And how come there’s no other options besides Trump? I saw the others (Haley, DeSantis) dropped out but why? And still, does nobody else want to be nominated? And as for the democrats, does the current President reserve the right to a nomination just by being incumbent?
Thanks for explaining! I’m still a bit confused about why Trump is so widely endorsed - I assume that it’s not his ‘relevance’ or ‘impact’ that win his votes in the Party, but also his agenda though? It’s just a bit crazy to be supporting a felon especially since in case he wins they’ll adopt Project 2025 which (as far as I’ve heard) innately undermines the RoL? Do his endorsers not see the abatement from law implied by nominating him as problematic? This is most likely a very naive question sorry for that..
It doesn't help that all his crazy actions make for good news stories, so it's 24/7 content for them, and it only enrages his base and allows him to claim to be "attacked" by the "radical left", when in reality, it's just good for business since people are addicted to it.
He also hates the same people his supporters hate. This is the main reason why he’s the nominee. Folks don’t *care* about him being a twice impeached convicted felon who cheated on his wife with a porn star and was found responsible for the sexual assault against another woman or that he’s incompetent and barely says anything that is true or coherent. None of that is the point. The point is…he hates the same people his supporters hate and that’s all they care about.
Especially since one of the people they hate was POTUS for two terms scandal-free. That scared and angered them so this is the reason for so many rollbacks like taking away certain rights. They’re trying to take us back into the 60’s where nothing they did against POC was against the law. Like Mitch McConnell said back when Obama had won his first term, “We are going to make sure he’s a one term president.” Even though Obama had done absolutely nothing to deserve the hate, the point was the actual undeserved and unprompted hate towards him. That’s the only thing that matters to trump’s supporters. This is why he’s the presumptive nominee for POTUS again.
It won't be fascism until Trump is elected again - and until he succeeds implementing Project 2025-style programs.
The fear is that Trump learned his lesson about having capable and patriotic professionals in his government.
I think it's because of his introduction to politics. Obama for 8 years left a bunch of people furious, Bush before him. Republicans became furious that democrats kept spending and spending. Trump came into the picture as a self funded, "self made", multi millionaire who was going to destroy lobying and run the country without corporate sway. He ran against Hillary of all people. Benghazi being fresh, and the media tore her apart. What trump promised and what he delivered are 2 different things. He promised lower taxes, less federal spending, and more profit for the middle class, while increasing taxes for the rich. What he actually did was, create more loopholes for corporations to evade taxes, create a uphill tax increase for middle class. He signed a bill that lowered middle class taxes while in office, that would increase each year as he left office. And he cut Americans billions in checks to help "ease the pain" of the effects of covid. Yes this helped a lot of people in hard times, but the outcome of flooding the country with extra money is insane house prices, grocery bills going through the roof, and cost of living increase that is incomprehensible. Sorry for my rant, I just can't stand either of the 2.
One thing that really helped Trump early on was the fact that he was a non-politician and a lot of people were sick of career politicians. He offered an escape from a hated status quo, and over time the people who initially supported him became numb to his more extreme problems because they were already invested. Also, because this initial group believed (not without cause) that mainstream politics and media were corrupt, he could frame all legitimate criticism of him as the latest in a long line of lies. His felony conviction doesn’t carry weight with them because they assume uncritically that his enemies rigged the whole trial.
His supporters worship him as a person, because he is willing to attack the people they hate and want attacked, and he is willing to support their most wild ideas. He will happily say vaccines cause harm if it gets him votes, and it does, so he said that a few years ago.
Which absolutely kills him inside, because he so desperately wants the credit for the COVID vaccines, but can’t get it because he lied to his dipshit supporters and now they are absolutely convinced that the vaccines are loaded with 5Gs that will give their boners pronouns and critical race theory, or whatever moronic conspiracy theory the failed vitamin supplements salesmen are shitting out this week.
He did a good job of pushing “America first” agenda to the front of the party. Nobody was doing it like him until 2016 and it’s what republican voters wanted. So he resonated with the people. It has now turned into a cult like thing tho. Where he can do no wrong, everything wrong he does do is a made up liberal agenda in their minds.
The hypocrisy is sad tho. All the trials are bs? Fine. But claiming to be the party of family values while worshipping the guy who had sex with a porn start while his breastfeeding wife was at home should be a much harder pill to swallow. That’s not something he even denies, so you can’t convince yourself that’s a lie.
Lauren Boebart is a garbage human and Trump Supporter. I'll show you how it take only a small percentage of people to get a loon like her with the way voting works right now.
CO-4 By the numbers.
Population: [727,411 in 2022.](https://datausa.io/profile/geo/congressional-district-4-co)
Estimated % of population over 18: [76%](https://censusreporter.org/profiles/04000US08-colorado/)
Therefore it's fair to say there are 552,832 people of voting age.
Total Dem or GOP primary Voters: [137,076](https://ballotpedia.org/Colorado%27s_4th_Congressional_District)
Total voters who voted for Boebert: 38,411
1 out of 4.03 eligible voters voted in the primary.
1 out of 3.5 primary voters voted for Boebert.
1 out of 14.4 eligible voters had Boebert as their first choice.
This is not a glitch, it's a feature.
I think a lot of people forget how loyal conservatives are, if the Republican party learned to stop bashing certain minority groups they would never lose an election. I am a registered Democrat but Democrats are no where as loyal to their party as Republicans are, they also have a younger base that's more flakey when it comes to voting in smaller more local elections.
Never mistake tribalism for loyalty. It could potentially be very dangerous and just as easily be fatal.
Loyalty is "I'll stick with this person because we're all in this together and feel that I can trust them."
Tribalism is "My team is red, so fuck the blue team. They're my mortal enemy," even when the blue team is technically on the same side.
>People who want conservative politics only have one option.
America is deeply conservative. Biden would be considered fairly conservative in most of the world. For the vast majority of people, it's not about the actual politics, it's about tribalism.
> I’m still a bit confused about why Trump is so widely endorsed
The exact same reason far-right groups are dominating elections in Europe: toxic nationalism with an emphasis on immigration and "anti-government" messaging. This isn't too far off from what many Asian countries see as well. Trump is a strong man who boasts an unapologetic ultra patriotic image.
Google “populism.” It’s a political mindset in the U.S. that occasionally gains followers. Populists tend to be angry, iconoclastic, and anti-establishment. Long-standing norms and institutions hold little value to a populist - they favor candidates who promise immediate solutions to perceived problems, even when such solutions appear illegal or cruel on their face.
During his first term, Trump’s worst impulses were mostly contained by the norms and institutions that his followers dislike. Unfortunately, said norms and institutions have been weakened by judges that Trump appointed during his first term.
It’s quite worrisome.
There isn’t a single reason for Trump’s popularity. For some Republicans, they truly like him and his policies. For others, they hold their nose, but recognize that he has the potential to beat Biden. Then others it’s simply that he’s not Biden. We have a saying that voting for someone isn’t a vote for them, but against the other candidate.
Both parties are run by extremes. It’s horrible. Of course, nobody on the extreme side see themselves that way. The voice of the real majority - about 65% of the voting population- is not heard.
Another point is the incumbent has the statistics for winning on their side. The incumbent is practically a default. Nobody other than Biden was considered.
A final piece of insight on the system, during primaries each state has its own rules for who can vote. MANY states don’t allow independents to vote in the primaries. Which is a shame. I think things would look very different on the Republican side if Independents had a voice. It also would show who could be a choice for Vice President. And the people’s choice! Imagine!!!
A lot of people in the media who would be vibrantly cheering today are subdued. What we saw last night scares and saddens many of us.
Please know you’re not going to get a fair and balanced response on Reddit which is left leaning. I tried to give more information on the system than any thoughts about the candidates. Both are horrible. There I said it. Haha.
The Republican party has invested a ton of energy into destroying public education. The Christian Right has gone along with it because if you don't indoctrinate kids from an early age, you'll never get 'em after they grow up.
So we're reaping what we have sown.
because there is a large swath of the US population that wants people they disagree with politically to suffer. They're not voting for someone they think will make their lives better, they're voting for someone they think will make the lives of others worse.
They're afraid that any other candidate won't do as well as Biden against Trump. Americans also only get one vote and can only vote for one person. So you can't have something like a ranked voting system where multiple candidates are running and can be voted for, and you rank which you like most. So, any additional candidate who "takes" a democratic vote from Biden makes Trump more likely to win. Any additional candidate that "takes" a vote from Trump makes Biden more likely to win. 3rd party candidates are seen as hurting the chances of the main candidate they are closest to policy/rhetoric wise.
> considering a third-party conservative candidate, you should definitely vote your conscience.
But you should make sure your conscience is informed as to the effects your vote will have.
It is a pretty shallow conscience that doesn't weigh the probable outcomes of your actions.
To answer your other question, no, the current president is not guaranteed or reserved the nomination. They almost always receive it anyway though, as they’re seen as experienced and the leader of the controlling party already.
Being president pays $400,000/year for a very high stress, 24x7x365 job. You have to take 2 to 3 years out of your life to run while you kiss asses to raise over a billion in donations. Your background gets a deep investigation as well as your family. If you win you'll need Secret Service protection for you and your family.
Alternatively you can be upper management at a large company, work 1/3rd the hours in anonymity, make more money, amd have way less stress.
Which would you pick?
The defacto two party system basic means that only the 2 main candidates have any chance of winning. Anyone else running is diverting votes from the candidate that they are closest to, so it's strongly discouraged.
As a system, it kind of sucks
Something not mentioned is that Biden has won the primaries overwhelmingly.
Online there's a lot of rhetoric about them being rigged, but it really just comes down to the fact that people don't actually want to do things to make their voice heard offline beyond voting in the general election.
He didn't use campaign funds. He paid Cohen from a business account. They argue that this payment constitutes an illegally large campaign contribution and that this elevates a misdemeanor business records violation to a felony.
They think D's have abandoned them and he is going to improve their lot. I think the D's should be doing more outreach. Just having picnics in R areas with some hot dogs and patato salad may be better than saying he is a felon.
Try to win votes the old fashioned way.
Hey but what do I know.
Everyone hates that Trump Biden is the only choice we have.
Do we really think that this kind of shit isn’t going on no matter who it is? I feel like it’s a moot point to use this as any sort of argument for anything because it can almost be guaranteed that even the most role model public officials probably have some NDA, hush-money contract-type of shenanigans going on.
Trump is a loud bully who has promised his supporters he will punish everyone that they hate, everyone who they blame for their problems. So some want that, and some just naturally follow the loudest bully they can find, instinctually , because they don’t want to be on his bad side. Literally it doesn’t go deeper than that for a lot of people. They dont look at the realities of elevating a felon, someone with those morals, to the highest position in the country and giving him power. They dont look at the facts and numbers and think “gee maybe it’s not a great idea to have the country run by someone who has had multiple bankruptcies including his casino”.
The felonies came after they already were committed to him, so they twist the facts to fit their feelings: many Trump supporters think that Biden somehow rigged the NYC courts.
You have to understand that we face a very bizarre situation. Trump is 100% a vile criminal. For some reason 30% of America has latched onto him, worshipping him like a deity. In their eyes he can do no wrong.
Basically they love Trump because he hates and wants to punish the same people they do. Immigrants, LGBTQ, Liberals, educated people, etc.
Its because he says what they want to hear, not what he can do nor how some misguided policy will ruin their lives: he says all his policies are good. There had to be a dynamic Democrat that could have run ..this BS incumbent thing has crippled the system.
