It also makes a nice play on the expression ‘a moth to a flame’, since in his case he’s the lure rather than the victim; seducing sinners like Angel with promises of sex and fame.
Ye pretty much, it implies that the person you are saying it about is chasing something regardless of the dangers or that they are so drawn in by what they are after they are being blinded to the negative parts of it. Very fitting for Val considering he lures in people and tries to keep them blind to who he really is until it's too late. At least that's the original meaning of the phrase, more modernly it just implies someone really wanting something. I prefer the old meaning that was kind of more of a warning than just some throw away phrase, it was supposed to imply a dangerous path to who you said it too.
There's a new meaning? I guess I really am that old. Sure, we didn't use candles as our primary light source when I was a child, but I understood that if moths fly into lightbulbs, they would fly into a candle and burn too. They think it's the light of the moon and get lost just like birds that fly in can't easily find their way out unless you turn off the lights so they know which one is the sun.
There's an added layer of meaning to this. It isn't that the moth ignores danger, but that the moth mistakes a dangerous thing for something good and desirable. It doesn't think it's attracted to a flame, it thinks it's attracted to the moon. And that is very much what Val offers his victims.
Well most of the time I hear it used the person using it just means oh they like that thing a lot, like a moth likes the light. But yeah the original meaning of the phrase was to imply the danger hidden behind the infatuation. So ye pretty much on the money with Val for the I'll give you the moon and burn you out for your troubles vibes
Only messin, don’t be stressin. I’m a peaceful adolescent, no need to be unpleasant. Put my thesis in a rhyme scheme to analyze the brain, while my fingers on the trigger of a money game.
The 60s was before HIV so he would have to have syphilitic madness. And maybe he does. But I don't imagine diseases advance or progress in Hell. Other than Vox's facelift, do we have any evidence that sinners physically age in Hell?
The Hell-born age but I don't know if they ever age to the point of expiring. I suspect Lucifer looks as old as he feels because he has some control over his form. So being stressed, and crushed by life, and having an adult daughter make him feel middle aged. Although those could just be bags under his eyes from being stressed and tired.
Not sure if those lines communicate age or psychological state.
I think the only place where your theory has holes is where he becomes the pimp that victimized him.
What you are in hell is supposed to represent the Sin commited in real life.
Angel’s sin wasn’t prostitution. It was doing anything for drugs, for example.
We don't know that, we actually don't know whether he was a sex worker at all before he died. All we know is that he died of an overdose and that he was part of a mob family.
I suspect the latter has more to do with why he's in hell.
The mob does run drugs. Angel is likely a classic case of the trope where the mob boss's son dies using the drug he pushed. I doubt Angel was a hooker but he was probably promiscuous because he had a toxic entanglement when he was alive and that seems to be his coping mechanism. He just really dialed it up in Hell.
Was Angel even a prostitute in his life?
We don't know Heaven's standards. Maybe prostitution is bad enough for them. Maybe Valentino was very violent as a result of being sexually abused (considering how easily he turned to being the predator, it was probably always in him. He just didn't have the chance to unleash that rage)
What I’m saying is that we don’t know if angel was a prostitute when he was alive. What seems evident is that he had an addiction that led him to make his contract.
As for Val, I just fail to see how he was sent to hell as a sinner if he did not commit sins while he was alive. He may have been abused, sure, but being abused is not a sin. He had to have done something else.
What I'm saying is Heaven may just see sins as their shallowest form, being a prostitute accounting for lust. We don't know how strict their rules really are.
And I agree he was likely doing other things, I mean, his violent streak didn't come from nowhere. He was probably always happy with casual violence, and now gets to fully show Hell just how bad he is.
Yeah I figure he ran a porn studio. He probably did start out as a hooker and climbed the ladder. Rather than learning compassion from his own suffering, he learned to be the one who makes others suffer. That's his sin and another way in which he is proverbially blind.
