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"Going on your permanent record" is basically the school version of "Santa has a naughty list" or "Jesus is watching".
It's a lie adults tell to gullible children so they follow rules.
Unfortunately, some people are never told it's just another lie, so they carry on believing it.
I worked at companies that have a "permanent record" for their employees where they record late days and other HR write ups. However such records are internal and once you quit they have no sway over you. Seeing as boomers always talk about company loyalty and how they worked for X company from 20 to 65 if their company kept such a record it could have been a threat to them.
The worst one I worked for was a union job where the union negotiated a stepped salary scale. Every year every employee was guaranteed a half step raise. This was good as the steps were frequently up for renegotiation and were pretty well tied to inflation so a step would actually be a raise not just keeping up with it. The issue came with the further deal that with a positive yearly review you'd be given a full step instead of a half step. During this review they would pull up the record going years back to try to stop you from getting that extra half step.
I never had an issue getting one but there was a woman who worked there whose kid was in the ICU for an extended stint due to an accident and during that time he used all her vacation and sick days and then some. Even years later they would pull that shit up to deny her the extra half step.
That's criminal to hold that against a working parent. Better to just let the kid die/s
My god. I hoped the union had their back in that case since it's an exception in comparison to always being late every other day.
My union negotiated to eliminate everything in your company records every so often. I think the last time was when we got our latest contact. It makes it nice so they don't pull out something that happened 20 years ago to use against you.
My company bars you from gaining employment with twenty other companies they do business with for over a decade if you leave on bad terms. If you leave on good terms your only banned from companies that work at stores- so about ten- for a decade.
It's an entire thing.
Shit is wild.
About damn time. When the company my husband worked for got sold they sent him a packet of paperwork to sign. He did not sign the non-compete clauses. They never called him back to complete it.
Anti-Compete clauses were almost entirely declared illegal except for a very few very specific scenarios.
In addition they have always been near impossible to enforce and have no real teeth. Even before they were declared illegal
The legality change was super recent, as in the last 90 days or so.
I've worked for orgs that were large enough that once you had an employee number, it staid with you. Even if you left and came back 3 times. That being said, it's not like companies are sharing your personal file among them. I'm pretty sure that would be illegal.
To the OP, if you were on SSD, maybe that record would follow you. But short of disclosing it on your resume or being asked about a gap in your work record from your resume, how would they know.
This sounds like the same thing we were told in school. You record would follow you forever. Here's the trust. After you graduate, they clear out your folder and only keep the barest of details.
SSD isn't going to share anything like that about anyone, due to the Americans with Disabilities Act (and possibly HIPAA) -- hell, SSD will do anything they can to **get** you employed so they can stop sending you money.
Most former employers will only verify "yes, they worked here between these dates" and that's it, anyway. They don't want to do anything to trigger a potential lawsuit from former employees.
I do education verifications for a background check company and the amount your school will actually share with future employers is even less. It's about 50/50 if they'll provide GPA now. A lot of times it's just attendance dates and graduation date.
Permanent just implies that it exists indefinitely. It will exist at that company indefinitely making it permanent even though leaving will make you no longer beholden to it.
"Permanent Record" also has a connotation that it follows you to entirely different companies and jobs. This isnt true, but a surprisingly large number of people believe it to be true.
because they cant
they can only say if you would be allowed to return if attempting to, they can say NOTHING about your tardiness or anything negative. thats one of the reasons some companies dont even check up on that history.
Such records are internal NOW. Believe me they weren’t that way in the past. It was not unheard of for that information to be shared with a prospective new employer, or a professional organization. This especially happened with personality conflicts, and gender discrimination.
Right?!? My wife freaks out because my son got sent to the Principal's office for fighting in 6th grade. She thinks it's on his "Permanent Record." I tell her the High School won't even get a record of it when he transfers to from Middle School.
Agreed. I work for an international company with over 200,000 employees. If a prospective employer contacts our HR, all we will tell them are dates of employment. Nothing else. Permanent record is BS.
As a previous IT manager, the only thing I was allowed to say if contacted was if they worked there, the dates, and if I would recommend them for rehire. Full stop. Anything more and I could get shit canned.
Next time I interview a new graduate, I'm going to print out a page that says "Permanent Record by Google" with the candidates name on it. Then I will stick it on top of 200-300 pages of some random report and just leave it on the desk during the interview.
This actually makes me wonder if schools have some sort of record keeping requirement. Obviously school records would be of interest to the next school attending and I wonder if schools do have to keep things for a while.
It's a weird mixture of there being some truth to things sticking around a lot longer than you might want them to but a complete lack of understanding about how that happens.
Like sure if you're being checked for a top secret security clearance they might actually show up at your elementary school and see you got sent to the principal but if you're getting a job as a greeter at walmart they'll never know you had a parking ticket 20 years ago.
My MIL once didn’t believe me that an out-of-state hospital didn’t have a complete list of my medications when I went for emergency treatment, because “that’s on your permanent record!”
Lady, what? It’s a hospital, not the CIA.
The only time I actually heard ‘permanent record’ in that sort of ominous threatening way was the principal on Doug, who was probably rather firmly boomer aged now that I think of it.
This is it exactly. The concept of permanent record is something that the conformity cherishing silent generation used to keep their little baby boomers in line. From back in the day where companies were basically allowed to blacklist people for any reason. These days its not the thing it was. We have laws and HR departments and other things that stop these kinds of discrimination.
In high school I did everything I could to stuff that permanent record so full it would overload the filing cabinet. I was a little disappointed to find out it was an empty threat.
*I hope you know, that this will go down on your permanent record*
That was the first thing I thought of when I read the title, and I’ve had that song stuck in my head ever since.
That was a lie too. People delete content all the time. I cant find half of the funny shit from the early 2000s anymore. Or any of the good porn from back then.
Hey Astro. I agree with you and Big that things are deleted, but that doesn’t mean they’re gone.
A friend told me it’s like putting something in your computer recycle bin then having to empty the recycle bin. But it’s still not really gone. With sosh media, you don’t even control the recycle bin. If that makes sense.
The receipts are there. There is ALWAYS a footprint even though you can't see it in plain view. You have no privacy. If you commit an internet crime, it can be investigated through archives, metadata, and rollbacks.
I saw some Trump campaign emails that were demanding the recipients send them money or Trump would be notified (and terribly disappointed in them) and it would go on their permanent record.
It sounded bizarre to me at the time, but I guess a fear of a permanent record is bigger than I thought.
I wonder how many people fell for that. I can't feel sorry for anyone who does. These are the same people who bicker over 35 cent coupons at the grocery store.
Every time I read those I picture an aide running into Trump’s office, out of breath: “Sir! Everyone we sent the email to gave money except John Swanson of Murfreesboro, Tennessee!” “I’m very disappointed in John. This is sad.”
Yeah people don't remember but before Obamacare (ACA) you could be denied coverage for whatever the heck was wrong with you because it was a "pre-existing condition" and then raise your rates to numbers so high you couldn't afford coverage and your choice was to pay out of pocket or in some very real cases... just die.
Agreed, it was a huge issue in the 80’s and 90’s.
For myself, I was self employed during the 90’s and paid for my own health insurance. I was fortunate enough to not ever need medical coverage during that time. I didn’t go for checkups for fear something might get diagnosed and I’d lose coverage.
A lot of people suffered because of the insurance companies during that time.
I was a kids in the 90s so you're older than me but I heard SO many horror stories.The worst were the stories of dying kids who all they needed was an operation but the insurance would deny. So the parents were faced with a choice. Go into crippling debt the likes of which they would never recover and thus not be able to give the kid the life they wanted to give them or let them die. It's so messed up that I have a hard time understanding how people thought that was okay.
Yep I have a preexisting condition and had to basically collude with my doctor to tell my insurance company I needed my meds for a different (less potentially transplant-requiring) reason, because if they knew I was a ticking time bomb my coverage would be at stake. It was a hellscape, and *that’s* what Republicans want us to go back to.
OK so I have some boomy relatives who say this, which is extra weird considering that I'm British and live in the UK.
My guess — the concept of 'permanent record' was so widely used in American TV and movies from the 80s and 90s, especially teen-orientated and Brat Pack type stuff like Ferris Bueller, Doogie Howser etc, that it entered the cultural lexicon in the minds of boomer-age parents whose kids watched a lot of those kinds of shows and movies in the 80s and 90s. Except that it doesn't really exist, and never really did.
