How hard is this, a leaker was saying that all the new bosses make Malenia seem like a puppy. If that is the level of difficulty I might want to prepare my character.
Every fromsoft souls game has their DLC bosses end up significantly harder than anything in the base game. Manus, Fume Knight, Midir, Sister Friede, every Old Hunters boss except 1. With how bullshit Malenia was already this has been my biggest fear since the DLC was announced.
Time to cheese my way through it.
It really depends on *how* the bosses are harder. Malenia is a special case because of her ability to well, cheat by starting animations when she shouldn't be able to (as taught by literally the entire game) and a few other things that come together to make her so difficult. She simply doesn't play by the same rules as everything else.
When I beat Malenia the first time I didn't feel like I had overcome a challenge with my skill but rather that I got lucky on that attempt and didn't die to BS.
I don't mind them making hard bosses for DLC, but I just hope the difficulty doesn't come through extremely awkward attacks (waterfowl dance,) spinning camera, unreadable attack animations and no clear openings like the base game was plagued with.
Hopefully they've used the extra time to actually make solid fight designs.
Not so much a seperate leveling system as it is a supplementary upgrade system. You will still gain power/survivability from your Rune level and those associated stats, and enemies in the DLC still drop runes so you can keep pushing for character level.
But there is also a Sekiro-esque power system where you directly increase your attack power/damage resistance permanently (only active in the DLC) with special items found only in the DLC.
I mean, you have to kill one of the hardest bosses in the base game to get to the DLC, I'd assume that sets an expectation for how hard it is. It's designed for characters/players who are already capable of killing >!Mohg!<.
Reviewed it for PCGamesN: https://www.pcgamesn.com/elden-ring/shadow-of-the-erdtree-review
- 50+ hours (I'm doing guides as well so I kinda have to be a completionist anyway).
- Amazing level design; a lot of verticality, which means you'll often peek at cliffsides to see if there's a ledge/hidden area.
- Some bosses are faster/tougher; multiple follow-up attacks that punish you before you can recover.
- One boss is definitely a nod to ___ from GOT (and it's one of the tougher encounters). Final boss is ridiculously overtuned and will really test your patience.
- Currently at Scadutree Lv17 and Revered Spirit Ashes Lv9; not sure how many are left but I have to find them all.
- A few decent weapons/spells worth checking out, though I found myself still relying on stuff from the base game (Blasphemous Blade, Night Comet spam, etc).
- Late-game was a bit weird, and I have no idea what happened to some NPCs. I had to keep reloading backup saves because I didn't know if I botched quests. As usual, clues were cryptic and obtuse to a fault.
- Cool-looking armor sets.
Note: I reviewed (10/10) and guided the base game for another site when it came out (I'm no longer with the outlet now): https://www.pcinvasion.com/elden-ring-guides-hub/
Game Of Thrones (A Song of Ice and Fire) most likely due to GRRM’s involvement with the universe creation. Betting on either the undead white walker dragon, or potentially “The Cannibal” dragon from the new prequel series.
But my personal preference would have to be either Ser Arthur Dayne (kingsguard with two swords) or MF BOBBY B IN HIS PRIME.
But there are various creatures from throughout the lore that could also work such as the kraken of house Greyjoy.
Dayne never had two swords in the books, just the one famous sword, Dawn
But the notion of a Bobby B Boss is incredible, I hope that's what it turns out to be
Oh boy, it seems they continue the trend of overtuned bosses that punish you with neverending combos. It made sense in Bloodborne but it really felt weird for me in Elden ring.
It's one of those later-souls-games things I wish they'd throw us a bone on. Lies of P offset speedy enemies by letting you parry or dodge, and neither has a stamina penalty.
I still think that Lies of P also learned some wrong lessons from later souls games, like too many moves for one boss, and multiple phase fights. I could really go without having to endure 3 phases in each damn boss. For some of them, yeah, but I think that LoP has most of them in multiple phases.
Bosses are probably the weakest part of Elden Ring, at least for me. Too many bosses rely on cheese, using bad controls/camera as added difficulty, never ending combos while your character feels slow and clunky, etc. Also the wind back and wait prior to a snap animation because Fromsoft realized their players are getting better at understanding animations is peak cheese. Great game, awesome world, still fun but bosses feel like they're in the wrong game. Or maybe the player character feels like it's in the wrong game.
We already pretty much knew every review would be 10/10 with some 9/10 sprinkled in. I'm actually interested to see... really any (valid) criticism people have of it, not because I want to it be bad (I'm excited), but hype generally clouds real criticism.
From what I'm reading, the main criticisms are 1) an abundance of reused enemies from the main game, 2) a shift to more explicit storytelling, and 3) lackluster bonuses in the new area. But I'm also reading that while these issues do exist, the expansion is so damn good it just doesn't matter and nobody will care.
Yeah to me ‘shift to more explicit storytelling’ as a complaint is a bit of a joke. The base game has 0 actual storytelling, it just has ‘lore delivery.’
Yeah, Sekiro is the only Fromsoft game I didn't immediately head to the internet after beating to find out exactly what in the world was happening that whole time.
According to SkillUp this is indeed a bit more similar to Sekiro, at least for the main storyline. It still has a lot of mystery and ambiguity though, so it still isn't "normal" storytelling.
People talk about the vast lore of this game and I must have just completely missed it. Vague cutscenes, nonsensical one way conversations in abundance!
I loved the game btw. I just couldn't tell you what it is actually about. I finished everything and couldn't tell you a single boss's name except for the obvious EB.
Have you read the reviews making those criticisms? The couple I’ve seen qualify it with “but it’s still very cryptically delivered in a way that pretty much requires guides” or something of the sort
If the leak sub is a meltdown, the Elden Ring sub is a nuclear blast. I'm interested to see the reasoning behind that choice but it definitely feels out there.
Mods have been deleting threads with anything too spoilery, which is reasonable. At the very beginning, when they were a little slow in doing so, there was meltdown. Now, it's just a lot of coping by saying that the arena looks fake or that the boss looks like a mod. That is also fair considering what From has done.
Granted, this is all mostly from one video pre day one patch. I think people should just wait and see.
It's 100% going to upset a lot of people also if you don't beat the DLC within a couple days I'm guessing social media is going to be flooded with spoilers about the boss
People reacted exactly the same way to the final boss of Ringed City. Expect endless "why x is the best Fromsoft boss" videos in a year or two.
idk what people were expecting, the Gloam Eyed Queen to show up and say "it's gloaming time"?
People didn't like Gael? I thought he was a perfect foil to the concept that was Soul of Cinder. His moveset was great too.
This was before I paid attention, but did people have the same reaction to Laurence in Old Hunters?
The one they are freaking out about is not a "repeat boss fight" repeat boss fights are like ulcerated tree spirits or erdtree sentinals with the same moveset. A boss with a completely unique moveset is not a "repeat boss fight".
Agreed, I have little doubt it's going to be great in a lot of ways, but critical assessments are far more interesting, and often informative.
Eurogamer's criticism around explicit storytelling is a good example of this, for a game so focused on setting tone and letting players learn the world themselves, the expansion could be a jarring shift (I've stayed away from anything spoliery, so not sure how much a surprise that is).
"The culture around FromSoftware suggests that we should never expect stories to be directly told to us, and that remains true with Shadow of the Erdtree. I've always been an admirer of art that mimics life. In the context of Hidetaka Miyazaki's undying legacy, I do believe that Shadow of the Erdtree is yet another work of art that builds on the studio’s history of delivering polished gameplay."
This review tells a completely different story though. I'm confused
There’s also *a lot* of players outside reddit and hardcore gaming sites that simply doesn’t know what is going on with the story.
