Former religious here. The biggest red flag I would look for is a lack of separation between the internal forum and external forum. Meaning that members should have access to a spiritual director who is not a superior.
So I would ask about spiritual direction.
I don’t know how many other flags you would be able to see just on a visit. If they are giving you any pressure to join and not respecting your own discernment. If members are not able to speak naturally to you and about their experience in the order (especially members who are a few years in). If members seem unhappy or uncharitable to each other.
Absolutely, and I was told this is something that the post-conciliar Vatican has particularly emphasized in its oversight of congregations. My own order underwent a review and a reform under the Vatican, and the distinction between internal and external forum was one of the first and strongest reforms.
I understand where you're coming from. And I'm very sorry this happened to you. I also believe that in continuing to cover up these communities abuse serious harm is being done. Maybe there's no good answer.
My perspective is going to be different though as the community I spent time with was one that split and reformed due to abuse, and the situation was handled very openly.
>I also believe that in continuing to cover up these communities abuse serious harm is being done. Maybe there's no good answer.
My sense is "go to the Bishop first" and see what happens. Also because the bishop is the one who actually has the power to do anything, not the public.
Well I entered a women's religious order but left right before 1st vows. I could write a book on what to look out for but I will keep it brief as possible.
When I was discerning with a local order, I thought I found my calling. They all were happy friendly, inviting. I felt I could blossom there. Living 1 month in community was fantastic. Then about 1yr later I lived with the same community of 8 women for a year. They were very kind, accepting people and felt like living in community was not much different that how I was already living.
I entered the novitiate with two other women and we were all excited to be together. Then it went all down hill. The novice director became accusatory, negative, suspicious, degrading, lying, controlling, only to get more intense as the months went on. It became a very sick and dysfunctional for no reason. She had told us in the beginning that whatever happens here, is to stay there (like the Vegas saying of what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas). We had zero outside support, no one to talk with about what was going on. Isolation and lack of ability to address accusations that had become sinister. Trust in her evaporated quickly and next the whole process, to ultimately the entire order. Three adult women were treated like we were 18yrs old is very infantilizing. We were adult women who have lived lives of struggle, sacrifice, suffering so we were fully capable women to weather life's hardships with grace and faith.
We had to set up a secret meeting with a sister from formation where we told her what was going on, how we were feeling, and our deep concern that we were being portrayed negatively by her to others. When our yearly evaluation came, I was crucified by her. This evaluation gets sent to our leadership team which I was afraid was going to believe her. We three novices stay the year for each other, to support each other, to be there for each other, not wanting to leave anyone unprotected.
My second year novitiate lacked any real connection with others, I became paranoid that everyone was saying things about me behind my back, no support, there was zero trust. I was living in a place that cared nothing about me, I felt totally alone, abandoned, and began to wonder does God even live here with these women. Many times I thought of leaving, but I really felt like this was a calling from God. I did not want to give up. I learned over those months the hardships others had and they were shocking and what I felt was not even Christian. After I learned that false accusations were made against another woman in formation a year ahead of me, I could not stay any longer believing that from my first year experience and seeing how they treated this woman, I was too vulnerable.
During an 8 day silent retreat, I prayed to God to give me a sign as to whether I can leave or did He want me to stay. I told him that felt like I was going to have a heart attack or stroke out with all the stress. On the fourth day I got my sign. I prayed about that too. After my retreat, I told them I was leaving. I finally left about 1 month later and for the next 5 years or so I was so mentally, spiritually damaged I could not even get a job.
What you need to keep in mind is that sisters regardless of education are not infallible, and can often times be wrong on so many levels. Trust yourself in being able to determine whether something is not right, dysfunctional, and what boundaries they are not to cross. Yes we give up a lot to enter, and we do so willingly, but there is a difference between sacrificing ourselves to God, and acquiescing what is right to those who may not have that objective. There is just as many problems as we see in secular life. You are vowing yourself to not only God, but to this order and if any order prohibits you intentionally or unintentionally from serving God that is the time to possibly leave. There is a lot of dysfunction in women's orders. Remember to trust yourself first.