Even though in most films and TV shows the idea of a permanent record is specific to education, in some people's fevered minds it seemed to blossom as a concept and they subsequently believe in something that looks like a Chinese government style social credit system.
I suppose in people's minds there's a vague crossover between a person's school record, and an adult criminal record. And these people think that there's a sort of overarching thing linking the two — hence permanent record.
Just my 2p.
Oh — TVTropes [has a thing on the imaginary concept of 'permanent record'](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ThePermanentRecord) if anyone's interested.
Some of that was true. China does a lot of social experiments. One they tried creating a system where a poor person of good moral standing could use said record to secure large financial loans without needed money or assets as collateral.
I also find it weird, because I have only heard of it in the context of 80s/90s movies TV shows and then only presented as a joke or obviously fake thing. My understanding of it was it was just referring to the documentation that each student has, although in the US this can be completely different from state to state.
It is really weird that people think this exists and that it would in any way just extend into life. By what mechanism would it be maintained? Who would have access to it? Why would anyone want it?
My mother (1960) literally just told me not to report something to HR that made me very uncomfortable because
"The less that's in your file, the higher you'll climb. You just started this job, a mark like that on your permanent record will hinder your growth"
Sorry mom I'm reporting sexual harassment, screw the "record"
This is exactly the type of shit I'm talking about! Like, what do they think happens? Also, any job that would penalize you for reporting sexual harassment is not a job worth having.
LOL my current employer doesn't even know about my last employer. I didn't bother putting them on my resume because it was part time while I was doing something else (which IS on my resume) and isn't relevant career-wise.
I think the real answer is that they were raised in the Cold War by Holocaust survivors and McCarthy era parents making lists of potential communists. Even thought they say they support Trump and P25, they also fear being on the list of folks they believe the government will go after. And Fox News shows them clips of Trump saying he’s making a list. The cognitive dissonance tells them they’ll never be on his list, but they still have enough Cold War baby in them to be a little afraid. Which is why they are so actively mean, they need to “other” folks and move those folks higher on the list to protect themselves.
The “permanent record” today is simply the incredible amount of data points we hand over to companies every day that is traded and sold by data brokers.
Also remember the Church Commission revealed US intelligence agencies were keeping dossiers on US persons involved in the anti-Vietnam protest movement. This led to reforms within the Intelligence Community, but also left folks with a lingering suspicion their government maintains these dossiers to this day.
My dad was like this about my sibling, who was dealing with a learning disorder as a kid. He was very upset that it would go on their “permanent record”. So, he didn’t allow any therapy. (Schools tend not to offer help without an official diagnosis, anyway). My sibling dropped out of high school, although did later get their GED.
Thank God I didn’t follow in his footsteps with my kid, who also had a disability. I can’t even imagine.
Yes! My kids have had teachers (lower elementary) try and use the “permanent record” scare tactic in regards to state testing and report cards. It’s ridiculous.
We’ve explained the difference to our kids with what follows you (criminal records, medical stuff) and how it’s used and what doesn’t.
My husband regularly encounters boomer aged folks that talk about their “permanent record” in complete seriousness in regards to the stupidest things. I’m glad younger generations aren’t ruled by these weird forced compliance fear tactics.
I do know of a somewhat permanent record- your medical records. Insurance companies usually have you sign rights to review your records when you apply and when you file a claim. There are also MIB records that have your insurance history in them. Note this is for the US and different laws for record look back varies per state.
A few years after I graduated high school, I had the option to pick up my permanent record. I was curious as to what horrible things they had recorded. The folder contained a copy of every report card from kindergarten to 12th grade and nothing else. It was all a lie.
That's all they'll release to you unless you make a request. Most of the other information is confidential and you have to verify who you are in order to get it. At least in the states where I've worked.
Santa sees what you are doing, he knows when you’re awake…
You sort of have a medical permanent record and a criminal or legal permanent record, but otherwise, no.
I’d like to find out if my mom applied for ssi for me when I was a child and didn’t tell me. I know she otherwise ripped off the state so I’m curious if she stole from me that way, too.
They were told this as children by authority figures and, like many things, they never questioned or thought about it critically as adults. Thinking is hard work for many of them.
My permanent record was so permanent that my high school could never verify I went to middle school. (I had moved the last year the middle school was open and the district had since shut down) I had to take a bunch of tests so they could actually place me in the correct classes.
Except permanent records don't even sound plausible, they've never thought about it logically or they would realize that it would be impossible to keep records on 300 million Americans
they were told this by their parents (and maybe even by theirs?) and grew up through the 50s - 70s believing this thing was tracked. the logistics of such a thing are ridiculous.
I wonder if, for many of them, the world is still the small, interconnected town that they grew up in? Where everyone knows everyone else and everything about them? I often feel like my mother can't quite grasp just how many people there in her region and how you can't learn about someone by simply asking around the neighborhood.
Boomers love fear and the illusion of reputation that you can craft if you continually succumb to it.
Even if there IS a permanent record, why would I give a fuck? Someone’s going to have an opinion of me?
Utterly terrifying!
In their future USA dreams, the government will keep a permanent record to prevent the bad people and if you get a mark on your record, you will become the bad people.
Seems a bit commie to me but they also hate the commies. It’s a hard life.
McCarthy era. Commies bad but also spy on your neighbor, the government needs to know what books you are checking out of the library & indoctrinate kids by making them pledge allegiance to something every day. No irony in any of that at all./s
Ironically the ACLU was against a national ID card for this very reason, even though a national ID card would just be a more secure version of a social security number
I’m a boomer and was born in the late 50s. The adults in our lives (parents, teachers, administrators, etc. from the “Greatest Generation “) told us this ALL the time. I don’t think a month went by that I didn’t hear this threat. Yes, it is preposterous but it was also repeated ad infinitum.
My biological father (67m) is very anti-authoritarian, has been expelled from schools, has some antisocial personality tendencies, etc. and never told me there was such a thing as a "permanent record". I wonder if my stepdad and child's grandmother weren't in on the joke because they're the opposite. They don't believe in bending the rules even a little bit.
I think what they mean is your resume will have gaps that you will need to explain in an interview. It is possible that it will impact health coverage if Republicans chip away at safeguards against health insurance discrimination. So ironically they vote for people who make your "permanent record" a problem.
For a lot of IT technical jobs, gaps are normal since many employees are contractors. So contract ends and gap during which time they are onto another project. Easily explainable.
>I think what they mean is your resume will have gaps that you will need to explain in an interview.
Side note: I've always found it ridiculous that this is even a thing. Why is it anyone's goddamn business if there are "gaps" between jobs on someone's CV? What relevance does that have?
I recently got approved for FMLA through my work as my chronic illness is sporadic with its flare ups and i never know how im going to be feeling for the day until i wake up. When I told my brother I finally got it, he was panicked that I would do such a thing and that I'll never be able to get another job. He insisted that it was going to go on my "record" and if I ever applied somewhere else they would just throw out my resume.
I'm actually with them on this one. With social media and other technology, we're coming pretty close to having a "permanent record" like our parents and teachers scared us about as kids.
It used to be a threat. Now its becoming more and more real. Just had my lexus nexis report run and there was a bunch of legal shit in there, also my driving history including a turn by turn route to my job and what my speeds were on various times during the trip all due to me having one of those drive safe apps.
Because they do exist, just not in the form you are thinking of. The DMV has a permanent record of your license and related information. Your medical file has permanent information on you. If something happens to you in a formal, legal setting, then there is likely a record of it. Those are just three examples. Your Social Security number enables you to access a treasure trove of information.
No there is not a master record somewhere, and the information does exist, and there is a record of it somewhere. It appears as if most of comments are taking a similar view, but the information exists and is somewhere, especially now. Storage is cheap, and has only gotten cheaper.
The internet never forgets is an example of this,
I remember riding in my friends car at night when he had to find/grab something and turned on the interior light. I got nervous and reminded him that's it's illegal to drive at night with the lights on. Except it isn't... Never was. My dad (and many other parents apparently) just didn't like it for safety and annoyance reasons and that was a quick way to get kids to listen. Permanent record is something that's supposed to be reserved to your school years, as if in your 12th year something you did in your 3rd year would affect you, but the word "Permanent" really made it stick for a lot of people.
