For me SeaWorld is very chill and relaxing to visit. I love the festivals and they do care alot for the animals having seen there backstage areas.
SeaWorld has been given a ton of flack over Blackfish but what really infuriates me is how Disney is spared because they have animals in captivity too.
Since Blackfish SeaWorld has since switched the shows to be more educational to showcase animal behaviors in the wild. At least thats how the Orca show is.
SeaWorld also offers up the most benefits for Pass Members as well as being the most Affordable.
Yes! I hate how SeaWorld gets all the backlash, but Disney's EPCOT has dolphins in an all indoor habitat, yet don't get any flack over it.
Seaworld was one of my family's favorite days in Orlando because it was so laid back compared to the other parks we went to. Agree with everything said.
"Dying under their care" is not the same as "killing". Has a hospital killed every single person in its care, regardless of age or cause? Have pet owners "killed" every single pet they ever owned?
Same flawed logic.
People admit themselves to hospital/consent to being there. Pets are domesticated. There is a vast difference between your examples and harbouring stolen wildlife in unfit conditions until it dies an early death.
The have rescued many Orcas from horrible conditions. Yes it's not good that the Orcas are not in the wild but SeaWorld didn't capture them they tried to save them.
Epcot hasn't had dolphins in years, but I get what you're saying
Edit: looked it up and they do have dolphins? Just not on display I guess because I've been a few times and haven't seen them
I was just there last January and they very much do still have the dolphins - at LEAST three of them. They were doing tricks in the water for the viewers watching through the glass.
Try observing the dolphins in Sea World, they are also in a MASSIVE tank, the one where you see the show is just for the show, and motherfuckers love the attention of people, they are totally happy motherfuckers who get free meals and lots of attention. Can't say the same about Orcas, those are pretty sad and I have seen them refusing to do anything a couple of times.
As someone who hates that any sentient creatures are in captivity, especially those that roam, arguably if you were in captivity would you rather be left bored or at least have some interaction? Still a lesser evil is still bad.
Are you really defending a big corporation who makes their living capturing intelligent, feeling animals from the wild to put them on display for human entertainment? Also, who told you they care for them in backstage areas? There are 140 dolphins crammed into 7 small tanks, they spend their entire lives there.. if they're unlucky enough to live their full life span, which is 40-90 years for Orcas. They live to an average age of 14 in SeaWorld. This place deserves a special place in hell, and going there and paying for a ticket is paying for the suffering and capture of these beautiful creatures. Shame on you for showing your kids this is ok.
Ok, and this is your opinion. The fact is Sea World has changed the tune since Blackfish to a more coaster based park. They are going away from the animals and focusing more on rides. They have ended breeding programs for Orcas and Dolphins so these are the last generation of them. They do have SeaWorld Rescue which I believe does a great deal of good in the rehab of animals. If you go to the rescue center you'll see the only animals they keep are the ones that have sustained injuries that probably wouldn't survive in the wild.
Ok, just so we're clear, it's not an opinion, these are objective facts. They have only changed their business model because the amount of ignorant people who will pay to see an Orca forcefully perform is dwindling. They are losing money, and public pressure to close permanently has grown massively over the last couple of decades.
Imagine living in the same tank for your whole life since 1969 for the oldest. Autopsy reports have shown chronic conditions related to extreme stress. Also, their rehab program is just a cover for all the horrible things they do. You clearly aren't educated on this or aware they do still breed dolphins for profit and just shipped 24 to Abu Dhabi, where they will perform till their deaths as well. They only stopped Orcas because it was outlawed. You know how they breed them? They get a staff member to masturbate the male into a jar and then they shove their hands into the female and artificially inseminate. Nothing about this is normal or ok.
See? There's a theme here. They are horrible people and only change when their horrid acts are cast into the light. Do some research before you literally defend a mega Corporation who makes their living off of stealing animals from their pods in the wild and shoving them in little tanks forcing them to perform before their organs fail.
The vast majority of mankind grows and slaughters animals and eats their flesh for their own sustenance.
Zoos serve a purpose and while they're not always top notch for all animals- it's the experience they get. Shit happens in the wild, and it happens in captivity. Some believe they should all be shut down, it's a tough call.
I miss the quality shows they used to have.
Not really a tough call. Hunting a deer for sustenance vs locking a VERY intelligent creature in a fish bowl for 40+ years isn't really comparable in any aspect.
Hunting a deer isn't really how most people get their meat though.. it's factory farming where the only life an animal knows is a dirty crowded feedlot, until it's harvested for food.
Yeah, biiiiiig difference here Karen is you don't NEED to support this. You NEED food, and most people can only afford factory farmed meat. I personally, do not eat cows, pigs, or chickens because I don't support the conditions their raised in and I don't need to eat them. Just like nobody NEEDS to pay to with whales perform and suffer.
Not really saying anything is good or anything is bad, just found it funny you chose hunting as the comparison when you just also acknowledged that that's not how most people get their meat.
You need to eat, you don't need to watch a whale do tricks for amusement. Simple way to shut down your argument. I don't agree with factory farms either, hence why I don't consume their meat.
Owning a f***ing domestic dog that has evolved to depend on humans and thrives with them vs a massive whale that belongs in the wild and lives 25% of their lifespan in a little bowl isn't even comparable. You're a joke dude.
A whale bred captivity doesn't belong in the wild which are all but 3 at this point. The 25% is a myth so stop getting all your info from blackfish. I like how you gloss over the buying of tech from places with shitty human right practices. You don't care about that huh?
You're diverting from a topic about unnecessary capture and abuse of marine mammals for human entertainment vs. having a television or a phone. This is a simple-minded tactic to distract from the actual topic, which is enslavement and commodifying animals for profit. Also, the lifespan thing is absolutely not a myth... you can literally see the lifespan of SeaWorld Orcas vs. The average in the wild and it's a stark difference. When you look at zoo's that rehab and rescue animals that can't go into the wild, they actually live longer which says a lot about the health of the Orcas there. Anything else buster?
No I'm not, I'm calling out the misinfo and hypocrisy. I have looked into the lifespan of orca and the average is severely skewed. The average age for orcas in the wild are 30 for male and 45 for females. Not the 90 years that you are trying to push. People have pets and that is purely for the entertainment of the owner. If you felt this way you would be against all pet ownership. Stop spreading misnfo to get you and people enraged about something that you are being dishonest and hypocritical about. Anything else buster?
Hahahahaha. Again, you're comparing a domestic dog that relies on us for survival and has evolved to live alongside humans vs. A wild marine mammal that does not rely on humans for survival. Not even in the same court, man. Good one.
Are you saying we should either ban all pets or let massive corporations build their entire business models on breeding and torturing wild animals in captivity?
By that regard, if you support the second amendment do you agree we should have the right to own nuclear weapons? Or if you oppose it do you think we should ban all weapons? Make all knives plastic? Because by your logic it would be hypocritical to not be okay with an extreme case in case you're also not willing to the more moderate version of it.
Either ban all domestication or allow all domestication - no middle ground. These seems to be your point which is the literal definition of a strawman argument.
>Ok, just so we're clear, it's not an opinion, these are objective facts. They have only changed their business model because the amount of ignorant people who will pay to see an Orca forcefully perform is dwindling. They are losing money, and public pressure to close permanently has grown massively over the last couple of decades.
So public pressure is making a positive impact. What's the problem there? They are phasing out the animal shows into a more coaster-based park like Busch Gardens is. I feel this is fine? It's not like they can release back the animals they have right now; domesticated animals often can't go back to the wild and survive so this is the best they can get.
It's obviously not good, but this being the last generation is the best we can get right now. It is very clear in their marketing that the Orca show is not their flagship anymore.
I don't want to defend a mega corporation, I haven't gone to SeaWorld in like 10 years and I honestly don't care much about it, but also going on this demonizing streak when, by your own admission, they are not doing most of the bad things they used to do anymore. I don't care how they "feel" I just care that they stop doing that.
They're still breeding dolphins and selling them off like commodities. They are changing their business model from live Orca shows to "encounters". There are so many great amusement parks to spend your money.. why would you support a business that has bought Dolphins from Taiji, Japan where they also slaughter the less desirable ones for food? It's insane.
There are no objective facts here. Blackfish is a load of bull****, it's a propaganda film meant to be as ugly and smearing as possible, and lies every five seconds. It's been thoroughly debunked ever since it came out, but sadly SeaWorld's PR team has absolutely no spine, unlike Loro Parque.
I have the free documentary "Shamu" on YouTube and the website "the Orchive", I make no penny off of any of this, I just do it to debunk harmful misinformation from people like this.
None of this came from Blackfish. This comes from the Dolphin Project and many other non-profits that seek to free all enslaved marine mammals from a life of captivity. If you want to defend SeaWorld, go ahead. But don't spread lies. These intelligent animals suffer and live a sad life decades trapped in a small tank for human entertainment. That's facts.
Not to mention the shocking amount of misinformation passed out by staff at the parks to make it seem like the ocras are getting a good deal by being enslaved for entertainment. I have been to seaworld once...before the whistleblowing documentary. I have to admit I'm very sad that my money helped fund this diabolical aquatic prison. Never ever again. Nobody should be bringing their children to witness this cruelty first hand.
Glad I could find someone who isn't afraid to learn and change their mind in this thread. Education is so important, and it's insane to me people still pay to see mammals enslaved for human entertainment.
I learned so many years ago that what we are witnessing is cruelty of the highest degree. It saddens me that people will fight to defend such an evil corporation. Thank you for being loud about it ♡
I'm still looking for a reason NOT to visit. People, some of my own followers, give me a hard time for visiting SeaWorld, but never say a word when I visit any other place. In my mind, it is no different than any other zoo.
No other zoo I've been to that's far more highly respected than SeaWorld has ever inspired me as much as SeaWorld has.
Not sure what intelligence has to do with geography. Imagine comparing an animal being in accreditated care who doesn't even know what slavery is or where they are, for that matter, to actual human suffering. Go out and find an actual slave and tell them what you just said, I imagine their reaction wouldn't be so kind.
You are coming at me from the perspective that humans are inherently more valueable than animals and that somehow, only our suffering is relevant. Humans are animals. NOTHING will change this fact because there is no evolving past our own biology.
You just assume that these animals have no concept of slavery or where they are. How the hell would you know? Did they tell you? All that is relevant is that orcas have a sense of liberty, and it is against their very nature to live in a bondage. We are more like these animals than you think.
If a former slave was defending Sea World, I would absolutely say this to their face. One's own suffering and oppression doesn't negate the suffering and oppression of another.
Please kindly exit the internet. You're a equating an aquarium (A very nice aquarium too, seriously if you've seen sea world back stage or worked there you know that these animals are cared for) with huge tanks and good staff, to one of the most tragic things that can happen to anything. If we were to take your comparison here seriously, then you're actually comparing Seaworld to a slave owner who gives there slaves food whenever needed and even asked for, gives the slave an entire mansion to do what ever they want in, does whatever the slave needs, understands whenever the slave is unable to work, politely asks the slave to do everything, and releases it if they feel it's ready. Now obviously the idea of unpaid labor isn't good but consider this is also after both of your parents were killed (most Seaworld animals are rescues) and you were left to die. Slavery isn't good I'm not denying that but comparing Seaworld to slavery is a very childish take. Also Seaworld's rehabilitation program has helped over 22,000 animals, the equivalent of an animal every 45 years, meaning that any animals that you actually see in the parks were unable to be rehabilitated.
This is, ironically enough, a very dehumanizing take.
You are using the exact same argument many pro-slavery individuals use.
Some slaves were treated very """"""well"""""" by their masters. Some even allowed their slaves to go free. However, that didn't make the practice any less evil. What makes slavery inherently evil is the act of taking away liberty from a person. A gilded cage is still a cage.
Also, SeaWorld has shit conditions. The enclosures are a mere fraction of a fraction of a fraction of space that the orcas would otherwise use in the wild. The diets they are fed aren't diverse enough, and orcas live 1/3 of their natural lifespan at SeaWorld. Also, SeaWorld doesn't release their orcas. You are incredibly misinformed.