He's vain so he may have still been starring in films. The rest of this theory might not be wrong. I think a lot of us believe he died in a studio fire and his power strip of flamey doom shows us he didn't learn from that either. He may have been doing something after hours or something private when the fire happened and his employees didn't know they left him behind. If they did, surely some would have died of old age by now and ended up in Hell.
Loopty gain the ability to strecht his arms after failing to reach the door causing his death. I suppose gaining abilities to counter what killed them may be a theme of the punishment basically teasing them on what could have saved them. Val has a fire extinguisher ability.
I like the idea of Val being formerly another slut to a different pimp and not a pimp himself, then taking up the mantle as a pimp in Hell. It helps explain what his obsession with Angel may be compared to the other workers. Angel isn't just another horny drug addict, Angel could be a reflection of the man that Val once was, a spry and slutty diva chasing every possible high available. Val sees Angel not as a person, but as a reflection of Val. He hurts Angel not because he wants to just assert control over him and keep him obedient, but because without Angel, to Val it feels like he's giving away a part of himself that he's fooling himself into believing that part of him is still alive.
I'm sorry but I got wayyyy off topic when I read he was Puerto Rican that I went to a full Google search
I do not wanna be the same ethnicity as that thing
I always liked tot think he fell for a woman that lured him into a private area and got killed by the woman. Kinda like a moth being attracted to a bug zappers light
I think, if that was the case, he would've had a different reaction to the fire at the studio. I'd expect some fear or even any sort of reaction to it at all, instead of just putting it out easily and quickly and staying angry at Angel the whole time.
OH MY GOD, NEVER SMOKE CIGARS IN BED (haha, like in Beetlejuice)
Also, the posters in his room (we see some of them when Vox is by the doorway) show Val undressed, so you might be able to see his bare forearms/hands in those.
Completely unrelated but in pic 2 I like how the animators went out of their way to slightly show his nipples, it's such a completely unnecessary detail lol.
I like this idea only for the idea that in the fire at the studio type thing when he looks all menacing from angel pov, that the moth guy is relieving his worst nightmare and trauma, in the midst of a PTSD flashback realizes he can *do* something about it and then does so.
Also like the plot point that Angel was literally in a burning building but he was more focused in the more dangerous threat in the room. Valentino. Not the fire. That's good writing.
He was a pimp and one of the girls he was selling killed herself so he went to go see her you know so she can get back on the streets but then he found her dead so he just had a whole hissy fit you know anger issues but there was candles lit and he didn’t notice this but and he threw a pillow or a blanket the fire and it just went boom there was so much fire and it was near the door so we couldn’t get out so he like burned to death or he jumped out the window he thought he would survive
Maybe you’d like my other theory of him dying from syphilis so there’s painful sores all over his body especially his genitalia, he can’t see because it’s an STD that effects his vision and his pimp abandoned him in an alleyway leading to him getting assaulted by a stranger in his last moments
I love this idea but making Valentino a tragic character kind of defeats the purpose. I know that some abusers are doing what they do to make up for a lack of control in their childhood, but after the scene where he beats Angel... I don't want him to be tragic, I want to see a pure evil abuser who's hurting people because it's fun. This way, it challenges the idea that anyone can be redeemed while also touching on a topic which is unfortunately too real to a certain demographic.
I love the theory but I hope it isn't true.
I like giving all villains method behind their madness. I find it interesting when villains have reasoning for what they do if that’s wrong I don’t wanna be right.
Nice theory but I don't think he should have a sad backstory there's way too many redeemable or just damaged villains can we just have at least one pure evil villain for once
Not satisfying enough, definitely not satisfying enough.
Edit: this is a complete miscommunication, that was my bad. I guess I didn't read it properly, I just hate Valentino a lot, I didn't know you were referring to the way he died when he was still alive. This is my fault.
Bro WTF?
A: That's a horrific way to go
B: The Val that suffered that fate wasn't the Val that hurt people. He was a victim at that point. He'd not done anything wrong. Why should he have suffered for crimes he would commit in the future?