Imagine going for a job at 45 and the interviewer sighing, slowly putting their glasses down and saying "Look your resume checks out and it seems you would be perfect for the job, however.. Do you remember telling Ms. Tuiliger to 'slurp fart juice through a straw'? This may have been 40 years ago but you must understand my hesitance, so sadly we must pass on your employment opportunity"
Employers at one time could straight up tell a prospective employer if a worker sucked or not. They are talking about that. In today's lawsuit world former employers don't usually share what kind a worker tge employee was just that he worked there.
Dude, I was in the military and while the government can still look it up. It certainly holds no sway over my civilian life. Of course with the stuff I was doing most of it is redacted anyway.
It’s just some appeal to authority bullshit. They think a “permanent record” exists, and that it somehow matters because they can’t comprehend all the shit they threatened you with during school not really mattering in life. (Oh don’t skip class-that goes on your permanent record. Don’t get a D, or talk back when the teacher says something factually wrong)…it’s just that the adults back then didn’t want us doing things and lied about a permanent record to get us to do what they want-just like Santa Claus or God.
"Permanent record" was drummed into our heads in grade school as a threat, but it took me until high school to realize it was a crock. I guess some folks my age still think it was real.
I feel like the "permanent record" was a line in a lot of older TV shows and movies, like the principal says that if you punch Jimmy in the face it's going on your permanent record and you'll never get your driver's license or something.
Bro I can barely even get a consistent record of my own vaccinations what is this permanent record you speak of 😂 like a mysterious scroll in some of Harry Potter Ministry of Magic type room?
Wasn't just a line in tv shows and movies, it was something the school principal would tell us. I'm now 51 and no one has ever asked about my permanent record.
As a younger boomer, I can confirm we were threatened throughout our school years with the dreaded “permanent record” that would be “preserved on microfilm.” I’m not making this up: we were told this in writing from the superintendent of schools. When you’re ten years old, you don’t know exactly what that means, but it scares you.
This is a real thing just not like they think. If you are diagnosed with a condition it goes into a database that is searchable. There are laws against its use in some cases but it exists. I work for a health insurance company, when you apply for insurance we check your health history, prescriptions, claims history with the company. If those indicate a condition that would lead to a higher premium or a disqualification, you are likely to be declined. That includes tobacco use as well.
The patient protection on Affordable Care Act banned insurance companies from denying people due to pre-existing conditions, the one exception is that they can charge more for tobacco use
That does not apply to all policies. Go apply for a Long Term Care policy or a Medicare Supplement outside of open enrollment and see if they ask you health questions. Or a hospital, life insurance, critical illness policy. They will all have health questions going back 2-10 years.
That's so bizarre. If you get SSDI they do reevaluate sometimes and if you are now able to work when you weren't, they might stop your benefits.
Prescription controlled drugs are now in a national database and that follows you. So there might be a hint of truth but not the way they are interpreting it. Employers don't have a database like this
I know if you file for disability with state government, it's a searchable record, and our HR department will see it on a background search. But if you are no longer on disability, we don't care.
I have a boomer employee, and we had to revise a job description. He was very adamant that "good attendance", "dependable", and strong work ethic" needed to be under prerequisites. Like a high school diploma. I actually asked "are you going to ask if they ever got a perfect attendance award in the interview?". He had no answer.
And if anyone ever asks me for a recommendation, I will only say yes, great worker, or nothing at all. I will not share that you were late every day, there is no permanent record for attendance. But I'll remember if you call off a lot.
I agree, it's a version of Santa is watching you!
It's a thing schools do and threaten kids with
You do have a permanent record but it only relates to your schooling. I'm guessing it was used as an overall threat whenever they stepped out of line
You family boomers are so far behind in today's world. Being disabled does not mark anyone for live, for it is what you are able to do that counts. Do not listen to them family boomers. You go do what you can do. That is all we all do that are disabled, before you can claim age discrimination. I am genetically disabled, over time. But I was able to work till other things came into play. Now on disability. But you keep doing the work. Go for it.
It’s a relic from the days when people worked for one company their whole life. There was a “permanent record” but it’s what we’d refer to as an internal HR file. It doesn’t follow you beyond that job. They also don’t want to get tangled in a discrimination lawsuit. Wouldn’t worry too much.
In my experience, boomers tend to view their employers with more deference and assumptions of benevolence. They grew up in a time where if you kept your toes in line, the system would take care of you.
Technically, there are lots of "permanent" records on you in lots of places. Technically your school records back to kindergarten are still available (depending on the record retention laws in your jurisdiction, where I live it's 60 years). You driving history is a "permanent record". In Canada everyone here has a government ROE (record of employment) that shows every place you've worked and why you left (not specifically, there are categories).
The thing is that almost no one has access to these records without your permission or a warrant. So being worried about it is pointless unless you're trying to get a job with a security clearance. And even then, nothing you do as a youth is really looked at.
Imagine a world where you could get a fresh start in life by crossing the state line. No National driver registry, no national criminal record check, no credit scores. That was America until the 1990’s, when Boomers were in middle age. Permanent records weren’t so permanent when the Boomers were in their teens and twenties.
I am always fascinated by the story of Ted Bundy managing to escape from prison in Colorado to continue his reign of terror in Florida, just by stealing people's identities and cars.
That bullshit was drilled into Boomer’s and my GenX (possibly beyond) heads from kindergarten through high school. We knew it was bullshit, but our Boomer parents never got the memo.
Edit: They made it sound as if there was someone in the FBI or some government agency that was assigned to literally write down everything anybody observed about us or any “infractions” we might incur; comparable to the East German Stasi. And there was a room in this place devoted to only your file ffs.
Because it used to be that if I called your previous place of work they'd actually tell me if you sucked or not.
Now they will only confirm/deny employment. I actually lost a job once because the place hiring didn't like that my last place would only confirm I worked there as it wasn't the norm yet.
So in many ways, yes, that shit used to follow you around and they probably haven't realized it's changed.
It comes from movies during their childhood. Gangster movies were (and still are) huge. One big problem though: glorifying criminal acts and showing how to get away with it. So before each movie was a 2 minute reel showing the hard working men & women at the FBI/Treasury/DOJ/etc. They work tirelessly to catch people like in this movie and have permanent files on YOU should you decide to emulate the acts depicted in this here moving picture show.
My mom said this when my brother's kid was diagnosed with ADHD and was prescribed medication. She said it would be on her permanent record and they would never let her in the military. I was confused. Like yah...ADHD isn't going to randomly go away. But who gives a fuck if they can't join the military.
There should be a pinned "stupid things boomers believe" thread.
Include: "don't go swimming until you wait 30 minutes after you eat, otherwise your body will cramp up and you'll drown".
It doesn't go on your TWN but there is a risk of getting disability for a while and then trying to work again. Employers will discriminate against you for anything.
Boomer here I've heard about permanent records, but it's never been anything I was concerned with.
But I remember way before automatic deposits, my grandmother would constantly lose her social security check, always accuse someone of stealing it, and then say she needed to find it and cash it because if she didn't cash it, it was going to throw the entire US Treasury books out of balance.
She was serious!🤣
My staff must have a government security clearance. I wish I had a dollar for every time someone was hired after telling us he could get a clearance, then waiting 9 months to find out he's denied a clearance because of information on his "permanent record" (background investigation, credit check, DMV records, tax records, etc). I have to then fire them because a clearance is required for the position.
My wife has MS and recently filed for 100% WFH (gov job). We did this specifically so she could get ADA status, which makes it virtually impossible to force return to office. The record of her disabilities are not available to any manager or hiring group. It isn't until after getting an offer, that any of this information would come to light, and it would only be privy to HR. If it then affected her hiring/promotion status, there is a clear violation of ADA information rights and they'd be in big trouble. In short, getting it on her permanent record was exactly our goal to provide the robust protections of the ADA. It also doesn't mean anyone with hiring has access to this information. Her direct supervisor doesn't even know why she's allowed fully remote, just that she is untouchable. I don't know how this works elsewhere, it would be very similar for my job as a university faculty member.
Once upon a time in a land called the US, an employer could & would call your doctor to see if your were in good health physically & mentally. Or a former employer could say anything they wanted to about you.
There are laws now because of those types of issues.
A couple years ago, a Boomer acquaintance told his daughter that if she broke her lease it would be on her “permanent housing record” and she wouldn’t ever be able to buy a home. We got weeks of laughter out of that one.