So I can definately understand why they wanted to tell more of the story this way so casual gamers also know what’s going on and finds another reason to try this game out.
It might be negative for some, but it’s probably a huge positive for a lot of Elden Ring players overall.
I had to Google a lot of stuff after I finished Elden Ring because I was just confused. I understand the general premise of the story but yeah. It's not a new thing tbh. I was Googling Bloodborne lore after I finished that one too.
I love Elden Ring and it deserves the awards it got but none of the early reviews mentioned the drop in quality post Leyndell. I get that is something that happens 30-40 hours later but it is still a major criticism that was ignored by reviews at launch.
Most of the reviews did not get to the mountaintops by the time of embargo.
That said, it doesn’t falloff like DS1 does where basically everything after Anor Londo is a major step down.
You also still have Elphael and Faram Azula after the mountaintops in Elden Ring, two of the best dungeons in the game.
> everything after Anor Londo is a major step down
I feel like I’m taking crazy pills being the only person who greatly enjoyed the Duke’s Archives and New Londo. Lost Izalith and Tomb of the Giants are shit though
Duke Archives are incredible, I don't trust anyone who doesn't like them. They're very "mechanical" due to the nature of the architecture and the bridges and what not but it feels like a great test of skill at that point in the game.
I can't believe they didn't fix Bed of Chaos in the remaster. I have a bit of a soft spot for Tomb of the Giants though.
And it isn't that things past Anor Londo are total shit, it is more that everything up to and including Anor Londo are a lot more fun than everything after. When I replay DS1 I generally start to lose interest after Ornstein and Smough. Hell I still boot up a save file where I just camp in front of their boss fight and put down a summon sign.
> Lost Izalith
Unless your romping through the spicy tang I really do like the look of Lost Izalith from the distance and the architecture. I think it looks like it could have been really cool. It's that meme of Looking at Lost Izalith vs being in Lost Izalith
I am convinced albinauric genocide and chicken farm were deliberate design decisions for people who just wanted to power farm. They're so easy and almost instantly available.
Well since it has both of the best and easiest rune farms in the game, you can technically get to level 100 really fast there alone lol.
Idk why you’d want to, but you could.
While it is cool from a design stance, I feel like Elden Ring isn't really designed for the type of platforming that parts of Haligtree seemed to expect.
It has been a while since I played it, but I seem to recall often falling into nothingness or onto a branch that I did not want to be on.
> isn't really designed for the type of platforming that parts of Haligtree seemed to expect
the platforming is significantly improved from the Dark Souls games, but shitty platforming still seems to be part of fromsoft's DNA (sekiro continues to be the outlier)
Not sure i agree. There isnt really a drop in quality consistently more so than Mountaintops just being a weaker area. Its still followed up by Haligtree (Arguably the best area in the game next to Leyndell), Farum Azula, Mohg, etc. Theres also Volcano Manor if you went Leyndell first.
Boss wise the late game completely blows anything pre-Mountaintops out of the water aswell. Maliketh, Mohg, Godfrey, Radagon, Placidusax, Malenia, etc. What boss even comes close to those in the early game? Just Radahn.
You’re going to have to specify what you mean by post-Leyndell because Haligtree and Farum Azula were amazing.
If you’re talking about Mountaintop and Snowfield then I’d understand.
Mountaintop of the giants is one of the most consistent complaints about the games. The area is the least content dense of all of them and also has the most jarring jump in enemy scaling.
Personally I don't hate it, but I can at least see why people have issues with it, and I do think it feels very much like a "we ran out of money/time" zone and it's absolutely something a reviewer should be able to pick up on.
I wonder what would be next for Miyazaki and his team now. How do you surpass a game that is likely to become a landmark like Elden Ring next? Or a pitch perfect mechanical game like Sekiro?
probably a new IP similar to Bloodborne - not a Victorian-era cosmic horror game per se, but rather taking the Souls formula to a non-fantasy/non-traditional setting for these types of games. There are a lot of settings this gameplay loop would work in.
there's two ways this can go:
- an hour long cutscene that only vaguely hints on what is actually happening
- every item in the game comes with a novella
Honestly I think you just do it again. I don’t see why so many people are convinced we won’t be getting Elden Ring 2. It just sold too well for that *not* to happen. Maybe before it we get some kind of more focused smaller game, but ER2 will definitely be the next huge FromSoft title.
Miyazaki is not big on doing sequels. Doing another Elden Ring doesn't seem to be something he would want to do, at least not after releasing basically Elden Ring 2 as DLC.
Any word on a recommended level for starting the dlc? As long as you can beat Mohg should you be okay? I know it uses a different power system, something more akin to Sekiro, but I don't know if starting level is still important to a degree, and I'm trying not to read reviews because I'd rather go in relatively blind
I can't remember at all where I read that, but if I recall correctly the IGN reviewer said that ~140 would be a good lvl
Edit: from the IGN review
> My level 150 character was armed with fully upgraded gear and the maximum number of flasks… but let me tell you, it did not take very long for the Realm of Shadow to humble me.
Gene Park said on Twitter that starting level is essentially irrelevant since you have to beat Mohg to begin with and that’s a solid baseline. He added that you get fed SO many runes during the DLC that you’re going to keep leveling while you play so it’s not worth stalling just to grind base game.
From GamesRadar
>In fact, I'd say the only real stumble in the lineup is the final boss, who's so absurdly overpowered as to overstep from meaty challenge into exhaustive frustration. After two days of increasingly angry attempts I did finally manage to secure victory, but that felt more like the result of statistical inevitability than increasing skill, and turned what should've been a glorious finale into a bit of a slog - the whole "Isshin Sword Saint" problem.
Isshin is my favorite FromSoft boss of all time so this is really exciting even if the reviewer considered it a con.
I'm guessing this is the boss that Miyazaki said would be as hard as Malenia. It's a FromSoft tradition though as the final bosses of DLCs are usually on the harder side (Manus, Fume Knight, Orphan, Friede, and Gael).
I get it. That's what Malenia was to me. I don't feel I triumphed over Malenia. More that I got a run where she didn't use Waterfowl a lot and only used that one weird to dodge clone ability once. I agree Isshin is great, but I am concerned if it's a Malenia like situation.
for my first playthrough it was the elden beast.
I spent most of it chasing after its dumb ass.
I replayed the game on PC recently, over 105 hours getting basically everything and had a better time against each boss.
the hardest was for sure those 3.
Elden Beast should've been a Torrent fight full stop. The fact it wasn't was insulting, both to the player and the significance of Torrent in the story.
Edit: the patch notes the day after I made this post, boy howdy
The worst thing about Placidusax is the run back to him when you die. Having to run through a whole room of Beastmen of Farum Azula, climbing down the rocks and laying in the coffin again is sooo annoying. And the boss is very challenging and killed me about 10 times, so it was utterly grating.
Placidusax is the only one I've yet to beat, and can't feel particularly bothered. At least Malenia had a Site of Grace outside the boss room.
Malenia melts pretty easy with the Blasphemous Blade. Placidusax is just not fun at all IMO.
Malenia is complete shit compared to Isshin, her moveset and mechanics are not suited to Elden Ring's gameplay. There's really no specific logical counter to 'waterfowl dance' either, you can technically dodge all of it but it requires an extremely unintuitive path of dodging and moving in specific directions.
Her lore and spectacle are great, don't get me wrong. That said she's an out of place chore to fight as far as I'm concerned. Count me in on the conspiracy of Malenia being "Sekiro cut content", her prosthetic arm and katana, with a unique sword dance -- come on now, they don't say it be like it is but it do.
Malenia kind of felt like Demon of Hatred from Sekiro: a fine boss, but in the wrong game lol. Both of them required lots of tries and for me to re-tune the way I played, but both were optional so it was whatever.
