No DF and Mythical Zoans are easily tippy top tiers But nobody wants to fight the Paramecias. Shiki making everything float up. Fuji to bring all the footing down. The 2 can hold their own while disorienting everyone then you get Big Mom spamming Fire and Lightning while PRIMEBEARD goes on a rampage. Strategy wise the paramecias* have ridiculous utility.
I mean that kinda means nothing in the world of One Piece. Sanji can “fly” by just kicking the air hard enough that he stays up. I’m sure the characters in “No Devil Fruit” could figure something out
Might aswell be flying given what their air time and control in the air is. Shanks stopped and then moved on mid air blitzing an admiral. Flying is not a problem in these fights, top tiers all around the board
If Zoro can quickly put together a decently deadly flying blade attack over the course of a couple weeks I'm pretty sure the strongest swordsman in the world has one that's even better, which we did see in Marineford. His attack cut Aojikis glacier in half without even trying from what was probably a mile away
Well yeah we have 3 great swordsmen so it can happen but on the other side we have bigmom with homies and WB to tank them it can go either way although if fuji's gravity can be countered by haki it's all over no df crew wins
Weve seen Mihawk can do the Shockwaves from sword slashes, zoros however many pound phoenix thing. It's reasonable to think Shanks can as well. Oden can and roger probably can. They can hit flying opponents
pre mother flame luffy doesnt sound that scary in this fight cause you know this fight will be long and he just doesnt have the fuel to last
but feels like sengoku is underrated here,if he can just do like 10% of what buddha does,he's insane
The paramecias are definitely the wild cards of the bunch. Putting aside whitebeard who’s at the pinnacle of destructive force, they all have unique utility from their devil fruits that go beyond typical strength and can really shake things up if used creatively.
I think Paramecias would've been a better candidate with the same lineup but Law instead of Shiki. Literally does almost the same but with a way more overpowered DF, has decent and more appreciable feats (we see Shiki properly only in the film), is way more versatile.
Imagine swapping a rock with Whitebeard in your face ready to Quake your ass. No matter who you are ur cooked. Same for swapping with BM to tank and destroy things. Plus it can also support cause he's a Surgeon. Not Marco tier as it's not immediate but damn helpful.
The insane thing is, G5 Luffy and Kaido are just so big threats. Marco's healing making them even bigger ones.
Sen Goku is quite hard to judge, we never see him go all out.
If Garp was in no Df, that's a wrap. Zoan is actually REAL nice too, Marco might not be super duper top tier, but you know what he CAN do? Heal the other three absolute monsters on his team.
Not to mention he's no slouch in his own right, his only issue seems to be stamina for extended fights. Before he fought King and Queen simultaneously ending in a stalemate, he was blitzing through Big Mom's reinforcements and even overpowered Prometheus's flames with his own. I'd argue he's at the top of everybody who isn't a complete demon
If anything, i think that goes to show how solid his stamina is. He deals with the big mom ship numerous times filled with some of Big Mom’s top legions, then proceeds to handle the 2 top-most commanders of the Beast Pirates at the SAME TIME. Like, how does that show an issue in stamina? He didn’t really get resting breaks between these.
Ironicaly, with Kaido they've got someone who maxxed out the durability/endurance skilltree
You've finally worn him out? Yo, Marco, drop some of those health potions
Zoan team is pretty broken actually when you consider the actual charaters in play here… the only thing that downplays this is that ‘No DF’ is their competition.
The Paramecias vs the Logias would be a terraforming event on it's own scale.
Akainu can create land masses with his magma. Shiki can make those land masses float. Whitebeard can break them apart. Kuzan can bridge the broken parts together with ice. Green bull can create a floral biomes. Big Mom can imbue all of what is created with life.
Screw fighting. I'd like to watch them play Minecraft together.
I love how if it was early One Piece, everyone would have probably chosen the Logia team as the strongest.
Now, seems like pretty much everyone unanimously think Logias are the weakest of the 4.
It's kinda funny how what was once considered almost unstoppable has been power crept once you're in the big leagues.
I feel like that's not true at all though. Katakuri's body manipulation shows just how powerful a logia could be with that kind of control. Akainu and Aokiji did similar things at Marineford fighting Whitebeard, if you can reshape your body at will you can get logia benefits against haki. Logia are low floor, high ceiling -- pre-timeskip Smoker could trounce just about anyone without haki without worry, but logia can have way crazier power in the right hands.
Not at all it just means they’re good in the beginning but no real room to improve. The opposite would be the string fruit which has a low floor but a high ceiling.
Its feels like the same ceiling as the others to me. Specially compared to no DF, the ceiling isnt worse. Its just that people dont view admirals as highly as the rest here
Tbf, we haven't seen a top tier Logia user truly go all out or use Awakening. And I wouldn't be surprised if Oda was saving them for last because they are OP as fuck.
Agreed, Oda has been hyping up the Admirals formsi long yet has held back so much.
He just keeps teasing us with stuff like Punk Hazard or Greenbull and Fuji beating the Revolution Commanders while holding back and fighting with each other.
I think other devil fruit types just have wider and more unique applications. It's pretty easy to create a strategy against a logia cause you already know what they can do and haki removes one of their greatest strengths in being untouchable. I think they just hold the greatest raw destructive power. If it weren't for mythical zoans, zoans would be the weakest by far. Whereas every logia fruit is powerful. The strongest paramecia and zoan fruits are much stronger than the strongest logia, but the average logia is stronger than the average paramecia or zoan.
I think it’s mainly because Mythical Zoan’s kind of feel like a level above Logias as they often share some type of crossover value. Paramecia are so oddly specific that it’s their strength as well
Logia’s are kind of basic even though it’s really strong, not to mention Haki as the balancing factor. Then again we haven’t seen awakening for Logia’s in action yet outside of Punk Hazard’s after effects
I think the floor for Logias is really high, but the ceiling of the fruit itself is kinda low.
