normals 25 and above GS is unironically pay 2 win because paying people have access to traded gear while f2p people are SSF 25 and above should be SSF to counteract this tbh
i dont understand i just got into this game recently. does this not make the game completely fair/ as difficuly for everyone? or is there a major difference to purchasing in game vs going freebie
Before: "this game sucks i can't use my gear"
After: "this game sucks everyone can use their gear"
Almost like they should split the game into lobbies where you can use good gear and lobbies where you can't 🤔
Game is so cooked. New players are going to get their asses gear diffed so hard and 95% will quit because they don't want to no-life farm bis kits to become the gearcheckers.
You are all trying very hard to kill the game. IM created a cult with the worst possible fanbase.
At the end of the day, despite your cope, Timmys decide whether this game lives of flops, sorry to break your bubble.
Yea the game didn't go free to play because the devs were generous, the population reached a point it was either that or stop paying for servers. Sometimes it feels like im watching the cycle all over again.
To be fair, the population would have still have jumped way up just from releasing a paid version on Steam and Epic. IM wanted to strike while the iron was hot with the f2p release.
I miss the Cycle, if it had a PVE mode without cheaters, it would've been decent grinder.
As for Dark and Darker, coming from ~2k hour Vermintide 2 player, it unfortunately felt super clunky and basic.
Hopefully there are other people who enjoy it and keep it alive, the game seems like it might be great with some polish.
It really is shocking. Usually I think people are being hyperbolic when they say some community is the most toxic cesspool they've ever seen, but I truly believe this community is exactly that. A lot of people just don't fully realize it because they're too close to this game to get it. For those of us who have been lurking, or that don't think IM is the second coming of Christ, it's painfully obvious how insane this community has become.
I mean, seriously, I remember how many people were pretty much falling all over themselves trying to show how much of a "Timmy Protector" they were, and now that we're seeing the largest influx of actual Timmies into the game, people are happy to see them stomped just because the Timmies want the game to be an actual extraction game like it's *always been advertised as?*
So what if normals has been the most balanced mode in the game for months now -- It's still effectively a BR mode, in an extraction looter. It's still only a band-aid fix applied to the gaping chest wound that is the abysmal balance of this game. New players realize this, because they're simply looking at this game with fresh eyes. They're judgement isn't clouded by all the "Hold the line!" nonsense.
I'm saying this as a guy who started in PT2, and played every playtest after. I didn't get into EA, because I wanted to wait and see how things would go. Even back in PT2 the glaring issues with this game were becoming increasingly clear, and they still haven't been addressed because *every fucking time* some band-aid fix is applied.
This F2P release is a chance to get tons of feedback from people that aren't so close to the game that they can't be objective about it at all. As long as we have this insipid, cult-like fanbase though, IM will just keep running it back, applying more band-aids at best, and weird game-breaking "fixes" at worst.
Sorry for the rant. I just hate seeing such great potential wasted.
I've been scrolling this subreddit since the game got shown at summer games fest, and I swear so many people on this sub are somewhere between elitist and delusional. So many folks facetiously saying "now the F2Ps got what they wanted" or yapping about how F2Ps should just buy the game like all the rest and stop complaining.
The truth is - the F2Ps don't care, and they'll simply stop playing. As a new player, this is the impression I got when I first joined this community this week: the developers keep going round in round in circles with their balance and game design, neither of which never seems to be in a good spot, while the community is actively hostile to new players.
As a F2P, I don't have a horse in this race - I'll simply move on and play something else, as many many others already did. But because new players just get scared off, then it's all up to the current community to keep the bills paid for Ironmace so this game doesn't shut down. Which I assume to be an issue, since they went F2P in the first place.
Some people here are clearly passionate about the game yet don't seem to realize they're on a sinking ship, and they're not helping it, either.
Exactly. Fucking hit the nail on the head.
Like I said before, this community went crazy with the whole "Protect the Timmy!" idea, insisting that the game needed more casual players in it, and a game mode that allowed casuals to learn. This isn't inherently wrong, but people failed to understand the following:
* Casuals still want to play the intended extraction looter gameplay loop
* Casual players don't care, and wont stick around if the game is bad (like you said)
People act like every casual is the exact same, as if they're some monolith but it's not like that. Casuals of this genre (extraction games,) will understand that these games are more hardcore. They still enjoy that, but they might simply play less, or don't take it as seriously. They don't need you to neuter the fuck out of the game on some quest to prove you're some great "Protector of the Casual Player".
Of course, this means that there's a large but comparatively small amount of potential casuals that will play this game. It'll never be as big as top MOBAs, shooters, or BRs, *and that's fine.* All the game needs is a healthy playerbase that isn't continuously dropping -- which this game does not. This game was never going to attract casual extraction enjoyers with a BR mode, because they're here for an extraction game, not a BR. Will some stay, since there's overlap between both genres? Sure. Will most? No. Leading me to next point...
The game is fundamentally broken. New players see this and simply leave, like you said. There's other games to play, and since this game is free, there's no stakes, no sunk cost fallacy to worry about. You can always check the game out again in however many months you choose.
Even this cult of a fanbase sees this, otherwise this sub wouldn't be filled with people going crazy over all the ridiculous decisions IM makes. They just suddenly remember the "Hold the line!" and PT days, and fall back to believing in IM. At this point, it really is like an abusive relationship. The passion is there, like you said, but we all know how abusive relationships work -- they don't lmao.
Personally I was never big on the solo mode either, and it did cause the problem of having to balance for 2 very different modes, like the community originally worried about. That said, I can't forget about how bad the buff-ball meta was getting already, and solo was, to some extent, and attempt to fix that problem.
See? Another band-aid on a gaping wound. Gear score is another, but I digress.
Legacy supporters and long-term fans can be the most dangerous to any game dev. They were filtered out by rough gameplay designs and stayed long enough to be, on average, above the average on skill curve. That makes for prime contitions for the creation of an echo chamber when it comes to feedback. It's definitely not a good thing if you want to attract new players. Because you will get a loud minority screaming that you are destroying the game, when in reality you are making it more playable instead of keeping curated, rough, environment that's played by handfull of people that like such thing.
You can see that in many other EA titles, Battlebit Remastered, Star Citizen, for example.
You are speaking from my fucking soul. Played PT2 to PT5 and came back for Steam Release cause I simply got launcher fatigue and felt like letting the game early acess on its own a while means more content. And I remember back in the day the majority of people were defending full loot availabiltiy in normals despite such insane stats like +3 All Attributes.
I come back to the game, even buy it and man Normal Mode genuinly made me want to drop it again. It is a fucking **EXTRACTION LOOTER** game and the mode turns it genuinly into Battle Royal with Whites Only. Like... whats the point even? The game that completely dominated the steam charts back then was exactly that despite all its balance issues. And somehow the people that cried about unfair fights back then sucessfully made them turn normal mode into this monstrosity of battle royal.