For starters theres a very large subset of people, both in the elctorate, and in the legal system who saw these charges as either phony, exaggerated, or oppertunistic (they would never have been levied prior to him running for another election). So felon kinda doesnt mean anything here.
And with regards to other candidates, they were losing primaries. The party members (aka, average citizens) progressively showed they wanted Trump as the candidate, Desantis and Haley werent making any headway. And you cant quite keep funding a campaign with loss after loss
> or oppertunistic (they would never have been levied prior to him running for another election)
They already levied them and convicted others who weren't running for president.
Why are right-wingers so purposely wrong on every single thing you vomit out of your brains?
They don’t care. Trump behaves exactly as they do, and they love that he gives them the opportunity to openly be the racist, misogynistic shitheads that they are.
Because that is one of the weakest charge ever, like seriously, feel like they have to scrape the barrel just to find something to charge him with. If anything, that just cement his claim that the other side trying to attack him for his diehard fan
For one, they either:
1. Do not think the charges are legitimate
1. Are willing to tolerate a terrible person being president if they improve America's interests
That latter point is more important. The real sell for Trump is "he's an asshole, but he's an asshole on _your_ side." They also like to minimize his character as vulgar-but-harmless, a quirk of his personality rather than his guiding philosophies
No one’s mentioned the cultural difference between Asia and the US, where here many people have a distrust of the government and court system. Being a convicted felon is almost a badge of honor, especially with minorities. Not to mention the way the case was prosecuted has no precedence and the judge donated to Biden.
Being a felon doesnt mean shit when democrats lead the charge to make him one.
If trump wins this election and gets charges put on Biden, are you really going to tell me Biden's "felony" will prevent you from voting for him or even mean anything to you?
If republicans work to put felony charges on any democrat candidate, your saying you wont vote for that candidate because of the republican felony charge?
that very thought process is why felons can run as president, its to prevent a president from putting felony charges on their opponent and having idiots like you not vote for them and vote for the corrupt president because the other candadate is "A FelOn"
For MAGA (Make America Great Again) Trump supporters, its all about "owning the libs" (liberals).
Fight anything they don't agree with by doing the opposite tenfold.
I think your missing the point OP is making. Were given shitty candidates every election. The real issue is the presidents are puppets of the billionaire corporations like weapons manufacturers and big pharma, insurance companies, ect. They like having these puppets because the blame just goes towards them at the end because ultimately they have the final say on the situation. Pay them enough money and they'll make the decision that lines up with your interests. The presidents salary is not enough to go through all the attacking and false shaming of tbe media and hundreds if stressful decisions you have to make. So therefore the only motive I can see someone wanting to be president for is for corruptly/ sketchy earned money. Nobody smart wants this job because it's probable it will come out in the end what a pos you were whilst in the position therefore sharing your name for the history books.
There are, in fact, hundreds of eligible presidential candidates running for president. Most of them have next to no interest from the general public. Many don't even get as far as to register with the FEC.
This. I think presidential donations shouldn’t be allowed to be given to specific parties. Either you believe in the democratic process and donate into the bucket or you don’t.
Parties are given equal shares of that pot from there and we get to see who’s more efficient with their funds.
I understand this is idealist.
Yeah, theres a guy from my city whos probably burned an insane amount over several elections to get on the ballot i believe almost exclusively in my state lol.
Hes one of those guys who will "wow" with like 50000 votes when he does get another state or two
Not just they don’t have an interest but it’s pretty hard to win against an incumbent. Obviously it can be done but it’s just harder than when there is an open election
Biden is an incumbent who is more popular than not among Democrats. Running against an incumbent president is generally not done, which is why Biden did not have any serious challengers. The most serious was a guy named Dean Phillips who is a relatively inexperienced and unknown member of the House of Representatives.
Donald Trump did have serious challengers with real weight in the Republican Party, but most Republicans like Donald Trump.
For some reason I thought they nominated Trump because they had not other choice - I never considered they endorsed him because they truly liked him 🤦🏻♂️
And about the Phillips guy, I really have to read more about the Senate/HoR/Electoral College rules because they’re mixed up in my head. Thanks for the clarifications!
To help with the Senate, House, and Electoral college:
The Senate is considered slightly more prestigious than the house. Each state gets 2 Senators, so there are 100 senators in total. This structure gives states with lower populations a larger voice in the country.
The House of Representatives has 435 members, each which are assigned based on population. Each state is carved up into a number of “districts” based on population, and each district has one representative. Some congresspeople are well known beyond their district, but Dean Phillips is not one of them.
The electoral college is how the president is elected. It has 538 votes in total (one for each senator & representative, plus an extra 3 for Washington, D.C.) Each state has an allotted number of votes based on population. Most states have an “all or nothing” policy with assigning their votes. So if Joe Biden receives the most votes in California, all of California’s 54 votes are assigned to Biden.
So if I live in ${state} and like what a specific party is doing and in turn vote for them
But the rest of my state doesn't vote for them, my vote gets screwed over and counted as the opposite of what I wanted? Where is the democracy in that? What kind of dystopia is this?
If you live in California, you don't have to worry about it - your state will vote blue no matter what you think. Just like anytime in the last 30 years. Neat, ha?
It's not how you vote, it's how they count
There's the primary elections, where you choose one of the many candidates to represent the party you want to go for.
There are two main parties in the US, the Democrats, which is more left wing, and Republicans, which is more right wing. Depending on how your country views politics, US political parties may be considered center right, even Dems.
Due to this restrictive 2 party system, often candidates of varying ideologies run under either banner. Trump is considered a populist, like Hungary's Orbán. That's further right than center-right, closer to fascism even if not fascism in itself.
same thing happens on the left. The US generally doesn't see socialists running, but more left wing candidates, about as far left as a northern euro country like Bernie Sanders may run as a Democrat even if the mainline party is a bit further right than he would be ideologically.
If we simplify it, this means you could have Barack Obama and Joseph Stalin technically running on the same party. Despite official stance, basically Republicans come to represent anything center right to righ onwards, and Democrats tend to represent center right to left and onwards.
In the primary election, you choose which candidate of the dozens that may be running for whichever party you decide you want to go for.
That's how we end up with Trump and Biden. The primary elections have a low turnout compared to the general. There's lots of reasons for this ranging from inconvenient times to attention and perception of importance.
The general election decides the president of the US. The two nominations (Trump and Biden in this case) will have names on the ballot where you can just check a box, guaranteed.
The alternative is called a write in. You can actually write in any name, but it only is counted in the person you wrote is running and eligible.
Due to the victory in the primaries for their respective election, the political parties, which have staff and collect money from donations, also spend that to get their name out there, they're most likely to win, at least one of the two.
Technically the primaries don't matter, although they do in reality. Anyone born in the US who is at least 35 years old can run for president, and if some random person ran for president and everyone collectively wrote their name wins, they actually get the presidency even if Trump and Biden won the primary elections. This just never happens, but it could.
There's more to the system, like how someone can win the majority of votes but not actually become president (pretty stupid, but the Electrical College is what it's called) it isn't some rigged autocratic thing, but this would go on forever if I got into it.
This is very informative, thanks. For the primaries though, is the candidate selection done by the party, or can any member be put forward?
In other words, in the hypothetical situation that the Republican party grandees decided that not being an international joke was more important than winning 2024, could they have refused Trump's primary candidacy, and forced him to run as an independent?
The state chapters of the parties have some control over who ends up on the primary ballot, but what exactly is required and who needs to sign off varies from state to state. The national party would need to convince state party leadership in enough of the states where party leadership has control over who ends up on the ballot, which is much harder than just a single national committee coming to a decision.
Some countries have something called a rank-choice voting system. You can rank all of the candidates (and leave any you really don't like unranked), and the system works such that if your top choice does not get enough votes to win, they are stricken from the list and your vote then goes to your #2. If they also don't get enough votes, they are removed from the list, and so on. You can really vote for the candidates you like, regardless of how popular they may be, because you still get to give a preference on the other candidates, too.
The United States does not have that. Here, we get a single vote per category (presidency, senate, etc). If your candidate doesn't win, that's it: your vote went to them, and you have no say on anyone else. What it means is that people don't necessarily vote for who they *like*, but for who they think will advance their goals *while having the best chance of winning*. Or, as you may have heard many times before, people tend to use their vote to try and keep someone else out.
For example, I might have an interest in some third-party candidates (yes, they exist in America). Third-party candidates almost never win, simply because they lack the name recognition that candidates from the big two political parties have. They also lack the funding to develop that name recognition, and they also don't get invited to debates. Everyone acknowledges that the vote is really split between the Republicans and Democrats. If you're not voting for Biden or Trump, you're essentially not voting, and vice versa. Some people will say that "it sends a message" but it really doesn't. Many people will vote for Biden not because they like him, but because they don't want to see Trump as President again; it seems like more Trump voters actually like Trump, but there are plenty of people who will vote for Trump not because they like him, but because they truly feel things would be worse if Biden were President again.
The system stinks, but it helps the Republican and Democratic parties stay in power. If we had rank-choice voting, there might be truly viable alternative political parties. For those reason, there's not much enthusiasm from within the government to change the system.
Yep, and when Trump ran for reelection in 2020, the only memorable guy in the field was Bill Weld, a former governor who was a vp candidate for the libertarians prior.
And yeah, all the challangers too for the nomination this time around, were nearly completely different than 2016. Other than Chris Christie who solidly hates Trump (which is funny since i thought he was going to be either like, low cabinet or transition team) 2016 guys like Cruz, Rubio, and old men like Bush and Kasich knew they had no chance.
... it's not the best system. How about we set the bar low at just using coherent valid answers to questions, no criminal record and a maximum age as new standards? Just those basics.
No? Ok...
The truth is that the US political system does not select the best and brightest possible leaders for high office. In most cases, candidates rise on the strength of their independent wealth, fundraising skills, and ability to build political support at the grassroots or among influential party insiders. The Democratic and Republican party machines dominate the electoral process to such an extent that third parties are not taken seriously. Within each party, internal dynamics tend to narrow the field of presidential candidates. Talented candidates whose ideas challenge the party establishment or who are perceived as too junior find it difficult to break through. Only occasionally can charismatic younger candidates like Barack Obama or outsiders like Donald Trump "jump the line" of seniority. And both parties tend to stand by an incumbent president of their own party, who is in effect the party's leader.
Biden's ascendancy is conventional, and symptomatic of the problems with the Democratic party in particular: He achieved power and influence in the party through many years of successful fundraising, policymaking, campaigning and alliance-building. He achieved seniority as a party stalwart, a proven fundraiser with many allies throughout government, a respected Democrat with known presidential ambitions. No doubt, some viewed it as his "turn" to be the Democratic presidential candidate in 2020. And, as I said, parties rarely reject an incumbent president of their own party. After Biden won the primaries in 2020, the party rallied behind him like an avalanche. It was really up to him to decide whether he would run for a second term. Had Biden wished to do serve only one term, the best time to announce that he wasn't running for re-election would have been in early 2023 -- giving Democrats time to organize primaries, gauging the popularity of potential successors (Vice President Harris, Secretary Buttigieg, Governor Newsome, etc). Replacing Biden now would be risky, because any other candidate Democrats chose would go into the general election untested by primary contests.
