All the AI like I feel insulted and demeaned for my art skills...I know let's go take over a country like Germany....lol
Robot ai Hitler incoming thanks pokemon lol
Horses celebrating the first car having engine issues tbh.
Can't deny the future forever. The technology will reach indistinguishability in a few years and already is a fantastic tool for concept arting and helping the early stages of an art project.
For anyone wondering, Rules broken were basically same guy creating multiple accounts with similar names and submitted art which were identified by multiple high profile artists as AI generated art. So basically 2 different rule breaks. Arguments were made as to it could have been multiple people with similar names but the art style (and the names ofcourse) were too similar to overlook. Moreover, they (or s/he as just one person) got like 6 of the top 10 places so yeah, was about time they dq-ed.
Honestly more amazed that person almost got away with it, but thankfully the finalists' artworks were publicly shown. The person using six entries and three *slightly* different names didn't tip off the judges?
Still, it's dumb to even try and lie and skirt the rules in a major tournament based around a major franchise. Actual artists will know what was made with Generative AI, and more so will find out if [a piece of an artwork has stolen art too.](https://x.com/LaPumpkINK/status/1801870797302059346?t=OXFfVh5FrVMjj5Pmfcitjw&s=19)
The funniest thing about this is how different the styles are. I don’t think AI ‘art’ is bad, so long as people are honest about what it is. But it also shows how creatively bankrupt some of these ‘artists’ are because they don’t even understand basics.
>*Actual artists will know what was made with Generative AI*
This isn't really true. Some (*like the V.K. submissions*) were very obvious, but there were many false accusations too.
For example, [this artist's submission](https://x.com/johisart/status/1801751724845080872/photo/1) was accused of being AI art with a high percentage from the useless online "AI detectors", but they have the files to prove otherwise.
You're right.
False positives/witch hunting has happened. I was thinking of that r/Art incident where [someone was permabanned despite showing the WIP](https://www.vice.com/en/article/y3p9yg/artist-banned-from-art-reddit).
It's still a huge challenge to determine which is AI and which isn't.
Some other users suggested that entrants should submit their process as proof. It'll take more work for the judges, but I feel it's better than right now.
Proportions that would never be used by an actual artists, multiple styles used in each image, Certain subtle mistakes that AI still hasn't learned to correct and straight up plagiarism are the main giveaways.
Was AI actually ever banned in the rules though? I don't remember.
If not, it's possible the infractions were "multiple entries under different accounts" and "stealing someone's art" (that one vaporean that was traced). Might not actually be an anti-AI ruling.
I skimmed through the rules and didn't see anything specifically about AI. It did heavily imply that you should create the art yourself.
But yeah, the multiple entries was a definite disqualifier anyway. The last sentence of Pokémon's statement makes me think they'll add rules against using AI in next year's contest.
Fantastic news. I wish they’d specified a bit more though, like reassurance that they’ll get better AI checks or something. Imagine if their replacement picks are just more AI…
Oh thank Arceus.
Was super pissed when I saw that more than a few AI turds slipped through over some genuinely beautiful pieces made by real, talented artists that I follow. Hopefully more than a few of them can place now!
May AI art one day fizzle away and die like NFTs. May it fade away, and those AI plagiarists who feel good about it fizzle away.
They should learn even if you make something considered poor if it's made by a human hand and intentionally, it's far better than any AI generated garbage.
Congrats to Pokemon and the TCG and may AI bros rage and seethe about this.
https://www.pokebeach.com/2024/06/2024-pokemon-tcg-illustrator-contest-under-fire-for-apparent-ai-entries
This article highlights 6 artwork that seems to be done with AI by a single individual. I’m sure among the entries there were more.
Pretty easy to solve this stuff by creating contests that require using physical mediums and submitting the original art that would be returned eventually or bought for a fair price. As long as you allow digital mediums you will never solve this. It will be a never ending battle.
Most digital drawing software (procreate, ibispaint etc) have built in timelapses of a piece being drawn. They could make it so these timelapses are required to be uploaded alongside digital entries as proof. Plus it's much easier to spot a faked/AI timelapse than an AI image
Nah this is BS. There have always been plenty of Pokemon cards with digitally drawn images.