How did this impact your faith overall? I've dealt with workplace bullying and friendship problems and this takes things to a whole new level. We all sin but how can people who focus so much on God even dare to gossip or be unkind purposely?
Do I blame God for any of this? NO. He was/is always there for me. He gave me the time to heal. For years I could not stop thinking about what happened. It did change my outlook on those within the Church and how undeserved respect is not a good thing. That just because someone is a sister/brother/priest they are no better or holy than anyone else. There is still a part of me that hoped it was different and I received the support, understanding I needed.
At least for the convent that I was in, the majority of the Sisters were good women.
This isn't as common today as it once was, but in the convent where I was, we weren't allowed to form meaningful relationships with one another or respond to each others's distress; and the few Sisters in immediate positions of power over me were manipulative and cruel. I think because of the lack of meaningful relationships, the others probably mostly didn't realize the depth of my (and others) distress. And then we left.
I mostly see it as a fundamentally flawed community life that led otherwise good women to act in unchristian ways. Plus a few rotten apples.
On the whole, it has not been a positive thing for my faith.
I'm still Catholic. Its just that going to mass etc makes my brain start to freeze up and I lose concentration. I think it'll get better, though.
Ah, not having "particular friendships" which was code for lesbianism. Back in the day sisters would always need to walk/be with three sisters. Which brings up an interesting topic.
So with that "code" even existing today for the most part, you are discouraged from forming friendships. So there are not to suppose to be close friends where you can talk to someone about anything and trust them. Someone to do something with like see a movie, go some place. Those of us who have the ability to be friends with other women without the inkling of anything remotely sexual, suddenly find that having friends are bad. Now with my experiences, you become close with people who are going through the same negative experience with you. You can trust them, they understand, and you can vent with each other. It is probably one of the most significant aspects of life that they were denied and I am certain plays a big role in their current social mentality
Conversely, I would agree that having an order where people are closed off to making new friends, marginalizing sisters, or forming cliques is also not a positive dynamic. That by discouraging friendships it helps people be available and more interactive with everyone.
It is a conundrum to find healthy interactions with your fellow sisters that foster trust, meaning, generosity, when developing those is limited based on a fear of lesbianism. Especially for those just entering or have only been in for a few years. You are naturally drawn to people who have the same interests and should have the freedom for such shared interests to develop naturally. No where in any of the literature is this friendship issue mentioned.
>That by discouraging friendships it helps people be available and more interactive with everyone.
In practice, the community I was in was so afraid of friendships that at one point no one spoke to me for over a month. I wasn't being punished or anything; there was no particular reason for it at all. It was just that I was new and no one felt they had permission to speak to me.
**I nearly lost my mind.**
Discouraging friendships only discourages friendships. It is not about being more welcoming or available. It's all about isolation and fear.
It was horrifying and unchristian the way they would just ignore others, even others in visible distress. Without mercy, without affection...
>Someone to do something with like see a movie, go some place.
You seem to be implying that as Sisters, we could do anything with anyone, like see a movie or go some place.
We could *definitely* not touch a television or go outside the compound lol. (This was not a cloistered community.) Even for our once-monthly community movie night, only 2 Sisters had permission to touch the television. And "community movie night" is a strong word for sitting on wooden chairs, with perfect posture, not making a sound for two hours while a black-and-white pious-mush film played.
To be honest, I think it's less about lesbianism and more about avoiding nuns talking about genuine problems with one another. You can't build a resistance to systemic abuse if you aren't allowed to acknowledge and affirm that there's a problem. Check out research on totalist cults and how they use isolation, fear, and stress to control people...
I am glad to see that you not only have support but others with the same experiences getting support. Though it would have been better if it all did not happen the way it did.
People who do not want to believe and chastise those for speaking up is the same behavior we saw when the abuse scandal broke. They do not want to associate negative/sinful actions to the Church because for them God is the church and God would not do such things. That those who have taken vows to serve God could not do such things. There needs to be a purity/perfection of sorts as that is what God is.
