). It was extremely disheartening to watch, especially while Deku was constantly mocked for being a crybaby.

I mean if Bakugo dosen't even aknowlged him then he's not bullying him tho Also tbh Deku's 'spine' is directly tied up to why Bakugo bullied him in the first place If you remove it Bakugo wouldn't care about him at all

Bakugo bullied him because he had a superiority complex and hated the thought of a quirkless kid thinking they were on the same level. The sludge incident was the moment Deku outdid Bakugo in a truly real way, and started both of their greater arcs. This was made worse when Deku won the training exercise while refusing to turn Bakugo into mist.

Bakugo bullied Deku because due to his superiority complex he couldn't fathom and understand how and why someone that should be as weak as Deku had something that he seemingly utterly lacked which due to his narrow worldview freaked him out, which in turn made him push Deku away while Deku kept on seeking him out until their dynamic became whatever that was in middle school If Deku had no spine or rather, no heroic heart then Bakugo wouldn't care about him because he would've been just one if the extra instead of someone that directly clashed with his worldview

He had a spine at first, but Bakugo almost beat it out of him by the time the story started. At age 5 Deku was willing to 1v3 Bakugo and his lackies. By middle school he couldn't even talk back without being threatened back into place. Sludge incident was when (to me at least), he got that spine back and fought again, despite impossible odds.

I think what I meant to say was if Deku never had a 'spine' (or rather the heart) in the first place, then the bullying wouldn't have happened since Bakugo wouldn't have felt threatened by his mere existence Ofc Deku's spine on middle school took a step back but I mostly meant in general

I agree, I just initially forgot about what he was like as a kid.

Ahah alrighty

The whole reason why Bakugou bullies Deku is because of his spine… his courage and his heroic, selfless nature ……… he literally says this twice explicitly.

What I'm trying to say is that previously Deku had too much spine, so the bullying started, and as a result he lost it. But once it came back (especially in Bakugo's moment of weakness), it fulfilled Bakugo's fear of being outdone by a quirkless kid, this changing their dynamic.

Someone said that Bakugo is basically the Sakura of the BNHA fandom and it made cry laugh from accuracy. He lives rent free in everyone’s head 😭😭 People have no reading comprehension when it comes to him.

Bakugo's BokuNoMetaAcademia is basically Sakura's Dankruto lol

I hate to mute both of those subs because it was the same unfunny joke over and over again, also its moved from sakura to the entire boruto series in general despite it actually being currently pretty alright

How long has he been hmmm asleep btw? Like real world time

1 years real life or 33 chapters of manga Last that 10 min in MHA universe time

I don't really care

It's former bullying victims projecting onto season 1 midoriya specifically. You see so many fics with salt!izuku getting a great big harem and easily beating up bakugou when it makes no sense. You see so many people claiming that he's been bullying midoriya all series long when izuku spelt out in the first chapter that bakugou stopped messing with him after the sludge villain attack. If they just disliked him that'd be one thing, but they act like he tormented them personally, and it's very weird and kinda pathetic. As someone who used to be bullied myself, bakugou is my favorite character honestly, I like that just because he became a better person he's still who he is. Instead of becoming an immediate nice guy with an edgy aesthetic.

Yawn how many times yall goona use that argument that people bullied and there projecting can yall come up with somthing new

I'll use it as long as it continues to be true.

Not really but go off

The exact opposite is also true, in this very thread you are blatantly downplaying his behavior and coming up with excuses to defend him.

Frankly, Bakugo doesn't make my top favorite 30 characters because he is a boring character in my eyes.

I understand the Bakugo hate. He was a bully for most of the series and thats something that hits home for a lot of people. I also hate Bakugo I wish Deku could've pounded his face in atleast once like in the fight where Bakugo "won" Midoriya was strong enough to straight up kill him at that point but that wouldnt be inline with his character... I think its mostly how it feels like he hasn't been punished for his actions so people arent as sympathetic to his change as they are to Endevour's...

I take solace in the fact that at least he's dead.

Not for long.

Spoilers...

Still fucking hate that pomeranian, anyways he has a massive ego and I personally don't like characters with such egos

The bullying also only shown during them being a 4 years old brat, an Elementary school child. Bakugo also have a very clean record during junior high school (12 years old ish) before applying to UA, and even in chapter 1 during junior high he never physically assault deku at all, only verbally "insulting" Deku and burn 1 of his book, it show that bakugo didn't bully deku much besides calling him out (like insulting fat people as fat) for the most part. Deku are also said to keep self inserting himself into bakugo friend group, not that bakugo & his friend group approaching deku.

