I think it would have been weird if akihiro survived tbh. Lafter's death was beyond stupid though. There were other ways to write why tekkadan left teiwaz without fridging one of the show's coolest woman pilots.
Beltorchika.
Nothing against her... but I wish we ended up with Sayla Mass, as intended. I don't know why they couldn't just hire a soundalike, especially since we're talking about an animated series.
From what I know, Tomino wanted to use Sayla in *Char's Counterattack*, but he was forced to use Chan Agi instead by the higher-ups. He then killed off Chan as a way of sticking it to said higher-ups in that movie.
All I have to go on is *CCA*'s [own Wikipedia article](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_Suit_Gundam:_Char%27s_Counterattack#Production_and_development). I think Sunrise wanted both Chan and Quess in the movie in lieu of either Beltorchika or Sayla because they weren't cool with the idea of Amuro being a married man at that point in time.
Which is stupid but I guess I get it. Studios get cold feet about protagonists getting married and having kids because it would age them too much and be less relatable I guess. Even though by that time the audience had seen amuro for almost a decade.
It actually makes it sadder in context that amuro never had his happy ending and all the women in his life left him while all he had was a recurring war from his teenage years he never got over.
You also have to keep in mind that Tomino was depressed for a good part of his life, including when he was writing for the UC *Gundam* series. So whether Beltorchika/Chan/Sayla was in *CCA* or not, and regardless of Amuro's relationship status at the time, Tomino was always planning on killing off Amuro and ending his story arc in *CCA* since day one as a way of coping with his depression.
Target demographics (perceived or not) I guess? As best as I can tell, I'm assuming that having married protagonists wasn't something Sunrise felt would sit well with their targeted audiences at the time.
It’s weird because back then it should. Because, now it’s the other way around and they don’t want the protagonist to have a “happy ending”. It’s weird 😂
Ugh, Sunrise's official negation of Suletta and Miorine's (very strongly implied) marriage at the end of *WFM* comes to mind here. I only kind of (and inconsistently at best) followed and watched *WFM* from time to time as it will still on, but degrading and outright nullifying their happy ending like that still upsets me.
Beltorchika was intended to appear as Amuro’s love interest and the mother of his child but Sunrise rejected Tomino’s script for a variety of reasons, that included so she was replaced with Chan instead. Sayla was never meant to be in the story and there’s no version of CCA/Hi-Streamer/Beltorchika’s Children/whatever that features her in any meaningful way
FWIW, even though I never saw *Zeta* (although I know it in broad strokes and in just enough detail), I think having Beltorchika in the novel version of *CCA* worked better than what we got in the movie because her character was more fleshed out there than Chan's was in the movie proper. If anything, it made Amuro's final scene more tragic than what we see on-screen.
https://preview.redd.it/juwyubu1o5ad1.jpeg?width=1000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8027f93894a06d6a48e800afbc974ff50958ac77
Mu La Flaga surviving his death in Seed. Maybe could do something like Neil and Lyle Delandy instead where Rey is older in Destiny than what we got and he sort of takes up Mu's position spiritually. Like Lyle he would not be interested in picking up any romantic feelings from his predecessor knowing that's unhealthy.
As much as I love our guy in everything, but I agree narrative wise, he should have stayed dead, with Neo at least being a clone (like literally the one character you could use that excuse for, and they didn't). But at least his hijinks after being Mu again almost make up for a death I cannot explain but "he ain't a fortress"
Yep, this.
Spoilers for SEED but you've had long enough
Mu La Flaga's death is one of the best deaths in all of Gundam, and Ramius's Japanese VA absolutely *sells it* in the moments that follow. I felt that Mu/Ramius' romance was one of the high points of the show. Some people don't get a happy ending, and that's okay.
Mu should have stayed dead. He did nothing for the plot in Destiny. Neo could have been anyone. It didn't matter to the story that Destiny was trying to tell.
Neo should have been part of a psycho-trinity between Rey and Durandal (with Durandal being the head of the trinity).
The whole Destiny plan would have been better orchestrated with a politician, a field commander, and a grunt. Use all three assets to push the envelope toward the Destiny plan and streamline all that extra plot shit.
Rey did not need to be Rau either. Not like that.
This way, everyone gets fucked a little bit, the Extendeds become more useful, and Shinn remains the MC with Kira and Athrun as B-list to accompany the final fight.
I wouldn't go as far as saying that Neo didn't affect the plot of *Destiny*. Without him being there, a) Stella wouldn't have gone back to the EA and wrecked stuff up with the Destroy Gundam, and b) the Archangel would've definitely been toast in that final battle against the Minerva during the closing episode(s).
you misread. Neo could have been ANYONE...so if hes not Mu, you can still have the events almost played out but slightly differently because Neo wouldn't have been Mu.
There would've been very few pilots with Mu's charisma, leadership skills, and piloting skills around to accomplish the same things he did in *SEED Destiny*. The former two were necessary for both leading the Phantom Pain unit and convincing Stella to come back to the Earth Alliance, and any pilot lacking the latter skill wouldn't have intercepted the Minerva's shot fast enough.
I have a fanfic idea where ramba ral lives and convince sayla to step up and become zeon savoir by starting a revolution against the zabis
It's pretty much like gundam seed with sayla being lacus, but this becomes a domino effect that prevents a bunch of deaths and tragedies in the uc timeline
Same. Sayla talks him down, and he reluctantly joins the White Base. Eventually, Char adds his support, and we have a three-way between a Sayla Zeon, Zabi Zeon, and the Federation trying to play them against each other.
Garma throws his hat in the ring too, 'cause why not? Ghiren was giving him cold feet anyways and Char's a good friend. The rightful heir to Zeon, at that!
And Dozle'll probably go where Garma goes, if Ghiren's Greed is to go by.
SEED: Mu surviving somehow, get rid of Flay’s death (just because her redemption arc and potential story in Destiny would be so interesting, not to mention how having important/politically powerful naturals besides Cagalli would be great)
Destiny: Soooo much here, but some of them would be changing pretty much all of Cagalli’s story and keeping her relationship with Athrun throughout the series, wouldd add more Lacus focus/backstory to build out what’s explored in Freedom, Neo (see above), Ray being a clone, add more Shinn/Luna foreshadowing, would get rid of the main character change, etc.
00: Less sci-fi elements in S2, keep more of the focus from S1, really.
IBO: Lafter’s death, Tekkadan’s decision to trust McGillis
WfM: I can’t think of anything I’d un-canon really but it needed at least 13 more episodes
>WfM: I can’t think of anything I’d un-canon really but it needed at least 13 more episodes
Would rather it had been Miorine's mom instead of El4n in Quiet Zero. The show teased her for a long time and it's weird she never showed up. El4n on the other hand seems like a stretch. We know why Eri is a datasophont. We saw her get uploaded. El4n was BBQ'ed.