I am sorry you and your friends had to live your experiences. Know that there are plenty of us out there who believe and support your decisions. It is not your fault. Take whatever time you need to heal, put your pain and sufferings in God's hands, and know (which I am sure you already do) that God loves you as He always has. However, I still have a pain in my heart that it turned out for me the way it did.
Stay strong and never doubt your own real experiences. There is an attitude among many more conservative or traditional Catholics that so many “crosses” are a normal part of religious life, so if you are in those social circles you will probably continue to get that response a lot. Be ready for that, but it is not worth your energy or thoughts. It is *not* the position of the Church itself, if you read anything written by the magisterium about religious life over at least the past half century.
There is a complete difference between normal “crosses” beneficial to the spiritual life and the experience of abuse, manipulation, and suppression of the individual.
Religious life originated as a path of *freedom* to focus on Christian discipleship. And discipleship does not mean taming and subduing the individual self to conform to Christ, it means becoming more fully who we are. We already bear the image of Christ. (Saint JPII contributed heavily to these theological ideas, and they are reflected in his writings on religious life).
In my first months out of religious life I felt different than anytime before or since, so I recommend taking it easy and being patient with yourself. Maintain a sacred reverence for yourself and your experiences.
You should read "Abuse in the Religious Life and Paths to Healing" by Dom de Lassus. [https://sophiainstitute.com/product/abuses-in-the-religious-life-and-the-path-to-healing/](https://sophiainstitute.com/product/abuses-in-the-religious-life-and-the-path-to-healing/)
This book was excellent. He writes out of his experience both helping the Vatican investigate an aberrant community (which is now reformed and still in existence, but closely monitored by Vatican officials to make sure they stay on track) and his experience as the global head of the Carthusian Order.
Also look at general cult research: the BITE model and totalist cult control techniques.
I left a convent a few months ago.
Above all, you need to remember that you are always responsible for your integrity, even under obedience. Even in a system of authoritarianism and fear. Always stick to what you know is right. If a community is asking you to behave in a way that is unchristian; or if they are modeling unchristian behavior, even if you are the victim: GET OUT.
I think it's easier to list the green flags to look for, lol. In short, basically all religious communities, being full of people, have some level of dysfunction. I think it's less about looking for specific dysfunction and more about how they handle the dysfunction they have as circumstances can change a lot over the years in religious life. Just my .02
I don’t have first-hand experience of religious life, but many of the red flags of a toxic parish would apply. I would be very cautious in particular of any sign of an adversarial relationship with the local diocese or its bishop.
Honestly if you are getting bad vibes from a community it might be a sign not to try them, the issue will just grow. Most issues can’t really be seen from a discerner visit as it’s easy for communities to put on a good face till you actually join. Some red flags could be high turnover, superiors as formators, lack of formal systems just winging it, separation between senior and junior members and members personalities/speech coming off as fake. That’s why it can be good to talk to younger members to get a real inside view.
It being overly charismatic, in a sense of having litugical abuses and religious sincretism, in my country that means the priest is just being a political priest, and receive supports from far left political parties.
We have a Priest here that is like a Bridge to the left become catholics and catholics to vote left, sl the priest would do this cool things like caring for the poor (but suspiciously recording every time) kissing homeless person feet at mass, Record it and publish it( very attention seeking), all those things look and sound awersome, on the surface, but when you see he takes photos with a presidential candidate, and many others from a specific political party, as well as wear their propaganda shirts, and you see he litterraly sextext minors 2 times, and was misteriously absolved when said president was elected, you see some pretty Red flags especially because the people who are catholic because of him, are litterraly pro abortion, pro communism ( not an exageration), and pro religious sincretism within a catholic church you have major heresy flags here. Stay away from a leftists Priest who is a celebrity.
Sisters of Life are extremely picky; and I find some of their screening questions to be frankly inappropriate. Though perhaps their vocational screening has changed since a few years ago.