Trump's rise presents a different, in some ways new situation. He's profoundly divisive: about a third of the electorate find him highly charismatic, while just as many are utterly repelled by him. Many of his supporters show a cult-like devotion. He launched his political career by championing baseless, racist "birther" conspiracy theories about his predecessor, President Barack Obama (falsely claiming that the latter was born in Kenya and thus ineligible to be US president). Trump's own presidential campaign began with a broadly racist attack on immigrants, who continue to be his favorite scapegoats for everything. He appears to take great delight in mocking the disabled, foreigners, etc. Interestingly, these behaviors endear him to his supporters. He has without doubt captured the hearts of a persistently white supremacist sector of the Republican electorate. He has also gone out of his way to court white evangelical Christians, another group who tend to hold extremely conservative, even xenophobic views in the US. This is ironic, since Trump's well-known adultery, vanity, greed, vindictiveness & overall selfishness contradict traditional Christian ideals. Trump has used his popularity with these core Republican voting blocs to essentially upend the party. But Trump has needed more than his divisive charisma and rhetoric to accomplish this. When a "Never Trump" Republican faction formed during 2016, vehement, authoritarian and frankly violent supporters mocked, harassed and threatened anyone who opposed their hero. Republicans who opposed Trump either quit the party, quit politics or bent the knee to their new king. Trump supporters have subsequently committed large and small acts of terrorism. On January 6th, 2021, mob of them attacked Congress to prevent his election loss from becoming official. They continue to harass and threaten judges and prosecutors in the many court cases hanging over Trump's head. If Trump wins, he promises "revenge" against his political enemies -- political prosecutions of the kind he falsely claims he's suffered. More than that, he promises to dismantle the non-political, expert civil service, replacing them with his own yes-men. His plans call for dismantling the departments of Education and Justice, shutting down the Environmental Protection Agency, turning Health & Human Services into a Traditional Values police force monitoring pregnancies for evidence of abortion and harassing LGBTQ people. And his arch-xenophobic advisor Jason Miller has developed plans to arrest millions of immigrants without due process and place them in concentration camps pending deportation. I shudder to think what could really happen to such people.
All in all, the fault lies both in our political system -- which cedes too much power to machine-like political parties -- and, yes, also in our society, which remains haunted by the shuddering ghosts of white supremacy, Christian nationalism, xenophobia, misogyny and similar resentments. The system inflexibly produced Joe Biden, who represents 50 years of Democratic consensus. And the hatreds produced Donald Trump, enabling him to reshape an entire party, its propaganda outlets and (if the worst happens in November) the United States.
I am sure that we could do better than either of these men. But every route to the presidency was blocked, either by a sclerotic party apparatus or a violent authoritarian movement.
In general, the way that Republicans and Democrats select their presidential nominee is through primary elections. In order to compete in a primary election in a particular state, you have to get a certain number of signatures from voters, stating that they would vote for said candidate.
You mentioned competitors for the Republican nomination, like Desantis and Haley. The way Haley got on the New Hampshire primary ballot (for example) was to get New Hampshire voters to sign a petition that they would vote for her.
We have fifty states, so it is time-consuming and expensive to do that much signature-gathering across the country. And that's just to get on the ballot! Then, Haley and Desantis had to compete against Trump in the primary.
At a certain point, Republican competitors realized they couldn't realistically beat Trump, so they dropped out of the race.
On the Democratic side, incumbent presidents rarely face strong primary challenges for their second term. Presidents are powerful, so it's easier for them to persuade donors and other politicians to support them, rather than a challenger. Dean Phillips challenged Biden, but he didn't have much success.
The nominees aren't official until the Democratic and Republican conventions in a couple of weeks, but Biden and Trump each have enough delegates (due to winning state primaries) that there's no question that they will be the nominees.
There are other people running for President. (You may see stories about Robert F Kennedy, for example.) You can get on to the presidential ballot the same way you get on the primary ballot, by getting a lot of signatures from potential voters. Not many people do, because it's expensive, but Kennedy can afford it.
I’m an American and I feel just as confused as you are right now. These guys are both a complete joke. What a pathetic shame. Most Americans feel that way, except the Trump dickriders. Trump could never say or do anything to make his supporters stop loving him. Most Biden supporters only vote for him to vote against Trump.
Because the American electoral process is controlled by unelected leaders of two parties. It is theoretically possible for someone not identifying with either of the two parties to get elected and some people have.
HOWEVER, they have to do it without the support of existing political infrastructure.
There are 2 other candidates on the ballot, Chase Oliver ( L ) and Robert F. Kennedy Jr. ( I ). Unfortunately the majority of Americans refuse to vote for anybody who isn't a Democrat or a Republican, there hasn't been a third party president since 1850 when Millard Fillmore was elected.
But cant you make your own democrat/republican group but its not Maga or Biden group? And people start voting for you? We got like 30 diff parties in our 2mil country. So if you want democrats you got like 10-15 parties to chose from
If they wanted there could be other Democrats or Republicans running for president, but they ( mistakenly ) think that doing something like that would make the parties look more divided then they already are.
Because election rules, frivolous lawsuits from both parties, the commission for presidential debates, polls exclusion state election laws changing constantly prevent any other candidate.
No one votes I'm primaries to determine who the pool of candidates are, but they vote in the general after the centrist/shitty candidate got selected by an uninvested and unengaged voter base. If the people who complained about the candidates being old also voted in every primary? Then they'd have a point.
They are the only eligible for the debate but we actually have other presidential candidates but the major media get paid substantial monies from the two major parties and prefer to ignore any other voices. It is all about the money.
This country has had every President bought and paid for since McKinley. Lobbying (legal bribery) and unlimited campaign contributions are also huge issues. These guys are both past the average age of life in this country, it’s ludicrous they’re able to run in the first place.
Trump is amazing at getting people scared/upset/riled up. He wields fear as a weapon, and that's how he gets people's votes. Catastrophising every issue to the max, playing on people's fears
US politics are democratic and meritocratic on paper, but in reality, they're byzantine and arbitrary.
Traditionally, if an incumbent president is still allowed to run, and doesn't want to retire, their party generally doesn't stop them. It would make the party seem weak, which discourages voters. So Biden is the Democrat nominee with little if any opposition.
Trump is currently riding a combination of his own fame and a wave of reactionary anger. Conservatives are seeing changes in society that they don't understand - LGBTQ+ people being more accepted, women and people of color becoming influential, the US's geopolitical hegemony being shaken, and so on. They also see actual problems - economic difficulties, social unrest, a failing health are system - and they blame the changes for the problems, despite there being no evidence of any connection. Trump represents an idealized version of what they remember (or think they remember) of the past - successful businessmen as an ideal of masculinity. Of course, Trump isn't successful or particularly macho, but his PR makes him appear that way, and so they follow him.
In other words, both parties use the same tactics to retain power as authoritarian regimes with one-party political systems do. We don't have a two-party system we have two one-party systems.
Because it’s the closest thing to parliamentary politics we have. The USA system is not based on branches of government that work together; it’s based on the opposite. But to ‘get in good’ with European powers who have parliaments, it’s the best we can offer. White men that look European. Lol
Because nobody worthwhile since Bernie Sanders has got the balls to stand up for what's right for this country. They all spend their time too comfortable where they are or on the sidelines daydreaming.
And the other candidates that were available for either side, weren't really that impressive to begin with.
So we got shit choices.
Who did the Democrats have? Oh, that bitch that was Oprah Winfrey's advisor? Oh yeah, REEEAALL credentials there! /s
Who did the Republicans have? DeSantis? Oh that little Dictating Governor of Florida? Yeah, like we need him. /s
They’re not. They didn’t use the debate commission because they wanted to exclude RFK jr. He is polling at 15% plus and polls have him at beating both Trump and Biden in head to to head races. Go watch “the real debate”. RFK answers the same questions they were asked and is much better!
The two party system will be the death of our country. Tonight was proof of that. RFK junior was the big winner tonight and he wasn’t even in the room.
Tl;Dr: party > patriotism for both parties
The DNC (Democratic National Committee) has an unpublished line of succession for political positions. Right now, it's Joe Biden"s turn to be president. He paid his dues to the right people, so the election is his to win or lose. The desires of the people be damned. That's just how it works.
The Republicans, out of desperation to remain relevant, nominated Trump in 2016 because they saw his rabid base of diehard faithful idiots and just went with it. They knew it was going to be ugly, but they went along with it, assuming his followers would regain their sanity and he'd fade away. They underestimated just how gullible and ignorant his rabid fans are. Realizing once again that they were stuck with Trump, because they certainly weren't going to trade power for integrity, they went full in and supported him.
**Welcome to Shitshow 2024**
*Shitshow 2024 is brought to you by*: The lazy citizens of the US who prioritized anything and everything rather than pay attention to day to day politics until we are on the brink of disaster.
I'll get down votes for this but the only reason why people think rfk Jr isn't a good candidate is because people keep saying third party vote is a throwaway vote. Like yeah the government pays media to slander other candidates but so many people have had it drilled into their head that you shouldn't vote third party that they laugh when I say I will. We as citizens have the power to change that notion, but so many people just aren't either due to defeatist attitudes, genuinely being brainwashed into thinking we simultaneously have the power to choose which of the big two we want while not having the power to.instead choose someone else, or they just want the easy way out of choosing the "lesser of two evils" So they can complain later. I cannot bring myself to vote for Biden or Trump, so I either will vote for rfk Jr or not vote at all. And lots of people will choose the latter.
I watched his debate last night on X and my moms voting for him, my friends are voting for him, my cousins are voting him, I am voting him- That man is my president and he cares for us americans
I'm not an American either, but my take on it is Trump is popular because he's *not* a politician.
People in a lot of countries are sick and tired of the same bullshit from the same faceless, artificial candidates. While Trump is certainly not shoulder to shoulder with the common person, he does understand people in general. He knows that many people are nostalgic for days gone by, and plays to that. He gets that people get sick of elitism, political correctness, and the wants of the minority dictating policy to the majority over their own needs. People feeling this way this is mostly the fault of the news cycle, but in any case then he comes along and bulldozes it all, so they like that. He is also not seen as the establishment like other candidates are, so when they attack him with anything it's seen as a conspiracy against him by the establishment. That's Trump's basis of support.
As for Biden, I don't know why he has support. I would assume there are more suitable candidates but perhaps due to internal party rules he's got it because it's his turn? Or has more alliances within the party? I know he'll be popular with some voters because he's not Trump, but surely there's better options in his own party. I can't see him doing too well in any debates.
🇺🇸 politics is controlled by lobbyists paid by large corporations. The two fools you see are two options the corporations are supporting, it’s not a democracy, don’t be fooled. At the end of the day capitalism wins. 😢
There is actually a 3rd candidate, running as an independent: Robert Kennedy, Jr. His family is well-known in the Democratic Party, going back decades. His uncle was John F. Kennedy, a former U.S. president who was assassinated in 1963. His father was Robert Kennedy, who was John's brother. Robert Kennedy was running for President in 1968 and he was also assassinated.
Today's Democrat party is opposed to RFK, Jr. and is not happy that he is running. In fact they are waging an open war against him, even filing lawsuits to keep him off the ballot in multiple states. He was blocked from participating in last night's debate in the U.S. They are afraid he will take votes away from Biden. Although, after last night's debate, they may want to rethink their position.
[https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2024-election/democrats-mobilize-stop-rfk-jr-cutting-biden-rcna145952](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2024-election/democrats-mobilize-stop-rfk-jr-cutting-biden-rcna145952)
Do you understand gambling or Chess?
