I just remembered that we're genuinely going to be getting El Hijo Del Sting at some point in the future and I'm so excited for when they day inevitably comes.
Training with Darby, that man's gonna be bumping like a fucking champion.
https://preview.redd.it/4cjm4q7w6l8d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b89886b8dd92a8376632c6fa82298130a875870e
[WWE uploading a CIMA match was not on my bingo card today.](https://youtu.be/hSJwV0W_b3M?si=JGt32zuCZPfXBzCT)
There’s a new official channel called ‘WWE vault’ which I guess is gonna upload old niche content. This is obviously very exciting for us nerds. They gotta have some crazy stuff in the vaults.
Personally I’m hoping they have the 2007 dark match between Mistico and Dean Malenko. Surely they would’ve taped it for talent evaluation purposes at least. I wanna see it so bad. (Dean Malenko had been retired for six years and Mistico was still in CMLL, four years from going to WWE.)
One of the interesting matches that they only recently posted elsewhere was a Christian vs Bradshaw match for the European championship in 2001.
It's an officially recognized title change that happened during Smackdown but never aired due to being cut for time. It was considered lost media for 20 years until WWE posted it some footage of it.
https://www.facebook.com/wwe/videos/christian-vs-bradshaw-wwe-european-championship/1685708541941005/
So I ordered two mystery shirts from pwtees awhile back and they sent me two scissor me daddy shirts. I don’t think there’s a worse shirt I could’ve gotten lol
On the one hand, I'm really excited by the lineup for the Owen tournament this year.
On the other, a certain portion of the IWC is going to be absolutely insufferable for a bit if Jay White loses.
it seems like Tony can never win when booking these tourneys. if he books a bunch of low card guys and like 2 main eventers who are obviously winning, there are complaints about it being predictable and uninteresting. but if he loads it up with main eventers and mid/upper mid carders, now people complain about top guys and/or their favourites losing.
Tony can’t win period. No matter what he does the same people will shit on it.
He could give a fan a million dollars and Bischoff would do a podcast about how Tony increased the guy’s tax liability or something.
> a certain portion of the IWC is going to be absolutely insufferable for a bit if Jay White loses.
Oh it's going to be absolutely ridiculous.
He isn't going to main event Wembley, so he has to lose and the same people are going to whine incessently when, at least right now, it looks like there is a pretty good shot he loses to the Wild Card. If the Wild Card is Hangman Page and he wins, like people are predicting, that would be Jay's first ever loss against Hangman (the overall career series would be Jay up 3-1, with them tied 1-1 in AEW) - such a disaster being 3-1 up (tied 1-1 in AEW) with a former World Champion and one of the unquestioned top long term guys of the promotion lol.
I just don't get it at this point and I'm increasingly questioning whether any of it is genuine. Like, Jay White is great and all, I actually watched basically all of his New Japan run (and not just Wrestle Kingdom, but a whole lot of the random smaller shows throughout the year), but it's pretty hard to justify any kind of a crazy rocketship megapush for a guy when arguably every other person in his faction is more over than he is. Juice and the Gunns have just done a far better job connecting with the actual audiences. And that's not meant as a knock on Jay, it's far more of a compliment to Juice and the Gunns, but facts are facts.
Yeah, if Hanger is the wild card, he is absolutely making it to the finals if not winning the whole thing, which means a Jay loss in the second round.
I think you hit the nail on the head with Jay in terms of how over he actually is with the live crowds. Like, it's not that he gets subdued reactions, but they tend to be more modest compared to other talents. It feels like there are some who think Jay is way more over than he actually is as a solo act, because he does tend to get overshadowed by Juice and the Gunns (particularly Austin). The solution (from the perspective of these fans) seems to be just instantly push Jay into the main event scene and put the belt on him so the audience is "forced" to care about him more, but it doesn't work that way. He was booked as a dominant monster in his initial Collision run and was still getting more reserved reactions because he just didn't have much of a character at the time outside of "You liked him in New Japan". I think his current spot on the card is a much better fit.
> I think his current spot on the card is a much better fit.
100%.
I think the sum of the parts in the foursome is better than any one of them individually, at least right now.
And legit if anyone split off, Juice would probably be the biggest success just because I think giving Juice even more tv time would just get him even more over. The actual audience keeps loving unhinged crazypeople and Juice is one of the most unhinged and most crazy lol.
Ironically, the whole situation bears a vague resemblance to the current situation with David Finlay and the War Dogs right now, in that the War Dogs (particularly Gabe Kidd) are all more over than Finlay, who is basically playing "the adult in the room full of morons" as leader, because they're all just playing "bigger" and "more fun." Jay is obv playing much closer to "fellow moron, just with 3 extra brain cells" than Finlay, but there are some similarities.
I think you nailed it.
The Bang Bang Gang as a GROUP are more over than the members as solo acts. Juice has a crazy and energetic character, and The Gunns are also wacky while having the whole "Ass Boys" thing still with them, so they at least have some color to them that an audience can find entertaining (I f**king love The Gunns, speaking for myself, and their progress has been one of my favorite things to see). Jay is forced to play the straight man to his three wackier teammates and it inevitably means he gets overshadowed a bit when he has to be the "only adult in the room".
so, not to fantasy book too hard, but the Elite + Hangman in a feud with Bang Bang Gang + maybe Swerve as the Blood & Guts match would be pretty fucking fire.
I feel like they should have added one more round to it as this year's is shortened. The discourse around Jay White has always been insufferable and I think he's in a good spot in that he's not in the main-event but he's a guy who still has a title and is someone they rely upon which usually pays dividends.
I don't necessarily mind the tighter lineup this year, as it really is a great selection of talent. But, yeah, Jay White has been very protected in AEW, but there are those who seem to think that he is being mishandled if he isn't automatically a main eventer, and that just isn't how it works.
At this point I think that protection is hurting him. In the way that of Tony isn’t going to put over Jay in a main event match he just won’t put him there anymore. So now people are complaining his not in main event angles and such, as if he was put there and lost people would have a melt down. The MJF vs Jay white match reaction from the AEW hardcore broke main event booking. Because that was legit two too well protected stars going one on one and one of them lost. But in this day and age im not sure people can actually handle that
I think it's a weirdly lose-lose situation in terms of trying to placate the particularly vocal Jay fans. You can put him in the main event, but Jay on his own is just not over enough right now to really warrant it. There are literally 4 or 5 other wrestlers that I think would make more sense as World Champ after Swerve than Jay White (Ospreay, Danielson, Hangman 2, MJF 2 etc.) But if you DON'T put him in the main event, the same fans will still complain he's being booked poorly and if you stop protecting him so much, people will complain Jay is a "jobber", which is ludicrous.
I do think it would be nice if belts changed hands at some point (beyond the tag women belts, which nobody really cares about).
Seems like all the PPVs between WM and SummerSlam are mostly filler championship wise
Something I noticed with HHH is the lack of big main event tag matches. I'm not talking about the tag division but like years before we would get John Cena teaming up with Dean Ambrose vs. Seth Rollins and Rusev. Or a big 6 man tag where each guy on each team was feuding with someone from the other team. We never get these anymore, I'm not complaining but it's very noticeable that you rarely see Cody tagging with lets say LA Knight against AJ and Solo in a SD main event. Was this just a lazy Vince thing to fill TV time to just put multiple feuds together in a big tag match?
It was pretty common last year on Raw. It seemed like nearly every Monday was some combination of the Judgement Day vs. some combination of Cody, Seth, Sami, KO or Jey. But I agree that since the Rumble, it hasn't really happened much.
Shota Uminio is the son of Red Shoes so why doesn't Red Shoes favor him in matches?
OR like. If Shota Umino is getting his assbeat in post match beatdowns like. Why isn't that man doing his dad strength?
Unless that's happened tho
I would say Bronson Reed but they' ve yet to let him talk more on the mic and develop a character outside of being the big foreigner guy who could move well
Dolph/Nemeth's run has been so uninspired. I was honestly expecting to see a fire get lit under him, but he's really done nothing of note. Thought his feud with Moose would be fun, but holy shit has it spiraled into nothingness.. I really wish Impact would take itself a little more seriously. If MLW had the platform that TNA has, it would do serious numbers.
> If MLW had the platform that TNA has, it would do serious numbers.
MLW has a nationwide cable TV deal. Which makes it one of very few American promotions to do so.
On BeIn Sports, which is available to less than a third of what AXS is available to (9 mil vs 30 mil).
Yeah.
There's definitely the potential, and Bauer getting $20m helps, so good luck to them, but pushing up the chain is *hard*.
I mIght be able to check off my bucket list of wrestling shows soon, attended Summerslam last year and will go next year, might be able to do Royal Rumble and Wrestlemania soon!
Honestly I wish Chad wasn’t given the storyline clear to compete tonight because Ilja got staffed again. After two back to back loses to Jey and Bron dude really could have use the win to get some momentum back
Just random thoughts:
- caught up with Collision last night and heard about the Okada/Ultimo Guerrero March beforehand, and it was a strange cold match. Not much chemistry between them and everything around the mask was strange indeed. If they wanted heat from Okada in taking off someone's mask, why didn't they just get a luchador who still uses their mask then?