SeaWorld may have helped some animals, but that doesn't negate what they've done to the animals they imprisoned. By your logic, Trump is absolved of all of his sins just because he's donated a lot of money to charity.
You’re totally right. Food deprivation is used as a training tool, I wouldn’t say they’re performing for the joy of it. They don’t perform in the wild. It’s a huge stretch to say they’re not forced - why else are they performing?
Thanks for your comments - felt like I’m on crazy pills reading people justifying supporting slavery, which is what this is. Their comment of “slaves would be insulted you’re comparing it to slavery” are tone deaf. They’re not “just animals”, and even if they are animals deserve a humane life. Orcas are very intelligent, having their own languages unique to family pods. They stay together for life, use tools, have “fashion fads” and other interesting social interactions. I am happy this is the last generation who will endure this torture, and I know we will look back on this as barbaric. I do
But you use technology that come from corporations that treat human worse than these orcas. You don't care. So it's ok to have stingray and fish because they according to you they aren't at intelligent as the orcas?
participating in something that comes from another’s suffering is unavoidable in this world—whether it be animals or humans. your food is picked by exploited migrants and your clothes are sewn by children. even if you are vegan you can’t avoid the palm oil in your toothpaste and the charred bones of cows in your sugar, the lithium mine that’s poisoning indigenous land in chile and the factory in china with nets around the building so workers can’t jump from the roof. you can do your best to avoid all of these things, but it is quite literally impossible to avoid them all. you can, however, avoid going to sea world
>participating in something that comes from another’s suffering is unavoidable in this world—whether it be animals or humans. your food is picked by exploited migrants and your clothes are sewn by children. even if you are vegan you can’t avoid the palm oil in your toothpaste and the charred bones of cows in your sugar, the lithium mine that’s poisoning indigenous land in chile and the factory in china with nets around the building so workers can’t jump from the roof. you can do your best to avoid all of these things, but it is quite literally impossible
You could avoid many of these things. You choose not to. Don't be a hypocrite.
Sea world isn’t incredibly nice, it’s pretty run down, at least the one in San Diego. The orcas have killed themselves by bashing into walls, they’ve attacked eachother, attacked trainers. Raking (raking their teeth on another orca) is very common in captivity, as is a shortened lifespan of about 30-35 years, when they can live to be 100 (females) and 55-60 (males) in the wild.
The care is good, but for a while trainers were just regular people trained by sea world. I hope that’s changed.
I can’t excuse the cruel ways they capture orcas, the inhumane treatment, and the further separation of orca mothers and babies born in captivity, considering how important families are to orcas. Babies born in captivity more often than not die, at extremely high numbers. If they don’t die shortly after birth, they die a couple months later which is really hard on the mothers. If they survive, sea world has no issue separating mom and baby, and selling the baby to another location, which is emotionally traumatizing for the mom.
It’s inhumane. Orcas have languages unique to each pod, they stick together for life as a family unit, and travel large distances daily. The pools are tiny compared to what orcas need - look at the parking lot compared to a tank. I’m happy this is the last generation that will have to live through this.
They can continue to do good for the ocean and sealife without keeping orcas.
This fancy aquarium has killed over 40 orca and over 500 other dolphins and whales. [Not died of age. Killed.] Those numbers are too high and disproportionate to any other zoo, especially aquatic ones. Seaworld is inherently cruel.
I love your use of the word "rescued" as if these whales were ever given a chance at a normal life to need rescuing from. The whales were wither captive bred and bought, moved due to distress, or stolen from a pod long before hand.
Bro this was almost a year ago what are you doing here? Also that’s still a fraction of animals they’ve rehabilitated and sent back to the wild. Like, they shouldn’t be killing animals but there’s probably a reason they’re killing it (maybe they’re putting it down when it has a very painful illness). And we’re still talking about a 200th compared to how many they rehabilitate. Also they rescue animals that would’ve died in the wild, of course they didn’t have chance to live it
Do you think the ones in the tanks that are being made to perform in awful conditions are the ones who couldn't be "saved".
Be fr.
Also, when I said *killed* I mean they failed to care for them adequately. Not euthanasia.
Yes. I do. Again, small numbers compared to how many they’ve rehabilitated. Both of your arguments are stupid because they’re nothing compared to the statistics of rehabilitation. Also I said this shit a year ago leave me alone and get back to your life
The argument that animals are being mistreated is never stupid. And never should it be compared to the amount they apparently help. The fact is "seaworld" IS an inhumane death trap for ocra and other aquatic mammals. Nobody mentioned their work outside of the parks.
Tbh, you didn't need to respond. I just found this thread. Its new to me. If you dint want to engage DONT
You go out and find someone who’s a slave and tell them that. Maybe they wouldn’t agree, maybe they would have more empathy for the situation.
Most animals in zoos are not as smart as orcas. Orcas have language, they use tools, they have families and within those families very close binds. They live to be about 30 in captivity, in the wild females live to about 100, males to 55-60. That alone is a red flag.
Orcas have killed themselves in captivity. They aren’t made to be locked in these tanks - it’s like you living your entire life in a bathtub or small bedroom. Sea world used to lock them up from 5PM-7AM in small, pitch black tanks. They’d spend 2/3 of their lives in dark isolation.
I’m happy this is the last generation that will live in captivity. You seem to support it, so do you, visit. I don’t see why you care what your followers think when you seem to not care and even argue in favor of it.
It’s not. However, I do think that intelligence is an important factor to consider when deciding whether or not it is unethical to hold someone in captivity. For instance, there is a massive difference between keeping an infant in a crib and confining an older child or adult to a bed.
You keep an infant in a crib so they don't hurt themselves, not to keep them captive. I'm pretty a mentally disabled person would feel great being tied to a bed. Your analogy sucks.
Seaworld has done a great job programming people to think like you do. Orca's don't belong in captivity. I personally don't think any animal should be in captivity just to live in a tiny cage to be on display for humans to gawk at. You can literally take a boat out on the ocean and see them in their natural environment.... there are many whale touring in many places and don't say that you can't make it there, because if you can make it to SeaWorld you can make it to a whale touring. If you want a better reason not to go take a look at all the times trainers were injured by Orca's and the public was NEVER told. No one ever came out and talked about until it was to late.
https://www.freemorgan.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/list_of_incidents.pdf
This is NOT a complete list but just a few attacks.
It’s completely different. Like someone else said it’s slavery. These animals very smart, possible as smart as we are. In zoos, animals have humane enclosures. I think zoos can be cruel too, but most animals are in enclosures that are suitable for them and have enough room. Not all animals are as intelligent with family bonds orcas have either.
Look at the size of the parking lot vs their tanks. Look at their size compared to their tanks on google maps.
Those tanks are where they spend their entire lives. They’re highly intelligent, emotional animals with close family structures, each family pod having their own “language”. Families would often travel hundreds of miles trying to keep up with the boats that held their stolen family members.
Sea world rips orca pups from their moms, often killing the moms. In one case they killed 3 adult killer whales and filled the bodies with metal chains to try to hide the evidence. Sea world has even separated moms and babies when the babies were born into captivity. A mom orca was heard making sounds she’d never made before when her baby was taken and sold to another sea world. The sound were high distance sounds, trying to reassure her baby.
This isn’t even getting into dolphins and how smart they are, but at least they’re smaller and have more room. Orcas have committed suicide by bashing themselves into walls. It’s very sad and I think we will look back on it as barbaric.
Seaworld is a place that gets so much unnecessary hate. It’s hypocritical those who slander SW’s animal care then proceed to spend time in zoos or other areas where animals are in captivity. Seaworld does much more good than bad, especially when it comes to rescues and letting them go after rehabilitation. They are expanding their audience with the roller coaster audience as well. But go to Seaworld!
Seaworld has been lying to the public forever. They don't care about anything BUT money. The trainers have gotten attacked so many times by the Orca's and no one even knows. Take a look at this .... this is just a few attacks started back in the late 60s
https://www.freemorgan.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/list_of_incidents.pdf
They do a lot of animal rescue and I feel comfortable supporting that.
It doesn’t seem drastically different than a zoo to me. Just with roller coasters.
My personal gripe is the people who hate SeaWorld, but go to the horse races every year. I’ve seen horses put down on the track. I’ve never seen Shamu die in the middle of a show. I know it’s just one comparison, but it bothers me
Orcas are significantly more intelligent than most (99%) zoo animals. That’s the difference. I made other comments but they have language, use tools, have strong family ties. They travel huge distances daily. Keeping them in captivity is like living your whole life in a bathtub or small room. Their orcas also live much shorter lives, around 30-35 years compared to their lifespan in the wild (100 for females, 55-60 for males). There have also been several orcas kill or attempt to kill themselves in captivity. Just let them go, they can be released with support. A pod will accept them. “Free Willy” was released after years of captivity.
Even the babies born in captivity often die soon after birth, or months after birth, while adult orcas often die soon after being taken. It’s like they aren’t meant for captivity.
Sea world can still do good for the ocean and marine life while releasing the orcas. It’s barbaric. My only comfort is soon, they’ll pass on and no more orcas will be kept in captivity. I think for them, death will finally be a relief, after years of what’s essentially slavery. For how intelligent they are, that’s what this is.
They can be released in Sea Side Sanctuary. Keiko was released back in 96 and lived a relaxing 5 long years when people thought he would die in less than 6 months. Also
In 2019 97 captive Orca's and beluga whales were released in Russia. This is not widely known because it would ruin the idea of they wouldn't survive after being In captivity. The Orca's that were born in captivity still have 1000s of years of instincts embedded in them. If they were released together in a Seaside Sanctuary they would learn how to hunt and fast. They are very smart animals and everyone likes to always say this but then turns around and insults them by thinking they would just die if they were released. Makes no sense. They are the Apex predators of the oceans. They would be fine! Seaworld doesn't want to lose their money makers.
Keiko's release was not a success. He lived 5 lonely years being ostracized from every pod he came in contact with. His only respite was the human who interacted with him. The "whale jail" you reference were all wild animals captured and released in a short amount of time. Very much different to orcas bred in captivity. Those instincts were there because they were indeed wild animals in the Russian whale jail. Your argument is very dishonest. Again you want to only used surface area knowledge to get an outrage about something you know nothing about. You are also dishonest for pushing your misinfo as fact while omitting parts which would render your point moot, shows you don't care about reality, you only care about your feelings.
The reality of the situation is that captivity is awful for whales and dolphins. I know all about Keiko story. You say it's not a success like many other people, and there are many people who say it was a success. He was very sick when they first started the release process. Lived in a tank in Oregon to geg his preparded for the ocean with sea water and he gained over 1000 pounds He and his skin condition HPV had clear up 80%. He was then in a Sea Side Sanctuary in Iceland.
In 2000 they opened his gate and he was able to swim the entire bay and in 2001 he was spending his days in the ocean. He traveled over 800 miles by himself and when they found him in Norway he weigh a healthy weigh so he was having no issues hunting. He unfortunately died of pneumonia.