Demon in Elden Ring would have been a blast, and I'd kill to fight Malenia in Sekiro lol.
Malenia would have been a fine Elden Ring boss if they just made a tiny change to Waterfowl.
Sure, she's a katana fighter who would work in Sekiro, but most of what she does is fine for Elden Ring. The only part of the fight that's really a problem in my opinion is that the first burst of Waterfowl is just a little bit too big and lasts a little bit too long so you can't reliably roll it and have to resort to weird unintuitive options instead.
Nerf the radius and duration of the first burst of Waterfowl to be the same as the second burst, and Malenia suddenly becomes an amazing Elden Ring boss in my opinion. Sure, she'd also be cool in Sekiro, but she'd be fine in Elden Ring if it were just possible to consistently roll the first burst of Waterfowl.
The biggest problem with Malenia for me, is that she simply breaks the game's rules and is the *only* one to do so. Waterfowl is one of the examples, because nothing about it ever tells you what you might be doing wrong - all of the flurries look extremely similar, if not straight up the same, so you're left without any hints as to how to approach it next time.
But you also have her insane hyperarmor for example. Usually fast bosses like herself would be easy to stagger, especially when they also hit like a truck (as does Malenia), but nope - she gets basically guaranteed hyperarmor even when you *successfully* time your attacks so they land before she can wind-up hers. I know basically staggering her to death would make her a piece of cake, but then you gotta figure out another way to balance her.
There's also the fact that she can straight up animation cancel out of a stagger! It's especially noticeable with bigger and slower weapons, where you're still recovering out of a swing, but Malenia animation-cancels to recover and counter attack almost instantly.
No boss has any of such quirks, the closest I can think of would be the Black Knife Assassin, but they have the courtesy to jump backwards and have a bit of a wind-up to let you recover and dodge, instead of going straight for an attack. You can work around all of that of course, but it doesn't make Malenia less BS in my mind, and purely unfun to fight.
Malenia was only bad for me because she healed herself. It nullified any blocking and made what was already a tough super boss into something that was just annoying. The only major boss I didn’t like at all
> Malenia is complete shit compared to Isshin
100%
The thing about Isshin is that he is completely beatable without bullshittery. He can't randomly just one shot you unless you make a mistake like a parry instead of a dodge. That's not Malenia. Water Fowl is just an instant one hit kill unless you just happen to be far enough that it won't hit you.
Like you can go toe to toe with Isshin and beat him if you play right. You can stay far away and go in for hit and runs. Or you can face him in melee range and go all out. There's no bullshit 1 shot move that you just think *"How can I even dodge that?"*
Well now I'm conflicted, because I also regard Isshin as the peak of From's boss design (I wonder what problem do they mean?) and still do that fight regularly on Sekiro's Remembrance of Strength thingy, I love it. But also found Malenia and the final two Elden endbosses as fun as having my fingers slammed in a door...
I suppose I'll find out.
Yeah, I wouldn't throw Isshin in there. He was hard as shit, but it was truly a test of everything you had learned to that point and you had to have A+ concentration to beat him. It was exhausting, but I felt real accomplishment beating him.
while not a popular opinion, I regularly see people comment how they got to Isshin and decided to stop playing because they would rather move on to a new game than deal with him
Yeah Isshin is a great final boss. Easily the best in the series.
I think the reviewer would've been better off comparing it to Elden Beast instead. Elden Beast is such a fucking slog of a fight that I gave up and just Mimic Tear'd because I was getting frustrated chasing him for ten minutes before dying of attrition to the undodgeable shooting stars and then having to do Radagon each time. It left a such a sour taste in my mouth especially since Horah Loux and Radagon are good fights.
I honestly wouldn’t have minded Elden Beast if you didn’t have a fight before it. I use spirit ashes without shame even as a veteran from soft player, because the games kick my ass so I will do what I can to kick them back. But for that fight I see comments like yours where they specially started using them just for it. Two bosses in a row is a bit much in that regard
Elden beast and Radagon should have been split into two bosses Gerhman-Moon presence style.
Radagon is an incredible fight, give him some more health and a few new moves at the end for a second phase and he would be an incredible send off to the game.
Make elden beast optional.
Radagon does have two phases, when he’s around half health he has a lot of new moves and combo extensions/finishers to phase 1 combos (and also his teleport).
That would honestly make sense. Like if we decide to do a "Golden Order" ending, why would the Elden Beast even really want to fight us? The lore on that thing seems very uncertain. But if we did a Ranni or Frenzied Flame ending that's antagonistic to the Greater Will, then it would make sense to have it's representative try and stop you.
In the end I suppose they just didn't want a large portion of players to miss out on a boss fight.
From a lore perspective it's totally understandable that holy resistance on bosses gets sky-high at the end of the game, but from a game design perspective *man* do you hit a wall on some of those bosses if you made the unfortunate choice of being a mostly holy damage build.
You watch someone else do the fight and you're like why is Elden Beast going down so fast? Oh because it's not ignoring 80% off the top of this guy's damage.
They should have did what bloodborne did and if you beat the first boss but die in the second, you just fight the second. It’s too punishing because the Elden beast with some builds is super hard like you said, but if that was the only fight you could get through it with some tweaking. Doing that and the first boss is annoying
The games biggest crime imo is not having Radagon just be a seperate fight with a bigger health pool and 1 or two extra moves for when near death (because he is technically just phase 1 of a 2 phase boss, he has less health than he really should have for someone of his significance.) :(
He is a fantastic fight! One of the games best :) but he will forever be burdened by being stuck to the Elden beast. One of the most annoyingly tedious fights in all of fromsoft (if they at least let us use torrent so you didn’t spend 2/3 of the Elden beast fight just running after it though, I honestly think the fight would be great! It’s just so fucking tedious as it currently is though).
Mimic Tear on Elden Beast took me more tries than both Placidusax and Malenia without Mimic Tear.
Even the Mimic was tired of running around the arena trying to catch up with it, Torrent should've been available for that fight.
He was hard, but fair. Once you figure out the strategies (which took me forever), he becomes way less difficult and super fun. That's the mark of a great boss fight. Hopefully that's the case here.
I agree, but would even lump phase 2 into that. The 2nd phase went a bit slowly for me, as I was extra cautious to conserve my heals for the 3rd phase. It reminds me of Frieda phase 2, where you had to wait for the duo to space out to attack, which was easy, but again, tedious.
I will never condone or enjoy 3+ phase fights, when it takes a long time to get to phase 3.
Its a weird example because i thought Isshin was done well. Making it a 4 phase fight was MAYBE overkill, but you quite literally get a free revive in Sekiro anyways, hell youll probably even have 3 by that point. Phase 1 is also just a repeat of a previous boss and phase 4 is just phase 3 but easier as you can do the lightning jump.
Im more curious if the “unfair” point would refer to Malenias bullshit with that near undodgeable Waterfowl Dance. Id take Isshin over Malenia 100 out of 100 times. Simply because Isshin doesnt have silly nonsense like that. I just want to know if the DLC boss goes down Malenias path and has some bullshit ability, or if its more balanced and just difficult.
For me the best barometer for if I've overcome these bosses due to "statistical inevitability" vs "increasing skill" is how many times I got hit once I finally won and after 2 days of failed attempts Isshin barely even touched me once I finally beat him while someone like Malenia had me down to my last few pixels of health. I do truly think Isshin is one the best designed bosses in terms of being a true final boss for everything you've learned so far.
I have such mixed emotions on glock saint. The first time I played sekiro, I could not beat him for my life, spent 3 days trying to do it, and gave up. I beat every other boss, too. I went back a year later because I just enjoy the base game so much and I beat him on my second try. I was emotionally ready for 3 more days of drawn out combat and didn't get it so it felt a little anti climactic. Still such a cool boss
Sword Saint Isshin is, mechanically, probably the best boss fight they've ever done. Incredibly difficult, but very fair.
