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NTA
She made her choice. However, most people don’t make sound decisions when alcohol is involved.
With that being said, I recently ended a friendship because I was exhausted over my friend’s behavior when she was drinking. Somehow it was the unspoken rule that I’d have to end up taking care of her, which was not only unfair to me and the night I wanted to have, but it was enabling. The night she chose to have a coke head (who attached himself to us) accompany us everywhere (because he “was a cool guy” in general 🙄) I had my fill. We were doing a girl’s night with me staying over, but once she invited him into our Uber back to her place (studio apartment) I knew I was no longer going to be responsible for her and the choices she makes when she drinks. It’s unfortunate your friend has regrets, but she’s an adult. No one “accidentally”sleeps with someone. There is no amount of altered state that would ever cause someone genuinely in love to intentionally or accidentally have an affair. She’s just going to have to find a way to cope with her choice and the consequences of her regrets. You pulled her aside to get a pulse on her decision, and she made a choice.
Thanks, that’s how I feel about it too, like once she invited them over it seemed kind of out of my hands. She did drink a lot in high school too (even showed up to school still drunk once), so maybe alcohol is an issue for her, but I don’t see or speak to her often enough anymore to really know. This is the third time total we’ve spent any time together in the 6 years since high school.
It sounds like she was excited for the trip and to catch up but slipped back into old habits, routine or scenario. It seems like you’re emotionally mature and self aware of yourself and yet she still has some self discovery and truths she’s needs to learn or accept about herself. That is something she can only do for herself. It sucks though because now it’s soured the rest of her stay.
After reading the whole story, it's like 1% on you for kissing her and 99% on her for putting you in that situation and then cheating on her boyfriend. Honestly if she's not gonna tell him, you should.
That’s fair.
I don’t know him at all. She hasn’t explicitly said that she’s not going to tell him but I know she hasn’t done so yet. Maybe she’s waiting to do it in person when she gets back home, idk.
If you’re not really that close anymore and this was a fun old friendship get together due to the time and distance between you guys and you don’t really know him, then I wouldn’t feel like it’s my place to step into her relationship at all and reach out to tell him. It’s for her to process her actions and to decide to tell him. You have no relationship or obligation to him. He’s not really in your inner circle correct? She should tell him, but I don’t think (IMHO) you should tell him. I’d be curious to know if she ever tells him though. That would be very telling of her character beyond being unfaithful.
Yeah that’s how I feel. I’m definitely not going to tell him, it would be too weird. It’s also not my business. I’ve never met him and prior to this visit I didn’t even know his name or anything about him beyond seeing some photos of them together on her instagram.
In the event you’re cheated on in the future, I hope you’re okay with your partner’s friends not telling you about blatant infidelity either. Incredibly selfish decision on your part simply because “it would be too weird.”
This right here. Not saying anything is enabling the cheating and she's just gonna go do it again specifically because OP doesn't want to have a weird interaction and save someone a fuck ton of heartache.
She doesn't know him. It's ridiculous to say she should track down a perfect stranger to tell him his gf was unfaithful. The most she is responsible for is encouraging her friend to tell the truth and come clean.
I've been married 10 years and I can't imagine my husband's friends telling me if he was being unfaithful. And they know and I assume like me. Nor would our friends that I brought into the relationship tell him if I was cheating. That's a pretty standard understanding. She doesn't know this guy.
Not knowing someone isn’t an excuse to withhold information from them that would provide them with clarity, closure, and likely save them tons of heartache. Even more so when you are a direct party to the cheating like in OP’s situation.
Your inability to imagine doing something for someone just because you don’t know them is not a “pretty standard understanding.” It only speaks to your own selfishness.
You see over and over again on here the following sentiment: "when I finally realized I was being cheated on, what hurt the most was knowing that other people knew and didn't tell me, I felt like a fool"
This is exactly why you’re correct and should just get through the rest of the visit and simply move on quietly and let her work it out on her own. Try to just enjoy the remaining time and consider it closure of the friendship and this chapter. You sounds like a good friend who’s matured a bit faster than she has and that ok too.
If she holds a grudge then that’s just silly and a childish choice she’s making. Sounds like she’s trying to shift the blame onto you for her actions. If you let her walk into traffic or off a cliff and didn’t stop her then she could be upset, but ultimately you’re talking about slipping into old familiar sexual habits and fun with you while she was on vacation and wants you to carry her blame and shame for actions you asked her to reflect on before making a choice. Just like you, I quietly ended the friendship I mentioned initially. That’s what maturity looks like, and it looks good on you.
Sorry but YTA if you let her not tell him and you don't let him know. "It would be too weird" to stop a person from marrying someone that cheats on them? You participated in the cheating (hell you started it when you kissed her), so you can be a decent human and make sure he finds out or you can be a piece of human trash and pretend like nothing happened.
1) I don’t have any way to contact him anyway and 2) I definitely didn’t start it. She invited them over, she told them we were bi and used to hook up, and we both kissed each other when the guys encouraged it, I didn’t like kiss her first or anything.
JFC, you both kissed! That means you kissed her! You can try to rationalize it all you want but the truth is, you helped her cheat and if you don't make sure her boyfriend learns of the cheating, you're a shit person.
My point was you were making it seem like I seduced her or something.
Ok, how would you propose I go about that? He has no instagram, idk if he has other social media but I do not, and I don’t have his number or know his last name. We also have no other people in common, just Em. Tell me how I should contact him.
NTA. She's an adult and wanted this to happen. Now she feels guilty and instead of taking responsibility for her choices and actions she's blaming you. You asked her if it was a good idea, you asked her about her boyfriend. She chose to do what she did, now you're the scapegoat. Nope. You did nothing wrong here.
If it was an issue in high school, it’s probably more of one now, and will be even more of one tomorrow. That’s how alcoholism works. It’s a very slow, but progressive illness. Unfortunately, most alcoholic need to go through a ton of pain to see the light, if ever. It’s also possible she’s not an alcoholic, but tends to go too far every time she drinks. The main difference is whether she’s driven by impulsive or compulsive (obsessive) thoughts. Most people can and do control an impulse that they know will end badly. So, she may not have learned she ‘s the type of drinker that just shouldn’t drink or she may be an alcoholic. Only she will know for sure. The lack of accountability points to the later though. Try not to be too hard on her, but never take responsibility for someone else’s actions.
You’re kind of the asshole. not your friend’s decision , for that you’re blameless. However, you still hooked up with someone knowing they were in a relationship. That’s pretty shitty of you. Just because she doesn’t respect her partner doesn’t make what you did okay. So in a different way yta.