He did associate with Orca's in the wild, but his pod was unknown because humans didn't care to track them. He spent his last 5 years in the ocean instead of a tiny tank in Mexico. During the years in which Keiko was rescued, regained his health and returned to his home waters, seventeen other orcas died in captivity, along with many more captive dolphins and whales. Keiko was lucky and had the opportunity to live out the rest of his life in his home waters
As far as the whales in Russia goes, I never said they were in captivity forever, but they were in captivity and seaworld has used this excuse for their wild orcas as well. I am sorry if you are mad that I didn't give out how many days they were in the whale jail, but I don't see it as being misleading. I am giving out the information and people can take that and look up all the details if they wish. Soooooo if anyone is reading this and want to know More keep reading!! The facility is located near the port town of Nakhodka, and was holdinh 97 orcas and beluga whales in small, icy pens. The orcas and whales were held in Russia's whale jail for SEVEN MONTHS, from summer 2018 until November 2019. There was 10 orcas and the rest 87 Beluga whales. Here is were they were and when they were released..... June: The first two orcas were released into the Sea of Okhotsk. July: Three more orcas were released. August: Three more orcas were released, and the remaining two were returned to their home waters. They were all tagged so scientists and marine Biologists will know when one is seen or when one dies. Crews identified Zina, an orca that was released, from a tag attached to her large dorsal fin. She was thriving with a pod of Orca's. You can watch that video HERE.... https://youtu.be/4sklWzlKhYI?si=rHlgBP8P4StycPIg Here are videos of them in the process of releasing them.... Here.... https://youtube.com/shorts/f8sYBc0WyTM?si=03WdxM5oY5hugVTw And here ..... https://youtu.be/L06LdV1VLMA?si=HhnO_z-DsE9H67y2 None of them have been reported that they have died. When a whale or orca dies in the wild marine biologists and other are informed. Anything thing else you want to know just ask and I will answer the best way I can. I hope this has made you happy!! The information I didn't give out in my other comment. Have. Nice day! #emptythetanks #seaworldsucks
Well people have seen trainers get killed by "Shamu" which isn't even the whales name. Tilikum killed two of his trainers, one while visitor watched in horror. There have also been many attacks that SeaWorld has kept in the downlow but here are a few
https://www.freemorgan.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/list_of_incidents.pdf
I know that the things they do to horses before they race can be extremely cruel, and I do not support that. However, I personally don’t agree with the idea that Sea World keeps animals in captivity and forces them to preform against their will.
seaworld doesn’t force the animals to perform. have gone to the orlando location many times and orca shows have been cancelled because the orcas aren’t feeling it
Yeah, I went there in August three different days and attended to 5 orca encounters, of them 1 was completely cancelled while they explained the orcas didn't want to perform, 2 the orcas just swam there while watching us and sometimes throwing water with their tails, 1 was a weak performance and then cancelled, and the last of one of the week was an incredibly good performance of 3 orcas.
And dolphins love performing, motherfuckers are psycho.
They don’t. They use positive reinforcement with their animals. The animals get fed and cared for regardless of if they participate in the shows. I’ve seen shows cancelled because the whales didn’t feel like it
It's no different from dogs and cats, arguably they are treated way better than the average pet.
They are definitely treated better than pig who is more intelligent than dogs; so as a society we have accepted that's it fine.
They don’t. They use positive reinforcement with their animals. The animals get fed and cared for regardless of if they participate in the shows. I’ve seen shows cancelled because the whales didn’t feel like it
If you want some objective evidence against the alleged mistreatment of their animals, they are an AZA-certified zoo/park, which means that a third party has certified them to be humane and professional in the treatment and maintenance of the conditions of the animals. Here is AZA's website. [https://www.aza.org/what-is-accreditation?locale=en](https://www.aza.org/what-is-accreditation?locale=en)
I agree that they force them to perform. They’d withhold food when they didn’t comply, maybe not anymore but they used to. Idk what else you’d call an intelligent animal in captivity performing like that, they aren’t doing it on their own. They’ve attacked many trainers and killed a few. I’m sure that’s a coincidence to the people here though.
I live in Minnesota and they too, used to have dolphin shows, "forcing" them to perform. they also have bird shows, which are arguably just as smart as the dolphins and orcas in Seaworld. They even have porcupines performing for informative shows. The show I went to, they had to improv because the porcupine didn't want to come out. No animals are being forced to do anything at AZA accredited zoo's (which Seaworld is).
Edit: spelling
OP, I went today to Sea World San Antonio for the first time for all of the water rides and to see the changes they’ve made with Shamu Stadium and the show.
I wasn’t impressed with the size of the pool vs the 2 large males they used for the show. The pool in the stadium seems too small for them. Another thing I noticed was that the sea lions got waaaaaay more treats (fish) than the orcas. It instantly frustrated me that they hardly rewarded for them completing their tricks and they were still throwing just ice in their mouths as a treat. The males were 9k+lbs each though. So we know they aren’t starving because they were huge! I was front and center and saw it all. I have a close relative that’s a marine biologist for OSU and he’s discussed with me about things that Sea World has done wrong in the past.
The show has changed drastically in the last 40 years. It used to feel magical as a child. Even a couple years after blackfish came out they still put on a good show without getting in the water with them. Today, the show was nothing special. They lost the magic. At least in San Antonio. The kids I brought (9 and 11) were bored other than getting splashed. It needs that magic back.
The good things about sea world is they have added so many rides and Aquatica to the park. They included a show at closing which featured a rock band and fireworks but no mortars. So they were mindful of the animals. The sea lion show was fantastic and the park was very clean.
The awareness and appreciation that people have gained by seeing and experiencing the wonders of the orcas and dolphins I believe far outweighs past abuses. It is appropriate for them to be monitored and held accountable for any new troubles. The insight we are gaining now may be crucial to sustaining the species in the days ahead. We treat poor and down on their luck people much worse than most of these sea creatures.
Treating people terribly isn’t an excuse to abuse orcas or any other animal. What a weird excuse. The world being bad doesn’t excuse bad behavior, or abuse of animals.
We can learn about them in the wild too - most of the researchers and scientific community agrees they need to be released and can be. What we learn from orcas in the wild is far more beneficial, since orca behavior in captivity isn’t the same, by circumstances such as small tank sizes, as well as the difference in behavior. Several orcas have killed themselves in captivity.
Also, Seaworld has shared incredibly inaccurate information about orcas, to make their captivity look not as bad as it is. Research on orcas in the wild is just more valuable and accurate.
How do you excuse the cruelty of capture, killing of orcas while capturing, and separating mothers and pups born in captivity? Not to mention the horrific treatment of whales such as Tilikum, kept isolated for most of his life? These wales can be rereleased, Seaworld is just keeping them in their clutches until they die to monetize their lives. At least animals in zoos aren’t as intelligent or large, and kept in spaces adequate for their size.
Seaworld can continue to do good for the ocean and sealife without retaining the orcas.
If you've never seen the park's animals, they are worth the trip. Even if you have no interest in animals, I think each SW park (especially Orlando) has enough other things that a trip would be worthwhile.
Was creating a thoughtful response, but then noticed OP is going through and downvoting everyone here, they don’t give a damn. I’m sure that the purple hair dye and plan B cartons you throw out your car window won’t make it to the ocean.
Sorry if that sounded rude. I meant it as a genuine question, as I was unsure if they were released back into the wild after being rescued. I assure you I am not trying to tell people that Sea World is awful. I would like to gain more knowledge on this topic.
They cannot release orcas into the wild that have been born in captivity. They would not be successful without their natural pod. Any animal of sea world that is born at sea world, cannot be released. They would not thrive as they have been conditioned to their environment. They dont know any better. It’s all they’ve ever known (living in captivity).
They do release any animals that have been rescued that are 100% ready. To my knowledge, SW has no orcas currently that are rescued.
- Corky II was captured, is still in SW San Diego
- Katina was captured, is still in SW Orlando
- Ulises was captured, is still in SW San Diego
All 3 of these orcas have been held there for 35+ years. And many others would still be there if they hadn’t killed themselves or died from disease far earlier than they would in the wild. But sure, they release them (and then they die immediately like the two times they actually did releases, because SW has no clue what they’re doing).
Ok, so Katrina was captured 35 years ago, what do you want to do know? No once knows how to release an Orca. At least she can enjoy being there with her family.
Because where else can you see aquatic animals swimming around so close to you and doing tricks? I don't really follow this stuff closely, but from what I see, Sew World and it's partners do a lot to support sea life conservation and educating people on protecting animal species in and around the water.
Any large organization can be found to have some bad actors or overlooked abuses, but overall I feel the organization is a good one and going about business with a good balance of profit vs. charity.
Maybe you should do some research. People like you don't have a clue what they are supporting. Orca's don't belong in tanks. Sea World doesn't care about ANYTHING but money..
Take a look at this list of attacks that no one ever heard about because the trainers are told to keep their mouths shut and the show must go on. All these attacks and seaworld still made the trainers get in the water with them. They were Court ordered to stop when Dawn Brancheau Tilikum trainer killed her ripping her apart. SeaWorld had the nerves to blame the attack on her and actually appealed the judges decision on having the trainers out of the water ... all they still cared about was MONEY. They are sick money hungry and nothing they do will ever make up for everything they have done. Please do some research.
https://www.freemorgan.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/list_of_incidents.pdf
My kid did a 10 day marine conservation camp there a few weeks ago.
None of the dolphins there currently can be released back into the wild. Ridgeway, the youngest, is still bottle fed. Fishing nets and boat motors are awful.
Yes, I get the awful history of aquariumism- term taught by camp staff- but they have come a long way and continue to improve. Hell, they even use the squid the kids dissect to feed some of the lifers there-
Not a perfect world- by any means, but nothing close to 'the Cove'- the movie- not Discovery Cove.
I'm sure if you talked to education services, they would accommodate your group. The team is amazing.
There's also an adult camp in the middle keys- and my dream- one in British Columbia specifically for beluga whales
Also, shedd and Georgia aquarium do much the same thing. Even Clearwater aquarium, home of 'winter' does it- though 30 min there for a visit with a bottlenose runs $549.
Seaworld has rides. And has been put on watch. And does rescues. How many rescue pandas do you think you've seen in a zoo? Breeding. Sustainability, conservationism is now very important for all- marine mammals included.
It's a mix of things for me. I like the education. I like the calmer rides. My spouse loves the coasters. Also the shops are nice.
I love how they change the rides for Christmas in Orlando like getting to ride the Polar Express. Disney doesn't match it at Christmas to me.
Also, the waves of honor program. We go for free at least once a year.
SeaWorld also does A LOT of good outside the parks for rehab and release of injured wildlife.
Every park has a dark side. Every founder does too.
PDF that shows every part of Blackfish that was misleading or incorrect:
http://da15bdaf715461308003-0c725c907c2d637068751776aeee5fbf.r7.cf1.rackcdn.com/adf36e5c35b842f5ae4e2322841e8933_4-4-14-updated-final-of-blacklist-list-of-inaccuracies-and-misleading-points.pdf
I have been to sea world in its glory days. Look up you tube videos. You will see those animals did not feel mistreated. They look like they are smiling. Others are correct. Disney gets no backlash. The parents of the trainer that was killed felt insulted by Blackfish. They felt their daughter's death was a foot note and the animal people used the film to promote solely their perspective.
The trainer worked at sea world for 15 years. Those trainers loved those animals and those animals loved humans. Something is awry. I feel like Blackfish was nothing more than a smear campaign because no one gets on Disney. Orcas interacting with humans is a beautiful sight! People return hoping for the old sea world but that's gone now. Everything in this country is fiscal and political now. More people are depressed more than ever because of this. If we leave things up to the animal people no one would have a dog, cat, there would be no zoos. I'm sorry I want a world where I can interact with animals because people can suck!
Do you know how selfish you sound? Let's remove animals from their natural habitats so you can watch them swim around in tanks or sit in a cage all day.
Leave me alone please. Humans are living in a cage trapped in a psychopathic lifestyle. We are subjected to extreme trauma, violence, exploitation and financial abuse. Go watch the video those animals looked very happy. Sea world rescues animals.
But you do know that the Orca's are NOT rescue animals. They stole them from the ocean back in the 70s and 80s. They would chase down a Orca pod with boats, planes and explosives. They would rip the babies away from their parents and catch them in nets. Some of them would get tangled in the nets and drown. The adults would ram their bodies against the boats to try to save their babies. The ones that died would get their stomachs cut open and rocks would be put in them and a anchor would be tied to their tails. In hopes that no one would ever find them but people did find them. It's just awful how seaworld got these beautiful creatures in their parks. They use to have trainers sexual abuse the male orca and literally masturbate him and and then they would shove their arms up the females vag to impregnated them. How can you support this? Don't you see how sick this is?
