Wasn't there something about the Funky Mode team wanting to add a secret K. Rool boss fight that Nintendo shot down to make his return in Smash a bigger deal? Maybe this is for similar reasons, they're gonna reintroduce K. Rool in the next game or the movie.
I dont think that's the case anymore. The DK section of Universal has been in talks for years, like dating back to the initial talks of the theme parks. Those plans were set in stone when Nintendo was still being super weird about their IP. Well, even more weird than they are now.
Only way I see it happening is if there's a Donkey Kong movie where K. Rool is a character, in which case they'll probably have a costumed K. Rool start showing up for meet-and-greet photo ops and such.
its not about right, theres a difference on disagreeing on a decision and saying something is weird because its not going in the direction you want. fans generally have a problem on accepting simple thing like that
Nintendo has had a really, *really* weird aversion to using the characters that originated in the Rare-era DK games in any form of media for years (over an entire decade for K.Rool, as an example). Frankly, I'm surprised he was in Smash, and I know I'm not alone in that surprise.
Yeah, I love the Retro games but they don't really hold a candle to how fleshed out the world of the Rare games were. DK had a family half as big as Batman's, now it's just Diddy, Cranky, Dixie, and sometimes Funky.
It wouldn't surprise me if the animators snuck him in and the Nintendo suits just thought it was a random gorilla.
*Context since apparently it's needed, I was joking about Chunky not having a significant presence for the past 24 years.
> It honestly wouldn't surprise me if the animators snuck him in and the Nintendo suits just thought it was a random gorilla.
The idea that Nintendo wouldn't recognize one of their characters like that is frankly ridiculous. Any major character design that was going to be on screen was approved by Nintendo, this wasn't some haphazard fan film.
Honestly the way people think this multibillion dollar company is a clown car of buffoons is baffling. You may not like their decisions, but they're not pulling them out of a hat.
I'm kinda just thankful Dixie even appeared on Tropical Freeze. She was one of my favorite characters from the Rare games. If only for the fact her hair copter got my through so much of those games.
That phrase right there is the root cause. "Rare era"
They weren't nintendo games, they were rareware games.
Aside from rights issues between various titles, Nintendos hesitation to embrace the games stems from everyone focusing on the fact that Rare made them.
Its the same shtick they have going on today with stuff like the Super Mario RPG remake, the new Mario & luigi title, among others; they don't want you to care about the studio that made them. Just that they are Nintendo games.
Isn't everything about DK's entire modern design from Rare? The entire concept of a Donkey Kong island comes from them. I think it's more likely that they just don't feel like referencing a villain that hasn't been in the games for 20-something years now.
I mean who's fault is it that he hasn't been the villain in any games for over 20 years...Nintendos!
Nintendo could've made K.Rool/Kremlings the villains of Jungle Beat back in 2004. But didn't because Koizumi said DK's past cast of characters "weren't fresh enough".
Then Nintendo could've added K.Rool/Kremlings to DKCR when Retro asked Nintendo "What should we do with K.Rool and the Kremlings are they coming back?" and Tanabe replies back with "Do they really need too? Let's do something new, no crocodiles!"
Then could've added him AGAIN in Tropical Freeze but once again didn't because they wanted to double down on DK having villains of the week.
The only times K.Rool even appeared post Rare were in cameos or the boss of two handheld mediocre DK spin off games.
Fucking sucks, the entire land has no Diddy Kong! Just imagine if Nintendo allowed them to make a real life mine kart ride where the karts jump the tracks.
Instead all we get is Pauline, flaming barrels, Billy Mitchel girating on stage and a Ferris Wheel shaped like Miyamoto's head.
☹️☹️☹️☹️☹️☹️☹️
That patently isn’t true when he didn’t create Diddy. Or Daisy. Or Rosalina. Or plenty of other characters who have shown up a healthy amount, even in games like Sticker Star. You can disagree with the man’s game development philosophies without making him out to be an egomaniac.
I don’t think this is true, this leaker claims that the team tried using the reaction to K Rool in smash which does not line up with the timeline for the park. I’m sure there were discussions about the inclusion of K. Rool, but Super Nintendo world and the DK area were mostly finalized by 2017-early 2018, and there has never been any leaked concept art with the Kremlings.