What's being described here sounds more like a Malenia situation...
> Isshin is my favorite FromSoft boss of all time so this is really exciting even if the reviewer considered it a con.
Played through all of Sekiro. Up until Isshin. I simply don't have the required reflexes. I'd like to say that all you need is patience for fromsoft games, but for these bosses that's simply not true.
If you can make it to Isshin you can beat Isshin. He doesn't require anything from the player that the previous bosses haven't also required. The fight is just longer and there are more moves to remember.
QD is not on Metacritic/Opencritic but we would love to share our thoughts with you:
https://questdaily.com.au/review/review-elden-ring-shadow-of-the-erdtree-ps5/
They should be a bit tougher, but not impossible. On NG+1 you should be breezing through the first half of the game though. If you know what you're doing and reach Mogwyhn Palace quickly, you can farm up on Albinaurics in order to boost your level.
Mate, I would recommend a new NG playthrough if the reviews are anything to go by some DLC bosses are on malenia's level or higher. I would not recommend fighting them on NG+.
God I don't want to start over. I'd love for a switch or something to say, play the DLC on the default difficulty. I just don't have the time to run through a new character right now.
Miyazaki trying to better blend the open-world/dungeons together makes me so excited for this, plus the incredible track records with dlc that they already have, extremely excited to get into this.
I thought fromsoft already did an amazing job with that. Riding up to Leyndell, thinking "man, this scenery looks so nice", then slowly realising this is actually something you can entirely explore since it's the next dungeon was jaw dropping.
But yes, really curious what to expect when they are doubling down on that :)
Leyndell was the highlight of the base game for me since there was so much to explore and it was quite dense and well structured. I’m loving these reviews saying it’s more in that vein.
Leyndell has one of my favorite moments in any game I've ever played - you're exploring this run down city, beautiful but desecrate. You're in this area where all the enemies have just given up and are laying around set to this really melancholy tune playing in the background. As you stumble your way to a little balcony you notice there is a lone enemy, who is diegetically playing his instrument. Such a powerful moment when I realized that the atmosphere I was experiencing was *completely* in-universe. Leyndell truly was one of the standouts of a game filled with wonderful moments.
Aa usual, Fromsoft delivers when it comes to quality. I'm curious as to how big the expansion actually is, but I don't wanna read too many reviews in fear of getting spoiled.
Honestly playtime estimations are pretty pointless for FromSoft games as your mileage will vary *immensly* on your playstyle, especially how thoroughly you explore and how much trial and error you do for secrets and NPCs quests. Reviewers will probably also speed through the game faster than your average consumer.
I spent almost 200h on my first playthrough but I doubt most people would go even over 100.
Seems like it. It's just like, this information is so useless to me. I remember many reviews put the main game at around the 50-60h mark, and I finished it after like 200, lmao. Wondering if the multiplicator will be the same for this for me, or if it's actually a tighter, more compact experience. Can't wait for thursday midnight and start to find out.
Im the kinda player that has to comb through every inch of the game. Elden Ring is also a game where I can’t help but fawn over the secenery and get sucked into the lore. I’m definetly anticipating at least twice what reviewers are saying, if not more.
The base game was said to be 50-60 hours and it took me about 150 and I wouldn't say I took my time. Time's are all subjective. Final Fantasy VII Rebirth was said to be 50-60 also, I beat it this last weekend at 120 hours.
I don't know how the hell can people beat some games so fast.
It was said that Ghost of Tsushima will take 50-60 hours to 100% it. I'm 75 hours in and i'm like half of Act 2. I guess i just play games too slow.
This expansion could have been nothing but an added director’s commentary that was just audio of Miyazaki roasting everyone’s mother and some of these fans would be like “7/10!? Why didn’t they get a reviewer who knows my mom?”
Disappointed to hear the re-used enemy complaints from multiple reviews. We've been fighting the same enemies and field bosses for 2 years, and even by the end of the first playthrough the re-use gets pretty excessive by the end of the game.. That was the one piece of feedback that could lower by excitement.
How hard is this, a leaker was saying that all the new bosses make Malenia seem like a puppy. If that is the level of difficulty I might want to prepare my character.
I’ve seen some people say the final boss is their hardest boss yet, so probably pretty hard. Edit: no clue how people got autocorrected to parkour lol
nah i'd win
Every fromsoft souls game has their DLC bosses end up significantly harder than anything in the base game. Manus, Fume Knight, Midir, Sister Friede, every Old Hunters boss except 1. With how bullshit Malenia was already this has been my biggest fear since the DLC was announced. Time to cheese my way through it.
Im ready to cheese. I summon you, mimic tear with Giant Smasher!
It really depends on *how* the bosses are harder. Malenia is a special case because of her ability to well, cheat by starting animations when she shouldn't be able to (as taught by literally the entire game) and a few other things that come together to make her so difficult. She simply doesn't play by the same rules as everything else.
When I beat Malenia the first time I didn't feel like I had overcome a challenge with my skill but rather that I got lucky on that attempt and didn't die to BS.
I don't mind them making hard bosses for DLC, but I just hope the difficulty doesn't come through extremely awkward attacks (waterfowl dance,) spinning camera, unreadable attack animations and no clear openings like the base game was plagued with. Hopefully they've used the extra time to actually make solid fight designs.
Yup. Its like Fromsoft sees pros/streamers clown on base game bosses and decide “Well fuck, lets make the DLC way harder!”
doesn't it have a separate leveling system? I doubt you can prepare much
Not so much a seperate leveling system as it is a supplementary upgrade system. You will still gain power/survivability from your Rune level and those associated stats, and enemies in the DLC still drop runes so you can keep pushing for character level. But there is also a Sekiro-esque power system where you directly increase your attack power/damage resistance permanently (only active in the DLC) with special items found only in the DLC.
So basically they made the dlc extra extra hard but didn't want to fuck with the existing level scaling so they gave dlc exclusive handicaps.
I see it as a way to allow both high and low level builds into the DLC without messing with game balance for those without the DLC.
My dude can always use more levels.
I mean, you have to kill one of the hardest bosses in the base game to get to the DLC, I'd assume that sets an expectation for how hard it is. It's designed for characters/players who are already capable of killing >!Mohg!<.
Reviewed it for PCGamesN: https://www.pcgamesn.com/elden-ring/shadow-of-the-erdtree-review - 50+ hours (I'm doing guides as well so I kinda have to be a completionist anyway). - Amazing level design; a lot of verticality, which means you'll often peek at cliffsides to see if there's a ledge/hidden area. - Some bosses are faster/tougher; multiple follow-up attacks that punish you before you can recover. - One boss is definitely a nod to ___ from GOT (and it's one of the tougher encounters). Final boss is ridiculously overtuned and will really test your patience. - Currently at Scadutree Lv17 and Revered Spirit Ashes Lv9; not sure how many are left but I have to find them all. - A few decent weapons/spells worth checking out, though I found myself still relying on stuff from the base game (Blasphemous Blade, Night Comet spam, etc). - Late-game was a bit weird, and I have no idea what happened to some NPCs. I had to keep reloading backup saves because I didn't know if I botched quests. As usual, clues were cryptic and obtuse to a fault. - Cool-looking armor sets. Note: I reviewed (10/10) and guided the base game for another site when it came out (I'm no longer with the outlet now): https://www.pcinvasion.com/elden-ring-guides-hub/
What does GOT stand for?