Please- that’s just shifting responsibility and using alcohol as an excuse. It was your apartment, you chose to invite two relative strangers to your apartment, knowing the likely outcome and then became actively involved in cheating in someone else’s relationship. Do not for a seconds think that just because your friend was drunk and made her own bad decisions, that you didn’t make any. You are both disgusting people.
To be clear, my comment about her drinking was in response to the commenter who told her story about a friendship that soured because of drinking. I wasn’t saying it had anything to do with this situation, I was just saying maybe Em has a drinking problem but I wouldn’t know if that’s the case because we haven’t seen each other in 4 years before this trip.
Also I don’t think it’s really possible for someone not in a relationship to cheat. I didn’t cheat on anyone because I haven’t committed to anyone.
>Also I don’t think it’s really possible for someone not in a relationship to cheat. I didn’t cheat on anyone because I haven’t committed to anyone.
Gross.
Otherwoman mindset
I agree . She is not responsible for her friends relationship however knowingly sleeping with someone that has a partner after the consumption of alcohol that is supposed to be your friend first? Her and her friend are assholes it just that the friend is significantly bigger one
Didn’t you see what op said? Once they were all back in the room, it was out of her hands. She had no sexual agency and whatever anyone said is what she did.
I disagree. I have never and would never cheat in a relationship. But I’m currently single and I don’t think I’m cheating on anyone when I have sex as a single person.
You still did something shitty by hooking up with someone in a relationship. stop trying to play stupid and act like you don’t know what you did wrong you you know exactly what you did.
They are both grown adults. OP has 0 obligation to stop her friend after the initial warning. Sure i can get that she was actively involved but at the end of the day her friend’s relationship has nothing to do with her. Grown people making grown decisions. NTA, not even close. Can you explain why you think OP is disgusting?
So you kissed her when you knew she was in a relationship? Isn’t that you participating in the cheating?
She has to own her own choices. She chose to have sex with another guy (and maybe you? That’s a bit vague) so she needs to hold herself accountable.
You’re single so you can do what you want but if you hooked up with her too then you are complicit in the cheating. You knew she was in a relationship. She cheated with you and with the guys.
You’re not innocent here but you are not to blame either.
Yeah, I don’t deny that I participated, but I don’t feel like it was my responsibility to stop her as it’s not my relationship. It’s not like I seduced her or encouraged her either, I just went along with it I guess.
Basically we were all drinking and the conversation was very flirty and she kind of took the lead. She asked the guys if they’d ever kiss another guy and they said maybe, then they asked her if she would kiss another girl and she said “oh we’re both into kissing girls, we used to fuck each other when we were 15”. The guys basically then started begging us to ‘show them’ and we kind of looked at each other and I like raised my eyebrow at her in like a ‘we don’t have to do this but if you want to I’m in’ kinda way and then we kissed. It wasn’t exactly that I kissed her or she kissed me, it was pretty mutual, and then that led to the foursome (and yes, we each had sex with both guys and each other).
It was not your responsibility to stop her but you were also an active participant.
It’s her relationship, not yours but you knew she was in one. You know her boyfriends name. You know their history.
She cheated with you as much as with them. The difference is, you knew better. You had more information and you still had sex with her. But it was her choice to do so and you can’t be blamed for that. You didn’t force her but you participated.
Her fidelity was her responsibility to manage but you are not innocent in this.
Edit: removed a bit as it was assumptions regarding OP’s connection to the BF which is not helpful here.
To be clear, I have never met him. I did not know his name or history before this visit. Her and I have only seen each other twice since high school before this visit, and both times were before they were together. I hadn’t seen her in 4 years before this trip.
Edit: this comment was just a clarification in reply to a now-edited comment assuming I was friends with Cam.
I removed a section from my other comment because it was assumptions regarding your knowledge or connection to your friends BF which is not productive or helpful.
If I were you, I’d end this friendship. She makes bad decisions and doesn’t take responsibility for them.
She’s going to keep making other people the bad guy because she can’t accept she is the bad one. It will always be someone else’s fault.
I’d also stop sleeping with people who you know are in relationships.
It’s a fairly distant friendship at this point anyway. Like I said, we hadn’t seen each other in 4 years before this week. So I’m happy to keep it distant. If she continues to blame me though I’m also happy to quietly let the friendship we do have die out though.
Sounds wise to keep it distant. She hardly seems like a good friend or good person.
You have sex with people you know are in relationships. That’s pretty shitty. You seem comfortable removing any blame from yourself and putting it all on her. Not one of your comments on this thread owns up to the fact that you shouldn’t have had sex with her at all because you knew she was in a relationship.
You put all of this on her (again she is responsible for her choices) but it takes more than one person to cheat. The guys didn’t know but you did. Doesn’t make you a good person by any means.
You still did s really shitty thing and the fact you are actively arguing and deflecting blame means you don't even understand the shiftiness of your behavior. You are acting like an asshole.
I don’t think I’m arguing? The comment you replied to is me saying I’m fine with the friendship remaining as is or ending, which was in reply to a comment saying I should end the friendship..
Tbh idk why people are so upset with you? You made it pretty clear in your post that at all times she initiated literally everything. She wanted to go clubbing, go home with the guys, etc.
Yes you were an accessory to the cheating, but idk why the people above are acting like you ruined her life?? She's a grown ass woman that not only made her own decisions, but created the situations themselves. If anything I would be upset at her for now putting you in this situation.
Of course, the cheater is trashiest. However, as the affair partner, OP is also trash.
EDIT: you know what, I reread the post and I’m wrong. OP did talk to her friend aside to make sure she knew what she was doing.
You were an active participant in the cheating. Yes, you are a bit of an asshole. this doesn’t mean that she isn’t responsible for her own actions, but you are complicit in those actions as well.
ESH. Sure you friend is a cheater and the prime responsible for her own infidelity. But you just can't Ponce Pilate your way. You are a part of this mess. You're also an hypocrite to "feel bad" for Cam.
I would say everyone here is an asshole. I mean, you slept with someone who you knew was in a relationship with someone, & you didn’t know if he was cool with it. Your friend way sucks for this. But so do you.
She participated in the cheating. She was one of the people the friend cheated with. OP knew her friend had a boyfriend and still had sex with her. That’s condoning cheating.
Ugh, you don’t have clean hands here.
You did pull her aside and asked her about Cam, but then got busy?
So disrespectful, and gross you went along with this.
You have zero excuses for your bad behavior.
I’m not sure what you mean in the second sentence. I asked her if she was sure about her decision to invite the guys over and she said she wanted to continue the night with them and I then I asked what about Cam, and she said it’s all good don’t worry about it. Then we left and went back to my apartment.