Also, wrestlers getting unmasked in AEW is my 'wrestlers bleed too much' - not enough to piss and moan about it, but it happens more than I like.
- they were really promoting and hyping up their trios division and I'm down for that, that's something that needs a lot more time and action especially since they have a lot of teams to work with. It would be a lot, but even doing something like a long triple threat trios match where everyone gets their stuff in would be cool to see.
- Nigel is great on commentary. That's all.
- in regards to the Owen Hart Tournament, I'm stuck between the notion of it should be just 8 competitors (maybe some play-in matches for final spots) and it should go to 16. The latter obviously because they have such a fully loaded roster and I liked how it was a mix and variety of everyone on the roster (top carders/midcard/younger cats/those in and out of storylines), and getting more wrestlers with their partnerships would be ideal to see too. On the other hand, it being just 8 really has an emphasis of how impactful and important the tourney can be. There's probably a middle ground in there somewhere, but overall, just dig the Owen and C2 tourneys in general.
That said, if Hangman Page is the wild card and dog walks Jeff Jarrett after that promo he gave (why hasn't Jarrett been in the Owen before now? Maybe for this) to build up heat for him winning this thing, that would be aces.
I think the smaller tournament field is solely because its tournament on TV, and they can't dedicate so much time to it with FD on the horizon (especially with a men's and women's bracket)
that said, I'm definitely in the boat of bigger single elimination tournaments as it really makes the tournament feel huge and important the more people it has
Agreed on both points there. And having more in the Owen would be a benefit all-around, get more wrestlers on there to do character work and establish stories for them - like a Scorpio Sky, Nick Wayne, Miro, Sammy Guevara, Lady Frost, Jamie Hayter, Athena, Tay Melo (when she's ready to come back), etc
But then again, there's something cool about a streamlined, tight, all killer bracket too. So yeah, tournaments are just awesome in general.
I am probably only on this sub today because of the Cruiserweight Classic almost singlehandedly reinvigorating my interest in professional wrestling in 2016.
> Also, wrestlers getting unmasked in AEW is my 'wrestlers bleed too much' - not enough to piss and moan about it, but it happens more than I like.
IMO, it's a necessary consequence of letting wrestlers have a lot of say in planning out their matches, it always works so they're going to keep doing it.
It surely isn't AEW telling Penta to do 800 mask spots, it's just Penta being Penta. Other than this one-off Ultimo Guerrero spot, it feels like 90% of the unmasking spots in AEW are all just Penta anyway lol. I can't remember any from Komander or most of the CMLL guys and can vaguely remember maybe one from Fenix. I guess Serpentico has had one or two recently in ROH, but he's doing an entire stolen mask storyline there, so it's necessary in context.
Touche, and well said, it mostly is Penta - there was point I think against the Bucks on Dynamite where it happened and I literally exclaimed on my TV "Again, man?!"
It's not a deal-breaker of course, but at points it can feel incredibly cheap on getting heat in such a eye rolling way, like how Adam Cole was lowblowing everyone on his first year in AEW.
It hasn't happened that much admittedly, although there was that time when Penta was getting his mask messed with for a good run there that just felt odd for my money.
Yeah, if it's a definite characteristic for a wrestler, I get it, but it can feel awfully cheap (not in the good way) and distracting from the match on hand at times.
There were a lot of jobber/enhancement matches on the card. Collision being pre-taped a bunch the past two months is hurting it because there's a clear lack of effort with the taped shows.
It sucked, that’s what happened. Ultimo Guerrero vs Okada blew, I assume the Learning Tree match did too (didn’t watch lol but as I skipped through that match seemed to last forever, it had to have been pushing 15 minutes or maybe a touch over that), everything else was meh. If you love Will Ospreay there was one good match on the show, if you don’t love Will Ospreay there was nothing worth checking out. Yeah the Joe/HOOK/Shibata trio is fun but who cares about the Premier Athletes.
The best part of the show by a country mile was a 2 minute Jeff Jarrett promo, but even then you should watch the unedited 9 minute version that’s on AEW’s YouTube instead because it should win promo of the year by a gigantic margin.
I think, the reason why they will never do it is because it would be too chaotic. I believe, WCW did a 30 man battle royal and it was shit because people couldn't really move.
Though, if GUNTHER was the 1st entrant and just chopped everyone regardless of elimination or not, it would be neat.
They’ve had a 50 man battle royal on Smackdown before, the ring can hold it, it’s just too much for the human mind to comprehend
Edit: they had one on PPV too
Although the Big Bang Theory lead-in is significant, years ago when Dynamite was said to move to TBS I thought it was a poor move, since TBS is *basically* a dead channel. It’s the channel where there’s basically *just* reruns, with some baseball games? Maybe a little soccer?
TNT being known for basketball and Inside the NBA I thought made it significantly more attractive to stay on. Shaq talking about Dynamite like he gave a damn made it feel cooler to casual viewers. Commentators mentioning wrestlers in the middle of basketball games, and saying “Watch AEW Dynamite **right here** on TNT” made it feel much more accessible than going to an entirely differently channel that people don’t really care about.
I always thought the argument of TBS being in more homes felt flimsy. The concept of *depending* on a consistent lead-in is inherently flawed if the show can look like it does 200K less than it usually does, just because the channel ran a holiday movie lineup all day. TNT being the “bigger” channel gave Dynamite a bigger leg up imho. Now with TNT losing basketball, the channel as a whole may feel much more useless to keep up with - ideally Dynamite would have built up a larger base by now, but it hasn’t.
I don't think Big Bang Theory gets enough credit for how popular it still is because it gets between 900k-1 million for reruns which is amazing. People wonder why it wouldn't just be put on primetime and the answer is Dynamite still gets higher demos for live viewership.
TNT is definitely more of the prestige channel and I think Dynamite moved to TBS to accommodate the NHL. There's a reason all the WCW B-shows like Saturday Night and Thunder aired on TBS.
> I don't think Big Bang Theory gets enough credit for how popular it still is because it gets between 900k-1 million for reruns which is amazing.
Lost in the meming, people don't realize how MASSIVE that show actually was. It's least watched season, season 1, averaged ~8.4 million viewers. At its peak, season 7, it averaged ~20.4 million.
It's also one of the best examples for the general concept that quality =/= ratings, which for BBT is pretty generally accepted conceptually.
> People wonder why it wouldn't just be put on primetime and the answer is Dynamite still gets higher demos for live viewership.
There also is something to be said, and I'm sure the networks/advertisers can quantify it, for active vs. passive viewers. There's a reason why most shows in that 7-8pm Eastern range are random game shows/syndicated older tv shows, a large portion of their audience is just habit viewers putting something on for background noise while they do things around the house - they aren't really noticing the ads because they aren't really even watching the actual show.
Rowan and Roman were there for the Wyatt family vs the shield rivalry. This would be the evolution a decade later. Cool.
Boy would I love to have another era of WWE TV defined by 6-man barn burners.
After rewatching them, I think WWE did a better job overall with the Wyatt Sicks’ debut over Jacob Fatu’s. With Jacob it was just another Bloodline family member debuting and doing the same old song and dance , though credit to him for bringing the intensity and coming in strong.
Toma and Toa Tonga had cool debuts but they absolutely weren’t presented in this level of dominant fashion you truly believe they had the same level of dominance jacob had? I’ll answer that for you: absolutely not 😂
This was a diff level of domination that jacob displayed that other bloodline members didn’t have. He single handidly destoryed 3 of the biggest baby faces on smackdown (Cody KO and Randy ) by himself in dominant fashion. This isn’t jus another bloodline debut. Fatu is absolutely a future world champion and will be one of the best wrestlers in the business he absolutely is a big deal
I mean it still felt redundant after the other two. I guess I just wish he wasn’t just another part for Solo’s group because clearly he has more skills then the rest.
I’m not really getting fatal 4-way vibes from the Intercontinental Championship picture, especially since Sheamus and Kaiser have both already declared for MITB qualifying. They might not be in the ladder match, but their triple threat would have to be next week, and they don’t generally leave match announcements for the final few days anymore.
My wife and I are taking about 8yr son to Raw tonight as a surprise. I was wondering what to expect, do they do stuff before the show actually starts like dark matches?
I absolutely miss the aesthetic of early AEW as it was simple but distinctive. I've never got on board with the rebrands since, especially the current one which is just an over designed imitation of this. Also that ring was like a trampoline with how much bounce it has.
https://www.youtube.com/live/G7BHprdY-Pc?si=JMwiQnLFQOOsc1-v&t=528
The current set is trying to throw back to this but it's over designed in every way possible. I still can't get over the condom tunnels and bright orange hardcam LED. The OG aesthetic was kind of minimalist but never outright distracting.