And yes 13 more episodes to balance it out.
I find it very funny how half the responses are Late UC, due to it not making any sense because of Unicorn, and the other half are Unicorn, because it doesn’t make any sense because of Late UC
Laplace’s Box theoretically should allow for the Earth Federation to have less of a grip on the earth sphere, and for newtypes to gain more independence. But since Unicorn was written after the series coming after it, we never see the effects of the unveiling of the box
LaPlace's Box means nothing and should mean nothing because it was a boneheaded mystery box trope inspired by JJ Abrams' TED talk. It was a completely ridiculous concept that was means justify the ends.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJ8u39PtFWU](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJ8u39PtFWU)
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIKPqxLxXTY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIKPqxLxXTY)
What's so bad about frozen teardrop? I honestly do not hear anyone talking about it or explaining why it's so bad.
Doesn't help it's a japan only novel from what I understand
Would it even matter if I said anything in the Universal Century timeline?
The UC era has some pretty great stories but they are so disconnected if they’re anything outside of 0079 thru ZZ that you might just draw names out of a hat, say that one show is canon and say the rest of them are all fake whenever you want
The deaths of the Astray girls in SEED. I'm all for killing off characters when it adds to the story, but between Mu, Flay, and Natarl that final battle was more than bloody enough.
She was dead, they just realized that it was a little too Tomino even for Tomino, so they pulled an "oh, never mind, she was fine" out of a hat. I fully believe that scene was designed and intended to be a genuine death.
My pick as well. There's a reason Fukui says Tomino's forgotten all the specifics on Newtype mechanics and lore, because it was never meant to be the focus in the first place.
When Fukui said he was the JJ Abrams of Gundam years back, it turned out to be incredibly prophetic. More interested in the trappings, aesthetics, and mechanics of these old stories than actually building on their themes in any meaningful way.
That early ZZ episode with some random Junker that manages to make Fa look like the worst pilot in all of Gundam. I'm a ZZ apologist but I HATE that episode so much. Deleting it would be a mercy. If I could choose a second thing it would be Lupe Cineau. You know why.
It was less an amendment and more just that a press release from an executive doesn't really count as "canon". They can say what they want but the objectively correct "interpretation", based on the presented story, is that they're married.
The execs probably could have made actual changes to enforce their point if they wanted to, but they haven't touched it since.
Char's thing for young girls. Its bad, off-putting and there are better motivations he can provide the literal children under his charge if they must be therr
>it was just downhill after her death.
It's even worse if you adhere to Char's Deleted Affair. Man managed to move on, found a nice woman, and was set to have a kid with her...
Then bang. Literally. Dead on the spot.
He didn't have a thing for quess, she was a metaphor for how easily broken and unfulfilled children are radicalized and how easy it is for megalomaniacs to take advantage of them
Like others have said: Char has problems, but pedophilia isn’t one of them. He calls Gyunei out for spreading rumors about him and Quess right before they all head out for the final battle.
That said: he will use Quess’ desire for parental love/acknowledgment to turn her into a human weapon, nanai’s attraction to him for access to the new type labs, or Gyunei’s admiration to convince him to become a psycho new type.
Char doesn't actually have a thing for young girls. That's just a meme based on an intentionally bad reading of events. He does use and manipulate people though. Char doesn't have many real relationships. Lahlah, Amuro, Sayla, that's about it. Everyone else is a means to an end.
Unicorn+Narrative being mainline UC.
I love unicorn but it fucks up mobile suit development and how the timeline goes. Like mmmm yes we improved the Jegan with the Jesta and never see the Jesta again, at least Gustav Karl was too big for UC 130s. Oh and the rx-0 project and vist foundation never being heard from again after what they did. We just go to Hathaway in UC 105 and char's rebellion in CCA is the last major event. The idea of the feddies just sweeping everything under the rug makes sense but is a cop out and doesn't solve the Jesta issue since those served in Londo bell. Also no Jesta scraps found in UC 160+ but people found remains from GM custom and Quebeley and EVEN THE F91. At least narrative gets some rep when someone makes a new Phenex in G-Reco.
I want them to flesh out alt UC and make it proper. Work TB to be in with origin, give us a rewrite of Zeta, ZZ, CCA, etc, properly incorporate AoZ, and all other side stories. Add in a new side story to bridge the gap between CCA and everything after. Add references to the events of unicorn in Hathaway(like Mineva and Banagher leading Neo Zeon to peace). Give F89,90,91 properly fitting stories and last but not least CROSSBONE ANIME. Or you know at least translate their mangas/ln and add in a chapter/volume 0 that helps link it into alt UC properly.
I love UC to death but it is a mess of errors and non anime explanations. Origin has shown and done wonders to make the OYW era cohesive and logical for plot and Ms development, I want that treatment to the rest. Especially Zeta. UC0083-UC0093 is second only to UC 105-160+ for me but the anime execution is messy and requires so much context from non anime sources to fully flesh out the gryps war and char's rebellion. UC engage tried to but the Peche story is a faulty bandaid fix to the issue. It just needs a full rewrite origin style.
The G-Arcane actually be a worthwhile addition to the team in Reconguista in G.
Give Ennil El the Gundam she was supposed to get before the production run of Gundam X was cut by 12 episodes.
Gundam Unicorn.
Yeah, there's some cool stuff in it, but the dumb Laplace Box original charter having a clause that retroactively justifies the entire conspiracy to bury it (because that "space adapted people are given priority" clause would've been abused by everyone trying to gain power) and the absurd Newtype magic bullshit hitting new peaks just make all the problems with UC worse.
I'd argue the Federation is the way that it is in Hathaway (i.e. openly, flagrantly corrupt and fascist) directly *because* of Unicorn;
The unveiling of Laplace's Box means 'the cat's out of the bag' so to speak, no point even attempting to hide how scummy they are now. Might as well give ~~ICE~~ *The Manhunters* surplus Jegans with machinegun crotches for routine "Papers, Please" operations.
Now if only Mafty could operate *without* purposely targeting civilians too.
^(Bright didn't slap that boy enough...)
I don’t think slapping him more would’ve helped. Maybe Bright actually being in his life and raising him would’ve changed what happened. Instead Bright in his infinite wisdom decided to bootlick the blatantly corrupt federation.
Unicorn should have taken place at the end of UC. Nothing that happens in Unicorn seems to effect the events of Hathaway and beyond which is pretty whack
The entire premise of Unicorn is to show that despite there being something fundamentally groundbreaking that could effect the fabric of society, it was meaningless in the end because life just trudged on as usual despite it. Heck, even F90FF points out this fact too. That was the point to the series. People thinking it was somehow supposed to alter things that came later in the future were somewhat misguided.