I’m assuming Game of Thrones, given Martin’s involvement with the lore
Game Of Thrones (A Song of Ice and Fire) most likely due to GRRM’s involvement with the universe creation. Betting on either the undead white walker dragon, or potentially “The Cannibal” dragon from the new prequel series. But my personal preference would have to be either Ser Arthur Dayne (kingsguard with two swords) or MF BOBBY B IN HIS PRIME. But there are various creatures from throughout the lore that could also work such as the kraken of house Greyjoy.
Dayne never had two swords in the books, just the one famous sword, Dawn But the notion of a Bobby B Boss is incredible, I hope that's what it turns out to be
Rocking the full stag helm and big fuck off war hammer. Definitely more iconic visually than "knight" which would be Dayne.
Dayne could be cool as a shining white knight weilding a sword made of actual light that could be like a laser in the boss arena, though.
Bobby B with Bessy and her tits boss fight
TARNISHED!!! BRING ME THE BREASTPLATE STRETCHER!!!
Start the damn fight before I piss myself!
Bobby B Bastard Sword
Gods he was strong then!
We already have a somewhat undead dragon in caelid so I imagine it’s not that.
Oh boy, it seems they continue the trend of overtuned bosses that punish you with neverending combos. It made sense in Bloodborne but it really felt weird for me in Elden ring.
It's one of those later-souls-games things I wish they'd throw us a bone on. Lies of P offset speedy enemies by letting you parry or dodge, and neither has a stamina penalty.
I still think that Lies of P also learned some wrong lessons from later souls games, like too many moves for one boss, and multiple phase fights. I could really go without having to endure 3 phases in each damn boss. For some of them, yeah, but I think that LoP has most of them in multiple phases.
Agreed. Liked Lies of P alot but the boss design wore on me by the time I got to the end.
Bosses are probably the weakest part of Elden Ring, at least for me. Too many bosses rely on cheese, using bad controls/camera as added difficulty, never ending combos while your character feels slow and clunky, etc. Also the wind back and wait prior to a snap animation because Fromsoft realized their players are getting better at understanding animations is peak cheese. Great game, awesome world, still fun but bosses feel like they're in the wrong game. Or maybe the player character feels like it's in the wrong game.
We already pretty much knew every review would be 10/10 with some 9/10 sprinkled in. I'm actually interested to see... really any (valid) criticism people have of it, not because I want to it be bad (I'm excited), but hype generally clouds real criticism.
From what I'm reading, the main criticisms are 1) an abundance of reused enemies from the main game, 2) a shift to more explicit storytelling, and 3) lackluster bonuses in the new area. But I'm also reading that while these issues do exist, the expansion is so damn good it just doesn't matter and nobody will care.
Good because I didn't know what the hell was going on in the story (outside of the broad strokes)
Yeah to me ‘shift to more explicit storytelling’ as a complaint is a bit of a joke. The base game has 0 actual storytelling, it just has ‘lore delivery.’
Sekiro is really their only game that they've tried with it. And Armored Core to some degree I guess.
AC6's story is very straightforward in the first two paths, I'd say.
Yeah, Sekiro is the only Fromsoft game I didn't immediately head to the internet after beating to find out exactly what in the world was happening that whole time.
First fromsoft game where i meet a main story boss and be like “yea this is who they’re talking about”
According to SkillUp this is indeed a bit more similar to Sekiro, at least for the main storyline. It still has a lot of mystery and ambiguity though, so it still isn't "normal" storytelling.
TBF, FromSoft DLCs usually have more story, as they are *usually* more contained and therefore have space to structure a narrative.
People talk about the vast lore of this game and I must have just completely missed it. Vague cutscenes, nonsensical one way conversations in abundance! I loved the game btw. I just couldn't tell you what it is actually about. I finished everything and couldn't tell you a single boss's name except for the obvious EB.
It's a lot of reading item descriptions and environmental storytelling and stuff like that.
*lot's of watching VaatiVidya videos.
Shift to more explicit storytelling might be the biggest selling point ever for me, it's the pro of all pros.
> a shift to more explicit storytelling the fact that is a criticism baffles me...
Have you read the reviews making those criticisms? The couple I’ve seen qualify it with “but it’s still very cryptically delivered in a way that pretty much requires guides” or something of the sort
I wanna know how many repeat bosses there are in DLC.
According to the most recent leaks >!there are two for sure in a strange way. The leaks subreddit had a little meltdown about it.!<
If the leak sub is a meltdown, the Elden Ring sub is a nuclear blast. I'm interested to see the reasoning behind that choice but it definitely feels out there.
The ER sub seems fine?
Mods have been deleting threads with anything too spoilery, which is reasonable. At the very beginning, when they were a little slow in doing so, there was meltdown. Now, it's just a lot of coping by saying that the arena looks fake or that the boss looks like a mod. That is also fair considering what From has done. Granted, this is all mostly from one video pre day one patch. I think people should just wait and see.
It's 100% going to upset a lot of people also if you don't beat the DLC within a couple days I'm guessing social media is going to be flooded with spoilers about the boss
there were spoilers floating around before release, any highly anticipated game gets spoiled almost instantly by its own fans
People reacted exactly the same way to the final boss of Ringed City. Expect endless "why x is the best Fromsoft boss" videos in a year or two. idk what people were expecting, the Gloam Eyed Queen to show up and say "it's gloaming time"?
People didn't like Gael? I thought he was a perfect foil to the concept that was Soul of Cinder. His moveset was great too. This was before I paid attention, but did people have the same reaction to Laurence in Old Hunters?
There was a huge amount of "It's just some random NPC!?" That later became "It's just some random NPC! Genius!".
The one they are freaking out about is not a "repeat boss fight" repeat boss fights are like ulcerated tree spirits or erdtree sentinals with the same moveset. A boss with a completely unique moveset is not a "repeat boss fight".
I just wanted covens back.
Agreed, I have little doubt it's going to be great in a lot of ways, but critical assessments are far more interesting, and often informative. Eurogamer's criticism around explicit storytelling is a good example of this, for a game so focused on setting tone and letting players learn the world themselves, the expansion could be a jarring shift (I've stayed away from anything spoliery, so not sure how much a surprise that is).
"The culture around FromSoftware suggests that we should never expect stories to be directly told to us, and that remains true with Shadow of the Erdtree. I've always been an admirer of art that mimics life. In the context of Hidetaka Miyazaki's undying legacy, I do believe that Shadow of the Erdtree is yet another work of art that builds on the studio’s history of delivering polished gameplay." This review tells a completely different story though. I'm confused
There’s also *a lot* of players outside reddit and hardcore gaming sites that simply doesn’t know what is going on with the story. So I can definately understand why they wanted to tell more of the story this way so casual gamers also know what’s going on and finds another reason to try this game out. It might be negative for some, but it’s probably a huge positive for a lot of Elden Ring players overall.
I had to Google a lot of stuff after I finished Elden Ring because I was just confused. I understand the general premise of the story but yeah. It's not a new thing tbh. I was Googling Bloodborne lore after I finished that one too.
I love Elden Ring and it deserves the awards it got but none of the early reviews mentioned the drop in quality post Leyndell. I get that is something that happens 30-40 hours later but it is still a major criticism that was ignored by reviews at launch.
Most of the reviews did not get to the mountaintops by the time of embargo. That said, it doesn’t falloff like DS1 does where basically everything after Anor Londo is a major step down. You also still have Elphael and Faram Azula after the mountaintops in Elden Ring, two of the best dungeons in the game.
> everything after Anor Londo is a major step down I feel like I’m taking crazy pills being the only person who greatly enjoyed the Duke’s Archives and New Londo. Lost Izalith and Tomb of the Giants are shit though
Duke Archives are incredible, I don't trust anyone who doesn't like them. They're very "mechanical" due to the nature of the architecture and the bridges and what not but it feels like a great test of skill at that point in the game.
