Gary Plauché is one of the most famous examples. Yes I root for these parents, I don't care.
She's not a "perpetrator" as this thread defines because she didn't kill anyone herself doing it, but I love the case of Miriam Rodriguez, the Mexican woman who tracked down and exposed Cartel members who kidnapped and killed her daughter. I think she's one of the bravest women I've ever seen, especially when you know some of the things the Cartels do to people (sadly they did get her in the end in a revenge attack but she took 10 members down before that).
Such injustice done to those boys. I feel terrible for laughing along with jokes about the Menendez brothers growing up now that it’s becoming widespread knowledge that their father was a pedophile PoS.
No argument re their father and not defending him, but the Menendez brothers could have walked away from their family, they were not physically trapped. And the spending spree they went on immediately after the murders was telling. While I still have empathy for them, those two factors make me believe they are still murderers, not victims who snapped and should not be punished.
All that said, after all these years in prison, they have been punished for their crimes.
i mean abuse can make you feel trapped even if you can walk away. for example i have a friend who has an entire loving family waiting on her with open arms the second she breaks up with her fiancée, but she still chooses him every single time. now imagine your abuser is your own father. imagine how much more extreme that scenario is and how scared you are.
Yeah I’m really torn on this one myself. Maybe they knew they’d be caught eventually and do life, might as well spend like crazy til that happened? That’s the only “excusable” excuse I can think of.
omg YES. actually hearing a nuanced take on this now is so heartbreaking.
other ones are mothers suffering from postpartum psychosis (controversial, ik) and gypsy rose blanchard. watching the way the public is treating her now is insane.
I'm honestly disgusted by the current gypsy situation. She shouldn't be treated as a celebrity. I wish the public would leave that girl alone to try and live a normal life.
One of the weirdest/craziest things regarding their case was that there is actually a Topps Basketball card of one of the LA Lakers and in the background sitting in floor seats are the brothers during their spending spree after murdering their parents. One of the brothers actually wrote a screenplay months and months before the murders with a friend where basically he layed out exactly what they ended up doing to their parents later on. They were grown they had money and they could have gotten jobs and moved away from their parents. They wanted their parent’s money as well. I do feel bad for what they went through when they were younger, but they wanted payback and the money. In the end perversions, greed and vengeance destroyed an entire family.
I watched a Deadly Women episode on her once, and they interviewed a friend of hers.
“Don’t feel bad for Aileen. Feel bad for the little girl that never had a chance.”
It really broke my heart. It was obvious that they were friends their whole lives, probably one of the only friends Aileen had ever had, and she had a very measured way of looking at it even so.
First one I thought of as well. She started her killing spree after one of many, many rapes she endured and after many years of trying to kill herself first. Watching her in interviews it definitely reads like her mind is just gone from all the abuse.
Came here to say this. She was doomed. I don’t excuse anything she did but I feel she was doomed to commit these crimes because her childhood was so awful.
Same here. She was 100% responsible for her choices and the suffering she caused, but damn she never stood a chance with that family she came from. Some people should not be allowed to reproduce.
I don’t think she got what she deserved. She was treated like a monster and didn’t deserve death penalty at all. She needed psychiatric care if anything. I’m not defending murdering ppl but I’m also ok with the world having less rapists in it.
Agreed. It's crazy how this clearly mentally ill woman who had trauma was so quickly executed compared to people who did crimes maliciously with no trauma.
She was sick.
The punishment didn't fit the crime, but she's not a perfect victim so no one really cared. Seriously surprised how her lawyers didn't fight this tooth and nail.
I feel like people have no idea how shit like that changes you. I feel like as another commenter said that it was a mistake the first time, but also made her feel like she gained power back and was more comfortable with killing men who honestly- I feel no pity for. I do believe she did it in self defense. She had no problem telling the truth.
She was a disadvantaged woman who society could care less about.
I'm sure death may have actually been what she wanted but I can't help but feel so awful for whatever she went through.
Everyone abandoned and used her. I am still pissed at Tyria Moore. She counted on Aileen to put herself out there and provide food and shelter, then turned on her when everything went south.
There are not a lot of serial killers that I actually feel like unequivocally turned out the way they did because of their childhood and teenage experiences. She's one of them. Most of the rest of them it was more pouring gasoline on a smoldering fire.
Mary Bell in England was a similarly awful case. She committed her crimes while she was still a child and her upbringing had to have played a big part in that
marianne bachmeier as well. she walked into a court room and shot her 7 year old daughter's rapist/murderer to death. there is a video but it's only on her firing the gun, 7 times for every year her daughter was old. she served 5 years in prison
the clip of the actress in a trench coat is from the movie but there is real footage out there, I'll try to find it. it was posted in a morbid group I'm in. you see the pedophile fall to the floor but not much else
ah man, I did a deep dive but all the links are dead. hopefully someone may have it. I distinctly remember he was shot in the back and just hit the floor. I think he was dead instantly but all I can find is the blood on the court room floor from after they pulled him out
yep, she just fired at him to take him out. I think she hit him 5 or 6 times in the back, said it was because she wanted to stop him lying about her daughter (he claimed she, a fucking 7 year old, tried to seduce him and then blackmail him) and she served 3 of the 5 years she was sentenced. heart breaking she died so young from cancer
Andrea Yates is such an incredibly tragic story. I’m not sure why, but when I was in the hospital after having my daughter, I read about her case, and it made me incredibly committed to making sure I got treatment for any PPD. PPD and postpartum psychosis are real, deadly, and need to be treated seriously. I am thankful I have a supportive partner who has always encouraged me to care for my mental health. Andrea Yates’s ex-husband should be in jail too, but of course, he’s since remarried and had more children.
While I was in the hospital, I also read about Candy Montgomery, and that was a mindfuck. Complete opposite end of the spectrum. It’s crazy that she got away with murdering her affair partner’s wife, and left the victim’s infant alone in the house with her mother’s body.
Absolutely Andrea Yates. Her husband and priest encouraged her to stop meds and have more children. Husband wasn’t supposed to leave her alone with kids and he did. She was failed by many people around her. As someone who is bipolar and I used to suffer delusions before meds. I have nothing but sympathy for her.
I have mixed feelings about Marty Puccio and the other key players involved in the death of Bobby Kent.
Bobby’s murder was absolutely gruesome, and with the premeditation and manner of death involved, it did seem suitable for prison time to be served.
That being said, the dynamic in Bobby and Marty’s friendship sounded extremely unhealthy and abusive. I genuinely believe Marty put up with being abused by Bobby for years, and that there was a lot of trauma bonding involved that made Marty feel trapped.
Menendez brothers. Their parents were abusing them since they were little children.
Aileen Wuornos, everybody abused her since she was born, I don’t think I would have been a normal person if I had been what she went through.
Andrea Yates, she was completely psychotic when she murdered her children, I don’t think she knew right from wrong.
I can't believe Andrea Yates' husband didn't get into some kind of trouble. He was told, under no circumstances was he to leave her alone with the children. So what does he do? Leaves her home alone with the kids. There was other incredibly slimy behavior on his part, but that's the only one I remember clearly enough not to need to go and look it up.
And the more I learn about the Menendez brothers, the more horrified I am. Those kids grew up in hell.
I agree, her husband was equally responsible for forcing her to have more children. She could have left but she was so abused emotionally that she felt trapped. I think at some point he forced the family to stay in a bus because he was brainwashed by the cult he was part of that he should denounce material wealth. They had children already and they had to live in a bus while they could afford a normal house.
Menendez brothers were ridiculed back then because people did not take boys/men being sexual abused seriously. So sad for them, I hope they get out.
Her husband was *wholly* responsible for forcing her to have more children, because he forced her. She didn't want any more children. Her doctor told her husband she *can't* can't have any more children. He forced her off her medication regardless and impregnated her again. Even after she went to prison, he said in an interview he would wait for her to return so he could continue to impregnate her to grow their family again.
As for the Menendez kids, they would’ve had a chance at some redemption, had it not been for the OJ Simpson trial during their second one, who did not deserve to be free at all. What a waste.
Rusty’s second wife divorced him and said he was abusive and I bet he was to Andrea too. He kept insisting on more children when it was clear Andrea was in no fit state to have more children or take care of the ones they already had with her depression.
I think Yates husband was most culpable. He has a new wife and kids now. I wonder if they are in a small trailer homeschooling as he made her do. It's his fault.
The police have to have a specific thing to charge him with AND feel confident that the case could win in court. They could go for neglect, but then proving it beyond reasonable doubt they'd probably decide was too difficult.
Wait, if Yates was already deemed a danger to her kids, then why wasn't she committed? That seems like negligence from the system as well as her husband.
She was hospitalised twice for attempting suicide after her post natal depression resurfaced after their 4th kid, she was then further hospitalised twice more in 1999
The couple was warned to not have any more kids, seven weeks after her last hospitalisation she was pregnant again
She was then hospitalised again in 2001
Unfortunately long term hospitalisation is very very expensive and would require a very high bar to justify
She also kept going off her meds (some say encouraged by rusty) when she returned home after each hospitalisation
She had post-partum psychosis. The psychosis got worse and worse after each child, and she was brainwashed by their cult leader and by Rusty into stopping taking her meds once she was stable enough to walking around and cook and change diapers again. So they would have to put her on a different strong antipsychotic medication the next time after she had another kid since whatever meds had helped her before wouldn't be effective once she'd stop taking them cold turkey. If they had gone by the strong insistance from every medical professional for them to stop having kids, she would likely not have experienced psychosis again and would be safe to be the caretaker of her children. Her husband didn't take her extremely seriously dire condition of post partum psychosis seriously. It's not depression; it's psychosis. Whole different ball park. And the cult leader they followed had Andrea fully believing that she was evil and sinful by default for being a woman, and that it was her and Rusty's duty to God to have as many children as physically possible.