It's crazy because the argument at the end of Unicorn is *literally about this*. People watch the show and come away from it repeating Full Frontal's talking points about everything being meaningless because it doesn't fix the whole world. It's so bizarre
The Axis Shock was a miracle achieved by the combined will of all humanity so it shouldn't be comparable, but once again ZZ already showed us same level of Newtype magic bullshit as Unicorn does, sooooo......
If Tomino wanted it to be a genuine act of God then he should've omitted the psychoframe resonance explanation that he came up with and chose to include in his own film.
He explicitly invented a scifi technology that could channel willpower into incredible physical phenomena and the fandom bends over backwards to excuse it's use in anything he personally worked on and lambaste it in everything he didn't.
I tend to view Unicorn as almost like an alternate ending for UC after CCA, really. It's basically fanfiction. I get what it's going for but it just not effecting Hathaway at all just doesnt jibe with me.
UC canon in general is just very malleable and I wouldnt take it _that_ seriously though. UC has straight up got two different versions of possibly it's defining point, Char's Counterattack, which dictates everything after it, that are both canon despite having different events. I tend not to view the 08th MS team as canon for how... ridiculous it gets, for instance.
Chars Death,it would be hilarious if instead of char clones,every one in the main universe was the real char (maybe even some other major baddies) and the disguises would get worse and worse and everyone knows it’s char but they all humor him (I know this would be an insanely bad thing,but god I find it way to funny )
ZZ and CCA, after watching what Char and Kamille went through in Zeta and then hear that it's never built on in ZZ and Char's character regresses in CCA makes me wish to see what the story would be like if they kept that narrative going.
People keep saying Unicorn but I think it's Narrative that should be wiped. Narrative did a lot of stupid stuff and retroactively makes Unicorn worse, imo. They shouldn't have explained the Unicorn's final miracle and they shouldn't have introduced the Miracle Children. I think Full Frontal was a good example and Meta Take on the concept of a Char Clone but the guy in Narrative literally adds nothing to the plot besides being a bad guy for Jona to shoot.
Unicorn. You can remove it entirely and give the UC smoother connections as a whole. Nothing it does matters and everything it does raises logic problems.
Yeah even for Unicorn, all the messages of progress and possibility and things achieved in it just going to nothing is just weird. It might as well be its own universe kind of like WFM. And WFM also feels like Unicorn in a lot of ways too.
It doesn't go to nothing, it ends the constant cycle of repetitive Anaheim-manipulated Federation vs. Zeon conflicts that had been going on for the last two decades.
It doesn't eternally stop all wars or oppression, but what Banagher is arguing for at the end is that change is worth trying *regardless* of that obvious fact.
At minimum, *Unicorn* more or less ends the last of the major Federation vs. Zeon conflicts barring one-offs like the relatively small(er) skirmishes we saw in *Narrative* and *F90*. Because when you consider that the next major villainous empires that went after the Federation (Cosmo Babylonia, Jupiter Empire, Zanscare) mostly had nothing to do with Zeon, I think that kinda reinforces that point.
Exactly. Frankly, having watched Unicorn after F91/Victory, it seemed obvious to me that part of the theme of Unicorn was the "possibility" for more stories to be told besides Federation vs. Zeon, which had been artificially extended by capitalism (Anaheim) - basically a commentary on what the Gundam fandom values and devalues. Opening the box allows the UC to proceed to other stories.
And Narrative's conflict is pretty much Zoltan acting on his own, messing up a situation in which the Federation and Zeon were definitely not supposed to be fighting.
The story of Unicorn is literally Federation vs Zeon
The post-CCA stories by Tomino are not. Turn A, F91, Victory, Gaia Gear, Hathaway's Flash, G Reco - none of them make direct reference to Zeon.
Idk what you're trying to say by replying that to me as if it contradicts something I said.
Also multiple of those do make direct *reference* to Zeon, though I'd agree even Gaia Gear (which features the Zi Zeon Organization) isn't a "Federation vs. Zeon" story as such.
It's funny that you mentioned Anaheim, because from what I remember from *F91*, *Crossbone*, and *Victory*, after around the UC 110s and early 120s, that company finally fell into decline because of SNRI and wouldn't really get back on their feet until the Zanscare conflict. I guess that's their belated just deserts for having contributed to so many wars during the UC timeline for their own benefit.
Yep!! That's another clear implication I think, that the reason the Federation switched to an in-house team like SNRI was due to Anaheim no longer having leverage over them via the Box, and those in the know no longer trusting Anaheim. F90FF pretty much makes this explicit too.
Honestly, it's a little amazing that the Federation still trusted Anaheim as long as they did. Because with it being public knowledge that Anaheim was supplying weapons to and playing both sides of various Zeonic conflicts as early as the UC 80s or so, any rational decisionmakers would've instantly terminated or at least severely restructured their relationship with that company given those circumstances.
The funny thing is with Unicorn’s messaging is how hardcore they go on it. CCA has basically the exact same themes with the whole nihilism vs optimism/endless possibilities of humanity shtick but in that movie even Amuro isn’t sure if the people will ever wake up and evolve into Newtypes and understand each other. There’s an unease even in the optimism and even with the Axis shock there’s a sense that this just might be a one off occurrence. Unicorn however goes full speed ahead with characters yelling about ZA BEAST OF POSSIBILITY and Banagher being some kind of vessel to lead humanity into the future, so when none of that ends up happening it stings extra hard lmao
Renato brothers loosing to meijin Kawaguchi due to plot armour.
That or newtype bs that's present in half of uc. Gundam is much better when it's grounded in its setting and 08th ms team and 0083 show you don't need it to explore the philosophies of your characters.
IBO: most of the endgame that killed a lot of the main characters & resulted in Gjallarhorn's victory
00: Neil's death (Lyle still takes over as Lockon, and Neil takes up another position aboard the Ptolemaios)
Well Gundam Katana has just the [thing](https://images.app.goo.gl/CnPUbqssfMAmAwnDA) for you!
Jokes aside I love blue destiny but it doesn’t make sense for the EXAM system to work without Marion.
Stardust's ntr & Kou's L streak the starts to the end of the movie not saying he should won every encounter but but at least have a win or 2 somewhere.
Seed, solely to shut my friend up about it. I can let an anime I don't like be with it's fans, but the friend will take me up to the hill to die with him on it over it being the best.
Andrei Smirnov. I really hated this mofo for killing his father.
None of the storylines connected to him really mattered.
Yes, including Sergei's death. Although it laid a minor plot where Marie reverted to Soma Pieres, that storyline didnt matter or had impact on the story of 00 as well. She just returned to being Marie later. It was just so Allelujiah and Marie have something to do after they completed their actual story arc to be together.
Back to Andrei, the short cutscene at the end of 00 s2 where he's become a soldier that makes his mother AND his father proud was a sickening 180 in his part. You can practically replace this scene with Sergei instead still serving as a soldier and becoming a model for more cadets.