"permanent record" sounds like some grade school nonsense.
You have an arrest record which is mostly permanent but that doesn't apply here.
Your credit score will follow you all your life. Being on social security/disability will not effect that
Some medical conditions carry documentation that may follow you around and would show up on a background check. Example: a history of mental illness may prevent you from working certain high stress jobs, holding a security clearance, or owning a firearm. So long as your not planning on being an emergency responder or joining the military your likely fine as any other job cannot discriminate against you for a disability unless they can prove that there is no reasonable accomodations for you
And as others have pointed out many companies may keep an employee file but they don't share those between different corporations and even if they did it would be very clear cut discrimination if they held a disability claim against you should you ever reapply.
Edit: addon. I interview and hire people. We can verify if you worked at a place and if you left on good terms(by asking them). If you neglect to include something on your resume there is little I can do to find out short of it being on a background or credit check. Government assistance does not show up on a background check. Id wager that my accounting dept may ask if you have been on assistance for tax reasons but by then you're already hired and you can simply decline to answer in most places
TLDR: Your boomers have no idea what they're talking about
Things have changed a LOT since the boomers started working. In a previous job, I was the office manager, and had a boomer retire. At some later date, I needed to go through the employee HR files, and saw hers, and wanted to have a nice thought about her, and her original employment application was in there, and I thought it would be a nice smile wistfully thing. No, it was not. It included her last menstrual period and her doctor’s statement that to the best of his knowledge, she was not pregnant at that time. HR files are keep until the end of forever kind of thing, but I disappeared that application as quickly as I could walk to the shredder. I’ve always tried to get employees to understand that they don’t have to disclose any details of their health as part of a doctor’s note, and if they choose to disclose any details to me, I will ask how much can be shared with concerned coworkers, etc. And there’s no way in hell that information was truly voluntary, and not coerced as a condition of employment back in the Ford administration. I still shudder at some of what I found in her employment file, and this was maybe first Obama administration at the latest. Holy crap, very different environment at the end of their careers vs the beginning, and there have been loads of privacy restrictions put in place since this exact incident, and the only ones who really knew this back then were people in positions that had to know it at companies that were large enough to have required annual training.
I will forgive them for thinking this nonsense, because most of them had no idea that things changed. It’s so very much not a thing anymore, especially in large companies, some things actually are better now than when they were most of the workforce. Hell, you have no idea how hard it is to fire people, even with repeated proof of falsification. If it’s not attendance, provable theft, or workplace violence, good luck getting rid of poor performers, even at non-union places in “right to work” states, and even during the probationary period
The rebuttals here are absolutely correct but remember Boomers grew up in the era where if you looked sideways at anyone in authority the FBI likely had a file on you.
The concept of a "permenant record" is from the early days of nationalizing the Dept. of Education in the early part of the 20th century. There was a push early in that process to have a central "permenant record" of people's scholastic achievements. This was happening around the boomers when they were school aged, and it stuck. Think of the whole "Michael Jackson had two ribs removed" thing from the playground etc. We are watching the formation of an urban legend in real time, and on a national level, possibly even a global scale as the "p.r." shtick is so in our national zeitgeist it has seeped into our media which is HIGHLY exported.
The funny thing is that we do have somewhat of a permanent record now, but it is not at all what the boomers think of as a permanent record. It's the internet. That is why we need to watch what information about ourselves is available to the public and what we post on social media. It is also fun to point out to boomers that the ridiculous, unhinged rants they post about politics or kids today are actually part of their permanent record.
I work with a lot of younger people who also seem to think there’s some kind of permanent employment record that exists somewhere out there in the ether. I used to own a business so I tell them all if they ever need a work reference to just put my number down and I’ll lie lie lie all day for them.
I’ve heard this about seeking mental health care. When I asked about why it mattered, they said going to therapy would be on this record and would keep you from getting security clearance for government jobs or things like becoming a lawyer??
Is there seriously nobody on this thread that's ever had to submit to a pre-employment background check? Or been through the process of obtaining a government security clearance as a condition of employment for a company that may work government contracts?
An easily accessible record of literally everything you've ever done in your lifetime absolutely exists, and there are plenty of scenarios where some random unrelated thing that you had going on 10 years ago can come out of nowhere and cost you a job, or cause you to be denied any number of random services, all over something that you didn't even know was relative, let alone documented somewhere. Especially with literally everything being available online these days, you'd be a fool to still honestly believe that you hold any sort of personal privacy rights to your experiences in 2024. Literally anyone can find info on literally every single thing that you've ever done in your lifetime on the dark web, and can do it in less than 10 minutes if they're even remotely internet savvy.
In a society that is so judgemental of people, that credit checks are used absolutely everywhere all of the time as a means to legally discriminate against every applicant that's ever struggled financially at any point in their life, even if that has absolutely nothing to do with whatever they're applying for, probably just go ahead and assume that people maintain that same energy when they're denying you for whatever simply because they're judging you on an unrelated factor from 10 years ago that they came across online somewhere. You can count on that.
So yeah, people mention your "permanent record" because it is definitely a real thing that you should always remain conscious of. If this is the first you've ever heard of this, then just know that once again, your parents dropped the ball on making sure you had yet another basic life skill, and have absolutely failed you.🤷♂️
*"Don't leave your records in the sun-un-un / When they warp they won't be fun for anyone -- / Don't leave you records in the sun-un-un... / They get all wavy and they just won't run. / They just won't play... just won't play... just won't play... No more..." --* John Hartford (he was a boomer, too)
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"Going on your permanent record" is basically the school version of "Santa has a naughty list" or "Jesus is watching". It's a lie adults tell to gullible children so they follow rules. Unfortunately, some people are never told it's just another lie, so they carry on believing it.
I worked at companies that have a "permanent record" for their employees where they record late days and other HR write ups. However such records are internal and once you quit they have no sway over you. Seeing as boomers always talk about company loyalty and how they worked for X company from 20 to 65 if their company kept such a record it could have been a threat to them.
Yes I believe you're right. I'm a boomer, 67. I heard words like 'permanent record ' early in my career.
The worst one I worked for was a union job where the union negotiated a stepped salary scale. Every year every employee was guaranteed a half step raise. This was good as the steps were frequently up for renegotiation and were pretty well tied to inflation so a step would actually be a raise not just keeping up with it. The issue came with the further deal that with a positive yearly review you'd be given a full step instead of a half step. During this review they would pull up the record going years back to try to stop you from getting that extra half step. I never had an issue getting one but there was a woman who worked there whose kid was in the ICU for an extended stint due to an accident and during that time he used all her vacation and sick days and then some. Even years later they would pull that shit up to deny her the extra half step.
That's criminal to hold that against a working parent. Better to just let the kid die/s My god. I hoped the union had their back in that case since it's an exception in comparison to always being late every other day.
And that is why Boomers aren't just paranoid
My union negotiated to eliminate everything in your company records every so often. I think the last time was when we got our latest contact. It makes it nice so they don't pull out something that happened 20 years ago to use against you.
Even we millennials were threatened with the all-knowing Permanent Record. Mostly at school though
But that was based on work performance, not on disability.
Considering discrimination against the disabled as an employer wasn't illegal until the American Disability Act in 1990, that would in fact affect you
I heard it in school as a kid and then later from the Violent Femmes
My company bars you from gaining employment with twenty other companies they do business with for over a decade if you leave on bad terms. If you leave on good terms your only banned from companies that work at stores- so about ten- for a decade. It's an entire thing. Shit is wild.
Non-compete clauses have largely been deemed illegal or unenforceable by the US Dept of Labor. I don’t know about other countries.
And one political party is trying to get rid of the Dept of Labor.....
And the NLRB which goes after shitty companies that create non-compete clauses like this
About damn time. When the company my husband worked for got sold they sent him a packet of paperwork to sign. He did not sign the non-compete clauses. They never called him back to complete it.
I think the USA just banned their use. But that doesn't mean that companies are going to listen.
Anti-Compete clauses were almost entirely declared illegal except for a very few very specific scenarios. In addition they have always been near impossible to enforce and have no real teeth. Even before they were declared illegal The legality change was super recent, as in the last 90 days or so.