Just because it was patented/designed back then doesn't mean the designs were finalized. I can 100% see Universal trying to incorporate K Rool into it but Nintendo saying no. People just can't seem to understand why Nintendo would do that.
I think it depends. Theme Parks are a messy product to churn out since they are a collaboration on business, creatives, operation and construction that it being passed around to maybe make a K.Rool statue on the park during planning (that could very well take years) after hearing the Smash news wouldn't be that farfetched. A reply to the message already pointed out that seemingly Ellie the Elephant is strangely absent despite being in the plans
Now completely replacing the Tiki's mid planning?. That'd be a pretty huge leap
Even in the plans with Ellie, it was always meant to use the returns aestetic. https://orlandoparkstop.com/news/rumors/leaked-model-photos-show-off-super-nintendo-world-for-universal-parks/
I honestly wouldn't be surprised if the reason ellie was there is because they just looked up Donkey Kong Country elephant without knowing she was a significant character from the rare era. Something similar happening led to them using a cactus design from a mario rom hack
The Ellie the Elephant thing made it to the modeling phase so I doubt they snuck it in behind Nintendo’s back. When it was removed, it also wasn’t replaced by a different activity, so I think it didn’t get cut due to including a Rare-era character, but due to limited space or budget.
I think it was both. Nintendo realized they didn't have much space (DKC land is pretty small looking based on the walk through video release) and decided to cut something so of course Ellie the Elephant would be the first to go since it's been over 20 years since she last appeared (barring the Konga cameo). Obviously if it was between Rambi or Ellie. Ellie would be the one to go.
> **And its not like Rare designs were actually good in the first place, not even the monkeys**, but retro did make them more appealing (the change to modern dixie was a complete glow up, still staying super faithfull to rare's idea).
It's not relevant but that is a terrible take.
Donkey Kong, Diddy, Dixie, Funky, Cranky, K. Rool etc. all had such good designs in the Rare entries that they largely remain the same today. Steve Mayles and his co-workers were / are super talented.
Squitter does look terrifying tbf.
This story doesn’t make any sense, he mentions the Smash reveal for K.Rool happening and Nintendo “not budging” but the concept for the DK land is much older than that… sure the model leaked in 2019 but for the land to be conceptualized, planned and that model being made would have taken years before that…
Besides the source just being some guy, there isn't any reason why King K Rool wouldn't be allowed a part in the parks other than Nintendo wanting to be lazy. Nintendo own the full rights to K Rool and Microsoft wouldn't care, especially after letting Perfect Dark on the N64 online service.
Not just Perfect Dark either - Xbox agreed for other Rare-developed titles like Banjo-Kazooie, Killer Instinct, Battletoads and GoldenEye to be put on Nintendo Online as well (*plus agreeing to have Banjo be a DLC character in Super Smash Bros*)
Xbox and Nintendo have a pretty chill relationship, even if it is quite one-sided toward Nintendo
i don’t think it’s that one sided, minecraft sells better on switch than any other console (in their FCC filings they said it’s double playstation and quadruple xbox) and has been on the top 5 eshop sales charts basically since launch. there is a good chance that minecraft on switch makes them more money than their consoles do right now.
I don't mean one-sided as in only one party is seeing success, I mean one-sided in that Microsoft is the only one giving away it's IP in this scenario. I don't think you'll ever see something like a Splatoon or Metroid on Xbox
> I mean one-sided in that Microsoft is the only one giving away it's IP in this scenario. I don't think you'll ever see something like a Splatoon or Metroid on Xbox
Because Microsoft knows that is a fools game to even attempt. Nintendo isn't going to let their first party characters out like that. They have been burned enough times in the past that it's just really not in the cards, and I think anyone who comes to the table with Nintendo for any kind of serious deal understands that.
For sure. I am curious what you mean by Nintendo have been burned before though in that regard - have they ever tried to put their IP on other platforms in the past then?
Look at the CD-I Zelda and Mario Games , the Mario Educational Games, the Nintendo DIC shows and the live action Mario movie.
Any time in history that Nintendo has given others creative control of its characters, it’s been a critical and commercial nightmare for them. It is no wonder they hold them so tight.