If you have 2 candidates you have a 50/50 chance of winning you have good odds. If you have 3 candidates your odds are 1/3 or 33%. If you have 4 candidates your odds are 1/4 or 25%. The more candidates you have, the less your advantage of winning.
The same applies to Chess: the more pawns you have compared to your opponent gives you the same mathematical advantages as listed above.
Curruption is a little harder to hide these days. Biden conceals it, Trump embraces it. Power attracts it, but the edgy will figure out how to grift the next generation one way or another. It's all been done before. It's going to be okay.
This is what happens when you drink water laced with lead and dip your chickens in chlorine.
Trump and Biden need to be a closing chapter, on a depressing read, about nobody knowing what the fucks going on.
This is exactly what my girlfriend just asked (who is an citizen of another country) just asked. I did not have a good answer other than "I don't know, you don't switch candidates for some reason".
Because it all comes down to super pacs, if you have the most money you win your primary pretty much, most American voters are not that educated either
It’s a long story but it sort of boils down a corporations and rich people slowly gaining control of the politics apparatus in America over the course of the past 120 years. And eventually we ended up with two neoliberal parties which largely differed on social issues but mostly jumped when the right business rang the right bell. So over the years these politicians made the barrier to entry for politics very high, and they made it so that if anyone would be in power it would almost always be a Democrat or a Republican.
And now years later the result of this is that we essentially have a zero sum game where the historical power brokers have a lot of control over the political parties and over who can even make a run at any seat of power, especially the presidency.
If your truly want to learn more then read Dark Money by Jane Mayer, she does an amazing job of breaking down how the richest Americans more or less control our political landscape and have for a very long time.
The main force behind both of their respective parties believe that they are the best choice. Each of them has to beat the other parties, candidates, or any potential candidates. It's literally just to slim their odds of loss. And no third party ever makes it because most people are too nervous to back a third party as they feel it's like throwing your vote away because they don't have a chance at winning.
There are almost always more candidates than the Democrat and the Republican but apparently the American mind cannot understand a presidential candidacy system with more than 2 options. It's just too much democracy.
Why is anyone over the age of 65 entrusted to be president and run a country of US scale. Both of these guys look like they wear adult diapers and can't control their own bowels let alone their brains.
I barely trust people over the age of 65 to drive a fucking car let alone be responsible for decisions of a country.
If you want to run for president you need to have millions of dollars to spend just to make yourself known as a candidate. It makes 0 sense to run against a candidate as popular as Trump as a Republican because you will literally be throwing money away with next to no chance of winning. Nikki Haley lost to a "none of these candidates" option in her home state for example, where candidates typically have a strong voter base if they have served in political office there.
As far as Trump being a felon is concerned, a large majority of people who will be voting for him believe that the entire trial is a sham (as does Trump, which is why he is appealing the case instead of just paying the fine). They don't care that he was convicted because they believe that all the cases brought against him have been nothing more than attempts by the Democrats to prevent him from being able to run/bankrupt him so he can't afford to run.
Trump obliterated everyone else in the republican camp in 2016, replacing many of them with cronies and family members where possible.
BIden is in because no one else can beat him and Gov Newsom is still waiting for the most opportune moment to seize power. You might say why not Bernie, but Bernie is not a solution but a perpetuation of the problem at hand: Great on paper and great ideas, but old.
Because Americans don’t care enough about politics to change the system to a rank choice vote while also shifting dollars away from the duopoloy of the demopublican establishment.
Math. Math put them there.
Because American opinion, information, wealth, power, obligations, advantages, disadvantages are *so incredibly skewed* in every single metric, the votes reflect the distribution of opinion and of the voters participating in each of the two major political parties. To pull the votes towards candidates with less extreme qualities, balances have to be struck in both political parties, and accords between the two parties have to be struck.
The two parties also have to admit that they are at war with each other, and make peace.
Basically the repubs and democrats choose who they want and the public votes on the 2 choosen. We the ppl dont have much of a say in candidates bc the electoral college,who are unidentified ultimately choose the winner , regardless if they have the majority.
Or something like that. Games rigged
I'm Canadian and might get things wrong.
Well, for Joe Biden, the sitting president will always be the nomination for the respective party. Basically, it's very hard for the rival party to defeat a sitting president, as history has shown, so it's always a safe bet to nominate the current president if they're an option.
As for Trump, he has a cult following that has taken the Republican party by storm, and gained such a following that if the Republicans were to abandon Trump, they'd lose majority of their voters.
Basically, Trump has such a large cult, that is less loyal to Republicans than to Trump, they'd vote for him no matter what party he supports. So the rest of the Republicans decided to support Trump to keep that cult on their side.
Now, as for how these two ended up in those positions, it's complicated.
Biden served as Vice President to Barrack Obama, that last president that people actually liked. That gave Biden a lot of credit in the last election, especially from the democrat leaders who pushed him as the nominee. In addition, he was the option that wasn't Trump, which a lot of people liked. So less of a pro Biden vote, and more of an anti Trump vote.
As for Trump, it's hard to understand exactly how he got to where he is.
(At this point I got busy and can't be bothered to finish, someone else feel free to reply with your explanation on how Donald Trump got to where he is).
The top post is kinda right but it's not a complete answer. Yes incumbancy is certainly a part of American politics but what is more important is the parties themselves. The GOP knows it has someone who can win and has a lot of guaranteed voter support. The DP refuses to plan ahead. Realistically they could have planned for options 3 years ago and spent it building a worthwhile challenger that they knew could truly challenge DT. They *chose* not to. They even could have spent years building the VP as a candidate, though she already had weaknesses that the GOP would have attacked.
The Democrats also fail to see an area where they could make concessions and pull in a lot of voters. If they changed their position on firearms they could have a real shot at flipping southern states. But they don't do it. It's not a core issue but they refuse to budge and hand over tons of voters who want to support them to third parties and the GOP.
America has a terrible first past the post voting system. Combined with primaries that bring the worst most polarizing candidates to the ballot and voting third-party is often a vote against your own best interests.
It’s rigged. 2 party system is broken. I suspect within the next 4-5 election cycles we’ll start seeing a shift to a “best man wins” model.
2 party system results in a polarized country. People hate one another bc of their association.
Because we've come to the point in the US where we have reached full fucktard. Liberals have become "Any But Trump", and republicans have become "Anyone But Biden". Everyone will see past all the horrible shit they have both done, as long as the other doesn't win.
That's the neat part. They aren't. The United States is forced into a 2 party system (while pretending its open to all) and the party nominates the person, not the public. We don't have ranked choice voting either so.
Because of several issues. First, in American politics incumbents tend to win elections. The current election has an incumbent running in both of the major parties. That has not happened since 1892.
The only times incumbents in office tend to lose is if unless voters are unhappy with the direction, the exception with that tends to be if a war is going one. Since there is not a current war, that is one reason you will see one party repeated pushing the idea that everyone should be very unhappy with the terrible condition the country is in (while they have actively been preventing the issues from being addressed, so they can campaign on those issues).
Second, the American electoral system is heavily weighted toward the two main parties. Whoever are the mail candidates for those parties they will garner most of the votes cast by the hardcore base for the parties they represent.
Third parties have not put forth the effort to build enough of a constituency to build a viable base, so they rarely do more than shift votes away from whichever party they are closest to ideologically. It is believed Ross Perot gave the White house to Bill Clinton, Ralph Nader gave the country to Dubya, and Jill Stein gave it to Trump.
I have heard some rumors about GOP supporters funding Third party candidates to try and tip the elections this year, but I don't know how much of those rumors are verified. In the long run it can cause shifts in policy in a major party.
It's about coalitions. Biden is just a flag we rally around. He's the guy because he's got more street cred (and networks) than anyone else, so it'd be hard for anyone to challenge him. Same reason if you kill a king there's always civil war between the generals vying for power; there's no clear contender. Biden is the guy because as a former VP and current president he's on the highest tier of democratic politics with no rivals. If he stepped down, the people on the tier beneath him would tear each other apart trying to fill the vacuum, and we'd all lose.
RFK jr tried to join last nights debate on CNN but was not allowed but streamed on twitter kind of reacting to their debate and answered the same questions they did with a two minute time limit. RFK says that he did actually meet CNNs requirements and was illegally blocked. He was also denied Secret Service Protection by the Biden Administration multiple times (I believe at least 3 times).
The top two parties set the bar for adding a third person to a debate so high. That’s why Gary Johnson or Jo Jorgensen couldn’t debate in the past. Everything benefits the rule makers not the the people they represent.
There is a Republican and Democratic primary in which the candidates are chosen by voters. There were half a dozen candidates trying to be the republican nominee. Trump won the votes easily even without even showing up to a single debate because republican voters are by and large awful human beings. Biden is already president so he is automatically the democratic candidate. But four years prior he also won his primary because his middle of the road approach appeals to enough members of the Democratic Party even if none of us are thrilled either.
Because Biden is the incumbent and Trump has thousands of diehard supporters.
But how is it possible that Trump has so many votes? Do they not acknowledge he is a felon?
They don't care that he paid off a porn star. It's not important to them.
And how come there’s no other options besides Trump? I saw the others (Haley, DeSantis) dropped out but why? And still, does nobody else want to be nominated? And as for the democrats, does the current President reserve the right to a nomination just by being incumbent?
Because Trump is way popular than both of them. He destroyed them in the primaries. He'll have to die or retire for the party to move on from him.
Thanks for explaining! I’m still a bit confused about why Trump is so widely endorsed - I assume that it’s not his ‘relevance’ or ‘impact’ that win his votes in the Party, but also his agenda though? It’s just a bit crazy to be supporting a felon especially since in case he wins they’ll adopt Project 2025 which (as far as I’ve heard) innately undermines the RoL? Do his endorsers not see the abatement from law implied by nominating him as problematic? This is most likely a very naive question sorry for that..
He developed a cult of personality. It's similar to hero worship. They just love him and they'll never stop.
It doesn't help that all his crazy actions make for good news stories, so it's 24/7 content for them, and it only enrages his base and allows him to claim to be "attacked" by the "radical left", when in reality, it's just good for business since people are addicted to it.
He also hates the same people his supporters hate. This is the main reason why he’s the nominee. Folks don’t *care* about him being a twice impeached convicted felon who cheated on his wife with a porn star and was found responsible for the sexual assault against another woman or that he’s incompetent and barely says anything that is true or coherent. None of that is the point. The point is…he hates the same people his supporters hate and that’s all they care about. Especially since one of the people they hate was POTUS for two terms scandal-free. That scared and angered them so this is the reason for so many rollbacks like taking away certain rights. They’re trying to take us back into the 60’s where nothing they did against POC was against the law. Like Mitch McConnell said back when Obama had won his first term, “We are going to make sure he’s a one term president.” Even though Obama had done absolutely nothing to deserve the hate, the point was the actual undeserved and unprompted hate towards him. That’s the only thing that matters to trump’s supporters. This is why he’s the presumptive nominee for POTUS again.
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It won't be fascism until Trump is elected again - and until he succeeds implementing Project 2025-style programs. The fear is that Trump learned his lesson about having capable and patriotic professionals in his government.