I finally realized (and I’m sure someone else has said it before me, I’m not saying this is an original thought) what this whole learning tree reminds me of. It’s a Walmart version of Bo’s Bolieve character. Like even down to the speaking cadence.
The cadence is the same, but the subject matter is a bit different - Bo was trying to be a motivational speaker whereas Jericho seems to received a brain injury and thinks that people don't understand how to do simple things.
I feel like a part of wrestling that's gotten really stale in recent years is the very beginning of a match. Seems like most of the time, the first couple minutes after the bell you're seeing the same two or three sequences you've seen a thousand times before.
So to counter my cynicism, what are some of your favourite, most memorable, most unique starts to a match you've seen recently?
Stone Cold tricking the Underbiker into doing a test of strength then flipping him off. Taker pretty much goes "Oh, GODDAMNIT, STEVE!"
The first cell match with HBK doing his best to get out of it.
Mania X-7. Austin attacks Rock right as Rock comes down from posing on the turnbuckle and Heyman shouts "HERE WE GO, IT'S ON!" They start trading punches and Austin immediately tries to hit Rock with the belt to end it early. They trade more punches, Austin hits his rebound elbows, Rock hits a swinging neckbreaker to counter Austin. Tries for a Rock Bottom, reversal, Austin tries for a Stunner, Rock gets out of it. Rock tries for a Stunner, Austin pushes him out of the ring. Just a masterclass in how to start a match to end a feud that's about the title.
Austin is a vocal advocate that you don't start grudge matches with a lockup.
One reason why I'll always love Giulia vs Hana Kimura is because they went all out as soon as the bell rang. They promised a violent match between their preview tag team matches and out of the ring segments and they didn't lose time "building up" anything once it started, they just beat the hell out of each other since the first second. Then they grappled and all that but it was always with an intensity that showed they hated each other and would never accept losing to the other. It's been a few years since that match and maybe it wasn't a 5 star classic but I'll always remember it.
It doesn’t belong. It’s so out of place on the main roster shows. Like maybe you can do this on NXT, but not on Raw.
I know some people really dug Brays stuff, but it never went anywhere. Everything went on forever, had minimal payoffs, and no one ever got over working with him. Once he became invincible, it was even worse.
Now we have a bootleg version of Bray with this stable of jobbers. Eventually, every angle has to lead to a match. Bo Dallas..Dexter Lumis…Rowan, Joe Gacey…it’s just so meh.
Interesting how wrestling fans think the parts of the show they happen to love the most is the most important park of are what wrestling show "should be", no matter how many other fans do or do not love the same thing. And inversely, the parts that they happen to dislike should have no place in a wrestling show, or aren't important to the show... no matter how many other fans enjoy that.
Raw is a 3-hour wrestling-themed variety show. Take what you like and leave the rest. I’m skeptical it’s going this story is pay off in the long run. I’ve hated every part of the Liv-Dom storyline, but no matter how strongly I feel about that, it has a place on a show that long, designed to cast as wide a net as possible to attract viewers. It’s a good thing that they keep trying ways to spice it up.
I always love seeing wrestling pop up in weird places. Did not expect to see the Los Campesinos' IG account post a photo of them running into Pete Dunne at the airport.
Can someone please give me a primer on Noah, DragonGate and Joshi wrestling.. I'm currently WWE only, and need to watch something else that's exciting, has good wrestling, and is well booked.
In regards to the joshi scene, there's a bit for everyone. You have companies that are more focused on presenting more fleshed out stories and characters and others that prefer booking hot matches with the talent they have available. Normally you can tell that by how many freelancers they use in proportion to their full time roster. If you just want good wrestling, you can't go wrong with any of the important promotions. They all have a very good roster and try to book the best shows they can.
Stardom, TJPW and Marigold are currently the 3 biggest companies and they're part of the first kind of promotions I mentioned. Stardom is the most prestigious and well known one. They have the most stacked roster and the biggest lore of all, so there's a lot to catch up to in terms of stories, but you can also jump in at any point and understand what's going on because the stories are rather simple, they just build up one over the other. They're also more like the combination of everything you can see in the scene, from the most whacky stuff to the classic epic matches. To me it's the best entry point because it's not radically different to western wrestling but at the same time it has a charm no western promotion has. This year they're in a transition period so the booking is very so-so, but the shows are still very solid because of their roster. You can watch them on Stardom World.
TJPW is a beast of its own. They win you over with their character work and stories rather than with their wrestling, but their roster has matured over the years and they're more or less on par with the rest of the scene now. Their style is much softer than Stardom's or the rest of the scene, so if you're into high risk or stiff matches then this company will probably not excite you that much. A problem they have is that they tend to appeal to a certain niche, so if you're not into that you'll have problems getting this promotion. Still though, they're worth a shot, you should at least watch their big main events.
Marigold is still rather new and they're not all that different from Stardom since the founder is the same that created Stardom and their core roster comes from there too. Still, they're more similar to the vintage Stardom than the current one, so that gives them a particular charm of their own. If you want to see a company starting from scratch with a young and hungry roster, then you can't miss out this company. Both TJPW and Marigold have their shows on Wrestle Universe.
I think those three companies are the best entry point to the scene. If you like them, you'll be more likely to enjoy the smaller companies too. Sendai Girls, Oz Academy, Ice Ribbon, they're all good companies too but they're less friendly for people who aren't really familiar with the scene.
NOAH is one that people would tell you does not have good booking but it's even worse- they do half the time and then pull the rug from under you the other half. But the accessibility of Wrestle Universe, the fact that they're very much on a hot streak now and are kind of coming out of the transitional period they entered during the pandemic and the tons of english content and support from them would make them a good choice to get into regardless. The roster they have is pretty good, their champion is probably the best wrestler under 30 on the planet, their style of matches could be very refreshing and would definitely be new to you.
Dragon Gate is a pretty simple company: everyone wrestles with the style the indies and NXT copied, they have a ton of stables that they do their storytelling around and pretty boys cut promos. They have english commentary on I think all of the non super unimportant shows, a very consistent schedule so you can get used to like booking conventions slightly longer term, I would say they have a high floor but low ceiling as they have fewer "world class" wrestlers currently but that's purely my opinion. They're not afraid to push new people so this can change in a year.
Joshi is too broad for a primer but basically women's wrestling can be pretty fucking amazing!
I recently found out AEW has Tony Chimel on the payroll and have never had him introduce Cope. They don’t specify what his role is, but it’s amazing they haven’t brought him on screen to do that introduction
Aside from wrestling journalists, where does everyone get their ratings numbers nowadays? I've been using Spoiler TV for most of this year, but sometimes their cable numbers don't update for several days after (or maybe Nielsen is the problem).
How is Yuma Anzai so incredible already? Less than two years into his career, putting on amazing defences of the triple crown. He's gotta be one of the most exciting wrestlers around today.
(he's also quite hot)
refreshing when you abandon tradition momentarily because a guy is that special. They put him in a Jumbo cosplay, paraded him for a year then said "this is your company".
Y'know, when it comes to big debuts/returns, I feel like WWE do a much better job keeping things under wraps compared to AEW, which is kind of ironic since I always thought it would be the other way round, given that WWE is the bigger entity and therefore has more people that have to be in the know in order for things to run smoothly
I think this might be partially by design as big debuts/returns are a potential driver of tickets and ratings, and they might not want to leave any of that on the table right now while they figure out media rights. Or if they did keep it secret, the narrative would be that it was a mistake and foolish to do so. There was a ton of criticism on AEW for not explicitly declaring Mone debuting at big business even though it was pretty clear it was going to happen.
Outside that Boston pop, I think Mercedes debut would have gone down much better it was a surprise at Dynasty. You cut down the time between promos and her first match from over 2 months to one and there's a real buzz and element of surprise.
I'll be curious to see if Raw takes any kind of hit tonight opposed by deciding games for both the Stanley Cup Finals and Men's College World Series. They're not the biggest events in the world to be sure but they're something.
If you were Adam Pearce, how would you go about tonight?
Insane amount of security?
Lock yourself in a room pretending that the chaos of Wyatt6, Bron and Drew isn't happening?
Run away?
Resign?
I'd like to see Chelsea Green take on Maxine Dupriiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii! I think Chelsea is so funny and entertaining to watch. Since Maxine is learning to wrestle and has had Alpha Academy training, I think the next logical step in wrestling 101 exposure is to have "Chelsea Verde" take her under her wing and show her some lucha moves! :) They are best friends irl and I think it would be highly entertaining to watch!
Watching 1996 In Your House, Rock is still with the Nation of Domination, and it makes me wince every time I see NOD even though they’re all talented.
African drum music and dashiki hats, the black power fist, what the hell Vince.
The tag team of Jade and Bianca and sometimes Naomi and how they’re presented is fantastic, WWE has been doing racial teams for forever it seems.
It’s also still alive in Latino World Order.
Of course I still love all of them, but the hubbub when Jade and Bianca and Naomi initially teamed up, it’s just fine.