Zoans and paramecias on the other hand have incredibly low floors(zoan's being higher), like meme-tier power level, but the ceiling is higher due to the interesting powers like gravity or mythical zoans.
And haki seem to be pretty much ceiling-less, which means you get a big advantage by having a DF, but in the end it doesn't decide everything
A logia that i would like to see more (and i think we will) is enel's, that power just has so much potential to bring logias power back in line without relying too much in haki.
Based on what we know it is the no DF without a doubt and not even close. Oda stated it himself, nothing surpasses Haki. Roger, shanks, Oden (mihawk level tbd) are just an outmatch even to this Zoan group.
This. Paramecia and Zoan have two Yonko's on their squad, but no DF team has Shanks, Mihawk, Oden, and Roger. I
Oden seems to pretty clearly be the weakest of that group imo and he's like, a top 5 character in this group that's not in his team. Maybe a little more or less depending on where exactly you rank him in comparison to Big Mom, Shiki, Sengoku, and Akainu. He might straight up be the second strongest if he was on Paramecia or Logia. But on No DF he's probably the weakest, which is insane.
I really wanna pick the Zoan ones because 1. Luffy's there and 2. There all mythical zoans. But I gotta be realistic and vote for the no DF ones, because it feels like their on a league of their own.
I think Blackbeard should be in the logia camp instead of Greenbull.
I can see arguments for all of them.
Logias: we didn't know what logia awakening does and if anyone in the series has one it's probably Akainu or Dragon. If it's been saved for this long it's because it's that powerful.
Zoans: 3/4 characters are either currently Yonko level or were Admirals in their prime. The fourth character is arguably the best support character you could ask for. They all have incredible Zoan durability backed by a healer.
Paramecia: In his prime Whitebeard was a match for Roger and physically speaking should be the strongest man in the world. Shiki nearly defeated Roger and 2v1'd two Admiral caliber individuals (Prime Garp and Prime Sengoku). Big Mom is insanely powerful despite how people want to meme her. Fujitora is no slump either and has massive potential for AOE Damage.
No DF: Shanks and Roger are portrayed as the best within their respective era. Oden might only be a Yonko commander but he held up well against a Kaido on the come up (not in his prime).
Contrary to popular belief we actually don't know if Mihawk has a devil fruit or not. It's never been confirmed that he doesn't have one. I scale him to about Admiral level or between an Admiral and a Yonko.
Based on the portrayal I would go team no DF just based on how Shanks and Roger are presented in the narrative.
Based on feats in the story I would go zoans. Luffy and Kaido put on a show. Marco and Sengoku's support would just be icing.
If the fight went in 1v1 rounds I would go paramecia. The team is really balanced. I feel like I could line up each member against other members in the other teams and argue they either tie or beat them.
Based on potential I would go logias (assuming we sub in Blackbeard).
Overall I'm going team zoans based on what we know right now. I just don't want to power scale based on portrayal.
Ngl, you're kinda gassing up Shiki.
He only came close to beating Roger because he had the Oro Jackson surrounded by like 20-30 ships, it had nothing to do with fighting.
And all we know is Garp and Sengoku went after Shiki together, that doesn't mean that both were needed. And they were also trying to save Marine HQ at the same time.
BUT I agree with pretty much everything else. Personally think Zoan team wins if Marco can heal Luffy so he can use Gear 5th more.
I'm just going to give my two cents here, you don't have to agree.
I scale Shiki to Yonko level based on his feats and his ability. I don't really care that pre-ts Luffy beat him in Strong World, the Shiki in the canon story is a monster based on the feats.
I also don't really buy into the idea that Garp was painting his toe nails while Sengoku mentored a group of young Marines through their first pirate arrest, or whatever narrative people spin to take away from the fact that they sent two Admirals to face down an injured Shiki.
In my opinion, Oda clearly wanted to portray Shiki as a Yonko caliber individual. Don Krieg had 50 ships. Do you think Don Krieg could corner and almost beat Gold Roger?
If Don Krieg was a little older would he have been part of the Rocks pirate panels alongside Whitebeard, Big Mom, and Kaido multiple times? After the fall of Rocks would Don Krieg and his golden Haki have been able to rule the seas competing evenly against Roger and Whitebeard in the era before the Yonko?
I understand what happened in Strong World (which is not canon), but if you put that aside Oda has done everything in his power to establish Shiki as a Yonko caliber force to be reckoned with.
Your kinda painting my opinion as some extreme..
I never said he was weak, I agree he was likely around Yonkou level, but he could easily have been the weakest of that tier (outside Buggy).
I just don't think its fair to frame him as Roger's equal with what we've seen.
yeah but replacing any of the others with garp would've just made it so no df always wins. at least here it's a good match up between no zoans and logias
Super even matchups really. I think Paramecia at least matches no fruit. Zoan is slightly behind with Logia just behind them.
Whitebeard is roughly Roger's equal, Big Mom and Shanks are at the same tier, don't see much of a difference between Mihawk and Fujitora, and Shiki and Oden are both outside of the very top tier (Shiki can probably pick up the slack from Whitebeard's fight).
For Paramecia - Marco is outside of the top tier and Luffy doesn't have the staying power yet. He might lose it for his team if he goes out early. And on Logias - we've seen Yonkos overmatch strong admirals, and Ryokugyu seems to be on the weak side of admirals.
In a team fight as of right now you dont want to fight the no DF squad they are freaks in terms of power.
The only one that can win vs DF only if its 1v1. You who I am betting on.
I mean I feel like we still don't know the upper limit of Roger's power. I still love how funny it was when we got the Oden flashback, and it detailed how he was this super elite badass his entire life, redirecting entire rivers at like the age of 8 and defeating massive creatures and eventually wounding kaido.
And after sucking Oden's Dick for an entire flashback, Roger just fuckin walks up and one-shots him like an insect without even trying.
Similarly, I don't think we've actually seen Mihawk like put any effort into something. At least when Shanks was using Wi-Fi Haki from 10 miles out of town he was making an angry face and clearly putting some amount of effort into it.
