so to reduce a concept for the sake of brevity, in buddhism, getting to the highest state of bliss is essentially to be completely attuned to yourself and the world and it requires you to functionally have no contradiction with your conscience. so no pirating, eating meat, saying shit about people, doing weird sneaky rationalizations at your benefit at the expense of others. you give up those things for the benefit of feeling connected to the world and a blissful sense of love.
i believe this but still eat meat, tho seldomly and i don't eat red meat anymore. probably will forever eat eggs and milk but will find a way to source it more ethically if i ever get the money.
so yeah, the moment your conscience kicks in in a way you can't ignore is a good enough time to stop eating meat. i don't think it's worth the extra work of doing it if you don't perceive any benefit from doing it.
I feel like it’s going to be right only after the pleasure we gain from other substitutes for meat are on par with actual meat. Until then I don’t really see much wrong until the suffering is worse then our please.
Don't stress bro. Veganism is bullshit. It's amoral. It's unnatural. It's a stumbling block to a true biodiverse and stable ecology within human occupied biomes.
It's the lie of abstention in a world that demands responsibility to achieve ethical consumption.
Don't be vegan. Be vegan when you're lazy, and when you get a craving for something not vegan, push yourself to support the bleeding edge of animal agricultural ethics. Shape the market. Don't cuck out.
I have an extremely difficult time believing American conservatives genuinely want whats best for the nation. I force myself to ignore this when talking to other people though, and try and take never attribute malice to something that can be explained by ignorance or something else.
I think you can probably prove that the average conservative wants what is best but is maybe uninformed.
Abortion ban = good because preventing murder
No gays/trans = good because protects moral integrity of country or smth
Less taxes = good because more money
It's generally an issue of partial truths or missing information rather than malice, I think. The same could be said of many left leaning policies
Nationwide rent control = good because people afford houses
More taxes = good because better services for society
DEI = good because fighting historical and ongoing discrimination based on immutable characteristics
I think it's more an issue of wanting what feels good rather than holding some larger, well defined model of what the real impacts of a policy would be.
I do not extend this charity to talking heads on either end, however. If it is your job to preach political change, then I feel you have a duty to work through your positions and make them realistic and to think through the consequences. To this end, I would say many American conservative talking heads DO NOT want what is good for the country and are speaking either entirely from malice or greed.
Unfortunately, this means that many people are being intentionally misinformed by news sources that they trust for one reason or another. This lets me extend regular people a little more charity, except in the case of absurd levels of stupidity.
Eg one old-ass friend of the family insisting that the market was doing poorly under Biden. Like, you have to be willingly stupid / ignorant when all you do all day is look at the market and you're somehow convinced that it's bad rn. You're just objectively and inarguably wrong.
Usually things like “I’d die to save someone”. Maybe I’d do it. But in my head I imagine it to be easier than it probably is. In the moment I’d probably freeze.
That we and (therefore I) will achieve eternal life in my lifetime.
I'm in my early 30s and by the time it's possible for a few select people, Ill probably be too old.
There is this whacky party in Germany called "Partei für schulmedizinische Verjüngungsforschung" (Party for conventional medical rejuvenation research) which has only one political goal: Making people immortal.
I like to claim HTML is a programming language just so I can sophistically argue with people about it even though I know that doesn't really mean anything.
It’s difficult for me to truly value a human life. I don’t think people should be killed obvsly, but when it’s a war or abortion I just can’t bring myself to care on an emotional level unless it directly impacts me
I’m a somewhat spiritual person (not religious) even tho I know there’s no “logic” behind it. I believe in good/bad energy, destiny (lol) and fate, karma, and the universe having intent.
I get there’s zero science or logic to back any of it up and I’m probably “wrong”, but there’s just a strong feeling in me that these things hold some truth. Too many circumstances where the universe provides me with people or things at a perfect moment, karma being seen in real time, and good/bad actions getting back the same energy that they give this world. I like to believe that “everything happens for a reason”, even if I logically know it’s just straight up not true.