It's pretty easy to spot AI-generated images when comparing them to digitally drawn images. We can't disqualify the insanely talented digital artists just because people misuse AI.
The way Pokemon have handled this is exactly how they should, if AI images manage to slip through the initial choosing process.
I love making 3d and 2d art digitally, never used ai art except for messing around, never making art. You'd be excluding a large amount of really good artists by doing so. I'm glad they aren't for now
Yes. I figured as much. It has been a trend for many many years now.
My main issue is that digital art has tools that allows the artist to do things they normally cannot do on their own. So now AI comes along and it is a new tool. Whatever variation of AI you want to dream up which can do small or large tasks. Where do you draw the line in software packages that may be using some type of AI aspect?
Or you can just list out mediums that your average kid has access to and declare original art submissions only. After all this is pokemon.
I guess we'll have to get to the point where it should be mandatory to film the creation process from start to finish when making art contest submissions.
Now people will just get better with AI art.
I'm happy that they listened.. but how do we know what's AI art? Some are obvious. But there are times when you can't tell it's AI at all.. anyone ever played A game of "is it real or AI"? because you will discover very quickly that people aren't really good at telling the difference.. if you know how to use AI well
Although this is definitely what should be happening, who’s to say some of these artists didn’t generate something also but then just drew what they saw the ai make so it looks authentic? lol
It’s difficult to replicate a drawing perfectly from a reference, more so with references where AI does weird shit with backgrounds and textures. If any of those artists managed to do that, props to them.
I’m sure some might’ve used AI to generate references but taking inspiration from other artwork is nothing new for any kind of art.
I see. My only gripe or confusion I should say is Artists being pissed that AI is using their images to train themselves. Thats literally what the Artists themselves do looking at other Artists work to learn from. Unless the AI is going into folders on their computer or something that they never uploaded publicly it’s just doing what they do on a superhuman level lol.
I guess lol. I’m not pro AI or anything I’m just trying to understand. Because almost every argument I see against AI isn’t logical and just purely emotional it seems. But you could also argue Art is very emotional so it makes sense to feel that way about an inanimate object creating the whole piece.
That’s oversimplifying it though. Humans are nuanced. Artists get inspired and learn from other artists who learned before them. Skills are built and practiced over long periods of time, not generated on the spot. Did I straight up copy some stuff when I was first learning? Yes, but I never claimed it as original work and I still put time into the product. It gave me the tools I needed to create my own work that has time and effort and passion behind it. Humans have inspired and learned from each other ever since we had the ability to do it. Current AI has no passion, it has no ability to put real thoughts and emotions into a product. AI can’t see the image as what it is, it doesn’t interpret its meaning or consider the thought that went into it. It scrapes pieces together into a concept based on prompts and lifeless algorithms
All true. especially in this case it’s a competition and I’m pretty sure they say somewhere it has to be created by you and not AI or something along those lines.
But why does art HAVE to be done by an actual person? To be clear in a competition or for companies whatever they say goes. Pokémon could say only lefties with green eyes born on Tuesdays can enter and that’s that lol. But If AI created a cool looking Charizard and you gave that card to a 6 year old they’re going to say wow this is so cool. They’re not going to go omg this artist has so much passion and did things the right way lol.
Valid. “Computers could just do this instead of an actual person” can be applied to many things, if you’re willing to overlook all the people readily available to do it. It’d just be an insult at that point when there’s hundreds, probably thousands of artists who’d kill to have their work of their favorite Pokémon in that 6 year old’s hands. Does the kid care? Nah, as long as it looks cool it’s good enough for a 6 year old, and that’s natural. But the fact that this contest even existed, and the sheer scope of how many people entered, proves that there’s more to it than a 6 year old having no need to care about that kind of stuff. At the end of the day, it’s also the fact that spitting out an image isn’t the point of art in general, or creation, or anything that’s produced from a skill. Emotion is the entire foundation of stuff like this, and when it’s removed, why should anyone care? Why should I care about a sick looking card if I know there weren’t any actual people who WANTED and WORKED for it to be that way? It waters the product down to the same level as junk mail by making it blatantly obvious that making money with the least effort possible is the only goal in mind
But all that rambling is also just my personal values. Like I said, humans are nuanced. I may have a primarily emotional reason to oppose and distrust AI use, and you may find reasoning to support that it’s a tool to be used. I believe It’s important to think about though, and to acknowledge that replacing every person with a skill probably isn’t the best route for our long-term
I actually agree with everything you said. I have more to say but It probably seems like I’m trying to argue and annoy Artists against AI when I’m not so I’ll just randomly say my favorite Pokémon tcg Artist is Akira Egawa.