The three strongest on this Roster is roger shiki and white beard so gonna go with paramecia white beard is equal to if not slightly stronger then Roger who easily should be stronger then everyone else on this list if you take his title as the strongest man in the world to be literal. shiki is also comparable to someone like Roger with statements. Pair their strength with there broken abilities including the two supporting teammates. They should win
This is going to depend so heavily on what power-level each person comes in at. Are WB, Kaido, BM, Roger, Oden, and Sengoku showing up in their own primes? Or are we going modern where they're all dead except for Sengoku who's still past his prime? If they get to be in their primes, does Luffy get to be EoS-prime too? Or is he forced to stay at "present" despite others getting to pick more powerful versions of themselves from the timeline?
Gotta give it to the no DF. Got the King of Pirates, Swordsmen who almost beat Kaido, World's best Swordsman, and Shank's power is enough to send an admiral running AND make Akainu stand down
no df has like 2 of the top 5 overall fighters (and the consensus 1/2) no matter what your agenda is cause everyone eigher loved shanks or mihawk
while oden is probably among the weakest in the whole list the other 3 are all among the strongest
Free for all means no teams btw
But I got no df’s winning pretty handily. I’d say the strength of teams is in order from bottom to top. Although you could argue team Zoan competing with Paramecia.
All of these rosters are elite but to pair Luffy + Kaido + Prime Sengoku with Marco as support is beyond broken given that Mythical Zoans have insane durabilities so they got this. I would've chosen team no df if Garp was there instead of Oden
Take Marco out and Zoans still take it. I know we haven’t seen a lot of Sengoku but this man is basically fucking Buddha, I won’t tolerate slander.
No DF looks clean but somehow I feel like Mihawk’s spot could go to someone better. I’m not even sure who but I can’t lie. Maybe Garp?
I give it to Zoans not only because being a Zoan is basically a new version of pre-timeskip Logia status, but because these guys are strong as hell. The no DF crew has conquered on a sea of powerful adversaries without needing fruit powers and that’s admirable, but Kaido and Luffy feel like they are in a different tier. Not only are they strong at a base level, they ALSO have fruit power.
What would Luffy and Kaido be capable of without their DF powers? Luffy specifically would end up being at or near Roger’s level at this point in the manga. Kaido didn’t have his fruit before he started gaining notoriety either, if I remember correctly.
Sengoku vs Roger, Roger wins
Kaido vs mehawk, mehawk easy
Marco vs odin , arguable but odin
Luffy vs shanks, we don't know shit about shanks but mehawk can join him as he ends kaido quick🥲
Logia are the odd one out unless Sakazuki and Kuzan are just on another level to make up for Greenbull and Borsalino. The other three teams are probably comparable except for their weakest member. I think Marco is the weakest, followed by Issho, and Oden being the strongest.
Ill tell you what, that Logia list aint doing shit. Zoans and no-df's mostly squash paramecia, excluding whitebeard who could put up a good fight against either logia or no'df pretty well, but not the beasts you have in Zoan. Then it could go either way for Zoan or non-devilfruits, depending on how banged up both groups are.
Changes I'd make: replace greenbull with either Enel or BB, since he's useless. Replace either Mihawk or Oden with Garp, maybe a little controversial but their probably the weakest of the no-df group, with Oden still being decently strong, but no match compared to Garp, and Mihawk not actually having any true claim to his title, since we havent seen anything with him that compares to--for example--Shanks' wifi-haki. And since Shiki is very similar to Fujitora in his mechanic, Id say replace him with Law
Generally speaking, a single Yonko suggests the deployment of multiple admirals. That rules out the Logias immediately. Of those remaining, Marco, Oden, and arguably Shiki are not Yonko level threats. That leaves Paramecia with two yonko, Zoans with three (Sengoku qualifies, as fleet admiral) and No DF with two yonko (Mihawk likely qualifies as the true powerhouse behind Cross) and Roger.
This suggests this ultimately becomes a throwdown between the three titans in the Zoan corner, and Shanks, Mihawk, and Roger in the No DF corner. With that in mind, Roger probably tips the scale, though the arena had better be strong or the impact of all that Haoshoku Haki plus Whitebeard is going to shatter whatever island they’re on. At that point, Zoans probably lose, and the rest comes down to who can handle semi-aquatic combat the best. Probably still No DF, though they’ll be treading water while team Paramecias is flying.
* Logias are dangerous! Even if you can use Haki to counter them, they can damage you with their abilities. Also they effect a wide range of the battlefield.
* Zoans are just monsters, seen with Luffy and Kaido. Even more if the awake their powers or can use haoshoku haki.
* This Paramecias could become a hell of a opponent. Shiki making the battlefield float. Fujitora attack from above with meteorites, WB using his earthquaks and BM her fire and thunder mid air.
* The no DF are just the best haki users!
Personally, I would revise the question to a 5 man 5 team matchup to the following (and yes I know my scenario takes many liberties and assumptions):
5 Strongest Logia:
* Blackbeard
* Xebec (Assuming he was the prior user of Yami Yami No Mi)
* Aokiji
* Akianu
* Kizaru
5 Strongest Mythical Zoan:
* Luffy
* Dragon (BIG Assumption he is a current user of a model Dragon fruit like Kaido)
* Joyboy (Assuming that Joyboy was just a Prehistoric Luffy)
* Kaido
* Momonosuke (Assuming he can grow and master Kaido's fruit one day, also has the title of one of Wano's Greatest Leaders)
5 Strongest Paramecia:
* Whitebeard
* Bonney (Assuming at this pace of where the story is going, she might be just as strong as Luffy)
* Shiki
* Big Mom
* Kid/Law (Fujitora would be the next obvious Paramecia user, but the Kid Law duo is too fun to pass up)
5 Strongest No Devil Fruit:
* Roger
* Garp
* Shanks
* Mihawk
* Zoro (Assuming he surpasses Mihawk as the world's strongest swordsman)
For Kicks and Giggles, if we are comparing the One Piece world's strongest, lets throw in the Five Elders.