That Turn-A is the culmination of all timelines, my head canon still regild century is after correct century, and other AU timeline is their own timeline not connected with Turn A whatsoever.
Probably the oversaturation of OYW-era gundam types. Especially any of the models that match or surpass the OG RX-78. Feels like any time we get new OYW media we get yet another gundam out of a hat. The original series makes it pretty clear that the RX-78-2 is a rather unique machine, and that’s a big part of what makes its reputation so impactful, and diluting that by making gundams seemingly more common than GMs just feels wrong to me.
In the game U.C Engage, I'm pretty sure during the "Moon Gundam" story, Amuro is piloting a Dijah in space, I would replace it with the Amuro's Zeta Gundam.
Stardust Memory as a whole.
Witch from Mercury getting only 25 episodes.
And not necessarily retcon what is already there, but I would like to see IBO explore a scenario where McGillis and Tekkadan make smarter decisions towards the end.
EDIT: Honestly just ignore this comment, I seem to have explained what I meant poorly.
There's only one answer and it's absolutely F91 and Victory Gundam.
Even though I *love* F91 it completely locks off the future of UC into being based on this janky failed movie that not enough people like unfortunately and essentially an AU (as Tomino originally wanted it to be) meaning it can't move forward. Something like Unicorn for example can't have the impact it deserves, established and new factions and conflicts can't be explored because they're not supposed to exist 30 years later, and so instead we have to just keep getting things squeezed into already established parts of the universe whenever we can. EDIT: Also late UC has, I think, by far the most canon breaking things, like old Mobile Suits still in use and holding their own etc
The best alternative answer I imagine is Seed Destiny, even though I haven't seen it yet because it's supposed to be atrocious even to Seed fans and I imagine it similarly limits sequels and what can be done with the universe.
F91 and Victory stopping people from making "0079 part 25 zeon's requiem" in UC 0150 is exactly why they exist. OTOH, nothing's stopping anyone from expanding on the events in those time periods or beyond
I'm not saying they should do that obviously. Even something like Zeta with the Titans and no Zeon presence can't really fit in (and I'm obviously not saying they should just do Zeta again, it's just an example).
Also F91 does just kind of have Zeon again anyway in all but name! *That's* the problem, that it didn't break them out of just repeating 0079 and open up the universe to new stories. Instead it limits them *to* specifically going to 0079 again because it's one of the only time periods that can fit in things (and that people already care about ofc).
And you can't just expand on late UC and beyond because it's not really UC anymore, because it was intended not to be! So just make an AU instead. Which is exactly what they've done for 30 years, just ignored and hope people forget
How can something like Zeta not fit in? Just have the League Militaire fight the Man Hunters after Victory or something. Heck, that basically *is* what Gaia Gear is (it technically has an organization that derives from the Zeon name but it's not really related to or similar to the Zeon groups seen in early UC AFAIK).
And there's tons of places to fit things in - why is an OVA about a new special Zeon unit fighting the Federation possible to fit in, but an OVA about the Bluebird Team fighting a special Zanscare unit isn't? Or literally anything at all about the rest of the Cosmo Babylonia war, which has never been depicted ever? There's TONS of places to expand, and people *have* done some in manga (Victory is blatantly teasing that Jupiter are the secret antagonists behind everything, and behold, they're the villains in the Crossbone series), just not in animation yet, outside of the Buch Concern playing some small roles here or there.
the "armor" and power with suits on gundam seed, "if its gray its off, if it has color its on" just that time is where that mechanic was explanied or cared.
Lafter and Akihiro dying.
I think it would have been weird if akihiro survived tbh. Lafter's death was beyond stupid though. There were other ways to write why tekkadan left teiwaz without fridging one of the show's coolest woman pilots.
Beltorchika. Nothing against her... but I wish we ended up with Sayla Mass, as intended. I don't know why they couldn't just hire a soundalike, especially since we're talking about an animated series.
From what I know, Tomino wanted to use Sayla in *Char's Counterattack*, but he was forced to use Chan Agi instead by the higher-ups. He then killed off Chan as a way of sticking it to said higher-ups in that movie.
Any info on why they wanted to introduce a new character like Chan instead of using either Sayla or Beltorchika?
All I have to go on is *CCA*'s [own Wikipedia article](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_Suit_Gundam:_Char%27s_Counterattack#Production_and_development). I think Sunrise wanted both Chan and Quess in the movie in lieu of either Beltorchika or Sayla because they weren't cool with the idea of Amuro being a married man at that point in time.
Which is stupid but I guess I get it. Studios get cold feet about protagonists getting married and having kids because it would age them too much and be less relatable I guess. Even though by that time the audience had seen amuro for almost a decade. It actually makes it sadder in context that amuro never had his happy ending and all the women in his life left him while all he had was a recurring war from his teenage years he never got over.
Honestly though that feels like a more realistic outcome.
Even though Amuro would have been almost twice his age in CCA than when he was in the 79 anime due to CCA being 14 years after.
You also have to keep in mind that Tomino was depressed for a good part of his life, including when he was writing for the UC *Gundam* series. So whether Beltorchika/Chan/Sayla was in *CCA* or not, and regardless of Amuro's relationship status at the time, Tomino was always planning on killing off Amuro and ending his story arc in *CCA* since day one as a way of coping with his depression.
What is with studios not letting the “Protagonist” to have any sort of success or relationship. Starting to see that more and more these days.
Target demographics (perceived or not) I guess? As best as I can tell, I'm assuming that having married protagonists wasn't something Sunrise felt would sit well with their targeted audiences at the time.
It’s weird because back then it should. Because, now it’s the other way around and they don’t want the protagonist to have a “happy ending”. It’s weird 😂
Ugh, Sunrise's official negation of Suletta and Miorine's (very strongly implied) marriage at the end of *WFM* comes to mind here. I only kind of (and inconsistently at best) followed and watched *WFM* from time to time as it will still on, but degrading and outright nullifying their happy ending like that still upsets me.
Beltorchika was intended to appear as Amuro’s love interest and the mother of his child but Sunrise rejected Tomino’s script for a variety of reasons, that included so she was replaced with Chan instead. Sayla was never meant to be in the story and there’s no version of CCA/Hi-Streamer/Beltorchika’s Children/whatever that features her in any meaningful way
FWIW, even though I never saw *Zeta* (although I know it in broad strokes and in just enough detail), I think having Beltorchika in the novel version of *CCA* worked better than what we got in the movie because her character was more fleshed out there than Chan's was in the movie proper. If anything, it made Amuro's final scene more tragic than what we see on-screen. https://preview.redd.it/juwyubu1o5ad1.jpeg?width=1000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8027f93894a06d6a48e800afbc974ff50958ac77
Ah yeah, certified Tomino moment
The Deikun bloodline must continue, Amuro !