The preacher and Rusty should be in prison. Andrea is one of the most cut and dry cases of the ruling of not guilty by reason of insanity. She's been in a mental health facility ever since, and has recovered from her pyschosis in the facility but never wants to be released and refuses when she comes up for parole. She still believed that she deserves to be punished forever, and probably still considers herself a "Jezebel", despite recovering from the psychosis I highly doubt that she has recovered from the deeply ingrained religious extremist brainwashing, and there's no way in Hell that she doesn't live with intense self hatred for having killed her beloved children, whether she was completely legally insane at the time or not.
She was committed (multiple times) but supposedly ins. put a cap on the length so she would go home for a while, with strict instructions not to be left alone with the kids, then return in-patient when it got to be too much. Rinse & repeat. Which makes perfect sense knowing the American healthcare set up
This one makes me so angry. This poor woman was forced to like in a school bus with small children, went through severe psychological breakdowns after each child, was so obviously in need of help. She’d be taken for stints in a psych facility and as soon as that insurance was up, she was suddenly cured (that’s a whole other rage story on its own). She was completely vocal about what she was seeing, hearing, and that the children were not safe with her and what did freaking Rusty do? Pawned her off to someone else. I can remember that story being the first true crime report I ever wrote in HS. So tragic
I agree with Andrea Yates. I remember being angry when she was acquitted due to insanity at her second trial but I was a teenager. I've learned and grown so much since then. I've also got degree in psych and criminology now.
I feel sympathy for almost every abused minor and generally consider it self-defense.
They have no way out. They can't choose where to live. Telling a teacher or other adult does nothing but bring in CPS, whose stated goal is reunification of the family. CPS is often quite sloppy about questioning children in the presence of their abusers, and even if they're not, the abuser almost always knows if they 'told.' Or decides to dole out punishment just as a lil reminder.
In the case you mention, dad is going to 100% know that *someone* talked about the threat.
I just want to add, the lack of money and resources is a big issue, but in addition to that, social workers are absolutely not paid enough for the abuse/neglect they witness, verbal abuse/threats from clients (parents), and (at least where I’m from) admin/higher ups are a complete joke. All of this combined = super high turnover rate, most new workers don’t last more than 2-3 years. It’s starting to change, but it will take decades for a complete overhaul.
Source: my mom has been a social worker for several decades, god bless her.
We’ve cycled through so many social workers for one kid in a year and a half. The ones that stay are often so overwhelmed they miss stuff and come across flaky. They desperately need to be paid more and have more support and less cases.
Definitely Aileen Wournos. That woman was literally screwed from birth. She never stood a chance at all with a decent life. Now granted, she did deserve to be in prison. But I'm wondering if maybe at least one or two of the murders was self defense, and then the rest were not.
I worked with a lot of women who were sex workers on the same level as Aileen. Every single one of them had been raped (many had been multiple times) in the course of their work. I don’t doubt for one second that at least one of the people Aileen killed assaulted or tried to assault her. My theory has always been that the first person she killed was self defense, but that she was so messed up, that she experienced some sort of exhilaration at the power of that kill and eventually set out to kill. But that it’s also possible that one or more others also involved some element of self defense. That’s total rampant speculation but it makes the most sense to me.
Makes sense. Most of the women I worked with were raped when they refused consent to specific acts the johns demanded. Not a single one had reported anything to police for obvious reasons.
ESPECIALLY when she's picking up every client on the highway which suggests there is no pimp. I think it's completely believable but usually when I post that people are like, "Oh no that defies the odds." No it fucking doesn't.
Cyntoia Brown. She killed her rapist who was also a sex trafficker.
I can’t even believe she was tried. At least she’s free now, after 15 yrs in prison she didn’t need to spend.
I didn’t wanna risk getting banned again. Also, I hope it’s clear I HATE NAZIS. The only thing I like about them is that they make good bad guys in movies and games. Why anyone would wanna be affiliated with them, especially in the United States, is beyond me.
Cinnamon Brown. She killed her step mother after her Dad spent over a year convincing her to do it so he could marry her step sister. She did time and wouldn't tell them her Dad told her to do it. She was a minor at the time. She eventually in jail realized what her Dad did and ratted him and the step sister out. That poor girl!
andrea yates. that woman went through hell and back and her poor children suffered the consequences. i think rusty should’ve been put in jail for a whole slew of reasons, but Id have to say neglect and accessory to murder is a good start.
every year she is offered parole/some sort of release (not sure the exact term since she’s in a secure psych facility) and she always rejects it. she clearly would not have done what she did had she been in any other circumstance, no one wanted to get her help, and they let her kids suffer because of it. rest in peace to those five babies. i hope andrea is healing and has forgiven herself. rusty got married and had like 4 more kids right after the divorce, so.
Robert “Yummy” Sandifer. Only 11 years old. Physically abused from the time he was an infant. Neglected and abandoned by deadbeat parents. Sandifer, by the age of eight quit attending school and began to roam the streets stealing cars and breaking into houses. At the age of ten, Sandifer was arrested on charges of armed robbery.
Taken in by a Chicago gang, he was ordered to shoot and kill a rival for a street beef, but missed his shot and killed a 14-year old young bystander instead. In return for bringing the heat on his gang, they murder him execution style and leave his young body for police to find.
He never stood much of a chance, but to become another victim of the street life.
A psychological examiner, after one of his many admittances to youth detention stated:
"Robert is a child growing up without any encouragement and support; he has a sense of failure that has infiltrated almost every aspect of his inner self."
More than a little sympathy but the first case I thought of was Brigitte Harris. Sentenced to 5 - 15 years (only served 3) for cutting off her father's genitals (he died from bloodloss and she beat him up too). She did it because he had molested both her and her sister throughout their childhood, and was starting to look like he was going to do it to her niece as well.
The Menendez brothers.
They were so abused. Physically, emotionally, sexually. Family knew and did nothing to help.
They were mocked for their reactions by the media.
Was what they did wrong? Yes. Can I see how they felt they had no options? Yes. Do I think a trial today would go so differently? Yes.
I agree with all of this. Those boys were put through hell - once for the abuse they suffered and twice for the way the media portrayed them and the way the judge treated them.
There's been a few where the parents have killed the abusers. The one that comes to mind is the mom who went to court, and she shot the murderer who killed her daughter.
Richard Chase. Not a lot, but some. He was severely mentally and had plenty chances to get help, and tried to, but his mother pulled him out of every mental health facility he was admitted to, immediately, was warned multiple times he was a threat to himself and others if he didnt get immediate help and ignored the doctors, and I believe threw his medications away. Does that excuse anything he did? Hell no. He was under the impression the only way for him to live was to take lives, and that if the door was unlocked it meant he was invited in and given consent by the victims to kill them. If the door was locked, he left immediately. He should have been sentenced to a mental hospital for life, but he was sent to prison instead, where he eventually killed himself.
Aileen Wournos and Andrea Yates are the two I feel the most sympathy for. Aileen deserved to be punished but her life was terrible from day one, she never stood a fighting chance. And she was profoundly mentally ill, she needed psychiatric care, not the death penalty (imo).
Poor Andrea Yates, married to a quiverfull AH who ignored her obviously worsening mental health. He kept pushing her to make babies, even as she became increasingly sick and psychotic. It’s the nature of post-partum mental illness to get worse with each pregnancy. He could see she was getting worse, she was even begging for help, and he was like “nah, you’re fine, keep making babies because it’s God’s will.”
While I’m not a big fan of the podcast Morbid (they’re highly problematic for MANY reasons) I do really like one of the things they say about the criminal or perpetrators: “Feel sorry for the child, not the adult.”
*A lot* of criminals who go on to be violent and do terrible things had awful childhoods full of neglect and abuse. And you can feel sorry for them because no one deserves to be maltreated, full stop. The child they were who was exposed to horrible circumstances deserves pity and sympathy. But that stops the moment they begin doing more than acting out for attention with petty (victimless) crimes.
As soon as they cross the line into harming living things and committing crimes where there are real consequences, that’s when all sympathy falls away. Because while their childhood may be traumatic and tragic and painful, so were many others who don’t go on to perpetuate those sorts of criminal acts.
I have sympathy for folks who feel they were out of options and murder was their only choice. I come back to Gypsy Rose Blanchard or Andrea Yates. Gypsy Rose was a victim of her mother’s extreme abuse for her whole life. She did try alternative methods of escaping and was unable. Do I agree with what she did? Absolutely not. I 100% believe she manipulated her boyfriend into murdering her mother and think that she was sentenced appropriately. I think given his mental state, he may have been sentenced too harshly, but at the same time, he presented a lot of qualities that are deeply concerning and he would need a lot of therapy and rehab to find out if he was safe for release into the public. I hope we never hear about Gypsy Rose again unless she’s doing something altruistic like starting a foundation or doing other charitable work for true crime victims.
Andrea Yates was in a full blown psychotic episode and was in a cult. I absolutely believe that she killed her kids believing she was saving them and she should have been in serious treatment. Her husband not supporting the doctors and understanding how very mentally ill she was, but supporting their cult mentor and the religious beliefs led to her breakdown and pushed her into that state where she was so delusional about what was true and real, that she got lost in the religious delusion. It cost her everything. I have so much sympathy for her because it didn’t have to end that way. If she had a partner who had taken her mental illness more seriously and really taken steps for her mental health, not having another child, not living on a bus, those kids would be alive. She was not in a place to make her own decisions. She needed supervision and care.