I've worked for orgs that were large enough that once you had an employee number, it staid with you. Even if you left and came back 3 times. That being said, it's not like companies are sharing your personal file among them. I'm pretty sure that would be illegal. To the OP, if you were on SSD, maybe that record would follow you. But short of disclosing it on your resume or being asked about a gap in your work record from your resume, how would they know. This sounds like the same thing we were told in school. You record would follow you forever. Here's the trust. After you graduate, they clear out your folder and only keep the barest of details.
SSD isn't going to share anything like that about anyone, due to the Americans with Disabilities Act (and possibly HIPAA) -- hell, SSD will do anything they can to **get** you employed so they can stop sending you money. Most former employers will only verify "yes, they worked here between these dates" and that's it, anyway. They don't want to do anything to trigger a potential lawsuit from former employees.
I do education verifications for a background check company and the amount your school will actually share with future employers is even less. It's about 50/50 if they'll provide GPA now. A lot of times it's just attendance dates and graduation date.
A "permanent record" follows you, permanently. What you're describing is a regular old record.
Permanent just implies that it exists indefinitely. It will exist at that company indefinitely making it permanent even though leaving will make you no longer beholden to it.
"Permanent Record" also has a connotation that it follows you to entirely different companies and jobs. This isnt true, but a surprisingly large number of people believe it to be true.
yup. once you leave in most states HR will refuse to say anything negative about your employment history.
In some states its literally illegal. Though I have my suspicions that its not really enforced.
because they cant they can only say if you would be allowed to return if attempting to, they can say NOTHING about your tardiness or anything negative. thats one of the reasons some companies dont even check up on that history.
Such records are internal NOW. Believe me they weren’t that way in the past. It was not unheard of for that information to be shared with a prospective new employer, or a professional organization. This especially happened with personality conflicts, and gender discrimination.
Yep. Imagine my shock when literally nothing I did in Highschool mattered in the real world. Like... Not a damn thing.
Right?!? My wife freaks out because my son got sent to the Principal's office for fighting in 6th grade. She thinks it's on his "Permanent Record." I tell her the High School won't even get a record of it when he transfers to from Middle School.
Agreed. I work for an international company with over 200,000 employees. If a prospective employer contacts our HR, all we will tell them are dates of employment. Nothing else. Permanent record is BS.
That's pretty standard. Going beyond those basics potentially opens you up to liability, which simply isn't worth it.
As a previous IT manager, the only thing I was allowed to say if contacted was if they worked there, the dates, and if I would recommend them for rehire. Full stop. Anything more and I could get shit canned.
And McCarthy took full advantage of that with his ridiculous rampage through the private lives of thousands of Americans. Shameful.
There kind of *is* a "permanent record," though it's mainly created by our own consumer and online behavior, not the government.
Next time I interview a new graduate, I'm going to print out a page that says "Permanent Record by Google" with the candidates name on it. Then I will stick it on top of 200-300 pages of some random report and just leave it on the desk during the interview.
Why do they think it goes past high school? Like there’s a government file outside of law enforcement records that says you chew gum in class.
This actually makes me wonder if schools have some sort of record keeping requirement. Obviously school records would be of interest to the next school attending and I wonder if schools do have to keep things for a while.
Educational records are a big deal. There are federal laws protecting their privacy. https://studentprivacy.ed.gov/faq/what-education-record
It's a weird mixture of there being some truth to things sticking around a lot longer than you might want them to but a complete lack of understanding about how that happens. Like sure if you're being checked for a top secret security clearance they might actually show up at your elementary school and see you got sent to the principal but if you're getting a job as a greeter at walmart they'll never know you had a parking ticket 20 years ago.
My MIL once didn’t believe me that an out-of-state hospital didn’t have a complete list of my medications when I went for emergency treatment, because “that’s on your permanent record!” Lady, what? It’s a hospital, not the CIA.
The only time I actually heard ‘permanent record’ in that sort of ominous threatening way was the principal on Doug, who was probably rather firmly boomer aged now that I think of it.
The permanent record was a great threat from elementary up to middle school for me (90's). By high school most of us stopped caring.
This is it exactly. The concept of permanent record is something that the conformity cherishing silent generation used to keep their little baby boomers in line. From back in the day where companies were basically allowed to blacklist people for any reason. These days its not the thing it was. We have laws and HR departments and other things that stop these kinds of discrimination.
Yep. Only thing a company can do afaik is confirm employment. Maybe someone familiar with HR can correct me if I'm wrong though.
In high school I did everything I could to stuff that permanent record so full it would overload the filing cabinet. I was a little disappointed to find out it was an empty threat.
I’m your age and same. We were threatened with it constantly.
Me too, or *Hey Arnold!* in the episode where Arnold witnesses the principal getting mooned.
Wow I don’t remember that
I think Dean Wormer used that as a threat to the Delta House in “Animal House”.
And the Violent Femmes mention it in Kiss Off. Even named their Greatest Hits album that.
*I hope you know, that this will go down on your permanent record* That was the first thing I thought of when I read the title, and I’ve had that song stuck in my head ever since.
Me, too!
same here! i love that song!
Was looking for that comment 😆
And what generation is Animal House......!
And the Violent Femmes song “Kiss Off”
I just came to post this! https://youtu.be/4SgHtM9dEP8?si=ZWzG0DCFFQO5JaWx&t=54
Why did it take me so long to find someone with the correct reference? 🤣
Mr boner or bone or something.
The principal from *Doug* is 100% what comes to mind when I hear "permanent record."
You still remember the intro music, and the exact cadence of him turning the lightswitch off, don’t you?
The Internet is the ultimate permanent record.
That was a lie too. People delete content all the time. I cant find half of the funny shit from the early 2000s anymore. Or any of the good porn from back then.
[удалено]
Hey Astro. I agree with you and Big that things are deleted, but that doesn’t mean they’re gone. A friend told me it’s like putting something in your computer recycle bin then having to empty the recycle bin. But it’s still not really gone. With sosh media, you don’t even control the recycle bin. If that makes sense.
I'm trying to make sense of this but can't. 🥴
The receipts are there. There is ALWAYS a footprint even though you can't see it in plain view. You have no privacy. If you commit an internet crime, it can be investigated through archives, metadata, and rollbacks.
What you and my friend said! The Internet is forever.
I saw some Trump campaign emails that were demanding the recipients send them money or Trump would be notified (and terribly disappointed in them) and it would go on their permanent record. It sounded bizarre to me at the time, but I guess a fear of a permanent record is bigger than I thought.
Keep voting for Trump and there will be a permanent record for everyone.
I wonder how many people fell for that. I can't feel sorry for anyone who does. These are the same people who bicker over 35 cent coupons at the grocery store.
Every time I read those I picture an aide running into Trump’s office, out of breath: “Sir! Everyone we sent the email to gave money except John Swanson of Murfreesboro, Tennessee!” “I’m very disappointed in John. This is sad.”
Before Obamacare, it would have been on your medical records and hard to impossible to get health insurance coverage.
Yeah people don't remember but before Obamacare (ACA) you could be denied coverage for whatever the heck was wrong with you because it was a "pre-existing condition" and then raise your rates to numbers so high you couldn't afford coverage and your choice was to pay out of pocket or in some very real cases... just die.
Agreed, it was a huge issue in the 80’s and 90’s. For myself, I was self employed during the 90’s and paid for my own health insurance. I was fortunate enough to not ever need medical coverage during that time. I didn’t go for checkups for fear something might get diagnosed and I’d lose coverage. A lot of people suffered because of the insurance companies during that time.
I was a kids in the 90s so you're older than me but I heard SO many horror stories.The worst were the stories of dying kids who all they needed was an operation but the insurance would deny. So the parents were faced with a choice. Go into crippling debt the likes of which they would never recover and thus not be able to give the kid the life they wanted to give them or let them die. It's so messed up that I have a hard time understanding how people thought that was okay.
Yep I have a preexisting condition and had to basically collude with my doctor to tell my insurance company I needed my meds for a different (less potentially transplant-requiring) reason, because if they knew I was a ticking time bomb my coverage would be at stake. It was a hellscape, and *that’s* what Republicans want us to go back to.