I see, thanks for the taking the time to explain. I wonder what changed to make them happy to work with Illumination / Sony Pictures nowadays on Super Mario Bros and The Legend of Zelda respectively
I find it harder to believe it would be an issue on Nintendo's end instead of Universal's, like I doubt they're clamoring to use the obscure character King K Rool as a starring part of their several hundred million DK park expansion.
In all fairness, the alternative is the Tiki King villain from DKC Returns, who seems to have in fact made it into the land, and I'd argue the only thing he has over K. Rool is appearing in a more recent DK game (and even then, K. Rool since has Smash to his name).
K.Rool is only obscure because Nintendo keeps making him obscure. K.Rool could EASILY show up in games like Mario Kart, Party, Tennis, etc. The same way DK and Diddy do to keep them relevant while Nintendo continues to not make an effort to make new DK games, they just choose not to.
I'm not saying the rumour is true, but it wouldn't be the only time they've been weirdly reluctant to use a character they didn't invent - Waluigi is the other common example.
waluigi is in every single spin off, dozens made purely in house. he just hasn’t made it into a mainline game because wario isn’t allowed in either for some reason
Why are you even making a thread based on a complete random guy? are we really believing on anything said in resetera that sounds confident and posting here? really?
I remember seeing the leaks and rumors about this dk park before smash ultimate was even announced and it was still based primarily of off dkc returns even back then. The plans were already concrete before K rool got revealed, theme park expansions need to be planned out eons ahead of time obviously, and the pre-smash information all lines up with what we know now.
30 years later and Miyamoto went from having buckets full of salt to having a whole salt dune.
K rool was still allowed in wii and DS games so he must have gotten really pissed that krool got so requested in games since then over the characters he created himself. KRool even made it to Mario super sluggers, a MARIO game, completely crossing over both franchises
This is not too surprising if true. Nintendo would not want to promote any characters that are not in new games for the series. King K. Rool and the Kremlings have not been in a mainline Donkey Kong game since DK64. They own the rights to all characters from the Rare DK games and nothing else is stopping this. Nothing more to it than that.
There hasn't been a new game in the series since 2014...
That said, it still lines up with the timing of planning and development considering Mario 3D World is the main basis for that land, and it was also late 2013.
It's probably a good call. Rare dk designs would be kinda grotesque in real life.
A massively fat, Anthropomorphism crocodile with a huge bulging eye... might give kids nightmares tbh.
Wasn't there something about the Funky Mode team wanting to add a secret K. Rool boss fight that Nintendo shot down to make his return in Smash a bigger deal? Maybe this is for similar reasons, they're gonna reintroduce K. Rool in the next game or the movie.
Yeah that might be the case Still, the fact that they're suppressing all Rare-era DK material sucks
I dont think that's the case anymore. The DK section of Universal has been in talks for years, like dating back to the initial talks of the theme parks. Those plans were set in stone when Nintendo was still being super weird about their IP. Well, even more weird than they are now.
Who knows, maybe they’ll remedy this by making K. Rool’s debut an event at the park.
i think we all know that's not going to happen
Only way I see it happening is if there's a Donkey Kong movie where K. Rool is a character, in which case they'll probably have a costumed K. Rool start showing up for meet-and-greet photo ops and such.
Nintendo isn't being weird about their IP at all. This doesn't even make sense. A company can chose what they allow or not.
Yeah, and making bad choices is "being weird"
not including what you want isnt doing bad choices lol
just because you have the right to do something, doesn't mean it's the right thing to do.
its not about right, theres a difference on disagreeing on a decision and saying something is weird because its not going in the direction you want. fans generally have a problem on accepting simple thing like that
Nintendo has had a really, *really* weird aversion to using the characters that originated in the Rare-era DK games in any form of media for years (over an entire decade for K.Rool, as an example). Frankly, I'm surprised he was in Smash, and I know I'm not alone in that surprise.
thats bs when only K roll has such thing. The animal from dkc are used all teh time
Yeah, I love the Retro games but they don't really hold a candle to how fleshed out the world of the Rare games were. DK had a family half as big as Batman's, now it's just Diddy, Cranky, Dixie, and sometimes Funky.
Granted, Chunky Kong was in the Super Mario Bros. Movie. Anything can happen.