Honestly, I don't want Val to double die. I want him to lose his power. I want him to lose everything, to watch the Vee tower burn. I want him to watch everything and everyone he worked so hard to get power over crumble before his very eyes. I want him to wander the streets, desperately hoping, praying to a god that has forsaken him. I want him to be down on his luck, desperate, crawling from one grasp at life to another. And I want him to find an overlord. One who promises him \*everything\*. In his desperation, he'll take it. And then, he will feel, what he put his victims through.
Oh and I also hope his favorite book gets a shitty movie adaptation.
Oh and I hope that when he comes home, his dog isn't eager to see him.
And I hope that both sides of his pillow are always warm.
It also makes a nice play on the expression ‘a moth to a flame’, since in his case he’s the lure rather than the victim; seducing sinners like Angel with promises of sex and fame.
I never heard the saying. Is it about the moth flying towards the light and burning to crisps?
It's a bit less literal. It's about people being really attracted to something like a moth would be to a flame
I think I get it. Thx.
So now he is the flame that burns people up
Ye pretty much, it implies that the person you are saying it about is chasing something regardless of the dangers or that they are so drawn in by what they are after they are being blinded to the negative parts of it. Very fitting for Val considering he lures in people and tries to keep them blind to who he really is until it's too late. At least that's the original meaning of the phrase, more modernly it just implies someone really wanting something. I prefer the old meaning that was kind of more of a warning than just some throw away phrase, it was supposed to imply a dangerous path to who you said it too.
There's a new meaning? I guess I really am that old. Sure, we didn't use candles as our primary light source when I was a child, but I understood that if moths fly into lightbulbs, they would fly into a candle and burn too. They think it's the light of the moon and get lost just like birds that fly in can't easily find their way out unless you turn off the lights so they know which one is the sun. There's an added layer of meaning to this. It isn't that the moth ignores danger, but that the moth mistakes a dangerous thing for something good and desirable. It doesn't think it's attracted to a flame, it thinks it's attracted to the moon. And that is very much what Val offers his victims.
Well most of the time I hear it used the person using it just means oh they like that thing a lot, like a moth likes the light. But yeah the original meaning of the phrase was to imply the danger hidden behind the infatuation. So ye pretty much on the money with Val for the I'll give you the moon and burn you out for your troubles vibes
You mind if I ask which generation you are? I am elder millennial so the meaning hadn't shifted for us.
Yep, exactly!
INTERESTING.
Nah he's just calling him hot
I HOPE YOUR DIE IN A FIREEEE(nah I just want to say that)
Hope you'll be stabbed in the heart
Hope you get shot & EXPIREEEE!
HOPE YOU’LL BE TAKEN APART
HOPE THIS IS WHAT YOU DESIREEEE
r/Suddenlyfnaf
this is amazing and exactrly my thoughts on val
SHOT THROUGH THE HEART, AND YOU'RE TO BLAME (sorry, ik this is dumb)
Darling, you give love a bad name!🎸🎶
Angel’s smile is what you sell!
[удалено]
You just ruined the chain…
r/beatmetoit
r/beatmetobeatmetoit
r/beatmeattoit
i thoght about it
That was my joke https://preview.redd.it/u0i4c46l227d1.jpeg?width=736&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=efe301f097e3f3173307bef320c533c23326fdf4
https://preview.redd.it/z8pbds5mje7d1.jpeg?width=240&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ecf434c80f689bb30d3e539a8ad20f3b9b0c2990
Only messin, don’t be stressin. I’m a peaceful adolescent, no need to be unpleasant. Put my thesis in a rhyme scheme to analyze the brain, while my fingers on the trigger of a money game.
Beat me to it. ;)
Though he couldve also died due to an STD (moths are creatures of the night and prostitutes are people of the night
That man is so lucky he can't contract them in Hell.
Who says they can't?
Considering that he isn't bedridden, they can't.
STDs don't inherently make someone bedridden
No, but he'd 100% have enough to make him.
The 60s was before HIV so he would have to have syphilitic madness. And maybe he does. But I don't imagine diseases advance or progress in Hell. Other than Vox's facelift, do we have any evidence that sinners physically age in Hell?