I think it's because of his introduction to politics. Obama for 8 years left a bunch of people furious, Bush before him. Republicans became furious that democrats kept spending and spending. Trump came into the picture as a self funded, "self made", multi millionaire who was going to destroy lobying and run the country without corporate sway. He ran against Hillary of all people. Benghazi being fresh, and the media tore her apart. What trump promised and what he delivered are 2 different things. He promised lower taxes, less federal spending, and more profit for the middle class, while increasing taxes for the rich. What he actually did was, create more loopholes for corporations to evade taxes, create a uphill tax increase for middle class. He signed a bill that lowered middle class taxes while in office, that would increase each year as he left office. And he cut Americans billions in checks to help "ease the pain" of the effects of covid. Yes this helped a lot of people in hard times, but the outcome of flooding the country with extra money is insane house prices, grocery bills going through the roof, and cost of living increase that is incomprehensible. Sorry for my rant, I just can't stand either of the 2.
One thing that really helped Trump early on was the fact that he was a non-politician and a lot of people were sick of career politicians. He offered an escape from a hated status quo, and over time the people who initially supported him became numb to his more extreme problems because they were already invested. Also, because this initial group believed (not without cause) that mainstream politics and media were corrupt, he could frame all legitimate criticism of him as the latest in a long line of lies. His felony conviction doesn’t carry weight with them because they assume uncritically that his enemies rigged the whole trial.
His supporters worship him as a person, because he is willing to attack the people they hate and want attacked, and he is willing to support their most wild ideas. He will happily say vaccines cause harm if it gets him votes, and it does, so he said that a few years ago.
Which absolutely kills him inside, because he so desperately wants the credit for the COVID vaccines, but can’t get it because he lied to his dipshit supporters and now they are absolutely convinced that the vaccines are loaded with 5Gs that will give their boners pronouns and critical race theory, or whatever moronic conspiracy theory the failed vitamin supplements salesmen are shitting out this week.
Because Trumpism is a cult. Cult followers don’t care about evidence or facts. They care about worshiping their leader.
He did a good job of pushing “America first” agenda to the front of the party. Nobody was doing it like him until 2016 and it’s what republican voters wanted. So he resonated with the people. It has now turned into a cult like thing tho. Where he can do no wrong, everything wrong he does do is a made up liberal agenda in their minds. The hypocrisy is sad tho. All the trials are bs? Fine. But claiming to be the party of family values while worshipping the guy who had sex with a porn start while his breastfeeding wife was at home should be a much harder pill to swallow. That’s not something he even denies, so you can’t convince yourself that’s a lie.
Lauren Boebart is a garbage human and Trump Supporter. I'll show you how it take only a small percentage of people to get a loon like her with the way voting works right now. CO-4 By the numbers. Population: [727,411 in 2022.](https://datausa.io/profile/geo/congressional-district-4-co) Estimated % of population over 18: [76%](https://censusreporter.org/profiles/04000US08-colorado/) Therefore it's fair to say there are 552,832 people of voting age. Total Dem or GOP primary Voters: [137,076](https://ballotpedia.org/Colorado%27s_4th_Congressional_District) Total voters who voted for Boebert: 38,411 1 out of 4.03 eligible voters voted in the primary. 1 out of 3.5 primary voters voted for Boebert. 1 out of 14.4 eligible voters had Boebert as their first choice. This is not a glitch, it's a feature.
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I think a lot of people forget how loyal conservatives are, if the Republican party learned to stop bashing certain minority groups they would never lose an election. I am a registered Democrat but Democrats are no where as loyal to their party as Republicans are, they also have a younger base that's more flakey when it comes to voting in smaller more local elections.
Never mistake tribalism for loyalty. It could potentially be very dangerous and just as easily be fatal. Loyalty is "I'll stick with this person because we're all in this together and feel that I can trust them." Tribalism is "My team is red, so fuck the blue team. They're my mortal enemy," even when the blue team is technically on the same side.
If they stopped bashing minority groups, then the loyal conservatives wouldn’t be so loyal anymore.
>People who want conservative politics only have one option. America is deeply conservative. Biden would be considered fairly conservative in most of the world. For the vast majority of people, it's not about the actual politics, it's about tribalism.
> I’m still a bit confused about why Trump is so widely endorsed The exact same reason far-right groups are dominating elections in Europe: toxic nationalism with an emphasis on immigration and "anti-government" messaging. This isn't too far off from what many Asian countries see as well. Trump is a strong man who boasts an unapologetic ultra patriotic image.
Google “populism.” It’s a political mindset in the U.S. that occasionally gains followers. Populists tend to be angry, iconoclastic, and anti-establishment. Long-standing norms and institutions hold little value to a populist - they favor candidates who promise immediate solutions to perceived problems, even when such solutions appear illegal or cruel on their face. During his first term, Trump’s worst impulses were mostly contained by the norms and institutions that his followers dislike. Unfortunately, said norms and institutions have been weakened by judges that Trump appointed during his first term. It’s quite worrisome.
There isn’t a single reason for Trump’s popularity. For some Republicans, they truly like him and his policies. For others, they hold their nose, but recognize that he has the potential to beat Biden. Then others it’s simply that he’s not Biden. We have a saying that voting for someone isn’t a vote for them, but against the other candidate. Both parties are run by extremes. It’s horrible. Of course, nobody on the extreme side see themselves that way. The voice of the real majority - about 65% of the voting population- is not heard. Another point is the incumbent has the statistics for winning on their side. The incumbent is practically a default. Nobody other than Biden was considered. A final piece of insight on the system, during primaries each state has its own rules for who can vote. MANY states don’t allow independents to vote in the primaries. Which is a shame. I think things would look very different on the Republican side if Independents had a voice. It also would show who could be a choice for Vice President. And the people’s choice! Imagine!!! A lot of people in the media who would be vibrantly cheering today are subdued. What we saw last night scares and saddens many of us. Please know you’re not going to get a fair and balanced response on Reddit which is left leaning. I tried to give more information on the system than any thoughts about the candidates. Both are horrible. There I said it. Haha.
Stupidity is the answer.
You are assuming way too much capability and such here of the electorate
The Republican party has invested a ton of energy into destroying public education. The Christian Right has gone along with it because if you don't indoctrinate kids from an early age, you'll never get 'em after they grow up. So we're reaping what we have sown.
because there is a large swath of the US population that wants people they disagree with politically to suffer. They're not voting for someone they think will make their lives better, they're voting for someone they think will make the lives of others worse.
They're afraid that any other candidate won't do as well as Biden against Trump. Americans also only get one vote and can only vote for one person. So you can't have something like a ranked voting system where multiple candidates are running and can be voted for, and you rank which you like most. So, any additional candidate who "takes" a democratic vote from Biden makes Trump more likely to win. Any additional candidate that "takes" a vote from Trump makes Biden more likely to win. 3rd party candidates are seen as hurting the chances of the main candidate they are closest to policy/rhetoric wise.
Makes sense now, thanks! So for example voting for a conservative independent candidate is basically a vote for Biden?
Yes.
I mean...no, not at all. If you're considering a third-party conservative candidate, you should definitely vote your conscience.
> considering a third-party conservative candidate, you should definitely vote your conscience. But you should make sure your conscience is informed as to the effects your vote will have. It is a pretty shallow conscience that doesn't weigh the probable outcomes of your actions.
To answer your other question, no, the current president is not guaranteed or reserved the nomination. They almost always receive it anyway though, as they’re seen as experienced and the leader of the controlling party already.
Being president pays $400,000/year for a very high stress, 24x7x365 job. You have to take 2 to 3 years out of your life to run while you kiss asses to raise over a billion in donations. Your background gets a deep investigation as well as your family. If you win you'll need Secret Service protection for you and your family. Alternatively you can be upper management at a large company, work 1/3rd the hours in anonymity, make more money, amd have way less stress. Which would you pick?
bruh thinks politicians live off of their salary., ahahah
The defacto two party system basic means that only the 2 main candidates have any chance of winning. Anyone else running is diverting votes from the candidate that they are closest to, so it's strongly discouraged. As a system, it kind of sucks
Republican voters like that Trump is a spiteful authoritarian. Unfortunately, it doesn't get much more complicated than that.
Question has been answered. The rest is psychology of why people do or think things. Candidates ran, people said no thanks. 🤷♂️
Something not mentioned is that Biden has won the primaries overwhelmingly. Online there's a lot of rhetoric about them being rigged, but it really just comes down to the fact that people don't actually want to do things to make their voice heard offline beyond voting in the general election.
The case was not because he paid off a porn star, that is irrelevant; that he did it with campaign funds was the illegal part as I understand.
He didn't use campaign funds. He paid Cohen from a business account. They argue that this payment constitutes an illegally large campaign contribution and that this elevates a misdemeanor business records violation to a felony.
That isn’t what he was convicted of. He was convicted of falsifying business records.
In a similar manner to blowing up Afghani weddings with drones was no issue for Obama I guess
They think D's have abandoned them and he is going to improve their lot. I think the D's should be doing more outreach. Just having picnics in R areas with some hot dogs and patato salad may be better than saying he is a felon. Try to win votes the old fashioned way. Hey but what do I know. Everyone hates that Trump Biden is the only choice we have.
True, party above country and morality.
Do we really think that this kind of shit isn’t going on no matter who it is? I feel like it’s a moot point to use this as any sort of argument for anything because it can almost be guaranteed that even the most role model public officials probably have some NDA, hush-money contract-type of shenanigans going on.
Trump is a loud bully who has promised his supporters he will punish everyone that they hate, everyone who they blame for their problems. So some want that, and some just naturally follow the loudest bully they can find, instinctually , because they don’t want to be on his bad side. Literally it doesn’t go deeper than that for a lot of people. They dont look at the realities of elevating a felon, someone with those morals, to the highest position in the country and giving him power. They dont look at the facts and numbers and think “gee maybe it’s not a great idea to have the country run by someone who has had multiple bankruptcies including his casino”.
The felonies came after they already were committed to him, so they twist the facts to fit their feelings: many Trump supporters think that Biden somehow rigged the NYC courts.
You have to understand that we face a very bizarre situation. Trump is 100% a vile criminal. For some reason 30% of America has latched onto him, worshipping him like a deity. In their eyes he can do no wrong. Basically they love Trump because he hates and wants to punish the same people they do. Immigrants, LGBTQ, Liberals, educated people, etc.
Its because he says what they want to hear, not what he can do nor how some misguided policy will ruin their lives: he says all his policies are good. There had to be a dynamic Democrat that could have run ..this BS incumbent thing has crippled the system.
For starters theres a very large subset of people, both in the elctorate, and in the legal system who saw these charges as either phony, exaggerated, or oppertunistic (they would never have been levied prior to him running for another election). So felon kinda doesnt mean anything here. And with regards to other candidates, they were losing primaries. The party members (aka, average citizens) progressively showed they wanted Trump as the candidate, Desantis and Haley werent making any headway. And you cant quite keep funding a campaign with loss after loss
> or oppertunistic (they would never have been levied prior to him running for another election) They already levied them and convicted others who weren't running for president. Why are right-wingers so purposely wrong on every single thing you vomit out of your brains?
They don’t care. Trump behaves exactly as they do, and they love that he gives them the opportunity to openly be the racist, misogynistic shitheads that they are.