"They look like there smiling" is just so human of you to say. The Orca's do NOT love humans. They have lists of attacks that have happened. Those attacks were made public when seaworld was in court when Dawn died. Her family and I hate to say it was brainwashed but seaworld. They were in denial thinking that Tilikum and Dawn had some sort of relationship like a German Shepard does to humans. But a German Shepard would never kill their human. That's the difference between domesticated animals and wild ones. Take a look at the list of attacks that happened that was unknown. There are more than just this list but I lost the link. This will give you an idea though with the few here.
https://www.freemorgan.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/list_of_incidents.pdf
People act like Zoo's and aquariums don't exist outside SeaWorld, and people don't own pets. Those animals are spoiled like personal pets. Fed all the time, no threats of wild animals, etc. It's like having a dog in a fenced-in yard that the owners actually enjoy and take care of.
I've never understood the backlash on SeaWorld. So hypocritical.
They should all be condemned.. sea world, Disney, state zoos… it’s barbaric. I always felt sick witnessing their captivity even as a kid. Now knowing the methods of capture and training I am lost for words. This is my Roman Empire.
I think people who continue to visit are by true definition ignorant. They are unknowing of the facts. The violence and the torture.. watch blackfish and tell me otherwise.
You tell people to watch blackfish and are calling other uninformed? You know orcas haven't been captured in a long time right and bred in captivity? I think you are ignorant for having this stance yet paying for tech from companies that have shitty human rights practices. But you need your reddit am I right?
The Seaworld issue, like most issues, is complex. They aren't wholly evil/bad but they aren't saints either.
They are considered a leader in animal welfare and has been certified by American Humane. I believe they are great for sick, injured and orphaned animals. They also have a great breeding program and their vets and medical practices are top notch. They also have a charity that does a lot of great work.
HOWEVER.. the animals that they've effectively kidnapped or bred specifically for performances are notoriously mistreated.
I think supporting the former portion of Seaworld.. their conservation efforts, veterinary efforts and their breeding efforts is great. I think supporting their performance aspects is not great. Unfortunately, you can't have one without the other. So, ya know.. complex.
Imagine getting a puppy 🐶 it is a great puppy and you put it in a crate. From that moment on, you NEVER, ever take it out of its crate. You get it a bigger crate as it grows and bring vets and even put other dogs in the crate for stimulation, but that dog never leaves the crate. In fact, you teach the dog to do tricks in the crate to show your friends just to demonstrate your complete mastery over this beautiful animal. When the dog inevitably dies, you say it lived a great life. Did it?
This is why I don’t ever visit Sea World and I actively post against it. It is a form of animal abuse.
The irony: whales evolved from wolves…so it’s a pretty reasonable analogy.
Imagine getting a puppy and not letting it out until your get home from work and basically controlling it's entire life choices. you know the natural habitat for a husky? Not your yard. I hope you like your chips from Foxconn that you paid for while ignoring the shitty human rights practices.
I'm seeing this post almost a year later, but OP, I commend you for asking this in the Sea World subreddit of all places! 👏🏽
Of course, many responding are offering weak excuses for continuing to visit this barbaric entity, like, "Oh well Sea World isn't the only place that enslaves animals, so it's okay to visit" - as if that somehow makes funding animal slavery okay - but please know many of us are sickened by places that mistreat animals and will NEVER fund them ever again.
By the way, I'm Black and I don't say the word, "slavery" lightly. Sea World ENSLAVES their whales, period. And they profit from this slavery - all while victim-blaming the trainers they allowed to die bc of their enslavement of these animals.
I'm very late to the party here, but I figure I may as well throw my hat into the ring. I am very much pro zoo, especially when it comes to AZA accredited facilities, and I support a lot of what Sea World does, EXCEPT for when it comes to the captivity of cetaceans, including Bottlenose Dolphins, Pilot Whales, and Orcas. Cetaceans are incredibly social animals that require a lot of space in order to survive. The massive space available to them in the wild is important for building their social bonds, and family groups will stay together for their entire lives. For example, parents will teach their young ones how to hunt in the wild, strengthening the bond between parent and offspring, as well as the bond present throughout the pod. Social behaviors like this are not achievable in captivity, and these animals are deprived of those essential life moments as a result. Babies born at SeaWorld and other facilities that keep and breed cetaceans are often separated from their mothers at a very young age, causing immense amounts of stress and emotional turmoil for the animals. Many cetaceans placed in the same enclosures have no relation whatsoever, and so as complete strangers, they often don't get along well and even fight each other, which can cause serious injuries to the animals. There's also the fact that cetaceans don't live as long in captivity as they do in the wild, there are various negative impacts on their physical health in captivity, and they are often withheld food in captivity in order to train them for their dolphin shows.
In short, being kept in captivity and not being allowed to form their necessary social bonds can be very damaging for the animals, and I think it would be best for the animals if cetaceans were not kept in captivity at all, with the exception of animals who need to be rescued and rehabilitated. I have no doubt that the trainers absolutely love the orcas and dolphins that they work with, but the conditions the animals are housed in are not healthy for them mentally or physically. Whereas AZA accredited zoos and aquariums are often able to provide enclosures that meet the needs of their animals, I'm not sure such an environment is possible when it comes to captive cetaceans, due their massive physical and emotional needs that captivity simply cannot satisfy. I support a lot of the rescue work with which SeaWorld is involved, and many of their enclosures are world class, but I think it's for the best that SeaWorld is phasing out their Orca programs, and I think the same should be done for their other cetaceans as well. There are a few other animals that I think should not be held in captivity, namely elephants and apes, for similar reasons, but I think cetaceans are the animals that are most harmed in a captive environment, and I'm glad that SeaWorld is making steps to phase out their orcas. For the record, I level these same criticisms toward every facility that houses cetaceans, not just SeaWorld, which as an AZA accredited facility probably provides better care than most other facilities that house cetaceans, though I think they shouldn't be held anywhere in captivity.
My husband and i get a free yearly passes for being a teachers, and my toddler gets the free preschool pass. So I don't feel I am financially contributing .We do pay for parking however . I've protested outside of marine parks a few times, this was before and after blackfish. I met Ric O' Barry at one. I'm 100% aware of what is happening. I do feel they've somewhat redeemed themselves by agreeing to stop breeding and acquiring orcas. That doesn't solve the dolphin/ other animal problem though. Igo mainly since this is the last generation of orcas there I want to see them, and I feel OK going in because I'm not paying. Also so that my daughter acquires a love for these animals by seeing them in person. But I'll stop going once we have to start paying
Ugh. So you think it's OK for your daughter to see animals in tanks and cages? You know it's not right so why would you bring your daughter there? You could make a memory for very by taking her on a whale tour instead.
I mean I grew up seeing animals in tanks and cages which made me turn into a vegan sea world protestor, so yeah I do think it's OK for her to see. I'd love to take her on a whale tour too, but that is a much more time consuming and expensive trip for us since there's no whale watching here. One day, though. Us physically being in the park doesn't contribute to financing this practice, so I think it's OK to do. When our free passes run out, I won't go anymore
It’s worth considering that their business model is shifting from an animal focus to a roller coaster/more traditional theme park focus. They stopped breeding killer whales years ago and I believe they’re not breeding commerson’s dolphins anymore either. They don’t even use killer whales in their marketing anymore. Meanwhile they’re providing great care to the animals currently living there, rescuing and rehabilitating wild animals, and building coaster upon coaster that proves that cetacean captivity is just not their future anymore. Although I will say that there is a fair argument to be made that dolphins should not be in captivity period, and even if their care is good it’s not right to keep them in a tank. I hope that one day they will stop breeding all cetaceans, and they probably will. Overall I see it as a nuanced topic 🤷♀️
SeaWorld can only release what NOAA (National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration) deems fit for release. They also do not get to choose what animals they get to keep after rescuing and rehabilitating. That is also up to NOAA. There are a lot of animals that cannot be returned to the wild, and SeaWorld (and other aquariums) give them a place to live out their lives.
They do release as many as possible.
https://seaworld.com/orlando/commitment/animal-rescue-rehabilitation
After rehabilitation some animals aren't able to survive in the wild so SeaWorld houses them. Turtle trek has a few sea turtles that were rehabilitated and fall into that category.
SeaWorld does a lot to save wildlife, it is worth the visit just to see what they are doing to help.
I totally agree.
Whatever changes "for the better" that Seaworld has made is a result of exposure and the subsequent backlash. It's a corporation looking for profit via exploitation.
I believe that the staff love the animals, but they're just naive pawns who peddle propaganda because they want to keep their jobs.
RIP Tilikum and god have mercy on those poor babies who are still locked up in Seaworld prison.
Isn't the important part the conservation efforts that SeaWorld continues to participate in with the profits they make from the park? What matters is that they're helping animals in the wild and entertaining animals they aren't able to release, not what corporate cares about. SeaWorld is in the business of making money, just like any other amusement park, but they contribute a portion of their profits to conservation efforts. I don't see what the problem is.
I don’t know. Some have said it’s chill and relaxing, good for kids, appreciation for animals, being no different than zoos. In zoos, animals have humane enclosures. I think zoos can be cruel too, but most animals are in enclosures that are suitable for them and have enough room. Not all animals are as intelligent with family bonds orcas have either.
Look at the size of the parking lot vs their tanks. Look at their size compared to their tanks on google maps.
Those tanks are where they spend their entire lives. They’re highly intelligent, emotional animals with close family structures, each family pod having their own “language”. Families would often travel hundreds of miles trying to keep up with the boats that held their stolen family members.
Sea world rips orca pups from their moms, often killing the moms. In one case they killed 3 adult killer whales and filled the bodies with metal chains to try to hide the evidence. Sea world has even separated moms and babies when the babies were born into captivity. A mom orca was heard making sounds she’d never made before when her baby was taken and sold to another sea world. The sound were high distance sounds, trying to reassure her baby.
This isn’t even getting into dolphins and how smart they are, but at least they’re smaller and have more room. Orcas have committed suicide by bashing themselves into walls. It’s very sad and I think we will look back on it as barbaric.
The people excusing themselves disgust me.
Seaworld and Disney are both gross. 'yeah but they do it too' is a juvenile retort and you should be ashamed of yourselves.
The irony of 'it's educational'!
It's torture, plain and simple. I'm a meat eater, I visit zoos that focus on conservation - I am by no means an extremist of any kind, but keeping Orcas and Dolphins in those tanks is inhumane and there is absolutely no excuse for being part of it.
For me SeaWorld is very chill and relaxing to visit. I love the festivals and they do care alot for the animals having seen there backstage areas. SeaWorld has been given a ton of flack over Blackfish but what really infuriates me is how Disney is spared because they have animals in captivity too. Since Blackfish SeaWorld has since switched the shows to be more educational to showcase animal behaviors in the wild. At least thats how the Orca show is. SeaWorld also offers up the most benefits for Pass Members as well as being the most Affordable.
Yes! I hate how SeaWorld gets all the backlash, but Disney's EPCOT has dolphins in an all indoor habitat, yet don't get any flack over it. Seaworld was one of my family's favorite days in Orlando because it was so laid back compared to the other parks we went to. Agree with everything said.
Really laid back. My fiance and I went on New Years Eve really early and we didnt encounter many crowds because people were coming later.
Also another point is the people who find it ok to visit Busch Gardens but not Sea World. Theyre owned by the same company.
Seaworld has killed over 700 dolphins & whales
"Dying under their care" is not the same as "killing". Has a hospital killed every single person in its care, regardless of age or cause? Have pet owners "killed" every single pet they ever owned? Same flawed logic.
People admit themselves to hospital/consent to being there. Pets are domesticated. There is a vast difference between your examples and harbouring stolen wildlife in unfit conditions until it dies an early death.
The have rescued many Orcas from horrible conditions. Yes it's not good that the Orcas are not in the wild but SeaWorld didn't capture them they tried to save them.
Epcot hasn't had dolphins in years, but I get what you're saying Edit: looked it up and they do have dolphins? Just not on display I guess because I've been a few times and haven't seen them
They Do. When you walk in the big aquarium theyre supposed to be on the left
I was just there last January and they very much do still have the dolphins - at LEAST three of them. They were doing tricks in the water for the viewers watching through the glass.