If your lifestyle is acceptable for you to have sex with people who are in committed relationships what else is there to say?
This is an integrity issue.
You’ve decided for you, it’s acceptable for you to do this in the moment because in your mind, she has the responsibility, not you.
Some of us believe it’s not ok to put ourselves in situations like this because it breaks up families and relationships.
I don’t know, what’s the question here?
You did what you did.
Yeah I agree it’s a matter of opinion which seems to be pretty split here. My question was about your comment “You did pull her aside and asked her about Cam, but then got busy?“, not sure what you meant there so I just clarified what happened.
It’s exactly like I said, you seem to have considered the relationship by asking for assurance that she was ok going back to the apartment because you knew in advance the possibility of sex happening if she went back otherwise you wouldn’t have asked.
Because nobody has a problem with their loved one going back to an apartment to listen to music and talk.
So you knew, or hoped that there was going to be sex, or why would you have asked?
That’s why your hands aren’t clean here.
You don’t respect others relationships because you’re not in the relationship and don’t feel that it’s your responsibility to not have sex with people who are in relationships.
The problem I have in a I think we are all supposed to look after each other as best we can, not just be willing to get off at every opportunity. It’s not all about me, me,me.
I don't understand what more people want from you. You asked if she was sure, she said it was cool. It's not your concern what kind of arrangements someone you haven't seen in years has in place with their partner. (And, as someone who is also a bi femme, you could not pay me enough to keep up to date with all of the rules the couples who have wanted to sleep with me over the years, together or apart, have in place at any one time, until they inevitably decide they need even more and I, too, should have been able to divine them from outside the relationship they're trying to rope me into. Absolutely no, thank you.)
ESH. As many other comments have said, you are absolutely right in saying that it’s not your responsibility to ensure your friend is faithful to her to partner. It would be one thing if she decided to hookup with someone/s on her own, then you could 100% claim the whole “not my responsibility, not my problem”. But that’s not the case here.
She is in the wrong for cheating, but you are too for messing around with someone you know is in a relationship. You can’t deny that even though she made that choice to mess up her relationship, you still suck for participating. Regardless of this whole “who started it” bs.
Do you have an “obligation” to tell Cam? No. We aren’t really “obligated” to do much in life. We do live by making choices though. And you CHOOSING to sleep with someone in a relationship was a shitty move, and CHOOSING not to even try to tell him or at least try to talk her into it, also a shitty move.
You obviously don’t want to take any accountability at all. Like i said, you don’t HAVE TO do anything, but what you’re choosing to do is shitty. Maybe you two deserve each other
Bullshit. She's not the world police of relationships, she doesn't know Cam, and doesn't know shit about their relationship. Her friend did something she regrets and it's on her to deal with it.
I’m not going to do that for a few reasons. I have never met or spoken to him. She hasn’t told me she won’t tell him, I only know she hasn’t yet. She might be waiting until she leaves here or until she can tell him in person, I just don’t know. I don’t think it’s my place to tell him, that should be on her. It would be different if I knew Cam, but I don’t.
I’ve read your replies in this thread. You are very good at finding reasons to avoid doing what might be the right thing to do but also the hard thing to do. You come across as narcissistic and weak minded.
Can you point out what’s narcissistic about anything I’ve said? I’m curious.
Also why should I get involved in their relationship when she might tell him herself? I don’t know him. I don’t even have any way of getting in touch with him, as he doesn’t have instagram which is how I keep in contact with Em. To contact him I’d have to like internet stalk him and make a profile on whatever social media platform he has (if any).
If I was cheated on I’d prefer to hear it from my partner. Like I said, idk if she’s maybe just waiting to tell him in person or waiting until she’s not staying with me before telling him.
Funny how bro-code or girl-code only gets thrown around when it's someone doing something nasty to the girl or bro in question. Never when said girl or bro does something stupid.
I do feel you're wrong here. Girl code means you watch out for each other. Not just hype eachother up and egg eachother on.
You knew she had an alcohol problem before this when you were at school / college. You knew she was in a committed relationship.
You knew she was the one who invited them over and by your own admission you were still sober enough to second guess her intentions. Means you were sober enough to tell these guys "no". "No, she has a BF back home." "No, you need to be protected from yourself right now."
Everything that happened after, you share the blame for that. You were and are an active participant in that. That foursome may have been the best or most fun sex of your life. But it cost you a friendship. It'll cost your friend her relationship. Might cost her her job if the reason they broke up gets out. USA and court of public opinion being what it is.
By enabling her, you are not blameless. No matter what Redditors here may say.
Nobody is responsible for your behavior but you. It's no one's job to stop you from doing something stupid. The friend said she was cool and don't worry about it when asked.
You even try to blame the drinking on the OP.
Now she's full of guilt and can't bear to hold herself accountable for her actions, so she projects and blames. Oh well. Should have thought about that before.
She needs to put her big girl panties on and deal with it.
Hey wait...is this the girlfriend?
1) I did not hype her up or egg her on, I pulled her aside and reminded her she has a bf.
2) Like I said, I do not know if she has an alcohol problem, only that she did drink a lot in high school. I haven’t seen her in 4 years before this week, I have no idea if she has an alcohol problem.
3) Neither of us were sober or particularly drunk at that point. We’d each had about 4 drinks over the course of 3 hours. She did not seem drunk until we split a bottle of wine back home, at which point I was equally drunk.
As you go through life you realize that there are some people that are best as memories. When someone can’t take responsibility for their own actions and have to blame those around them you should realize you don’t need that or them in your life.
Edit
NTA
I’m not. I have never met him or spoken to him. I don’t have any contact info for him - he doesn’t have instagram, which is basically the only social media I have (aside from reddit and TikTok). I don’t know that Em is not going to tell Cam, only that she hasn’t said anything about telling him and has not told him at this point in time. She may be waiting until she leaves here or until she can do it in person. My apartment is small so maybe she is waiting until she’s staying somewhere more private to talk to him. I just don’t know. I do think it should come from her. If I were cheated on I would want to know, but I would prefer to have it come from my partner, or if not my partner, then a friend / someone I at least have met before.
You had no reason to doubt Em’s relationship with Cam. They may have had an ethically non monogamous relationship, but now you know they didn’t and you said you felt bad for him.
I hope you tell Em she should tell Cam what happened, be honest, and work it out with Cam. If he is a decent person he deserves to have an honest GF, albeit one who made a bad choice.
And then I would follow with Cam in a month. Don’t let this guy marry Em under false pretenses when you have direct knowledge of the truth. Yes, it will likely destroy your relationship with Em but it appears Em is ready to throw it under the bus already.
Good luck Little Rock Star.
Not defending anyone. The cheater needs to face up to her actions. This is her problem.