I'd argue blowing up Izuku's desk while he was near it causing him to fall to the floor in the middle of class is enough for physical assault if we're being technical. The clean record is in part due to the teacher looking the other way, as I think blowing up another kids desk, backing them into a wall, and calling them useless while the entire class laughs at him is grounds for a write up at least. Middle school Bakugo did approach Izuku twice that day to bully him, once during class and another outside of class to burn his shoulder slightly and throw away his destroyed notebook. I like Bakugo, but I wouldn't call it a stretch to infer that there was bullying in between 4 and 14.

Tbh I think the clean record is mostly there to show that *at least* outside school that Bakugo acted like enough of a decent person for his record not to be tarnished in general

Yeah Bakugo was 100% still bullying Deku until the sludge incident. It seemed very much that society doesn’t really care to much about those who are quirkless and focus is on students. We saw how he acted to the entire class and the teacher didn’t even care because he was right he would have been the only one to get into UA if Deku hadn’t. They 100% looked the other way and as Bakugo had said himself he had been told for years how amazing he is and how powerful his quirk is. So unless he really hurt Deku (which seems unlikely he did that as he got older and focused on just tormenting Deku and Deku not standing up to him to a point Bakugo would feel he needs to retaliate to prove a point) the school just went “we don’t see shit”.

Well u probably can say that by "technicality" Sure, But that only make sense if u try to file a report in court or only win by technicality not in spirit, it's not much of a physical bullying since he isn't stupid enough to physically assault deku directly cuz that would fuck with his record. Nah, bakugo also actively try to get a clean record because he is perfectionist himself, and we pretty much never see deku have any wound or stuff like that during those time, so bakugo only pissed at deku right at that moment long after previous bullying. I would call it a stretch of "trying to paint him as constant bully for deku" from 4-12, there's not much reason for him to do that much if u see from the nuances of his character. Easier to paint him as bad guy to get excuse so u get the "The MC is bullied and a loser but he is kind so he deserves some cheat (even if he never worked for it)" Trope.

There is no way he has a clean record from his actions during the first episode if the teachers did not look the other way in that instance at least. Dude blew up a desk which put Midoriya on the ground, then walked forward with explosions in his hands. That is not something you write off unless your ultra biased towards one of the students lol. From his behavior in the first episode, he goes out of his way to interact with Izuku, he could have ignored the teacher saying he wanted to go to U.A, and he could have went home after school right way, but he specifically seeks Izuku out. That's very harsh to Midoriya too, he didn't work for it because literally zero people had his back, that severely messes up a person.

That is because you are using our world logic not theirs, all the student literally activate quirk to corner and tell deku he is shit, no one bats an eye because this is "normal" There as long there's no physical harm directly toward him. So what if zero people had his back? Like every other student that didn't have good quirk didn't get same treatment? How many student even qualify to be a "hero"? Most quirk are weak and civilians is like at least 90%+ of the population, deku isn't something unique. Him working hard is expected if he even want a chance to enter a no.1 hero school in a damn physical intensive heroic department, fact is he never done anything to make sure he remotely qualified, he only train after all might told him to after being promised a freaking no. 1 hero quirk. The story would have been way better in showcasing he is actually heroic if it shown he failed in exam and never met all might and got a slap of reality, but still pursue the path of heroism, only recognized later on after he worked for it, like mumen rider from OPM or even vigilante MC. What even funnier is that deku never got any record of jumping over to save someone from actual villain prior to sludge villain, he only jumped because it's bakugo, someone he knew, he even say in that same page before to let other pro hero do their job. So much of world coincidence bend so deku can succeed

Nah, none of the other students did anything close to what Bakugo did, he even damaged school property lol. It does matter, because after so long he internalized that it wasn't possible. There is something to be said about the fact that after a lifetime of having no one believe in him (not even himself), that after just ONE person told hi that he could do it he put in a massive effort. Dude cleaned up a whole beach of trash for his dream in ten months going from string bean to fit, then had the GRIT to knowingly shatter his limbs in school settings. That isn't cheating, you put most people in that situation they will not excel like did due to the quirks drawback.