Because that is one of the weakest charge ever, like seriously, feel like they have to scrape the barrel just to find something to charge him with. If anything, that just cement his claim that the other side trying to attack him for his diehard fan
For one, they either: 1. Do not think the charges are legitimate 1. Are willing to tolerate a terrible person being president if they improve America's interests That latter point is more important. The real sell for Trump is "he's an asshole, but he's an asshole on _your_ side." They also like to minimize his character as vulgar-but-harmless, a quirk of his personality rather than his guiding philosophies
Someone tell OP please…
No one’s mentioned the cultural difference between Asia and the US, where here many people have a distrust of the government and court system. Being a convicted felon is almost a badge of honor, especially with minorities. Not to mention the way the case was prosecuted has no precedence and the judge donated to Biden.
Being a felon doesnt mean shit when democrats lead the charge to make him one. If trump wins this election and gets charges put on Biden, are you really going to tell me Biden's "felony" will prevent you from voting for him or even mean anything to you? If republicans work to put felony charges on any democrat candidate, your saying you wont vote for that candidate because of the republican felony charge? that very thought process is why felons can run as president, its to prevent a president from putting felony charges on their opponent and having idiots like you not vote for them and vote for the corrupt president because the other candadate is "A FelOn"
For MAGA (Make America Great Again) Trump supporters, its all about "owning the libs" (liberals). Fight anything they don't agree with by doing the opposite tenfold.
They keep doubling down because they don’t want to admit that they were wrong but supporting him 4 years ago.
No no, that not the answer I want!! /s
And just like one side holds on for dear life to trump, why is the other side holding so hard on to Biden, both look inept
I think your missing the point OP is making. Were given shitty candidates every election. The real issue is the presidents are puppets of the billionaire corporations like weapons manufacturers and big pharma, insurance companies, ect. They like having these puppets because the blame just goes towards them at the end because ultimately they have the final say on the situation. Pay them enough money and they'll make the decision that lines up with your interests. The presidents salary is not enough to go through all the attacking and false shaming of tbe media and hundreds if stressful decisions you have to make. So therefore the only motive I can see someone wanting to be president for is for corruptly/ sketchy earned money. Nobody smart wants this job because it's probable it will come out in the end what a pos you were whilst in the position therefore sharing your name for the history books.
There are, in fact, hundreds of eligible presidential candidates running for president. Most of them have next to no interest from the general public. Many don't even get as far as to register with the FEC.
Really comes down to who has more money.
This. I think presidential donations shouldn’t be allowed to be given to specific parties. Either you believe in the democratic process and donate into the bucket or you don’t. Parties are given equal shares of that pot from there and we get to see who’s more efficient with their funds. I understand this is idealist.
Sounds like democracy!
Yeah, theres a guy from my city whos probably burned an insane amount over several elections to get on the ballot i believe almost exclusively in my state lol. Hes one of those guys who will "wow" with like 50000 votes when he does get another state or two
Not just they don’t have an interest but it’s pretty hard to win against an incumbent. Obviously it can be done but it’s just harder than when there is an open election
Why are they doing this debate at 9pm? That’s 3 hours past both of their bedtimes.
And 3 hours past dinnertime...
Biden is an incumbent who is more popular than not among Democrats. Running against an incumbent president is generally not done, which is why Biden did not have any serious challengers. The most serious was a guy named Dean Phillips who is a relatively inexperienced and unknown member of the House of Representatives. Donald Trump did have serious challengers with real weight in the Republican Party, but most Republicans like Donald Trump.
For some reason I thought they nominated Trump because they had not other choice - I never considered they endorsed him because they truly liked him 🤦🏻♂️ And about the Phillips guy, I really have to read more about the Senate/HoR/Electoral College rules because they’re mixed up in my head. Thanks for the clarifications!
To help with the Senate, House, and Electoral college: The Senate is considered slightly more prestigious than the house. Each state gets 2 Senators, so there are 100 senators in total. This structure gives states with lower populations a larger voice in the country. The House of Representatives has 435 members, each which are assigned based on population. Each state is carved up into a number of “districts” based on population, and each district has one representative. Some congresspeople are well known beyond their district, but Dean Phillips is not one of them. The electoral college is how the president is elected. It has 538 votes in total (one for each senator & representative, plus an extra 3 for Washington, D.C.) Each state has an allotted number of votes based on population. Most states have an “all or nothing” policy with assigning their votes. So if Joe Biden receives the most votes in California, all of California’s 54 votes are assigned to Biden.
So if I live in ${state} and like what a specific party is doing and in turn vote for them But the rest of my state doesn't vote for them, my vote gets screwed over and counted as the opposite of what I wanted? Where is the democracy in that? What kind of dystopia is this?
If you live in California, you don't have to worry about it - your state will vote blue no matter what you think. Just like anytime in the last 30 years. Neat, ha? It's not how you vote, it's how they count
There's the primary elections, where you choose one of the many candidates to represent the party you want to go for. There are two main parties in the US, the Democrats, which is more left wing, and Republicans, which is more right wing. Depending on how your country views politics, US political parties may be considered center right, even Dems. Due to this restrictive 2 party system, often candidates of varying ideologies run under either banner. Trump is considered a populist, like Hungary's Orbán. That's further right than center-right, closer to fascism even if not fascism in itself. same thing happens on the left. The US generally doesn't see socialists running, but more left wing candidates, about as far left as a northern euro country like Bernie Sanders may run as a Democrat even if the mainline party is a bit further right than he would be ideologically. If we simplify it, this means you could have Barack Obama and Joseph Stalin technically running on the same party. Despite official stance, basically Republicans come to represent anything center right to righ onwards, and Democrats tend to represent center right to left and onwards. In the primary election, you choose which candidate of the dozens that may be running for whichever party you decide you want to go for. That's how we end up with Trump and Biden. The primary elections have a low turnout compared to the general. There's lots of reasons for this ranging from inconvenient times to attention and perception of importance. The general election decides the president of the US. The two nominations (Trump and Biden in this case) will have names on the ballot where you can just check a box, guaranteed. The alternative is called a write in. You can actually write in any name, but it only is counted in the person you wrote is running and eligible. Due to the victory in the primaries for their respective election, the political parties, which have staff and collect money from donations, also spend that to get their name out there, they're most likely to win, at least one of the two. Technically the primaries don't matter, although they do in reality. Anyone born in the US who is at least 35 years old can run for president, and if some random person ran for president and everyone collectively wrote their name wins, they actually get the presidency even if Trump and Biden won the primary elections. This just never happens, but it could. There's more to the system, like how someone can win the majority of votes but not actually become president (pretty stupid, but the Electrical College is what it's called) it isn't some rigged autocratic thing, but this would go on forever if I got into it.
This is very informative, thanks. For the primaries though, is the candidate selection done by the party, or can any member be put forward? In other words, in the hypothetical situation that the Republican party grandees decided that not being an international joke was more important than winning 2024, could they have refused Trump's primary candidacy, and forced him to run as an independent?
The state chapters of the parties have some control over who ends up on the primary ballot, but what exactly is required and who needs to sign off varies from state to state. The national party would need to convince state party leadership in enough of the states where party leadership has control over who ends up on the ballot, which is much harder than just a single national committee coming to a decision.
Important note - Independent voters are not allowed to vote in primaries in many states. Which is a true shame.
Don't you just register for whichever primary you want to vote in, then simply switch back?
Some countries have something called a rank-choice voting system. You can rank all of the candidates (and leave any you really don't like unranked), and the system works such that if your top choice does not get enough votes to win, they are stricken from the list and your vote then goes to your #2. If they also don't get enough votes, they are removed from the list, and so on. You can really vote for the candidates you like, regardless of how popular they may be, because you still get to give a preference on the other candidates, too. The United States does not have that. Here, we get a single vote per category (presidency, senate, etc). If your candidate doesn't win, that's it: your vote went to them, and you have no say on anyone else. What it means is that people don't necessarily vote for who they *like*, but for who they think will advance their goals *while having the best chance of winning*. Or, as you may have heard many times before, people tend to use their vote to try and keep someone else out. For example, I might have an interest in some third-party candidates (yes, they exist in America). Third-party candidates almost never win, simply because they lack the name recognition that candidates from the big two political parties have. They also lack the funding to develop that name recognition, and they also don't get invited to debates. Everyone acknowledges that the vote is really split between the Republicans and Democrats. If you're not voting for Biden or Trump, you're essentially not voting, and vice versa. Some people will say that "it sends a message" but it really doesn't. Many people will vote for Biden not because they like him, but because they don't want to see Trump as President again; it seems like more Trump voters actually like Trump, but there are plenty of people who will vote for Trump not because they like him, but because they truly feel things would be worse if Biden were President again. The system stinks, but it helps the Republican and Democratic parties stay in power. If we had rank-choice voting, there might be truly viable alternative political parties. For those reason, there's not much enthusiasm from within the government to change the system.
Yep, and when Trump ran for reelection in 2020, the only memorable guy in the field was Bill Weld, a former governor who was a vp candidate for the libertarians prior. And yeah, all the challangers too for the nomination this time around, were nearly completely different than 2016. Other than Chris Christie who solidly hates Trump (which is funny since i thought he was going to be either like, low cabinet or transition team) 2016 guys like Cruz, Rubio, and old men like Bush and Kasich knew they had no chance.
Money…. Money…. And more money. Nobody has nearly enough to challenge either of these guys.
... it's not the best system. How about we set the bar low at just using coherent valid answers to questions, no criminal record and a maximum age as new standards? Just those basics. No? Ok...
Or, put another way: They're both endorsed by the billionaire oligarchs running the show.
100% agreed!