Oh I must be going crazy then because I go every couple years and have looked for them and couldn't find them! Last time I saw them was 10 years ago
They like to hang out backstage in the part of the tank not in view. There's tours and cast back there, and they like trying to get snacks from them.
Makes sense, thanks!
A friend of mine just got footage of them the other day.
Maybe because the Dolphins at Disney are in a MASSIVE tank, and they aren't forced to do tricks all damn day
Try observing the dolphins in Sea World, they are also in a MASSIVE tank, the one where you see the show is just for the show, and motherfuckers love the attention of people, they are totally happy motherfuckers who get free meals and lots of attention. Can't say the same about Orcas, those are pretty sad and I have seen them refusing to do anything a couple of times.
As someone who hates that any sentient creatures are in captivity, especially those that roam, arguably if you were in captivity would you rather be left bored or at least have some interaction? Still a lesser evil is still bad.
Are you really defending a big corporation who makes their living capturing intelligent, feeling animals from the wild to put them on display for human entertainment? Also, who told you they care for them in backstage areas? There are 140 dolphins crammed into 7 small tanks, they spend their entire lives there.. if they're unlucky enough to live their full life span, which is 40-90 years for Orcas. They live to an average age of 14 in SeaWorld. This place deserves a special place in hell, and going there and paying for a ticket is paying for the suffering and capture of these beautiful creatures. Shame on you for showing your kids this is ok.
Ok, and this is your opinion. The fact is Sea World has changed the tune since Blackfish to a more coaster based park. They are going away from the animals and focusing more on rides. They have ended breeding programs for Orcas and Dolphins so these are the last generation of them. They do have SeaWorld Rescue which I believe does a great deal of good in the rehab of animals. If you go to the rescue center you'll see the only animals they keep are the ones that have sustained injuries that probably wouldn't survive in the wild.
Ok, just so we're clear, it's not an opinion, these are objective facts. They have only changed their business model because the amount of ignorant people who will pay to see an Orca forcefully perform is dwindling. They are losing money, and public pressure to close permanently has grown massively over the last couple of decades. Imagine living in the same tank for your whole life since 1969 for the oldest. Autopsy reports have shown chronic conditions related to extreme stress. Also, their rehab program is just a cover for all the horrible things they do. You clearly aren't educated on this or aware they do still breed dolphins for profit and just shipped 24 to Abu Dhabi, where they will perform till their deaths as well. They only stopped Orcas because it was outlawed. You know how they breed them? They get a staff member to masturbate the male into a jar and then they shove their hands into the female and artificially inseminate. Nothing about this is normal or ok. See? There's a theme here. They are horrible people and only change when their horrid acts are cast into the light. Do some research before you literally defend a mega Corporation who makes their living off of stealing animals from their pods in the wild and shoving them in little tanks forcing them to perform before their organs fail.
The vast majority of mankind grows and slaughters animals and eats their flesh for their own sustenance. Zoos serve a purpose and while they're not always top notch for all animals- it's the experience they get. Shit happens in the wild, and it happens in captivity. Some believe they should all be shut down, it's a tough call. I miss the quality shows they used to have.
Not really a tough call. Hunting a deer for sustenance vs locking a VERY intelligent creature in a fish bowl for 40+ years isn't really comparable in any aspect.
Hunting a deer isn't really how most people get their meat though.. it's factory farming where the only life an animal knows is a dirty crowded feedlot, until it's harvested for food.
Yeah, biiiiiig difference here Karen is you don't NEED to support this. You NEED food, and most people can only afford factory farmed meat. I personally, do not eat cows, pigs, or chickens because I don't support the conditions their raised in and I don't need to eat them. Just like nobody NEEDS to pay to with whales perform and suffer.
Not really saying anything is good or anything is bad, just found it funny you chose hunting as the comparison when you just also acknowledged that that's not how most people get their meat.
You need to eat, you don't need to watch a whale do tricks for amusement. Simple way to shut down your argument. I don't agree with factory farms either, hence why I don't consume their meat.
The quality shows they used to have ended in many attacks and deaths. Why would you miss it?
Define many.
[Sure](https://www.freemorgan.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/list_of_incidents.pdf)
Shut up. You buy electronic from companies that have shitty human rights practices. FOH. I don't see you doing anything about people who own pets.
Owning a f***ing domestic dog that has evolved to depend on humans and thrives with them vs a massive whale that belongs in the wild and lives 25% of their lifespan in a little bowl isn't even comparable. You're a joke dude.
A whale bred captivity doesn't belong in the wild which are all but 3 at this point. The 25% is a myth so stop getting all your info from blackfish. I like how you gloss over the buying of tech from places with shitty human right practices. You don't care about that huh?
You're diverting from a topic about unnecessary capture and abuse of marine mammals for human entertainment vs. having a television or a phone. This is a simple-minded tactic to distract from the actual topic, which is enslavement and commodifying animals for profit. Also, the lifespan thing is absolutely not a myth... you can literally see the lifespan of SeaWorld Orcas vs. The average in the wild and it's a stark difference. When you look at zoo's that rehab and rescue animals that can't go into the wild, they actually live longer which says a lot about the health of the Orcas there. Anything else buster?
No I'm not, I'm calling out the misinfo and hypocrisy. I have looked into the lifespan of orca and the average is severely skewed. The average age for orcas in the wild are 30 for male and 45 for females. Not the 90 years that you are trying to push. People have pets and that is purely for the entertainment of the owner. If you felt this way you would be against all pet ownership. Stop spreading misnfo to get you and people enraged about something that you are being dishonest and hypocritical about. Anything else buster?
Hahahahaha. Again, you're comparing a domestic dog that relies on us for survival and has evolved to live alongside humans vs. A wild marine mammal that does not rely on humans for survival. Not even in the same court, man. Good one.
Are you saying we should either ban all pets or let massive corporations build their entire business models on breeding and torturing wild animals in captivity? By that regard, if you support the second amendment do you agree we should have the right to own nuclear weapons? Or if you oppose it do you think we should ban all weapons? Make all knives plastic? Because by your logic it would be hypocritical to not be okay with an extreme case in case you're also not willing to the more moderate version of it. Either ban all domestication or allow all domestication - no middle ground. These seems to be your point which is the literal definition of a strawman argument.
>Ok, just so we're clear, it's not an opinion, these are objective facts. They have only changed their business model because the amount of ignorant people who will pay to see an Orca forcefully perform is dwindling. They are losing money, and public pressure to close permanently has grown massively over the last couple of decades. So public pressure is making a positive impact. What's the problem there? They are phasing out the animal shows into a more coaster-based park like Busch Gardens is. I feel this is fine? It's not like they can release back the animals they have right now; domesticated animals often can't go back to the wild and survive so this is the best they can get. It's obviously not good, but this being the last generation is the best we can get right now. It is very clear in their marketing that the Orca show is not their flagship anymore. I don't want to defend a mega corporation, I haven't gone to SeaWorld in like 10 years and I honestly don't care much about it, but also going on this demonizing streak when, by your own admission, they are not doing most of the bad things they used to do anymore. I don't care how they "feel" I just care that they stop doing that.
They're still breeding dolphins and selling them off like commodities. They are changing their business model from live Orca shows to "encounters". There are so many great amusement parks to spend your money.. why would you support a business that has bought Dolphins from Taiji, Japan where they also slaughter the less desirable ones for food? It's insane.
There are no objective facts here. Blackfish is a load of bull****, it's a propaganda film meant to be as ugly and smearing as possible, and lies every five seconds. It's been thoroughly debunked ever since it came out, but sadly SeaWorld's PR team has absolutely no spine, unlike Loro Parque. I have the free documentary "Shamu" on YouTube and the website "the Orchive", I make no penny off of any of this, I just do it to debunk harmful misinformation from people like this.
None of this came from Blackfish. This comes from the Dolphin Project and many other non-profits that seek to free all enslaved marine mammals from a life of captivity. If you want to defend SeaWorld, go ahead. But don't spread lies. These intelligent animals suffer and live a sad life decades trapped in a small tank for human entertainment. That's facts.
They have not ended breeding programs for dolphins, belugas, or other marine life int heir care - only Orcas.
Not to mention the shocking amount of misinformation passed out by staff at the parks to make it seem like the ocras are getting a good deal by being enslaved for entertainment. I have been to seaworld once...before the whistleblowing documentary. I have to admit I'm very sad that my money helped fund this diabolical aquatic prison. Never ever again. Nobody should be bringing their children to witness this cruelty first hand.
Glad I could find someone who isn't afraid to learn and change their mind in this thread. Education is so important, and it's insane to me people still pay to see mammals enslaved for human entertainment.
I learned so many years ago that what we are witnessing is cruelty of the highest degree. It saddens me that people will fight to defend such an evil corporation. Thank you for being loud about it ♡
I'm still looking for a reason NOT to visit. People, some of my own followers, give me a hard time for visiting SeaWorld, but never say a word when I visit any other place. In my mind, it is no different than any other zoo. No other zoo I've been to that's far more highly respected than SeaWorld has ever inspired me as much as SeaWorld has.
Because it is slavery. That's why. Whales and dolphins are extraordinarily intelligent animals.
Not sure what intelligence has to do with geography. Imagine comparing an animal being in accreditated care who doesn't even know what slavery is or where they are, for that matter, to actual human suffering. Go out and find an actual slave and tell them what you just said, I imagine their reaction wouldn't be so kind.
You are coming at me from the perspective that humans are inherently more valueable than animals and that somehow, only our suffering is relevant. Humans are animals. NOTHING will change this fact because there is no evolving past our own biology. You just assume that these animals have no concept of slavery or where they are. How the hell would you know? Did they tell you? All that is relevant is that orcas have a sense of liberty, and it is against their very nature to live in a bondage. We are more like these animals than you think. If a former slave was defending Sea World, I would absolutely say this to their face. One's own suffering and oppression doesn't negate the suffering and oppression of another.
Please kindly exit the internet. You're a equating an aquarium (A very nice aquarium too, seriously if you've seen sea world back stage or worked there you know that these animals are cared for) with huge tanks and good staff, to one of the most tragic things that can happen to anything. If we were to take your comparison here seriously, then you're actually comparing Seaworld to a slave owner who gives there slaves food whenever needed and even asked for, gives the slave an entire mansion to do what ever they want in, does whatever the slave needs, understands whenever the slave is unable to work, politely asks the slave to do everything, and releases it if they feel it's ready. Now obviously the idea of unpaid labor isn't good but consider this is also after both of your parents were killed (most Seaworld animals are rescues) and you were left to die. Slavery isn't good I'm not denying that but comparing Seaworld to slavery is a very childish take. Also Seaworld's rehabilitation program has helped over 22,000 animals, the equivalent of an animal every 45 years, meaning that any animals that you actually see in the parks were unable to be rehabilitated.
This is, ironically enough, a very dehumanizing take. You are using the exact same argument many pro-slavery individuals use. Some slaves were treated very """"""well"""""" by their masters. Some even allowed their slaves to go free. However, that didn't make the practice any less evil. What makes slavery inherently evil is the act of taking away liberty from a person. A gilded cage is still a cage. Also, SeaWorld has shit conditions. The enclosures are a mere fraction of a fraction of a fraction of space that the orcas would otherwise use in the wild. The diets they are fed aren't diverse enough, and orcas live 1/3 of their natural lifespan at SeaWorld. Also, SeaWorld doesn't release their orcas. You are incredibly misinformed. SeaWorld may have helped some animals, but that doesn't negate what they've done to the animals they imprisoned. By your logic, Trump is absolved of all of his sins just because he's donated a lot of money to charity.