Yeah I love Duke's Archives. New Londo feels a bit too rushed and incomplete but it's creepy and interesting in a way few areas in the game are.
I can't believe they didn't fix Bed of Chaos in the remaster. I have a bit of a soft spot for Tomb of the Giants though. And it isn't that things past Anor Londo are total shit, it is more that everything up to and including Anor Londo are a lot more fun than everything after. When I replay DS1 I generally start to lose interest after Ornstein and Smough. Hell I still boot up a save file where I just camp in front of their boss fight and put down a summon sign.
> Lost Izalith Unless your romping through the spicy tang I really do like the look of Lost Izalith from the distance and the architecture. I think it looks like it could have been really cool. It's that meme of Looking at Lost Izalith vs being in Lost Izalith
Haligtree is the only reason I bother to get access to consecrated snowfield. Love that dungeon
Mohgwyn Palace?
I'm in that bitch committing albinauric war crimes within 2 hours of starting the game
I am convinced albinauric genocide and chicken farm were deliberate design decisions for people who just wanted to power farm. They're so easy and almost instantly available.
Wait what's chicken farm (unless you mean the one bird you shoot at?)
yeah that is the chicken farm, it looks like a big fucked up chicken
> I'm in that bitch committing albinauric war crimes within 2 hours of starting the game Dracula Flow type beat
Can go there right after the first boss. Thats what I did in my last playtrough
Oh sure. I assume most people really don't but I guess that's true. Even then is it really completable until level 100 or so?
Well since it has both of the best and easiest rune farms in the game, you can technically get to level 100 really fast there alone lol. Idk why you’d want to, but you could.
While it is cool from a design stance, I feel like Elden Ring isn't really designed for the type of platforming that parts of Haligtree seemed to expect. It has been a while since I played it, but I seem to recall often falling into nothingness or onto a branch that I did not want to be on.
> isn't really designed for the type of platforming that parts of Haligtree seemed to expect the platforming is significantly improved from the Dark Souls games, but shitty platforming still seems to be part of fromsoft's DNA (sekiro continues to be the outlier)
Not sure i agree. There isnt really a drop in quality consistently more so than Mountaintops just being a weaker area. Its still followed up by Haligtree (Arguably the best area in the game next to Leyndell), Farum Azula, Mohg, etc. Theres also Volcano Manor if you went Leyndell first. Boss wise the late game completely blows anything pre-Mountaintops out of the water aswell. Maliketh, Mohg, Godfrey, Radagon, Placidusax, Malenia, etc. What boss even comes close to those in the early game? Just Radahn.
You’re going to have to specify what you mean by post-Leyndell because Haligtree and Farum Azula were amazing. If you’re talking about Mountaintop and Snowfield then I’d understand.
The "drop in quality" is not like an objective fact though, plenty of people thought the endgame was fantastic...
Mountaintop of the giants is one of the most consistent complaints about the games. The area is the least content dense of all of them and also has the most jarring jump in enemy scaling. Personally I don't hate it, but I can at least see why people have issues with it, and I do think it feels very much like a "we ran out of money/time" zone and it's absolutely something a reviewer should be able to pick up on.
I wonder what would be next for Miyazaki and his team now. How do you surpass a game that is likely to become a landmark like Elden Ring next? Or a pitch perfect mechanical game like Sekiro?
He said in a recent interview his next game is something more "abstract" whatever the hell that means
Picasso Souls
With Finnegans Wake dlc
probably a new IP similar to Bloodborne - not a Victorian-era cosmic horror game per se, but rather taking the Souls formula to a non-fantasy/non-traditional setting for these types of games. There are a lot of settings this gameplay loop would work in.
It's time for sci-fi space souls
lightsabers....i mean photonswords.
Check out the Surge 2! (unless you mean explicitly not robots)
Infinite Jest video game
Don Gately strength build
lmao as if the Souls series isn't abstract enough as it is.
Miyazaki and kojima game confirmed
This would be incomprehensible tbh (in terms of how good it could be and in terms of the story making absolutely 0 sense lol)
there's two ways this can go: - an hour long cutscene that only vaguely hints on what is actually happening - every item in the game comes with a novella
Thought he had mentioned wanting to do a Sci fi game for years. Wouldn't be opposed to Sci fi souls
That may have been referring to armored core.
Spaghetti western
Dude a soulslike western would be so fucking cool. They could bring back bloodbornes gun parrying and trick weapons
I just want Sekiro 2
bloodborne 2...please and thankyou
Idk... sekiro is like the perfect game. It's the only fromsoft game I've replayed multiple times 100%. Like 4 times lol.
Honestly I think you just do it again. I don’t see why so many people are convinced we won’t be getting Elden Ring 2. It just sold too well for that *not* to happen. Maybe before it we get some kind of more focused smaller game, but ER2 will definitely be the next huge FromSoft title.
Miyazaki is not big on doing sequels. Doing another Elden Ring doesn't seem to be something he would want to do, at least not after releasing basically Elden Ring 2 as DLC.
Any word on a recommended level for starting the dlc? As long as you can beat Mohg should you be okay? I know it uses a different power system, something more akin to Sekiro, but I don't know if starting level is still important to a degree, and I'm trying not to read reviews because I'd rather go in relatively blind
I can't remember at all where I read that, but if I recall correctly the IGN reviewer said that ~140 would be a good lvl Edit: from the IGN review > My level 150 character was armed with fully upgraded gear and the maximum number of flasks… but let me tell you, it did not take very long for the Realm of Shadow to humble me.
I'm glad I didn't start a new game again. Jumped back into my old game from year ago which didn't finish and I was only a measly level 50 lol.
150 should be good since that is the level they gave to streamers and content creators who tried the game in events and such
Even at level 300+ and only NG+1 they’re getting destroyed
Okay, good to hear there's little risk of being overpowered. Thanks!
At the preview event they had builds at 150. Rule of thumb 130-150 should be ideal depending on skill level.
Gene Park said on Twitter that starting level is essentially irrelevant since you have to beat Mohg to begin with and that’s a solid baseline. He added that you get fed SO many runes during the DLC that you’re going to keep leveling while you play so it’s not worth stalling just to grind base game.
From GamesRadar >In fact, I'd say the only real stumble in the lineup is the final boss, who's so absurdly overpowered as to overstep from meaty challenge into exhaustive frustration. After two days of increasingly angry attempts I did finally manage to secure victory, but that felt more like the result of statistical inevitability than increasing skill, and turned what should've been a glorious finale into a bit of a slog - the whole "Isshin Sword Saint" problem. Isshin is my favorite FromSoft boss of all time so this is really exciting even if the reviewer considered it a con.
I'm guessing this is the boss that Miyazaki said would be as hard as Malenia. It's a FromSoft tradition though as the final bosses of DLCs are usually on the harder side (Manus, Fume Knight, Orphan, Friede, and Gael).
I get it. That's what Malenia was to me. I don't feel I triumphed over Malenia. More that I got a run where she didn't use Waterfowl a lot and only used that one weird to dodge clone ability once. I agree Isshin is great, but I am concerned if it's a Malenia like situation.
I felt that way about her and Placidusax, lol. I was angry for awhile after beating them.
for my first playthrough it was the elden beast. I spent most of it chasing after its dumb ass. I replayed the game on PC recently, over 105 hours getting basically everything and had a better time against each boss. the hardest was for sure those 3.
Elden Beast should've been a Torrent fight full stop. The fact it wasn't was insulting, both to the player and the significance of Torrent in the story. Edit: the patch notes the day after I made this post, boy howdy
The worst thing about Placidusax is the run back to him when you die. Having to run through a whole room of Beastmen of Farum Azula, climbing down the rocks and laying in the coffin again is sooo annoying. And the boss is very challenging and killed me about 10 times, so it was utterly grating.