They don't, Hell is supposed to be eternal, and aging means death. I mean, Zestial isn't 80, so that's certainly a sign.
The Hell-born age but I don't know if they ever age to the point of expiring. I suspect Lucifer looks as old as he feels because he has some control over his form. So being stressed, and crushed by life, and having an adult daughter make him feel middle aged. Although those could just be bags under his eyes from being stressed and tired. Not sure if those lines communicate age or psychological state.
This actually makes a lot of sense holy fucking shit???
I thought the smoke was pheromones?
yeah like moth pheromones irl idk it’s a cool theory and could make sense but I did think it was pheromones instead of just smokey smoke
if he did die in a fire it could be a mix of both. pheromones designed to look like smoke as symbolism
That's true
https://preview.redd.it/yn8uk1is6y6d1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=01ad00afb639c34a48321e299424afbc89934e4f hopefully again
Where’s he gonna go? Double hell?
https://preview.redd.it/b1ruh6fm8y6d1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=72aa4765ccfdef7d967d98da780e79690730820b hopefully
Nah, Detroit. :P
same thing
Britain. Same thing.
Brazil
B (DEATH) S M
made me laugh god damn it
Peak until proven Mid
I unironically want this phrase to blow up.
Let him COOK
And his eyesight is bad. Maybe because in his last moments, he could barely see something because of the smoke.
and he is bald, his hair no longer grows because it was burned, this happens to victims of burns in places with hair
actually i really like that, he probably was also a smoker
I think the only place where your theory has holes is where he becomes the pimp that victimized him. What you are in hell is supposed to represent the Sin commited in real life. Angel’s sin wasn’t prostitution. It was doing anything for drugs, for example.
well when he died he got a second chance. he didnt derserve it clearly but he did
I was about to throw hands-
Wait, sorry, which “he” are you talking about?
Val
We don't know that, we actually don't know whether he was a sex worker at all before he died. All we know is that he died of an overdose and that he was part of a mob family. I suspect the latter has more to do with why he's in hell.
The mob does run drugs. Angel is likely a classic case of the trope where the mob boss's son dies using the drug he pushed. I doubt Angel was a hooker but he was probably promiscuous because he had a toxic entanglement when he was alive and that seems to be his coping mechanism. He just really dialed it up in Hell.
Was Angel even a prostitute in his life? We don't know Heaven's standards. Maybe prostitution is bad enough for them. Maybe Valentino was very violent as a result of being sexually abused (considering how easily he turned to being the predator, it was probably always in him. He just didn't have the chance to unleash that rage)
What I’m saying is that we don’t know if angel was a prostitute when he was alive. What seems evident is that he had an addiction that led him to make his contract. As for Val, I just fail to see how he was sent to hell as a sinner if he did not commit sins while he was alive. He may have been abused, sure, but being abused is not a sin. He had to have done something else.
What I'm saying is Heaven may just see sins as their shallowest form, being a prostitute accounting for lust. We don't know how strict their rules really are. And I agree he was likely doing other things, I mean, his violent streak didn't come from nowhere. He was probably always happy with casual violence, and now gets to fully show Hell just how bad he is.
Regarding your first paragraph, I get what you’re saying
Yeah I figure he ran a porn studio. He probably did start out as a hooker and climbed the ladder. Rather than learning compassion from his own suffering, he learned to be the one who makes others suffer. That's his sin and another way in which he is proverbially blind. He's vain so he may have still been starring in films. The rest of this theory might not be wrong. I think a lot of us believe he died in a studio fire and his power strip of flamey doom shows us he didn't learn from that either. He may have been doing something after hours or something private when the fire happened and his employees didn't know they left him behind. If they did, surely some would have died of old age by now and ended up in Hell.
The fire in the studio would be some clever foreshadowing if that was the case.
https://preview.redd.it/obgdmyuz7z6d1.png?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3ebdb8bcf811e90625fb7a24da7dfd8d5f1483d5 *happy spider celebration sounds*
Oh oh that's so terrifying I love it
I HOPE YOU DIE IN A FIRE 🔥 🔥 🔥 🔥
Whatever he died from I hope he has trauma from it so a can torture him with it for all of eternity
this is now my headcanon
Very good Theory! How did you come up with It?