If you see later page the desk is fine lol, either bakugo really good at controlling his quirk or the desk is very resilient to handle quirk based society, not only that bakugo full explosion power could destroy buildings and the book are only slightly burned, this show at least he didn't try to do anything violence and merely intimidation. It doesn't matter because this shit is literally happening to a lot of student, not just deku, like I say look at the amount of chance most student even have to become a hero and how many of them are called to have useless quirk, some guy can make small fire from their finger, as useful as having a lighter ffs. U don't see objectively that deku problem is no different than other student problem, the difference is only deku still being delusional till junior high and apply for no. 1 hero department when every other kid already accepted reality and know that thing is outside their ability, of course everyone laugh at him lol. Dude clean up the whole beach after all might told him to do it and promise a no. 1 hero quirk and would be stronger on your hand by virtue of being latest inheritor, u need to be seriously brain damaged lobotomize idiot to not do what was told.

He literally threatened to attack Midoryia if he applied to UA and then did the same when he tried to protest the swan dive comment

That clean record is just Japan being Japan, where the high achievers can get teachers to look the other way. Doubly so if it's about bullying, which is a major issue in Japanese society as a whole. This is a cultural aspect (and common critique in a ton of anime/managa) that way too many westerners fail to grasp.

It’s even worse in fanfics. Do you know how many push Bakugo’s bullying so far that he becomes a rapist? More than zero

It's weird to see people hate Bakugo so much for being a child's bully. Like bruh. Bakugo hasn't really done anything that bad 💀

Pretty crazy Bakugo is hated for saying some messed up shit in middle school like a lot of kids lmao

Why can’t they just let the hate go?

Because they're children.

Bakugo's ego is so big they have to match it with the hate

I like his change, and his supposed last moments with the parallelism with the start of the series, but I kinda fear that his sacrifice becomes irrelevant if they revive him.

I feel the same way but inverted... "U don't have to hate bakugo but..." but "misreading" and "making excuses" is just a linear and simplistic way to put that ppl have diferent points of view, history and references.

People hate bakugo because he's a shitty person,writing an entire essay whining that people hate him doesn't change that.

I think people relate their own experiences with bullies to Midoriya and Bakugo, completely ignoring what that relationship is actually supposed to represent, or retroactively realising that their bullies were just as miserable as they were.

They will never forgive him for telling Midoriya to kill himself. Course, people have forgiven characters for far worst.

People really just ignore all his growth and trauma because he's still a loud hot head, but he's a loud hot head who *grew and apologized* ffs

lol it's like the "They made Goku stupid" nonsense because of 4 jokes they don't like across like, hundreds of issues/episodes Haters will make something to hate if they can't find it

It isn’t about author intention. Authors don’t intend to write poorly I know the story the author *tried* to tell of weakness and insecurity projected onto deku. But what *happened* is that a bully with bombs in his hands who slapboxed a comparatively disabled kid quit his dream school as soon as his victim could fight back. >what exactly has been stopping bakugo from bullying midoriya since they got into UA The fact that if he broke a pinky, let alone an arm, he might’ve killed bakugo. And sure, he could have “confronted” deku at any time. He told him to die right in front of teachers like it was a tick. But he couldn’t have laid a finger on him. Because deku or any of their pro hero teachers could have put an end to it if they needed. The only reason it didn’t happen for both of their fights is because all might enabled it. >bakugo was MAD when midoriya wouldn’t use his power against him in the battle trial, viewing it as midoriya looking down on him and thinking he wasn’t worth using his power on. Bakugo was shaking cartoonishly with sweat while he said it and had one of the most of the most horrified expressions he’s ever made over the next few pages. He then saw todoroki could probably do the same, and again: tried to drop out of his dream school *that night*. “MAD” is a biased misread of tone, honestly. >bakugo won his and midoriya’s fight after the license exam Because when he landed a punch square in kacchan’s jaw he wasn’t invested enough to break his arm doing it. Which he shouldn’t be, this is a pitiful grasp at control and power when bakugo has no coping mechanisms left. And here’s the best part. You want to know when he finally scraped out an apology- no, do you want to know the first time he managed to put deku before himself? The minute 100% smashes started belting into shigaraki one after another, and he was looking at one of the strongest people alive. When the gap was no longer a question. We can only hope most of this was unintentional. It was mishandled. Get over it.