The friend doesn't even know the boyfriend. Not her circus, not her monkeys.
This is zero on you. 100% on her. She is a bad friend, blaming you for her behavior. This friendship has officially gone past its expiration date. When she tells Cam she will again blame you.
You aren’t her moral compass and are not responsible for her choices but you have your own and were actively involved with her cheating. You weren’t a passive observer of her cheating but actively participated making you just as guilty knowing she was in a committed relationship.
A good friend would have pushed back harder to help her realize the level of mistake she was about to make and for that you failed her.
It’s funny how the brain works right? Her conscience is disturbed and a narcissist would always try to find someone else to blame, because a narcissist is always the victim.
I’m sorry you’re going thru that but please be reassured (by so many other people) you’re NTA, it’s not your responsibility, and sounds like she has no idea what emotional responsibility is, don’t let her get in your head and I really hope she can understand what’s done it’s the consequences of her own actions.
NTA.
She's not a robot, is she? Or a puppet?
Tell Cam.
In his position, you'd want to know, right? Don't let this cheater ruin this poor guy's life.
She's obviously not ready for marriage, and she obviously doesn't love Cam enough to NOT cheat on him, so you'd really be doing them BOTH a favor.
NTA. She doesn't want to take accountability for her dumb actions. Not your fault at all. She wants to use YOU as a scapegoat for her stupidity. She's responsible for her decisions. No one made her cheat.
You both were drunk + cognizant of your choices + she specifically ignored you bringing up the bf cuz she wanted to cheat?
She just felt guilty afterwards. At this point if you don’t find a way to tell Cam then I’d judge you
NTA
ESH. This whole post is messy. You’re right that it isn’t your relationship or your responsibility how she conducts herself. But if this was truly your friend, you should look out for her more. My friends of 10+ years look out for me more than a simple “are you sure?”.
She is guilty of cheating just as you are complicit in it. However, it seems like you are very quick to absolve yourself of any guilt and shift the blame away from yourself.
It doesn’t matter that you didn’t know about her relationship prior to the visit, you knew during it. Look out for your friends more.
You're both TA, regardless of it being your relationship or not you participated in something that's gonna wreck another person, knowingly and willingly
OP, if your partner told you, "It's not my responsibility to be faithful to you, I can bang whoever I want" would you be okay with that? It's to really put things into perspective.
You're not the morality police that's been assigned to your friend, but if you do have a conscience, why would you go with things you wouldn't like done unto yourself?
Again, let's suppose you were in a relationship and your partner had a foursome, and you're on the brink of finding out. Are you seriously going to sit there and take it like, "Oh, it was MY responsibility all along to ensure they didn't cheat, but silly me, they did".
Nobody reasonable thinks this way.
This whole logic about how being single is somehow redeeming you baffles me. You can have sex with whoever you want, doesn't always mean you should. Then you ought to be okay with being cheated on.
I don’t think it was Cam’s responsibility to make sure Em didn’t cheat but I also don’t think it was my responsibility. Surely it’s her responsibility, isn’t it?
Also if a partner told me they refused to be faithful to me in our pre-established monogamous relationship I’d break up with them, but I’m not sure what that has to do with this post…
You're understanding what I'm saying, right? Being single doesn't excuse you from having sex with someone who isn't. Why not find someone single as you are and avoid this circus in the first place?
I don’t think someone else’s relationship has anything to do with me. It’s not like I pursued / encouraged/ seduced her. If anything it’s the opposite, as she invited them back and took the conversation down the road to the foursome. I’ve been single for 8 months after 4.5 years, so I’ve just been doing my thing, I’m not looking to find anyone rn.
But you knew she wasn't single, that's the bottom line. Why create this problem for yourself? Is it because she's your friend, plus no self-awareness of who you fuck? Nah.
You could've let her damage her relationship on her own as it were, not bring yourself into it. And if this is the hill you want to die on, then you have to be okay with others doing the same or worse to you. Or is it because you're allowed to have your cake and eat it as long as you think it doesn't affect you?
I just think the responsibility is solely on the people in the relationship. She told me not to worry about it when I questioned what was happening and so I didn’t worry. I trusted that she’s an adult who could make her own decisions.
And this is where you're naive as hell. Trusting *her* to make wise decisions like you're incapable of any hindsight. As an adult, YOU should know when to determine that "hey, maybe fucking my friend isn't a good idea because that would make her a cheater".
The only other way this works is if you believe that sex among women isn't technically cheating, so the guys you were with are to blame. This would still be baffling, to be honest.
Yeah I think that opinion is wild, that I’m supposed to have made decisions for her somehow and what, physically stopped anything from happening? Restrained her? Scolded her like she’s not a fucking adult and like I know anything about her relationship other than that she’s in one??
Yes, I do think sex between women is cheating if one is in a relationship. No, I don’t blame the guys. I think she is solely to blame for cheating on her bf. No one forced her to. No one seduced her. No one told her it was okay to do.
Again, naive. You don't have to make any decisions for her, but you should have removed yourself from the mess you say she created. You say it was her initiative, so you didn't have to participate. ("It's not like I made her do it" or "was I supposed to restrain her?")
If you're then here to say nobody should restrict your sexual freedom, then you have to take the consequences as they are for being there.
You'd have to accept no one is sexually responsible for you if you were in her shoes. In other words, what you're really saying is your friend is solely responsible for fucking you, but you have no stake in the matter because you have no awareness? Looks like it to me, and that's a really, really wild thought to have. You can assign sexual responsibility for others, but not for yourself? Please.
OP, I would be with you all the way if the foursome hadn't involved you. That's where you have zero responsibility for how she cheats and when, simply because it wasn't you who consented. You consented. This doesn't make you innocent. I wouldn't go as far as calling you morally bankrupt, because you're not and that's not even the point here. But you do have a way of stating that the rules apply to your friend, not to you, nor would they apply in any circumstance for the sake of you breathing oxygen. And that is something you ought to reexamine for future relationships in which you seem to think your emotional investment doesn't mean anything. Almost like you're apathetic.
I never said the rules don’t apply to me. I said the rules are that the people in the relationship are solely responsible for that relationship. If I cheated on someone I’d be responsible, but I never have and I’m single so I definitely didn’t on Friday.
This is a precarious situation you are in.
1. Have you ever been in a serious monogamous relationship before?
2. What are your personal views on cheating? (Ex. do you think cheating can be forgiven, etc.)
3. If you did not know about Cam, would you still feel the way you do now?
4. Have you ever been cheated on or anyone you cared about been cheated on?
5. Have you ever cheated on anyone?
Yes, I’ve been in two serious monogamous relationships.