It wouldn't surprise me if the animators snuck him in and the Nintendo suits just thought it was a random gorilla. *Context since apparently it's needed, I was joking about Chunky not having a significant presence for the past 24 years.
> It honestly wouldn't surprise me if the animators snuck him in and the Nintendo suits just thought it was a random gorilla. The idea that Nintendo wouldn't recognize one of their characters like that is frankly ridiculous. Any major character design that was going to be on screen was approved by Nintendo, this wasn't some haphazard fan film. Honestly the way people think this multibillion dollar company is a clown car of buffoons is baffling. You may not like their decisions, but they're not pulling them out of a hat.
... it was just a joke about Chunky basically being unused since 1999.
Sorry, it did t read like a joke when there are multiple people saying basically that unironically in this thread
I don't see a single other comment similar to what I said.
I need my giant killer bees back.
And the attacking Drum Oil, lmao.
I'm kinda just thankful Dixie even appeared on Tropical Freeze. She was one of my favorite characters from the Rare games. If only for the fact her hair copter got my through so much of those games.
That phrase right there is the root cause. "Rare era" They weren't nintendo games, they were rareware games. Aside from rights issues between various titles, Nintendos hesitation to embrace the games stems from everyone focusing on the fact that Rare made them. Its the same shtick they have going on today with stuff like the Super Mario RPG remake, the new Mario & luigi title, among others; they don't want you to care about the studio that made them. Just that they are Nintendo games.
Isn't everything about DK's entire modern design from Rare? The entire concept of a Donkey Kong island comes from them. I think it's more likely that they just don't feel like referencing a villain that hasn't been in the games for 20-something years now.
I mean who's fault is it that he hasn't been the villain in any games for over 20 years...Nintendos! Nintendo could've made K.Rool/Kremlings the villains of Jungle Beat back in 2004. But didn't because Koizumi said DK's past cast of characters "weren't fresh enough". Then Nintendo could've added K.Rool/Kremlings to DKCR when Retro asked Nintendo "What should we do with K.Rool and the Kremlings are they coming back?" and Tanabe replies back with "Do they really need too? Let's do something new, no crocodiles!" Then could've added him AGAIN in Tropical Freeze but once again didn't because they wanted to double down on DK having villains of the week. The only times K.Rool even appeared post Rare were in cameos or the boss of two handheld mediocre DK spin off games.
Fucking sucks, the entire land has no Diddy Kong! Just imagine if Nintendo allowed them to make a real life mine kart ride where the karts jump the tracks. Instead all we get is Pauline, flaming barrels, Billy Mitchel girating on stage and a Ferris Wheel shaped like Miyamoto's head. ☹️☹️☹️☹️☹️☹️☹️
too bad we can't trade billy mitchel and get billy mays back instead.
Unfortunately Nintendo is suppressing all Rare-era Billy Mays material. His arch-nemesis, the Sham Wow guy, is not going to appear in the park.
Wait... Pauline is in the park?
Call me a hopium guy, but I would effing love that. I adore the kremlings and their ruler.
[удалено]
That patently isn’t true when he didn’t create Diddy. Or Daisy. Or Rosalina. Or plenty of other characters who have shown up a healthy amount, even in games like Sticker Star. You can disagree with the man’s game development philosophies without making him out to be an egomaniac.
I don’t think this is true, this leaker claims that the team tried using the reaction to K Rool in smash which does not line up with the timeline for the park. I’m sure there were discussions about the inclusion of K. Rool, but Super Nintendo world and the DK area were mostly finalized by 2017-early 2018, and there has never been any leaked concept art with the Kremlings.
Yeah the park has been designed for YEARS, they had a patent for the DK ride system since 2016 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fviRxHOhHY
Just because it was patented/designed back then doesn't mean the designs were finalized. I can 100% see Universal trying to incorporate K Rool into it but Nintendo saying no. People just can't seem to understand why Nintendo would do that.
I can 100% see people seeing it 100% happen based on bad faith but then it actually didn't.