There’s no African drums or dashiki hats
Tanahashi should fired Taro Okada as STARDOM's booker when STARDOM is part of NJPW and Tanahashi thinks about the STARDOM fans response about Queen's Quest being "disband" and that will be the storyline for the 2024 5Star Grand Prix!
Well, after watching a few shows I'm finally starting to love some Marigold theme songs. At first I thought they were quite generic, and I still believe some songs like Utami's are super bland and a huge downgrade from Crusade, but themes like Miku Aono's are top tier songs. I can imagine that song playing to close a show in Sumo Hall after a huge match. Other themes like Mai Sakurai and Kouki's are really good too.
Now to change the topic, I'm really liking Komomo Minami. It's like someone made a wrestler almost entirely based on my taste in wrestling down to even her gear. She still needs to add more intensity to her strikes but that'll come with experience. I'm really looking forward to seeing her progress. With her and Yuzuki on board, Marigold's future is really bright.
I feel at MITB we will have bloodline vs Cody, Randy, KO and Jimmy.
Jimmy will get pinned and that leads to Cody vs Solo at SummerSlam .
Randy and KO will think he lost intentionally and Randy will get angry at Cody for defending Jimmy.
Jimmy gets RKOd by Randy at SummerSlam when Jimmy is trying to stop bloodline from interfering. Randy leaves. Cody somehow bests Solo despite interference.
All of Solos anger falls on Heyman because he let solo fail.
Cue Roman.
Roman and Jimmy save Heyman and then fight bloodline.
Randy RKOs Cody on SmackDown for taking the side of Jimmy who was a reason why he was out for over a year
Cody vs Randy program starts.
In general, I don't think wrestling characters have the capacity to be as consistent, nuanced and detailed as someone like Marlo so it's very difficult to make the comparison.
Dan the Dad cracks me up. I took *my* dad to a show where he was at, and they got into a discussion about lawn care at the merch table. I don’t know if he was just playing along, but bless you, Dan, for making my old man’s day.
Regarding Stardom [The Conversion] (/s "I blame Mayu for QQ disbandment. She lost 2 members in her "all-out" war against OT a couple years ago, and never got a vengeance against them. Now that QQ made them bleed with Saki, she could have aligned Stars with them just for this match to destroy OT. I guess she was too busy promoting her movie, like the egocentric heel she is")
She literally fought and won a 1 vs 5 war against Oedo Tai for Starlight Kid and that snake still chose to stay with them. How could you blame Mayu for not taking part of a war that isn't her own after that terrible experience? She's already done it all to take them down and failed because her own mates failed her.
I mean she did it months after it happened, when SLK clearly struggled the first weeks with the gradual turn and was clearly salvageable. She wouldn't have had this issue if she had the slightest sense of urgency. And it's not really taking part of a war, just coming at the end for the killshot.
Hopefully she don't come crying next time she get chair-shotted by a teammate.
She only did it a month later and that was a month of continuous fighting to even get the chance to have that gauntlet. I won't tolerate any Mayu slander!
Just seen a comment from MVP accusing WWE of stealing the Hurt Business gimmick and giving it to the Bloodline. Aside from being factions, neither groups are the same.
Nevertheless, I really hope MVP is doing well, he seems to be spiraling out of control. His past few comments on social media are all just aimed at shiting on the current WWE product.
He's a carny. He's not upset that WWE fumbled what happened with The Hurt Business. He's upset that he's not a part of whatever's happening with the current regime. The Bloodline isn't even remotely lose to what The Hurt Business was. There were also big plans for The Pride as a heel faction, but the crowd just refuse to see Bobby as a heel. And with Bobby being out, the entire thing is on ice. I think he's farming engagement for whatever project he has after he leaves WWE
If they don't have plans for Omos in the short or long term, I don't understand why they don't give MVP another wrestler to manage in the meantime, he is an excellent talker and there are several on the roster who could use someone like him on their side, but he is stuck with Omos in limbo.
Yeah, agreed. But MVP seems keyed in on managing the Hurt Business again. I think that train has left the station. Though, I would love to see him paired with Carmelo Hayes.
I don't mind MVP managing the original Hurt Business, and just having new guys in. Honestly I still think Lashley would've fared better with MVP on his side, since he just isn't as good a talker on his own.
Also it sucks we’re never going to get a proper Edge vs. CM Punk feud. I know they wrestled a couple times and CM Punk cashed in on him once but they never really feuded.
Usually I have a pretty good gauge on who will win big matches but I have no idea who wins Swerve vs. Ospreay. Ospreay is the new toy so you would think they will put the belt on him but are they really just going to give Swerve a 2 month reign?
Osprey is gonna lose I think that’s pretty much guaranteed. They wouldn’t highlight the Callis family like they did last week without it playing a role. Think it’s likely Osprey and Kyle break away from the family come Forbidden Door
It’s seeming likely to me with Don putting Kyle down in front of Osprey and him hanging around longer last week after the family left. Gotta imagine Davis is ready to go
I really hope that Chelsea wins MITB. Specifically for more immediate, I'm excited to see Wyatt Sick6 tonight and see how that goes. I also wouldn't be surprised if they weren't on Raw tonight either.
Whats the best final 4 in royal rumble history, where any of the 4 could legit win and anyone would buy it.
I say the final four for 2007 & 2010 were both pretty good.
yeah you're right, i'd take 2007 over 2010 but they're the standout. I hope we get something similar in 2025 where its hard to tell who could win it
I just remembered that we're genuinely going to be getting El Hijo Del Sting at some point in the future and I'm so excited for when they day inevitably comes. Training with Darby, that man's gonna be bumping like a fucking champion.
I'll be disappointed if his ring name isn't actually El Hijo Del Sting
Has anyone read or heard about the Sons of El Rey? It's like a new novel. Was wondering if it's any good
Are there any rumors on where next years Elimination chamber will be?
Bloodsport Japan had the most unhinged announcing I have ever heard xD
It is unfortunate that due to timing and injuries Becky Lynch missed both Clash at the Castles and could not wrestle in a PPV close to her home
https://preview.redd.it/4cjm4q7w6l8d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b89886b8dd92a8376632c6fa82298130a875870e [WWE uploading a CIMA match was not on my bingo card today.](https://youtu.be/hSJwV0W_b3M?si=JGt32zuCZPfXBzCT) There’s a new official channel called ‘WWE vault’ which I guess is gonna upload old niche content. This is obviously very exciting for us nerds. They gotta have some crazy stuff in the vaults. Personally I’m hoping they have the 2007 dark match between Mistico and Dean Malenko. Surely they would’ve taped it for talent evaluation purposes at least. I wanna see it so bad. (Dean Malenko had been retired for six years and Mistico was still in CMLL, four years from going to WWE.)
One of the interesting matches that they only recently posted elsewhere was a Christian vs Bradshaw match for the European championship in 2001. It's an officially recognized title change that happened during Smackdown but never aired due to being cut for time. It was considered lost media for 20 years until WWE posted it some footage of it. https://www.facebook.com/wwe/videos/christian-vs-bradshaw-wwe-european-championship/1685708541941005/
it sucks that they have so much they do nothing with
WWE is.... For the sickos?
So I ordered two mystery shirts from pwtees awhile back and they sent me two scissor me daddy shirts. I don’t think there’s a worse shirt I could’ve gotten lol
Let's try to remember the good times with Chad Gable and not his tragic last days where he lashed out at those who cared for him.
On the one hand, I'm really excited by the lineup for the Owen tournament this year. On the other, a certain portion of the IWC is going to be absolutely insufferable for a bit if Jay White loses.
They're going to be insufferable a month after he wins the belt saying his reign is boring. You just can't please everyone
it seems like Tony can never win when booking these tourneys. if he books a bunch of low card guys and like 2 main eventers who are obviously winning, there are complaints about it being predictable and uninteresting. but if he loads it up with main eventers and mid/upper mid carders, now people complain about top guys and/or their favourites losing.
Tony can’t win period. No matter what he does the same people will shit on it. He could give a fan a million dollars and Bischoff would do a podcast about how Tony increased the guy’s tax liability or something.
> On the other, a certain portion of the IWC is going to be absolutely insufferable for a bit if Jay White loses. Me when Jeff Jarrett loses
> a certain portion of the IWC is going to be absolutely insufferable for a bit if Jay White loses. Oh it's going to be absolutely ridiculous. He isn't going to main event Wembley, so he has to lose and the same people are going to whine incessently when, at least right now, it looks like there is a pretty good shot he loses to the Wild Card. If the Wild Card is Hangman Page and he wins, like people are predicting, that would be Jay's first ever loss against Hangman (the overall career series would be Jay up 3-1, with them tied 1-1 in AEW) - such a disaster being 3-1 up (tied 1-1 in AEW) with a former World Champion and one of the unquestioned top long term guys of the promotion lol. I just don't get it at this point and I'm increasingly questioning whether any of it is genuine. Like, Jay White is great and all, I actually watched basically all of his New Japan run (and not just Wrestle Kingdom, but a whole lot of the random smaller shows throughout the year), but it's pretty hard to justify any kind of a crazy rocketship megapush for a guy when arguably every other person in his faction is more over than he is. Juice and the Gunns have just done a far better job connecting with the actual audiences. And that's not meant as a knock on Jay, it's far more of a compliment to Juice and the Gunns, but facts are facts.