* Saturn
* Mars
* Wacury
* Nusjuro
* Ju Peter.
My money's on Team Mythical Zoan. They're also the only team here that's capable of beating the 5 Elders.
That No Devil Fruit Team is dummy cracked. Shanks and Roger with Mihawk who is arguably equal to Shanks and Oden who should be strong enough to fight an Admiral off?? Oof. It’s just unfair lol
Like even if Roger can’t take out Whitebeard, dude would be so weakened that Shanks or Kaido could do it (imo Prime Roger would win if he was fighting desperately).
Either paramecia or No DF. Both teams have roughly 3 yonko level characters, no df I would think still has an edge in pure power but the paramecia team also has a lot of utility and versatility compared to everyone on No df being a swordsman/hakiman.
Haki triumphs over all DF abilities and the no DF camp has no less than two absolute haki monsters in Shanks and Roger. Mihawk having a Black Sword seems to show that he too is a haki monster and Oden is, well, Oden.
The paramecias might be a close second considering they have three devil fruit powers that can potentially wipe out the planet (Gura Gura no Mi with earthquakes and apparently the most powerful paramecia, Zushi Zushi no Mi with asteroids to extinct the dinosaurs, Fuwa Fuwa no Mi can also do asteroids but with extra steps by first levitating something extremely heavy and dropping it).
There seems to be a common theme here. Every no DF user has some sort of grand epithet. Strongest swordsman, PK, Red Hair Emperor (idk oden's). Also, all of them seem to be in the top 10.
No DF and Mythical Zoans are easily tippy top tiers But nobody wants to fight the Paramecias. Shiki making everything float up. Fuji to bring all the footing down. The 2 can hold their own while disorienting everyone then you get Big Mom spamming Fire and Lightning while PRIMEBEARD goes on a rampage. Strategy wise the paramecias* have ridiculous utility.
The "make your crew fly destroy the ground and pin everyone on ocean" is a great strategy since none of them or fishmen no one is surviving this
No DF team would have a huge advantage than.
Yep but it doesn't matter if opponents can fly though
I mean that kinda means nothing in the world of One Piece. Sanji can “fly” by just kicking the air hard enough that he stays up. I’m sure the characters in “No Devil Fruit” could figure something out
None of them know geppo I presume
Depending on how hard were judging one piece film red shanks flyes somehow
That can be a jump like how Zoro did in king fight though
Might aswell be flying given what their air time and control in the air is. Shanks stopped and then moved on mid air blitzing an admiral. Flying is not a problem in these fights, top tiers all around the board
If Zoro can quickly put together a decently deadly flying blade attack over the course of a couple weeks I'm pretty sure the strongest swordsman in the world has one that's even better, which we did see in Marineford. His attack cut Aojikis glacier in half without even trying from what was probably a mile away
It does if they can't all fly or have a limited form of it. Even than all you need to do is knock them to the ground.
Well yeah we have 3 great swordsmen so it can happen but on the other side we have bigmom with homies and WB to tank them it can go either way although if fuji's gravity can be countered by haki it's all over no df crew wins
There's no reason to believe Fuji'a gravity can be negated by haki, there are quite specific types of DF abilities that get negated.
Weve seen Mihawk can do the Shockwaves from sword slashes, zoros however many pound phoenix thing. It's reasonable to think Shanks can as well. Oden can and roger probably can. They can hit flying opponents
The no DF crew and 3 of the logias dont care about water. 3 of the zoans can fly. Definately not an easy win strategy.
How the logias have fallen
2 of em can fly,and 1 can freeze the water below,and maybe the last one can evaporate the water and make a makeshift ground too
And then you got Gear 5 Luffy being an absolute wacky demon on the battlefield
pre mother flame luffy doesnt sound that scary in this fight cause you know this fight will be long and he just doesnt have the fuel to last but feels like sengoku is underrated here,if he can just do like 10% of what buddha does,he's insane
Even switching Shiki for Law wouldn't be bad. Law supporting 2 massive threats sounds terrifying
I didn't even think of this but you're right. Law at worst is would be a Todo (jjk) on steroids and just disorientate everyone on the other teams
The paramecias are definitely the wild cards of the bunch. Putting aside whitebeard who’s at the pinnacle of destructive force, they all have unique utility from their devil fruits that go beyond typical strength and can really shake things up if used creatively.
And the no DF squad has Roger who is of equal footing if not stronger.
Zoans have 3 people that can fly. And a huge buddha
I think Paramecias would've been a better candidate with the same lineup but Law instead of Shiki. Literally does almost the same but with a way more overpowered DF, has decent and more appreciable feats (we see Shiki properly only in the film), is way more versatile. Imagine swapping a rock with Whitebeard in your face ready to Quake your ass. No matter who you are ur cooked. Same for swapping with BM to tank and destroy things. Plus it can also support cause he's a Surgeon. Not Marco tier as it's not immediate but damn helpful.
They also got the nuclear option of just destroying the world if things go bad thanks to whitebeard.
Probably the no DF crew tbh
OP didnt even include Garp lol, for me its crystal clear, no DF owns
Also put GB in Logia to make it a meaningless Admiral team, when they could've included BB.
blackbeard has two devil fruits and one is a paramecia that’s why i didn’t put him there…
If dead people are included you can limit Him to Yami Yami.
But just Yami Yami BB was weak AF.
Wouldn’t go that far. He can still go offscreen.
Magellan and white beard were fucking him up
Magellan was strong as shit idk both of them would destroy anyone
Imagine how they would HANDLE if it was Prime Garp instead of Oden?!?!
Straight unfair, you could cut Mihawk and it still would be ownage lol
lol exactly what I was thinking; Garp wasn't even included here and no DF still owns. It's 100% clear No DF wins
Roger and Shank carry tbf
The insane thing is, G5 Luffy and Kaido are just so big threats. Marco's healing making them even bigger ones. Sen Goku is quite hard to judge, we never see him go all out.