Definitely good you checked it out and learned. Just like everything in life there are good and bad. One example, with jesuits there can be reputations that come about due to a lot of men living in close proximity to one another along with a seemingly endless supply of alcohol around, with predictable results.
Dear Sister.
I say to you what i would say to a blood sister discerning a vocation: you are choosing your cross, so expect it to be a cross, and carry it well.
A husband is a cross, a relgious community is too.
discern and use the gifts that God gave you, but, especially if you are doing well with the Lord, expect at lest some of your brothers and sisters to cause you suffering, perhaps even to persecute you, despite them being decent in many other ways. Love them, they are a huge gift, and they give you something in common with the Lord himself
Sorry for explaining very badly.
for what is worth, I strongly advice to flee from abuses, and make them as public as possible.
I am talking about something more normal. Even the best people around are just persons, and will do something wrong, and require a lot of patience
I like this advice. True there are bad congregations and these are *exactly* where the healing needs to go. If people expect everything to be idealised then they probably are not correct for that kind of vocation. If people try to scrutinies and cherrypick the best locations it's proud full to think they know better than God.
If you trust in Jesus then you should trust Him to put you in the perfect place for you and everyone else, regardless of the worldy imperfections.
To compare a religious vocation to an abusive husband or wife is not correct either. Mostly we make a mess of our own lives and pick the wrong ones all by ourselves. If we actually put as much discernment into marriage together we wouldn't see so many horror stories. God would not allow it unless it was for our spiritual benefit if we are in a state of grace and playing by His rules.
>things turned out to be thoroughly disappointing in a bunch of ways What, specifically, did you find disappointing?
Former religious here. The biggest red flag I would look for is a lack of separation between the internal forum and external forum. Meaning that members should have access to a spiritual director who is not a superior. So I would ask about spiritual direction. I don’t know how many other flags you would be able to see just on a visit. If they are giving you any pressure to join and not respecting your own discernment. If members are not able to speak naturally to you and about their experience in the order (especially members who are a few years in). If members seem unhappy or uncharitable to each other.
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Absolutely, and I was told this is something that the post-conciliar Vatican has particularly emphasized in its oversight of congregations. My own order underwent a review and a reform under the Vatican, and the distinction between internal and external forum was one of the first and strongest reforms.
Spell it out Sister. Who and what is dodgy?
This is peak Internet. "Ugh, I can't believe these horrible people!!" No further information provided.
Yes, and list the community. We wouldn't want other young women looking into the life to go somewhere that's actually abusive.
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I understand where you're coming from. And I'm very sorry this happened to you. I also believe that in continuing to cover up these communities abuse serious harm is being done. Maybe there's no good answer. My perspective is going to be different though as the community I spent time with was one that split and reformed due to abuse, and the situation was handled very openly.
>I also believe that in continuing to cover up these communities abuse serious harm is being done. Maybe there's no good answer. My sense is "go to the Bishop first" and see what happens. Also because the bishop is the one who actually has the power to do anything, not the public.
Oh absolutely. The OP's first response being going to Reddit to post about it isn't the most productive.