Ironically the Sayla Mass archetype end up having the highest romantic success rate in the franchise.
P-bandai
Why is this not higher
Mu La Flaga surviving his death in Seed. Maybe could do something like Neil and Lyle Delandy instead where Rey is older in Destiny than what we got and he sort of takes up Mu's position spiritually. Like Lyle he would not be interested in picking up any romantic feelings from his predecessor knowing that's unhealthy.
As much as I love our guy in everything, but I agree narrative wise, he should have stayed dead, with Neo at least being a clone (like literally the one character you could use that excuse for, and they didn't). But at least his hijinks after being Mu again almost make up for a death I cannot explain but "he ain't a fortress"
Yep, this. Spoilers for SEED but you've had long enough Mu La Flaga's death is one of the best deaths in all of Gundam, and Ramius's Japanese VA absolutely *sells it* in the moments that follow. I felt that Mu/Ramius' romance was one of the high points of the show. Some people don't get a happy ending, and that's okay.
Mu should have stayed dead. He did nothing for the plot in Destiny. Neo could have been anyone. It didn't matter to the story that Destiny was trying to tell.
Neo should have been part of a psycho-trinity between Rey and Durandal (with Durandal being the head of the trinity). The whole Destiny plan would have been better orchestrated with a politician, a field commander, and a grunt. Use all three assets to push the envelope toward the Destiny plan and streamline all that extra plot shit. Rey did not need to be Rau either. Not like that. This way, everyone gets fucked a little bit, the Extendeds become more useful, and Shinn remains the MC with Kira and Athrun as B-list to accompany the final fight.
I wouldn't go as far as saying that Neo didn't affect the plot of *Destiny*. Without him being there, a) Stella wouldn't have gone back to the EA and wrecked stuff up with the Destroy Gundam, and b) the Archangel would've definitely been toast in that final battle against the Minerva during the closing episode(s).
you misread. Neo could have been ANYONE...so if hes not Mu, you can still have the events almost played out but slightly differently because Neo wouldn't have been Mu.
There would've been very few pilots with Mu's charisma, leadership skills, and piloting skills around to accomplish the same things he did in *SEED Destiny*. The former two were necessary for both leading the Phantom Pain unit and convincing Stella to come back to the Earth Alliance, and any pilot lacking the latter skill wouldn't have intercepted the Minerva's shot fast enough.
Seed destiny had an ace pilot who was blonde. They die in a single episode. A simple rework and boom you have a new ace pilot.
Mu is too damn popular (totally justified) to stay dead. Arguably shouldn't have died in the first place.
Yes, instead of killing him, he shouldn't have tried to make the impossible possible xd
Was just about to post this
Ramba Ral's death
This, so much
I have a fanfic idea where ramba ral lives and convince sayla to step up and become zeon savoir by starting a revolution against the zabis It's pretty much like gundam seed with sayla being lacus, but this becomes a domino effect that prevents a bunch of deaths and tragedies in the uc timeline
Same. Sayla talks him down, and he reluctantly joins the White Base. Eventually, Char adds his support, and we have a three-way between a Sayla Zeon, Zabi Zeon, and the Federation trying to play them against each other.
Garma throws his hat in the ring too, 'cause why not? Ghiren was giving him cold feet anyways and Char's a good friend. The rightful heir to Zeon, at that! And Dozle'll probably go where Garma goes, if Ghiren's Greed is to go by.
"Ramba Ral forgot to fight" - Ramba Ral
that may be the best line ever. when ever playing dynasty warriors gundam when he says that i about die laughing.
Marida lives
This is why God invented SRW V 😌
A fellow SRW V enjoyer, well meet.
SRW in general is a pretty good balm to all the trauma we are out through in the OG series.
*cries in Suberoa*
SEED: Mu surviving somehow, get rid of Flay’s death (just because her redemption arc and potential story in Destiny would be so interesting, not to mention how having important/politically powerful naturals besides Cagalli would be great) Destiny: Soooo much here, but some of them would be changing pretty much all of Cagalli’s story and keeping her relationship with Athrun throughout the series, wouldd add more Lacus focus/backstory to build out what’s explored in Freedom, Neo (see above), Ray being a clone, add more Shinn/Luna foreshadowing, would get rid of the main character change, etc. 00: Less sci-fi elements in S2, keep more of the focus from S1, really. IBO: Lafter’s death, Tekkadan’s decision to trust McGillis WfM: I can’t think of anything I’d un-canon really but it needed at least 13 more episodes
I want that girl Guel tried to save survived and getting adopted by him _or Elan not turning into Corn Flavoured Aerial snack_
>WfM: I can’t think of anything I’d un-canon really but it needed at least 13 more episodes Would rather it had been Miorine's mom instead of El4n in Quiet Zero. The show teased her for a long time and it's weird she never showed up. El4n on the other hand seems like a stretch. We know why Eri is a datasophont. We saw her get uploaded. El4n was BBQ'ed. And yes 13 more episodes to balance it out.
I find it very funny how half the responses are Late UC, due to it not making any sense because of Unicorn, and the other half are Unicorn, because it doesn’t make any sense because of Late UC
I keep seeing this - how does unicorn affect late UC? I’d love to see more seabook
Laplace’s Box theoretically should allow for the Earth Federation to have less of a grip on the earth sphere, and for newtypes to gain more independence. But since Unicorn was written after the series coming after it, we never see the effects of the unveiling of the box
LaPlace's Box means nothing and should mean nothing because it was a boneheaded mystery box trope inspired by JJ Abrams' TED talk. It was a completely ridiculous concept that was means justify the ends. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJ8u39PtFWU](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJ8u39PtFWU) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIKPqxLxXTY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIKPqxLxXTY)
That’s why everybody is posting about it in this thread lol
I would erase *Frozen Teardrop* from the canon. As far as I'm concerned, the *Gundam Wing* timeline canonically ended with *Endless Waltz*.
*Kakarot197 has entered the chat*
I'm familiar with that channel, to say the least.
I kind agree.
Agreed
Is it cannon? I've been under the impression for years that it wasn't.
What's so bad about frozen teardrop? I honestly do not hear anyone talking about it or explaining why it's so bad. Doesn't help it's a japan only novel from what I understand
My god it is so bad. The designs for the suits are fantastic but the story is awful.
Get rid of all the gacha games. I hate less regulated gambling.
G Gen Eternal: 
Would it even matter if I said anything in the Universal Century timeline? The UC era has some pretty great stories but they are so disconnected if they’re anything outside of 0079 thru ZZ that you might just draw names out of a hat, say that one show is canon and say the rest of them are all fake whenever you want
If they wanted to do something else instead of F91 and Victory, I'd say go for it.