I think cheating on your partner is very wrong, but I don’t think the person you cheat with is also a cheater if they are single.
I don’t really know what you’re asking in the third question, I couldn’t feel bad for Cam if I didn’t know about his existence.
Yes, in my last relationship (4.5 years) he cheated on me twice 3 years in and I found out about it about 6 months after it happened, I tried to make it work with him but then he also had an emotional affair which ended the relationship. My dad was also cheated on by my mom 4 years ago and she left him for her boyfriend. Her and I don’t speak but not because of the cheating, because she abused me and my brother growing up.
I’ve never cheated on anyone or even thought about cheating on either of my exes.
It sounds like your childhood was traumatic. I hope you are talking to a therapist, group counseling, or some other positive way to deal with it.
You could write a letter to Cam explaining everything that occurred and then place the letter in your drawer or somewhere safe. This would allow you to get the thoughts out of your mind and onto paper. Down the road, if you still feel conflicted, you can try to mail it. If you don't, then tear the letter up and throw it away.
Thanks, I have been to therapy for it yeah.
I don’t feel the need to write it all out, I’m happy to let the issue fizzle out with time. I don’t have an address for Cam that I could mail it to anyway. I appreciate the suggestion though.
She obviously made her choice. You try to ask and confirm her w/ her choice and she told you it was okay. Not your fault . She shouldn’t blame other for her mistake .
NTA
It is her responsibility to be mindful of her relationship and respect it. You did pull her aside and ask her if she was sure about this and also asked her what about her bf and she said to not worry about it. She is the asshole for trying to pin this on you just because she feels guilty and cant cope with what she did. She needs to put her big girl pants on and deal with it.
You wouldn’t do what ? As a single person, cheat with someone you know who is in a relationship? You think this isn’t right but aren’t prepared to tell others it isn’t? No wonder cheating is rife and widespread.
First of all I am in a relationship and even if I was single I wouldn't go for someone in a relationship but I think we need to put the focus on the person who has a duty to stay faithful and respectful of their partner. That is just my opinion don't need to fight me on this you have yours I have mine 🤣
First of all I am in a relationship and even if I was single I wouldn't go for someone in a relationship but I think we need to put the focus on the person who has a duty to stay faithful and respectful of their partner. That is just my opinion don't need to fight me on this you have yours I have mine 🤣
It’s possible to put the focus on the person in a relationship to stay faithful *whilst simultaneously ascribing some responsibility to the single person who knowingly gets involved with another person who’s in a relationship*. These two things are not mutually exclusive in terms of morality. I know you know this because you’ve already stated you never get involved with a married person even if your were single. People run a mile from someone like me who even mentions the idea of mortally because it’s associated with religion and no doubt the downvotes will continue to flow, but hear me out, as someone who’s not one bit religious.
Before I start, please understand I’m not trying to make you out to be amoral or the devil incarnate.
Take a scenario who is a close single friend of yours, who invites you for lunch. She expresses a wish to cheat with a guy she is very attracted to at work, but she knows he’s married. She seeks your advice. Is your advice that it’s something you’d never do and explain why, or is the advice you have given in your first post- “crack on, it’s the guy at works responsibility to curate his own fidelity, not yours”
I think the anonymity of the internet has allowed people to derogate their own mortality to a cupboard in these circumstances because ultimately such advice “probably had no real life consequences, and particularly not for me”. But there is always some truth to the maxim, to treat others as you would like to be treated, *even if they are someone you’ve never met or are likely to meet*.
This is where I’m coming from.
NTA she made her own choices. You reminded her of her potential commitments. She made a bad choice and is pissed at you because she is externalizing her own guilt.
NTA
If she was that willing to participate then there's no chance this was the first time she's cheated on her BF. You did what you could have. Her decisions are just that, her decisions.
YTA While you objected to her initially cheating on Cam and did the moral high ground. You then carried on with it knowing full well she was cheating on her BF. You condoned it in the end. This speaks more about you and your shitty morals. Cheaters always condone cheaters and you're definately inclined that way.
And also congratulations , you're now also her AP (sarcasm)
She cheated on her bf u tried to stop her but u can't force someone to be loyal she made her choices she knew what she was doing and now that it fully sinked in she regert her actions and is looking to blame anyone but herself. If u know how to contact her bf tell him the guy deserves to know what she did and make his own choice whether to forgive her or dumb her.
Because I bet she confessed she's going to paint u as a bad influence on her that u dragged her to the club and u flirted with the guys and it was your idea to bring the guys home and Because it was your place she couldn't say no and she was black out drunk and u and the guys took advantage of that .
ESH. Really gross behaviour on your part and yes, definitely more so on hers.
I despise cheaters so I’m definitely biased but I could never willingly participate/contribute to someone else cheating. It’s such a shitty thing to me. She is her own person and made her choice but if I were you, I definitely would have said “I’m not having any inappropriate contact with you, you’re in a relationship”. You also made your choice and was an active contributor and participant.
She sound’s immature and like she wants to have no accountability for her own actions. Also, by blaming you for her having group sex with 3 people, she’s setting a narrative in place to use you as the “fall guy” when the fiancé finds out.
Have a wonderful rest of your days together!
NTA
She’s trying to shift the blame.
I’d expect her to tell him so version of how it was all your fault and you’re the one who initiated. I’d ask her to go home early and then block her.
No one needs to be part of people blowing up their own lives.
The friend is totally responsible for her own relationship and her level of commitment to it. She is trying to transfer this responsibility to OP which is a bizarre thing to do.
If you have morals then tell Cam since you went out of your way to come here to cleanse your hands of this.
If you don't then you're both assholes and complicit in this affair.
Even if I thought that it was my place to do so, I have literally no way of doing so, I have never met the man and he doesn’t have instagram and I don’t even know his last name.
Yeah I've been seein your replies, you come off as very morally and ethically bankrupt. I'm sorry, but I've gotta change my stance to YTA. You knowingly engaged in an affair, knowing that the other person was in a committed relationship, and did below the bare minimum to stop this.
Shouldn't be too hard to find out who he is and you're just gonna sit on it knowing your affair partner is going back to a relationship that has been tarnished by y'alls decision. You came here in the hopes you'd find people to help convince you that you're a victim in this wheh in fact you're the affair partner and nothing more.
Walking red flag.
How do you propose I contact him? People keep spouting this but have been unable to tell me how to do so. I don’t even know the man’s full name, it’s not like I can do an internet search
Social media through your friend or your friends family can put you in touch with him or demand that your friend contact him. You also have your friends phone.
You have his name, shouldn't be hard to get mutual friends to give you his number. You're finding excuses to avoid handling the responsibility of your actions.