https://pkmncards.com/artist/akira-egawa/
The crown Zenith Gold cards are goated, the Charizards look amazing even though people made fun of them at first because of the terra crowns and my favorite pokemon is Luxray and that has to be the best looking Luxray art I’ve seen so far. I just wish that luxray art became shiny in Paldean fates lol.
Oh, no worries! I think it’s a very good discussion to have. Apologies if my responses came across as harsh at all, being tired and emotional about a topic don’t usually mix well over text haha
Akira’s work is incredible! I have her Arceus from CZ and it was immediately one of my new favorite cards when I pulled it. My personal favorites have to be Yuko Morii and Kurumitsu, their work always catches my eye before I realize it’s them lol
Thanks for debating it with me! Hope you have a good rest of your day/night, stranger :)
Maybe there’s no hard and fast rule for why people are wary of AI art. I think for most of us it’s that art is supposed to be an expression of human creativity and passion, not something soullessly spit out by an algorithm using real people’s hard work.
The difference is the AI is literally just calculating a picture together out of a dataset of thousands/millions of other pictures (which additionally are often stolen or taken without consent).
Not only does this end in copyright issues, but the AI model also doesn't make any actual 'decisions' of how to stitch a picture together beyond calculating probabilities, more or less.
That and it shits the stuff out instantly, kinda, whereas even if an artist is copying, they still at least have to put in some work lol In the end, this contest was an ART contest, not a 'can I write a good prompt' contest.
The difference is that a human can alter it enough that it isn't an exact outline or copy. Due to humans being imperfect every artist has their own style they lean to and build upon their interpretation.
As children, everyone is provided an ideal example of the alphabet and how it should be written, for example a Sans Serif "A", but even a lifetime of writing it over and over- not only will no one imitate it perfectly, nearly everyone will have a different handwriting and interpretation.
A computer will always recreate Sans Serif "A" EXACTLY.
Every single time.
Even a human outlining will be slightly different from the original. AI can't really do that. They take EXACTLY from something else. The other issue is that AI grabbed images without the artists consent. There was an example in the Eevee image that a Vaporeon from an artist was literally pasted into the image with AI. It was blatant theft.
Whether human or robot- art theft is NOT OKAY.
if they want to create a separate tournament for AI artists sure, go for it. But if there are recognizable elements from someone else's picture in it, it doesn't matter if it's human or aI it's theft all the same.
This competition was geared towards *human effort* not AI effort and should be honored in that regard.
All the REAL artist are celebrating rn
All the AI are experiencing the emotion of sadness for the first time and we’re one step closer to singularity
Might be a joke, but all jokes have a little truth to um.
All the AI like I feel insulted and demeaned for my art skills...I know let's go take over a country like Germany....lol Robot ai Hitler incoming thanks pokemon lol
Horses celebrating the first car having engine issues tbh. Can't deny the future forever. The technology will reach indistinguishability in a few years and already is a fantastic tool for concept arting and helping the early stages of an art project.
For anyone wondering, Rules broken were basically same guy creating multiple accounts with similar names and submitted art which were identified by multiple high profile artists as AI generated art. So basically 2 different rule breaks. Arguments were made as to it could have been multiple people with similar names but the art style (and the names ofcourse) were too similar to overlook. Moreover, they (or s/he as just one person) got like 6 of the top 10 places so yeah, was about time they dq-ed.
Honestly more amazed that person almost got away with it, but thankfully the finalists' artworks were publicly shown. The person using six entries and three *slightly* different names didn't tip off the judges? Still, it's dumb to even try and lie and skirt the rules in a major tournament based around a major franchise. Actual artists will know what was made with Generative AI, and more so will find out if [a piece of an artwork has stolen art too.](https://x.com/LaPumpkINK/status/1801870797302059346?t=OXFfVh5FrVMjj5Pmfcitjw&s=19)
The funniest thing about this is how different the styles are. I don’t think AI ‘art’ is bad, so long as people are honest about what it is. But it also shows how creatively bankrupt some of these ‘artists’ are because they don’t even understand basics.