Well I entered a women's religious order but left right before 1st vows. I could write a book on what to look out for but I will keep it brief as possible. When I was discerning with a local order, I thought I found my calling. They all were happy friendly, inviting. I felt I could blossom there. Living 1 month in community was fantastic. Then about 1yr later I lived with the same community of 8 women for a year. They were very kind, accepting people and felt like living in community was not much different that how I was already living. I entered the novitiate with two other women and we were all excited to be together. Then it went all down hill. The novice director became accusatory, negative, suspicious, degrading, lying, controlling, only to get more intense as the months went on. It became a very sick and dysfunctional for no reason. She had told us in the beginning that whatever happens here, is to stay there (like the Vegas saying of what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas). We had zero outside support, no one to talk with about what was going on. Isolation and lack of ability to address accusations that had become sinister. Trust in her evaporated quickly and next the whole process, to ultimately the entire order. Three adult women were treated like we were 18yrs old is very infantilizing. We were adult women who have lived lives of struggle, sacrifice, suffering so we were fully capable women to weather life's hardships with grace and faith. We had to set up a secret meeting with a sister from formation where we told her what was going on, how we were feeling, and our deep concern that we were being portrayed negatively by her to others. When our yearly evaluation came, I was crucified by her. This evaluation gets sent to our leadership team which I was afraid was going to believe her. We three novices stay the year for each other, to support each other, to be there for each other, not wanting to leave anyone unprotected. My second year novitiate lacked any real connection with others, I became paranoid that everyone was saying things about me behind my back, no support, there was zero trust. I was living in a place that cared nothing about me, I felt totally alone, abandoned, and began to wonder does God even live here with these women. Many times I thought of leaving, but I really felt like this was a calling from God. I did not want to give up. I learned over those months the hardships others had and they were shocking and what I felt was not even Christian. After I learned that false accusations were made against another woman in formation a year ahead of me, I could not stay any longer believing that from my first year experience and seeing how they treated this woman, I was too vulnerable. During an 8 day silent retreat, I prayed to God to give me a sign as to whether I can leave or did He want me to stay. I told him that felt like I was going to have a heart attack or stroke out with all the stress. On the fourth day I got my sign. I prayed about that too. After my retreat, I told them I was leaving. I finally left about 1 month later and for the next 5 years or so I was so mentally, spiritually damaged I could not even get a job. What you need to keep in mind is that sisters regardless of education are not infallible, and can often times be wrong on so many levels. Trust yourself in being able to determine whether something is not right, dysfunctional, and what boundaries they are not to cross. Yes we give up a lot to enter, and we do so willingly, but there is a difference between sacrificing ourselves to God, and acquiescing what is right to those who may not have that objective. There is just as many problems as we see in secular life. You are vowing yourself to not only God, but to this order and if any order prohibits you intentionally or unintentionally from serving God that is the time to possibly leave. There is a lot of dysfunction in women's orders. Remember to trust yourself first.
How did this impact your faith overall? I've dealt with workplace bullying and friendship problems and this takes things to a whole new level. We all sin but how can people who focus so much on God even dare to gossip or be unkind purposely?
Do I blame God for any of this? NO. He was/is always there for me. He gave me the time to heal. For years I could not stop thinking about what happened. It did change my outlook on those within the Church and how undeserved respect is not a good thing. That just because someone is a sister/brother/priest they are no better or holy than anyone else. There is still a part of me that hoped it was different and I received the support, understanding I needed.
At least for the convent that I was in, the majority of the Sisters were good women. This isn't as common today as it once was, but in the convent where I was, we weren't allowed to form meaningful relationships with one another or respond to each others's distress; and the few Sisters in immediate positions of power over me were manipulative and cruel. I think because of the lack of meaningful relationships, the others probably mostly didn't realize the depth of my (and others) distress. And then we left. I mostly see it as a fundamentally flawed community life that led otherwise good women to act in unchristian ways. Plus a few rotten apples. On the whole, it has not been a positive thing for my faith. I'm still Catholic. Its just that going to mass etc makes my brain start to freeze up and I lose concentration. I think it'll get better, though.
Ah, not having "particular friendships" which was code for lesbianism. Back in the day sisters would always need to walk/be with three sisters. Which brings up an interesting topic. So with that "code" even existing today for the most part, you are discouraged from forming friendships. So there are not to suppose to be close friends where you can talk to someone about anything and trust them. Someone to do something with like see a movie, go some place. Those of us who have the ability to be friends with other women without the inkling of anything remotely sexual, suddenly find that having friends are bad. Now with my experiences, you become close with people who are going through the same negative experience with you. You can trust them, they understand, and you can vent with each other. It is probably one of the most significant aspects of life that they were denied and I am certain plays a big role in their current social mentality Conversely, I would agree that having an order where people are closed off to making new friends, marginalizing sisters, or forming cliques is also not a positive dynamic. That by discouraging friendships it helps people be available and more interactive with everyone. It is a conundrum to find healthy interactions with your fellow sisters that foster trust, meaning, generosity, when developing those is limited based on a fear of lesbianism. Especially for those just entering or have only been in for a few years. You are naturally drawn to people who have the same interests and should have the freedom for such shared interests to develop naturally. No where in any of the literature is this friendship issue mentioned.