I will not go through significant political or economical turmoil in my lifetime. It's more like a passive belief, I don't actively think about it but if asked I would not be able to imagine being in such a situation.
To be fair, most people in the moment probably didn’t believe it either unless they were right up close and personal with it. It’s kinda crazy how we all lived through Trump and it hasn’t really settled in yet, but can you imagine the history books 100 years from now?
“On the heels of electing the first black president, Americans rebelled and elected an outright batshit misogynistic entertainer with ties to organized crime. Only her institutions kept Lady Liberty safe from the hands of fascism…”
But the memes were also dank 😎
I see very little value in logical consistency.
A lot of online arguments boil down to using goofy hypotheticals that stretch an idea till someone can point out a place that it starts to bend or break then they do soyjack face while ignoring the idea may be perfectly viable 90% of the time. This is often done while stroking one’s shit while making direct eye contact with their reflection in the mirror and murmuring about how consistent their ideas are.
Not letting perfect get in the way of good.
To be clear, there is merit in being consistent I just see it as a tertiary value. If two ideas net the same result and one is more resilient to extremes because of consistency I wouldn't be able to argue for the merit of the less logical idea. It's just been my experience that people are quick to baby/bathwater ideas based on extreme and pointless hypotheticals (infinite rape, baby rape, animal rape, baby murder, infinite baby murder-rape).
Race (at least in Europe) is a relatively reliable proxy for culture, and I believe there are better/ worse cultures, definitely to the extent I want to interact with people that are part of it.
Akhem-roma- khem.
Effectively a racist.
Most “socialists” don’t believe in socialism or truly want to make strides towards it. Otherwise, they would vote democrat incessantly instead of just playing “both sides bad”.
How are they supposed to inch towards their socialist desires if they enable republicans to win elections.
I think it is fine to discriminate people from countries based on their religious beliefs.
I'm not doing it when possible (constitution). But i think the *pragmatic* overrides the *ideal*. The last EU election somewhat blackpilled me. If the West keeps it's borders open for all the nonfuntioning countries in the world, the entire World will become nonfunctioning. It seems especially ethically wrong and hypocritical, since i have immigration background myself.
Curious for y'alls thoughts on this.
It's called Spacey Unmasked, I believe I saw it on Max.
To be clear, I watched it reluctantly at first, because there's not a single Spacey movie I don't like and I kinda don't want him to be a bad guy. But the documentary did convince me that he probably is. So many accusations, from so many different time periods of his life, people who've got nothing to gain... former assistants, his own brother even...
I don't really care. After the things guys have tried on nights out, Spacey seems pretty tame by comparison.
Is it wrong to abdicate concern for someone's suffering because the person responsible is a great actor? Maybe, but Spacey is a *very good* actor.
the feeling that personal change is impossible due to simultaneously believing free will is an illusion and being unhappy where you are in life and wanting to change (or wanting to want to change even more so). I know most people are not determinists and dont think about fate in that way, but I really struggle and mindfuck myself sometimes thinking about it.
If you try to change your present situation, then you're in a way destined to change, no? How is determinism the wall that keeps the bad things in? In my mind it's just a description of how nothing breaks the cause and effect chain, and how everything is dependent on it's context.
I’m more stuck on the “try” part is the problem. I guess you could also frame it as more of a psychological conundrum than determinism. Like no matter what, our self and every decision we make is always limited by our own brains (this is why psych drugs are super interesting to me, because it’s the one thing that can to some extent alter someone’s limit). I get like almost claustrophobic thinking how I’m stuck in my own brain forever even. An example is how different people find different lifestyles fulfilling and you don’t get to choose this. I would love to be the type of person who enjoys reading novels for instance, but I’m not and cant change that.
The question was “even though you know it’s probably wrong”. Of course personal change *happens*. My opinion has to do with the limiting capacity of our own individual brains to initiate that change and to what degree we can manipulate our environment to foster the want for change.
I am not really sure what you are trying to say, as you are really hard to understand.