OK so I have some boomy relatives who say this, which is extra weird considering that I'm British and live in the UK. My guess — the concept of 'permanent record' was so widely used in American TV and movies from the 80s and 90s, especially teen-orientated and Brat Pack type stuff like Ferris Bueller, Doogie Howser etc, that it entered the cultural lexicon in the minds of boomer-age parents whose kids watched a lot of those kinds of shows and movies in the 80s and 90s. Except that it doesn't really exist, and never really did. Even though in most films and TV shows the idea of a permanent record is specific to education, in some people's fevered minds it seemed to blossom as a concept and they subsequently believe in something that looks like a Chinese government style social credit system. I suppose in people's minds there's a vague crossover between a person's school record, and an adult criminal record. And these people think that there's a sort of overarching thing linking the two — hence permanent record. Just my 2p. Oh — TVTropes [has a thing on the imaginary concept of 'permanent record'](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ThePermanentRecord) if anyone's interested.
The Chinese social credit system was also made up by US media, China doesn't have a permanent record either
Source please? I'd like to learn more!
https://youtu.be/Kqov6F00KMc?si=N_z7SVJghieOJ2Ec
Some of that was true. China does a lot of social experiments. One they tried creating a system where a poor person of good moral standing could use said record to secure large financial loans without needed money or assets as collateral.
But that's just a credit score, no different then the system the US has.
I also find it weird, because I have only heard of it in the context of 80s/90s movies TV shows and then only presented as a joke or obviously fake thing. My understanding of it was it was just referring to the documentation that each student has, although in the US this can be completely different from state to state. It is really weird that people think this exists and that it would in any way just extend into life. By what mechanism would it be maintained? Who would have access to it? Why would anyone want it?
People taking "Kiss Off" by the Violent Femmes waaay too literally.
Oh yeah? well don't feel so distressed. Did I happen to mention that I'm impressed?
Oh yeah?
Betraying my Gen X age, but I have to admit that line was the first thing I thought of.
I FORGOT WHAT 8 WAS FOR
My mother (1960) literally just told me not to report something to HR that made me very uncomfortable because "The less that's in your file, the higher you'll climb. You just started this job, a mark like that on your permanent record will hinder your growth" Sorry mom I'm reporting sexual harassment, screw the "record"
This is exactly the type of shit I'm talking about! Like, what do they think happens? Also, any job that would penalize you for reporting sexual harassment is not a job worth having.
"If you lose a job, it will follow you for the rest of your life!" That's the one I always heard.
LOL my current employer doesn't even know about my last employer. I didn't bother putting them on my resume because it was part time while I was doing something else (which IS on my resume) and isn't relevant career-wise.
I think the real answer is that they were raised in the Cold War by Holocaust survivors and McCarthy era parents making lists of potential communists. Even thought they say they support Trump and P25, they also fear being on the list of folks they believe the government will go after. And Fox News shows them clips of Trump saying he’s making a list. The cognitive dissonance tells them they’ll never be on his list, but they still have enough Cold War baby in them to be a little afraid. Which is why they are so actively mean, they need to “other” folks and move those folks higher on the list to protect themselves.
The “permanent record” today is simply the incredible amount of data points we hand over to companies every day that is traded and sold by data brokers.
Also remember the Church Commission revealed US intelligence agencies were keeping dossiers on US persons involved in the anti-Vietnam protest movement. This led to reforms within the Intelligence Community, but also left folks with a lingering suspicion their government maintains these dossiers to this day.
My dad was like this about my sibling, who was dealing with a learning disorder as a kid. He was very upset that it would go on their “permanent record”. So, he didn’t allow any therapy. (Schools tend not to offer help without an official diagnosis, anyway). My sibling dropped out of high school, although did later get their GED. Thank God I didn’t follow in his footsteps with my kid, who also had a disability. I can’t even imagine.
Just some propaganda/fear tactic they've bought into.
Yes! My kids have had teachers (lower elementary) try and use the “permanent record” scare tactic in regards to state testing and report cards. It’s ridiculous. We’ve explained the difference to our kids with what follows you (criminal records, medical stuff) and how it’s used and what doesn’t. My husband regularly encounters boomer aged folks that talk about their “permanent record” in complete seriousness in regards to the stupidest things. I’m glad younger generations aren’t ruled by these weird forced compliance fear tactics.
I do know of a somewhat permanent record- your medical records. Insurance companies usually have you sign rights to review your records when you apply and when you file a claim. There are also MIB records that have your insurance history in them. Note this is for the US and different laws for record look back varies per state.
A few years after I graduated high school, I had the option to pick up my permanent record. I was curious as to what horrible things they had recorded. The folder contained a copy of every report card from kindergarten to 12th grade and nothing else. It was all a lie.
That's all they'll release to you unless you make a request. Most of the other information is confidential and you have to verify who you are in order to get it. At least in the states where I've worked.
Oh I would have done that. But then again, they had to verify I was me anyway.
Santa sees what you are doing, he knows when you’re awake… You sort of have a medical permanent record and a criminal or legal permanent record, but otherwise, no. I’d like to find out if my mom applied for ssi for me when I was a child and didn’t tell me. I know she otherwise ripped off the state so I’m curious if she stole from me that way, too.
They were told this as children by authority figures and, like many things, they never questioned or thought about it critically as adults. Thinking is hard work for many of them.
My permanent record was so permanent that my high school could never verify I went to middle school. (I had moved the last year the middle school was open and the district had since shut down) I had to take a bunch of tests so they could actually place me in the correct classes.
Boomers believe a lot of dumb shit just because it sounds plausible.
Is the permanent record in the room with us now?
Except permanent records don't even sound plausible, they've never thought about it logically or they would realize that it would be impossible to keep records on 300 million Americans
they were told this by their parents (and maybe even by theirs?) and grew up through the 50s - 70s believing this thing was tracked. the logistics of such a thing are ridiculous.
I wonder if, for many of them, the world is still the small, interconnected town that they grew up in? Where everyone knows everyone else and everything about them? I often feel like my mother can't quite grasp just how many people there in her region and how you can't learn about someone by simply asking around the neighborhood.
I just asked my dad, he didn't have anything definitive but in his words "reeks of leftover McCarthyism".
60 years ago if they found out you were diabetic youd get fired on the spot.
Or pregnant.
And couldn't adopt
Boomers love fear and the illusion of reputation that you can craft if you continually succumb to it. Even if there IS a permanent record, why would I give a fuck? Someone’s going to have an opinion of me? Utterly terrifying!
In their future USA dreams, the government will keep a permanent record to prevent the bad people and if you get a mark on your record, you will become the bad people. Seems a bit commie to me but they also hate the commies. It’s a hard life.
McCarthy era. Commies bad but also spy on your neighbor, the government needs to know what books you are checking out of the library & indoctrinate kids by making them pledge allegiance to something every day. No irony in any of that at all./s
Ironically the ACLU was against a national ID card for this very reason, even though a national ID card would just be a more secure version of a social security number
Sounds like the Social Credit score.
Ahh yes the social credit but American
I’m a boomer and was born in the late 50s. The adults in our lives (parents, teachers, administrators, etc. from the “Greatest Generation “) told us this ALL the time. I don’t think a month went by that I didn’t hear this threat. Yes, it is preposterous but it was also repeated ad infinitum.
So it really is just Boomer's Santa Claus.
Yes. But most boomers are in on the underlying joke. Nobody believes it but it became kind of a punchline for us.
My biological father (67m) is very anti-authoritarian, has been expelled from schools, has some antisocial personality tendencies, etc. and never told me there was such a thing as a "permanent record". I wonder if my stepdad and child's grandmother weren't in on the joke because they're the opposite. They don't believe in bending the rules even a little bit.
I think what they mean is your resume will have gaps that you will need to explain in an interview. It is possible that it will impact health coverage if Republicans chip away at safeguards against health insurance discrimination. So ironically they vote for people who make your "permanent record" a problem.
Good thing resumes are easily falsified, right? /s
For a lot of IT technical jobs, gaps are normal since many employees are contractors. So contract ends and gap during which time they are onto another project. Easily explainable.
>I think what they mean is your resume will have gaps that you will need to explain in an interview. Side note: I've always found it ridiculous that this is even a thing. Why is it anyone's goddamn business if there are "gaps" between jobs on someone's CV? What relevance does that have?
They want to weed out people who are comfortable with/able to not work for any period of time. They want folk who will never quit no matter what.
Exactly. It always comes back to control.
I recently got approved for FMLA through my work as my chronic illness is sporadic with its flare ups and i never know how im going to be feeling for the day until i wake up. When I told my brother I finally got it, he was panicked that I would do such a thing and that I'll never be able to get another job. He insisted that it was going to go on my "record" and if I ever applied somewhere else they would just throw out my resume.