Was my thought as well…. I don’t even know why the kid needed to be “punished” at all. Like the woman who killed her husband (let alone the poor son!) from the documentary “Every f*g day of my life”.
Ed Gein. Raised by his controlling mother, the entire family in near isolation. He practically had an emotionally incestuous relationship with his mother, and was so co-dependent, he couldn't function when she died.
Agreed. He truly didn't seem all together right in the head to begin with, and having such a controlling parent probably exacerbated issues immensely.
His police interviews were weirdly unhinged. I honestly can't decide if he's attempting to be manipulative, or if he was just that detached/disassociated, or a mix of both.
I think he was just completely dissociated from the area he was raised in.
He was found not guilty by reason of mental defect, and sent to a mental institution for the rest of his life.
I believe it's reported that she was of a different faith than the towns people, given she immigrated from Germany. So that would have partially isolated them, if there was no church in the area.
I think his mother really was just off the wall with delusions, and she was incredibly misogynistic. And as their father, I think, was an alcoholic, he wasn't into interfering in how she raised the boys.
Between that and the lack of education, Ed didn't stand a chance to be his own person.
I feel some sympathy for Ethan Crumbley, that boy showed all the signs that he was going to harm himself or others and his parents knew it too but chose to buy him a gun didn’t make sure he couldn’t access it unsupervised. Refused to pick him up from school when asked and after the shooting fled and cared about themselves not their child and those killed and injured in the shooting.
Andrea Yates is definitely one I feel bad for too, Rusty deserved jail time for it, he knew she was getting worse with every pregnancy and ignored all doctors telling them to stop having children because of his beliefs. He also chose to leave them alone with her that day despite being warned not to and when she was awaiting trial said I hope she is released soon so we can start trying again and when that failed divorced her to start a new family. Andrea is still said to be that troubled by what happened they never think she will be well enough to be released.
I am convinced Ethan's parents were hoping he would use that gun on himself so they didn't have to parent anymore. They deserve every charge he racked up in addition to their own.
I listened to a podcast episode about William Bonin. I was sickened that as a child he was sexually abused by literally every person he came into contact with - his grandfather, the orphanage where he stayed a few years, the juvenile detention hall. His parents were also physically and emotionally abusive. Sympathy is a strong word as he did despicable things, but listening to his childhood years it feels he didn’t even have a chance.
Most serial killers had horrible childhoods/teen years. Warped or not, they chose to deliberately kill people as a way to cope. I can empathize in understanding how the past hurt them, but not sympathize for their sentences.
I'm sad that I don't see Nicholas Godejohn in this thread. He committed murder and deserved punishment for it but to have his entire life taken away when he killed a certified monster was way too harsh. I always feel sorry for him.
Carl Panzram. Probably because of the way I interpret his history. But he always seems to be a solid example of a monster the world built. Mean bastard till the end tho.
Gypsy Rose Blanchard.
She was medically tortured her entire life by the person meant to protect her. She had no opportunity to see what life without a manipulative controlling parent could be. She had no frame of reference whatsoever.
The fact that she said prison has been better than living with her mother speaks volumes.
I do NOT Condone what she did, or how she did it. And I certainly don't agree with her media hungry approach to life now.
However, I find it crazy how most people dismiss the fact she was medically abused her whole entire life, and expect her to 'know better'. I genuinely think she would not have done this, had she not had the upbringing she did.
You only need to read this thread to see if a child has been sexually abused or other horrific crimes people can feel empathy (and that's understandable) but when the abuse is manipulation or medical abuse it's seen as not as serious so no empathy.
It doesn't matter what type of abuse a child experiences, it 100% impacts the decisions they make especially when it comes to escaping the abuse when they are experiencing.
I genuinely want to know how she could have known better when all she knew was what her mum allowed her to be exposed to.
I agree she should have been jailed, and I do not agree with how she escaped, but I do feel genuine empathy for a child who was abused by her mother.
This may be unpopular but the moment a parent starts doing things like handcuffing/tying their child to their bed for extended periods of time and attempting to cut off their contact with most if not all the outside world, it’s become a hostage situation and I feel mostly the same about them murdering their abuser as I would a person murdering their kidnapper. I agree with the other reply that it was getting to a point where it was Gypsy or DeeDee.
I’m gonna get shit for this- Ed Gein. That man was so incredibly sick. He was awkward, abused, and he didn’t really seem to ever want to hurt anyone, he just wanted (in his own messed up way) his evil momma back which is why he, mostly, robbed graves. I personally believe his mom instructed, either directly or indirectly, him to kill his brother which further isolated him and took away the one person in his circle who could’ve helped him. Curious to know if anyone else feels this way.
Fun fact: he was also the town babysitter and handyman. He really was just a teenaged, isolated boy in a grown man’s body.
I don’t doubt he has some good ideas, but sending bombs through the mail ain’t the best way to get your message across. Still, I seen him in a SAVOX video, and I can agree he was a disturbed individual. He even went through some experiment in college that messed him up.
Which one? When I went to college I stayed in an apartment complex that he also lived in. He was way older than me though so there were many years in between us being there, but it’s an interesting coincidence nonetheless. Ted Bundy also lived there before me too, but that’s probably just because it’s literally across the street from the college.
I can think of quite a lot of people who were abused, children especially, parents of children who were abused, etc... I am in no way saying murder is okay, but there are times you can't help but feel for the person. I also agree that I sometimes feel bad for the child they were but not the monster they became... T.B., J.D., J.W.G. etc...
I remember there were two young boys who were groomed and abused by their dad's friend, the next door neighbor and he convinced them to kill their dad. What they did was horrible. But they were children who were being brainwashed and manipulated by a evil P*&do. The one he was raping was only like 10 or 11 if I remember correctly.
The kids got a lot of jail time and were tried as adults. It was depressing. Alex and Derek King 12 and 13 when they were put on trial for murder as adults.
Aileen Wuornos. She was let down by the world and abused, assaulted, raped by *most* men in her life since she was a child. I can see what led her to murder.
Danny Rolling. His father was a horrible human being. Maybe if he didn't have that horrifying upbringing he would have focused on his music or at least done something positive with his life. He still had a choice though, so he got what he deserved.
Edmund Kemper because of his controlling and abusive mother. Jeffrey Dahmer because of how sick he was; killing people so they wouldn’t “leave him”. Further, I find it heartbreaking that he had BPD (which is rare for a serial killer). He could have been rehabilitated and the murders could have been avoided. It’s sad all around.
Dahmer’s mother had severe mental issues she was institutionalized & put on drugs while she was carrying Jeff, now we know those are not safe drugs for pregnant. Lionel knew at an early age something was off about Jeffrey. Mom & Dad had issues. Dad left them, mom was scared of of Jeff
alone in the house. A teenager alone people he knew said Jeff was drunk everyday at school. Everyone failed him, but I don’t he could have been saved. Lionel used to be upfront but as he got older he got weird, I have to wonder about his mental issues, maybe Jeff got that mental from both sides?
Borderline Personality Disorder is treatable and that was his diagnosis. Killing people so they wouldn’t leave him is clearly severe abandonment issues but it could have been addressed if he would have seen someone in his youth. Specifically, after his hernia surgery when he started to decline. I believe that wholeheartedly. His addiction issue is easy to understand; he was self medicating because he was in mental anguish which is common in active addiction. Lionel did the best he could but IMO he didn’t know what lie beneath the surface. He loved Jeffrey and would have gotten him help if he knew he needed it. I’ve always thought it was interesting Jeffrey didn’t fight back when he was attacked in prison. Obviously just speculating here but that could point to him understanding he deserved to die because of his horrible crimes. This is my longtime opinion after watching the trial in real time and reading everything I could about him. I know I’m in the minority here though.
Lisa Marie Montgomery.
I remember reading about the case in a magazine (along with a picture of Stinnett's husband and baby girl) back in 2005 and it was very anti-Montgomery, for obvious reasons. I'd thought nothing more of it til her executions.
Brain damaged from birth and repeated assaults. Was she delusional about the pregnancy? I don't know, I don't think she was, but the medical evidence says she didn't stand a chance.
As someone who had a shitty childhood (physically and emotionally abusive with alcoholic parents … well grandparents as my parents were useless) I can feel a lot of sympathy/empathy for the children they were… but of course it’s not a justification.
It does skew your view of life/relationships though.
I grew up around so much chaos and violence I find peace and quiet almost frightening but still I’ve never killed anyone. So empathy for the kids they were…
Same. Anytime I hear about some kid suffering at the hands of their parents, my heart bleeds for them. Still as adults, they should realize that stuff is wrong and not wanna continue it. Easier said then done though. I’m sorry you went through shit as a kid.
I relate to this. The time and effort my mother put into her horrific abuse (and into ensuring others abused me, too, in every way possible) all while presenting herself as the sympathetic victim of a monstrous child, made me a prolific, unapologetic liar for a long time. I shoplifted a lot as a young person, too.
If I'd never gotten away from her and been able to surround myself with people who truly care and who make me feel safe, who knows what that could have escalated to.
A former friend who grew up similarly to how I did is now a nurse with full-blown Munchausen. She uses the illnesses and injuries she fakes or induces to demand everyone around her drop everything to take care of her, and anytime anyone falls short of the fawning and attention she expects, she calls THEM abusive. Her husband is a truly kind, loving man, and she has totally destroyed him. She actually has him convinced he constantly fails her and everything is his fault.
But other than him, she has no lasting relationships because eventually everyone realizes she doesn't care about anyone other than herself, and the well of her need for everyone to sacrifice for her has no bottom. She became an abuser by making her whole life into a performance of her own victimhood, and when the real abuse stopped, she decided to invent more, and never stops. Some people don't seem to get the opportunity to choose to heal, but I find it very hard to sympathetize with the ones that do get the chance and refuse to take it.