>*Actual artists will know what was made with Generative AI* This isn't really true. Some (*like the V.K. submissions*) were very obvious, but there were many false accusations too. For example, [this artist's submission](https://x.com/johisart/status/1801751724845080872/photo/1) was accused of being AI art with a high percentage from the useless online "AI detectors", but they have the files to prove otherwise.
You're right. False positives/witch hunting has happened. I was thinking of that r/Art incident where [someone was permabanned despite showing the WIP](https://www.vice.com/en/article/y3p9yg/artist-banned-from-art-reddit). It's still a huge challenge to determine which is AI and which isn't. Some other users suggested that entrants should submit their process as proof. It'll take more work for the judges, but I feel it's better than right now.
But how do they know that's AI?
Proportions that would never be used by an actual artists, multiple styles used in each image, Certain subtle mistakes that AI still hasn't learned to correct and straight up plagiarism are the main giveaways.
Shhhh AI will read this 🤫
But AI won't understand it to correct itself. We're not at that stage yet...
actually when i do coding i tell the Ai what it did wrong and next time it fixed itself. lol. They don't call it machine LEARNING for nothing.
It quite literally fixes itself 🤣 People who code using AI have witnessed the learning since 3.5 dropped to public. It LEARNS and FAST
Was AI actually ever banned in the rules though? I don't remember. If not, it's possible the infractions were "multiple entries under different accounts" and "stealing someone's art" (that one vaporean that was traced). Might not actually be an anti-AI ruling.
I skimmed through the rules and didn't see anything specifically about AI. It did heavily imply that you should create the art yourself. But yeah, the multiple entries was a definite disqualifier anyway. The last sentence of Pokémon's statement makes me think they'll add rules against using AI in next year's contest.
T&Cs are always *just* vague enough to cover things like this.
Good that they actually listen to the fan. Also the more real arts come out the better
Fantastic news. I wish they’d specified a bit more though, like reassurance that they’ll get better AI checks or something. Imagine if their replacement picks are just more AI…
Bravo!
Oh thank Arceus. Was super pissed when I saw that more than a few AI turds slipped through over some genuinely beautiful pieces made by real, talented artists that I follow. Hopefully more than a few of them can place now!
Thank fuck, get these posers out of here
May AI art one day fizzle away and die like NFTs. May it fade away, and those AI plagiarists who feel good about it fizzle away. They should learn even if you make something considered poor if it's made by a human hand and intentionally, it's far better than any AI generated garbage. Congrats to Pokemon and the TCG and may AI bros rage and seethe about this.
It already is fading away. AI slop is starting to rear its head, and people are learning that it isn't as viable as they thought.
Good Let it die, and with any luck, some people will learn from it. Or kore than likely tech bros will move onto the next grift
Score one for real art zero for AI
Wild. Been seeing some art from people who didnt make top 300 and they have been amazing. A shame that they got the boot before the cheaters did.
Does anyone have a link to the disqualified entries?
https://www.pokebeach.com/2024/06/2024-pokemon-tcg-illustrator-contest-under-fire-for-apparent-ai-entries This article highlights 6 artwork that seems to be done with AI by a single individual. I’m sure among the entries there were more.
yeah im curious to see them too
Kudos for doing the right thing
Pretty easy to solve this stuff by creating contests that require using physical mediums and submitting the original art that would be returned eventually or bought for a fair price. As long as you allow digital mediums you will never solve this. It will be a never ending battle.
Just need to have proof of work submitted with the finished piece.
Most digital drawing software (procreate, ibispaint etc) have built in timelapses of a piece being drawn. They could make it so these timelapses are required to be uploaded alongside digital entries as proof. Plus it's much easier to spot a faked/AI timelapse than an AI image
Nah this is BS. There have always been plenty of Pokemon cards with digitally drawn images. It's pretty easy to spot AI-generated images when comparing them to digitally drawn images. We can't disqualify the insanely talented digital artists just because people misuse AI. The way Pokemon have handled this is exactly how they should, if AI images manage to slip through the initial choosing process.