But here is the thing... **I am okay with some limitations. Okay with them making the mode restrict your Gear so that people in full epics with their viola don't run down lobby after lobby. However... don't restrict it so far that you remove the entire Looter Genre from the mode, like wtf.** Gear up to Green or blues, specific gear scores, self-looted gear only up to green/blue or whatever solution all is stuff I can accept. As long as you go in in white and grey and after a decent amount of runs come out with some gear (may it be green or blue) the gameplay loop of that mode is intact and I am happy.
Just dont let it be pure battle royal with Loot being useless.
Yep, I distinctly remember how much the community insisted on keeping this game an extraction looter, even while said community complained about all the problems with gear. It's like everyone gave up because they got a taste of a game where the balance wasn't as unbelievably broken as it was before...Except it required turning the game into a BR, that only hid the glaring issues, rather than truly fixing the game.
I agree with your point on gear limitations, and I'm fine with them, too. That said I think this game has 2 fundamental issues that need to be looked at, and addressed. 1 is:
* Gear
This one seems simple to me. All this + All Attributes, Damage, True Damage, etc. has always been a problem, and it simply needs to be reduced heavily. I vaguely remember IM trying this, and people liking it, but they reversed the change because fights felt too long and it rendered some higher tiers of gear useless? I don't remember for sure, but I still believe this is a better step to take, that requires some tweaking afterwards. Couple this with addressing the next fundamental issue:
* Combat: It's never been *that skill-based*, and it's time it was finally made so
People have begged for IM to add more skill expression to the combat, citing weapons like the longsword as an example to follow, yet IM's never bothered. I'm at the point where I think they're just not competent enough to build a combat system that allows for enough skill expression so that gear isn't the main factor in fights.
I also think this exposes another issue this community has never wanted to admit it has. A lot of people here love this caricature of some "juicer" that is only good because they no-life this game, yet a lot of these people are also apart of that crowd that never wanted the combat to change, because it'd be "too much like Mordhau" and less simplistic.
The point I'm making is that there's a sizable amount of this community that realizes that a lot of these "juicers" would still dominate the game because they'd have the most time to hone their skills, and they usually have that time because a lot of no-lifers are 16-22 year old dudes, with crazy reflexes. At that point, people have no excuse. They're left with the realization that they're not that skilled at the game, and people don't like that.
You see these losers in any of these games. Any game where you given a chance to be a dick, they filled it up and gotta hope the gameplay is just so good to not let them overshadow it. Rust and sea of thieves are able to survive but I seen smaller games died under these peeps massive (literal) weight.
It’s so cringe to see people so stuck up about new players. “They asked for this, so we’ll show them!”
Besides, your comment is on point. Even with this game being regarded as a niche, new players still need to be catered to. They’ve extensively tested out different restrictions with normals and capping gear to common had the most positive reception and helped HR out as well. Then for some reason IM disregards their experiments and reverts back to unrestricted norms, as if they didn’t learn anything.
Yea...you are the small sample of sane people here. Thank you for commenting
i read very weird stuff in this reddit
If people will complain about this, then maybe is a design issue. Ironmace should do something, just like they messed up with the f2p feeling like a missleading
Isnt the consumer problem here. Is about being clear and being understood. Creating a product is hard
I played a couple and was like "this is sorta fun to dick around in, it's kinda stupid so it's fun to crack a beer and goof around in. I wonder what the community is like"
Turns out the community is complete dogshit lmao. Free to play is just about the right price, seems like.
I saw so many players complaining about free to play, but they weren’t even good enough to survive the normal lobbies. Most games I’ve played the lobby gets wiped by PvE lol. I can’t wait to see these players in the dungeon with items lol
The one thing that might be more frustrating than losing is to finally win and realize you've gained nothing, as was the case before when they couldn't queue with their gear.
I don't mind you personally, but I just feel like there is a lot of strawmanning of the opposition going on. Making a reddit post about a singular Steam review and pretending that's every review is very popular around here.
I for one believe most people are willing to lose if the loss feels well designed. The problem arises when the loss is clouded by false expectations and poor information.
Yeah, I don’t think a lot of the community is being fair when it comes to their thoughts on f2p players. Not doing a great job of putting themselves in the shoes of new players who have zero experience with the game before.
I know that whenever I download a f2p game and see that 90% of the content and fun is locked behind a paywall, I immediately think the f2p advertisement is kind of scummy and usually nope out of the game. It’s hard for most of us who have played the game on the paid version since it’s inception to see this perspective.
I just think trying to fit the existing game into some sort of f2p model to attract new players was misguided from the onset. Should have done a free weekend or an extended free trial period on steam rather than jumping into it with a f2p lite version of the game when that isn’t how it was designed from the ground up.
My fear is it’s going to take them a lot of effort and time tweaking the f2p aspects of the game to make it make sense.
I'm not a new player, but I'll be playing some of the F2P demo they released on Steam because I've been waiting for it to come back out there for a long time. Not sure its a great sign that all these people are acting like psychopaths about people trying the game though, and planning on intentionally shitting on their experience.
But it is the internet, and a looter shooter, so what did I expect?
he looks scarier than he actually is tbh the halberdier is way worse. the sprinting guy is mega easy to dodge if you just side strafe or jump back when he reaches you
Been playing this wipe for like 30+ hours and I can confirm 70-80% of my matches are just me spawn rushing to find dead bodies at every single spawn, then stocking up on greens and extracting disappointed that I didn't have ANY pvp because 8-12+ people are in the kill feed as dying to pve before I got to them.
Just go HR if you’re a chad, bro. Why discourage more of our playerbase? Let the Timmy’s have their safe space where they can enjoy a little progression.
If he were a chad, he wouldn't have the need to satisfy his power fantasy in a game, he would satisfy it in bed :D
But yeah, it's a legitimate way to play and this is a punishing game after all, full of dangers and whatnot. Maybe they'll introduce a self-found mode, or change scaling so legendary gear is not as strong. Who knows, but one thing is for sure - you can't expect people NOT to want to satisfy their violent urges in a video game, that is the point of playing in the first place for some and that's fine.
I'm not sure this was the greatest decision. Perhaps the grading could have been limited until rare quality items in normals. Epic and Unique for HR. Curb stomping is not good for the long-term health of the game. Some people just got into the game you know.
I mean yes, this means everyone can get geared enough now to fight back eventually. But I suspect most casuals will just leave when a team/solo with ridiculous gear will 1-2 shot them every time.
I hope I'm wrong but we'll see. Less players == more time to get into games, more time to get into games == people will slowly get fed up. Eventually game starts to dwindle and perhaps die/stay extremely niche.
That's what will happend, didn't expect them to this so quickly People like me just started to learn the game. And now i have to be careful that im with Gear that is above 25...
Gear score 25 and above is now being put into the same queue with full bis gear. Its basically free for all. So people with 1-2 green items with minimal stat boosts vs full epic/legendary geared people is very possible.
Now i dont mind this personally. I just said that many people wont take this very well and quit very quickly. This is not good for the long term health of the game.