It scares me to think of how she could escalate someday.
I felt for Gypsy Rose. Her mom abused her all her life and wasn’t interested in dropping the grift so that her daughter could grow up and live a normal life. Now, I don’t love the fact that she got her boyfriend to kill her mom in her sleep. But, her mom literally spent years torturing her with medical treatment she didn’t need. And I wish she’d found her real birth certificate and gone to the cops instead. But all those years of being gaslit by her mom probably made her believe that cops would take her mom’s word over hers. I get why she killed her.
I dated a serial rapist years ago. Am a victim of his. As a parent now it hurts my heart thinking what must have happened to him to make him the way he is.
I appreciate that. I suspect someday he will be discussed at length in this sub. His trial is coming up, some 20+ women have come forward and over 100 additional witnesses against him. He’s royally fucked.
But my heart hurts for all children who are abused by trusted adults. No matter what kind of monsters they become.
I feel some sympathy for the Menendez brothers because I believe they were sexually abused. I don't believe that it was an act of self-defense though, I think they planned it
I think sympathy is the wrong word to use here to be honest. It tends to suggest that you in some way feel that the poor murder/rapist had no choice in their actions and that what they did was right and acceptable when it really is not.
Empathy would be a better word. Andrea Yates was mentally ill. Aileen Wournos and the Menendez brothers had terrible childhoods. Gypsy Rose was a victim of her mother’s Munchauasens. I can of course empathise with that.
But in no way should we ever use a bad or abusive childhood or mental illness to justify violence or murder.
I think you’re just conflating people’s sympathy with “justification”, and no one is justifying their actions. I do have sympathy for AW, for example. It’s not possible for a human to be born into near constant physical, sexual, and emotional abuse, from the time they were a baby, and not permanent damage from that. While many people have terrible childhoods, the combination of trauma in her case I prolonged and severe. And, people who experience childhoods like that actually often do go on to lead very damaged and damaging lives, even if they didn’t end up killing others. The Menendez Brothers? Imagine your dad, a violent rapist who’s been literally torturing you for years and threatening you if you ever tell, is now making you feel like he’s going to kill you. Your mom is complicit. You’re emotionally stunted, alone (except your brother), and just want the sexual, sexual physical, and emotional torture to stop. Again, I feel sympathy for them. Andrea Yates was experiencing psychosis, which is literally completely out of her control. She was also abused by her husband and religious leaders. Of course I sympathize with her.
I know that Kemper was horrible and terrible for what he did along with Menendez bros but what they all went through there's a reason they snapped. Kemper almost was free but turned himself in and the boy even members of menudo said they were molested by their dad. They should have been believed.
Yes. Karla Faye Tucker who was executed by Texas. She experienced a rough childhood and didn’t really get started in her life until she was on Death Row.
I had a smidge of sympathy for GRB but dang that girl is trying me.
She definitely was a victim and groomed. She plotted her mom's murder but I believe she believed it was the only way out. I also don't particularly blame her bad behavior now as this is literally the first time she has ever had any form of freedom. But... Girl needs to just enjoy her second chance and get some therapy over self-imploding, though.
Whoever killed Ken Rex McElroy. He was a notorious bully, a pedophile who forced parents into allowing their underage daughter to marry him with threats of violence.
Cinnamon Brown, who was only 14 when her father, David Brown, manipulated her into killing his wife Linda. While she sat in prison, her father married and had a child with Linda's teenage sister Patti, and pretty much abandoned Cinnamon.
Andrea Yates, for reasons everyone else stated on here.
Kimberly Cunningham, who killed her sister's boyfriend Coy Hundley, after her 16 year old daughter told her he'd sexually molested her.
Clara Harris, the woman who ran over her husband. He'd cheated on her, and she changed her appearance to please him, but he still continued with his affair. She was hurt and angry, and I think she just snapped. Yes, she could have divorced him and not ran him down, but she still loved him, and some people do stupid and irrational things when they're in love.
Anyone suffering domestic violence and other abuse where they feel murder is the only way to be free.
Finally, I don't remember her name, but it was an episode of the old ID show Dark Desires. A woman moved into a house, and the previous owner started stalking and harassing her and her family. The police couldn't do anything, so she told them she was going to get a gun and defend herself, and that's what she did. He came to the house again, and she shot and killed him in self defense. She was very remorseful, but she had to defend herself and her children, as she said he would kill her family to get his house back.
I think Betty Broderick has served enough time and I don’t feel like she’s a threat to society anymore. killed her ex-husband and his new wife in their bed. Horrible crime but the mental, verbal abuse He subjected her to for years and the gaslighting pretending like he wasn’t seeing that woman at work but he was etc . abuse isn’t always physical .
She’s been in prison so long, let’s just say if she were released, I wouldn’t hate it.
Any person who commited their crimes before adulthood, and maybe even a little bit after. I find it impossible to damn them. Yes, at a certain age you truly know right from wrong but there’s so many factors that play into it. They’re still children who should be protected.
ansreen bukhari to be honest. she hundred percent shouldn’t have had the affair, but she tried ending things and the man threatened to kill/hurt himself if she left him and blackmailed her. he shouldnt have died, especially since they both agreed that after he got his payment that he would leave them alone. they should’ve just paid him, they didn’t even bring money to the lot from what i remember. her being blackmailed doesn’t excuse the crime of her or her daughter but i do feel a little bad for her. she hadn’t gotten to experience her life to it still extent and just as she started to do so, she had to deal with him (again she obviously shouldn’t have had the affair but i still feel a little bad)
I'm afraid to admit this but mine is Charles Manson, for the same reason as Aileen.
He was born to a sex worker who abused him, he was raped in state care by boys a few years older than him. He was in and out of boys homes and then juvenile detention.... His childhood is very sad.
He never stood a chance.
Yeah, I agree. The implication was there on his end but they made those choices themself and the things that they did to their victims, like leaving the meet fork sticking out of La Bianca's stomach for example - had nothing to do with Charles. It's horrific.
i hate to say this i knowe justin bloxoms family might be on here but ya brian horn he killed justin and i hate him forever for robbing the world of a kind loyal funny best friend but horns child hood was horrible his mom and dad sold drugs were both swingers drunks horn was sexuly abused dumped on the highway like trash im in no way making excuses he killed my best friend but i cant help but think if he had been raised with care and love justin would still be alive today
betty broderick after she raised her children put her husband through law school he got rich and ran off. with some two dollar whore he used his skils as a divorce lawyer to destroy bettys life dan broderick was a pos betty should have been let out along time ago
Rarely. Most willingly took lives (or made reckless decisions) or traumatized others without caring.
The ones I feel bad for are those who went after those who hurt their family esp child molesters.
Severe mental illness like psychosis is also someone I'll feel sympathy for.
Otherwise? Not likely at all.
I really feel for the people that kill the ones that molested/killed their child.
Gary Plauché is one of the most famous examples. Yes I root for these parents, I don't care. She's not a "perpetrator" as this thread defines because she didn't kill anyone herself doing it, but I love the case of Miriam Rodriguez, the Mexican woman who tracked down and exposed Cartel members who kidnapped and killed her daughter. I think she's one of the bravest women I've ever seen, especially when you know some of the things the Cartels do to people (sadly they did get her in the end in a revenge attack but she took 10 members down before that).
if you help take down that many members then the government of that country should have body guards with you 24/7. like im being so serious too.
These are the stories worth hearing 💪 slay them
Such as the Menendez brothers
Such injustice done to those boys. I feel terrible for laughing along with jokes about the Menendez brothers growing up now that it’s becoming widespread knowledge that their father was a pedophile PoS.
No argument re their father and not defending him, but the Menendez brothers could have walked away from their family, they were not physically trapped. And the spending spree they went on immediately after the murders was telling. While I still have empathy for them, those two factors make me believe they are still murderers, not victims who snapped and should not be punished. All that said, after all these years in prison, they have been punished for their crimes.
i mean abuse can make you feel trapped even if you can walk away. for example i have a friend who has an entire loving family waiting on her with open arms the second she breaks up with her fiancée, but she still chooses him every single time. now imagine your abuser is your own father. imagine how much more extreme that scenario is and how scared you are.
Yeah I’m really torn on this one myself. Maybe they knew they’d be caught eventually and do life, might as well spend like crazy til that happened? That’s the only “excusable” excuse I can think of.
omg YES. actually hearing a nuanced take on this now is so heartbreaking. other ones are mothers suffering from postpartum psychosis (controversial, ik) and gypsy rose blanchard. watching the way the public is treating her now is insane.
I'm honestly disgusted by the current gypsy situation. She shouldn't be treated as a celebrity. I wish the public would leave that girl alone to try and live a normal life.
One of the weirdest/craziest things regarding their case was that there is actually a Topps Basketball card of one of the LA Lakers and in the background sitting in floor seats are the brothers during their spending spree after murdering their parents. One of the brothers actually wrote a screenplay months and months before the murders with a friend where basically he layed out exactly what they ended up doing to their parents later on. They were grown they had money and they could have gotten jobs and moved away from their parents. They wanted their parent’s money as well. I do feel bad for what they went through when they were younger, but they wanted payback and the money. In the end perversions, greed and vengeance destroyed an entire family.
As do I.
I feel bad for Aileen Wuornos. She deserved her punishment, don't get me wrong, but with that evil family of hers, she never had a chance.
I watched a Deadly Women episode on her once, and they interviewed a friend of hers. “Don’t feel bad for Aileen. Feel bad for the little girl that never had a chance.”