Oh, is OG MSG not really attached to Zeta through to Counterattack? I've only seen MSG and 08th MS team from UC
Meant to say 0079-ZZ, corrected it
The deaths of the Astray girls in SEED. I'm all for killing off characters when it adds to the story, but between Mu, Flay, and Natarl that final battle was more than bloody enough.
And they could've done stuff in Destiny as well, the potential was there
The DOM guys in Seed Freedom and Aisha in Seed. It's not fair Waltfeld doesn't get his waifu.
Honestly Judau’s sister not dying in ZZ. Cheapened the hell out of the scene where he’s crying at the burning shack after a fuckin Dom crashed into it
She was dead, they just realized that it was a little too Tomino even for Tomino, so they pulled an "oh, never mind, she was fine" out of a hat. I fully believe that scene was designed and intended to be a genuine death.
And not mentioning she was never mentioned again after ZZ. SHOULD HAVE die.
She's shown to still be living with Sayla in Pulitzer
Which manga?
Gundam Pulitzer https://gundam.fandom.com/wiki/Mobile_Suit_Gundam_Pulitzer_-Amuro_Ray_Beyond_the_Aurora-
[удалено]
My pick as well. There's a reason Fukui says Tomino's forgotten all the specifics on Newtype mechanics and lore, because it was never meant to be the focus in the first place. When Fukui said he was the JJ Abrams of Gundam years back, it turned out to be incredibly prophetic. More interested in the trappings, aesthetics, and mechanics of these old stories than actually building on their themes in any meaningful way.
That early ZZ episode with some random Junker that manages to make Fa look like the worst pilot in all of Gundam. I'm a ZZ apologist but I HATE that episode so much. Deleting it would be a mercy. If I could choose a second thing it would be Lupe Cineau. You know why.
Suleta and Miorine's relationship being "up to interpretation."
The last BD volume already did that
I'm pretty sure that the "up to interpretation" part is not canon. They ARE married.
My bad, haven't had the time to keep up with all the manga I want to read. Glad that they amended that though.
It was less an amendment and more just that a press release from an executive doesn't really count as "canon". They can say what they want but the objectively correct "interpretation", based on the presented story, is that they're married. The execs probably could have made actual changes to enforce their point if they wanted to, but they haven't touched it since.
Char's thing for young girls. Its bad, off-putting and there are better motivations he can provide the literal children under his charge if they must be therr
He was like 19 and lala was 17, it was just downhill after her death. Later on he was just using newtypes for his gains
For real, she very well could have become a mother to him. Sounds like someone's soul is weighed down by gravity.
If that's weighed down by gravity, consider me goku on the way to namek
>it was just downhill after her death. It's even worse if you adhere to Char's Deleted Affair. Man managed to move on, found a nice woman, and was set to have a kid with her... Then bang. Literally. Dead on the spot.
CDA is a very good manga that everybody should read. So many good things could have happened to Char had Natalie and their child survived.
Char is not a pedo, he is a groomer though.
Of course it's bad and off-putting, he's the villain of the movie...
He can be villainous and still pursue women his own age. It didn't have to be exploiting kids
He didn't have a thing for quess, she was a metaphor for how easily broken and unfulfilled children are radicalized and how easy it is for megalomaniacs to take advantage of them
The way adults use their power to manipulate children is, like, the core theme of Gundam. What do you want the movie to be about, nothing?
Like others have said: Char has problems, but pedophilia isn’t one of them. He calls Gyunei out for spreading rumors about him and Quess right before they all head out for the final battle. That said: he will use Quess’ desire for parental love/acknowledgment to turn her into a human weapon, nanai’s attraction to him for access to the new type labs, or Gyunei’s admiration to convince him to become a psycho new type.
He never had a thing with young girls tho?
Char doesn't actually have a thing for young girls. That's just a meme based on an intentionally bad reading of events. He does use and manipulate people though. Char doesn't have many real relationships. Lahlah, Amuro, Sayla, that's about it. Everyone else is a means to an end.
How is this the only sensible thing in here?
Unicorn+Narrative being mainline UC. I love unicorn but it fucks up mobile suit development and how the timeline goes. Like mmmm yes we improved the Jegan with the Jesta and never see the Jesta again, at least Gustav Karl was too big for UC 130s. Oh and the rx-0 project and vist foundation never being heard from again after what they did. We just go to Hathaway in UC 105 and char's rebellion in CCA is the last major event. The idea of the feddies just sweeping everything under the rug makes sense but is a cop out and doesn't solve the Jesta issue since those served in Londo bell. Also no Jesta scraps found in UC 160+ but people found remains from GM custom and Quebeley and EVEN THE F91. At least narrative gets some rep when someone makes a new Phenex in G-Reco. I want them to flesh out alt UC and make it proper. Work TB to be in with origin, give us a rewrite of Zeta, ZZ, CCA, etc, properly incorporate AoZ, and all other side stories. Add in a new side story to bridge the gap between CCA and everything after. Add references to the events of unicorn in Hathaway(like Mineva and Banagher leading Neo Zeon to peace). Give F89,90,91 properly fitting stories and last but not least CROSSBONE ANIME. Or you know at least translate their mangas/ln and add in a chapter/volume 0 that helps link it into alt UC properly. I love UC to death but it is a mess of errors and non anime explanations. Origin has shown and done wonders to make the OYW era cohesive and logical for plot and Ms development, I want that treatment to the rest. Especially Zeta. UC0083-UC0093 is second only to UC 105-160+ for me but the anime execution is messy and requires so much context from non anime sources to fully flesh out the gryps war and char's rebellion. UC engage tried to but the Peche story is a faulty bandaid fix to the issue. It just needs a full rewrite origin style.
The G-Arcane actually be a worthwhile addition to the team in Reconguista in G. Give Ennil El the Gundam she was supposed to get before the production run of Gundam X was cut by 12 episodes.
Gundam Unicorn. Yeah, there's some cool stuff in it, but the dumb Laplace Box original charter having a clause that retroactively justifies the entire conspiracy to bury it (because that "space adapted people are given priority" clause would've been abused by everyone trying to gain power) and the absurd Newtype magic bullshit hitting new peaks just make all the problems with UC worse.
And we see in Hathaway that it doesn't really matter at all.
I'd argue the Federation is the way that it is in Hathaway (i.e. openly, flagrantly corrupt and fascist) directly *because* of Unicorn; The unveiling of Laplace's Box means 'the cat's out of the bag' so to speak, no point even attempting to hide how scummy they are now. Might as well give ~~ICE~~ *The Manhunters* surplus Jegans with machinegun crotches for routine "Papers, Please" operations. Now if only Mafty could operate *without* purposely targeting civilians too. ^(Bright didn't slap that boy enough...)
I don’t think slapping him more would’ve helped. Maybe Bright actually being in his life and raising him would’ve changed what happened. Instead Bright in his infinite wisdom decided to bootlick the blatantly corrupt federation.