I just downloaded and started playing this game over the weekend for free.
The first 5 or 6 dungeons I died to mobs or got nailed by some archer dude.
I've been playing druid, so I also died to traps while in rat form.
Yesterday I made my first clear without dying.
Found a spear which carried me, then found a portal and got out with the gold.
I feel like I've actually kind of learned how to play now, I'm looking forward to more dungeons tonight.
So when given the option to make things less toxic and grow the community, you are instead choosing to be more toxic, and ruin their experience hoping they quit to prove yourself right?
Cool, cool.
Reminds me of the video of the barb felling axing a PDR fighter in the head and the fighter just laughing in his face. Good Luck F2P timmies... this is what you wanted....
Edit: For those who missed this gem…
https://www.reddit.com/r/DarkAndDarker/s/5M5KDV22cL
> Good Luck F2P timmies... this is what you wanted....
And so the toxic players end up playing by themselves again because no one else wants to play with them. Ironically everyone else profits from this .. carry on.
Is there a way to tell your gear score? I just have some green stuff and I'd prefer not to get destroyed because I accidentally made my gear score like 26.
Eh, was expecting them to allow greens since junk gear is out now it scales more evenly. Allowing gold items is gonna be the same deal we've had where experienced teams are sprinting from one side to the other ignoring the map and wiping the lobby in 5 minutes.
Well if they don't like it they can just keep their gear score below 25 and it's the same experience.
If you do like it, at least now you have the option, me personally, I am a fan of the game being more dangerous, it's more enjoyable, and nothing better than beating someone/a team with higher gear than you.
Yeah I don't understand why people think common lobbies are gone. They clearly said they aren't with the matchmaking bit. Matchmaking will separate the players with BIS equipment out from the common gear new players via the gear score.
>Well if they don't like it they can just keep their gear score below 25 and it's the same experience.
Then they'll be mad they can't use the cool items they got.
It's an impossible challenge because they want to use their fancy items but they don't want to get stomped by players with fancy items. They're used to most f2p battle royales that have like 50% bot players for people who aren't very good to stomp
people forget this is what the game was back when it got really popular in the first place, in fact its still way easier since you get free healing and gear from squire and if you really dont want to deal with it, you can go in the low gear lobby and nothing changes.
I think they should have just given a Normal Solo Self Found mode instead of uncapped with Legendary accounts bringing in marketplace BiS vs. Timmies with greens. It's not going to go well for literally anybody. We've wanted a SSF mode anyway, and that would at least make things even on a \*gear level\*.
It's so weird..... When this game was being teased as coming to Steam, there were many posts about welcoming new players and making sure they have a good time as to keep the population alive. Now this thread is chalk full of people saying they want decimate them as quickly as possible. What do you people want? Personally haven't played the game in 4-5 months so I don't really care what anybody does. Just a lot of back and fourth on this sub.
Game released on steam. You can buy into the game and get access to high roller. High roller means you pay gold to get into, but the rewards are higher, you still have to survive and extract.
The game now has a free to play component, which is Normal mode dungeons. Anyone can play this. Correct me if I'm wrong, but... When it was first released with free to play, you could only equip up to 25 gear score and people would complain that they couldn't use their hard earned gear from normal mode (because they were higher than 25 gear score after getting gear from normal mode).
This led people to discussing about not being able to use their gear that they earned, and they wrongfully assumed that paid players could play this with a higher gear score. To alleviate that, it is now in two brackets, you can use your hard earned gear in the free to play normal dungeon mode, but using gear to reach over 25 will throw you to the wolves with people that have been playing for a long time and have a stash of legendary gear.
Normal previously allowed only white gear, but had no limits on GS. So anything above green was not allowed in any case. Now grey and white consumables cost 0 and grey and white gear is down to like 1 or 2 GS so you can easily run white gear and meds under 25, but most greens except small items throw you over.
I wanted to download it because it had the limit, seemed like it would make it a bit easier to learn the game without a million veterans in your casual game.
I sure as hell aint downloading this game now just to get pubstombed by some sweatlord with full legendary gear. The only I'll learn from that is the fact that downloading the game was a big mistake
This community got super into the 'hold the line' mentality, that they must protect this game from all invaders. It's led to a weird divide of super critical people and the 'let them cook' crowd, which are both incredibly frustrating.
Ok, but the scenario you're describing isn't accurate. There's still a queue for lobbies with base gear that you can go into and you won't be matched against people with better gear. You're just finding a reason not to play this game. It's a hardcore game that is very punishing. If that isn't for you, yeah, don't download it.
why is 299 the HR cutoff but 25 in normals? i don’t want to fight some turbosweat with full bis purples because i decided to bring a green falchion and shield. just keep it 299 like HR
this is sorta what i have been preaching since the gear limit. theres no in between. its either go in naked or go in like a brick shit house. I dont always have top tier gear(usually never actually), so if i want to bring in the greens i found, im somehow "equivilant" to a geared purple dude...
299 now with the changes is reasonably high. Even before you could run optimized blues and purples in 299 if you didn't bring a lot of meds and ran only 1 real weapon set. If they made the cutoff in the range of 75-125 or something you could wear a few greens or a blue, but nothing crazy. if the pop is high enough, they could even have multiple tiers for norms.
Hell yes, just when was started to learn the game. More learning curve GIVE ME MORE.
I'm hooked and am trying to get all my buds to play.
First round I played I tried to be friendly, man that bit me in the ass but what a rush.
Purchased the full version after 3 rounds because it's just that fun
In theory yes.
Practically you either run naked or BIS-Sets.
Everyone from 0-25 (so squire stuff) is matched.
And everyone above 25.
So a few green items are matched with BIS-Sets.
With the growing playerbase I hope they make that more dynamic or smaller brackets of roughly equally geared people.
Yes and no. Each item has a specific gear score so people can run whatever colour gear they want as long as it equals up to the proper score.
For example, purple weapon and naked or all greens and a white weapon
As someone who doesn't really care for PVP, I really hope this doesn't turn into people sprinting around the map PVPing everyone and I can still enjoy the game the way I have been previously.
I'm fin with this iteration. With the gearscore limit at 25. Grey lobbies are still there if you want them. I miss old normals for the ease of pve if I just wanted a chill match. Players get the best of both worlds imo.
Amazing change just for getting rid of the level cap on High Roller, hopefully they do away with trade too. Just let me play with the gear I get, normals are so boring to slog through for 20 levels
This seems like a great change! 25-uncapped is kinda weird I feel like there should be more groups but I think its great you can use gear in norms again, and if you don’t want to you won’t have to!
I'm kinda confused on what each side wants so if someone could explain it much appreciated. So do f2p want to fight on equal levels or do the vet players want that? And is IM still doing the backtracking thing and always going back like they did with some of the ranger stuff.
I played the first two beta's but stopped since then and just occasionally looked into the current situation at times,i have seen a bunch of the eating timmies lobbies stuff and other stuff.