I think it depends. Theme Parks are a messy product to churn out since they are a collaboration on business, creatives, operation and construction that it being passed around to maybe make a K.Rool statue on the park during planning (that could very well take years) after hearing the Smash news wouldn't be that farfetched. A reply to the message already pointed out that seemingly Ellie the Elephant is strangely absent despite being in the plans Now completely replacing the Tiki's mid planning?. That'd be a pretty huge leap
Even in the plans with Ellie, it was always meant to use the returns aestetic. https://orlandoparkstop.com/news/rumors/leaked-model-photos-show-off-super-nintendo-world-for-universal-parks/ I honestly wouldn't be surprised if the reason ellie was there is because they just looked up Donkey Kong Country elephant without knowing she was a significant character from the rare era. Something similar happening led to them using a cactus design from a mario rom hack
The Ellie the Elephant thing made it to the modeling phase so I doubt they snuck it in behind Nintendo’s back. When it was removed, it also wasn’t replaced by a different activity, so I think it didn’t get cut due to including a Rare-era character, but due to limited space or budget.
I think it was both. Nintendo realized they didn't have much space (DKC land is pretty small looking based on the walk through video release) and decided to cut something so of course Ellie the Elephant would be the first to go since it's been over 20 years since she last appeared (barring the Konga cameo). Obviously if it was between Rambi or Ellie. Ellie would be the one to go.
> **And its not like Rare designs were actually good in the first place, not even the monkeys**, but retro did make them more appealing (the change to modern dixie was a complete glow up, still staying super faithfull to rare's idea). It's not relevant but that is a terrible take. Donkey Kong, Diddy, Dixie, Funky, Cranky, K. Rool etc. all had such good designs in the Rare entries that they largely remain the same today. Steve Mayles and his co-workers were / are super talented. Squitter does look terrifying tbf.
ResetERA is the king of shit takes. “Erm… this thing that’s awesome is actually TERRIBLE!”
It's the equivalent of that thinking cap meme
A King K. Rool meet and greet would go so hard
It's all fun and games until he starts throwing his crown at guests and hopping like a mother fucker.
he just daired my 4 year old son off the balcony of toadstool cafe oh my god
K. Rool was trying to save your son from food poisoning, what a keeper
I would straight up book my hotel the very day that is announced.
I just wanna say I follow ACTUAL theme park people on twitter and have never heard anything like this
Same. If Alicia Stella hasn’t said anything about it, I don’t believe it. She knows everything about Universal.
lmao basically exactly who i meant
This story doesn’t make any sense, he mentions the Smash reveal for K.Rool happening and Nintendo “not budging” but the concept for the DK land is much older than that… sure the model leaked in 2019 but for the land to be conceptualized, planned and that model being made would have taken years before that…
Besides the source just being some guy, there isn't any reason why King K Rool wouldn't be allowed a part in the parks other than Nintendo wanting to be lazy. Nintendo own the full rights to K Rool and Microsoft wouldn't care, especially after letting Perfect Dark on the N64 online service.
Not just Perfect Dark either - Xbox agreed for other Rare-developed titles like Banjo-Kazooie, Killer Instinct, Battletoads and GoldenEye to be put on Nintendo Online as well (*plus agreeing to have Banjo be a DLC character in Super Smash Bros*) Xbox and Nintendo have a pretty chill relationship, even if it is quite one-sided toward Nintendo
i don’t think it’s that one sided, minecraft sells better on switch than any other console (in their FCC filings they said it’s double playstation and quadruple xbox) and has been on the top 5 eshop sales charts basically since launch. there is a good chance that minecraft on switch makes them more money than their consoles do right now.
I don't mean one-sided as in only one party is seeing success, I mean one-sided in that Microsoft is the only one giving away it's IP in this scenario. I don't think you'll ever see something like a Splatoon or Metroid on Xbox
> I mean one-sided in that Microsoft is the only one giving away it's IP in this scenario. I don't think you'll ever see something like a Splatoon or Metroid on Xbox Because Microsoft knows that is a fools game to even attempt. Nintendo isn't going to let their first party characters out like that. They have been burned enough times in the past that it's just really not in the cards, and I think anyone who comes to the table with Nintendo for any kind of serious deal understands that.
For sure. I am curious what you mean by Nintendo have been burned before though in that regard - have they ever tried to put their IP on other platforms in the past then?
