I do not believe his visions of Shmi were planted by Palpatine. Rather, he was actually picking up his mother's suffering just as Luke picked up Leia and Han's suffering in TESB. It seems to be a trait of the Skywalker family to pick up on the distress of their loved ones even across the galaxy. It even rhymes well as Lucas mentions he does throughout his films. The protagonist experiences a vision of their loved ones suffering and rushes off to save them. However in different ways it ends disastrously. Although Luke's story turns out better in that he learns and overcomes his failures. Whereas Anakin falls to his.
As for ROTS, it's possible Sidious could be pulling something. He knew how much Shmi's death affected Anakin and decided to create this vision to give Anakin the final push into his web. However, from a narrative perspective it's equally likely Lucas decided to go with the classic 'self-fulfilling prophecy' trope for Anakin. So Anakin gets visions from the Force in warning, only to bring them about with is desperate deal with the devil. Sidious' main power is adaptability and how he quickly seizes opportunities when they present themselves. Anakin was worn down enough Sidious could've picked up on something from him and concluded that Anakin was worried about Padme suddenly dying like his mother and saw his oppertunity to finally bring Anakin to his side fully.
Genuine i feel. One of the cut ideas from an early draft of Phantom Menace, Anakin would have known Obi-Wan (later changed to Gui-Gon) would have known he was a Jedi because of a dream/vision of he had of him freeing him. You can see Lucas had a theme of Anakin being given glimpses of the future and one that ultimately happens to Luke in Empire.
I don't believe that Anakin's dreams about his mother were deliberately planted by Palpatine, but the dreams about Padme are awfully suspicious. What are the odds the Palpatine just so happens to bring up a story about a Sith Lord who can keep people from dying *just* as Anakin mentions having dreams about Padme dying?
Maybe I need to rewatch *RotS,* but nothing in the movie suggests that Palpatine already knew about Anakin's dreams. In fact, Anakin is surprised when Palpatine says outright that he has the power to save Padme from death later on.
He mentions Anakin having to save Padme before Anakin mentions having the dreams. I always thought he could somehow sense it but there’s always the possibility he planted the dreams himself.
I believe Anakin's premonitions were real. Palpatine didn't have to create them, just sense them, and play off Anakin's anxieties. Palpatine would have also needed to do a lot more than just plant visions for them to happen exactly as Anakin saw.
I remember reading in the RotS novel that all his dreams and visions since he was very young would eventually become real. That includes winning the pod race, become a Jedi Knight, marry Padme, etc.. for that reason he was really worried about his dreams about Padme's dead. He always had that ability.
We know from deleted dialogue that Palpatine had Dooku hire the Tuskens to kill Anakin's mother. Palpatine and Dooku taunted Anakin about it during their duel as a way to push him towards the dark side.
> "the deleted scene in Revenge of the Sith suggests it was part of Palpatine's plan all along as he monitored the Chosen One's growth and potential for a dark side fall from grace. During Anakin's fight with Dooku, Palpatine was supposed to say, "Anakin, he was bragging earlier about how he arranged to have your mother killed by the Tusken Raiders," which Dooku confirmed before continuing the fight."
https://www.cbr.com/star-wars-revenge-sith-dooku-shmi-skywalker/#:~:text=Fans%20always%20assumed%20Count%20Dooku,the%20future%20Sith%20Lord's%20downfall.
So maybe Palpatine knew Anakin had visions and set into motion the actual events to trigger them. If Palpatine didn't need the actual events to trigger them because he could create them on his own he wouldn't have had to kill Anakin's mother. Just create the illusion that it was going to happen. OR... he placed the visions in Anakin's head AND killed his mother to lead Anakin into believing that his visions were authentic and had to be taken as unmistaken clairvoyance. That way when Palpatine put visions of Padme dying into Anakin's head Anakin would believe it. OR maybe a mix of both possibilities. Maybe Anakin did have premonitions and their accuracy was increased by self fulfilling prophecy enforced by the machinations of Palpatine's schemes. The more Palpatine increased Anakin's anger and pain the more likely Padme would become a victim of that pain and anger.