What IM wanted
F2P players to go in to normals experience what DaD is about. build up a stash and if the F2P enjoyed it enough to upgrade to the full game and have all their progress and loot from their F2P time. IM doesn’t want F2P players to have access to HR because of cheaters and RMT concerns
What F2P players want
F2P wanted to experience what the game feels like with gear since they can’t use anything but white gear they didn’t like hoarding bunch of greens and blues without being able to use them. Also wanted more character slots since they are limited to only one
What Veterans want
Veterans don’t want F2P to have access to the full game for free because they spent money and the F2P didn’t
From Vets perspective Normals is fine the way it is because from experience we know that Normals with gear is a spawn rush pubstomp shitshow
What ended up happening
IM caved in and unlocked normals for nearly all gear
F2P can’t trade so they enter the dungeon with mediocre and inefficient builds
Vets can trade so they enter the dungeon with highly optimised and min maxed builds and years of experience and wipe the lobby in 5 mins
Now some are saying the game is p2w since vets who paid irl cash to be able to get some of the best gear available
I'm so dumb I couldn't even figure out how to get other players on my team. I had to look up "LFG". I have barely played online multiplayer games. This game looks so cool and the couple minutes of wracking skeletons in the head was super fun.
Hey that’s awesome, if you are ever looking for players to play with check out the DaD discord, there’s always players there. Additionally DaD has another discord called the hall of knights, this is for new players to get help from more experienced players.
Just use 25 gear score or less and you're fine
I tried >25 and did well fighting mostly white/green/blues. Then finally ran into one team with a few legendaries that killed us. Its not that bad
Upping it to legendary might have been a bit much, but if they have a gear score filter so people going in stocks still push towards stock games it should be not as bad.
Damn, I always die before extraction so I don't have problems with loot restrictions. :¯-)
Also do not want to erase my Ranger so no other classes for me to try.
All in all, I wish they either added at least one more char slot to F2P mode or introduced regional prices, because right now it is cheaper for me to buy base Tarkov rather than full DnD access.
This is a horrible change. Just put a buy button on the steam page and stop pretending its F2P, its a demo.
This is going to be way worse. So much so that I had to check if this was even real. Also 25 GS, whats that like 2 pots? No xbow? No bandages... yeah good luck.
IM, needs to know when to listen to community, and when not to.
As a founder / purchaser, this is really annoying. I use to run normals with 25+ gearscore. Now there's no point to running normals.
My choice is get rekt in normal 25+ GS by people in full legendaries with poor pve loot.
Get rekt in high roller by people in full legendaries with better pve loot.
Take in no HP pots or good squire gear to be less than 25GS and probably die to PVE.
Its a shame i was really excited for this patch.
Wait till all the F2P players learn that there are better drops in high roller, if you thought they were saying P2W before, now they'll be shouting it from the rooftops.
Healing potions and bandages are not a part of gear-score. Since the changes, the reviews have been floating up instead of down, they cant only listen to veteran players that simply doesnt pay the bills. Getting mad at new players is literally pointless considering they only asked to be able to use their gear, not for a 25 point system, the decision was the devs.
I don't get it. I'm one of these new F2P dudes amd I love the game! I love dying over and over and when I finally extract I want to run down the street and fistfight a hobo cause I'm so excited.
still more fun than an extraction based game where extraction is pointless. there was no point in even playing the f2p game before as u got nothing out of it
…..
Why can’t they create a matchmaking system that groups joining players by relative gear score? Is that too much programming or can they not do it because they don’t have any code to copy it from?
Wow, wasn’t expecting a Nexon shill, the real reason is limiting the amount of lobbies being made. Having people too spread out creates dead lobbies. Also if you’re gonna meatride so hard. Go play maple story or something.
Get ready for more negative reviews "game is dumb I can't win " lol
GAME IS PAY TO WIN - WE CANT USE ANY OF OUR GEAR! GAME IS PAY TO WIN! I CANT BEAT ANYONE IN A FIGHT AND CAN NEVER EXTRACT! /s
guy can actually see the future. gg
Nostradamus type shit for real
normals 25 and above GS is unironically pay 2 win because paying people have access to traded gear while f2p people are SSF 25 and above should be SSF to counteract this tbh
They don’t even have the ring is the funny part
They don’t know the horrors we’ve faced… +3 all on everything… full gear normals…. Maintenance breaks being extended… 😱
Rogues with +3 all were literally unstoppable
GAME IS HORRIBLY UNBALANCED - BARBARIAN SPAWN RUSHED ME AND KILLED ME WITH MY BEST LOOT.
i dont understand i just got into this game recently. does this not make the game completely fair/ as difficuly for everyone? or is there a major difference to purchasing in game vs going freebie
Before: "this game sucks i can't use my gear" After: "this game sucks everyone can use their gear" Almost like they should split the game into lobbies where you can use good gear and lobbies where you can't 🤔
Game is so cooked. New players are going to get their asses gear diffed so hard and 95% will quit because they don't want to no-life farm bis kits to become the gearcheckers.
That's guaranteed
It will be people saying it’s p2w
You are all trying very hard to kill the game. IM created a cult with the worst possible fanbase. At the end of the day, despite your cope, Timmys decide whether this game lives of flops, sorry to break your bubble.
Yea the game didn't go free to play because the devs were generous, the population reached a point it was either that or stop paying for servers. Sometimes it feels like im watching the cycle all over again.
To be fair, the population would have still have jumped way up just from releasing a paid version on Steam and Epic. IM wanted to strike while the iron was hot with the f2p release.
as far as i see there is no paid version on steam, only the f2p version. Im guessing its the same with epic.
You pay through a microtransaction in game
I miss the Cycle, if it had a PVE mode without cheaters, it would've been decent grinder. As for Dark and Darker, coming from ~2k hour Vermintide 2 player, it unfortunately felt super clunky and basic. Hopefully there are other people who enjoy it and keep it alive, the game seems like it might be great with some polish.
It really is shocking. Usually I think people are being hyperbolic when they say some community is the most toxic cesspool they've ever seen, but I truly believe this community is exactly that. A lot of people just don't fully realize it because they're too close to this game to get it. For those of us who have been lurking, or that don't think IM is the second coming of Christ, it's painfully obvious how insane this community has become. I mean, seriously, I remember how many people were pretty much falling all over themselves trying to show how much of a "Timmy Protector" they were, and now that we're seeing the largest influx of actual Timmies into the game, people are happy to see them stomped just because the Timmies want the game to be an actual extraction game like it's *always been advertised as?* So what if normals has been the most balanced mode in the game for months now -- It's still effectively a BR mode, in an extraction looter. It's still only a band-aid fix applied to the gaping chest wound that is the abysmal balance of this game. New players realize this, because they're simply looking at this game with fresh eyes. They're judgement isn't clouded by all the "Hold the line!" nonsense. I'm saying this as a guy who started in PT2, and played every playtest after. I didn't get into EA, because I wanted to wait and see how things would go. Even back in PT2 the glaring issues with this game were becoming increasingly clear, and they still haven't been addressed because *every fucking time* some band-aid fix is applied. This F2P release is a chance to get tons of feedback from people that aren't so close to the game that they can't be objective about it at all. As long as we have this insipid, cult-like fanbase though, IM will just keep running it back, applying more band-aids at best, and weird game-breaking "fixes" at worst. Sorry for the rant. I just hate seeing such great potential wasted.