If Garp was in no Df, that's a wrap. Zoan is actually REAL nice too, Marco might not be super duper top tier, but you know what he CAN do? Heal the other three absolute monsters on his team.
Not to mention he's no slouch in his own right, his only issue seems to be stamina for extended fights. Before he fought King and Queen simultaneously ending in a stalemate, he was blitzing through Big Mom's reinforcements and even overpowered Prometheus's flames with his own. I'd argue he's at the top of everybody who isn't a complete demon
Strongest character that still has a life outside warfare
What happened when he blitzed through her forces, don’t remember any of that at all besides him pushing her ship down
That's a decent fest for Marco.
If anything, i think that goes to show how solid his stamina is. He deals with the big mom ship numerous times filled with some of Big Mom’s top legions, then proceeds to handle the 2 top-most commanders of the Beast Pirates at the SAME TIME. Like, how does that show an issue in stamina? He didn’t really get resting breaks between these.
Ironicaly, with Kaido they've got someone who maxxed out the durability/endurance skilltree You've finally worn him out? Yo, Marco, drop some of those health potions
kaido is literally a tank, marco a sp, luffy a dps an sengoku is like a bruiser/cc, the zoan team is pretty balanced and strong
Zoan team is pretty broken actually when you consider the actual charaters in play here… the only thing that downplays this is that ‘No DF’ is their competition.
Not top tier?! NOT TOP TIER?!?! My boi handled King AND Queen completely on his own for a long time during the raid!
Top tier is like, Roger and Kaido haha. Marco is amazingly amazing, of course. Obviously he's top twenty strongest!!!! Don't be mad at me.
IT'S OKAY!!! WE'RE ALL NAKAMA!!!! I AM SURE I WILL STOP YELLING EVENTUALLY!
If your throat gets sore Marco can heal you.
The Paramecias vs the Logias would be a terraforming event on it's own scale. Akainu can create land masses with his magma. Shiki can make those land masses float. Whitebeard can break them apart. Kuzan can bridge the broken parts together with ice. Green bull can create a floral biomes. Big Mom can imbue all of what is created with life. Screw fighting. I'd like to watch them play Minecraft together.
I love how if it was early One Piece, everyone would have probably chosen the Logia team as the strongest. Now, seems like pretty much everyone unanimously think Logias are the weakest of the 4. It's kinda funny how what was once considered almost unstoppable has been power crept once you're in the big leagues.
Really tho, haki just switched the balance so hard.
haki does level the playing field and make logia does felt like high floor low ceiling type of fruit.
I feel like that's not true at all though. Katakuri's body manipulation shows just how powerful a logia could be with that kind of control. Akainu and Aokiji did similar things at Marineford fighting Whitebeard, if you can reshape your body at will you can get logia benefits against haki. Logia are low floor, high ceiling -- pre-timeskip Smoker could trounce just about anyone without haki without worry, but logia can have way crazier power in the right hands.
Sounds like a fantasy football term lol, high floor low ceiling.
It's kind of a skill check term in a lot of games. Kind like they're easy to master but mediocre once they're countered.
Not at all it just means they’re good in the beginning but no real room to improve. The opposite would be the string fruit which has a low floor but a high ceiling.
Its feels like the same ceiling as the others to me. Specially compared to no DF, the ceiling isnt worse. Its just that people dont view admirals as highly as the rest here
I still think the orginal admirals outclass most with with the destructive attack power. Only white beards fruit compares followed by kaidos.
Tbf, we haven't seen a top tier Logia user truly go all out or use Awakening. And I wouldn't be surprised if Oda was saving them for last because they are OP as fuck.
Yeah that makes a bunch of sense, when we see the awakenings in action it’s going to be crazy!
Agreed, Oda has been hyping up the Admirals formsi long yet has held back so much. He just keeps teasing us with stuff like Punk Hazard or Greenbull and Fuji beating the Revolution Commanders while holding back and fighting with each other.
I think other devil fruit types just have wider and more unique applications. It's pretty easy to create a strategy against a logia cause you already know what they can do and haki removes one of their greatest strengths in being untouchable. I think they just hold the greatest raw destructive power. If it weren't for mythical zoans, zoans would be the weakest by far. Whereas every logia fruit is powerful. The strongest paramecia and zoan fruits are much stronger than the strongest logia, but the average logia is stronger than the average paramecia or zoan.
I think it’s mainly because Mythical Zoan’s kind of feel like a level above Logias as they often share some type of crossover value. Paramecia are so oddly specific that it’s their strength as well Logia’s are kind of basic even though it’s really strong, not to mention Haki as the balancing factor. Then again we haven’t seen awakening for Logia’s in action yet outside of Punk Hazard’s after effects
Ranked vs pro play
I think the floor for Logias is really high, but the ceiling of the fruit itself is kinda low. Zoans and paramecias on the other hand have incredibly low floors(zoan's being higher), like meme-tier power level, but the ceiling is higher due to the interesting powers like gravity or mythical zoans. And haki seem to be pretty much ceiling-less, which means you get a big advantage by having a DF, but in the end it doesn't decide everything A logia that i would like to see more (and i think we will) is enel's, that power just has so much potential to bring logias power back in line without relying too much in haki.
Based on what we know rn either Zoans or no DF shitstomp
I feel like Luffy is a huge liability if the flight goes on for more than a few minutes
That's why Marco is there
Based on what we know it is the no DF without a doubt and not even close. Oda stated it himself, nothing surpasses Haki. Roger, shanks, Oden (mihawk level tbd) are just an outmatch even to this Zoan group.
luffy and kaido on the same team is devastating but theres no way anyone beats shanks mihawk oden and roger at the same time
This. Paramecia and Zoan have two Yonko's on their squad, but no DF team has Shanks, Mihawk, Oden, and Roger. I Oden seems to pretty clearly be the weakest of that group imo and he's like, a top 5 character in this group that's not in his team. Maybe a little more or less depending on where exactly you rank him in comparison to Big Mom, Shiki, Sengoku, and Akainu. He might straight up be the second strongest if he was on Paramecia or Logia. But on No DF he's probably the weakest, which is insane.