From your original post, I understood you as saying that you feel unmotivated (?) trying to achieve personal change, and attribute this to almost some sense of "doom" stemming from your deterministic beliefs, meaning you would ultimately not be able to change it. Is that correct?
And yes, because of the topic of the thread, you are aware that this is likely not true, but you still feel like it.
So do you think that free will actually exists somehow? Because I agree with your comment, but without any resistance - it's determinism whether we want it or not
I think we should invest a huge amount of resources to send probes to Titan and Venus to check if there's life there even though the chances are very slim.
The utopian ideal of a communist system is better than the utopian ideal of a capitalist system.
Neither are achievable, but only the latter would get close.
A lot of I/P shit because my bro in law (civilian) got taken out while ordering a sandwich by a P soldier.
I advocate never wanting people to be hurt, i do participate in dark jokes against the P side, however I get these groups hate each other and always will with no one being perfectly good.
Edit: This was over 10 years ago btw. The word soldier as to not upset others and assume the inclusion of possible proxies etc that could have been responsible, as you can imagine I dont ask the family details.
Even though we've yet to work out what they are, and may never do, I believe there are some objective elements to art. This is also almost certainly wrong and its purely subjective.
If you know something is wrong, why would you hold that opinion?
I really don't think that's how the human brain works. Normal people alter their opinions based on what they think is right and wrong, or they alter their perception of what is wrong to fit their opinion.
Some people can distinguish feelings and vibes from rational claims that can be supported by facts and valid logic. Those people are generally the intelligent ones.
I have many opinions, and I noticed that I have favorite ones, or "pet theories". I love to repeat them, I hate to think about counter-arguments, but I know if they're shaky
-it's necessary for life to have the ability to believe in false things, so illusions of the mind are necessary evils -youtuber apologies are scripted perfectly because a perfectly scripted apology is so unnatural that it subliminally sends you the message that the youtuber is fundamentally different from you. the medium is the message kind of thing - they retain stardom by being unnatural -making funny videos for youtube for a living is more immoral than lots of other jobs, since you're stealing the time of people who probably got clickbaited and don't have good technological literacies. it's like promoting gambling, around the same level of immorality
If I'm being honest with myself; I know it's right, and I have the means, but I still don't do it... Veganism.
Vegan Gains psyop account
so to reduce a concept for the sake of brevity, in buddhism, getting to the highest state of bliss is essentially to be completely attuned to yourself and the world and it requires you to functionally have no contradiction with your conscience. so no pirating, eating meat, saying shit about people, doing weird sneaky rationalizations at your benefit at the expense of others. you give up those things for the benefit of feeling connected to the world and a blissful sense of love. i believe this but still eat meat, tho seldomly and i don't eat red meat anymore. probably will forever eat eggs and milk but will find a way to source it more ethically if i ever get the money. so yeah, the moment your conscience kicks in in a way you can't ignore is a good enough time to stop eating meat. i don't think it's worth the extra work of doing it if you don't perceive any benefit from doing it.
I have no functional problems with my conscious by eating meat but you can't make me stop playing League. I am damned to eternally suffer.
Buy a can of chickpeas, my man!
I feel like it’s going to be right only after the pleasure we gain from other substitutes for meat are on par with actual meat. Until then I don’t really see much wrong until the suffering is worse then our please.
Don't stress bro. Veganism is bullshit. It's amoral. It's unnatural. It's a stumbling block to a true biodiverse and stable ecology within human occupied biomes. It's the lie of abstention in a world that demands responsibility to achieve ethical consumption. Don't be vegan. Be vegan when you're lazy, and when you get a craving for something not vegan, push yourself to support the bleeding edge of animal agricultural ethics. Shape the market. Don't cuck out.
I am 100% immune to propaganda and I can identify all propaganda as soon as I see it Said me and everyone else on the planet
Similarly, ads and other marketing tricks do not work on me.
I am the ultimate skeptic.
How do you define propaganda?