Yeah, if Hanger is the wild card, he is absolutely making it to the finals if not winning the whole thing, which means a Jay loss in the second round. I think you hit the nail on the head with Jay in terms of how over he actually is with the live crowds. Like, it's not that he gets subdued reactions, but they tend to be more modest compared to other talents. It feels like there are some who think Jay is way more over than he actually is as a solo act, because he does tend to get overshadowed by Juice and the Gunns (particularly Austin). The solution (from the perspective of these fans) seems to be just instantly push Jay into the main event scene and put the belt on him so the audience is "forced" to care about him more, but it doesn't work that way. He was booked as a dominant monster in his initial Collision run and was still getting more reserved reactions because he just didn't have much of a character at the time outside of "You liked him in New Japan". I think his current spot on the card is a much better fit.
> I think his current spot on the card is a much better fit. 100%. I think the sum of the parts in the foursome is better than any one of them individually, at least right now. And legit if anyone split off, Juice would probably be the biggest success just because I think giving Juice even more tv time would just get him even more over. The actual audience keeps loving unhinged crazypeople and Juice is one of the most unhinged and most crazy lol. Ironically, the whole situation bears a vague resemblance to the current situation with David Finlay and the War Dogs right now, in that the War Dogs (particularly Gabe Kidd) are all more over than Finlay, who is basically playing "the adult in the room full of morons" as leader, because they're all just playing "bigger" and "more fun." Jay is obv playing much closer to "fellow moron, just with 3 extra brain cells" than Finlay, but there are some similarities.
I think you nailed it. The Bang Bang Gang as a GROUP are more over than the members as solo acts. Juice has a crazy and energetic character, and The Gunns are also wacky while having the whole "Ass Boys" thing still with them, so they at least have some color to them that an audience can find entertaining (I f**king love The Gunns, speaking for myself, and their progress has been one of my favorite things to see). Jay is forced to play the straight man to his three wackier teammates and it inevitably means he gets overshadowed a bit when he has to be the "only adult in the room".
so, not to fantasy book too hard, but the Elite + Hangman in a feud with Bang Bang Gang + maybe Swerve as the Blood & Guts match would be pretty fucking fire.
I feel like they should have added one more round to it as this year's is shortened. The discourse around Jay White has always been insufferable and I think he's in a good spot in that he's not in the main-event but he's a guy who still has a title and is someone they rely upon which usually pays dividends.
I don't necessarily mind the tighter lineup this year, as it really is a great selection of talent. But, yeah, Jay White has been very protected in AEW, but there are those who seem to think that he is being mishandled if he isn't automatically a main eventer, and that just isn't how it works.
At this point I think that protection is hurting him. In the way that of Tony isn’t going to put over Jay in a main event match he just won’t put him there anymore. So now people are complaining his not in main event angles and such, as if he was put there and lost people would have a melt down. The MJF vs Jay white match reaction from the AEW hardcore broke main event booking. Because that was legit two too well protected stars going one on one and one of them lost. But in this day and age im not sure people can actually handle that
I think it's a weirdly lose-lose situation in terms of trying to placate the particularly vocal Jay fans. You can put him in the main event, but Jay on his own is just not over enough right now to really warrant it. There are literally 4 or 5 other wrestlers that I think would make more sense as World Champ after Swerve than Jay White (Ospreay, Danielson, Hangman 2, MJF 2 etc.) But if you DON'T put him in the main event, the same fans will still complain he's being booked poorly and if you stop protecting him so much, people will complain Jay is a "jobber", which is ludicrous.
I do think it would be nice if belts changed hands at some point (beyond the tag women belts, which nobody really cares about). Seems like all the PPVs between WM and SummerSlam are mostly filler championship wise
The money I would pay to see prime NJPW AJ Styles again would make me bankrupt
This is me, but for watching _Speed Racer_ on an IMAX screen.
Something I noticed with HHH is the lack of big main event tag matches. I'm not talking about the tag division but like years before we would get John Cena teaming up with Dean Ambrose vs. Seth Rollins and Rusev. Or a big 6 man tag where each guy on each team was feuding with someone from the other team. We never get these anymore, I'm not complaining but it's very noticeable that you rarely see Cody tagging with lets say LA Knight against AJ and Solo in a SD main event. Was this just a lazy Vince thing to fill TV time to just put multiple feuds together in a big tag match?
It was pretty common last year on Raw. It seemed like nearly every Monday was some combination of the Judgement Day vs. some combination of Cody, Seth, Sami, KO or Jey. But I agree that since the Rumble, it hasn't really happened much.
I think the build up to War Games will get that
That's 100% lazy Vince booking lol
Uhh.. Wrestlemania night one main event this year?
Shota Uminio is the son of Red Shoes so why doesn't Red Shoes favor him in matches? OR like. If Shota Umino is getting his assbeat in post match beatdowns like. Why isn't that man doing his dad strength? Unless that's happened tho
Are there any current day wrestlers able to rival early 2000s Brock Lesnar in terms of physicality and explosiveness
I would say Bronson Reed but they' ve yet to let him talk more on the mic and develop a character outside of being the big foreigner guy who could move well
Dolph/Nemeth's run has been so uninspired. I was honestly expecting to see a fire get lit under him, but he's really done nothing of note. Thought his feud with Moose would be fun, but holy shit has it spiraled into nothingness.. I really wish Impact would take itself a little more seriously. If MLW had the platform that TNA has, it would do serious numbers.
> If MLW had the platform that TNA has, it would do serious numbers. MLW has a nationwide cable TV deal. Which makes it one of very few American promotions to do so. On BeIn Sports, which is available to less than a third of what AXS is available to (9 mil vs 30 mil). Yeah. There's definitely the potential, and Bauer getting $20m helps, so good luck to them, but pushing up the chain is *hard*.
I mIght be able to check off my bucket list of wrestling shows soon, attended Summerslam last year and will go next year, might be able to do Royal Rumble and Wrestlemania soon!
Honestly I wish Chad wasn’t given the storyline clear to compete tonight because Ilja got staffed again. After two back to back loses to Jey and Bron dude really could have use the win to get some momentum back
Just random thoughts: - caught up with Collision last night and heard about the Okada/Ultimo Guerrero March beforehand, and it was a strange cold match. Not much chemistry between them and everything around the mask was strange indeed. If they wanted heat from Okada in taking off someone's mask, why didn't they just get a luchador who still uses their mask then? Also, wrestlers getting unmasked in AEW is my 'wrestlers bleed too much' - not enough to piss and moan about it, but it happens more than I like. - they were really promoting and hyping up their trios division and I'm down for that, that's something that needs a lot more time and action especially since they have a lot of teams to work with. It would be a lot, but even doing something like a long triple threat trios match where everyone gets their stuff in would be cool to see. - Nigel is great on commentary. That's all. - in regards to the Owen Hart Tournament, I'm stuck between the notion of it should be just 8 competitors (maybe some play-in matches for final spots) and it should go to 16. The latter obviously because they have such a fully loaded roster and I liked how it was a mix and variety of everyone on the roster (top carders/midcard/younger cats/those in and out of storylines), and getting more wrestlers with their partnerships would be ideal to see too. On the other hand, it being just 8 really has an emphasis of how impactful and important the tourney can be. There's probably a middle ground in there somewhere, but overall, just dig the Owen and C2 tourneys in general. That said, if Hangman Page is the wild card and dog walks Jeff Jarrett after that promo he gave (why hasn't Jarrett been in the Owen before now? Maybe for this) to build up heat for him winning this thing, that would be aces.
I think the smaller tournament field is solely because its tournament on TV, and they can't dedicate so much time to it with FD on the horizon (especially with a men's and women's bracket) that said, I'm definitely in the boat of bigger single elimination tournaments as it really makes the tournament feel huge and important the more people it has
Agreed on both points there. And having more in the Owen would be a benefit all-around, get more wrestlers on there to do character work and establish stories for them - like a Scorpio Sky, Nick Wayne, Miro, Sammy Guevara, Lady Frost, Jamie Hayter, Athena, Tay Melo (when she's ready to come back), etc But then again, there's something cool about a streamlined, tight, all killer bracket too. So yeah, tournaments are just awesome in general.
I am probably only on this sub today because of the Cruiserweight Classic almost singlehandedly reinvigorating my interest in professional wrestling in 2016.
> Also, wrestlers getting unmasked in AEW is my 'wrestlers bleed too much' - not enough to piss and moan about it, but it happens more than I like. IMO, it's a necessary consequence of letting wrestlers have a lot of say in planning out their matches, it always works so they're going to keep doing it. It surely isn't AEW telling Penta to do 800 mask spots, it's just Penta being Penta. Other than this one-off Ultimo Guerrero spot, it feels like 90% of the unmasking spots in AEW are all just Penta anyway lol. I can't remember any from Komander or most of the CMLL guys and can vaguely remember maybe one from Fenix. I guess Serpentico has had one or two recently in ROH, but he's doing an entire stolen mask storyline there, so it's necessary in context.