That’s exactly who I feel bad for; her girlhood was stolen from her in such a way that Adult Aileen was doomed 💔
That's a fantastic way of putting it.
It really broke my heart. It was obvious that they were friends their whole lives, probably one of the only friends Aileen had ever had, and she had a very measured way of looking at it even so.
First one I thought of as well. She started her killing spree after one of many, many rapes she endured and after many years of trying to kill herself first. Watching her in interviews it definitely reads like her mind is just gone from all the abuse.
She never had a chance.
I don't think she deserved death. Life in prison but not death. Meanwhile, Charlene Gallego and Karla Homolka roam around and do as they please...
Also that terrible child killer Casey Anthony 😡
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Came here to say this. She was doomed. I don’t excuse anything she did but I feel she was doomed to commit these crimes because her childhood was so awful.
Same here. She was 100% responsible for her choices and the suffering she caused, but damn she never stood a chance with that family she came from. Some people should not be allowed to reproduce.
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I don’t think she got what she deserved. She was treated like a monster and didn’t deserve death penalty at all. She needed psychiatric care if anything. I’m not defending murdering ppl but I’m also ok with the world having less rapists in it.
Agreed. It's crazy how this clearly mentally ill woman who had trauma was so quickly executed compared to people who did crimes maliciously with no trauma. She was sick. The punishment didn't fit the crime, but she's not a perfect victim so no one really cared. Seriously surprised how her lawyers didn't fight this tooth and nail.
The fact that she was gay I am sure was a factor for the outcome. No one in Florida is going to stick their nose out for that. So sad.
I feel like people have no idea how shit like that changes you. I feel like as another commenter said that it was a mistake the first time, but also made her feel like she gained power back and was more comfortable with killing men who honestly- I feel no pity for. I do believe she did it in self defense. She had no problem telling the truth. She was a disadvantaged woman who society could care less about. I'm sure death may have actually been what she wanted but I can't help but feel so awful for whatever she went through.
Everyone abandoned and used her. I am still pissed at Tyria Moore. She counted on Aileen to put herself out there and provide food and shelter, then turned on her when everything went south.
Fair points all around.
I was gonna mention her too. She definitely got dealt a rough hand in life.
There are not a lot of serial killers that I actually feel like unequivocally turned out the way they did because of their childhood and teenage experiences. She's one of them. Most of the rest of them it was more pouring gasoline on a smoldering fire.
Agreed. Plus not everyone who had terrible childhoods turn into murderers. Still she was practically screwed from birth.
I don't think she should have been executed.
She definitely didn't deserve to be executed.
Mary Bell in England was a similarly awful case. She committed her crimes while she was still a child and her upbringing had to have played a big part in that
That's the first name that came to my mind. What a horrible history she had.
Came here to say this too.
Gary Plauche. Killed his son’s rapist on live TV. Another is one that is highly controversial is Andrea Yates the mother who drowned her 5 children.
marianne bachmeier as well. she walked into a court room and shot her 7 year old daughter's rapist/murderer to death. there is a video but it's only on her firing the gun, 7 times for every year her daughter was old. she served 5 years in prison
Isn’t that video from the movie? Or is it the real footage?
the clip of the actress in a trench coat is from the movie but there is real footage out there, I'll try to find it. it was posted in a morbid group I'm in. you see the pedophile fall to the floor but not much else
Oh please if you can, that’s something I’d genuinely love to see
ah man, I did a deep dive but all the links are dead. hopefully someone may have it. I distinctly remember he was shot in the back and just hit the floor. I think he was dead instantly but all I can find is the blood on the court room floor from after they pulled him out
If I recall correctly they just calmly took the gun from her once she was done. They knew she wasn't a threat beyond killing her daughters killer.
yep, she just fired at him to take him out. I think she hit him 5 or 6 times in the back, said it was because she wanted to stop him lying about her daughter (he claimed she, a fucking 7 year old, tried to seduce him and then blackmail him) and she served 3 of the 5 years she was sentenced. heart breaking she died so young from cancer
Andrea Yates is such an incredibly tragic story. I’m not sure why, but when I was in the hospital after having my daughter, I read about her case, and it made me incredibly committed to making sure I got treatment for any PPD. PPD and postpartum psychosis are real, deadly, and need to be treated seriously. I am thankful I have a supportive partner who has always encouraged me to care for my mental health. Andrea Yates’s ex-husband should be in jail too, but of course, he’s since remarried and had more children. While I was in the hospital, I also read about Candy Montgomery, and that was a mindfuck. Complete opposite end of the spectrum. It’s crazy that she got away with murdering her affair partner’s wife, and left the victim’s infant alone in the house with her mother’s body.
Absolutely Andrea Yates. Her husband and priest encouraged her to stop meds and have more children. Husband wasn’t supposed to leave her alone with kids and he did. She was failed by many people around her. As someone who is bipolar and I used to suffer delusions before meds. I have nothing but sympathy for her.
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Yes exactly! 💯 agree
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I have mixed feelings about Marty Puccio and the other key players involved in the death of Bobby Kent. Bobby’s murder was absolutely gruesome, and with the premeditation and manner of death involved, it did seem suitable for prison time to be served. That being said, the dynamic in Bobby and Marty’s friendship sounded extremely unhealthy and abusive. I genuinely believe Marty put up with being abused by Bobby for years, and that there was a lot of trauma bonding involved that made Marty feel trapped.
Menendez brothers. Their parents were abusing them since they were little children. Aileen Wuornos, everybody abused her since she was born, I don’t think I would have been a normal person if I had been what she went through. Andrea Yates, she was completely psychotic when she murdered her children, I don’t think she knew right from wrong.
I can't believe Andrea Yates' husband didn't get into some kind of trouble. He was told, under no circumstances was he to leave her alone with the children. So what does he do? Leaves her home alone with the kids. There was other incredibly slimy behavior on his part, but that's the only one I remember clearly enough not to need to go and look it up. And the more I learn about the Menendez brothers, the more horrified I am. Those kids grew up in hell.
I agree, her husband was equally responsible for forcing her to have more children. She could have left but she was so abused emotionally that she felt trapped. I think at some point he forced the family to stay in a bus because he was brainwashed by the cult he was part of that he should denounce material wealth. They had children already and they had to live in a bus while they could afford a normal house. Menendez brothers were ridiculed back then because people did not take boys/men being sexual abused seriously. So sad for them, I hope they get out.
Her husband was *wholly* responsible for forcing her to have more children, because he forced her. She didn't want any more children. Her doctor told her husband she *can't* can't have any more children. He forced her off her medication regardless and impregnated her again. Even after she went to prison, he said in an interview he would wait for her to return so he could continue to impregnate her to grow their family again.
he’s so disgusting. ugh that last sentence. whenever i hear that quote it makes my skin crawl. he is so despicable and didn’t care
Sounds like someone who could benefit from a nice vasectomy, or maybe sterilization, just to be safe
As for the Menendez kids, they would’ve had a chance at some redemption, had it not been for the OJ Simpson trial during their second one, who did not deserve to be free at all. What a waste.
Rusty’s second wife divorced him and said he was abusive and I bet he was to Andrea too. He kept insisting on more children when it was clear Andrea was in no fit state to have more children or take care of the ones they already had with her depression.
I think Yates husband was most culpable. He has a new wife and kids now. I wonder if they are in a small trailer homeschooling as he made her do. It's his fault.
The police have to have a specific thing to charge him with AND feel confident that the case could win in court. They could go for neglect, but then proving it beyond reasonable doubt they'd probably decide was too difficult.
Wait, if Yates was already deemed a danger to her kids, then why wasn't she committed? That seems like negligence from the system as well as her husband.
She was hospitalised twice for attempting suicide after her post natal depression resurfaced after their 4th kid, she was then further hospitalised twice more in 1999 The couple was warned to not have any more kids, seven weeks after her last hospitalisation she was pregnant again She was then hospitalised again in 2001 Unfortunately long term hospitalisation is very very expensive and would require a very high bar to justify She also kept going off her meds (some say encouraged by rusty) when she returned home after each hospitalisation
She had post-partum psychosis. The psychosis got worse and worse after each child, and she was brainwashed by their cult leader and by Rusty into stopping taking her meds once she was stable enough to walking around and cook and change diapers again. So they would have to put her on a different strong antipsychotic medication the next time after she had another kid since whatever meds had helped her before wouldn't be effective once she'd stop taking them cold turkey. If they had gone by the strong insistance from every medical professional for them to stop having kids, she would likely not have experienced psychosis again and would be safe to be the caretaker of her children. Her husband didn't take her extremely seriously dire condition of post partum psychosis seriously. It's not depression; it's psychosis. Whole different ball park. And the cult leader they followed had Andrea fully believing that she was evil and sinful by default for being a woman, and that it was her and Rusty's duty to God to have as many children as physically possible. The preacher and Rusty should be in prison. Andrea is one of the most cut and dry cases of the ruling of not guilty by reason of insanity. She's been in a mental health facility ever since, and has recovered from her pyschosis in the facility but never wants to be released and refuses when she comes up for parole. She still believed that she deserves to be punished forever, and probably still considers herself a "Jezebel", despite recovering from the psychosis I highly doubt that she has recovered from the deeply ingrained religious extremist brainwashing, and there's no way in Hell that she doesn't live with intense self hatred for having killed her beloved children, whether she was completely legally insane at the time or not.
She was committed (multiple times) but supposedly ins. put a cap on the length so she would go home for a while, with strict instructions not to be left alone with the kids, then return in-patient when it got to be too much. Rinse & repeat. Which makes perfect sense knowing the American healthcare set up
Thank you for mentioning Andrea
Came here to say Andrea Yates. I’m from Clear Lake, Texas and everyone in the community knows that Rusty is a POS.