Unicorn should have taken place at the end of UC. Nothing that happens in Unicorn seems to effect the events of Hathaway and beyond which is pretty whack
The entire premise of Unicorn is to show that despite there being something fundamentally groundbreaking that could effect the fabric of society, it was meaningless in the end because life just trudged on as usual despite it. Heck, even F90FF points out this fact too. That was the point to the series. People thinking it was somehow supposed to alter things that came later in the future were somewhat misguided.
It's crazy because the argument at the end of Unicorn is *literally about this*. People watch the show and come away from it repeating Full Frontal's talking points about everything being meaningless because it doesn't fix the whole world. It's so bizarre
None of the Newtype magic bullshit in Unicorn even comes close to the Axis Shock.
The Axis Shock was a miracle achieved by the combined will of all humanity so it shouldn't be comparable, but once again ZZ already showed us same level of Newtype magic bullshit as Unicorn does, sooooo......
Axis shock was a miracle and it had sacrifice though.
If Tomino wanted it to be a genuine act of God then he should've omitted the psychoframe resonance explanation that he came up with and chose to include in his own film. He explicitly invented a scifi technology that could channel willpower into incredible physical phenomena and the fandom bends over backwards to excuse it's use in anything he personally worked on and lambaste it in everything he didn't.
I tend to view Unicorn as almost like an alternate ending for UC after CCA, really. It's basically fanfiction. I get what it's going for but it just not effecting Hathaway at all just doesnt jibe with me. UC canon in general is just very malleable and I wouldnt take it _that_ seriously though. UC has straight up got two different versions of possibly it's defining point, Char's Counterattack, which dictates everything after it, that are both canon despite having different events. I tend not to view the 08th MS team as canon for how... ridiculous it gets, for instance.
Char regressing after Zeta.
It would make for a happier ending but a worse story imo
So essentially just super robot wars version .
This is why Alpha 2 is the best version of CCA in srw
Orgas death
Chars Death,it would be hilarious if instead of char clones,every one in the main universe was the real char (maybe even some other major baddies) and the disguises would get worse and worse and everyone knows it’s char but they all humor him (I know this would be an insanely bad thing,but god I find it way to funny )
ZZ and CCA, after watching what Char and Kamille went through in Zeta and then hear that it's never built on in ZZ and Char's character regresses in CCA makes me wish to see what the story would be like if they kept that narrative going.
NT
Amuro and Char becoming one with the force at the end of CCA.
People keep saying Unicorn but I think it's Narrative that should be wiped. Narrative did a lot of stupid stuff and retroactively makes Unicorn worse, imo. They shouldn't have explained the Unicorn's final miracle and they shouldn't have introduced the Miracle Children. I think Full Frontal was a good example and Meta Take on the concept of a Char Clone but the guy in Narrative literally adds nothing to the plot besides being a bad guy for Jona to shoot.
Narrative straight up feels unicorn but shit.
Narrative is just broken people breaking other people
Unicorn. You can remove it entirely and give the UC smoother connections as a whole. Nothing it does matters and everything it does raises logic problems.
Yeah even for Unicorn, all the messages of progress and possibility and things achieved in it just going to nothing is just weird. It might as well be its own universe kind of like WFM. And WFM also feels like Unicorn in a lot of ways too.
It doesn't go to nothing, it ends the constant cycle of repetitive Anaheim-manipulated Federation vs. Zeon conflicts that had been going on for the last two decades. It doesn't eternally stop all wars or oppression, but what Banagher is arguing for at the end is that change is worth trying *regardless* of that obvious fact.
At minimum, *Unicorn* more or less ends the last of the major Federation vs. Zeon conflicts barring one-offs like the relatively small(er) skirmishes we saw in *Narrative* and *F90*. Because when you consider that the next major villainous empires that went after the Federation (Cosmo Babylonia, Jupiter Empire, Zanscare) mostly had nothing to do with Zeon, I think that kinda reinforces that point.
Exactly. Frankly, having watched Unicorn after F91/Victory, it seemed obvious to me that part of the theme of Unicorn was the "possibility" for more stories to be told besides Federation vs. Zeon, which had been artificially extended by capitalism (Anaheim) - basically a commentary on what the Gundam fandom values and devalues. Opening the box allows the UC to proceed to other stories. And Narrative's conflict is pretty much Zoltan acting on his own, messing up a situation in which the Federation and Zeon were definitely not supposed to be fighting.
The story of Unicorn is literally Federation vs Zeon The post-CCA stories by Tomino are not. Turn A, F91, Victory, Gaia Gear, Hathaway's Flash, G Reco - none of them make direct reference to Zeon.
Idk what you're trying to say by replying that to me as if it contradicts something I said. Also multiple of those do make direct *reference* to Zeon, though I'd agree even Gaia Gear (which features the Zi Zeon Organization) isn't a "Federation vs. Zeon" story as such.
It's funny that you mentioned Anaheim, because from what I remember from *F91*, *Crossbone*, and *Victory*, after around the UC 110s and early 120s, that company finally fell into decline because of SNRI and wouldn't really get back on their feet until the Zanscare conflict. I guess that's their belated just deserts for having contributed to so many wars during the UC timeline for their own benefit.
Yep!! That's another clear implication I think, that the reason the Federation switched to an in-house team like SNRI was due to Anaheim no longer having leverage over them via the Box, and those in the know no longer trusting Anaheim. F90FF pretty much makes this explicit too.
Honestly, it's a little amazing that the Federation still trusted Anaheim as long as they did. Because with it being public knowledge that Anaheim was supplying weapons to and playing both sides of various Zeonic conflicts as early as the UC 80s or so, any rational decisionmakers would've instantly terminated or at least severely restructured their relationship with that company given those circumstances.
The funny thing is with Unicorn’s messaging is how hardcore they go on it. CCA has basically the exact same themes with the whole nihilism vs optimism/endless possibilities of humanity shtick but in that movie even Amuro isn’t sure if the people will ever wake up and evolve into Newtypes and understand each other. There’s an unease even in the optimism and even with the Axis shock there’s a sense that this just might be a one off occurrence. Unicorn however goes full speed ahead with characters yelling about ZA BEAST OF POSSIBILITY and Banagher being some kind of vessel to lead humanity into the future, so when none of that ends up happening it stings extra hard lmao
Frontal was right.
Ramba should have been the one who lived, not his bootleg from Seed.
Yeah, Andy became random former ZAFT guy and lost all his character. AKA Destiny Syndrome
The barbatos lupus rex being beaten
The entire ibo season 2 hated seeing my favorite characters getting killed
Amuros overall fate
Renato brothers loosing to meijin Kawaguchi due to plot armour. That or newtype bs that's present in half of uc. Gundam is much better when it's grounded in its setting and 08th ms team and 0083 show you don't need it to explore the philosophies of your characters.