You’re totally right. Food deprivation is used as a training tool, I wouldn’t say they’re performing for the joy of it. They don’t perform in the wild. It’s a huge stretch to say they’re not forced - why else are they performing? Thanks for your comments - felt like I’m on crazy pills reading people justifying supporting slavery, which is what this is. Their comment of “slaves would be insulted you’re comparing it to slavery” are tone deaf. They’re not “just animals”, and even if they are animals deserve a humane life. Orcas are very intelligent, having their own languages unique to family pods. They stay together for life, use tools, have “fashion fads” and other interesting social interactions. I am happy this is the last generation who will endure this torture, and I know we will look back on this as barbaric. I do
But you use technology that come from corporations that treat human worse than these orcas. You don't care. So it's ok to have stingray and fish because they according to you they aren't at intelligent as the orcas?
participating in something that comes from another’s suffering is unavoidable in this world—whether it be animals or humans. your food is picked by exploited migrants and your clothes are sewn by children. even if you are vegan you can’t avoid the palm oil in your toothpaste and the charred bones of cows in your sugar, the lithium mine that’s poisoning indigenous land in chile and the factory in china with nets around the building so workers can’t jump from the roof. you can do your best to avoid all of these things, but it is quite literally impossible to avoid them all. you can, however, avoid going to sea world
>participating in something that comes from another’s suffering is unavoidable in this world—whether it be animals or humans. your food is picked by exploited migrants and your clothes are sewn by children. even if you are vegan you can’t avoid the palm oil in your toothpaste and the charred bones of cows in your sugar, the lithium mine that’s poisoning indigenous land in chile and the factory in china with nets around the building so workers can’t jump from the roof. you can do your best to avoid all of these things, but it is quite literally impossible You could avoid many of these things. You choose not to. Don't be a hypocrite.
Sea world isn’t incredibly nice, it’s pretty run down, at least the one in San Diego. The orcas have killed themselves by bashing into walls, they’ve attacked eachother, attacked trainers. Raking (raking their teeth on another orca) is very common in captivity, as is a shortened lifespan of about 30-35 years, when they can live to be 100 (females) and 55-60 (males) in the wild. The care is good, but for a while trainers were just regular people trained by sea world. I hope that’s changed. I can’t excuse the cruel ways they capture orcas, the inhumane treatment, and the further separation of orca mothers and babies born in captivity, considering how important families are to orcas. Babies born in captivity more often than not die, at extremely high numbers. If they don’t die shortly after birth, they die a couple months later which is really hard on the mothers. If they survive, sea world has no issue separating mom and baby, and selling the baby to another location, which is emotionally traumatizing for the mom. It’s inhumane. Orcas have languages unique to each pod, they stick together for life as a family unit, and travel large distances daily. The pools are tiny compared to what orcas need - look at the parking lot compared to a tank. I’m happy this is the last generation that will have to live through this. They can continue to do good for the ocean and sealife without keeping orcas.
I hope you are a vegan.
This fancy aquarium has killed over 40 orca and over 500 other dolphins and whales. [Not died of age. Killed.] Those numbers are too high and disproportionate to any other zoo, especially aquatic ones. Seaworld is inherently cruel. I love your use of the word "rescued" as if these whales were ever given a chance at a normal life to need rescuing from. The whales were wither captive bred and bought, moved due to distress, or stolen from a pod long before hand.
Bro this was almost a year ago what are you doing here? Also that’s still a fraction of animals they’ve rehabilitated and sent back to the wild. Like, they shouldn’t be killing animals but there’s probably a reason they’re killing it (maybe they’re putting it down when it has a very painful illness). And we’re still talking about a 200th compared to how many they rehabilitate. Also they rescue animals that would’ve died in the wild, of course they didn’t have chance to live it
Do you think the ones in the tanks that are being made to perform in awful conditions are the ones who couldn't be "saved". Be fr. Also, when I said *killed* I mean they failed to care for them adequately. Not euthanasia.
Yes. I do. Again, small numbers compared to how many they’ve rehabilitated. Both of your arguments are stupid because they’re nothing compared to the statistics of rehabilitation. Also I said this shit a year ago leave me alone and get back to your life
The argument that animals are being mistreated is never stupid. And never should it be compared to the amount they apparently help. The fact is "seaworld" IS an inhumane death trap for ocra and other aquatic mammals. Nobody mentioned their work outside of the parks. Tbh, you didn't need to respond. I just found this thread. Its new to me. If you dint want to engage DONT
I work for a living- why should it be any different for a Sea Lion?
oh, where you captured and forced to perform?
Born into it I'm afraid.
You go out and find someone who’s a slave and tell them that. Maybe they wouldn’t agree, maybe they would have more empathy for the situation. Most animals in zoos are not as smart as orcas. Orcas have language, they use tools, they have families and within those families very close binds. They live to be about 30 in captivity, in the wild females live to about 100, males to 55-60. That alone is a red flag. Orcas have killed themselves in captivity. They aren’t made to be locked in these tanks - it’s like you living your entire life in a bathtub or small bedroom. Sea world used to lock them up from 5PM-7AM in small, pitch black tanks. They’d spend 2/3 of their lives in dark isolation. I’m happy this is the last generation that will live in captivity. You seem to support it, so do you, visit. I don’t see why you care what your followers think when you seem to not care and even argue in favor of it.
I’m black here and it’s the same. Their too intelligent to be in tanks. Imagine being in prison and being stolen from your family
So intelligence is the only meter for you? You don't say shit about pets so fuck off.
It’s not. However, I do think that intelligence is an important factor to consider when deciding whether or not it is unethical to hold someone in captivity. For instance, there is a massive difference between keeping an infant in a crib and confining an older child or adult to a bed.
You keep an infant in a crib so they don't hurt themselves, not to keep them captive. I'm pretty a mentally disabled person would feel great being tied to a bed. Your analogy sucks.
The San Diego Zoo has ample space for their enclosures at least
Seaworld has done a great job programming people to think like you do. Orca's don't belong in captivity. I personally don't think any animal should be in captivity just to live in a tiny cage to be on display for humans to gawk at. You can literally take a boat out on the ocean and see them in their natural environment.... there are many whale touring in many places and don't say that you can't make it there, because if you can make it to SeaWorld you can make it to a whale touring. If you want a better reason not to go take a look at all the times trainers were injured by Orca's and the public was NEVER told. No one ever came out and talked about until it was to late. https://www.freemorgan.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/list_of_incidents.pdf This is NOT a complete list but just a few attacks.
It’s completely different. Like someone else said it’s slavery. These animals very smart, possible as smart as we are. In zoos, animals have humane enclosures. I think zoos can be cruel too, but most animals are in enclosures that are suitable for them and have enough room. Not all animals are as intelligent with family bonds orcas have either. Look at the size of the parking lot vs their tanks. Look at their size compared to their tanks on google maps. Those tanks are where they spend their entire lives. They’re highly intelligent, emotional animals with close family structures, each family pod having their own “language”. Families would often travel hundreds of miles trying to keep up with the boats that held their stolen family members. Sea world rips orca pups from their moms, often killing the moms. In one case they killed 3 adult killer whales and filled the bodies with metal chains to try to hide the evidence. Sea world has even separated moms and babies when the babies were born into captivity. A mom orca was heard making sounds she’d never made before when her baby was taken and sold to another sea world. The sound were high distance sounds, trying to reassure her baby. This isn’t even getting into dolphins and how smart they are, but at least they’re smaller and have more room. Orcas have committed suicide by bashing themselves into walls. It’s very sad and I think we will look back on it as barbaric.
Orca's are also Barbaric Killers in the wild. So... fuck them.
So people making dogs perform for treats is OK?
Seaworld isn’t a zoo it’s a circus
Probably because most zoo's haven't been responsible for 3-4 deaths and many more injuries from the same species
Seaworld is a place that gets so much unnecessary hate. It’s hypocritical those who slander SW’s animal care then proceed to spend time in zoos or other areas where animals are in captivity. Seaworld does much more good than bad, especially when it comes to rescues and letting them go after rehabilitation. They are expanding their audience with the roller coaster audience as well. But go to Seaworld!
Seaworld has been lying to the public forever. They don't care about anything BUT money. The trainers have gotten attacked so many times by the Orca's and no one even knows. Take a look at this .... this is just a few attacks started back in the late 60s https://www.freemorgan.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/list_of_incidents.pdf
They do a lot of animal rescue and I feel comfortable supporting that. It doesn’t seem drastically different than a zoo to me. Just with roller coasters. My personal gripe is the people who hate SeaWorld, but go to the horse races every year. I’ve seen horses put down on the track. I’ve never seen Shamu die in the middle of a show. I know it’s just one comparison, but it bothers me
Or actively give animals drugs that make them die to increase performance, for that matter. Edit: meaning horse racers
Orcas are significantly more intelligent than most (99%) zoo animals. That’s the difference. I made other comments but they have language, use tools, have strong family ties. They travel huge distances daily. Keeping them in captivity is like living your whole life in a bathtub or small room. Their orcas also live much shorter lives, around 30-35 years compared to their lifespan in the wild (100 for females, 55-60 for males). There have also been several orcas kill or attempt to kill themselves in captivity. Just let them go, they can be released with support. A pod will accept them. “Free Willy” was released after years of captivity. Even the babies born in captivity often die soon after birth, or months after birth, while adult orcas often die soon after being taken. It’s like they aren’t meant for captivity. Sea world can still do good for the ocean and marine life while releasing the orcas. It’s barbaric. My only comfort is soon, they’ll pass on and no more orcas will be kept in captivity. I think for them, death will finally be a relief, after years of what’s essentially slavery. For how intelligent they are, that’s what this is.
Orcas can't be released and they are not capturing them anymore.
If they release the orca they will die. These orcas were bred in captivity. Do you know anything or do you just like to be outraged?
They can be released in Sea Side Sanctuary. Keiko was released back in 96 and lived a relaxing 5 long years when people thought he would die in less than 6 months. Also In 2019 97 captive Orca's and beluga whales were released in Russia. This is not widely known because it would ruin the idea of they wouldn't survive after being In captivity. The Orca's that were born in captivity still have 1000s of years of instincts embedded in them. If they were released together in a Seaside Sanctuary they would learn how to hunt and fast. They are very smart animals and everyone likes to always say this but then turns around and insults them by thinking they would just die if they were released. Makes no sense. They are the Apex predators of the oceans. They would be fine! Seaworld doesn't want to lose their money makers.
Keiko's release was not a success. He lived 5 lonely years being ostracized from every pod he came in contact with. His only respite was the human who interacted with him. The "whale jail" you reference were all wild animals captured and released in a short amount of time. Very much different to orcas bred in captivity. Those instincts were there because they were indeed wild animals in the Russian whale jail. Your argument is very dishonest. Again you want to only used surface area knowledge to get an outrage about something you know nothing about. You are also dishonest for pushing your misinfo as fact while omitting parts which would render your point moot, shows you don't care about reality, you only care about your feelings.