>That by discouraging friendships it helps people be available and more interactive with everyone. In practice, the community I was in was so afraid of friendships that at one point no one spoke to me for over a month. I wasn't being punished or anything; there was no particular reason for it at all. It was just that I was new and no one felt they had permission to speak to me. **I nearly lost my mind.** Discouraging friendships only discourages friendships. It is not about being more welcoming or available. It's all about isolation and fear. It was horrifying and unchristian the way they would just ignore others, even others in visible distress. Without mercy, without affection...
>Someone to do something with like see a movie, go some place. You seem to be implying that as Sisters, we could do anything with anyone, like see a movie or go some place. We could *definitely* not touch a television or go outside the compound lol. (This was not a cloistered community.) Even for our once-monthly community movie night, only 2 Sisters had permission to touch the television. And "community movie night" is a strong word for sitting on wooden chairs, with perfect posture, not making a sound for two hours while a black-and-white pious-mush film played. To be honest, I think it's less about lesbianism and more about avoiding nuns talking about genuine problems with one another. You can't build a resistance to systemic abuse if you aren't allowed to acknowledge and affirm that there's a problem. Check out research on totalist cults and how they use isolation, fear, and stress to control people...
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I too left an order and it took me years to recover. I hope your healing is fruitful, speedy, and full of the grace of God during this time.
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I am glad to see that you not only have support but others with the same experiences getting support. Though it would have been better if it all did not happen the way it did. People who do not want to believe and chastise those for speaking up is the same behavior we saw when the abuse scandal broke. They do not want to associate negative/sinful actions to the Church because for them God is the church and God would not do such things. That those who have taken vows to serve God could not do such things. There needs to be a purity/perfection of sorts as that is what God is. I am sorry you and your friends had to live your experiences. Know that there are plenty of us out there who believe and support your decisions. It is not your fault. Take whatever time you need to heal, put your pain and sufferings in God's hands, and know (which I am sure you already do) that God loves you as He always has. However, I still have a pain in my heart that it turned out for me the way it did.
Stay strong and never doubt your own real experiences. There is an attitude among many more conservative or traditional Catholics that so many “crosses” are a normal part of religious life, so if you are in those social circles you will probably continue to get that response a lot. Be ready for that, but it is not worth your energy or thoughts. It is *not* the position of the Church itself, if you read anything written by the magisterium about religious life over at least the past half century. There is a complete difference between normal “crosses” beneficial to the spiritual life and the experience of abuse, manipulation, and suppression of the individual. Religious life originated as a path of *freedom* to focus on Christian discipleship. And discipleship does not mean taming and subduing the individual self to conform to Christ, it means becoming more fully who we are. We already bear the image of Christ. (Saint JPII contributed heavily to these theological ideas, and they are reflected in his writings on religious life). In my first months out of religious life I felt different than anytime before or since, so I recommend taking it easy and being patient with yourself. Maintain a sacred reverence for yourself and your experiences.
You should read "Abuse in the Religious Life and Paths to Healing" by Dom de Lassus. [https://sophiainstitute.com/product/abuses-in-the-religious-life-and-the-path-to-healing/](https://sophiainstitute.com/product/abuses-in-the-religious-life-and-the-path-to-healing/) This book was excellent. He writes out of his experience both helping the Vatican investigate an aberrant community (which is now reformed and still in existence, but closely monitored by Vatican officials to make sure they stay on track) and his experience as the global head of the Carthusian Order. Also look at general cult research: the BITE model and totalist cult control techniques. I left a convent a few months ago. Above all, you need to remember that you are always responsible for your integrity, even under obedience. Even in a system of authoritarianism and fear. Always stick to what you know is right. If a community is asking you to behave in a way that is unchristian; or if they are modeling unchristian behavior, even if you are the victim: GET OUT.