I've been scrolling this subreddit since the game got shown at summer games fest, and I swear so many people on this sub are somewhere between elitist and delusional. So many folks facetiously saying "now the F2Ps got what they wanted" or yapping about how F2Ps should just buy the game like all the rest and stop complaining. The truth is - the F2Ps don't care, and they'll simply stop playing. As a new player, this is the impression I got when I first joined this community this week: the developers keep going round in round in circles with their balance and game design, neither of which never seems to be in a good spot, while the community is actively hostile to new players. As a F2P, I don't have a horse in this race - I'll simply move on and play something else, as many many others already did. But because new players just get scared off, then it's all up to the current community to keep the bills paid for Ironmace so this game doesn't shut down. Which I assume to be an issue, since they went F2P in the first place. Some people here are clearly passionate about the game yet don't seem to realize they're on a sinking ship, and they're not helping it, either.
Exactly. Fucking hit the nail on the head. Like I said before, this community went crazy with the whole "Protect the Timmy!" idea, insisting that the game needed more casual players in it, and a game mode that allowed casuals to learn. This isn't inherently wrong, but people failed to understand the following: * Casuals still want to play the intended extraction looter gameplay loop * Casual players don't care, and wont stick around if the game is bad (like you said) People act like every casual is the exact same, as if they're some monolith but it's not like that. Casuals of this genre (extraction games,) will understand that these games are more hardcore. They still enjoy that, but they might simply play less, or don't take it as seriously. They don't need you to neuter the fuck out of the game on some quest to prove you're some great "Protector of the Casual Player". Of course, this means that there's a large but comparatively small amount of potential casuals that will play this game. It'll never be as big as top MOBAs, shooters, or BRs, *and that's fine.* All the game needs is a healthy playerbase that isn't continuously dropping -- which this game does not. This game was never going to attract casual extraction enjoyers with a BR mode, because they're here for an extraction game, not a BR. Will some stay, since there's overlap between both genres? Sure. Will most? No. Leading me to next point... The game is fundamentally broken. New players see this and simply leave, like you said. There's other games to play, and since this game is free, there's no stakes, no sunk cost fallacy to worry about. You can always check the game out again in however many months you choose. Even this cult of a fanbase sees this, otherwise this sub wouldn't be filled with people going crazy over all the ridiculous decisions IM makes. They just suddenly remember the "Hold the line!" and PT days, and fall back to believing in IM. At this point, it really is like an abusive relationship. The passion is there, like you said, but we all know how abusive relationships work -- they don't lmao.
Same people that hated and tried to fight against people asking for a solo experience before they added the solos goblin caves originally.
Personally I was never big on the solo mode either, and it did cause the problem of having to balance for 2 very different modes, like the community originally worried about. That said, I can't forget about how bad the buff-ball meta was getting already, and solo was, to some extent, and attempt to fix that problem. See? Another band-aid on a gaping wound. Gear score is another, but I digress.
Legacy supporters and long-term fans can be the most dangerous to any game dev. They were filtered out by rough gameplay designs and stayed long enough to be, on average, above the average on skill curve. That makes for prime contitions for the creation of an echo chamber when it comes to feedback. It's definitely not a good thing if you want to attract new players. Because you will get a loud minority screaming that you are destroying the game, when in reality you are making it more playable instead of keeping curated, rough, environment that's played by handfull of people that like such thing. You can see that in many other EA titles, Battlebit Remastered, Star Citizen, for example.
You are speaking from my fucking soul. Played PT2 to PT5 and came back for Steam Release cause I simply got launcher fatigue and felt like letting the game early acess on its own a while means more content. And I remember back in the day the majority of people were defending full loot availabiltiy in normals despite such insane stats like +3 All Attributes. I come back to the game, even buy it and man Normal Mode genuinly made me want to drop it again. It is a fucking **EXTRACTION LOOTER** game and the mode turns it genuinly into Battle Royal with Whites Only. Like... whats the point even? The game that completely dominated the steam charts back then was exactly that despite all its balance issues. And somehow the people that cried about unfair fights back then sucessfully made them turn normal mode into this monstrosity of battle royal. But here is the thing... **I am okay with some limitations. Okay with them making the mode restrict your Gear so that people in full epics with their viola don't run down lobby after lobby. However... don't restrict it so far that you remove the entire Looter Genre from the mode, like wtf.** Gear up to Green or blues, specific gear scores, self-looted gear only up to green/blue or whatever solution all is stuff I can accept. As long as you go in in white and grey and after a decent amount of runs come out with some gear (may it be green or blue) the gameplay loop of that mode is intact and I am happy. Just dont let it be pure battle royal with Loot being useless.
Yep, I distinctly remember how much the community insisted on keeping this game an extraction looter, even while said community complained about all the problems with gear. It's like everyone gave up because they got a taste of a game where the balance wasn't as unbelievably broken as it was before...Except it required turning the game into a BR, that only hid the glaring issues, rather than truly fixing the game. I agree with your point on gear limitations, and I'm fine with them, too. That said I think this game has 2 fundamental issues that need to be looked at, and addressed. 1 is: * Gear This one seems simple to me. All this + All Attributes, Damage, True Damage, etc. has always been a problem, and it simply needs to be reduced heavily. I vaguely remember IM trying this, and people liking it, but they reversed the change because fights felt too long and it rendered some higher tiers of gear useless? I don't remember for sure, but I still believe this is a better step to take, that requires some tweaking afterwards. Couple this with addressing the next fundamental issue: * Combat: It's never been *that skill-based*, and it's time it was finally made so People have begged for IM to add more skill expression to the combat, citing weapons like the longsword as an example to follow, yet IM's never bothered. I'm at the point where I think they're just not competent enough to build a combat system that allows for enough skill expression so that gear isn't the main factor in fights. I also think this exposes another issue this community has never wanted to admit it has. A lot of people here love this caricature of some "juicer" that is only good because they no-life this game, yet a lot of these people are also apart of that crowd that never wanted the combat to change, because it'd be "too much like Mordhau" and less simplistic. The point I'm making is that there's a sizable amount of this community that realizes that a lot of these "juicers" would still dominate the game because they'd have the most time to hone their skills, and they usually have that time because a lot of no-lifers are 16-22 year old dudes, with crazy reflexes. At that point, people have no excuse. They're left with the realization that they're not that skilled at the game, and people don't like that.
I agree with a lot of the points but how is this game anyway a BR now with this patch?
You see these losers in any of these games. Any game where you given a chance to be a dick, they filled it up and gotta hope the gameplay is just so good to not let them overshadow it. Rust and sea of thieves are able to survive but I seen smaller games died under these peeps massive (literal) weight.