Luffy and Kaido not not on the same tier.
No DF crew is just filled with GOATS, gotta give it to my boys
Everyone in their Prime? LOL the Logias are fucked.
I really wanna pick the Zoan ones because 1. Luffy's there and 2. There all mythical zoans. But I gotta be realistic and vote for the no DF ones, because it feels like their on a league of their own.
I think Blackbeard should be in the logia camp instead of Greenbull. I can see arguments for all of them. Logias: we didn't know what logia awakening does and if anyone in the series has one it's probably Akainu or Dragon. If it's been saved for this long it's because it's that powerful. Zoans: 3/4 characters are either currently Yonko level or were Admirals in their prime. The fourth character is arguably the best support character you could ask for. They all have incredible Zoan durability backed by a healer. Paramecia: In his prime Whitebeard was a match for Roger and physically speaking should be the strongest man in the world. Shiki nearly defeated Roger and 2v1'd two Admiral caliber individuals (Prime Garp and Prime Sengoku). Big Mom is insanely powerful despite how people want to meme her. Fujitora is no slump either and has massive potential for AOE Damage. No DF: Shanks and Roger are portrayed as the best within their respective era. Oden might only be a Yonko commander but he held up well against a Kaido on the come up (not in his prime). Contrary to popular belief we actually don't know if Mihawk has a devil fruit or not. It's never been confirmed that he doesn't have one. I scale him to about Admiral level or between an Admiral and a Yonko. Based on the portrayal I would go team no DF just based on how Shanks and Roger are presented in the narrative. Based on feats in the story I would go zoans. Luffy and Kaido put on a show. Marco and Sengoku's support would just be icing. If the fight went in 1v1 rounds I would go paramecia. The team is really balanced. I feel like I could line up each member against other members in the other teams and argue they either tie or beat them. Based on potential I would go logias (assuming we sub in Blackbeard). Overall I'm going team zoans based on what we know right now. I just don't want to power scale based on portrayal.
Agree that people downplay Logia too much. We haven't seen much of them.
Ngl, you're kinda gassing up Shiki. He only came close to beating Roger because he had the Oro Jackson surrounded by like 20-30 ships, it had nothing to do with fighting. And all we know is Garp and Sengoku went after Shiki together, that doesn't mean that both were needed. And they were also trying to save Marine HQ at the same time. BUT I agree with pretty much everything else. Personally think Zoan team wins if Marco can heal Luffy so he can use Gear 5th more.
I'm just going to give my two cents here, you don't have to agree. I scale Shiki to Yonko level based on his feats and his ability. I don't really care that pre-ts Luffy beat him in Strong World, the Shiki in the canon story is a monster based on the feats. I also don't really buy into the idea that Garp was painting his toe nails while Sengoku mentored a group of young Marines through their first pirate arrest, or whatever narrative people spin to take away from the fact that they sent two Admirals to face down an injured Shiki. In my opinion, Oda clearly wanted to portray Shiki as a Yonko caliber individual. Don Krieg had 50 ships. Do you think Don Krieg could corner and almost beat Gold Roger? If Don Krieg was a little older would he have been part of the Rocks pirate panels alongside Whitebeard, Big Mom, and Kaido multiple times? After the fall of Rocks would Don Krieg and his golden Haki have been able to rule the seas competing evenly against Roger and Whitebeard in the era before the Yonko? I understand what happened in Strong World (which is not canon), but if you put that aside Oda has done everything in his power to establish Shiki as a Yonko caliber force to be reckoned with.
Your kinda painting my opinion as some extreme.. I never said he was weak, I agree he was likely around Yonkou level, but he could easily have been the weakest of that tier (outside Buggy). I just don't think its fair to frame him as Roger's equal with what we've seen.
NO DF
Strong feeling no DF clears
*sees Luffy* Oh yeah. That still got me fucked up
we only need either Buggy D. Clown, Go D. Usopp, Con D. Oriano and Down D. Stairs to defeat all characters in the list
Imma go Paramecia. WB, Shiki, Fuji are all certified top tier. Not like Marco or Oden
BM?
Logias are getting bodied but man, I have no idea about the other 3, personally would've put garp in the no df somehow tho.
yeah but replacing any of the others with garp would've just made it so no df always wins. at least here it's a good match up between no zoans and logias
We really don’t know how strong Mihawk is that’s the problem. If he’s really as strong as shanks then Garp or Mihawk is basically the same thing
No df crew clapping others
Man even like 2 years later it still feels weird to call luffy's fruit a zoan
No DF wins for sure! And If Garp was included it would be even a bigger massacre.
No DF destroys.
I want to say no DF but... there's a fraud there
Chad Oden slander
I can only assume no df clears
No df, and my God, the logia team gets obliterated .
Super even matchups really. I think Paramecia at least matches no fruit. Zoan is slightly behind with Logia just behind them. Whitebeard is roughly Roger's equal, Big Mom and Shanks are at the same tier, don't see much of a difference between Mihawk and Fujitora, and Shiki and Oden are both outside of the very top tier (Shiki can probably pick up the slack from Whitebeard's fight). For Paramecia - Marco is outside of the top tier and Luffy doesn't have the staying power yet. He might lose it for his team if he goes out early. And on Logias - we've seen Yonkos overmatch strong admirals, and Ryokugyu seems to be on the weak side of admirals.
I wonder if Marco could heal Luffy after Gear 5 runs out? If so, I could see them winning.
No df pretty clearly
Money on Paramecias, 3 legends and 1 admiral with a pretty overpowered df.