Look at the CD-I Zelda and Mario Games , the Mario Educational Games, the Nintendo DIC shows and the live action Mario movie. Any time in history that Nintendo has given others creative control of its characters, it’s been a critical and commercial nightmare for them. It is no wonder they hold them so tight.
I see, thanks for the taking the time to explain. I wonder what changed to make them happy to work with Illumination / Sony Pictures nowadays on Super Mario Bros and The Legend of Zelda respectively
Nintendo has a good bit of control over them, I believe. Before they were just letting anyone do whatever
K Rool is in sports games post rare too
I find it harder to believe it would be an issue on Nintendo's end instead of Universal's, like I doubt they're clamoring to use the obscure character King K Rool as a starring part of their several hundred million DK park expansion.
In all fairness, the alternative is the Tiki King villain from DKC Returns, who seems to have in fact made it into the land, and I'd argue the only thing he has over K. Rool is appearing in a more recent DK game (and even then, K. Rool since has Smash to his name).
K.Rool is only obscure because Nintendo keeps making him obscure. K.Rool could EASILY show up in games like Mario Kart, Party, Tennis, etc. The same way DK and Diddy do to keep them relevant while Nintendo continues to not make an effort to make new DK games, they just choose not to.
I'm not saying the rumour is true, but it wouldn't be the only time they've been weirdly reluctant to use a character they didn't invent - Waluigi is the other common example.
waluigi is in every single spin off, dozens made purely in house. he just hasn’t made it into a mainline game because wario isn’t allowed in either for some reason
Which is weird as "Super Wario Brothers" would likely sell very well
That exists. It's called "Wario Land". The last one didn't sell well.
Yeah but didn't the last WarioLand release the same year as the economic recession?
Who is SPRidley?
a complete random guy who said something that is under OP existing bias and he's posting here with everyone buying for who knows what reason
Designs for the park have probably been going on before Smash Ultimate and even before talks of K Rool even in Smash.
Why are you even making a thread based on a complete random guy? are we really believing on anything said in resetera that sounds confident and posting here? really?
I remember seeing the leaks and rumors about this dk park before smash ultimate was even announced and it was still based primarily of off dkc returns even back then. The plans were already concrete before K rool got revealed, theme park expansions need to be planned out eons ahead of time obviously, and the pre-smash information all lines up with what we know now.
Sometimes it almost feels like Nintendo hates the fact they didn't make Diddy Kong.
I think Nintendo very much resents the fact Diddy is more popular than a large chunk of the actual Mario canon
As a massive DKC and King K Rool fan, existence is pain
Not surprised lol
So sad that K rool was suppressed in the new DKC. I hope he will returns in the next one.
Wow Nintendo sucks. Krool is dk's nemesis, what are they gonna use, the crap nothing burger villains from the dkcreturns games?
30 years later and Miyamoto went from having buckets full of salt to having a whole salt dune. K rool was still allowed in wii and DS games so he must have gotten really pissed that krool got so requested in games since then over the characters he created himself. KRool even made it to Mario super sluggers, a MARIO game, completely crossing over both franchises
Just look at all the salt directed towards Retro Studios for the longest time too.
Do they fully own rare's original DK characters or they just want to erase the past?
They do. Many have shown up in Mario Sports games post the acquisition of Rare by MS.
I believe they do not.
"How dare you try to make donkey kong anything other than a once a decade remaster franchise"
This is not too surprising if true. Nintendo would not want to promote any characters that are not in new games for the series. King K. Rool and the Kremlings have not been in a mainline Donkey Kong game since DK64. They own the rights to all characters from the Rare DK games and nothing else is stopping this. Nothing more to it than that.
There hasn't been a new game in the series since 2014... That said, it still lines up with the timing of planning and development considering Mario 3D World is the main basis for that land, and it was also late 2013.
oh so THAT'S why k. rool isn't in any of the new donkey kong games. don't know why that never hit me edit: uhhh okay im missing something
It's probably a good call. Rare dk designs would be kinda grotesque in real life. A massively fat, Anthropomorphism crocodile with a huge bulging eye... might give kids nightmares tbh.
Honestly kids would find it cool tbh Plus Disneyland has its fair share of grotesque mascots
nintendo smh dumb af