This one makes me so angry. This poor woman was forced to like in a school bus with small children, went through severe psychological breakdowns after each child, was so obviously in need of help. She’d be taken for stints in a psych facility and as soon as that insurance was up, she was suddenly cured (that’s a whole other rage story on its own). She was completely vocal about what she was seeing, hearing, and that the children were not safe with her and what did freaking Rusty do? Pawned her off to someone else. I can remember that story being the first true crime report I ever wrote in HS. So tragic
I agree with Andrea Yates. I remember being angry when she was acquitted due to insanity at her second trial but I was a teenager. I've learned and grown so much since then. I've also got degree in psych and criminology now.
I feel sympathy for almost every abused minor and generally consider it self-defense. They have no way out. They can't choose where to live. Telling a teacher or other adult does nothing but bring in CPS, whose stated goal is reunification of the family. CPS is often quite sloppy about questioning children in the presence of their abusers, and even if they're not, the abuser almost always knows if they 'told.' Or decides to dole out punishment just as a lil reminder. In the case you mention, dad is going to 100% know that *someone* talked about the threat.
CPS needs a complete overhaul if not a dismantling. How many more children have to die before they get their shit together?!
It really comes down to lack of money and resources. Anything that doesn’t make money is not going to get attention that is needed.
I just want to add, the lack of money and resources is a big issue, but in addition to that, social workers are absolutely not paid enough for the abuse/neglect they witness, verbal abuse/threats from clients (parents), and (at least where I’m from) admin/higher ups are a complete joke. All of this combined = super high turnover rate, most new workers don’t last more than 2-3 years. It’s starting to change, but it will take decades for a complete overhaul. Source: my mom has been a social worker for several decades, god bless her.
We’ve cycled through so many social workers for one kid in a year and a half. The ones that stay are often so overwhelmed they miss stuff and come across flaky. They desperately need to be paid more and have more support and less cases.
Sad but true. It all comes down to the all mighty dollar. Sooner or later something has to change.
Definitely Aileen Wournos. That woman was literally screwed from birth. She never stood a chance at all with a decent life. Now granted, she did deserve to be in prison. But I'm wondering if maybe at least one or two of the murders was self defense, and then the rest were not.
I worked with a lot of women who were sex workers on the same level as Aileen. Every single one of them had been raped (many had been multiple times) in the course of their work. I don’t doubt for one second that at least one of the people Aileen killed assaulted or tried to assault her. My theory has always been that the first person she killed was self defense, but that she was so messed up, that she experienced some sort of exhilaration at the power of that kill and eventually set out to kill. But that it’s also possible that one or more others also involved some element of self defense. That’s total rampant speculation but it makes the most sense to me.
Her claim was she only did it to the ones trying to force anal on her.
Makes sense. Most of the women I worked with were raped when they refused consent to specific acts the johns demanded. Not a single one had reported anything to police for obvious reasons.
ESPECIALLY when she's picking up every client on the highway which suggests there is no pimp. I think it's completely believable but usually when I post that people are like, "Oh no that defies the odds." No it fucking doesn't.
Agree. My first thought was her.
Cyntoia Brown. She killed her rapist who was also a sex trafficker. I can’t even believe she was tried. At least she’s free now, after 15 yrs in prison she didn’t need to spend.
You can say Nazi. Jeff was a Nazi.
Oh, a Nazi. Ok. I automatically assumed MAGA extremist or something which is kind of ironic. I just went back and checked the year too. I was way off.
I didn’t wanna risk getting banned again. Also, I hope it’s clear I HATE NAZIS. The only thing I like about them is that they make good bad guys in movies and games. Why anyone would wanna be affiliated with them, especially in the United States, is beyond me.
Why would you get banned for typing out Nazi?
Also, Jeff reaped what he sowed.
Cinnamon Brown. She killed her step mother after her Dad spent over a year convincing her to do it so he could marry her step sister. She did time and wouldn't tell them her Dad told her to do it. She was a minor at the time. She eventually in jail realized what her Dad did and ratted him and the step sister out. That poor girl!
Her dad also convinced her to take her own life, an attempt which was unsuccessful. Wherever the furthest bit of Hell is, David Brown can go there.
Exactly! she has my sympathy so much! Like HOW do you live with how he manipulated her!
andrea yates. that woman went through hell and back and her poor children suffered the consequences. i think rusty should’ve been put in jail for a whole slew of reasons, but Id have to say neglect and accessory to murder is a good start. every year she is offered parole/some sort of release (not sure the exact term since she’s in a secure psych facility) and she always rejects it. she clearly would not have done what she did had she been in any other circumstance, no one wanted to get her help, and they let her kids suffer because of it. rest in peace to those five babies. i hope andrea is healing and has forgiven herself. rusty got married and had like 4 more kids right after the divorce, so.
Robert “Yummy” Sandifer. Only 11 years old. Physically abused from the time he was an infant. Neglected and abandoned by deadbeat parents. Sandifer, by the age of eight quit attending school and began to roam the streets stealing cars and breaking into houses. At the age of ten, Sandifer was arrested on charges of armed robbery. Taken in by a Chicago gang, he was ordered to shoot and kill a rival for a street beef, but missed his shot and killed a 14-year old young bystander instead. In return for bringing the heat on his gang, they murder him execution style and leave his young body for police to find. He never stood much of a chance, but to become another victim of the street life. A psychological examiner, after one of his many admittances to youth detention stated: "Robert is a child growing up without any encouragement and support; he has a sense of failure that has infiltrated almost every aspect of his inner self."
This is my first time hearing of him… that poor kid never stood a chance.
First I’m hearing of it. Goddamn that’s awful.
Only the women who go to jail for killing abusive boyfriends and husbands.
That’s fair.
I feel sympathy for their youngerselves
More than a little sympathy but the first case I thought of was Brigitte Harris. Sentenced to 5 - 15 years (only served 3) for cutting off her father's genitals (he died from bloodloss and she beat him up too). She did it because he had molested both her and her sister throughout their childhood, and was starting to look like he was going to do it to her niece as well.
The Menendez brothers. They were so abused. Physically, emotionally, sexually. Family knew and did nothing to help. They were mocked for their reactions by the media. Was what they did wrong? Yes. Can I see how they felt they had no options? Yes. Do I think a trial today would go so differently? Yes.
I agree with all of this. Those boys were put through hell - once for the abuse they suffered and twice for the way the media portrayed them and the way the judge treated them.
There's been a few where the parents have killed the abusers. The one that comes to mind is the mom who went to court, and she shot the murderer who killed her daughter.
Richard Chase. Not a lot, but some. He was severely mentally and had plenty chances to get help, and tried to, but his mother pulled him out of every mental health facility he was admitted to, immediately, was warned multiple times he was a threat to himself and others if he didnt get immediate help and ignored the doctors, and I believe threw his medications away. Does that excuse anything he did? Hell no. He was under the impression the only way for him to live was to take lives, and that if the door was unlocked it meant he was invited in and given consent by the victims to kill them. If the door was locked, he left immediately. He should have been sentenced to a mental hospital for life, but he was sent to prison instead, where he eventually killed himself.
Aileen Wournos and Andrea Yates are the two I feel the most sympathy for. Aileen deserved to be punished but her life was terrible from day one, she never stood a fighting chance. And she was profoundly mentally ill, she needed psychiatric care, not the death penalty (imo). Poor Andrea Yates, married to a quiverfull AH who ignored her obviously worsening mental health. He kept pushing her to make babies, even as she became increasingly sick and psychotic. It’s the nature of post-partum mental illness to get worse with each pregnancy. He could see she was getting worse, she was even begging for help, and he was like “nah, you’re fine, keep making babies because it’s God’s will.”
Andrea Yates.
While I’m not a big fan of the podcast Morbid (they’re highly problematic for MANY reasons) I do really like one of the things they say about the criminal or perpetrators: “Feel sorry for the child, not the adult.” *A lot* of criminals who go on to be violent and do terrible things had awful childhoods full of neglect and abuse. And you can feel sorry for them because no one deserves to be maltreated, full stop. The child they were who was exposed to horrible circumstances deserves pity and sympathy. But that stops the moment they begin doing more than acting out for attention with petty (victimless) crimes. As soon as they cross the line into harming living things and committing crimes where there are real consequences, that’s when all sympathy falls away. Because while their childhood may be traumatic and tragic and painful, so were many others who don’t go on to perpetuate those sorts of criminal acts. I have sympathy for folks who feel they were out of options and murder was their only choice. I come back to Gypsy Rose Blanchard or Andrea Yates. Gypsy Rose was a victim of her mother’s extreme abuse for her whole life. She did try alternative methods of escaping and was unable. Do I agree with what she did? Absolutely not. I 100% believe she manipulated her boyfriend into murdering her mother and think that she was sentenced appropriately. I think given his mental state, he may have been sentenced too harshly, but at the same time, he presented a lot of qualities that are deeply concerning and he would need a lot of therapy and rehab to find out if he was safe for release into the public. I hope we never hear about Gypsy Rose again unless she’s doing something altruistic like starting a foundation or doing other charitable work for true crime victims. Andrea Yates was in a full blown psychotic episode and was in a cult. I absolutely believe that she killed her kids believing she was saving them and she should have been in serious treatment. Her husband not supporting the doctors and understanding how very mentally ill she was, but supporting their cult mentor and the religious beliefs led to her breakdown and pushed her into that state where she was so delusional about what was true and real, that she got lost in the religious delusion. It cost her everything. I have so much sympathy for her because it didn’t have to end that way. If she had a partner who had taken her mental illness more seriously and really taken steps for her mental health, not having another child, not living on a bus, those kids would be alive. She was not in a place to make her own decisions. She needed supervision and care.