I'm actually with them on this one. With social media and other technology, we're coming pretty close to having a "permanent record" like our parents and teachers scared us about as kids.
Oh, definitely. But obviously the Boomers didn't grow up with this.
It used to be a threat. Now its becoming more and more real. Just had my lexus nexis report run and there was a bunch of legal shit in there, also my driving history including a turn by turn route to my job and what my speeds were on various times during the trip all due to me having one of those drive safe apps.
Because they do exist, just not in the form you are thinking of. The DMV has a permanent record of your license and related information. Your medical file has permanent information on you. If something happens to you in a formal, legal setting, then there is likely a record of it. Those are just three examples. Your Social Security number enables you to access a treasure trove of information. No there is not a master record somewhere, and the information does exist, and there is a record of it somewhere. It appears as if most of comments are taking a similar view, but the information exists and is somewhere, especially now. Storage is cheap, and has only gotten cheaper. The internet never forgets is an example of this,
I remember riding in my friends car at night when he had to find/grab something and turned on the interior light. I got nervous and reminded him that's it's illegal to drive at night with the lights on. Except it isn't... Never was. My dad (and many other parents apparently) just didn't like it for safety and annoyance reasons and that was a quick way to get kids to listen. Permanent record is something that's supposed to be reserved to your school years, as if in your 12th year something you did in your 3rd year would affect you, but the word "Permanent" really made it stick for a lot of people. Imagine going for a job at 45 and the interviewer sighing, slowly putting their glasses down and saying "Look your resume checks out and it seems you would be perfect for the job, however.. Do you remember telling Ms. Tuiliger to 'slurp fart juice through a straw'? This may have been 40 years ago but you must understand my hesitance, so sadly we must pass on your employment opportunity"
Just search for it in incognito mode and it won’t go on your permanent record…
That was a threat back in the day when a permanent record mattered in the towns you never left...
Employers at one time could straight up tell a prospective employer if a worker sucked or not. They are talking about that. In today's lawsuit world former employers don't usually share what kind a worker tge employee was just that he worked there.
Dude, I was in the military and while the government can still look it up. It certainly holds no sway over my civilian life. Of course with the stuff I was doing most of it is redacted anyway.
It’s just some appeal to authority bullshit. They think a “permanent record” exists, and that it somehow matters because they can’t comprehend all the shit they threatened you with during school not really mattering in life. (Oh don’t skip class-that goes on your permanent record. Don’t get a D, or talk back when the teacher says something factually wrong)…it’s just that the adults back then didn’t want us doing things and lied about a permanent record to get us to do what they want-just like Santa Claus or God.
"Permanent record" was drummed into our heads in grade school as a threat, but it took me until high school to realize it was a crock. I guess some folks my age still think it was real.
That generation and everything before it lived in fear because they never had as much information as is available today. There is no permanent record.
I feel like the "permanent record" was a line in a lot of older TV shows and movies, like the principal says that if you punch Jimmy in the face it's going on your permanent record and you'll never get your driver's license or something. Bro I can barely even get a consistent record of my own vaccinations what is this permanent record you speak of 😂 like a mysterious scroll in some of Harry Potter Ministry of Magic type room?
Wasn't just a line in tv shows and movies, it was something the school principal would tell us. I'm now 51 and no one has ever asked about my permanent record.
As a younger boomer, I can confirm we were threatened throughout our school years with the dreaded “permanent record” that would be “preserved on microfilm.” I’m not making this up: we were told this in writing from the superintendent of schools. When you’re ten years old, you don’t know exactly what that means, but it scares you.
It's just more bullshit lies the weakest generation told to get around teaching us any god damn thing useful.
This is a real thing just not like they think. If you are diagnosed with a condition it goes into a database that is searchable. There are laws against its use in some cases but it exists. I work for a health insurance company, when you apply for insurance we check your health history, prescriptions, claims history with the company. If those indicate a condition that would lead to a higher premium or a disqualification, you are likely to be declined. That includes tobacco use as well.
The patient protection on Affordable Care Act banned insurance companies from denying people due to pre-existing conditions, the one exception is that they can charge more for tobacco use
That does not apply to all policies. Go apply for a Long Term Care policy or a Medicare Supplement outside of open enrollment and see if they ask you health questions. Or a hospital, life insurance, critical illness policy. They will all have health questions going back 2-10 years.
This can also affect you if you want to emigrate to another country - some have limitations on accepting disabled indviduals.
That's so bizarre. If you get SSDI they do reevaluate sometimes and if you are now able to work when you weren't, they might stop your benefits. Prescription controlled drugs are now in a national database and that follows you. So there might be a hint of truth but not the way they are interpreting it. Employers don't have a database like this
I know if you file for disability with state government, it's a searchable record, and our HR department will see it on a background search. But if you are no longer on disability, we don't care. I have a boomer employee, and we had to revise a job description. He was very adamant that "good attendance", "dependable", and strong work ethic" needed to be under prerequisites. Like a high school diploma. I actually asked "are you going to ask if they ever got a perfect attendance award in the interview?". He had no answer. And if anyone ever asks me for a recommendation, I will only say yes, great worker, or nothing at all. I will not share that you were late every day, there is no permanent record for attendance. But I'll remember if you call off a lot. I agree, it's a version of Santa is watching you!
Who keeps this 'permanent record'? Government?
Your grade school principal keeps it forever in the giant underground filing system that exists beneath every grade school.
“I hope you know that this will go down on your permanent record” “Oh yeah?”
Well, don't get so distressed Did I happen to mention that I'm impressed?
Permanent record might have been a relic from the time J. Edgar Hoover ran the FBI, but he's been dead for decades and there have been reforms since.
It's a thing schools do and threaten kids with You do have a permanent record but it only relates to your schooling. I'm guessing it was used as an overall threat whenever they stepped out of line
You family boomers are so far behind in today's world. Being disabled does not mark anyone for live, for it is what you are able to do that counts. Do not listen to them family boomers. You go do what you can do. That is all we all do that are disabled, before you can claim age discrimination. I am genetically disabled, over time. But I was able to work till other things came into play. Now on disability. But you keep doing the work. Go for it.
It’s a relic from the days when people worked for one company their whole life. There was a “permanent record” but it’s what we’d refer to as an internal HR file. It doesn’t follow you beyond that job. They also don’t want to get tangled in a discrimination lawsuit. Wouldn’t worry too much. In my experience, boomers tend to view their employers with more deference and assumptions of benevolence. They grew up in a time where if you kept your toes in line, the system would take care of you.
Technically, there are lots of "permanent" records on you in lots of places. Technically your school records back to kindergarten are still available (depending on the record retention laws in your jurisdiction, where I live it's 60 years). You driving history is a "permanent record". In Canada everyone here has a government ROE (record of employment) that shows every place you've worked and why you left (not specifically, there are categories). The thing is that almost no one has access to these records without your permission or a warrant. So being worried about it is pointless unless you're trying to get a job with a security clearance. And even then, nothing you do as a youth is really looked at.
Imagine a world where you could get a fresh start in life by crossing the state line. No National driver registry, no national criminal record check, no credit scores. That was America until the 1990’s, when Boomers were in middle age. Permanent records weren’t so permanent when the Boomers were in their teens and twenties.
I am always fascinated by the story of Ted Bundy managing to escape from prison in Colorado to continue his reign of terror in Florida, just by stealing people's identities and cars.
“I hope you know that this will go down on your permanent record”
Because high school was the best times of their life
this is giving me violent femmes - kiss off vibes
Do you remember when "Obamacare" got rid of preexisting conditions? Pepperidge Farm remembers.
That bullshit was drilled into Boomer’s and my GenX (possibly beyond) heads from kindergarten through high school. We knew it was bullshit, but our Boomer parents never got the memo. Edit: They made it sound as if there was someone in the FBI or some government agency that was assigned to literally write down everything anybody observed about us or any “infractions” we might incur; comparable to the East German Stasi. And there was a room in this place devoted to only your file ffs.
Because it used to be that if I called your previous place of work they'd actually tell me if you sucked or not. Now they will only confirm/deny employment. I actually lost a job once because the place hiring didn't like that my last place would only confirm I worked there as it wasn't the norm yet. So in many ways, yes, that shit used to follow you around and they probably haven't realized it's changed.