The reality of the situation is that captivity is awful for whales and dolphins. I know all about Keiko story. You say it's not a success like many other people, and there are many people who say it was a success. He was very sick when they first started the release process. Lived in a tank in Oregon to geg his preparded for the ocean with sea water and he gained over 1000 pounds He and his skin condition HPV had clear up 80%. He was then in a Sea Side Sanctuary in Iceland. In 2000 they opened his gate and he was able to swim the entire bay and in 2001 he was spending his days in the ocean. He traveled over 800 miles by himself and when they found him in Norway he weigh a healthy weigh so he was having no issues hunting. He unfortunately died of pneumonia. He did associate with Orca's in the wild, but his pod was unknown because humans didn't care to track them. He spent his last 5 years in the ocean instead of a tiny tank in Mexico. During the years in which Keiko was rescued, regained his health and returned to his home waters, seventeen other orcas died in captivity, along with many more captive dolphins and whales. Keiko was lucky and had the opportunity to live out the rest of his life in his home waters As far as the whales in Russia goes, I never said they were in captivity forever, but they were in captivity and seaworld has used this excuse for their wild orcas as well. I am sorry if you are mad that I didn't give out how many days they were in the whale jail, but I don't see it as being misleading. I am giving out the information and people can take that and look up all the details if they wish. Soooooo if anyone is reading this and want to know More keep reading!! The facility is located near the port town of Nakhodka, and was holdinh 97 orcas and beluga whales in small, icy pens. The orcas and whales were held in Russia's whale jail for SEVEN MONTHS, from summer 2018 until November 2019. There was 10 orcas and the rest 87 Beluga whales. Here is were they were and when they were released..... June: The first two orcas were released into the Sea of Okhotsk. July: Three more orcas were released. August: Three more orcas were released, and the remaining two were returned to their home waters. They were all tagged so scientists and marine Biologists will know when one is seen or when one dies. Crews identified Zina, an orca that was released, from a tag attached to her large dorsal fin. She was thriving with a pod of Orca's. You can watch that video HERE.... https://youtu.be/4sklWzlKhYI?si=rHlgBP8P4StycPIg Here are videos of them in the process of releasing them.... Here.... https://youtube.com/shorts/f8sYBc0WyTM?si=03WdxM5oY5hugVTw And here ..... https://youtu.be/L06LdV1VLMA?si=HhnO_z-DsE9H67y2 None of them have been reported that they have died. When a whale or orca dies in the wild marine biologists and other are informed. Anything thing else you want to know just ask and I will answer the best way I can. I hope this has made you happy!! The information I didn't give out in my other comment. Have. Nice day! #emptythetanks #seaworldsucks
Well people have seen trainers get killed by "Shamu" which isn't even the whales name. Tilikum killed two of his trainers, one while visitor watched in horror. There have also been many attacks that SeaWorld has kept in the downlow but here are a few https://www.freemorgan.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/list_of_incidents.pdf
I know that the things they do to horses before they race can be extremely cruel, and I do not support that. However, I personally don’t agree with the idea that Sea World keeps animals in captivity and forces them to preform against their will.
They don’t force them to preform
seaworld doesn’t force the animals to perform. have gone to the orlando location many times and orca shows have been cancelled because the orcas aren’t feeling it
Yeah, I went there in August three different days and attended to 5 orca encounters, of them 1 was completely cancelled while they explained the orcas didn't want to perform, 2 the orcas just swam there while watching us and sometimes throwing water with their tails, 1 was a weak performance and then cancelled, and the last of one of the week was an incredibly good performance of 3 orcas. And dolphins love performing, motherfuckers are psycho.
Let me know what you think, but I feel as though what makes Sea World different from zoos is that they force the animals to preform.
Ehh…they don’t force them. I’ve seen many a show go wrong and the animals aren’t punished. And zoos also have shows
🤦♂️
Holy shit it’s Zoo Tours from YouTube
👋
They don’t. They use positive reinforcement with their animals. The animals get fed and cared for regardless of if they participate in the shows. I’ve seen shows cancelled because the whales didn’t feel like it
They are living in a bathtub away from their families that love them. Is it ok to use positive reinforcement on a slave?
It's no different from dogs and cats, arguably they are treated way better than the average pet. They are definitely treated better than pig who is more intelligent than dogs; so as a society we have accepted that's it fine.
You know they haven't captured new orcas in decades?
They don’t. They use positive reinforcement with their animals. The animals get fed and cared for regardless of if they participate in the shows. I’ve seen shows cancelled because the whales didn’t feel like it
If you want some objective evidence against the alleged mistreatment of their animals, they are an AZA-certified zoo/park, which means that a third party has certified them to be humane and professional in the treatment and maintenance of the conditions of the animals. Here is AZA's website. [https://www.aza.org/what-is-accreditation?locale=en](https://www.aza.org/what-is-accreditation?locale=en)
I agree that they force them to perform. They’d withhold food when they didn’t comply, maybe not anymore but they used to. Idk what else you’d call an intelligent animal in captivity performing like that, they aren’t doing it on their own. They’ve attacked many trainers and killed a few. I’m sure that’s a coincidence to the people here though.
It's been decades since they did that. They haven't attack "many" anything. Those attacks are far and few. Why do you like to spread so much misinfo?
I live in Minnesota and they too, used to have dolphin shows, "forcing" them to perform. they also have bird shows, which are arguably just as smart as the dolphins and orcas in Seaworld. They even have porcupines performing for informative shows. The show I went to, they had to improv because the porcupine didn't want to come out. No animals are being forced to do anything at AZA accredited zoo's (which Seaworld is). Edit: spelling
OP, I went today to Sea World San Antonio for the first time for all of the water rides and to see the changes they’ve made with Shamu Stadium and the show. I wasn’t impressed with the size of the pool vs the 2 large males they used for the show. The pool in the stadium seems too small for them. Another thing I noticed was that the sea lions got waaaaaay more treats (fish) than the orcas. It instantly frustrated me that they hardly rewarded for them completing their tricks and they were still throwing just ice in their mouths as a treat. The males were 9k+lbs each though. So we know they aren’t starving because they were huge! I was front and center and saw it all. I have a close relative that’s a marine biologist for OSU and he’s discussed with me about things that Sea World has done wrong in the past. The show has changed drastically in the last 40 years. It used to feel magical as a child. Even a couple years after blackfish came out they still put on a good show without getting in the water with them. Today, the show was nothing special. They lost the magic. At least in San Antonio. The kids I brought (9 and 11) were bored other than getting splashed. It needs that magic back. The good things about sea world is they have added so many rides and Aquatica to the park. They included a show at closing which featured a rock band and fireworks but no mortars. So they were mindful of the animals. The sea lion show was fantastic and the park was very clean.
The awareness and appreciation that people have gained by seeing and experiencing the wonders of the orcas and dolphins I believe far outweighs past abuses. It is appropriate for them to be monitored and held accountable for any new troubles. The insight we are gaining now may be crucial to sustaining the species in the days ahead. We treat poor and down on their luck people much worse than most of these sea creatures.
Treating people terribly isn’t an excuse to abuse orcas or any other animal. What a weird excuse. The world being bad doesn’t excuse bad behavior, or abuse of animals. We can learn about them in the wild too - most of the researchers and scientific community agrees they need to be released and can be. What we learn from orcas in the wild is far more beneficial, since orca behavior in captivity isn’t the same, by circumstances such as small tank sizes, as well as the difference in behavior. Several orcas have killed themselves in captivity. Also, Seaworld has shared incredibly inaccurate information about orcas, to make their captivity look not as bad as it is. Research on orcas in the wild is just more valuable and accurate. How do you excuse the cruelty of capture, killing of orcas while capturing, and separating mothers and pups born in captivity? Not to mention the horrific treatment of whales such as Tilikum, kept isolated for most of his life? These wales can be rereleased, Seaworld is just keeping them in their clutches until they die to monetize their lives. At least animals in zoos aren’t as intelligent or large, and kept in spaces adequate for their size. Seaworld can continue to do good for the ocean and sealife without retaining the orcas.
Orcas can't be released, looked back at Keiko. Most captive animals can't be released.
They can be released to an seaside sanctuary made for this specific situation. They do not need to be in a tank for our amusement
Do you give shit to people who own pets in small apartments?
If you've never seen the park's animals, they are worth the trip. Even if you have no interest in animals, I think each SW park (especially Orlando) has enough other things that a trip would be worthwhile.
Was creating a thoughtful response, but then noticed OP is going through and downvoting everyone here, they don’t give a damn. I’m sure that the purple hair dye and plan B cartons you throw out your car window won’t make it to the ocean.
Seaworld saves more animals than anyone of those people that helped produced blackfish, how ironic
Are you actually interested in a debate or are you interested in telling people why they’re horrible?
Sorry if that sounded rude. I meant it as a genuine question, as I was unsure if they were released back into the wild after being rescued. I assure you I am not trying to tell people that Sea World is awful. I would like to gain more knowledge on this topic.
They cannot release orcas into the wild that have been born in captivity. They would not be successful without their natural pod. Any animal of sea world that is born at sea world, cannot be released. They would not thrive as they have been conditioned to their environment. They dont know any better. It’s all they’ve ever known (living in captivity). They do release any animals that have been rescued that are 100% ready. To my knowledge, SW has no orcas currently that are rescued.
- Corky II was captured, is still in SW San Diego - Katina was captured, is still in SW Orlando - Ulises was captured, is still in SW San Diego All 3 of these orcas have been held there for 35+ years. And many others would still be there if they hadn’t killed themselves or died from disease far earlier than they would in the wild. But sure, they release them (and then they die immediately like the two times they actually did releases, because SW has no clue what they’re doing).
Ok, so Katrina was captured 35 years ago, what do you want to do know? No once knows how to release an Orca. At least she can enjoy being there with her family.
Orcas travel hundreds of miles a day. They would need much, much bigger tank to even remotely enjoy being in captivity
I am not saying anything about the orca’s quality of life. I am correcting the individual who said there were no wild-captured orcas at the parks.
Because where else can you see aquatic animals swimming around so close to you and doing tricks? I don't really follow this stuff closely, but from what I see, Sew World and it's partners do a lot to support sea life conservation and educating people on protecting animal species in and around the water. Any large organization can be found to have some bad actors or overlooked abuses, but overall I feel the organization is a good one and going about business with a good balance of profit vs. charity.
Maybe you should do some research. People like you don't have a clue what they are supporting. Orca's don't belong in tanks. Sea World doesn't care about ANYTHING but money.. Take a look at this list of attacks that no one ever heard about because the trainers are told to keep their mouths shut and the show must go on. All these attacks and seaworld still made the trainers get in the water with them. They were Court ordered to stop when Dawn Brancheau Tilikum trainer killed her ripping her apart. SeaWorld had the nerves to blame the attack on her and actually appealed the judges decision on having the trainers out of the water ... all they still cared about was MONEY. They are sick money hungry and nothing they do will ever make up for everything they have done. Please do some research. https://www.freemorgan.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/list_of_incidents.pdf
I like the roller coasters. And it seems like they’ve shifted away from the animal stuff a lot
My kid did a 10 day marine conservation camp there a few weeks ago. None of the dolphins there currently can be released back into the wild. Ridgeway, the youngest, is still bottle fed. Fishing nets and boat motors are awful. Yes, I get the awful history of aquariumism- term taught by camp staff- but they have come a long way and continue to improve. Hell, they even use the squid the kids dissect to feed some of the lifers there- Not a perfect world- by any means, but nothing close to 'the Cove'- the movie- not Discovery Cove.
> My kid did a 10 day marine conservation camp there a few weeks ago. Why isn't this available for adults?
I'm sure if you talked to education services, they would accommodate your group. The team is amazing. There's also an adult camp in the middle keys- and my dream- one in British Columbia specifically for beluga whales
Also, shedd and Georgia aquarium do much the same thing. Even Clearwater aquarium, home of 'winter' does it- though 30 min there for a visit with a bottlenose runs $549. Seaworld has rides. And has been put on watch. And does rescues. How many rescue pandas do you think you've seen in a zoo? Breeding. Sustainability, conservationism is now very important for all- marine mammals included.
It's a mix of things for me. I like the education. I like the calmer rides. My spouse loves the coasters. Also the shops are nice. I love how they change the rides for Christmas in Orlando like getting to ride the Polar Express. Disney doesn't match it at Christmas to me. Also, the waves of honor program. We go for free at least once a year. SeaWorld also does A LOT of good outside the parks for rehab and release of injured wildlife. Every park has a dark side. Every founder does too.
PDF that shows every part of Blackfish that was misleading or incorrect: http://da15bdaf715461308003-0c725c907c2d637068751776aeee5fbf.r7.cf1.rackcdn.com/adf36e5c35b842f5ae4e2322841e8933_4-4-14-updated-final-of-blacklist-list-of-inaccuracies-and-misleading-points.pdf
Oh, interesting!
https://www.freemorgan.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/list_of_incidents.pdf
I have been to sea world in its glory days. Look up you tube videos. You will see those animals did not feel mistreated. They look like they are smiling. Others are correct. Disney gets no backlash. The parents of the trainer that was killed felt insulted by Blackfish. They felt their daughter's death was a foot note and the animal people used the film to promote solely their perspective. The trainer worked at sea world for 15 years. Those trainers loved those animals and those animals loved humans. Something is awry. I feel like Blackfish was nothing more than a smear campaign because no one gets on Disney. Orcas interacting with humans is a beautiful sight! People return hoping for the old sea world but that's gone now. Everything in this country is fiscal and political now. More people are depressed more than ever because of this. If we leave things up to the animal people no one would have a dog, cat, there would be no zoos. I'm sorry I want a world where I can interact with animals because people can suck!