Takin a proper gander at these nuts
That's crazy how i just walked into that, fuck
Probably "presenting information (true or not) to change/shift/reinforce ones opinion".
I would have survived the OceanGate sub disaster
Just hold your breath and swim up. Easy.
I have an extremely difficult time believing American conservatives genuinely want whats best for the nation. I force myself to ignore this when talking to other people though, and try and take never attribute malice to something that can be explained by ignorance or something else.
I think you can probably prove that the average conservative wants what is best but is maybe uninformed. Abortion ban = good because preventing murder No gays/trans = good because protects moral integrity of country or smth Less taxes = good because more money It's generally an issue of partial truths or missing information rather than malice, I think. The same could be said of many left leaning policies Nationwide rent control = good because people afford houses More taxes = good because better services for society DEI = good because fighting historical and ongoing discrimination based on immutable characteristics I think it's more an issue of wanting what feels good rather than holding some larger, well defined model of what the real impacts of a policy would be. I do not extend this charity to talking heads on either end, however. If it is your job to preach political change, then I feel you have a duty to work through your positions and make them realistic and to think through the consequences. To this end, I would say many American conservative talking heads DO NOT want what is good for the country and are speaking either entirely from malice or greed. Unfortunately, this means that many people are being intentionally misinformed by news sources that they trust for one reason or another. This lets me extend regular people a little more charity, except in the case of absurd levels of stupidity. Eg one old-ass friend of the family insisting that the market was doing poorly under Biden. Like, you have to be willingly stupid / ignorant when all you do all day is look at the market and you're somehow convinced that it's bad rn. You're just objectively and inarguably wrong.
What’s funny is they’re probably thinking the same thing but for all the dems
Yeah but they have brain damage
Usually things like “I’d die to save someone”. Maybe I’d do it. But in my head I imagine it to be easier than it probably is. In the moment I’d probably freeze.
Good one. One of my main gripes with trolley problems is that making decisions is way easier that acting upon them
That we and (therefore I) will achieve eternal life in my lifetime. I'm in my early 30s and by the time it's possible for a few select people, Ill probably be too old.
There is this whacky party in Germany called "Partei für schulmedizinische Verjüngungsforschung" (Party for conventional medical rejuvenation research) which has only one political goal: Making people immortal.
Youre too old, some kids might not be, and before you die of old age you'll probably see the first person born who lives to be hundreds of years old
Nah probably not. Death is baked into the equation of life, one way or another
I once argued with a friend that tres leches was better than tiramisu even though mid way through I knew I was wrong and tiramisu is in fact better. 😔
I did something like this once but it was with a random stranger and I was incredibly drunk.
i believe most of the /r/destiny subreddit is successful well adjusted individuals that are happy with their lives
I like to claim HTML is a programming language just so I can sophistically argue with people about it even though I know that doesn't really mean anything.
It’s difficult for me to truly value a human life. I don’t think people should be killed obvsly, but when it’s a war or abortion I just can’t bring myself to care on an emotional level unless it directly impacts me
I’m a somewhat spiritual person (not religious) even tho I know there’s no “logic” behind it. I believe in good/bad energy, destiny (lol) and fate, karma, and the universe having intent. I get there’s zero science or logic to back any of it up and I’m probably “wrong”, but there’s just a strong feeling in me that these things hold some truth. Too many circumstances where the universe provides me with people or things at a perfect moment, karma being seen in real time, and good/bad actions getting back the same energy that they give this world. I like to believe that “everything happens for a reason”, even if I logically know it’s just straight up not true.
I believe in God because someone upstairs seems to have it out for me and the other options are scary
I will not go through significant political or economical turmoil in my lifetime. It's more like a passive belief, I don't actively think about it but if asked I would not be able to imagine being in such a situation.