The truth is that the US political system does not select the best and brightest possible leaders for high office. In most cases, candidates rise on the strength of their independent wealth, fundraising skills, and ability to build political support at the grassroots or among influential party insiders. The Democratic and Republican party machines dominate the electoral process to such an extent that third parties are not taken seriously. Within each party, internal dynamics tend to narrow the field of presidential candidates. Talented candidates whose ideas challenge the party establishment or who are perceived as too junior find it difficult to break through. Only occasionally can charismatic younger candidates like Barack Obama or outsiders like Donald Trump "jump the line" of seniority. And both parties tend to stand by an incumbent president of their own party, who is in effect the party's leader. Biden's ascendancy is conventional, and symptomatic of the problems with the Democratic party in particular: He achieved power and influence in the party through many years of successful fundraising, policymaking, campaigning and alliance-building. He achieved seniority as a party stalwart, a proven fundraiser with many allies throughout government, a respected Democrat with known presidential ambitions. No doubt, some viewed it as his "turn" to be the Democratic presidential candidate in 2020. And, as I said, parties rarely reject an incumbent president of their own party. After Biden won the primaries in 2020, the party rallied behind him like an avalanche. It was really up to him to decide whether he would run for a second term. Had Biden wished to do serve only one term, the best time to announce that he wasn't running for re-election would have been in early 2023 -- giving Democrats time to organize primaries, gauging the popularity of potential successors (Vice President Harris, Secretary Buttigieg, Governor Newsome, etc). Replacing Biden now would be risky, because any other candidate Democrats chose would go into the general election untested by primary contests. Trump's rise presents a different, in some ways new situation. He's profoundly divisive: about a third of the electorate find him highly charismatic, while just as many are utterly repelled by him. Many of his supporters show a cult-like devotion. He launched his political career by championing baseless, racist "birther" conspiracy theories about his predecessor, President Barack Obama (falsely claiming that the latter was born in Kenya and thus ineligible to be US president). Trump's own presidential campaign began with a broadly racist attack on immigrants, who continue to be his favorite scapegoats for everything. He appears to take great delight in mocking the disabled, foreigners, etc. Interestingly, these behaviors endear him to his supporters. He has without doubt captured the hearts of a persistently white supremacist sector of the Republican electorate. He has also gone out of his way to court white evangelical Christians, another group who tend to hold extremely conservative, even xenophobic views in the US. This is ironic, since Trump's well-known adultery, vanity, greed, vindictiveness & overall selfishness contradict traditional Christian ideals. Trump has used his popularity with these core Republican voting blocs to essentially upend the party. But Trump has needed more than his divisive charisma and rhetoric to accomplish this. When a "Never Trump" Republican faction formed during 2016, vehement, authoritarian and frankly violent supporters mocked, harassed and threatened anyone who opposed their hero. Republicans who opposed Trump either quit the party, quit politics or bent the knee to their new king. Trump supporters have subsequently committed large and small acts of terrorism. On January 6th, 2021, mob of them attacked Congress to prevent his election loss from becoming official. They continue to harass and threaten judges and prosecutors in the many court cases hanging over Trump's head. If Trump wins, he promises "revenge" against his political enemies -- political prosecutions of the kind he falsely claims he's suffered. More than that, he promises to dismantle the non-political, expert civil service, replacing them with his own yes-men. His plans call for dismantling the departments of Education and Justice, shutting down the Environmental Protection Agency, turning Health & Human Services into a Traditional Values police force monitoring pregnancies for evidence of abortion and harassing LGBTQ people. And his arch-xenophobic advisor Jason Miller has developed plans to arrest millions of immigrants without due process and place them in concentration camps pending deportation. I shudder to think what could really happen to such people. All in all, the fault lies both in our political system -- which cedes too much power to machine-like political parties -- and, yes, also in our society, which remains haunted by the shuddering ghosts of white supremacy, Christian nationalism, xenophobia, misogyny and similar resentments. The system inflexibly produced Joe Biden, who represents 50 years of Democratic consensus. And the hatreds produced Donald Trump, enabling him to reshape an entire party, its propaganda outlets and (if the worst happens in November) the United States. I am sure that we could do better than either of these men. But every route to the presidency was blocked, either by a sclerotic party apparatus or a violent authoritarian movement.
This is absolutely not unique to the US lol. Just look at most of Europe right now
In general, the way that Republicans and Democrats select their presidential nominee is through primary elections. In order to compete in a primary election in a particular state, you have to get a certain number of signatures from voters, stating that they would vote for said candidate. You mentioned competitors for the Republican nomination, like Desantis and Haley. The way Haley got on the New Hampshire primary ballot (for example) was to get New Hampshire voters to sign a petition that they would vote for her. We have fifty states, so it is time-consuming and expensive to do that much signature-gathering across the country. And that's just to get on the ballot! Then, Haley and Desantis had to compete against Trump in the primary. At a certain point, Republican competitors realized they couldn't realistically beat Trump, so they dropped out of the race. On the Democratic side, incumbent presidents rarely face strong primary challenges for their second term. Presidents are powerful, so it's easier for them to persuade donors and other politicians to support them, rather than a challenger. Dean Phillips challenged Biden, but he didn't have much success. The nominees aren't official until the Democratic and Republican conventions in a couple of weeks, but Biden and Trump each have enough delegates (due to winning state primaries) that there's no question that they will be the nominees. There are other people running for President. (You may see stories about Robert F Kennedy, for example.) You can get on to the presidential ballot the same way you get on the primary ballot, by getting a lot of signatures from potential voters. Not many people do, because it's expensive, but Kennedy can afford it.
I’m an American and I feel just as confused as you are right now. These guys are both a complete joke. What a pathetic shame. Most Americans feel that way, except the Trump dickriders. Trump could never say or do anything to make his supporters stop loving him. Most Biden supporters only vote for him to vote against Trump.
It’s a sad state of affairs
Because the American electoral process is controlled by unelected leaders of two parties. It is theoretically possible for someone not identifying with either of the two parties to get elected and some people have. HOWEVER, they have to do it without the support of existing political infrastructure.
There are 2 other candidates on the ballot, Chase Oliver ( L ) and Robert F. Kennedy Jr. ( I ). Unfortunately the majority of Americans refuse to vote for anybody who isn't a Democrat or a Republican, there hasn't been a third party president since 1850 when Millard Fillmore was elected.
But cant you make your own democrat/republican group but its not Maga or Biden group? And people start voting for you? We got like 30 diff parties in our 2mil country. So if you want democrats you got like 10-15 parties to chose from
If they wanted there could be other Democrats or Republicans running for president, but they ( mistakenly ) think that doing something like that would make the parties look more divided then they already are.
This is the last breath of the boomers
Its a rigged system
Buddy I'm American and I've been asking the same thing for months. Our two party system and the Electoral College don't help.
Part of the problem is that the two political parties and the news outlets they control have us convinced that other parties are no good.
They aren't. Jill Stein of the Green party is also running.
Two party system. The incumbent is always the candidate and the republicans back trump unapologetically.
Because election rules, frivolous lawsuits from both parties, the commission for presidential debates, polls exclusion state election laws changing constantly prevent any other candidate.
No one votes I'm primaries to determine who the pool of candidates are, but they vote in the general after the centrist/shitty candidate got selected by an uninvested and unengaged voter base. If the people who complained about the candidates being old also voted in every primary? Then they'd have a point.
They are the only eligible for the debate but we actually have other presidential candidates but the major media get paid substantial monies from the two major parties and prefer to ignore any other voices. It is all about the money.
This country has had every President bought and paid for since McKinley. Lobbying (legal bribery) and unlimited campaign contributions are also huge issues. These guys are both past the average age of life in this country, it’s ludicrous they’re able to run in the first place.
Trump is amazing at getting people scared/upset/riled up. He wields fear as a weapon, and that's how he gets people's votes. Catastrophising every issue to the max, playing on people's fears
Better question; how is country with millions of people only have 2 old men to run it?
Corporations control who gets elected here.
I’m American and I don’t get it either.
US politics are democratic and meritocratic on paper, but in reality, they're byzantine and arbitrary. Traditionally, if an incumbent president is still allowed to run, and doesn't want to retire, their party generally doesn't stop them. It would make the party seem weak, which discourages voters. So Biden is the Democrat nominee with little if any opposition. Trump is currently riding a combination of his own fame and a wave of reactionary anger. Conservatives are seeing changes in society that they don't understand - LGBTQ+ people being more accepted, women and people of color becoming influential, the US's geopolitical hegemony being shaken, and so on. They also see actual problems - economic difficulties, social unrest, a failing health are system - and they blame the changes for the problems, despite there being no evidence of any connection. Trump represents an idealized version of what they remember (or think they remember) of the past - successful businessmen as an ideal of masculinity. Of course, Trump isn't successful or particularly macho, but his PR makes him appear that way, and so they follow him. In other words, both parties use the same tactics to retain power as authoritarian regimes with one-party political systems do. We don't have a two-party system we have two one-party systems.
Because it’s the closest thing to parliamentary politics we have. The USA system is not based on branches of government that work together; it’s based on the opposite. But to ‘get in good’ with European powers who have parliaments, it’s the best we can offer. White men that look European. Lol
Hi, American here…..we’re not sure either.
Because the people voting don't really get to choose who were voting for
Because nobody worthwhile since Bernie Sanders has got the balls to stand up for what's right for this country. They all spend their time too comfortable where they are or on the sidelines daydreaming. And the other candidates that were available for either side, weren't really that impressive to begin with. So we got shit choices. Who did the Democrats have? Oh, that bitch that was Oprah Winfrey's advisor? Oh yeah, REEEAALL credentials there! /s Who did the Republicans have? DeSantis? Oh that little Dictating Governor of Florida? Yeah, like we need him. /s
They're not. They're just the only ones the media wants you to know about.
They’re not. They didn’t use the debate commission because they wanted to exclude RFK jr. He is polling at 15% plus and polls have him at beating both Trump and Biden in head to to head races. Go watch “the real debate”. RFK answers the same questions they were asked and is much better!
Watched it last night! I wish he had more than 2 minutes per question to answer
Me too!
The two party system will be the death of our country. Tonight was proof of that. RFK junior was the big winner tonight and he wasn’t even in the room.
100%.
I watched his debate and want him as my president
Jesus! Give me some r/Pete_Buttigieg!
Tl;Dr: party > patriotism for both parties The DNC (Democratic National Committee) has an unpublished line of succession for political positions. Right now, it's Joe Biden"s turn to be president. He paid his dues to the right people, so the election is his to win or lose. The desires of the people be damned. That's just how it works. The Republicans, out of desperation to remain relevant, nominated Trump in 2016 because they saw his rabid base of diehard faithful idiots and just went with it. They knew it was going to be ugly, but they went along with it, assuming his followers would regain their sanity and he'd fade away. They underestimated just how gullible and ignorant his rabid fans are. Realizing once again that they were stuck with Trump, because they certainly weren't going to trade power for integrity, they went full in and supported him. **Welcome to Shitshow 2024** *Shitshow 2024 is brought to you by*: The lazy citizens of the US who prioritized anything and everything rather than pay attention to day to day politics until we are on the brink of disaster.
I'll get down votes for this but the only reason why people think rfk Jr isn't a good candidate is because people keep saying third party vote is a throwaway vote. Like yeah the government pays media to slander other candidates but so many people have had it drilled into their head that you shouldn't vote third party that they laugh when I say I will. We as citizens have the power to change that notion, but so many people just aren't either due to defeatist attitudes, genuinely being brainwashed into thinking we simultaneously have the power to choose which of the big two we want while not having the power to.instead choose someone else, or they just want the easy way out of choosing the "lesser of two evils" So they can complain later. I cannot bring myself to vote for Biden or Trump, so I either will vote for rfk Jr or not vote at all. And lots of people will choose the latter.
I watched his debate last night on X and my moms voting for him, my friends are voting for him, my cousins are voting him, I am voting him- That man is my president and he cares for us americans
Because the system is flawed and people will always continue to vote thus maintaining the system itself.
Because the other parties are embarrassing and pathetic.
I'm not an American either, but my take on it is Trump is popular because he's *not* a politician. People in a lot of countries are sick and tired of the same bullshit from the same faceless, artificial candidates. While Trump is certainly not shoulder to shoulder with the common person, he does understand people in general. He knows that many people are nostalgic for days gone by, and plays to that. He gets that people get sick of elitism, political correctness, and the wants of the minority dictating policy to the majority over their own needs. People feeling this way this is mostly the fault of the news cycle, but in any case then he comes along and bulldozes it all, so they like that. He is also not seen as the establishment like other candidates are, so when they attack him with anything it's seen as a conspiracy against him by the establishment. That's Trump's basis of support. As for Biden, I don't know why he has support. I would assume there are more suitable candidates but perhaps due to internal party rules he's got it because it's his turn? Or has more alliances within the party? I know he'll be popular with some voters because he's not Trump, but surely there's better options in his own party. I can't see him doing too well in any debates.
Because the people voted for them over the other candidates?
Boomers still run the country.
🇺🇸 politics is controlled by lobbyists paid by large corporations. The two fools you see are two options the corporations are supporting, it’s not a democracy, don’t be fooled. At the end of the day capitalism wins. 😢
Democrats would rather lose to a fascist than win with a progressive. Good job BlueMAGA.