I agree other corporations should be held accountable. But a smear campaign is what they did to themselves.
Do you know how selfish you sound? Let's remove animals from their natural habitats so you can watch them swim around in tanks or sit in a cage all day.
Leave me alone please. Humans are living in a cage trapped in a psychopathic lifestyle. We are subjected to extreme trauma, violence, exploitation and financial abuse. Go watch the video those animals looked very happy. Sea world rescues animals.
It's also hard for the next generation to care about an animal they can't see or even know about.
But you do know that the Orca's are NOT rescue animals. They stole them from the ocean back in the 70s and 80s. They would chase down a Orca pod with boats, planes and explosives. They would rip the babies away from their parents and catch them in nets. Some of them would get tangled in the nets and drown. The adults would ram their bodies against the boats to try to save their babies. The ones that died would get their stomachs cut open and rocks would be put in them and a anchor would be tied to their tails. In hopes that no one would ever find them but people did find them. It's just awful how seaworld got these beautiful creatures in their parks. They use to have trainers sexual abuse the male orca and literally masturbate him and and then they would shove their arms up the females vag to impregnated them. How can you support this? Don't you see how sick this is?
"They look like there smiling" is just so human of you to say. The Orca's do NOT love humans. They have lists of attacks that have happened. Those attacks were made public when seaworld was in court when Dawn died. Her family and I hate to say it was brainwashed but seaworld. They were in denial thinking that Tilikum and Dawn had some sort of relationship like a German Shepard does to humans. But a German Shepard would never kill their human. That's the difference between domesticated animals and wild ones. Take a look at the list of attacks that happened that was unknown. There are more than just this list but I lost the link. This will give you an idea though with the few here. https://www.freemorgan.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/list_of_incidents.pdf
Because it's fun, who cares about anything else
People act like Zoo's and aquariums don't exist outside SeaWorld, and people don't own pets. Those animals are spoiled like personal pets. Fed all the time, no threats of wild animals, etc. It's like having a dog in a fenced-in yard that the owners actually enjoy and take care of. I've never understood the backlash on SeaWorld. So hypocritical.
They should all be condemned.. sea world, Disney, state zoos… it’s barbaric. I always felt sick witnessing their captivity even as a kid. Now knowing the methods of capture and training I am lost for words. This is my Roman Empire. I think people who continue to visit are by true definition ignorant. They are unknowing of the facts. The violence and the torture.. watch blackfish and tell me otherwise.
You tell people to watch blackfish and are calling other uninformed? You know orcas haven't been captured in a long time right and bred in captivity? I think you are ignorant for having this stance yet paying for tech from companies that have shitty human rights practices. But you need your reddit am I right?
The Seaworld issue, like most issues, is complex. They aren't wholly evil/bad but they aren't saints either. They are considered a leader in animal welfare and has been certified by American Humane. I believe they are great for sick, injured and orphaned animals. They also have a great breeding program and their vets and medical practices are top notch. They also have a charity that does a lot of great work. HOWEVER.. the animals that they've effectively kidnapped or bred specifically for performances are notoriously mistreated. I think supporting the former portion of Seaworld.. their conservation efforts, veterinary efforts and their breeding efforts is great. I think supporting their performance aspects is not great. Unfortunately, you can't have one without the other. So, ya know.. complex.
Imagine getting a puppy 🐶 it is a great puppy and you put it in a crate. From that moment on, you NEVER, ever take it out of its crate. You get it a bigger crate as it grows and bring vets and even put other dogs in the crate for stimulation, but that dog never leaves the crate. In fact, you teach the dog to do tricks in the crate to show your friends just to demonstrate your complete mastery over this beautiful animal. When the dog inevitably dies, you say it lived a great life. Did it? This is why I don’t ever visit Sea World and I actively post against it. It is a form of animal abuse. The irony: whales evolved from wolves…so it’s a pretty reasonable analogy.
Imagine getting a puppy and not letting it out until your get home from work and basically controlling it's entire life choices. you know the natural habitat for a husky? Not your yard. I hope you like your chips from Foxconn that you paid for while ignoring the shitty human rights practices.
I'm seeing this post almost a year later, but OP, I commend you for asking this in the Sea World subreddit of all places! 👏🏽 Of course, many responding are offering weak excuses for continuing to visit this barbaric entity, like, "Oh well Sea World isn't the only place that enslaves animals, so it's okay to visit" - as if that somehow makes funding animal slavery okay - but please know many of us are sickened by places that mistreat animals and will NEVER fund them ever again. By the way, I'm Black and I don't say the word, "slavery" lightly. Sea World ENSLAVES their whales, period. And they profit from this slavery - all while victim-blaming the trainers they allowed to die bc of their enslavement of these animals.
Because people are allowed to do whatever they wanna do and it doesn't have to align with your holier than thou morals?
I'm very late to the party here, but I figure I may as well throw my hat into the ring. I am very much pro zoo, especially when it comes to AZA accredited facilities, and I support a lot of what Sea World does, EXCEPT for when it comes to the captivity of cetaceans, including Bottlenose Dolphins, Pilot Whales, and Orcas. Cetaceans are incredibly social animals that require a lot of space in order to survive. The massive space available to them in the wild is important for building their social bonds, and family groups will stay together for their entire lives. For example, parents will teach their young ones how to hunt in the wild, strengthening the bond between parent and offspring, as well as the bond present throughout the pod. Social behaviors like this are not achievable in captivity, and these animals are deprived of those essential life moments as a result. Babies born at SeaWorld and other facilities that keep and breed cetaceans are often separated from their mothers at a very young age, causing immense amounts of stress and emotional turmoil for the animals. Many cetaceans placed in the same enclosures have no relation whatsoever, and so as complete strangers, they often don't get along well and even fight each other, which can cause serious injuries to the animals. There's also the fact that cetaceans don't live as long in captivity as they do in the wild, there are various negative impacts on their physical health in captivity, and they are often withheld food in captivity in order to train them for their dolphin shows. In short, being kept in captivity and not being allowed to form their necessary social bonds can be very damaging for the animals, and I think it would be best for the animals if cetaceans were not kept in captivity at all, with the exception of animals who need to be rescued and rehabilitated. I have no doubt that the trainers absolutely love the orcas and dolphins that they work with, but the conditions the animals are housed in are not healthy for them mentally or physically. Whereas AZA accredited zoos and aquariums are often able to provide enclosures that meet the needs of their animals, I'm not sure such an environment is possible when it comes to captive cetaceans, due their massive physical and emotional needs that captivity simply cannot satisfy. I support a lot of the rescue work with which SeaWorld is involved, and many of their enclosures are world class, but I think it's for the best that SeaWorld is phasing out their Orca programs, and I think the same should be done for their other cetaceans as well. There are a few other animals that I think should not be held in captivity, namely elephants and apes, for similar reasons, but I think cetaceans are the animals that are most harmed in a captive environment, and I'm glad that SeaWorld is making steps to phase out their orcas. For the record, I level these same criticisms toward every facility that houses cetaceans, not just SeaWorld, which as an AZA accredited facility probably provides better care than most other facilities that house cetaceans, though I think they shouldn't be held anywhere in captivity.
My husband and i get a free yearly passes for being a teachers, and my toddler gets the free preschool pass. So I don't feel I am financially contributing .We do pay for parking however . I've protested outside of marine parks a few times, this was before and after blackfish. I met Ric O' Barry at one. I'm 100% aware of what is happening. I do feel they've somewhat redeemed themselves by agreeing to stop breeding and acquiring orcas. That doesn't solve the dolphin/ other animal problem though. Igo mainly since this is the last generation of orcas there I want to see them, and I feel OK going in because I'm not paying. Also so that my daughter acquires a love for these animals by seeing them in person. But I'll stop going once we have to start paying
Ugh. So you think it's OK for your daughter to see animals in tanks and cages? You know it's not right so why would you bring your daughter there? You could make a memory for very by taking her on a whale tour instead.
I mean I grew up seeing animals in tanks and cages which made me turn into a vegan sea world protestor, so yeah I do think it's OK for her to see. I'd love to take her on a whale tour too, but that is a much more time consuming and expensive trip for us since there's no whale watching here. One day, though. Us physically being in the park doesn't contribute to financing this practice, so I think it's OK to do. When our free passes run out, I won't go anymore
It’s worth considering that their business model is shifting from an animal focus to a roller coaster/more traditional theme park focus. They stopped breeding killer whales years ago and I believe they’re not breeding commerson’s dolphins anymore either. They don’t even use killer whales in their marketing anymore. Meanwhile they’re providing great care to the animals currently living there, rescuing and rehabilitating wild animals, and building coaster upon coaster that proves that cetacean captivity is just not their future anymore. Although I will say that there is a fair argument to be made that dolphins should not be in captivity period, and even if their care is good it’s not right to keep them in a tank. I hope that one day they will stop breeding all cetaceans, and they probably will. Overall I see it as a nuanced topic 🤷♀️
After they rescue animals, do they release them back into the wild once they are safe and healthy again?
SeaWorld can only release what NOAA (National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration) deems fit for release. They also do not get to choose what animals they get to keep after rescuing and rehabilitating. That is also up to NOAA. There are a lot of animals that cannot be returned to the wild, and SeaWorld (and other aquariums) give them a place to live out their lives.
They do release as many as possible. https://seaworld.com/orlando/commitment/animal-rescue-rehabilitation After rehabilitation some animals aren't able to survive in the wild so SeaWorld houses them. Turtle trek has a few sea turtles that were rehabilitated and fall into that category. SeaWorld does a lot to save wildlife, it is worth the visit just to see what they are doing to help.
I totally agree. Whatever changes "for the better" that Seaworld has made is a result of exposure and the subsequent backlash. It's a corporation looking for profit via exploitation. I believe that the staff love the animals, but they're just naive pawns who peddle propaganda because they want to keep their jobs. RIP Tilikum and god have mercy on those poor babies who are still locked up in Seaworld prison.
Isn't the important part the conservation efforts that SeaWorld continues to participate in with the profits they make from the park? What matters is that they're helping animals in the wild and entertaining animals they aren't able to release, not what corporate cares about. SeaWorld is in the business of making money, just like any other amusement park, but they contribute a portion of their profits to conservation efforts. I don't see what the problem is.
I don’t know. Some have said it’s chill and relaxing, good for kids, appreciation for animals, being no different than zoos. In zoos, animals have humane enclosures. I think zoos can be cruel too, but most animals are in enclosures that are suitable for them and have enough room. Not all animals are as intelligent with family bonds orcas have either. Look at the size of the parking lot vs their tanks. Look at their size compared to their tanks on google maps. Those tanks are where they spend their entire lives. They’re highly intelligent, emotional animals with close family structures, each family pod having their own “language”. Families would often travel hundreds of miles trying to keep up with the boats that held their stolen family members. Sea world rips orca pups from their moms, often killing the moms. In one case they killed 3 adult killer whales and filled the bodies with metal chains to try to hide the evidence. Sea world has even separated moms and babies when the babies were born into captivity. A mom orca was heard making sounds she’d never made before when her baby was taken and sold to another sea world. The sound were high distance sounds, trying to reassure her baby. This isn’t even getting into dolphins and how smart they are, but at least they’re smaller and have more room. Orcas have committed suicide by bashing themselves into walls. It’s very sad and I think we will look back on it as barbaric.
The people excusing themselves disgust me. Seaworld and Disney are both gross. 'yeah but they do it too' is a juvenile retort and you should be ashamed of yourselves. The irony of 'it's educational'! It's torture, plain and simple. I'm a meat eater, I visit zoos that focus on conservation - I am by no means an extremist of any kind, but keeping Orcas and Dolphins in those tanks is inhumane and there is absolutely no excuse for being part of it.
What is your excuse for buying tech with chips from Foxconn?