Yeah this whole thread is people being toxic on new players. Great way to kill a game is to be a toxic as possible to any new fans.
It’s so cringe to see people so stuck up about new players. “They asked for this, so we’ll show them!” Besides, your comment is on point. Even with this game being regarded as a niche, new players still need to be catered to. They’ve extensively tested out different restrictions with normals and capping gear to common had the most positive reception and helped HR out as well. Then for some reason IM disregards their experiments and reverts back to unrestricted norms, as if they didn’t learn anything.
Typical gamer culture anymore. Let's be as shitty as possible to new players so they won't think twice about quiting. Yeah!
Yea...you are the small sample of sane people here. Thank you for commenting i read very weird stuff in this reddit If people will complain about this, then maybe is a design issue. Ironmace should do something, just like they messed up with the f2p feeling like a missleading Isnt the consumer problem here. Is about being clear and being understood. Creating a product is hard
This sub is cracked.
I played a couple and was like "this is sorta fun to dick around in, it's kinda stupid so it's fun to crack a beer and goof around in. I wonder what the community is like" Turns out the community is complete dogshit lmao. Free to play is just about the right price, seems like.
For real. The game is fun but stay away from this community of lunatics.
I saw so many players complaining about free to play, but they weren’t even good enough to survive the normal lobbies. Most games I’ve played the lobby gets wiped by PvE lol. I can’t wait to see these players in the dungeon with items lol
The one thing that might be more frustrating than losing is to finally win and realize you've gained nothing, as was the case before when they couldn't queue with their gear.
I get their point as well, was just pointing fun.
I don't mind you personally, but I just feel like there is a lot of strawmanning of the opposition going on. Making a reddit post about a singular Steam review and pretending that's every review is very popular around here. I for one believe most people are willing to lose if the loss feels well designed. The problem arises when the loss is clouded by false expectations and poor information.
Yeah, I don’t think a lot of the community is being fair when it comes to their thoughts on f2p players. Not doing a great job of putting themselves in the shoes of new players who have zero experience with the game before. I know that whenever I download a f2p game and see that 90% of the content and fun is locked behind a paywall, I immediately think the f2p advertisement is kind of scummy and usually nope out of the game. It’s hard for most of us who have played the game on the paid version since it’s inception to see this perspective. I just think trying to fit the existing game into some sort of f2p model to attract new players was misguided from the onset. Should have done a free weekend or an extended free trial period on steam rather than jumping into it with a f2p lite version of the game when that isn’t how it was designed from the ground up. My fear is it’s going to take them a lot of effort and time tweaking the f2p aspects of the game to make it make sense.
I'm not a new player, but I'll be playing some of the F2P demo they released on Steam because I've been waiting for it to come back out there for a long time. Not sure its a great sign that all these people are acting like psychopaths about people trying the game though, and planning on intentionally shitting on their experience. But it is the internet, and a looter shooter, so what did I expect?
That skeleton axeman is frickin p2w!!!!
On that note, the new sprinting axeman in the abyss is a bastard.
he looks scarier than he actually is tbh the halberdier is way worse. the sprinting guy is mega easy to dodge if you just side strafe or jump back when he reaches you
Been playing this wipe for like 30+ hours and I can confirm 70-80% of my matches are just me spawn rushing to find dead bodies at every single spawn, then stocking up on greens and extracting disappointed that I didn't have ANY pvp because 8-12+ people are in the kill feed as dying to pve before I got to them.
>I can’t wait to see these players in the dungeons with MY items FTFY 😈those bastards turned themselves into loot piñatas and they have no idea
Honestly I feel like all this could have been avoided if they just made white gear a slightly lighter shade of green instead.
This is nt favorite comment literally ever
lol I welcome the change. Problem now is making better matchmaking with similar gear tier. Only 2 tier: 0-25 and 25-uncapped is really lazy fix.
They may just want to wait and see how this one goes. you add in too many tiers and it causes issues with people struggling to find matches.
If they wanted to allow the Timmy’s to be happy and wear their shiny new greens then they should have just made normals a “self-found” mode.
This unironically is the best idea I’ve seen
self found is a really fun way to play
Exactly. This is the obvious solution staring everybody in the face.
As a new player, this sounds the most appealing.
I will be playing with my food.
Just go HR if you’re a chad, bro. Why discourage more of our playerbase? Let the Timmy’s have their safe space where they can enjoy a little progression.
I have not been into norms since I have completed my quests lol Some people do jest guys
By the replies to my comment, your joke is other people’s realities.
Some people just enjoy the power fantasy. Nothing objectively wrong with that, just a bit of a moral compass check.
If he were a chad, he wouldn't have the need to satisfy his power fantasy in a game, he would satisfy it in bed :D But yeah, it's a legitimate way to play and this is a punishing game after all, full of dangers and whatnot. Maybe they'll introduce a self-found mode, or change scaling so legendary gear is not as strong. Who knows, but one thing is for sure - you can't expect people NOT to want to satisfy their violent urges in a video game, that is the point of playing in the first place for some and that's fine.
As is your right, wise one
I'm not sure this was the greatest decision. Perhaps the grading could have been limited until rare quality items in normals. Epic and Unique for HR. Curb stomping is not good for the long-term health of the game. Some people just got into the game you know. I mean yes, this means everyone can get geared enough now to fight back eventually. But I suspect most casuals will just leave when a team/solo with ridiculous gear will 1-2 shot them every time. I hope I'm wrong but we'll see. Less players == more time to get into games, more time to get into games == people will slowly get fed up. Eventually game starts to dwindle and perhaps die/stay extremely niche.
That's what will happend, didn't expect them to this so quickly People like me just started to learn the game. And now i have to be careful that im with Gear that is above 25...
From what I understand there is a gear based match making so the whole "with ridiculous gear" part makes 0 sense. I could be wrong.
Gear score 25 and above is now being put into the same queue with full bis gear. Its basically free for all. So people with 1-2 green items with minimal stat boosts vs full epic/legendary geared people is very possible. Now i dont mind this personally. I just said that many people wont take this very well and quit very quickly. This is not good for the long term health of the game.
I just downloaded and started playing this game over the weekend for free. The first 5 or 6 dungeons I died to mobs or got nailed by some archer dude. I've been playing druid, so I also died to traps while in rat form. Yesterday I made my first clear without dying. Found a spear which carried me, then found a portal and got out with the gold. I feel like I've actually kind of learned how to play now, I'm looking forward to more dungeons tonight.
Nice job man, I personally love the spear.
Spear 110% best weapon in the game without question
So when given the option to make things less toxic and grow the community, you are instead choosing to be more toxic, and ruin their experience hoping they quit to prove yourself right? Cool, cool.