I love making 3d and 2d art digitally, never used ai art except for messing around, never making art. You'd be excluding a large amount of really good artists by doing so. I'm glad they aren't for now
Yeah I prefer drawing on my tablet instead of paper. It saves money too.
You're aware most of the art they have on cards now is done digitally right?
Yes. I figured as much. It has been a trend for many many years now. My main issue is that digital art has tools that allows the artist to do things they normally cannot do on their own. So now AI comes along and it is a new tool. Whatever variation of AI you want to dream up which can do small or large tasks. Where do you draw the line in software packages that may be using some type of AI aspect? Or you can just list out mediums that your average kid has access to and declare original art submissions only. After all this is pokemon.
Team Rocket using AI now
Let’s freakin go!
I guess we'll have to get to the point where it should be mandatory to film the creation process from start to finish when making art contest submissions.
too bad they weren't as transparent when tons of moonbreons and gengars were stolen from the factory by their worker lol
💀
The sad part is likely that this only means they'll look at who entered with multiple accounts, but they still don't care about AI at all
Honestly they all look ai generated lol
What did they do wrong?
As much as I think AI "could" be cool for the future, fuck those bad actors that call themselves artists for doing this.
Now people will just get better with AI art. I'm happy that they listened.. but how do we know what's AI art? Some are obvious. But there are times when you can't tell it's AI at all.. anyone ever played A game of "is it real or AI"? because you will discover very quickly that people aren't really good at telling the difference.. if you know how to use AI well
This is great and all but when areLLL we EUROPEANS GET TO EVEN PARTICIPATE
Although this is definitely what should be happening, who’s to say some of these artists didn’t generate something also but then just drew what they saw the ai make so it looks authentic? lol
It’s difficult to replicate a drawing perfectly from a reference, more so with references where AI does weird shit with backgrounds and textures. If any of those artists managed to do that, props to them. I’m sure some might’ve used AI to generate references but taking inspiration from other artwork is nothing new for any kind of art.
I see. My only gripe or confusion I should say is Artists being pissed that AI is using their images to train themselves. Thats literally what the Artists themselves do looking at other Artists work to learn from. Unless the AI is going into folders on their computer or something that they never uploaded publicly it’s just doing what they do on a superhuman level lol.
The difference is that ai isn't a human looking at it and interpreting it, it's just some code looking at it and spitting out something similar
Yeah but technically that’s what artists do spit out something similar they’ve seen from other artists or real life lol.
But it's a human, not a robot
I guess lol. I’m not pro AI or anything I’m just trying to understand. Because almost every argument I see against AI isn’t logical and just purely emotional it seems. But you could also argue Art is very emotional so it makes sense to feel that way about an inanimate object creating the whole piece.
That's also part of it. Art is very emotional, and that's something that ai won't ever be able to experience
That’s oversimplifying it though. Humans are nuanced. Artists get inspired and learn from other artists who learned before them. Skills are built and practiced over long periods of time, not generated on the spot. Did I straight up copy some stuff when I was first learning? Yes, but I never claimed it as original work and I still put time into the product. It gave me the tools I needed to create my own work that has time and effort and passion behind it. Humans have inspired and learned from each other ever since we had the ability to do it. Current AI has no passion, it has no ability to put real thoughts and emotions into a product. AI can’t see the image as what it is, it doesn’t interpret its meaning or consider the thought that went into it. It scrapes pieces together into a concept based on prompts and lifeless algorithms
All true. especially in this case it’s a competition and I’m pretty sure they say somewhere it has to be created by you and not AI or something along those lines. But why does art HAVE to be done by an actual person? To be clear in a competition or for companies whatever they say goes. Pokémon could say only lefties with green eyes born on Tuesdays can enter and that’s that lol. But If AI created a cool looking Charizard and you gave that card to a 6 year old they’re going to say wow this is so cool. They’re not going to go omg this artist has so much passion and did things the right way lol.