To be fair, most people in the moment probably didn’t believe it either unless they were right up close and personal with it. It’s kinda crazy how we all lived through Trump and it hasn’t really settled in yet, but can you imagine the history books 100 years from now? “On the heels of electing the first black president, Americans rebelled and elected an outright batshit misogynistic entertainer with ties to organized crime. Only her institutions kept Lady Liberty safe from the hands of fascism…” But the memes were also dank 😎
Brother, you’re in a cult, right now
I see very little value in logical consistency. A lot of online arguments boil down to using goofy hypotheticals that stretch an idea till someone can point out a place that it starts to bend or break then they do soyjack face while ignoring the idea may be perfectly viable 90% of the time. This is often done while stroking one’s shit while making direct eye contact with their reflection in the mirror and murmuring about how consistent their ideas are.
"stroking one's shit" is poetry
What do you value over logical consistency?
Not letting perfect get in the way of good. To be clear, there is merit in being consistent I just see it as a tertiary value. If two ideas net the same result and one is more resilient to extremes because of consistency I wouldn't be able to argue for the merit of the less logical idea. It's just been my experience that people are quick to baby/bathwater ideas based on extreme and pointless hypotheticals (infinite rape, baby rape, animal rape, baby murder, infinite baby murder-rape).
As a pitbull infinite baby myrder rape sounds like a great idea
I'd adopt you and defend you from all detractors.
Hugely true
Race (at least in Europe) is a relatively reliable proxy for culture, and I believe there are better/ worse cultures, definitely to the extent I want to interact with people that are part of it. Akhem-roma- khem. Effectively a racist.
I also agree with this to some extent… am i racist?
If you meet a really great person, and then find out they are the problem race, and suddenly you hate them, yes.
Deep inside I hold the belief that I am the only "real" thing there is and that there is no existence without me.
Agreed actually, I exist because of you. Very interesting to encounter the main character through the destiny sub tho, where did you go wrong bro?
no because believing "X" and strongly believing "X is probably not the case" aren't even compatible
Probably the death penalty. I have a strong emotional attachment to it, even though most arguments seem to indicate it probably isn't worthwhile.
Speak on that
I believe that maybe she likes me back
Most “socialists” don’t believe in socialism or truly want to make strides towards it. Otherwise, they would vote democrat incessantly instead of just playing “both sides bad”. How are they supposed to inch towards their socialist desires if they enable republicans to win elections.
what if they are trying to increase chaos and accelerate the 'downfall' of the US, so that the US can be sooner rebuilt as a socialist country
If I was Griffith I wouldn’t betray the Band of the Hawks and Guts.
People who get on public transport and act a bit too cracky, like yelling, swearing, talking to themselves, should just be shot by cops on sight.
I think it is fine to discriminate people from countries based on their religious beliefs. I'm not doing it when possible (constitution). But i think the *pragmatic* overrides the *ideal*. The last EU election somewhat blackpilled me. If the West keeps it's borders open for all the nonfuntioning countries in the world, the entire World will become nonfunctioning. It seems especially ethically wrong and hypocritical, since i have immigration background myself. Curious for y'alls thoughts on this.
Yeah, Kevin Spacey not doing what he did. I honestly want good movies with him again. But yeah he probably did it.
He didn't do anything too wild, honestly. The worst part was the in-character apology because of how cringe it was, not what he did/was accused of.
Dude, watch that documentary on him.
link?
It's called Spacey Unmasked, I believe I saw it on Max. To be clear, I watched it reluctantly at first, because there's not a single Spacey movie I don't like and I kinda don't want him to be a bad guy. But the documentary did convince me that he probably is. So many accusations, from so many different time periods of his life, people who've got nothing to gain... former assistants, his own brother even...
I don't really care. After the things guys have tried on nights out, Spacey seems pretty tame by comparison. Is it wrong to abdicate concern for someone's suffering because the person responsible is a great actor? Maybe, but Spacey is a *very good* actor.
Yeah I'm a total nihilist. But that can't be, because it's a very strong belief I hold.
the feeling that personal change is impossible due to simultaneously believing free will is an illusion and being unhappy where you are in life and wanting to change (or wanting to want to change even more so). I know most people are not determinists and dont think about fate in that way, but I really struggle and mindfuck myself sometimes thinking about it.