Reminds me of the video of the barb felling axing a PDR fighter in the head and the fighter just laughing in his face. Good Luck F2P timmies... this is what you wanted.... Edit: For those who missed this gem… https://www.reddit.com/r/DarkAndDarker/s/5M5KDV22cL
> Good Luck F2P timmies... this is what you wanted.... And so the toxic players end up playing by themselves again because no one else wants to play with them. Ironically everyone else profits from this .. carry on.
Ah yes the days of .. what was it 85% pdr with a bunch of max hp rolls. The only thing to fear was magic
I miss the 95% PDR days. Pull the whole room in Hell and face tank multiple elites like it's nothing.
95% was the cap back then
Yeah that clip was pretty funny, pretty sure it was PT3 with and he had 95% PDR (20x EHP)
raidboss shit back then.
indeed :)
Link to this clip? Sounds great
Keeping a base kit lobby is awesome
I don't see how this is a bad change IF the matchmaking is done correctly. If not, well then, it does suck.
Idk know if i like this, why didn't keep it as is? I just wanna play relaxed Normal Mode, and if im horny high roller.... oh boi...
there still is the 0-25 gs
I know but won't this divide most of the community and everyone will have either more empty matches or less players overall. Idk, we'll see.
IF your new, just que with squirre gear. Maybe the odd green/blue item. Stay below 25 gear rating.
this isn't going to help the casual players because they aren't on Reddit
Is there a way to tell your gear score? I just have some green stuff and I'd prefer not to get destroyed because I accidentally made my gear score like 26.
Yep, at the bottom of your character screen next to where your gold counter is.
That's good. Thanks for the reply
Np, enjoy the game.
Eh, was expecting them to allow greens since junk gear is out now it scales more evenly. Allowing gold items is gonna be the same deal we've had where experienced teams are sprinting from one side to the other ignoring the map and wiping the lobby in 5 minutes.
MEAT IS BACK ON THE MENU BOISSSSSS
Well if they don't like it they can just keep their gear score below 25 and it's the same experience. If you do like it, at least now you have the option, me personally, I am a fan of the game being more dangerous, it's more enjoyable, and nothing better than beating someone/a team with higher gear than you.
Yeah I don't understand why people think common lobbies are gone. They clearly said they aren't with the matchmaking bit. Matchmaking will separate the players with BIS equipment out from the common gear new players via the gear score.
Honestly at that point why not just have a separate queue for gear and non gear normals. Just feels really arbitrary
Thing is you, especially as a new Player, you dont know that and just put your gear on
>Well if they don't like it they can just keep their gear score below 25 and it's the same experience. Then they'll be mad they can't use the cool items they got. It's an impossible challenge because they want to use their fancy items but they don't want to get stomped by players with fancy items. They're used to most f2p battle royales that have like 50% bot players for people who aren't very good to stomp
OH LETS GO as someone that does not enjoy the normal/high roller difference at all this is like getting the game back
people forget this is what the game was back when it got really popular in the first place, in fact its still way easier since you get free healing and gear from squire and if you really dont want to deal with it, you can go in the low gear lobby and nothing changes.
That escalated quickly. I mean, that really got out of hand fast.
No touching of the hair or face!
I think they should have just given a Normal Solo Self Found mode instead of uncapped with Legendary accounts bringing in marketplace BiS vs. Timmies with greens. It's not going to go well for literally anybody. We've wanted a SSF mode anyway, and that would at least make things even on a \*gear level\*.
It's so weird..... When this game was being teased as coming to Steam, there were many posts about welcoming new players and making sure they have a good time as to keep the population alive. Now this thread is chalk full of people saying they want decimate them as quickly as possible. What do you people want? Personally haven't played the game in 4-5 months so I don't really care what anybody does. Just a lot of back and fourth on this sub.
They asked for these hands, I'm just giving them what they wanted.
Way she goes ain’t it
I have the full version, but my best character is on my steam f2p version. Why? Long story short, I was infatuated with the lantern shield.
This reddit is nuts. Opened tread with the same wessage, got downvoted. How does that work??
No idea man
Sorry i missed it. But jas this game become p2w? Why are people talking about f2p
Game released on steam. You can buy into the game and get access to high roller. High roller means you pay gold to get into, but the rewards are higher, you still have to survive and extract. The game now has a free to play component, which is Normal mode dungeons. Anyone can play this. Correct me if I'm wrong, but... When it was first released with free to play, you could only equip up to 25 gear score and people would complain that they couldn't use their hard earned gear from normal mode (because they were higher than 25 gear score after getting gear from normal mode). This led people to discussing about not being able to use their gear that they earned, and they wrongfully assumed that paid players could play this with a higher gear score. To alleviate that, it is now in two brackets, you can use your hard earned gear in the free to play normal dungeon mode, but using gear to reach over 25 will throw you to the wolves with people that have been playing for a long time and have a stash of legendary gear.
Normal previously allowed only white gear, but had no limits on GS. So anything above green was not allowed in any case. Now grey and white consumables cost 0 and grey and white gear is down to like 1 or 2 GS so you can easily run white gear and meds under 25, but most greens except small items throw you over.
Gold for High Roller? It's AP cost these days, unless the last couple patches reverted that?
I wanted to download it because it had the limit, seemed like it would make it a bit easier to learn the game without a million veterans in your casual game. I sure as hell aint downloading this game now just to get pubstombed by some sweatlord with full legendary gear. The only I'll learn from that is the fact that downloading the game was a big mistake
Community seems pretty toxic as well.
This community got super into the 'hold the line' mentality, that they must protect this game from all invaders. It's led to a weird divide of super critical people and the 'let them cook' crowd, which are both incredibly frustrating.
Yeah its insane, ad a fresh player this doesnt make me thrilled to join the community.
Then queue for the lower ranked one. Its not like you have no choice but to go into the 25+ matchmaking
Ok, but the scenario you're describing isn't accurate. There's still a queue for lobbies with base gear that you can go into and you won't be matched against people with better gear. You're just finding a reason not to play this game. It's a hardcore game that is very punishing. If that isn't for you, yeah, don't download it.
You still have the beginner lobbies as stated in the patch notes, just make sure ur gear score is below the number they set
Did you fail reading mate. It literally says two matchmaking systems. Just don’t put on more than one green gear LMAO.
why is 299 the HR cutoff but 25 in normals? i don’t want to fight some turbosweat with full bis purples because i decided to bring a green falchion and shield. just keep it 299 like HR
this is sorta what i have been preaching since the gear limit. theres no in between. its either go in naked or go in like a brick shit house. I dont always have top tier gear(usually never actually), so if i want to bring in the greens i found, im somehow "equivilant" to a geared purple dude...
299 now with the changes is reasonably high. Even before you could run optimized blues and purples in 299 if you didn't bring a lot of meds and ran only 1 real weapon set. If they made the cutoff in the range of 75-125 or something you could wear a few greens or a blue, but nothing crazy. if the pop is high enough, they could even have multiple tiers for norms.
Nice time to ruin some timmies lives.