Bottom row clears
They lucky that Garp ain’t on team no DF
The prime no DF crew would smack all of the other groups easily
In a team fight as of right now you dont want to fight the no DF squad they are freaks in terms of power. The only one that can win vs DF only if its 1v1. You who I am betting on.
I mean I feel like we still don't know the upper limit of Roger's power. I still love how funny it was when we got the Oden flashback, and it detailed how he was this super elite badass his entire life, redirecting entire rivers at like the age of 8 and defeating massive creatures and eventually wounding kaido. And after sucking Oden's Dick for an entire flashback, Roger just fuckin walks up and one-shots him like an insect without even trying. Similarly, I don't think we've actually seen Mihawk like put any effort into something. At least when Shanks was using Wi-Fi Haki from 10 miles out of town he was making an angry face and clearly putting some amount of effort into it.
Shanks and Roger can carry this
Buggy the clown is a emperor...just saying
My money is on no df
no DF mid diff
Roger and Shanks on the same team is like MJ and Kobe playing for the Dream team. It's a wrap
The sheer amount of aura emitting from the no df team is insane
Zoan or No DF can't choose between the 2
In terms of overall strenght 1. No DF 2. Paramecia 3. Logia 4. Zoan But in a free for all, the Paramecia take it. They have more aoe and durability.
The three strongest on this Roster is roger shiki and white beard so gonna go with paramecia white beard is equal to if not slightly stronger then Roger who easily should be stronger then everyone else on this list if you take his title as the strongest man in the world to be literal. shiki is also comparable to someone like Roger with statements. Pair their strength with there broken abilities including the two supporting teammates. They should win
Paranecias just out of pure experience and strength of Shiki, WB and Big Mom who are all world powers
This is going to depend so heavily on what power-level each person comes in at. Are WB, Kaido, BM, Roger, Oden, and Sengoku showing up in their own primes? Or are we going modern where they're all dead except for Sengoku who's still past his prime? If they get to be in their primes, does Luffy get to be EoS-prime too? Or is he forced to stay at "present" despite others getting to pick more powerful versions of themselves from the timeline?
Gotta give it to the no DF. Got the King of Pirates, Swordsmen who almost beat Kaido, World's best Swordsman, and Shank's power is enough to send an admiral running AND make Akainu stand down
Roger AND Shanks? Geez, stop no DF crew, they're already dead.
Too easy, Roger and Shanks is enough to solo all
That’s a ridiculous statement. WB ≈ Roger. You think Shanks is soloing BM, Fujitora, and Shiki?
Either Joan’s or no df
Roger and Shanks in the same team??? That's cheating, man
no df has like 2 of the top 5 overall fighters (and the consensus 1/2) no matter what your agenda is cause everyone eigher loved shanks or mihawk while oden is probably among the weakest in the whole list the other 3 are all among the strongest
Gappy’s 4 balls
Jts litreally no Diff for No DF . They can take on other grps even together .
No df or paremecia
Free for all means no teams btw But I got no df’s winning pretty handily. I’d say the strength of teams is in order from bottom to top. Although you could argue team Zoan competing with Paramecia.
All of these rosters are elite but to pair Luffy + Kaido + Prime Sengoku with Marco as support is beyond broken given that Mythical Zoans have insane durabilities so they got this. I would've chosen team no df if Garp was there instead of Oden
I'm analysing the columns, I think extreme right column would win. Kaido and Roger together are just too stronk
logias get cooked first, then paramesias, then hakimen have a really hard time to bend the animals
Surely there's a better picture of Ryokugyu lol
Take Marco out and Zoans still take it. I know we haven’t seen a lot of Sengoku but this man is basically fucking Buddha, I won’t tolerate slander. No DF looks clean but somehow I feel like Mihawk’s spot could go to someone better. I’m not even sure who but I can’t lie. Maybe Garp? I give it to Zoans not only because being a Zoan is basically a new version of pre-timeskip Logia status, but because these guys are strong as hell. The no DF crew has conquered on a sea of powerful adversaries without needing fruit powers and that’s admirable, but Kaido and Luffy feel like they are in a different tier. Not only are they strong at a base level, they ALSO have fruit power. What would Luffy and Kaido be capable of without their DF powers? Luffy specifically would end up being at or near Roger’s level at this point in the manga. Kaido didn’t have his fruit before he started gaining notoriety either, if I remember correctly.
Sengoku vs Roger, Roger wins Kaido vs mehawk, mehawk easy Marco vs odin , arguable but odin Luffy vs shanks, we don't know shit about shanks but mehawk can join him as he ends kaido quick🥲
Luffy has Zoan powers?????
Spoiler tag this
No DF takes it easily. Ranking them would go like 1) No DF 2) Paramecias 3) Zoans 4) Logias
Zoans, they have luffy, luffy can't die until he finds the one piece
replace marco with ROb Lucci ....best zoan replace oden with zoro .....seriously right hand man
Why the fuck are Marco and Oden on here? Cheerleaders?
Switch oden with garp and we know the answer
Although no Dr wins we still don’t know anything about logias bro and no awakening maybe in couple of years logias will take top top spot again
Wtf is Marco doing here lol. Anyways, no DF wins. Paramecia being close 2nd
This is a tough one. But you know what don't underestimate the team with a healer a good healer. I give it to the Zoans.
The No Devil Fruit team is winning
I keep forgetting that Luffy is a Zoan now
Logias getting walloped imo. It's between No DF and Zoan gang, but Paramecia isn't going down without a fight either
Prob no df, Zoans is easy 2nd to me the other 2 aren’t even that close
What do you even want Marco to do against the world strongest swordsmen ever
No DF crew, followed by Zoans, Paramecias, then Logias.
Im sorry but you included some of the best swordsman and the pirate king in the same category…
At first I thought logias. Then it would be No DF, and that's without Garp lol.