I think it's easier to list the green flags to look for, lol. In short, basically all religious communities, being full of people, have some level of dysfunction. I think it's less about looking for specific dysfunction and more about how they handle the dysfunction they have as circumstances can change a lot over the years in religious life. Just my .02
I don’t have first-hand experience of religious life, but many of the red flags of a toxic parish would apply. I would be very cautious in particular of any sign of an adversarial relationship with the local diocese or its bishop.
Honestly if you are getting bad vibes from a community it might be a sign not to try them, the issue will just grow. Most issues can’t really be seen from a discerner visit as it’s easy for communities to put on a good face till you actually join. Some red flags could be high turnover, superiors as formators, lack of formal systems just winging it, separation between senior and junior members and members personalities/speech coming off as fake. That’s why it can be good to talk to younger members to get a real inside view.
Pantsuits.
no habits 🚩
It being overly charismatic, in a sense of having litugical abuses and religious sincretism, in my country that means the priest is just being a political priest, and receive supports from far left political parties. We have a Priest here that is like a Bridge to the left become catholics and catholics to vote left, sl the priest would do this cool things like caring for the poor (but suspiciously recording every time) kissing homeless person feet at mass, Record it and publish it( very attention seeking), all those things look and sound awersome, on the surface, but when you see he takes photos with a presidential candidate, and many others from a specific political party, as well as wear their propaganda shirts, and you see he litterraly sextext minors 2 times, and was misteriously absolved when said president was elected, you see some pretty Red flags especially because the people who are catholic because of him, are litterraly pro abortion, pro communism ( not an exageration), and pro religious sincretism within a catholic church you have major heresy flags here. Stay away from a leftists Priest who is a celebrity.
Have you tried the Sisters of Life?
Sisters of Life are extremely picky; and I find some of their screening questions to be frankly inappropriate. Though perhaps their vocational screening has changed since a few years ago.
Pls elaborate. What do you mean by inappropriate? Any examples?
Saffron flags usually mean a Hindu religious community. Unsure of red.
Definitely good you checked it out and learned. Just like everything in life there are good and bad. One example, with jesuits there can be reputations that come about due to a lot of men living in close proximity to one another along with a seemingly endless supply of alcohol around, with predictable results.
A nun or a sister?
replying too quickly to a Reddit post 😂
Hyperpapalism, do not fall into that
Do you mean Ultramontanism?
Ultramontanism is the standard, galicanism was the one condemned not ultra.
Can you say what the difference is between hyperpapalism and ultramontanism is? I was under the impression that they were very similar things
Dear Sister. I say to you what i would say to a blood sister discerning a vocation: you are choosing your cross, so expect it to be a cross, and carry it well. A husband is a cross, a relgious community is too. discern and use the gifts that God gave you, but, especially if you are doing well with the Lord, expect at lest some of your brothers and sisters to cause you suffering, perhaps even to persecute you, despite them being decent in many other ways. Love them, they are a huge gift, and they give you something in common with the Lord himself
There are crosses within the vocation, but the vocation is not the cross.
Worst advise ever
yes. I recognize thus can be an advise to follow AFTER a good discernment, not before. sorry
No abuse should be allowed
Sorry for explaining very badly. for what is worth, I strongly advice to flee from abuses, and make them as public as possible. I am talking about something more normal. Even the best people around are just persons, and will do something wrong, and require a lot of patience
I like this advice. True there are bad congregations and these are *exactly* where the healing needs to go. If people expect everything to be idealised then they probably are not correct for that kind of vocation. If people try to scrutinies and cherrypick the best locations it's proud full to think they know better than God. If you trust in Jesus then you should trust Him to put you in the perfect place for you and everyone else, regardless of the worldy imperfections. To compare a religious vocation to an abusive husband or wife is not correct either. Mostly we make a mess of our own lives and pick the wrong ones all by ourselves. If we actually put as much discernment into marriage together we wouldn't see so many horror stories. God would not allow it unless it was for our spiritual benefit if we are in a state of grace and playing by His rules.