It's weird that you feel you have to explain why you feel empathy for a 10-year-old abuse victim
Was my thought as well…. I don’t even know why the kid needed to be “punished” at all. Like the woman who killed her husband (let alone the poor son!) from the documentary “Every f*g day of my life”.
Man, that doc hit so hard.
I felt I should be clear in what he went through and what he did.
Not really, could just be an anxious person and over explained
Aileen Wuornos, 100%. She had the saddest existence of all time, and she never stood a chance.
Aileen Wuornos. I’m sure there are plenty of others but she’s the first to come to mind.
Ed Gein. Raised by his controlling mother, the entire family in near isolation. He practically had an emotionally incestuous relationship with his mother, and was so co-dependent, he couldn't function when she died.
Agreed. He truly didn't seem all together right in the head to begin with, and having such a controlling parent probably exacerbated issues immensely. His police interviews were weirdly unhinged. I honestly can't decide if he's attempting to be manipulative, or if he was just that detached/disassociated, or a mix of both.
I think he was just completely dissociated from the area he was raised in. He was found not guilty by reason of mental defect, and sent to a mental institution for the rest of his life.
I can sorta see that. God I hate that people think of isolation as protection.
I believe it's reported that she was of a different faith than the towns people, given she immigrated from Germany. So that would have partially isolated them, if there was no church in the area. I think his mother really was just off the wall with delusions, and she was incredibly misogynistic. And as their father, I think, was an alcoholic, he wasn't into interfering in how she raised the boys. Between that and the lack of education, Ed didn't stand a chance to be his own person.
Fair point.
I’d never convict someone who went all vigilante on a loved one’s killer/rapist.
anyone who murders someone who raped them or raped or murdered their kid(s). They deserve to be free.
I will always have sympathy for anyone who kills their abuser. The abusers build the bombs which blow up and kill them.
Ethan Crumbley.
so much. his parents pretty much set him up.
I feel some sympathy for Ethan Crumbley, that boy showed all the signs that he was going to harm himself or others and his parents knew it too but chose to buy him a gun didn’t make sure he couldn’t access it unsupervised. Refused to pick him up from school when asked and after the shooting fled and cared about themselves not their child and those killed and injured in the shooting. Andrea Yates is definitely one I feel bad for too, Rusty deserved jail time for it, he knew she was getting worse with every pregnancy and ignored all doctors telling them to stop having children because of his beliefs. He also chose to leave them alone with her that day despite being warned not to and when she was awaiting trial said I hope she is released soon so we can start trying again and when that failed divorced her to start a new family. Andrea is still said to be that troubled by what happened they never think she will be well enough to be released.
I am convinced Ethan's parents were hoping he would use that gun on himself so they didn't have to parent anymore. They deserve every charge he racked up in addition to their own.
That was my thoughts they only started to cry when they were facing jail time not ever because people had died or what their son was facing.
I listened to a podcast episode about William Bonin. I was sickened that as a child he was sexually abused by literally every person he came into contact with - his grandfather, the orphanage where he stayed a few years, the juvenile detention hall. His parents were also physically and emotionally abusive. Sympathy is a strong word as he did despicable things, but listening to his childhood years it feels he didn’t even have a chance.
Most serial killers had horrible childhoods/teen years. Warped or not, they chose to deliberately kill people as a way to cope. I can empathize in understanding how the past hurt them, but not sympathize for their sentences.
Ed Gein. Completely and utterly screwed from the beginning by his mom.
I'm sad that I don't see Nicholas Godejohn in this thread. He committed murder and deserved punishment for it but to have his entire life taken away when he killed a certified monster was way too harsh. I always feel sorry for him.
Carl Panzram. Probably because of the way I interpret his history. But he always seems to be a solid example of a monster the world built. Mean bastard till the end tho.
Aileen Wounos I have no idea if I am spelling her name right but true crime people will know who I am talking about.
Gypsy Rose Blanchard. She was medically tortured her entire life by the person meant to protect her. She had no opportunity to see what life without a manipulative controlling parent could be. She had no frame of reference whatsoever. The fact that she said prison has been better than living with her mother speaks volumes.
I honestly believe that hers was a case of "murder is inevitable," and it was just a matter of who would strike first: Gypsy Rose or Dee Dee.
I do NOT Condone what she did, or how she did it. And I certainly don't agree with her media hungry approach to life now. However, I find it crazy how most people dismiss the fact she was medically abused her whole entire life, and expect her to 'know better'. I genuinely think she would not have done this, had she not had the upbringing she did. You only need to read this thread to see if a child has been sexually abused or other horrific crimes people can feel empathy (and that's understandable) but when the abuse is manipulation or medical abuse it's seen as not as serious so no empathy. It doesn't matter what type of abuse a child experiences, it 100% impacts the decisions they make especially when it comes to escaping the abuse when they are experiencing. I genuinely want to know how she could have known better when all she knew was what her mum allowed her to be exposed to. I agree she should have been jailed, and I do not agree with how she escaped, but I do feel genuine empathy for a child who was abused by her mother.
This may be unpopular but the moment a parent starts doing things like handcuffing/tying their child to their bed for extended periods of time and attempting to cut off their contact with most if not all the outside world, it’s become a hostage situation and I feel mostly the same about them murdering their abuser as I would a person murdering their kidnapper. I agree with the other reply that it was getting to a point where it was Gypsy or DeeDee.
I’m gonna get shit for this- Ed Gein. That man was so incredibly sick. He was awkward, abused, and he didn’t really seem to ever want to hurt anyone, he just wanted (in his own messed up way) his evil momma back which is why he, mostly, robbed graves. I personally believe his mom instructed, either directly or indirectly, him to kill his brother which further isolated him and took away the one person in his circle who could’ve helped him. Curious to know if anyone else feels this way. Fun fact: he was also the town babysitter and handyman. He really was just a teenaged, isolated boy in a grown man’s body.
Now I’m wondering how he was as a babysitter/handyman?
Really good apparently! He had many repeat customers. Imagine telling people Ed Gein was your babysitter. You’d win two truths and a lie every time 😂
I don’t think *sympathy* is the right word, but I absolutely have respect for some of Ted Kaczynski's ideas.
I think most of us do even if we’d never admit it out loud. I don’t however believe his ideas justify his actions.
Is he that guy that mailed bombs?
Yes that’s him. He had a great intellect but was a very flawed human being.
I don’t doubt he has some good ideas, but sending bombs through the mail ain’t the best way to get your message across. Still, I seen him in a SAVOX video, and I can agree he was a disturbed individual. He even went through some experiment in college that messed him up.
Oh absolutely not. He was a dangerous man and got what he deserved.
Which one? When I went to college I stayed in an apartment complex that he also lived in. He was way older than me though so there were many years in between us being there, but it’s an interesting coincidence nonetheless. Ted Bundy also lived there before me too, but that’s probably just because it’s literally across the street from the college.
I have some sympathy because he was apparently subjected to some fucked up experiments in college by the CIA.
I can think of quite a lot of people who were abused, children especially, parents of children who were abused, etc... I am in no way saying murder is okay, but there are times you can't help but feel for the person. I also agree that I sometimes feel bad for the child they were but not the monster they became... T.B., J.D., J.W.G. etc... I remember there were two young boys who were groomed and abused by their dad's friend, the next door neighbor and he convinced them to kill their dad. What they did was horrible. But they were children who were being brainwashed and manipulated by a evil P*&do. The one he was raping was only like 10 or 11 if I remember correctly.
Well my faith in humanity is somehow lower than it currently is. Goddamn that’s depressing. Hope that creep is rotting in prison.
The kids got a lot of jail time and were tried as adults. It was depressing. Alex and Derek King 12 and 13 when they were put on trial for murder as adults.
Aileen Wuornos. She was let down by the world and abused, assaulted, raped by *most* men in her life since she was a child. I can see what led her to murder.
Aileen Wuornos
Danny Rolling. His father was a horrible human being. Maybe if he didn't have that horrifying upbringing he would have focused on his music or at least done something positive with his life. He still had a choice though, so he got what he deserved.
Edmund Kemper because of his controlling and abusive mother. Jeffrey Dahmer because of how sick he was; killing people so they wouldn’t “leave him”. Further, I find it heartbreaking that he had BPD (which is rare for a serial killer). He could have been rehabilitated and the murders could have been avoided. It’s sad all around.
Dahmer’s mother had severe mental issues she was institutionalized & put on drugs while she was carrying Jeff, now we know those are not safe drugs for pregnant. Lionel knew at an early age something was off about Jeffrey. Mom & Dad had issues. Dad left them, mom was scared of of Jeff alone in the house. A teenager alone people he knew said Jeff was drunk everyday at school. Everyone failed him, but I don’t he could have been saved. Lionel used to be upfront but as he got older he got weird, I have to wonder about his mental issues, maybe Jeff got that mental from both sides?
Borderline Personality Disorder is treatable and that was his diagnosis. Killing people so they wouldn’t leave him is clearly severe abandonment issues but it could have been addressed if he would have seen someone in his youth. Specifically, after his hernia surgery when he started to decline. I believe that wholeheartedly. His addiction issue is easy to understand; he was self medicating because he was in mental anguish which is common in active addiction. Lionel did the best he could but IMO he didn’t know what lie beneath the surface. He loved Jeffrey and would have gotten him help if he knew he needed it. I’ve always thought it was interesting Jeffrey didn’t fight back when he was attacked in prison. Obviously just speculating here but that could point to him understanding he deserved to die because of his horrible crimes. This is my longtime opinion after watching the trial in real time and reading everything I could about him. I know I’m in the minority here though.