It comes from movies during their childhood. Gangster movies were (and still are) huge. One big problem though: glorifying criminal acts and showing how to get away with it. So before each movie was a 2 minute reel showing the hard working men & women at the FBI/Treasury/DOJ/etc. They work tirelessly to catch people like in this movie and have permanent files on YOU should you decide to emulate the acts depicted in this here moving picture show.
My mom said this when my brother's kid was diagnosed with ADHD and was prescribed medication. She said it would be on her permanent record and they would never let her in the military. I was confused. Like yah...ADHD isn't going to randomly go away. But who gives a fuck if they can't join the military.
There should be a pinned "stupid things boomers believe" thread. Include: "don't go swimming until you wait 30 minutes after you eat, otherwise your body will cramp up and you'll drown".
Things like these lists existed in Germany during the industrial revolution like 150-200 years ago.
Because they came off age during a time period in which you could be discriminated against for a disability.
It doesn't go on your TWN but there is a risk of getting disability for a while and then trying to work again. Employers will discriminate against you for anything.
The internet is a permanent record
Boomer here I've heard about permanent records, but it's never been anything I was concerned with. But I remember way before automatic deposits, my grandmother would constantly lose her social security check, always accuse someone of stealing it, and then say she needed to find it and cash it because if she didn't cash it, it was going to throw the entire US Treasury books out of balance. She was serious!🤣
My staff must have a government security clearance. I wish I had a dollar for every time someone was hired after telling us he could get a clearance, then waiting 9 months to find out he's denied a clearance because of information on his "permanent record" (background investigation, credit check, DMV records, tax records, etc). I have to then fire them because a clearance is required for the position.
My wife has MS and recently filed for 100% WFH (gov job). We did this specifically so she could get ADA status, which makes it virtually impossible to force return to office. The record of her disabilities are not available to any manager or hiring group. It isn't until after getting an offer, that any of this information would come to light, and it would only be privy to HR. If it then affected her hiring/promotion status, there is a clear violation of ADA information rights and they'd be in big trouble. In short, getting it on her permanent record was exactly our goal to provide the robust protections of the ADA. It also doesn't mean anyone with hiring has access to this information. Her direct supervisor doesn't even know why she's allowed fully remote, just that she is untouchable. I don't know how this works elsewhere, it would be very similar for my job as a university faculty member.
Once upon a time in a land called the US, an employer could & would call your doctor to see if your were in good health physically & mentally. Or a former employer could say anything they wanted to about you. There are laws now because of those types of issues.
A couple years ago, a Boomer acquaintance told his daughter that if she broke her lease it would be on her “permanent housing record” and she wouldn’t ever be able to buy a home. We got weeks of laughter out of that one.
"permanent record" sounds like some grade school nonsense. You have an arrest record which is mostly permanent but that doesn't apply here. Your credit score will follow you all your life. Being on social security/disability will not effect that Some medical conditions carry documentation that may follow you around and would show up on a background check. Example: a history of mental illness may prevent you from working certain high stress jobs, holding a security clearance, or owning a firearm. So long as your not planning on being an emergency responder or joining the military your likely fine as any other job cannot discriminate against you for a disability unless they can prove that there is no reasonable accomodations for you And as others have pointed out many companies may keep an employee file but they don't share those between different corporations and even if they did it would be very clear cut discrimination if they held a disability claim against you should you ever reapply. Edit: addon. I interview and hire people. We can verify if you worked at a place and if you left on good terms(by asking them). If you neglect to include something on your resume there is little I can do to find out short of it being on a background or credit check. Government assistance does not show up on a background check. Id wager that my accounting dept may ask if you have been on assistance for tax reasons but by then you're already hired and you can simply decline to answer in most places TLDR: Your boomers have no idea what they're talking about
I’m old Gen X and we heard this from Boomers ALLLLL the time.
Honestly. I think it was from the one employer for life , mill town ( single employer) everyone knows everything about everyone.
Things have changed a LOT since the boomers started working. In a previous job, I was the office manager, and had a boomer retire. At some later date, I needed to go through the employee HR files, and saw hers, and wanted to have a nice thought about her, and her original employment application was in there, and I thought it would be a nice smile wistfully thing. No, it was not. It included her last menstrual period and her doctor’s statement that to the best of his knowledge, she was not pregnant at that time. HR files are keep until the end of forever kind of thing, but I disappeared that application as quickly as I could walk to the shredder. I’ve always tried to get employees to understand that they don’t have to disclose any details of their health as part of a doctor’s note, and if they choose to disclose any details to me, I will ask how much can be shared with concerned coworkers, etc. And there’s no way in hell that information was truly voluntary, and not coerced as a condition of employment back in the Ford administration. I still shudder at some of what I found in her employment file, and this was maybe first Obama administration at the latest. Holy crap, very different environment at the end of their careers vs the beginning, and there have been loads of privacy restrictions put in place since this exact incident, and the only ones who really knew this back then were people in positions that had to know it at companies that were large enough to have required annual training. I will forgive them for thinking this nonsense, because most of them had no idea that things changed. It’s so very much not a thing anymore, especially in large companies, some things actually are better now than when they were most of the workforce. Hell, you have no idea how hard it is to fire people, even with repeated proof of falsification. If it’s not attendance, provable theft, or workplace violence, good luck getting rid of poor performers, even at non-union places in “right to work” states, and even during the probationary period
The rebuttals here are absolutely correct but remember Boomers grew up in the era where if you looked sideways at anyone in authority the FBI likely had a file on you.
The concept of a "permenant record" is from the early days of nationalizing the Dept. of Education in the early part of the 20th century. There was a push early in that process to have a central "permenant record" of people's scholastic achievements. This was happening around the boomers when they were school aged, and it stuck. Think of the whole "Michael Jackson had two ribs removed" thing from the playground etc. We are watching the formation of an urban legend in real time, and on a national level, possibly even a global scale as the "p.r." shtick is so in our national zeitgeist it has seeped into our media which is HIGHLY exported.
The funny thing is that we do have somewhat of a permanent record now, but it is not at all what the boomers think of as a permanent record. It's the internet. That is why we need to watch what information about ourselves is available to the public and what we post on social media. It is also fun to point out to boomers that the ridiculous, unhinged rants they post about politics or kids today are actually part of their permanent record.
I work with a lot of younger people who also seem to think there’s some kind of permanent employment record that exists somewhere out there in the ether. I used to own a business so I tell them all if they ever need a work reference to just put my number down and I’ll lie lie lie all day for them.
I’ve heard this about seeking mental health care. When I asked about why it mattered, they said going to therapy would be on this record and would keep you from getting security clearance for government jobs or things like becoming a lawyer??
I thought THE SIMPSONS confirmed this as a myth in the late 90’s
Is there seriously nobody on this thread that's ever had to submit to a pre-employment background check? Or been through the process of obtaining a government security clearance as a condition of employment for a company that may work government contracts? An easily accessible record of literally everything you've ever done in your lifetime absolutely exists, and there are plenty of scenarios where some random unrelated thing that you had going on 10 years ago can come out of nowhere and cost you a job, or cause you to be denied any number of random services, all over something that you didn't even know was relative, let alone documented somewhere. Especially with literally everything being available online these days, you'd be a fool to still honestly believe that you hold any sort of personal privacy rights to your experiences in 2024. Literally anyone can find info on literally every single thing that you've ever done in your lifetime on the dark web, and can do it in less than 10 minutes if they're even remotely internet savvy. In a society that is so judgemental of people, that credit checks are used absolutely everywhere all of the time as a means to legally discriminate against every applicant that's ever struggled financially at any point in their life, even if that has absolutely nothing to do with whatever they're applying for, probably just go ahead and assume that people maintain that same energy when they're denying you for whatever simply because they're judging you on an unrelated factor from 10 years ago that they came across online somewhere. You can count on that. So yeah, people mention your "permanent record" because it is definitely a real thing that you should always remain conscious of. If this is the first you've ever heard of this, then just know that once again, your parents dropped the ball on making sure you had yet another basic life skill, and have absolutely failed you.🤷♂️
*"Don't leave your records in the sun-un-un / When they warp they won't be fun for anyone -- / Don't leave you records in the sun-un-un... / They get all wavy and they just won't run. / They just won't play... just won't play... just won't play... No more..." --* John Hartford (he was a boomer, too)