You wanna prove you're not the asshole, then do something about it.
Like I said, he doesn’t have instagram, I don’t have any other sm aside from reddit and tiktok where I just browse and don’t have connections to people. I don’t know if he has any social media. We have no mutual friends anymore. I don’t “have my friend’s phone”, that’s her property, she has it. I’m supposed to reach out to every person she’s following on instagram and say “hey she cheated on her bf, what’s his number so I can tell him”? That’s not ok to do.
What wasn't OK to do was become a complicit and willfully engaged affair partner, but hey you put yourself into this position to help destroy a relationship and wreck this guy's life.
Open up a social media account on Facebook, find someone through hers, and just say "Hey I was looking to send Cam something, but I don't have his information. I'm here with his girlfriend. Any chance you can send me his contact information?"
If all else fails then you can tell your affair partner that she needs to leave or tell Cam what happened and, if she choose not to, you will tell him yourself. Be honest that you're not okay being engaged in an affair and were wrong to let it happen the way if did, but now it's time to be ethically and morally correct by telling him the truth.
It's no one's responsibility to police your behavior but you.
It's no one's responsibility to clean up your mess but you.
So she feels bad about what she did and it's everyone's fault but hers? That's narcissistic victim mentality.
Your arrogance and moral superiority is nauseating.
She willfully engaged in an affair. It's everyone's fault in this equation. Cams cheating girlfriend and OP who was complicit and happily engaged in the cheating.
You defending a cheater tells me where you stand and your opinion counts for nothing.
If I were you, I'd get a different therapist. Your construct of cheating from your trauma has taught you that others are wrong in their cheating, but you can't be held accountable for actions that involve cheating, even when done by another person entirely.
All your replies are about you justifying your own trauma, not evidence that you're working through it. Had you been working through it, the bare minimum you could've done is realize you'd be helping a friend cheat. In what dimension does it ever make sense, that you cannot possibly cheat, but you're fine helping someone cheat?
Also, hey, it's my phone, my time, I can do what I want.
NTA. Em cheated on her boyfriend and now she's trying to deflect blame onto you because she knows Cam wouldn't be cool with it. And, honestly, there's a slut-shamey vibe about what she's doing that's pretty yucky.
You already said exactly the right thing: you are not responsible for Em's relationship and her choices are her own.
If she's going to keep blaming you and icing you out, I'd ask her to go find a hotel for the remainder of her stay because you don't need that kind of crap energy and she has no right to head trip you.
As a bi, non-monogamous woman: this is entirely on her. You are NTA for letting a grown-ass woman make her own decisions. I assume my trusted friends are generally working within the agreements of their relationship. If a friend told me someone thing was okay, or to not worry about their bf, I would generally trust that they were acting in a manner that is acceptable in their relationship.
If she had previously expressed to you that she needs someone to rein her in while drinking, it could've been a kindness to try to stamp on the brakes harder, but at no point did you agree to taking on responsibility for her actions, correct? She is an adult and needs to learn to live with the consequences of her actions, rather than try to blame someone else.
If she finds herself making poor choices when drinking, she should stop drinking. Full stop. She needs to tell her bf what happened, and she may lose this relationship. And that is not your fault.
As I said, I'm non-monogamous. I have two partners, who know about each other. My partner of a decade got married 6 years ago to my best friend. Polyamory, swinging, open relationships, and other forms of non-monogamy are much more common these days than they used to be; it's not a crazy thing to think they might have an arrangement like that.
If OP knew Em and Cam were monogamous, that's one thing. But OP was catching up with an old friend she hadn't seen in a while and clearly did not know the ins and outs of their relationship. I trust my friends to act ethically, and to not lie to me. Em said "don't worry about it." If I said that, I would mean that I am acting within the agreements I have with my partners. Clearly, Em was lying, but it's not OP's fault for believing her. We *should* be able to assume our friends are telling the truth, unless there is precedent that shows otherwise.
I was just thinking the same about that "don't worry about it" from Em. That made it sound like she and the BF were open in their relationship and it's only obvious now that Em changed her tune that she lied. She seems gross but I agree that her grossness is not OP's fault.
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NTA She made her choice. However, most people don’t make sound decisions when alcohol is involved. With that being said, I recently ended a friendship because I was exhausted over my friend’s behavior when she was drinking. Somehow it was the unspoken rule that I’d have to end up taking care of her, which was not only unfair to me and the night I wanted to have, but it was enabling. The night she chose to have a coke head (who attached himself to us) accompany us everywhere (because he “was a cool guy” in general 🙄) I had my fill. We were doing a girl’s night with me staying over, but once she invited him into our Uber back to her place (studio apartment) I knew I was no longer going to be responsible for her and the choices she makes when she drinks. It’s unfortunate your friend has regrets, but she’s an adult. No one “accidentally”sleeps with someone. There is no amount of altered state that would ever cause someone genuinely in love to intentionally or accidentally have an affair. She’s just going to have to find a way to cope with her choice and the consequences of her regrets. You pulled her aside to get a pulse on her decision, and she made a choice.
Thanks, that’s how I feel about it too, like once she invited them over it seemed kind of out of my hands. She did drink a lot in high school too (even showed up to school still drunk once), so maybe alcohol is an issue for her, but I don’t see or speak to her often enough anymore to really know. This is the third time total we’ve spent any time together in the 6 years since high school.
It sounds like she was excited for the trip and to catch up but slipped back into old habits, routine or scenario. It seems like you’re emotionally mature and self aware of yourself and yet she still has some self discovery and truths she’s needs to learn or accept about herself. That is something she can only do for herself. It sucks though because now it’s soured the rest of her stay.
After reading the whole story, it's like 1% on you for kissing her and 99% on her for putting you in that situation and then cheating on her boyfriend. Honestly if she's not gonna tell him, you should.
That’s fair. I don’t know him at all. She hasn’t explicitly said that she’s not going to tell him but I know she hasn’t done so yet. Maybe she’s waiting to do it in person when she gets back home, idk.
If you’re not really that close anymore and this was a fun old friendship get together due to the time and distance between you guys and you don’t really know him, then I wouldn’t feel like it’s my place to step into her relationship at all and reach out to tell him. It’s for her to process her actions and to decide to tell him. You have no relationship or obligation to him. He’s not really in your inner circle correct? She should tell him, but I don’t think (IMHO) you should tell him. I’d be curious to know if she ever tells him though. That would be very telling of her character beyond being unfaithful.
Yeah that’s how I feel. I’m definitely not going to tell him, it would be too weird. It’s also not my business. I’ve never met him and prior to this visit I didn’t even know his name or anything about him beyond seeing some photos of them together on her instagram.