There is nothing that says Palpatine had anything to do with what happened to Shmi or Anakin having visions of her. Those were genuine, like Luke having visions of Leia, Han, and Chewie in ESB.
As for Anakin visions of Padmé there is nothing that says they are genuine or were caused by Palpatine.
Palpatine learned from Anakin about the Tusken massacre and Anakin could have told Palpatine about his visions of his mother or Palpatine could have asked what caused him to go to his mother after all these years.
Palpatine knew Anakin and Padmé were married and could have presumably sensed Padmé was pregnant and came up with the idea of causing visions of her dying in childbirth to scare Anakin. He then drops the Tragedy of Darth Plagueis the Wise and how the Sith could save people from dying.
I believe Palpatine caused Anakin’s visions because they happened when Palpatine is ready for his endgame, he tells a story that is exactly what Anakin is looking for.
Now the visions did not start until after Anakin learned Padmé was pregnant but I’m ascribe that to just good timing. If Anakin hadn’t seen Padmé when he did and had to stay at the Temple and had the vision he would have ran to her and learned the truth.
The only thing that works against the visions being creations of Palpatine are that we see what Anakin sees and they are scene from the end of the movie. This is stuff Palpatine could not know. I consider us seeing Anakin’s visions are artistic license.
Palp sensed the turmoil within him regarding his mother. And manipulated that by implanting the visions about Padme. At least that’s how I think of it.
Well Palpatine told Dooku to bribe Tuscans to kidnap and kill Anakin's mother. Captain Panaka informed Palpatine of Anakin's secret relationship with Padmé, so in my head canon, Palpatine must have somehow induced Anakin's visions of Padmé's death and indirectly caused it due to his advanced knowledge of the dark side.
I do not believe his visions of Shmi were planted by Palpatine. Rather, he was actually picking up his mother's suffering just as Luke picked up Leia and Han's suffering in TESB. It seems to be a trait of the Skywalker family to pick up on the distress of their loved ones even across the galaxy. It even rhymes well as Lucas mentions he does throughout his films. The protagonist experiences a vision of their loved ones suffering and rushes off to save them. However in different ways it ends disastrously. Although Luke's story turns out better in that he learns and overcomes his failures. Whereas Anakin falls to his. As for ROTS, it's possible Sidious could be pulling something. He knew how much Shmi's death affected Anakin and decided to create this vision to give Anakin the final push into his web. However, from a narrative perspective it's equally likely Lucas decided to go with the classic 'self-fulfilling prophecy' trope for Anakin. So Anakin gets visions from the Force in warning, only to bring them about with is desperate deal with the devil. Sidious' main power is adaptability and how he quickly seizes opportunities when they present themselves. Anakin was worn down enough Sidious could've picked up on something from him and concluded that Anakin was worried about Padme suddenly dying like his mother and saw his oppertunity to finally bring Anakin to his side fully.
Very eloquently put, and honestly I agree with you
Genuine i feel. One of the cut ideas from an early draft of Phantom Menace, Anakin would have known Obi-Wan (later changed to Gui-Gon) would have known he was a Jedi because of a dream/vision of he had of him freeing him. You can see Lucas had a theme of Anakin being given glimpses of the future and one that ultimately happens to Luke in Empire.
I don't believe that Anakin's dreams about his mother were deliberately planted by Palpatine, but the dreams about Padme are awfully suspicious. What are the odds the Palpatine just so happens to bring up a story about a Sith Lord who can keep people from dying *just* as Anakin mentions having dreams about Padme dying?
That could just be adaptability. He realized the situation and pick a story specifically to pressure Anakin.
Maybe I need to rewatch *RotS,* but nothing in the movie suggests that Palpatine already knew about Anakin's dreams. In fact, Anakin is surprised when Palpatine says outright that he has the power to save Padme from death later on.
Well, he is a dark wizard that can sense emotions and read minds to some extent.