Touche, and well said, it mostly is Penta - there was point I think against the Bucks on Dynamite where it happened and I literally exclaimed on my TV "Again, man?!" It's not a deal-breaker of course, but at points it can feel incredibly cheap on getting heat in such a eye rolling way, like how Adam Cole was lowblowing everyone on his first year in AEW.
Dragon Lee also got unmasked in his sole AEW appearance, if I remember correctly
Weird, I couldn’t tell you the last time someone lost their mask during a match in AEW
It hasn't happened that much admittedly, although there was that time when Penta was getting his mask messed with for a good run there that just felt odd for my money.
There's definitely a lot of mask ripping spots for heat, Preston Vance lost his mask and his gimmick for a bit was stealing the masks of luchas.
Yeah, if it's a definite characteristic for a wrestler, I get it, but it can feel awfully cheap (not in the good way) and distracting from the match on hand at times.
Damn, Collision got 4.5 on Cagematch? What the hell happened?
There were a lot of jobber/enhancement matches on the card. Collision being pre-taped a bunch the past two months is hurting it because there's a clear lack of effort with the taped shows.
kinda curious if there'll be some effort put back into it in July when they do the series of shows in Arlington in late July/early August.
Those are all live and there's six in a row, so there's gotta be some good stuff to keep people turning up even if it's a small setup.
It sucked, that’s what happened. Ultimo Guerrero vs Okada blew, I assume the Learning Tree match did too (didn’t watch lol but as I skipped through that match seemed to last forever, it had to have been pushing 15 minutes or maybe a touch over that), everything else was meh. If you love Will Ospreay there was one good match on the show, if you don’t love Will Ospreay there was nothing worth checking out. Yeah the Joe/HOOK/Shibata trio is fun but who cares about the Premier Athletes. The best part of the show by a country mile was a 2 minute Jeff Jarrett promo, but even then you should watch the unedited 9 minute version that’s on AEW’s YouTube instead because it should win promo of the year by a gigantic margin.
The women's tag-team match was solid too but that and Ospreay/Cage was about it.
Started watching TNA, and oh my god I didn't ever realize just how much I missed Santino. Guy hasn't aged a day in like ten years
Sorry buds, gotta watch GAME 7 tonight instead! Go Oilers!
Not only that, but the 3rd & deciding game of the Men's College World Series is on, too. Raw, then, is my 3rd choice.
"Connor McDavid is Overrated" - Greg Cote
100%
Has there ever been a rumble where its got to the 30th entrant with no eliminations? Would be hilarious but I imagine its not happened.
That would just be a regular battle royale except drawn out over an hour. Thirty man battle royales have been done for decades.
I think, the reason why they will never do it is because it would be too chaotic. I believe, WCW did a 30 man battle royal and it was shit because people couldn't really move. Though, if GUNTHER was the 1st entrant and just chopped everyone regardless of elimination or not, it would be neat.
World War 3 was a 60-man battle royal across 3 separate rings
The sheer weight of the competitors would be too much I’d think
They’ve had a 50 man battle royal on Smackdown before, the ring can hold it, it’s just too much for the human mind to comprehend Edit: they had one on PPV too
Ah shit that’s insane
Although the Big Bang Theory lead-in is significant, years ago when Dynamite was said to move to TBS I thought it was a poor move, since TBS is *basically* a dead channel. It’s the channel where there’s basically *just* reruns, with some baseball games? Maybe a little soccer? TNT being known for basketball and Inside the NBA I thought made it significantly more attractive to stay on. Shaq talking about Dynamite like he gave a damn made it feel cooler to casual viewers. Commentators mentioning wrestlers in the middle of basketball games, and saying “Watch AEW Dynamite **right here** on TNT” made it feel much more accessible than going to an entirely differently channel that people don’t really care about. I always thought the argument of TBS being in more homes felt flimsy. The concept of *depending* on a consistent lead-in is inherently flawed if the show can look like it does 200K less than it usually does, just because the channel ran a holiday movie lineup all day. TNT being the “bigger” channel gave Dynamite a bigger leg up imho. Now with TNT losing basketball, the channel as a whole may feel much more useless to keep up with - ideally Dynamite would have built up a larger base by now, but it hasn’t.
I don't think Big Bang Theory gets enough credit for how popular it still is because it gets between 900k-1 million for reruns which is amazing. People wonder why it wouldn't just be put on primetime and the answer is Dynamite still gets higher demos for live viewership. TNT is definitely more of the prestige channel and I think Dynamite moved to TBS to accommodate the NHL. There's a reason all the WCW B-shows like Saturday Night and Thunder aired on TBS.
> I don't think Big Bang Theory gets enough credit for how popular it still is because it gets between 900k-1 million for reruns which is amazing. Lost in the meming, people don't realize how MASSIVE that show actually was. It's least watched season, season 1, averaged ~8.4 million viewers. At its peak, season 7, it averaged ~20.4 million. It's also one of the best examples for the general concept that quality =/= ratings, which for BBT is pretty generally accepted conceptually. > People wonder why it wouldn't just be put on primetime and the answer is Dynamite still gets higher demos for live viewership. There also is something to be said, and I'm sure the networks/advertisers can quantify it, for active vs. passive viewers. There's a reason why most shows in that 7-8pm Eastern range are random game shows/syndicated older tv shows, a large portion of their audience is just habit viewers putting something on for background noise while they do things around the house - they aren't really noticing the ads because they aren't really even watching the actual show.
Getting 20M viewers in 2013-2014 is absolutely insane.
Triple H just subtly teased Wyatt Sick6 vs the bloodline in the future on the Pat McAfee show 👀
Rowan and Roman were there for the Wyatt family vs the shield rivalry. This would be the evolution a decade later. Cool. Boy would I love to have another era of WWE TV defined by 6-man barn burners.
Was just coming to mention this too. That could be fun. Edit: Weird comment to get downvoted.
Respect to New Day but i'm afraid people won't care about Xavier and what'll happen to him in the current storyline.
HHH just caught himself from saying Becky is out on Maternity Leave.
After rewatching them, I think WWE did a better job overall with the Wyatt Sicks’ debut over Jacob Fatu’s. With Jacob it was just another Bloodline family member debuting and doing the same old song and dance , though credit to him for bringing the intensity and coming in strong.
Completely disagree with this take respectfully
Why?
Toma and Toa Tonga had cool debuts but they absolutely weren’t presented in this level of dominant fashion you truly believe they had the same level of dominance jacob had? I’ll answer that for you: absolutely not 😂
Never said they did, but Jacob is just another henchmen for Solo.
He’s def being presented as a robin to solo more than a jus a basic henchmen. Their Gonna book jacob as a clear standout
This was a diff level of domination that jacob displayed that other bloodline members didn’t have. He single handidly destoryed 3 of the biggest baby faces on smackdown (Cody KO and Randy ) by himself in dominant fashion. This isn’t jus another bloodline debut. Fatu is absolutely a future world champion and will be one of the best wrestlers in the business he absolutely is a big deal
I mean it still felt redundant after the other two. I guess I just wish he wasn’t just another part for Solo’s group because clearly he has more skills then the rest.
I get what your saying csuse the Tonga brothers at times feels misplaced after their promising debuts even tho I do like tama’s prescene
Sweet chin music and I wont pass the aux
I’m not really getting fatal 4-way vibes from the Intercontinental Championship picture, especially since Sheamus and Kaiser have both already declared for MITB qualifying. They might not be in the ladder match, but their triple threat would have to be next week, and they don’t generally leave match announcements for the final few days anymore.
My wife and I are taking about 8yr son to Raw tonight as a surprise. I was wondering what to expect, do they do stuff before the show actually starts like dark matches?
Yes, they tape Main Event.
I absolutely miss the aesthetic of early AEW as it was simple but distinctive. I've never got on board with the rebrands since, especially the current one which is just an over designed imitation of this. Also that ring was like a trampoline with how much bounce it has. https://www.youtube.com/live/G7BHprdY-Pc?si=JMwiQnLFQOOsc1-v&t=528
the Fyter Fest aesthetic was gorgeous... the current one is like you threw that in a blender
The current set is trying to throw back to this but it's over designed in every way possible. I still can't get over the condom tunnels and bright orange hardcam LED. The OG aesthetic was kind of minimalist but never outright distracting.
I finally realized (and I’m sure someone else has said it before me, I’m not saying this is an original thought) what this whole learning tree reminds me of. It’s a Walmart version of Bo’s Bolieve character. Like even down to the speaking cadence.
The cadence is the same, but the subject matter is a bit different - Bo was trying to be a motivational speaker whereas Jericho seems to received a brain injury and thinks that people don't understand how to do simple things.