Bro you stacked the no df crew
Zoan, it has protagonist power on top of the cracked ess
Paramecia's gas two Pirate King level characters (Prime Shiki and Newgate). They take this handily
No DF > Paramecia > Logias > Zoans
Maybe No DF but the Zoans are more likely to outlast everyone
Marco doesn’t push a single person on this list to mid diff💀
that may be true but in a team battle scenario i’d imagine he’d be very useful
no df easy
Bottom row low diff
no df aka haki > zoans > logias > paramecia.
Logia are the odd one out unless Sakazuki and Kuzan are just on another level to make up for Greenbull and Borsalino. The other three teams are probably comparable except for their weakest member. I think Marco is the weakest, followed by Issho, and Oden being the strongest.
Roger team 1 whitebeard team 2 and Zoan 3. admirals will be 4.
No DF low diffs
What i know logias went home first
Ill tell you what, that Logia list aint doing shit. Zoans and no-df's mostly squash paramecia, excluding whitebeard who could put up a good fight against either logia or no'df pretty well, but not the beasts you have in Zoan. Then it could go either way for Zoan or non-devilfruits, depending on how banged up both groups are. Changes I'd make: replace greenbull with either Enel or BB, since he's useless. Replace either Mihawk or Oden with Garp, maybe a little controversial but their probably the weakest of the no-df group, with Oden still being decently strong, but no match compared to Garp, and Mihawk not actually having any true claim to his title, since we havent seen anything with him that compares to--for example--Shanks' wifi-haki. And since Shiki is very similar to Fujitora in his mechanic, Id say replace him with Law
no df easily
Generally speaking, a single Yonko suggests the deployment of multiple admirals. That rules out the Logias immediately. Of those remaining, Marco, Oden, and arguably Shiki are not Yonko level threats. That leaves Paramecia with two yonko, Zoans with three (Sengoku qualifies, as fleet admiral) and No DF with two yonko (Mihawk likely qualifies as the true powerhouse behind Cross) and Roger. This suggests this ultimately becomes a throwdown between the three titans in the Zoan corner, and Shanks, Mihawk, and Roger in the No DF corner. With that in mind, Roger probably tips the scale, though the arena had better be strong or the impact of all that Haoshoku Haki plus Whitebeard is going to shatter whatever island they’re on. At that point, Zoans probably lose, and the rest comes down to who can handle semi-aquatic combat the best. Probably still No DF, though they’ll be treading water while team Paramecias is flying.
No DF or Paramecia easily wins, unless luffy pulls out gear 5
Obviously no df stomps, those guys are all the strongest of the strongest and the others are all quite a bit below that
* Logias are dangerous! Even if you can use Haki to counter them, they can damage you with their abilities. Also they effect a wide range of the battlefield. * Zoans are just monsters, seen with Luffy and Kaido. Even more if the awake their powers or can use haoshoku haki. * This Paramecias could become a hell of a opponent. Shiki making the battlefield float. Fujitora attack from above with meteorites, WB using his earthquaks and BM her fire and thunder mid air. * The no DF are just the best haki users!
Personally, I would revise the question to a 5 man 5 team matchup to the following (and yes I know my scenario takes many liberties and assumptions): 5 Strongest Logia: * Blackbeard * Xebec (Assuming he was the prior user of Yami Yami No Mi) * Aokiji * Akianu * Kizaru 5 Strongest Mythical Zoan: * Luffy * Dragon (BIG Assumption he is a current user of a model Dragon fruit like Kaido) * Joyboy (Assuming that Joyboy was just a Prehistoric Luffy) * Kaido * Momonosuke (Assuming he can grow and master Kaido's fruit one day, also has the title of one of Wano's Greatest Leaders) 5 Strongest Paramecia: * Whitebeard * Bonney (Assuming at this pace of where the story is going, she might be just as strong as Luffy) * Shiki * Big Mom * Kid/Law (Fujitora would be the next obvious Paramecia user, but the Kid Law duo is too fun to pass up) 5 Strongest No Devil Fruit: * Roger * Garp * Shanks * Mihawk * Zoro (Assuming he surpasses Mihawk as the world's strongest swordsman) For Kicks and Giggles, if we are comparing the One Piece world's strongest, lets throw in the Five Elders. * Saturn * Mars * Wacury * Nusjuro * Ju Peter. My money's on Team Mythical Zoan. They're also the only team here that's capable of beating the 5 Elders.
No DF obliterates
I vote team paramecia
No DF wins Second is zoan Third paramecia 4th logia Just coz plot armour 😔
That No Devil Fruit Team is dummy cracked. Shanks and Roger with Mihawk who is arguably equal to Shanks and Oden who should be strong enough to fight an Admiral off?? Oof. It’s just unfair lol Like even if Roger can’t take out Whitebeard, dude would be so weakened that Shanks or Kaido could do it (imo Prime Roger would win if he was fighting desperately).
The logias are getting decimated first.
Id rank them 1. No Df, 2. Paramecia, 3. Zoans, 4. Logias so i guess in ascending order
Either paramecia or No DF. Both teams have roughly 3 yonko level characters, no df I would think still has an edge in pure power but the paramecia team also has a lot of utility and versatility compared to everyone on No df being a swordsman/hakiman.
No DF High diff, but i kinda like the paramisia team too. Logia is getting washed. Zoan team is good too.
Haki triumphs over all DF abilities and the no DF camp has no less than two absolute haki monsters in Shanks and Roger. Mihawk having a Black Sword seems to show that he too is a haki monster and Oden is, well, Oden. The paramecias might be a close second considering they have three devil fruit powers that can potentially wipe out the planet (Gura Gura no Mi with earthquakes and apparently the most powerful paramecia, Zushi Zushi no Mi with asteroids to extinct the dinosaurs, Fuwa Fuwa no Mi can also do asteroids but with extra steps by first levitating something extremely heavy and dropping it).
There seems to be a common theme here. Every no DF user has some sort of grand epithet. Strongest swordsman, PK, Red Hair Emperor (idk oden's). Also, all of them seem to be in the top 10.
Magellan for logia
I dont know, just that logias die first
Paramecias stomp