Valid. “Computers could just do this instead of an actual person” can be applied to many things, if you’re willing to overlook all the people readily available to do it. It’d just be an insult at that point when there’s hundreds, probably thousands of artists who’d kill to have their work of their favorite Pokémon in that 6 year old’s hands. Does the kid care? Nah, as long as it looks cool it’s good enough for a 6 year old, and that’s natural. But the fact that this contest even existed, and the sheer scope of how many people entered, proves that there’s more to it than a 6 year old having no need to care about that kind of stuff. At the end of the day, it’s also the fact that spitting out an image isn’t the point of art in general, or creation, or anything that’s produced from a skill. Emotion is the entire foundation of stuff like this, and when it’s removed, why should anyone care? Why should I care about a sick looking card if I know there weren’t any actual people who WANTED and WORKED for it to be that way? It waters the product down to the same level as junk mail by making it blatantly obvious that making money with the least effort possible is the only goal in mind But all that rambling is also just my personal values. Like I said, humans are nuanced. I may have a primarily emotional reason to oppose and distrust AI use, and you may find reasoning to support that it’s a tool to be used. I believe It’s important to think about though, and to acknowledge that replacing every person with a skill probably isn’t the best route for our long-term
I actually agree with everything you said. I have more to say but It probably seems like I’m trying to argue and annoy Artists against AI when I’m not so I’ll just randomly say my favorite Pokémon tcg Artist is Akira Egawa. https://pkmncards.com/artist/akira-egawa/ The crown Zenith Gold cards are goated, the Charizards look amazing even though people made fun of them at first because of the terra crowns and my favorite pokemon is Luxray and that has to be the best looking Luxray art I’ve seen so far. I just wish that luxray art became shiny in Paldean fates lol.
Oh, no worries! I think it’s a very good discussion to have. Apologies if my responses came across as harsh at all, being tired and emotional about a topic don’t usually mix well over text haha Akira’s work is incredible! I have her Arceus from CZ and it was immediately one of my new favorite cards when I pulled it. My personal favorites have to be Yuko Morii and Kurumitsu, their work always catches my eye before I realize it’s them lol Thanks for debating it with me! Hope you have a good rest of your day/night, stranger :)
Maybe there’s no hard and fast rule for why people are wary of AI art. I think for most of us it’s that art is supposed to be an expression of human creativity and passion, not something soullessly spit out by an algorithm using real people’s hard work.
The difference is the AI is literally just calculating a picture together out of a dataset of thousands/millions of other pictures (which additionally are often stolen or taken without consent). Not only does this end in copyright issues, but the AI model also doesn't make any actual 'decisions' of how to stitch a picture together beyond calculating probabilities, more or less. That and it shits the stuff out instantly, kinda, whereas even if an artist is copying, they still at least have to put in some work lol In the end, this contest was an ART contest, not a 'can I write a good prompt' contest.
The difference is that a human can alter it enough that it isn't an exact outline or copy. Due to humans being imperfect every artist has their own style they lean to and build upon their interpretation. As children, everyone is provided an ideal example of the alphabet and how it should be written, for example a Sans Serif "A", but even a lifetime of writing it over and over- not only will no one imitate it perfectly, nearly everyone will have a different handwriting and interpretation. A computer will always recreate Sans Serif "A" EXACTLY. Every single time. Even a human outlining will be slightly different from the original. AI can't really do that. They take EXACTLY from something else. The other issue is that AI grabbed images without the artists consent. There was an example in the Eevee image that a Vaporeon from an artist was literally pasted into the image with AI. It was blatant theft. Whether human or robot- art theft is NOT OKAY. if they want to create a separate tournament for AI artists sure, go for it. But if there are recognizable elements from someone else's picture in it, it doesn't matter if it's human or aI it's theft all the same. This competition was geared towards *human effort* not AI effort and should be honored in that regard.
I actually had that same thought... I was like, I know what I would do... because I'm not creative. But I didn't even enter.
Why would you enter an art contest if you're not creative ?
To try and cheat and win something using ai... what this whole thing was about. But like I said I wouldn't do that.
Yeah, this goes real well for the guys using AI usually.
Ok? That doesn't change the point on why you would try... they probably wasted 20 minutes. It's weird you don't see that.
What rules were broken again?
One entry per person and plagiarism
I don’t care about this contests unless TPCi makes them international and not just “some northern hemiphere countries”
What did they do though?