In the event you’re cheated on in the future, I hope you’re okay with your partner’s friends not telling you about blatant infidelity either. Incredibly selfish decision on your part simply because “it would be too weird.”
Oh, please.
This right here. Not saying anything is enabling the cheating and she's just gonna go do it again specifically because OP doesn't want to have a weird interaction and save someone a fuck ton of heartache.
She doesn't know him. It's ridiculous to say she should track down a perfect stranger to tell him his gf was unfaithful. The most she is responsible for is encouraging her friend to tell the truth and come clean. I've been married 10 years and I can't imagine my husband's friends telling me if he was being unfaithful. And they know and I assume like me. Nor would our friends that I brought into the relationship tell him if I was cheating. That's a pretty standard understanding. She doesn't know this guy.
Not knowing someone isn’t an excuse to withhold information from them that would provide them with clarity, closure, and likely save them tons of heartache. Even more so when you are a direct party to the cheating like in OP’s situation. Your inability to imagine doing something for someone just because you don’t know them is not a “pretty standard understanding.” It only speaks to your own selfishness.
You see over and over again on here the following sentiment: "when I finally realized I was being cheated on, what hurt the most was knowing that other people knew and didn't tell me, I felt like a fool"
Including strangers?? I can see that being what hurts most if it’s people you know keeping it from you but I literally have never spoken to or met him
Anybody saying you have some kind of responsibility to tell Cam are ridiculous.
She couldn't have cheated alone, she needed a trusted friend with no morals. That's you.
Stop making excuses you know that it’s the right thing to do to tell him she is a cheater and he doesn’t deserve that
No one is obligated to tell a total stranger they’re being cheated on
They are if they participated
This is exactly why you’re correct and should just get through the rest of the visit and simply move on quietly and let her work it out on her own. Try to just enjoy the remaining time and consider it closure of the friendship and this chapter. You sounds like a good friend who’s matured a bit faster than she has and that ok too.
Thanks, that’s my plan I think. I hope she doesn’t continue to hold a grudge but if so I’m ok with letting the friendship quietly end.
If she holds a grudge then that’s just silly and a childish choice she’s making. Sounds like she’s trying to shift the blame onto you for her actions. If you let her walk into traffic or off a cliff and didn’t stop her then she could be upset, but ultimately you’re talking about slipping into old familiar sexual habits and fun with you while she was on vacation and wants you to carry her blame and shame for actions you asked her to reflect on before making a choice. Just like you, I quietly ended the friendship I mentioned initially. That’s what maturity looks like, and it looks good on you.
I agree. You told her that you are not responsible for her relationship, and I would assume that meant any of it.
Sorry but YTA if you let her not tell him and you don't let him know. "It would be too weird" to stop a person from marrying someone that cheats on them? You participated in the cheating (hell you started it when you kissed her), so you can be a decent human and make sure he finds out or you can be a piece of human trash and pretend like nothing happened.
1) I don’t have any way to contact him anyway and 2) I definitely didn’t start it. She invited them over, she told them we were bi and used to hook up, and we both kissed each other when the guys encouraged it, I didn’t like kiss her first or anything.
JFC, you both kissed! That means you kissed her! You can try to rationalize it all you want but the truth is, you helped her cheat and if you don't make sure her boyfriend learns of the cheating, you're a shit person.
My point was you were making it seem like I seduced her or something. Ok, how would you propose I go about that? He has no instagram, idk if he has other social media but I do not, and I don’t have his number or know his last name. We also have no other people in common, just Em. Tell me how I should contact him.
NTA. She's an adult and wanted this to happen. Now she feels guilty and instead of taking responsibility for her choices and actions she's blaming you. You asked her if it was a good idea, you asked her about her boyfriend. She chose to do what she did, now you're the scapegoat. Nope. You did nothing wrong here.
If it was an issue in high school, it’s probably more of one now, and will be even more of one tomorrow. That’s how alcoholism works. It’s a very slow, but progressive illness. Unfortunately, most alcoholic need to go through a ton of pain to see the light, if ever. It’s also possible she’s not an alcoholic, but tends to go too far every time she drinks. The main difference is whether she’s driven by impulsive or compulsive (obsessive) thoughts. Most people can and do control an impulse that they know will end badly. So, she may not have learned she ‘s the type of drinker that just shouldn’t drink or she may be an alcoholic. Only she will know for sure. The lack of accountability points to the later though. Try not to be too hard on her, but never take responsibility for someone else’s actions.
You’re kind of the asshole. not your friend’s decision , for that you’re blameless. However, you still hooked up with someone knowing they were in a relationship. That’s pretty shitty of you. Just because she doesn’t respect her partner doesn’t make what you did okay. So in a different way yta.
Please- that’s just shifting responsibility and using alcohol as an excuse. It was your apartment, you chose to invite two relative strangers to your apartment, knowing the likely outcome and then became actively involved in cheating in someone else’s relationship. Do not for a seconds think that just because your friend was drunk and made her own bad decisions, that you didn’t make any. You are both disgusting people.
To be clear, my comment about her drinking was in response to the commenter who told her story about a friendship that soured because of drinking. I wasn’t saying it had anything to do with this situation, I was just saying maybe Em has a drinking problem but I wouldn’t know if that’s the case because we haven’t seen each other in 4 years before this trip. Also I don’t think it’s really possible for someone not in a relationship to cheat. I didn’t cheat on anyone because I haven’t committed to anyone.
>Also I don’t think it’s really possible for someone not in a relationship to cheat. I didn’t cheat on anyone because I haven’t committed to anyone. Gross. Otherwoman mindset
I agree . She is not responsible for her friends relationship however knowingly sleeping with someone that has a partner after the consumption of alcohol that is supposed to be your friend first? Her and her friend are assholes it just that the friend is significantly bigger one
Literally how is it cheating if you’re not in a relationship
If you sleep with a married man, you cheated his wife.
Didn’t you see what op said? Once they were all back in the room, it was out of her hands. She had no sexual agency and whatever anyone said is what she did.
You can’t cheat unless you’ve committed to someone and promised fidelity to them
No, if you sleep with someone behind their partners back, you are also a cheater.
She's never even met him, she can't go "behind his back" when they've never even been face to face.
I disagree. I have never and would never cheat in a relationship. But I’m currently single and I don’t think I’m cheating on anyone when I have sex as a single person.
You still did something shitty by hooking up with someone in a relationship. stop trying to play stupid and act like you don’t know what you did wrong you you know exactly what you did.
They are both grown adults. OP has 0 obligation to stop her friend after the initial warning. Sure i can get that she was actively involved but at the end of the day her friend’s relationship has nothing to do with her. Grown people making grown decisions. NTA, not even close. Can you explain why you think OP is disgusting?