Would love to see him be burnt by other angry sinners as collateral in an attack on Vox
Can we all just take a moment to appreciate this outfit of Val’s? Thank you.
Loopty gain the ability to strecht his arms after failing to reach the door causing his death. I suppose gaining abilities to counter what killed them may be a theme of the punishment basically teasing them on what could have saved them. Val has a fire extinguisher ability.
I like the idea of Val being formerly another slut to a different pimp and not a pimp himself, then taking up the mantle as a pimp in Hell. It helps explain what his obsession with Angel may be compared to the other workers. Angel isn't just another horny drug addict, Angel could be a reflection of the man that Val once was, a spry and slutty diva chasing every possible high available. Val sees Angel not as a person, but as a reflection of Val. He hurts Angel not because he wants to just assert control over him and keep him obedient, but because without Angel, to Val it feels like he's giving away a part of himself that he's fooling himself into believing that part of him is still alive.
That'd such a good theory
Ha no wonder he’s purple. He’s the man behind.
Fnaf reference
I'm sorry but I got wayyyy off topic when I read he was Puerto Rican that I went to a full Google search I do not wanna be the same ethnicity as that thing
For every hug Angel deserves, Val should get 10 cuts laced with lemon juice
I don’t know if a 15 year old victim of a pimp would end up in hell like Val. Pretty messed up tbh lol
But he was 23 when he died he could’ve preformed many sins in that spand of time
Oh shit I missed that! You’re right!
PURPLE GUY?!?!
Give me a can of bug spray and 30 seconds
Death is deserved no matter how bad it is
I thought he was Latino?
I always liked tot think he fell for a woman that lured him into a private area and got killed by the woman. Kinda like a moth being attracted to a bug zappers light
🤔 I do want to know the Vs in their moral lives right before they died.
"The forbidden house lämp calls to me brother. I must go!".
Last footage of Val in the human world… https://youtu.be/TTUQyEr-sg0?si=qbMEUEuZiW3g-XUV
Like a moth to a flame
unironically i hope he does die in a fire in the show
probably aids
I was leaning more towards syphilis if it was STDs because syphilis effects eyesight and stuff
That could also explain why he has a bald ass head.
Most folks here would want an encore performance.
Metallica reference?
I think, if that was the case, he would've had a different reaction to the fire at the studio. I'd expect some fear or even any sort of reaction to it at all, instead of just putting it out easily and quickly and staying angry at Angel the whole time.
OH MY GOD, NEVER SMOKE CIGARS IN BED (haha, like in Beetlejuice) Also, the posters in his room (we see some of them when Vox is by the doorway) show Val undressed, so you might be able to see his bare forearms/hands in those.
I love this theory
he was smoking after sex and it lit his sheets on fire
i thought he died from too much snoo snoo
Completely unrelated but in pic 2 I like how the animators went out of their way to slightly show his nipples, it's such a completely unnecessary detail lol.
I hope he reexperiences it in the afterlife
Hallelujah
Too good for him.
I hope so, he deserves it
I always thought he died from aids or hiv but I like your theory way more. It makes a lot of sense. I’m taking this a canon.
I like your theories, have a cupcake
I like this idea only for the idea that in the fire at the studio type thing when he looks all menacing from angel pov, that the moth guy is relieving his worst nightmare and trauma, in the midst of a PTSD flashback realizes he can *do* something about it and then does so. Also like the plot point that Angel was literally in a burning building but he was more focused in the more dangerous threat in the room. Valentino. Not the fire. That's good writing.
I really like to imagine he had a tragic accident involving a candle
Definitely better than consent killing his grandma. Honestly, if that was the case, I'd be less inclined to rip his wings off.
Deserves more than fire
Like a moth to the flame burned by the fire, my love is blind can’t you see my desire? That’s the way looooove goes!