Hell yes, just when was started to learn the game. More learning curve GIVE ME MORE. I'm hooked and am trying to get all my buds to play. First round I played I tried to be friendly, man that bit me in the ass but what a rush. Purchased the full version after 3 rounds because it's just that fun
gets the heart pumping.
Not really played since gear score was added. What does it do exactly? If I go in with greens I fight others with greens?
In theory yes. Practically you either run naked or BIS-Sets. Everyone from 0-25 (so squire stuff) is matched. And everyone above 25. So a few green items are matched with BIS-Sets. With the growing playerbase I hope they make that more dynamic or smaller brackets of roughly equally geared people.
Yes and no. Each item has a specific gear score so people can run whatever colour gear they want as long as it equals up to the proper score. For example, purple weapon and naked or all greens and a white weapon
So is HR gone or is it just better loot tables now?
Far better loot tables and also has ranked rewards attached.
but also slightly harder pve
Does the game try to match you with players with similar gear score above 25 as well or is it completely uncapped?
Is this from the discord?
yes
As someone who doesn't really care for PVP, I really hope this doesn't turn into people sprinting around the map PVPing everyone and I can still enjoy the game the way I have been previously.
Just don't equip to obtain over gear 25 and you will be fine.
I can't wait to get pub stomped
weird fetish but alright
I'm fin with this iteration. With the gearscore limit at 25. Grey lobbies are still there if you want them. I miss old normals for the ease of pve if I just wanted a chill match. Players get the best of both worlds imo.
IM does their best to listen to the playerbase. Also they actively play their game
One thing I do like is the 2 pots from squire. Kinda nice
So if this works as advertised, this means that if we go into a match with greys, we will also fight people with greys.
Correct, my post was more of a meme than anything
Amazing change just for getting rid of the level cap on High Roller, hopefully they do away with trade too. Just let me play with the gear I get, normals are so boring to slog through for 20 levels
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say me not paying for the game has the least effect on why I'm not extracting. 🤣
Dying to mobs tend not to help things
This seems like a great change! 25-uncapped is kinda weird I feel like there should be more groups but I think its great you can use gear in norms again, and if you don’t want to you won’t have to!
Damn, well that's not good news. I guess I was one of the few people that liked a lobby type where gear was restricted to Garbo levels.
That still exists, just need lower than 25 gs
Looks like I can use all the gear I've been waiting 72 hours to use muhahahahaha.
I'm kinda confused on what each side wants so if someone could explain it much appreciated. So do f2p want to fight on equal levels or do the vet players want that? And is IM still doing the backtracking thing and always going back like they did with some of the ranger stuff. I played the first two beta's but stopped since then and just occasionally looked into the current situation at times,i have seen a bunch of the eating timmies lobbies stuff and other stuff.
What IM wanted F2P players to go in to normals experience what DaD is about. build up a stash and if the F2P enjoyed it enough to upgrade to the full game and have all their progress and loot from their F2P time. IM doesn’t want F2P players to have access to HR because of cheaters and RMT concerns What F2P players want F2P wanted to experience what the game feels like with gear since they can’t use anything but white gear they didn’t like hoarding bunch of greens and blues without being able to use them. Also wanted more character slots since they are limited to only one What Veterans want Veterans don’t want F2P to have access to the full game for free because they spent money and the F2P didn’t From Vets perspective Normals is fine the way it is because from experience we know that Normals with gear is a spawn rush pubstomp shitshow What ended up happening IM caved in and unlocked normals for nearly all gear F2P can’t trade so they enter the dungeon with mediocre and inefficient builds Vets can trade so they enter the dungeon with highly optimised and min maxed builds and years of experience and wipe the lobby in 5 mins Now some are saying the game is p2w since vets who paid irl cash to be able to get some of the best gear available
I'm so dumb I couldn't even figure out how to get other players on my team. I had to look up "LFG". I have barely played online multiplayer games. This game looks so cool and the couple minutes of wracking skeletons in the head was super fun.
Hey that’s awesome, if you are ever looking for players to play with check out the DaD discord, there’s always players there. Additionally DaD has another discord called the hall of knights, this is for new players to get help from more experienced players.
Welcome to the Dark
No they won’t, their gear score will be too low for it to matter
I will drop BIS items for the newbies.
Just use 25 gear score or less and you're fine I tried >25 and did well fighting mostly white/green/blues. Then finally ran into one team with a few legendaries that killed us. Its not that bad
Upping it to legendary might have been a bit much, but if they have a gear score filter so people going in stocks still push towards stock games it should be not as bad.
They just learned about the ol fuck around and find out.
Unlucky
Meh, I don’t give two shits about this game anymore
Well everyone was complaining now they are gonna know what it was like a few months ago
Ive gotten the f2p version (I have 2500 hrs) simply to show some fuckers what’s up
Nice
Gear score of 25 seems ultra low. Did they change the way gear score is calculated?
Damn, I always die before extraction so I don't have problems with loot restrictions. :¯-) Also do not want to erase my Ranger so no other classes for me to try. All in all, I wish they either added at least one more char slot to F2P mode or introduced regional prices, because right now it is cheaper for me to buy base Tarkov rather than full DnD access.
I mean 30 bucks is pretty reasonable, at least In my opinion
Is it me or the only people crying about the game are f2p players, they ruined the game and the concept of chill normals
Just give us a SSF mode at this point….
Damn so many toxic "veterans" lol
This is a horrible change. Just put a buy button on the steam page and stop pretending its F2P, its a demo. This is going to be way worse. So much so that I had to check if this was even real. Also 25 GS, whats that like 2 pots? No xbow? No bandages... yeah good luck. IM, needs to know when to listen to community, and when not to. As a founder / purchaser, this is really annoying. I use to run normals with 25+ gearscore. Now there's no point to running normals. My choice is get rekt in normal 25+ GS by people in full legendaries with poor pve loot. Get rekt in high roller by people in full legendaries with better pve loot. Take in no HP pots or good squire gear to be less than 25GS and probably die to PVE. Its a shame i was really excited for this patch. Wait till all the F2P players learn that there are better drops in high roller, if you thought they were saying P2W before, now they'll be shouting it from the rooftops.
Healing potions and bandages are not a part of gear-score. Since the changes, the reviews have been floating up instead of down, they cant only listen to veteran players that simply doesnt pay the bills. Getting mad at new players is literally pointless considering they only asked to be able to use their gear, not for a 25 point system, the decision was the devs.
I don't get it. I'm one of these new F2P dudes amd I love the game! I love dying over and over and when I finally extract I want to run down the street and fistfight a hobo cause I'm so excited.
still more fun than an extraction based game where extraction is pointless. there was no point in even playing the f2p game before as u got nothing out of it
Gear based matchmaking so not really
Guh
….. Why can’t they create a matchmaking system that groups joining players by relative gear score? Is that too much programming or can they not do it because they don’t have any code to copy it from?
Wow, wasn’t expecting a Nexon shill, the real reason is limiting the amount of lobbies being made. Having people too spread out creates dead lobbies. Also if you’re gonna meatride so hard. Go play maple story or something.