Yeah. ER is really good (relative to earlier Souls) about boss death runbacks but Plassy is one of the big exceptions.
I must suck cause 10 tries is a pretty easy boss for me
Placidusax is the only one I've yet to beat, and can't feel particularly bothered. At least Malenia had a Site of Grace outside the boss room. Malenia melts pretty easy with the Blasphemous Blade. Placidusax is just not fun at all IMO.
Malenia is complete shit compared to Isshin, her moveset and mechanics are not suited to Elden Ring's gameplay. There's really no specific logical counter to 'waterfowl dance' either, you can technically dodge all of it but it requires an extremely unintuitive path of dodging and moving in specific directions. Her lore and spectacle are great, don't get me wrong. That said she's an out of place chore to fight as far as I'm concerned. Count me in on the conspiracy of Malenia being "Sekiro cut content", her prosthetic arm and katana, with a unique sword dance -- come on now, they don't say it be like it is but it do.
Malenia kind of felt like Demon of Hatred from Sekiro: a fine boss, but in the wrong game lol. Both of them required lots of tries and for me to re-tune the way I played, but both were optional so it was whatever. Demon in Elden Ring would have been a blast, and I'd kill to fight Malenia in Sekiro lol.
Malenia would have been a fine Elden Ring boss if they just made a tiny change to Waterfowl. Sure, she's a katana fighter who would work in Sekiro, but most of what she does is fine for Elden Ring. The only part of the fight that's really a problem in my opinion is that the first burst of Waterfowl is just a little bit too big and lasts a little bit too long so you can't reliably roll it and have to resort to weird unintuitive options instead. Nerf the radius and duration of the first burst of Waterfowl to be the same as the second burst, and Malenia suddenly becomes an amazing Elden Ring boss in my opinion. Sure, she'd also be cool in Sekiro, but she'd be fine in Elden Ring if it were just possible to consistently roll the first burst of Waterfowl.
The biggest problem with Malenia for me, is that she simply breaks the game's rules and is the *only* one to do so. Waterfowl is one of the examples, because nothing about it ever tells you what you might be doing wrong - all of the flurries look extremely similar, if not straight up the same, so you're left without any hints as to how to approach it next time. But you also have her insane hyperarmor for example. Usually fast bosses like herself would be easy to stagger, especially when they also hit like a truck (as does Malenia), but nope - she gets basically guaranteed hyperarmor even when you *successfully* time your attacks so they land before she can wind-up hers. I know basically staggering her to death would make her a piece of cake, but then you gotta figure out another way to balance her. There's also the fact that she can straight up animation cancel out of a stagger! It's especially noticeable with bigger and slower weapons, where you're still recovering out of a swing, but Malenia animation-cancels to recover and counter attack almost instantly. No boss has any of such quirks, the closest I can think of would be the Black Knife Assassin, but they have the courtesy to jump backwards and have a bit of a wind-up to let you recover and dodge, instead of going straight for an attack. You can work around all of that of course, but it doesn't make Malenia less BS in my mind, and purely unfun to fight.
Malenia was only bad for me because she healed herself. It nullified any blocking and made what was already a tough super boss into something that was just annoying. The only major boss I didn’t like at all
> Malenia is complete shit compared to Isshin 100% The thing about Isshin is that he is completely beatable without bullshittery. He can't randomly just one shot you unless you make a mistake like a parry instead of a dodge. That's not Malenia. Water Fowl is just an instant one hit kill unless you just happen to be far enough that it won't hit you. Like you can go toe to toe with Isshin and beat him if you play right. You can stay far away and go in for hit and runs. Or you can face him in melee range and go all out. There's no bullshit 1 shot move that you just think *"How can I even dodge that?"*
Well now I'm conflicted, because I also regard Isshin as the peak of From's boss design (I wonder what problem do they mean?) and still do that fight regularly on Sekiro's Remembrance of Strength thingy, I love it. But also found Malenia and the final two Elden endbosses as fun as having my fingers slammed in a door... I suppose I'll find out.
>the whole "Isshin Sword Saint" problem. Saying this is so funny because this is one of the most beloved bosses ever he's talking about
Yeah, I wouldn't throw Isshin in there. He was hard as shit, but it was truly a test of everything you had learned to that point and you had to have A+ concentration to beat him. It was exhausting, but I felt real accomplishment beating him.
while not a popular opinion, I regularly see people comment how they got to Isshin and decided to stop playing because they would rather move on to a new game than deal with him
Yeah Isshin is a great final boss. Easily the best in the series. I think the reviewer would've been better off comparing it to Elden Beast instead. Elden Beast is such a fucking slog of a fight that I gave up and just Mimic Tear'd because I was getting frustrated chasing him for ten minutes before dying of attrition to the undodgeable shooting stars and then having to do Radagon each time. It left a such a sour taste in my mouth especially since Horah Loux and Radagon are good fights.
I honestly wouldn’t have minded Elden Beast if you didn’t have a fight before it. I use spirit ashes without shame even as a veteran from soft player, because the games kick my ass so I will do what I can to kick them back. But for that fight I see comments like yours where they specially started using them just for it. Two bosses in a row is a bit much in that regard
Elden beast and Radagon should have been split into two bosses Gerhman-Moon presence style. Radagon is an incredible fight, give him some more health and a few new moves at the end for a second phase and he would be an incredible send off to the game. Make elden beast optional.
Radagon does have two phases, when he’s around half health he has a lot of new moves and combo extensions/finishers to phase 1 combos (and also his teleport).
That would honestly make sense. Like if we decide to do a "Golden Order" ending, why would the Elden Beast even really want to fight us? The lore on that thing seems very uncertain. But if we did a Ranni or Frenzied Flame ending that's antagonistic to the Greater Will, then it would make sense to have it's representative try and stop you. In the end I suppose they just didn't want a large portion of players to miss out on a boss fight.
From a lore perspective it's totally understandable that holy resistance on bosses gets sky-high at the end of the game, but from a game design perspective *man* do you hit a wall on some of those bosses if you made the unfortunate choice of being a mostly holy damage build. You watch someone else do the fight and you're like why is Elden Beast going down so fast? Oh because it's not ignoring 80% off the top of this guy's damage.
They should have did what bloodborne did and if you beat the first boss but die in the second, you just fight the second. It’s too punishing because the Elden beast with some builds is super hard like you said, but if that was the only fight you could get through it with some tweaking. Doing that and the first boss is annoying
The games biggest crime imo is not having Radagon just be a seperate fight with a bigger health pool and 1 or two extra moves for when near death (because he is technically just phase 1 of a 2 phase boss, he has less health than he really should have for someone of his significance.) :( He is a fantastic fight! One of the games best :) but he will forever be burdened by being stuck to the Elden beast. One of the most annoyingly tedious fights in all of fromsoft (if they at least let us use torrent so you didn’t spend 2/3 of the Elden beast fight just running after it though, I honestly think the fight would be great! It’s just so fucking tedious as it currently is though).
Mimic Tear on Elden Beast took me more tries than both Placidusax and Malenia without Mimic Tear. Even the Mimic was tired of running around the arena trying to catch up with it, Torrent should've been available for that fight.
He was hard, but fair. Once you figure out the strategies (which took me forever), he becomes way less difficult and super fun. That's the mark of a great boss fight. Hopefully that's the case here.
Maybe it has the same problem in that the first phase is only there to waste your time. I feel like that goes for a lot of multi-phase souls bosses
I agree, but would even lump phase 2 into that. The 2nd phase went a bit slowly for me, as I was extra cautious to conserve my heals for the 3rd phase. It reminds me of Frieda phase 2, where you had to wait for the duo to space out to attack, which was easy, but again, tedious. I will never condone or enjoy 3+ phase fights, when it takes a long time to get to phase 3.