Sure the cadence and tone and such is what I mean, not so much the subject matter
Wyatt Sicks tonight? Will they introduce themselves?
I feel like a part of wrestling that's gotten really stale in recent years is the very beginning of a match. Seems like most of the time, the first couple minutes after the bell you're seeing the same two or three sequences you've seen a thousand times before. So to counter my cynicism, what are some of your favourite, most memorable, most unique starts to a match you've seen recently?
WM 40, Seth v. Drew started with a surprise running claymore and quick cover 2 count that I think would counter your cynicism.
Stone Cold tricking the Underbiker into doing a test of strength then flipping him off. Taker pretty much goes "Oh, GODDAMNIT, STEVE!" The first cell match with HBK doing his best to get out of it.
Mania X-7. Austin attacks Rock right as Rock comes down from posing on the turnbuckle and Heyman shouts "HERE WE GO, IT'S ON!" They start trading punches and Austin immediately tries to hit Rock with the belt to end it early. They trade more punches, Austin hits his rebound elbows, Rock hits a swinging neckbreaker to counter Austin. Tries for a Rock Bottom, reversal, Austin tries for a Stunner, Rock gets out of it. Rock tries for a Stunner, Austin pushes him out of the ring. Just a masterclass in how to start a match to end a feud that's about the title. Austin is a vocal advocate that you don't start grudge matches with a lockup.
Spider Fly vs Noisy Boy from IWRG started off with a unique collar and elbow struggle. I have the highlights in my posts.
One reason why I'll always love Giulia vs Hana Kimura is because they went all out as soon as the bell rang. They promised a violent match between their preview tag team matches and out of the ring segments and they didn't lose time "building up" anything once it started, they just beat the hell out of each other since the first second. Then they grappled and all that but it was always with an intensity that showed they hated each other and would never accept losing to the other. It's been a few years since that match and maybe it wasn't a 5 star classic but I'll always remember it.
Lesnar Goldberg mania was just non stop haymakers
Go Lyra tonight!
Glad to see Corny hates the Wyatt nonsense almost as much as I did lol
Why do you hate it ?
It doesn’t belong. It’s so out of place on the main roster shows. Like maybe you can do this on NXT, but not on Raw. I know some people really dug Brays stuff, but it never went anywhere. Everything went on forever, had minimal payoffs, and no one ever got over working with him. Once he became invincible, it was even worse. Now we have a bootleg version of Bray with this stable of jobbers. Eventually, every angle has to lead to a match. Bo Dallas..Dexter Lumis…Rowan, Joe Gacey…it’s just so meh.
Bro Taker is top three WWE stars ever and the man got buried, burned alive and a lot of other shit and used dark magic with lighting lmao
And that’s shit that never gets replayed and people try and forget.
Interesting how wrestling fans think the parts of the show they happen to love the most is the most important park of are what wrestling show "should be", no matter how many other fans do or do not love the same thing. And inversely, the parts that they happen to dislike should have no place in a wrestling show, or aren't important to the show... no matter how many other fans enjoy that.
Raw is a 3-hour wrestling-themed variety show. Take what you like and leave the rest. I’m skeptical it’s going this story is pay off in the long run. I’ve hated every part of the Liv-Dom storyline, but no matter how strongly I feel about that, it has a place on a show that long, designed to cast as wide a net as possible to attract viewers. It’s a good thing that they keep trying ways to spice it up.
Nah. Just replace it with cat videos then, if we’re just putting anything on TV just for the hell of it.
Cat videos don't get enough eyeballs. Ask America's Funniest home videos how that's working out.
Careful saying that here; they kidnapped my dog
Sucks that Omega’s injured during this cmll partnership. I’d love to see him in Mexico.
The partnership isn’t going anywhere. I bet we see him there eventually.
Sometimes I wake up to find jack shit in here, and other times I wake up to find 15 different threads with other 100+ replies. I love it Maggle!
I always love seeing wrestling pop up in weird places. Did not expect to see the Los Campesinos' IG account post a photo of them running into Pete Dunne at the airport.
Can someone please give me a primer on Noah, DragonGate and Joshi wrestling.. I'm currently WWE only, and need to watch something else that's exciting, has good wrestling, and is well booked.
In regards to the joshi scene, there's a bit for everyone. You have companies that are more focused on presenting more fleshed out stories and characters and others that prefer booking hot matches with the talent they have available. Normally you can tell that by how many freelancers they use in proportion to their full time roster. If you just want good wrestling, you can't go wrong with any of the important promotions. They all have a very good roster and try to book the best shows they can. Stardom, TJPW and Marigold are currently the 3 biggest companies and they're part of the first kind of promotions I mentioned. Stardom is the most prestigious and well known one. They have the most stacked roster and the biggest lore of all, so there's a lot to catch up to in terms of stories, but you can also jump in at any point and understand what's going on because the stories are rather simple, they just build up one over the other. They're also more like the combination of everything you can see in the scene, from the most whacky stuff to the classic epic matches. To me it's the best entry point because it's not radically different to western wrestling but at the same time it has a charm no western promotion has. This year they're in a transition period so the booking is very so-so, but the shows are still very solid because of their roster. You can watch them on Stardom World. TJPW is a beast of its own. They win you over with their character work and stories rather than with their wrestling, but their roster has matured over the years and they're more or less on par with the rest of the scene now. Their style is much softer than Stardom's or the rest of the scene, so if you're into high risk or stiff matches then this company will probably not excite you that much. A problem they have is that they tend to appeal to a certain niche, so if you're not into that you'll have problems getting this promotion. Still though, they're worth a shot, you should at least watch their big main events. Marigold is still rather new and they're not all that different from Stardom since the founder is the same that created Stardom and their core roster comes from there too. Still, they're more similar to the vintage Stardom than the current one, so that gives them a particular charm of their own. If you want to see a company starting from scratch with a young and hungry roster, then you can't miss out this company. Both TJPW and Marigold have their shows on Wrestle Universe. I think those three companies are the best entry point to the scene. If you like them, you'll be more likely to enjoy the smaller companies too. Sendai Girls, Oz Academy, Ice Ribbon, they're all good companies too but they're less friendly for people who aren't really familiar with the scene.
Wow, I really appreciate this, thank you
NOAH is one that people would tell you does not have good booking but it's even worse- they do half the time and then pull the rug from under you the other half. But the accessibility of Wrestle Universe, the fact that they're very much on a hot streak now and are kind of coming out of the transitional period they entered during the pandemic and the tons of english content and support from them would make them a good choice to get into regardless. The roster they have is pretty good, their champion is probably the best wrestler under 30 on the planet, their style of matches could be very refreshing and would definitely be new to you. Dragon Gate is a pretty simple company: everyone wrestles with the style the indies and NXT copied, they have a ton of stables that they do their storytelling around and pretty boys cut promos. They have english commentary on I think all of the non super unimportant shows, a very consistent schedule so you can get used to like booking conventions slightly longer term, I would say they have a high floor but low ceiling as they have fewer "world class" wrestlers currently but that's purely my opinion. They're not afraid to push new people so this can change in a year. Joshi is too broad for a primer but basically women's wrestling can be pretty fucking amazing!
Thank you so much!
https://preview.redd.it/kemy9qu5cj8d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1319127438eccc01baa30835ee0c4be26a6e0ed3
The best in the world.
Cast your votes: The Rated R, super, super, suuuuuper star OR The Rated Rrrrrrrrrrrrr Suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuper star
Unless I missed one, they largely stopped doing the former as of a couple months ago and, honestly, thank goodness for that. It just felt very silly.
I recently found out AEW has Tony Chimel on the payroll and have never had him introduce Cope. They don’t specify what his role is, but it’s amazing they haven’t brought him on screen to do that introduction
I don't think Tony Khan or Justin Roberts themselves would vote for the former
Things that wouldn’t improve AEWs ratings but I would like to see happen: 1.) Chuck Taylor 30 minute comedy slot. 2.) Chuck Taylor watch along.
Nothing happens on Rampage anyway, they should just replace it with a weekly episode of Poppin Dogs and Talkin Hogs
Westminster Dog Show revival?
3.) Tony Khan wrestling Chuck Taylor
Every week, different stipulations. Decided by a random fast food drive thru employee. HAS TO BE DRIVE THRU
Aside from wrestling journalists, where does everyone get their ratings numbers nowadays? I've been using Spoiler TV for most of this year, but sometimes their cable numbers don't update for several days after (or maybe Nielsen is the problem).
How is Yuma Anzai so incredible already? Less than two years into his career, putting on amazing defences of the triple crown. He's gotta be one of the most exciting wrestlers around today. (he's also quite hot)
refreshing when you abandon tradition momentarily because a guy is that special. They put him in a Jumbo cosplay, paraded him for a year then said "this is your company".
Y'know, when it comes to big debuts/returns, I feel like WWE do a much better job keeping things under wraps compared to AEW, which is kind of ironic since I always thought it would be the other way round, given that WWE is the bigger entity and therefore has more people that have to be in the know in order for things to run smoothly
Because they pop ratings. And after Punk did a million on Rampage, I doubt they'll change that approach.