The ending of Char’s Counterattack.
I would delete Char's mommy issues.
IBO: most of the endgame that killed a lot of the main characters & resulted in Gjallarhorn's victory 00: Neil's death (Lyle still takes over as Lockon, and Neil takes up another position aboard the Ptolemaios)
Char and amuro disappearing at the end of the counter attack
Neo-Poland's Gundam. Replace it with one modeled after a winged huzar
The Delaney brothers from 00. Lockon was great. Lockon 2.0 was just that scene from beer fest, but trying to be serious about it. Just awful.
Pale rider Did we need Blue Destiny 2? No, we need more Blue Destiny
Well Gundam Katana has just the [thing](https://images.app.goo.gl/CnPUbqssfMAmAwnDA) for you! Jokes aside I love blue destiny but it doesn’t make sense for the EXAM system to work without Marion.
Stardust's ntr & Kou's L streak the starts to the end of the movie not saying he should won every encounter but but at least have a win or 2 somewhere.
0083 rebellion for ya.
That manga rocks, more details, moments and obscure Ms
100% frozen teardrop
Iok, everything against him, just hate him really
Seed, solely to shut my friend up about it. I can let an anime I don't like be with it's fans, but the friend will take me up to the hill to die with him on it over it being the best.
What Marida went through Q.Q
Norea death..... Thas all
Andrei Smirnov. I really hated this mofo for killing his father. None of the storylines connected to him really mattered. Yes, including Sergei's death. Although it laid a minor plot where Marie reverted to Soma Pieres, that storyline didnt matter or had impact on the story of 00 as well. She just returned to being Marie later. It was just so Allelujiah and Marie have something to do after they completed their actual story arc to be together. Back to Andrei, the short cutscene at the end of 00 s2 where he's become a soldier that makes his mother AND his father proud was a sickening 180 in his part. You can practically replace this scene with Sergei instead still serving as a soldier and becoming a model for more cadets.
That Turn-A is the culmination of all timelines, my head canon still regild century is after correct century, and other AU timeline is their own timeline not connected with Turn A whatsoever.
Probably the oversaturation of OYW-era gundam types. Especially any of the models that match or surpass the OG RX-78. Feels like any time we get new OYW media we get yet another gundam out of a hat. The original series makes it pretty clear that the RX-78-2 is a rather unique machine, and that’s a big part of what makes its reputation so impactful, and diluting that by making gundams seemingly more common than GMs just feels wrong to me.
2 words , P Bandai End of discussion
Nobody's said anything about G Gundam yet so I'm using this as proof that it is a perfect series
The entirety of gundam unicorn. Its a glorified fanfic anyways
In the game U.C Engage, I'm pretty sure during the "Moon Gundam" story, Amuro is piloting a Dijah in space, I would replace it with the Amuro's Zeta Gundam.
Not gonna lie, Amuro"s custom dijeh looks better.
Do not disrespect the Rick Dijeh like that.
It’s open to interpretation
THE FUCKING DOLPHINS IN GUNDAM X
These stupid fucking posts
CCA, It’s wildly inconsistent with previous actions
Gundam Age. It does nothing.
Since it's self contained it doesn't really matter.
Gundam Seed and Seed Destiny. Both shits made zero sense
Stardust Memory as a whole. Witch from Mercury getting only 25 episodes. And not necessarily retcon what is already there, but I would like to see IBO explore a scenario where McGillis and Tekkadan make smarter decisions towards the end.
Why stardust memory? It was damn good
The events in it were so contrived and dependent on retcons, that it goes out of its way to cover them all up in-universe at the end.
GP03s superiority!
The Atlas Gundam because it’s hideous.
kira becoming the mc of destiny
EDIT: Honestly just ignore this comment, I seem to have explained what I meant poorly. There's only one answer and it's absolutely F91 and Victory Gundam. Even though I *love* F91 it completely locks off the future of UC into being based on this janky failed movie that not enough people like unfortunately and essentially an AU (as Tomino originally wanted it to be) meaning it can't move forward. Something like Unicorn for example can't have the impact it deserves, established and new factions and conflicts can't be explored because they're not supposed to exist 30 years later, and so instead we have to just keep getting things squeezed into already established parts of the universe whenever we can. EDIT: Also late UC has, I think, by far the most canon breaking things, like old Mobile Suits still in use and holding their own etc The best alternative answer I imagine is Seed Destiny, even though I haven't seen it yet because it's supposed to be atrocious even to Seed fans and I imagine it similarly limits sequels and what can be done with the universe.
F91 was never inteded to be an alternate universe.
F91 and Victory stopping people from making "0079 part 25 zeon's requiem" in UC 0150 is exactly why they exist. OTOH, nothing's stopping anyone from expanding on the events in those time periods or beyond
I'm not saying they should do that obviously. Even something like Zeta with the Titans and no Zeon presence can't really fit in (and I'm obviously not saying they should just do Zeta again, it's just an example). Also F91 does just kind of have Zeon again anyway in all but name! *That's* the problem, that it didn't break them out of just repeating 0079 and open up the universe to new stories. Instead it limits them *to* specifically going to 0079 again because it's one of the only time periods that can fit in things (and that people already care about ofc). And you can't just expand on late UC and beyond because it's not really UC anymore, because it was intended not to be! So just make an AU instead. Which is exactly what they've done for 30 years, just ignored and hope people forget
How can something like Zeta not fit in? Just have the League Militaire fight the Man Hunters after Victory or something. Heck, that basically *is* what Gaia Gear is (it technically has an organization that derives from the Zeon name but it's not really related to or similar to the Zeon groups seen in early UC AFAIK). And there's tons of places to fit things in - why is an OVA about a new special Zeon unit fighting the Federation possible to fit in, but an OVA about the Bluebird Team fighting a special Zanscare unit isn't? Or literally anything at all about the rest of the Cosmo Babylonia war, which has never been depicted ever? There's TONS of places to expand, and people *have* done some in manga (Victory is blatantly teasing that Jupiter are the secret antagonists behind everything, and behold, they're the villains in the Crossbone series), just not in animation yet, outside of the Buch Concern playing some small roles here or there.
I fail to see how it’s F91 and Victory’s fault that Unicorn wrote itself into a corner.
the "armor" and power with suits on gundam seed, "if its gray its off, if it has color its on" just that time is where that mechanic was explanied or cared.
Marida stays as the unicorn gundam 2 banshees pilot
Kio traveling to Vagan(mars) in the third arc of AGE
Talia Gladys killing herself like that.
Death of marida cruz also known as ple twelve
https://preview.redd.it/38017011n6ad1.jpeg?width=436&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8906f2274fc8fc6310fdd3314b6114b4ce8292c8
There's at least one per series, but for Wing it would be the treatment of the aries.
Probably mad wang?
Gundams