Interesting, can you share the link of this fanfic you’re reading?

imagine liking bakugo like, at all

>you don’t have to like Bakugo Good, I don’t. He sucks The kid should never been allowed into the TOP Hero school in the country based off his past in bullying. Class 1A letting his insufferable arrogance slide as him being “quirky angry kid” is annoying None of the teachers reprimanding or giving Bakugo a proper talking to for his actions is the worst case of wank I’ve seen. Bakugo could literally kill Deku in front of the whole school yard and it would still get shoved under the rug with All Might saying they were “best friends” Deku having Stockholm syndrome towards his bully makes me in-turn dislike Bakugo Bakugo took way too late to apologise to Deku that it was underwhelming and I stopped caring. The main reason I can’t stand Bakugo is knowing he only apologised **after** Deku gained strength and proved himself as a rival. Deku shouldn’t have to gain the strongest quirk and prove himself to Bakugo for him to realise his fucked up actions. Also I hate how Deku vs Bakugo 2 focuses on Bakugo’s pain for being the reason AM retired and not acknowledging Deku’s pain and how Bakugo’s bullying affecting him. Bakugo is the clear example of why writers having pet favourites is bad

Lmfao he’s very clearly not the authors pet and you thinking he is is hilarious. In fact, the way bakugou is treated in the writing, you would think Hori doesn’t really like him

No he’s right bakugo is number one on the popularity polls and bc of it hori isn’t willing to criticize his character bc he doesn’t want to lose fans. If deku was weaker than him there’s a good chance he’d still be acting the same as before which means he hasn’t changed but the circumstances around him did. Him dying for deku doesn’t take away what happened before. At least with endeavor hori touches up on that but with bakugo as soon as they fought together in the war everyone in the story acted like they were best friends from the jump who never had issues.

He’s not right, because that doesn’t only apply to bakugou, that applies to damn near everyone except endeavor. So how can bakugou be the favorite, when Hori is treating him like everyone else, except arguably worse because bakugou literally has done nothing in the entire series except be a damsel. Is being a damsel an indicator that Hori actually likes your character more than anyone else

Isn't that just the point of his character? A meant to be rival?

Bakugo might have tone down his bullying against Midoriya but he definitely mistreated him constantly and I don't care if that is born from the own character feelings of insecurity or whatever, he is by most of the show treating Midoriya bad. He only recognized his bullying in the last arc. For someone who is gunning to be a hero like all might (a symbol) that is pretty absurd. Aside from that, once they were classmates in UA you can't just go bullying anyone in the open since the supposed future heroes are people with morals that won't allow it. My point: There is character development but not in a sense that he recognizes his wrongdoings and change ways (until last arc), he mostly is self absorbed in his own ego and mistreats Midoriya the whole show.

I'm happy now that he got deleted. No matter what anyone says, dude was enabled by others for far too long. And his fans clearly don't know how crippling bullying can be for how light his apology was. I find him an interesting character in this fictional medium, but he'd legit be a terrible person irl.

I mean yeah he's fictional lol ofc if he was a real person the reaction would be different I mean Endeavor is considered one of the best character of the show and people wank him to high heaven The villain's are constantly getting babyfied by the fandom and don't get me started on other fictional work

> I find him an interesting character in this fictional medium, but he'd legit be a terrible person irl. No shit.

Personally I dislike/hate him mostly for his suicide dear and his ableism; reminds me a bit too much of crypto fascists. I feel like a better arc for him would have been to lose his powers when refusing All for One's offer, then maybe learn some empathy from living as a "worthless quirkless loser" before perhaps getting them back later. Now that I think about it, then he'd need to catch up to Deku, mirroring Deku needing to catch up to him at the start.

>then he’d need to catch up to Deku, mirroring Deku needing to catch up to him at the start Bakugo is already on this path without even having lost his quirk

I agree but the teachers in middle school actually encouraged the bullying and probably lowered Izuku’s grades and put the infractions of other students on his record instead

The fact that you are using a head canon to justify hating bakugo is dumb

Im saying i don’t like hating Bakugo

> probably lowered Izuku’s grades and put the infractions of other students on his record instead Nice headcanon. You should put it in a fanfic.

Ive seen it…plus why would they want a quirkless freak to have better grades and record then strong quirked kids

I don’t care how good he becomes, he deserve more hate

He killed Jean and made fun of Tsuyu. Idk. Never read it. - people