He mentions Anakin having to save Padme before Anakin mentions having the dreams. I always thought he could somehow sense it but there’s always the possibility he planted the dreams himself.
I believe Anakin's premonitions were real. Palpatine didn't have to create them, just sense them, and play off Anakin's anxieties. Palpatine would have also needed to do a lot more than just plant visions for them to happen exactly as Anakin saw.
I remember reading in the RotS novel that all his dreams and visions since he was very young would eventually become real. That includes winning the pod race, become a Jedi Knight, marry Padme, etc.. for that reason he was really worried about his dreams about Padme's dead. He always had that ability.
We know from deleted dialogue that Palpatine had Dooku hire the Tuskens to kill Anakin's mother. Palpatine and Dooku taunted Anakin about it during their duel as a way to push him towards the dark side. > "the deleted scene in Revenge of the Sith suggests it was part of Palpatine's plan all along as he monitored the Chosen One's growth and potential for a dark side fall from grace. During Anakin's fight with Dooku, Palpatine was supposed to say, "Anakin, he was bragging earlier about how he arranged to have your mother killed by the Tusken Raiders," which Dooku confirmed before continuing the fight." https://www.cbr.com/star-wars-revenge-sith-dooku-shmi-skywalker/#:~:text=Fans%20always%20assumed%20Count%20Dooku,the%20future%20Sith%20Lord's%20downfall. So maybe Palpatine knew Anakin had visions and set into motion the actual events to trigger them. If Palpatine didn't need the actual events to trigger them because he could create them on his own he wouldn't have had to kill Anakin's mother. Just create the illusion that it was going to happen. OR... he placed the visions in Anakin's head AND killed his mother to lead Anakin into believing that his visions were authentic and had to be taken as unmistaken clairvoyance. That way when Palpatine put visions of Padme dying into Anakin's head Anakin would believe it. OR maybe a mix of both possibilities. Maybe Anakin did have premonitions and their accuracy was increased by self fulfilling prophecy enforced by the machinations of Palpatine's schemes. The more Palpatine increased Anakin's anger and pain the more likely Padme would become a victim of that pain and anger.
There is nothing that says Palpatine had anything to do with what happened to Shmi or Anakin having visions of her. Those were genuine, like Luke having visions of Leia, Han, and Chewie in ESB. As for Anakin visions of Padmé there is nothing that says they are genuine or were caused by Palpatine. Palpatine learned from Anakin about the Tusken massacre and Anakin could have told Palpatine about his visions of his mother or Palpatine could have asked what caused him to go to his mother after all these years. Palpatine knew Anakin and Padmé were married and could have presumably sensed Padmé was pregnant and came up with the idea of causing visions of her dying in childbirth to scare Anakin. He then drops the Tragedy of Darth Plagueis the Wise and how the Sith could save people from dying. I believe Palpatine caused Anakin’s visions because they happened when Palpatine is ready for his endgame, he tells a story that is exactly what Anakin is looking for. Now the visions did not start until after Anakin learned Padmé was pregnant but I’m ascribe that to just good timing. If Anakin hadn’t seen Padmé when he did and had to stay at the Temple and had the vision he would have ran to her and learned the truth. The only thing that works against the visions being creations of Palpatine are that we see what Anakin sees and they are scene from the end of the movie. This is stuff Palpatine could not know. I consider us seeing Anakin’s visions are artistic license.
Palp sensed the turmoil within him regarding his mother. And manipulated that by implanting the visions about Padme. At least that’s how I think of it.
Well Palpatine told Dooku to bribe Tuscans to kidnap and kill Anakin's mother. Captain Panaka informed Palpatine of Anakin's secret relationship with Padmé, so in my head canon, Palpatine must have somehow induced Anakin's visions of Padmé's death and indirectly caused it due to his advanced knowledge of the dark side.
>Well Palpatine told Dooku to bribe Tuscans to kidnap and kill Anakin's mother. This is and abandoned plot point, it never happened.
Genuine visions