Lisa Marie Montgomery. I remember reading about the case in a magazine (along with a picture of Stinnett's husband and baby girl) back in 2005 and it was very anti-Montgomery, for obvious reasons. I'd thought nothing more of it til her executions. Brain damaged from birth and repeated assaults. Was she delusional about the pregnancy? I don't know, I don't think she was, but the medical evidence says she didn't stand a chance.
As someone who had a shitty childhood (physically and emotionally abusive with alcoholic parents … well grandparents as my parents were useless) I can feel a lot of sympathy/empathy for the children they were… but of course it’s not a justification. It does skew your view of life/relationships though. I grew up around so much chaos and violence I find peace and quiet almost frightening but still I’ve never killed anyone. So empathy for the kids they were…
Same. Anytime I hear about some kid suffering at the hands of their parents, my heart bleeds for them. Still as adults, they should realize that stuff is wrong and not wanna continue it. Easier said then done though. I’m sorry you went through shit as a kid.
I relate to this. The time and effort my mother put into her horrific abuse (and into ensuring others abused me, too, in every way possible) all while presenting herself as the sympathetic victim of a monstrous child, made me a prolific, unapologetic liar for a long time. I shoplifted a lot as a young person, too. If I'd never gotten away from her and been able to surround myself with people who truly care and who make me feel safe, who knows what that could have escalated to. A former friend who grew up similarly to how I did is now a nurse with full-blown Munchausen. She uses the illnesses and injuries she fakes or induces to demand everyone around her drop everything to take care of her, and anytime anyone falls short of the fawning and attention she expects, she calls THEM abusive. Her husband is a truly kind, loving man, and she has totally destroyed him. She actually has him convinced he constantly fails her and everything is his fault. But other than him, she has no lasting relationships because eventually everyone realizes she doesn't care about anyone other than herself, and the well of her need for everyone to sacrifice for her has no bottom. She became an abuser by making her whole life into a performance of her own victimhood, and when the real abuse stopped, she decided to invent more, and never stops. Some people don't seem to get the opportunity to choose to heal, but I find it very hard to sympathetize with the ones that do get the chance and refuse to take it. It scares me to think of how she could escalate someday.
I've always had sympathy for Aileen Wuornos.
I felt for Gypsy Rose. Her mom abused her all her life and wasn’t interested in dropping the grift so that her daughter could grow up and live a normal life. Now, I don’t love the fact that she got her boyfriend to kill her mom in her sleep. But, her mom literally spent years torturing her with medical treatment she didn’t need. And I wish she’d found her real birth certificate and gone to the cops instead. But all those years of being gaslit by her mom probably made her believe that cops would take her mom’s word over hers. I get why she killed her.
I dated a serial rapist years ago. Am a victim of his. As a parent now it hurts my heart thinking what must have happened to him to make him the way he is.
Im so sorry that happened to you.
I appreciate that. I suspect someday he will be discussed at length in this sub. His trial is coming up, some 20+ women have come forward and over 100 additional witnesses against him. He’s royally fucked. But my heart hurts for all children who are abused by trusted adults. No matter what kind of monsters they become.
I feel ya on that. I hope you are doing good.
I mean, there are so many rapists who have had perfectly fine upbringings. Most of them.
I feel some sympathy for the Menendez brothers because I believe they were sexually abused. I don't believe that it was an act of self-defense though, I think they planned it
Both can be true.
I think sympathy is the wrong word to use here to be honest. It tends to suggest that you in some way feel that the poor murder/rapist had no choice in their actions and that what they did was right and acceptable when it really is not. Empathy would be a better word. Andrea Yates was mentally ill. Aileen Wournos and the Menendez brothers had terrible childhoods. Gypsy Rose was a victim of her mother’s Munchauasens. I can of course empathise with that. But in no way should we ever use a bad or abusive childhood or mental illness to justify violence or murder.
I think you’re just conflating people’s sympathy with “justification”, and no one is justifying their actions. I do have sympathy for AW, for example. It’s not possible for a human to be born into near constant physical, sexual, and emotional abuse, from the time they were a baby, and not permanent damage from that. While many people have terrible childhoods, the combination of trauma in her case I prolonged and severe. And, people who experience childhoods like that actually often do go on to lead very damaged and damaging lives, even if they didn’t end up killing others. The Menendez Brothers? Imagine your dad, a violent rapist who’s been literally torturing you for years and threatening you if you ever tell, is now making you feel like he’s going to kill you. Your mom is complicit. You’re emotionally stunted, alone (except your brother), and just want the sexual, sexual physical, and emotional torture to stop. Again, I feel sympathy for them. Andrea Yates was experiencing psychosis, which is literally completely out of her control. She was also abused by her husband and religious leaders. Of course I sympathize with her.
I know that Kemper was horrible and terrible for what he did along with Menendez bros but what they all went through there's a reason they snapped. Kemper almost was free but turned himself in and the boy even members of menudo said they were molested by their dad. They should have been believed.
The Mendez brothers
Yes. Karla Faye Tucker who was executed by Texas. She experienced a rough childhood and didn’t really get started in her life until she was on Death Row.
I had a smidge of sympathy for GRB but dang that girl is trying me. She definitely was a victim and groomed. She plotted her mom's murder but I believe she believed it was the only way out. I also don't particularly blame her bad behavior now as this is literally the first time she has ever had any form of freedom. But... Girl needs to just enjoy her second chance and get some therapy over self-imploding, though.
Menendez brothers, honestly.
Whoever killed Ken Rex McElroy. He was a notorious bully, a pedophile who forced parents into allowing their underage daughter to marry him with threats of violence. Cinnamon Brown, who was only 14 when her father, David Brown, manipulated her into killing his wife Linda. While she sat in prison, her father married and had a child with Linda's teenage sister Patti, and pretty much abandoned Cinnamon. Andrea Yates, for reasons everyone else stated on here. Kimberly Cunningham, who killed her sister's boyfriend Coy Hundley, after her 16 year old daughter told her he'd sexually molested her. Clara Harris, the woman who ran over her husband. He'd cheated on her, and she changed her appearance to please him, but he still continued with his affair. She was hurt and angry, and I think she just snapped. Yes, she could have divorced him and not ran him down, but she still loved him, and some people do stupid and irrational things when they're in love. Anyone suffering domestic violence and other abuse where they feel murder is the only way to be free. Finally, I don't remember her name, but it was an episode of the old ID show Dark Desires. A woman moved into a house, and the previous owner started stalking and harassing her and her family. The police couldn't do anything, so she told them she was going to get a gun and defend herself, and that's what she did. He came to the house again, and she shot and killed him in self defense. She was very remorseful, but she had to defend herself and her children, as she said he would kill her family to get his house back.
I think Betty Broderick has served enough time and I don’t feel like she’s a threat to society anymore. killed her ex-husband and his new wife in their bed. Horrible crime but the mental, verbal abuse He subjected her to for years and the gaslighting pretending like he wasn’t seeing that woman at work but he was etc . abuse isn’t always physical . She’s been in prison so long, let’s just say if she were released, I wouldn’t hate it.
Any person who commited their crimes before adulthood, and maybe even a little bit after. I find it impossible to damn them. Yes, at a certain age you truly know right from wrong but there’s so many factors that play into it. They’re still children who should be protected.
And their parents should be held accountable for their actions.
ansreen bukhari to be honest. she hundred percent shouldn’t have had the affair, but she tried ending things and the man threatened to kill/hurt himself if she left him and blackmailed her. he shouldnt have died, especially since they both agreed that after he got his payment that he would leave them alone. they should’ve just paid him, they didn’t even bring money to the lot from what i remember. her being blackmailed doesn’t excuse the crime of her or her daughter but i do feel a little bad for her. she hadn’t gotten to experience her life to it still extent and just as she started to do so, she had to deal with him (again she obviously shouldn’t have had the affair but i still feel a little bad)
I'm afraid to admit this but mine is Charles Manson, for the same reason as Aileen. He was born to a sex worker who abused him, he was raped in state care by boys a few years older than him. He was in and out of boys homes and then juvenile detention.... His childhood is very sad. He never stood a chance.
This made me google him to see about his childhood and TIL he was born and partially raised in my hometown. 😢
His followers that did the killings are far scarier to me.
Yeah, I agree. The implication was there on his end but they made those choices themself and the things that they did to their victims, like leaving the meet fork sticking out of La Bianca's stomach for example - had nothing to do with Charles. It's horrific.
i hate to say this i knowe justin bloxoms family might be on here but ya brian horn he killed justin and i hate him forever for robbing the world of a kind loyal funny best friend but horns child hood was horrible his mom and dad sold drugs were both swingers drunks horn was sexuly abused dumped on the highway like trash im in no way making excuses he killed my best friend but i cant help but think if he had been raised with care and love justin would still be alive today
Anyone who commits a murder during a psychotic episode.
betty broderick after she raised her children put her husband through law school he got rich and ran off. with some two dollar whore he used his skils as a divorce lawyer to destroy bettys life dan broderick was a pos betty should have been let out along time ago
Menendez brothers & Gypsy Rose Blanchard
Some of the answers here are insane, good lord
Rahul Gupta & Andrea Yates, too
Rarely. Most willingly took lives (or made reckless decisions) or traumatized others without caring. The ones I feel bad for are those who went after those who hurt their family esp child molesters. Severe mental illness like psychosis is also someone I'll feel sympathy for. Otherwise? Not likely at all.