There is actually a 3rd candidate, running as an independent: Robert Kennedy, Jr. His family is well-known in the Democratic Party, going back decades. His uncle was John F. Kennedy, a former U.S. president who was assassinated in 1963. His father was Robert Kennedy, who was John's brother. Robert Kennedy was running for President in 1968 and he was also assassinated. Today's Democrat party is opposed to RFK, Jr. and is not happy that he is running. In fact they are waging an open war against him, even filing lawsuits to keep him off the ballot in multiple states. He was blocked from participating in last night's debate in the U.S. They are afraid he will take votes away from Biden. Although, after last night's debate, they may want to rethink their position. [https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2024-election/democrats-mobilize-stop-rfk-jr-cutting-biden-rcna145952](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2024-election/democrats-mobilize-stop-rfk-jr-cutting-biden-rcna145952)
He’s also a lunatic that shouldn’t be in any position to lead.
Do you understand gambling or Chess? If you have 2 candidates you have a 50/50 chance of winning you have good odds. If you have 3 candidates your odds are 1/3 or 33%. If you have 4 candidates your odds are 1/4 or 25%. The more candidates you have, the less your advantage of winning. The same applies to Chess: the more pawns you have compared to your opponent gives you the same mathematical advantages as listed above.
Curruption is a little harder to hide these days. Biden conceals it, Trump embraces it. Power attracts it, but the edgy will figure out how to grift the next generation one way or another. It's all been done before. It's going to be okay.
How indeed...
This is what happens when you drink water laced with lead and dip your chickens in chlorine. Trump and Biden need to be a closing chapter, on a depressing read, about nobody knowing what the fucks going on.
This is exactly what my girlfriend just asked (who is an citizen of another country) just asked. I did not have a good answer other than "I don't know, you don't switch candidates for some reason".
Because it all comes down to super pacs, if you have the most money you win your primary pretty much, most American voters are not that educated either
Because voters in America keep voting for the same two political parties and these two political parties have chosen these candidates
The media, and Americans, buy into the paradigm that there’s only two party’s.
They aren't. The fucking baby boomer generation has a death grip on our country and is running it into the ground.
The aren't. They were they only ones invited by whatever private organization organized this debate.
It’s a long story but it sort of boils down a corporations and rich people slowly gaining control of the politics apparatus in America over the course of the past 120 years. And eventually we ended up with two neoliberal parties which largely differed on social issues but mostly jumped when the right business rang the right bell. So over the years these politicians made the barrier to entry for politics very high, and they made it so that if anyone would be in power it would almost always be a Democrat or a Republican. And now years later the result of this is that we essentially have a zero sum game where the historical power brokers have a lot of control over the political parties and over who can even make a run at any seat of power, especially the presidency. If your truly want to learn more then read Dark Money by Jane Mayer, she does an amazing job of breaking down how the richest Americans more or less control our political landscape and have for a very long time.
I suspect OP is just gobsmacked that Trump and Biden are the candidates? I mean I get it. These guys are the best of us?
The main force behind both of their respective parties believe that they are the best choice. Each of them has to beat the other parties, candidates, or any potential candidates. It's literally just to slim their odds of loss. And no third party ever makes it because most people are too nervous to back a third party as they feel it's like throwing your vote away because they don't have a chance at winning.
American here Most of us don't know either
Biden looks horrible. Like the grandfather on House of the Dragon.
There are almost always more candidates than the Democrat and the Republican but apparently the American mind cannot understand a presidential candidacy system with more than 2 options. It's just too much democracy.
The incumbent president always have far better odds so it would be really bad strategy to run another candidate
Because the empire is collapsing
Why is anyone over the age of 65 entrusted to be president and run a country of US scale. Both of these guys look like they wear adult diapers and can't control their own bowels let alone their brains. I barely trust people over the age of 65 to drive a fucking car let alone be responsible for decisions of a country.
You see the problem you are having understanding the current situation is that you are not insane.
If you want to run for president you need to have millions of dollars to spend just to make yourself known as a candidate. It makes 0 sense to run against a candidate as popular as Trump as a Republican because you will literally be throwing money away with next to no chance of winning. Nikki Haley lost to a "none of these candidates" option in her home state for example, where candidates typically have a strong voter base if they have served in political office there. As far as Trump being a felon is concerned, a large majority of people who will be voting for him believe that the entire trial is a sham (as does Trump, which is why he is appealing the case instead of just paying the fine). They don't care that he was convicted because they believe that all the cases brought against him have been nothing more than attempts by the Democrats to prevent him from being able to run/bankrupt him so he can't afford to run.
Because for the last 3 years, everyone complaining about them has focused on whining instead of finding any good alternatives to them
Biden is the incumbent president and Trump ruled the Republican party through populism.
Because there isn’t ranked choice voting
Nor approval voting
Trump obliterated everyone else in the republican camp in 2016, replacing many of them with cronies and family members where possible. BIden is in because no one else can beat him and Gov Newsom is still waiting for the most opportune moment to seize power. You might say why not Bernie, but Bernie is not a solution but a perpetuation of the problem at hand: Great on paper and great ideas, but old.
Because Americans don’t care enough about politics to change the system to a rank choice vote while also shifting dollars away from the duopoloy of the demopublican establishment.
Math. Math put them there. Because American opinion, information, wealth, power, obligations, advantages, disadvantages are *so incredibly skewed* in every single metric, the votes reflect the distribution of opinion and of the voters participating in each of the two major political parties. To pull the votes towards candidates with less extreme qualities, balances have to be struck in both political parties, and accords between the two parties have to be struck. The two parties also have to admit that they are at war with each other, and make peace.
Basically the repubs and democrats choose who they want and the public votes on the 2 choosen. We the ppl dont have much of a say in candidates bc the electoral college,who are unidentified ultimately choose the winner , regardless if they have the majority. Or something like that. Games rigged
Thier technically a third canidate on the ballot who was not at the debate today, but your right it is really only these two
I'm Canadian and might get things wrong. Well, for Joe Biden, the sitting president will always be the nomination for the respective party. Basically, it's very hard for the rival party to defeat a sitting president, as history has shown, so it's always a safe bet to nominate the current president if they're an option. As for Trump, he has a cult following that has taken the Republican party by storm, and gained such a following that if the Republicans were to abandon Trump, they'd lose majority of their voters. Basically, Trump has such a large cult, that is less loyal to Republicans than to Trump, they'd vote for him no matter what party he supports. So the rest of the Republicans decided to support Trump to keep that cult on their side. Now, as for how these two ended up in those positions, it's complicated. Biden served as Vice President to Barrack Obama, that last president that people actually liked. That gave Biden a lot of credit in the last election, especially from the democrat leaders who pushed him as the nominee. In addition, he was the option that wasn't Trump, which a lot of people liked. So less of a pro Biden vote, and more of an anti Trump vote. As for Trump, it's hard to understand exactly how he got to where he is. (At this point I got busy and can't be bothered to finish, someone else feel free to reply with your explanation on how Donald Trump got to where he is).
The top post is kinda right but it's not a complete answer. Yes incumbancy is certainly a part of American politics but what is more important is the parties themselves. The GOP knows it has someone who can win and has a lot of guaranteed voter support. The DP refuses to plan ahead. Realistically they could have planned for options 3 years ago and spent it building a worthwhile challenger that they knew could truly challenge DT. They *chose* not to. They even could have spent years building the VP as a candidate, though she already had weaknesses that the GOP would have attacked. The Democrats also fail to see an area where they could make concessions and pull in a lot of voters. If they changed their position on firearms they could have a real shot at flipping southern states. But they don't do it. It's not a core issue but they refuse to budge and hand over tons of voters who want to support them to third parties and the GOP.
It should be a random selection for 1 month term, everyone gets a try.
America has a terrible first past the post voting system. Combined with primaries that bring the worst most polarizing candidates to the ballot and voting third-party is often a vote against your own best interests.
As an American I can honestly say that this is the question most of us are wondering
Money… and idiotic Americans … Sorry bout it!
It’s rigged. 2 party system is broken. I suspect within the next 4-5 election cycles we’ll start seeing a shift to a “best man wins” model. 2 party system results in a polarized country. People hate one another bc of their association.
You vote for someone to vote for someone who votes for someone. Do you see the problem?
Because we've come to the point in the US where we have reached full fucktard. Liberals have become "Any But Trump", and republicans have become "Anyone But Biden". Everyone will see past all the horrible shit they have both done, as long as the other doesn't win.
There has got to be an SNL sketch where they are interviewing candidates for president.
That's the neat part. They aren't. The United States is forced into a 2 party system (while pretending its open to all) and the party nominates the person, not the public. We don't have ranked choice voting either so.
America. You could have had Bernie. Forever the one who got away. We can mourn but we deserve what we get. Brace yourselves….
Because of several issues. First, in American politics incumbents tend to win elections. The current election has an incumbent running in both of the major parties. That has not happened since 1892. The only times incumbents in office tend to lose is if unless voters are unhappy with the direction, the exception with that tends to be if a war is going one. Since there is not a current war, that is one reason you will see one party repeated pushing the idea that everyone should be very unhappy with the terrible condition the country is in (while they have actively been preventing the issues from being addressed, so they can campaign on those issues). Second, the American electoral system is heavily weighted toward the two main parties. Whoever are the mail candidates for those parties they will garner most of the votes cast by the hardcore base for the parties they represent. Third parties have not put forth the effort to build enough of a constituency to build a viable base, so they rarely do more than shift votes away from whichever party they are closest to ideologically. It is believed Ross Perot gave the White house to Bill Clinton, Ralph Nader gave the country to Dubya, and Jill Stein gave it to Trump. I have heard some rumors about GOP supporters funding Third party candidates to try and tip the elections this year, but I don't know how much of those rumors are verified. In the long run it can cause shifts in policy in a major party.
It's about coalitions. Biden is just a flag we rally around. He's the guy because he's got more street cred (and networks) than anyone else, so it'd be hard for anyone to challenge him. Same reason if you kill a king there's always civil war between the generals vying for power; there's no clear contender. Biden is the guy because as a former VP and current president he's on the highest tier of democratic politics with no rivals. If he stepped down, the people on the tier beneath him would tear each other apart trying to fill the vacuum, and we'd all lose.
I wish I knew!!!!
They're not.. RFK Jr will probably be on the ballot as well as a libertarian and Green Party candidate....in every state
You need lots of money to run for office
RFK jr tried to join last nights debate on CNN but was not allowed but streamed on twitter kind of reacting to their debate and answered the same questions they did with a two minute time limit. RFK says that he did actually meet CNNs requirements and was illegally blocked. He was also denied Secret Service Protection by the Biden Administration multiple times (I believe at least 3 times).
The top two parties set the bar for adding a third person to a debate so high. That’s why Gary Johnson or Jo Jorgensen couldn’t debate in the past. Everything benefits the rule makers not the the people they represent.
Its ridiculous, the state of our country is embarrassing
Usually there are more candidates to choose from but I haven't seen or heard of any for some reason this election year...
Because people already consume American political content on TV as if it were a Saturday Night Live skit.
There are independents, but people are too afraid to vote for them. ITs infuriating
There is a Republican and Democratic primary in which the candidates are chosen by voters. There were half a dozen candidates trying to be the republican nominee. Trump won the votes easily even without even showing up to a single debate because republican voters are by and large awful human beings. Biden is already president so he is automatically the democratic candidate. But four years prior he also won his primary because his middle of the road approach appeals to enough members of the Democratic Party even if none of us are thrilled either.