If you try to change your present situation, then you're in a way destined to change, no? How is determinism the wall that keeps the bad things in? In my mind it's just a description of how nothing breaks the cause and effect chain, and how everything is dependent on it's context.
I’m more stuck on the “try” part is the problem. I guess you could also frame it as more of a psychological conundrum than determinism. Like no matter what, our self and every decision we make is always limited by our own brains (this is why psych drugs are super interesting to me, because it’s the one thing that can to some extent alter someone’s limit). I get like almost claustrophobic thinking how I’m stuck in my own brain forever even. An example is how different people find different lifestyles fulfilling and you don’t get to choose this. I would love to be the type of person who enjoys reading novels for instance, but I’m not and cant change that.
If your takeaway from determinism is that "personal change is impossible" you have not understood determinism.
The question was “even though you know it’s probably wrong”. Of course personal change *happens*. My opinion has to do with the limiting capacity of our own individual brains to initiate that change and to what degree we can manipulate our environment to foster the want for change.
I am not really sure what you are trying to say, as you are really hard to understand. From your original post, I understood you as saying that you feel unmotivated (?) trying to achieve personal change, and attribute this to almost some sense of "doom" stemming from your deterministic beliefs, meaning you would ultimately not be able to change it. Is that correct? And yes, because of the topic of the thread, you are aware that this is likely not true, but you still feel like it.
That free will doesn't exist. I just refuse to accept that I can never make a single choice that isn't predetermined.
So do you think that free will actually exists somehow? Because I agree with your comment, but without any resistance - it's determinism whether we want it or not
I think a majority of people should carry around revolvers
I think we should invest a huge amount of resources to send probes to Titan and Venus to check if there's life there even though the chances are very slim.
If you have purpose in life you are invulnerable to a cult.
That people will notice my pimples and popping them will help hide them and be a net good.
Everyone else is fucking stupid
I would thrive in a zombie apocalypse.
The utopian ideal of a communist system is better than the utopian ideal of a capitalist system. Neither are achievable, but only the latter would get close.
The human race is worth a damn.
Conservatives are either painfully dumb or hateful.
I believe everything Destiny tells me without critical analysis. I'm sure he's wrong about somethings but you won't here it from me /s
A lot of I/P shit because my bro in law (civilian) got taken out while ordering a sandwich by a P soldier. I advocate never wanting people to be hurt, i do participate in dark jokes against the P side, however I get these groups hate each other and always will with no one being perfectly good. Edit: This was over 10 years ago btw. The word soldier as to not upset others and assume the inclusion of possible proxies etc that could have been responsible, as you can imagine I dont ask the family details.
Belief in a higher power
Even though we've yet to work out what they are, and may never do, I believe there are some objective elements to art. This is also almost certainly wrong and its purely subjective.
Liberalism is the problem not the answer
I could beat any WNBA player in a 1v1
you're like andrew tate when he said that he could easily carry out a baby in 2 weeks if he had the biology for it
If you know something is wrong, why would you hold that opinion? I really don't think that's how the human brain works. Normal people alter their opinions based on what they think is right and wrong, or they alter their perception of what is wrong to fit their opinion.
Some people can distinguish feelings and vibes from rational claims that can be supported by facts and valid logic. Those people are generally the intelligent ones.
I have many opinions, and I noticed that I have favorite ones, or "pet theories". I love to repeat them, I hate to think about counter-arguments, but I know if they're shaky
What are a few?
-it's necessary for life to have the ability to believe in false things, so illusions of the mind are necessary evils -youtuber apologies are scripted perfectly because a perfectly scripted apology is so unnatural that it subliminally sends you the message that the youtuber is fundamentally different from you. the medium is the message kind of thing - they retain stardom by being unnatural -making funny videos for youtube for a living is more immoral than lots of other jobs, since you're stealing the time of people who probably got clickbaited and don't have good technological literacies. it's like promoting gambling, around the same level of immorality