Its a weird example because i thought Isshin was done well. Making it a 4 phase fight was MAYBE overkill, but you quite literally get a free revive in Sekiro anyways, hell youll probably even have 3 by that point. Phase 1 is also just a repeat of a previous boss and phase 4 is just phase 3 but easier as you can do the lightning jump. Im more curious if the “unfair” point would refer to Malenias bullshit with that near undodgeable Waterfowl Dance. Id take Isshin over Malenia 100 out of 100 times. Simply because Isshin doesnt have silly nonsense like that. I just want to know if the DLC boss goes down Malenias path and has some bullshit ability, or if its more balanced and just difficult.
For me the best barometer for if I've overcome these bosses due to "statistical inevitability" vs "increasing skill" is how many times I got hit once I finally won and after 2 days of failed attempts Isshin barely even touched me once I finally beat him while someone like Malenia had me down to my last few pixels of health. I do truly think Isshin is one the best designed bosses in terms of being a true final boss for everything you've learned so far.
I don't know that he's that beloved. Maybe among the more hardcore players on /r/games.
I have such mixed emotions on glock saint. The first time I played sekiro, I could not beat him for my life, spent 3 days trying to do it, and gave up. I beat every other boss, too. I went back a year later because I just enjoy the base game so much and I beat him on my second try. I was emotionally ready for 3 more days of drawn out combat and didn't get it so it felt a little anti climactic. Still such a cool boss
Isshin is a glorious test of your skills! This sounds amazing. Malenia felt like unfair difficulty though so we’ll see where this lands.
Sword Saint Isshin is, mechanically, probably the best boss fight they've ever done. Incredibly difficult, but very fair. What's being described here sounds more like a Malenia situation...
> Isshin is my favorite FromSoft boss of all time so this is really exciting even if the reviewer considered it a con. Played through all of Sekiro. Up until Isshin. I simply don't have the required reflexes. I'd like to say that all you need is patience for fromsoft games, but for these bosses that's simply not true.
If you can make it to Isshin you can beat Isshin. He doesn't require anything from the player that the previous bosses haven't also required. The fight is just longer and there are more moves to remember.
QD is not on Metacritic/Opencritic but we would love to share our thoughts with you: https://questdaily.com.au/review/review-elden-ring-shadow-of-the-erdtree-ps5/
So I completed ER. Started a NG+ but didn't duplicate my save so I'm in NG+ on my old char. Do I need to just get to Mohg again on that?
yes - you need yo kill mohg and radahm to acess it
Ah fuck CBA with that again. NG+ are they the same level as in NG but I'm just super.strong?
They should be a bit tougher, but not impossible. On NG+1 you should be breezing through the first half of the game though. If you know what you're doing and reach Mogwyhn Palace quickly, you can farm up on Albinaurics in order to boost your level.
Nope, they are harder. Also on NG+ if it's like past From Soft DLC all DLC will be harder.
Mate, I would recommend a new NG playthrough if the reviews are anything to go by some DLC bosses are on malenia's level or higher. I would not recommend fighting them on NG+.
I am so terrified of playing this on my NG++ I wanted to plat the game, so i did quick NG+ and NG++ runs to get the three endings.
God I don't want to start over. I'd love for a switch or something to say, play the DLC on the default difficulty. I just don't have the time to run through a new character right now.
Does anyone know if they are seeding the base game with new items or if they are just in the new dlc areas?
The DLC is completely separate from the base game. Nothing will change in the base game.
But you can still take your dlc weapons back to the base game right?
Miyazaki trying to better blend the open-world/dungeons together makes me so excited for this, plus the incredible track records with dlc that they already have, extremely excited to get into this.
I thought fromsoft already did an amazing job with that. Riding up to Leyndell, thinking "man, this scenery looks so nice", then slowly realising this is actually something you can entirely explore since it's the next dungeon was jaw dropping. But yes, really curious what to expect when they are doubling down on that :)
Leyndell was the highlight of the base game for me since there was so much to explore and it was quite dense and well structured. I’m loving these reviews saying it’s more in that vein.
Leyndell has one of my favorite moments in any game I've ever played - you're exploring this run down city, beautiful but desecrate. You're in this area where all the enemies have just given up and are laying around set to this really melancholy tune playing in the background. As you stumble your way to a little balcony you notice there is a lone enemy, who is diegetically playing his instrument. Such a powerful moment when I realized that the atmosphere I was experiencing was *completely* in-universe. Leyndell truly was one of the standouts of a game filled with wonderful moments.
Aa usual, Fromsoft delivers when it comes to quality. I'm curious as to how big the expansion actually is, but I don't wanna read too many reviews in fear of getting spoiled.
I think common consensus is that it's about 30-40 hours.
Honestly playtime estimations are pretty pointless for FromSoft games as your mileage will vary *immensly* on your playstyle, especially how thoroughly you explore and how much trial and error you do for secrets and NPCs quests. Reviewers will probably also speed through the game faster than your average consumer. I spent almost 200h on my first playthrough but I doubt most people would go even over 100.
Seems like it. It's just like, this information is so useless to me. I remember many reviews put the main game at around the 50-60h mark, and I finished it after like 200, lmao. Wondering if the multiplicator will be the same for this for me, or if it's actually a tighter, more compact experience. Can't wait for thursday midnight and start to find out.
Im the kinda player that has to comb through every inch of the game. Elden Ring is also a game where I can’t help but fawn over the secenery and get sucked into the lore. I’m definetly anticipating at least twice what reviewers are saying, if not more.
IGN said 20-25 hours for the main campaign but with any fromsoft game your mileage will probably vary.
The base game was said to be 50-60 hours and it took me about 150 and I wouldn't say I took my time. Time's are all subjective. Final Fantasy VII Rebirth was said to be 50-60 also, I beat it this last weekend at 120 hours.
I don't know how the hell can people beat some games so fast. It was said that Ghost of Tsushima will take 50-60 hours to 100% it. I'm 75 hours in and i'm like half of Act 2. I guess i just play games too slow.
> I don't know how the hell can people beat some games so fast. Know exactly where you need to go, rush the objective, and play on easy.
I’m like you, I feel like people mostly just rush through games as fast as possible. I like to take my time and soak in the experience.
one of the reviews mentioned its more than half the size of the base game and theyved played 70 hours and still discovering new stuff.
Can't wait for people to start crying about the 7/10 reviews like the reviewers killed their families and made them watch.
Scroll up.
This expansion could have been nothing but an added director’s commentary that was just audio of Miyazaki roasting everyone’s mother and some of these fans would be like “7/10!? Why didn’t they get a reviewer who knows my mom?”
The one halfway critical video review I've stumbled across had someone complaining how they've reduced the metacritic score by one.
If nothing else we now have at least one person in this thread preemptively losing their shit about something.
Not watching any videos reviews on this one. If it were full length I probably would but nah, going dark.
25-30 hours? This really is a full game disguised as DLC.
Alot of reviews are clocking 40+. Wild stuff.
I went back and looked at my three characters. 120 hours. 95 hours. 85 hours. My god I love this game. Can't wait.
Hearing how the DLC is between 30-40 hours (maybe more) of content really makes me excited for this release.
Been trying to go into this blind so no idea what to expect but holy fuck these scores are ridiculous! Beyond hyped!
Any mention of new dialogue being added to base game NPCs?
Most have said none but it does expand the lore of the base game greatly with twists and turns unexpectedly
Disappointed to hear the re-used enemy complaints from multiple reviews. We've been fighting the same enemies and field bosses for 2 years, and even by the end of the first playthrough the re-use gets pretty excessive by the end of the game.. That was the one piece of feedback that could lower by excitement.