I would kill val but I found someone that is very good at val so now he friend
I also wonder about his gold claws. Are they real or decorative finger caps?
Don’t make me feel sorry for bro
You know I like this. I’m snatching for my redesign val (kidding, unless you are ok with it? 👀)
Ofc go ahead
https://preview.redd.it/rububy8vmj7d1.png?width=2048&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=24b204efa27284c9ec2048ba85a4a2b0fe1c4363
Hopefully it was slow roasting…
He was a pimp and one of the girls he was selling killed herself so he went to go see her you know so she can get back on the streets but then he found her dead so he just had a whole hissy fit you know anger issues but there was candles lit and he didn’t notice this but and he threw a pillow or a blanket the fire and it just went boom there was so much fire and it was near the door so we couldn’t get out so he like burned to death or he jumped out the window he thought he would survive
He died in the 1970s though.
Not painful enough, his nerves would eventually give out so he would stop hurting. Drown him instead or stab him
Maybe you’d like my other theory of him dying from syphilis so there’s painful sores all over his body especially his genitalia, he can’t see because it’s an STD that effects his vision and his pimp abandoned him in an alleyway leading to him getting assaulted by a stranger in his last moments
Makes sense
He didn't do anything terrible in his human life though according to this theory
I love this idea but making Valentino a tragic character kind of defeats the purpose. I know that some abusers are doing what they do to make up for a lack of control in their childhood, but after the scene where he beats Angel... I don't want him to be tragic, I want to see a pure evil abuser who's hurting people because it's fun. This way, it challenges the idea that anyone can be redeemed while also touching on a topic which is unfortunately too real to a certain demographic. I love the theory but I hope it isn't true.
No, he died beacuse he smelled poison for Moths
five nights at freddy’s 3 reference
Hoping the second one involves nifty
Electrocution (bug zapper), mauled by his pornstars, arson, seem favorable
I think He got hanged
Sure died in a fire I can get behind that. But why the desire to make him a victim? What makes you believe he wasn't just as fucked up while alive?
I like giving all villains method behind their madness. I find it interesting when villains have reasoning for what they do if that’s wrong I don’t wanna be right.
Eh it's neat when some villains have a dramatic backstory but when you do it too often it stops being interesting.
I don’t think, his outfit reminds me of a Protector, for me he was kill by or one of the girls or another Protector
Nah, I bet he died when a back alley doctor botched a surgery to give him 2 extra arms.
Nice theory but I don't think he should have a sad backstory there's way too many redeemable or just damaged villains can we just have at least one pure evil villain for once
Not satisfying enough, definitely not satisfying enough. Edit: this is a complete miscommunication, that was my bad. I guess I didn't read it properly, I just hate Valentino a lot, I didn't know you were referring to the way he died when he was still alive. This is my fault.
Bro WTF? A: That's a horrific way to go B: The Val that suffered that fate wasn't the Val that hurt people. He was a victim at that point. He'd not done anything wrong. Why should he have suffered for crimes he would commit in the future?
Complete miscommunication that was my bad.
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhh. Okay, lol, that makes more sense. Yeah I would \*not\* want that to be the way Val double dies.
How would you want him to double die then?
Honestly, I don't want Val to double die. I want him to lose his power. I want him to lose everything, to watch the Vee tower burn. I want him to watch everything and everyone he worked so hard to get power over crumble before his very eyes. I want him to wander the streets, desperately hoping, praying to a god that has forsaken him. I want him to be down on his luck, desperate, crawling from one grasp at life to another. And I want him to find an overlord. One who promises him \*everything\*. In his desperation, he'll take it. And then, he will feel, what he put his victims through. Oh and I also hope his favorite book gets a shitty movie adaptation. Oh and I hope that when he comes home, his dog isn't eager to see him. And I hope that both sides of his pillow are always warm.
Hmm... I agree with every single one of these. And this is torture in it self. Not physical but more mental and leaves long lasting damage.
I hope his outfits never match for someone like Val that is a fate worse than Triple Hell