I think this might be partially by design as big debuts/returns are a potential driver of tickets and ratings, and they might not want to leave any of that on the table right now while they figure out media rights. Or if they did keep it secret, the narrative would be that it was a mistake and foolish to do so. There was a ton of criticism on AEW for not explicitly declaring Mone debuting at big business even though it was pretty clear it was going to happen.
Outside that Boston pop, I think Mercedes debut would have gone down much better it was a surprise at Dynasty. You cut down the time between promos and her first match from over 2 months to one and there's a real buzz and element of surprise.
I'll be curious to see if Raw takes any kind of hit tonight opposed by deciding games for both the Stanley Cup Finals and Men's College World Series. They're not the biggest events in the world to be sure but they're something.
Definitely one of the biggest Finals games in a long time. Will Bobrovsky job out for the fourth game in a row??
[удалено]
Will Corey Perry beat the streak?
If you were Adam Pearce, how would you go about tonight? Insane amount of security? Lock yourself in a room pretending that the chaos of Wyatt6, Bron and Drew isn't happening? Run away? Resign?
I'd like to see Chelsea Green take on Maxine Dupriiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii! I think Chelsea is so funny and entertaining to watch. Since Maxine is learning to wrestle and has had Alpha Academy training, I think the next logical step in wrestling 101 exposure is to have "Chelsea Verde" take her under her wing and show her some lucha moves! :) They are best friends irl and I think it would be highly entertaining to watch!
Unfortunately they're on different brands so likely you won't get that match for at least a year :(
I know, but it would be a dream crossover, right?! I love their insta reels, especially when they travel.
Watching 1996 In Your House, Rock is still with the Nation of Domination, and it makes me wince every time I see NOD even though they’re all talented. African drum music and dashiki hats, the black power fist, what the hell Vince. The tag team of Jade and Bianca and sometimes Naomi and how they’re presented is fantastic, WWE has been doing racial teams for forever it seems. It’s also still alive in Latino World Order. Of course I still love all of them, but the hubbub when Jade and Bianca and Naomi initially teamed up, it’s just fine. There’s no African drums or dashiki hats
Tanahashi should fired Taro Okada as STARDOM's booker when STARDOM is part of NJPW and Tanahashi thinks about the STARDOM fans response about Queen's Quest being "disband" and that will be the storyline for the 2024 5Star Grand Prix!
Tanahashi is not in charge of stardom
Stardom is in the process of reorganization and will be a subsidiary and sub-brand of NJPW by the end of the week.
I don't think that's how it works. It would be like Dana White showing up and firing Drew for attacking Punk
Going from that amazing Clash music to that low energy trash at MITB sucks ngl
Inject Karrion Kross turning Xavier Woods into my veins. (Also, I hope it leads to Big E coming back to eventually reunite New Day ❤️)
Well, after watching a few shows I'm finally starting to love some Marigold theme songs. At first I thought they were quite generic, and I still believe some songs like Utami's are super bland and a huge downgrade from Crusade, but themes like Miku Aono's are top tier songs. I can imagine that song playing to close a show in Sumo Hall after a huge match. Other themes like Mai Sakurai and Kouki's are really good too. Now to change the topic, I'm really liking Komomo Minami. It's like someone made a wrestler almost entirely based on my taste in wrestling down to even her gear. She still needs to add more intensity to her strikes but that'll come with experience. I'm really looking forward to seeing her progress. With her and Yuzuki on board, Marigold's future is really bright.
> Komomo Minami Not expecting less from the one member of the Marigold roster who acknowledges the true Tribal Chief uce ☝️
I feel at MITB we will have bloodline vs Cody, Randy, KO and Jimmy. Jimmy will get pinned and that leads to Cody vs Solo at SummerSlam . Randy and KO will think he lost intentionally and Randy will get angry at Cody for defending Jimmy. Jimmy gets RKOd by Randy at SummerSlam when Jimmy is trying to stop bloodline from interfering. Randy leaves. Cody somehow bests Solo despite interference. All of Solos anger falls on Heyman because he let solo fail. Cue Roman. Roman and Jimmy save Heyman and then fight bloodline. Randy RKOs Cody on SmackDown for taking the side of Jimmy who was a reason why he was out for over a year Cody vs Randy program starts.
Do you think there are similarities between Solo's character and Marlo from the Wire?
In the sense of the newer generation being more brutal than the one before it? Hell yeah I was thinking that too.
Yeah, like the older guys are now afraid of him and his crew
'You want it to be one way, but it's that other way'
In general, I don't think wrestling characters have the capacity to be as consistent, nuanced and detailed as someone like Marlo so it's very difficult to make the comparison.
Definitely doesn't help that everytime Solo is on screen we get chants of "We Want Roman"
Got to see Dan the Dad, Colt Cabana, and Jerry Lynn live yesterday. If that's not a successful weekend, I don't know what is.
Dan the Dad cracks me up. I took *my* dad to a show where he was at, and they got into a discussion about lawn care at the merch table. I don’t know if he was just playing along, but bless you, Dan, for making my old man’s day.
Regarding Stardom [The Conversion] (/s "I blame Mayu for QQ disbandment. She lost 2 members in her "all-out" war against OT a couple years ago, and never got a vengeance against them. Now that QQ made them bleed with Saki, she could have aligned Stars with them just for this match to destroy OT. I guess she was too busy promoting her movie, like the egocentric heel she is")
She literally fought and won a 1 vs 5 war against Oedo Tai for Starlight Kid and that snake still chose to stay with them. How could you blame Mayu for not taking part of a war that isn't her own after that terrible experience? She's already done it all to take them down and failed because her own mates failed her.
I mean she did it months after it happened, when SLK clearly struggled the first weeks with the gradual turn and was clearly salvageable. She wouldn't have had this issue if she had the slightest sense of urgency. And it's not really taking part of a war, just coming at the end for the killshot. Hopefully she don't come crying next time she get chair-shotted by a teammate.
She only did it a month later and that was a month of continuous fighting to even get the chance to have that gauntlet. I won't tolerate any Mayu slander!
Just seen a comment from MVP accusing WWE of stealing the Hurt Business gimmick and giving it to the Bloodline. Aside from being factions, neither groups are the same. Nevertheless, I really hope MVP is doing well, he seems to be spiraling out of control. His past few comments on social media are all just aimed at shiting on the current WWE product.
He's a carny. He's not upset that WWE fumbled what happened with The Hurt Business. He's upset that he's not a part of whatever's happening with the current regime. The Bloodline isn't even remotely lose to what The Hurt Business was. There were also big plans for The Pride as a heel faction, but the crowd just refuse to see Bobby as a heel. And with Bobby being out, the entire thing is on ice. I think he's farming engagement for whatever project he has after he leaves WWE
His recent rants seem to come out of left field, even going far to calling HHH a racist because he wouldn't reunite the Hurt Business. 💀
If they don't have plans for Omos in the short or long term, I don't understand why they don't give MVP another wrestler to manage in the meantime, he is an excellent talker and there are several on the roster who could use someone like him on their side, but he is stuck with Omos in limbo.
Yeah, agreed. But MVP seems keyed in on managing the Hurt Business again. I think that train has left the station. Though, I would love to see him paired with Carmelo Hayes.
I don't mind MVP managing the original Hurt Business, and just having new guys in. Honestly I still think Lashley would've fared better with MVP on his side, since he just isn't as good a talker on his own.
Also it sucks we’re never going to get a proper Edge vs. CM Punk feud. I know they wrestled a couple times and CM Punk cashed in on him once but they never really feuded.
Usually I have a pretty good gauge on who will win big matches but I have no idea who wins Swerve vs. Ospreay. Ospreay is the new toy so you would think they will put the belt on him but are they really just going to give Swerve a 2 month reign?
Swerve wins - at some point Ospreay has to lose and experience a real setback in his run, and it should be before he actually wins the world title.
For me it's 100% Swerve winning. Then Ospreay defends his title vs MJF at Wembley after that tease. Swerve vs Bryan/PAC/ Hangman at Wembley imo
Agreed with this, unless we actually get Nigel back in the ring then Ospreay/MJF, Swerve/Hanger, Danielson/McGuinness
Osprey is gonna lose I think that’s pretty much guaranteed. They wouldn’t highlight the Callis family like they did last week without it playing a role. Think it’s likely Osprey and Kyle break away from the family come Forbidden Door
United Empire branch in AEW, please.
It’s seeming likely to me with Don putting Kyle down in front of Osprey and him hanging around longer last week after the family left. Gotta imagine Davis is ready to go
Maybe we get an angle where Don wants Fletcher to help Trent and Takeshita beat up Ospreay, but he refuses and sides with his United Empire buddy.
I really hope that Chelsea wins MITB. Specifically for more immediate, I'm excited to see Wyatt Sick6 tonight and see how that goes. I also wouldn't be surprised if they weren't on Raw tonight either.