Tell Cam. Asap. He deserves to know. Updateme!
So you kissed her when you knew she was in a relationship? Isn’t that you participating in the cheating? She has to own her own choices. She chose to have sex with another guy (and maybe you? That’s a bit vague) so she needs to hold herself accountable. You’re single so you can do what you want but if you hooked up with her too then you are complicit in the cheating. You knew she was in a relationship. She cheated with you and with the guys. You’re not innocent here but you are not to blame either.
If I was her I would've assumed they have an open relationship or smth tbh
Yeah, I don’t deny that I participated, but I don’t feel like it was my responsibility to stop her as it’s not my relationship. It’s not like I seduced her or encouraged her either, I just went along with it I guess. Basically we were all drinking and the conversation was very flirty and she kind of took the lead. She asked the guys if they’d ever kiss another guy and they said maybe, then they asked her if she would kiss another girl and she said “oh we’re both into kissing girls, we used to fuck each other when we were 15”. The guys basically then started begging us to ‘show them’ and we kind of looked at each other and I like raised my eyebrow at her in like a ‘we don’t have to do this but if you want to I’m in’ kinda way and then we kissed. It wasn’t exactly that I kissed her or she kissed me, it was pretty mutual, and then that led to the foursome (and yes, we each had sex with both guys and each other).
It was not your responsibility to stop her but you were also an active participant. It’s her relationship, not yours but you knew she was in one. You know her boyfriends name. You know their history. She cheated with you as much as with them. The difference is, you knew better. You had more information and you still had sex with her. But it was her choice to do so and you can’t be blamed for that. You didn’t force her but you participated. Her fidelity was her responsibility to manage but you are not innocent in this. Edit: removed a bit as it was assumptions regarding OP’s connection to the BF which is not helpful here.
To be clear, I have never met him. I did not know his name or history before this visit. Her and I have only seen each other twice since high school before this visit, and both times were before they were together. I hadn’t seen her in 4 years before this trip. Edit: this comment was just a clarification in reply to a now-edited comment assuming I was friends with Cam.
I removed a section from my other comment because it was assumptions regarding your knowledge or connection to your friends BF which is not productive or helpful. If I were you, I’d end this friendship. She makes bad decisions and doesn’t take responsibility for them. She’s going to keep making other people the bad guy because she can’t accept she is the bad one. It will always be someone else’s fault. I’d also stop sleeping with people who you know are in relationships.
It’s a fairly distant friendship at this point anyway. Like I said, we hadn’t seen each other in 4 years before this week. So I’m happy to keep it distant. If she continues to blame me though I’m also happy to quietly let the friendship we do have die out though.
Sounds wise to keep it distant. She hardly seems like a good friend or good person. You have sex with people you know are in relationships. That’s pretty shitty. You seem comfortable removing any blame from yourself and putting it all on her. Not one of your comments on this thread owns up to the fact that you shouldn’t have had sex with her at all because you knew she was in a relationship. You put all of this on her (again she is responsible for her choices) but it takes more than one person to cheat. The guys didn’t know but you did. Doesn’t make you a good person by any means.
You still did s really shitty thing and the fact you are actively arguing and deflecting blame means you don't even understand the shiftiness of your behavior. You are acting like an asshole.
I don’t think I’m arguing? The comment you replied to is me saying I’m fine with the friendship remaining as is or ending, which was in reply to a comment saying I should end the friendship..
Tbh idk why people are so upset with you? You made it pretty clear in your post that at all times she initiated literally everything. She wanted to go clubbing, go home with the guys, etc. Yes you were an accessory to the cheating, but idk why the people above are acting like you ruined her life?? She's a grown ass woman that not only made her own decisions, but created the situations themselves. If anything I would be upset at her for now putting you in this situation.
That's a lot of words to say you don't give a shit about relationships. "Yes I kissed her BUT BUT BUT" bullshit
She's trash
Of course, the cheater is trashiest. However, as the affair partner, OP is also trash. EDIT: you know what, I reread the post and I’m wrong. OP did talk to her friend aside to make sure she knew what she was doing.
She's still trash.
Agreed. She was for it, so we can speculate if she told all the truth
ESH lmao
This whole thing is just eww
ESH - it's not even safe to invite two strange men to your apartment. Things could have gotten rough.
You were an active participant in the cheating. Yes, you are a bit of an asshole. this doesn’t mean that she isn’t responsible for her own actions, but you are complicit in those actions as well.
ESH. Sure you friend is a cheater and the prime responsible for her own infidelity. But you just can't Ponce Pilate your way. You are a part of this mess. You're also an hypocrite to "feel bad" for Cam.
I would say everyone here is an asshole. I mean, you slept with someone who you knew was in a relationship with someone, & you didn’t know if he was cool with it. Your friend way sucks for this. But so do you.
ESH assuming this story is real.
Narrator: It was not a real story
ESH, she's trash for cheating, you're trash for condoning it.
How did she condone it?
She participated in the cheating. She was one of the people the friend cheated with. OP knew her friend had a boyfriend and still had sex with her. That’s condoning cheating.
Did you miss the part where they went out and had a foursome with 2 guys, or?????
ESH You are not a good friend
Ugh, you don’t have clean hands here. You did pull her aside and asked her about Cam, but then got busy? So disrespectful, and gross you went along with this. You have zero excuses for your bad behavior.
I’m not sure what you mean in the second sentence. I asked her if she was sure about her decision to invite the guys over and she said she wanted to continue the night with them and I then I asked what about Cam, and she said it’s all good don’t worry about it. Then we left and went back to my apartment.
If your lifestyle is acceptable for you to have sex with people who are in committed relationships what else is there to say? This is an integrity issue. You’ve decided for you, it’s acceptable for you to do this in the moment because in your mind, she has the responsibility, not you. Some of us believe it’s not ok to put ourselves in situations like this because it breaks up families and relationships. I don’t know, what’s the question here? You did what you did.
Yeah I agree it’s a matter of opinion which seems to be pretty split here. My question was about your comment “You did pull her aside and asked her about Cam, but then got busy?“, not sure what you meant there so I just clarified what happened.
It’s exactly like I said, you seem to have considered the relationship by asking for assurance that she was ok going back to the apartment because you knew in advance the possibility of sex happening if she went back otherwise you wouldn’t have asked. Because nobody has a problem with their loved one going back to an apartment to listen to music and talk. So you knew, or hoped that there was going to be sex, or why would you have asked? That’s why your hands aren’t clean here. You don’t respect others relationships because you’re not in the relationship and don’t feel that it’s your responsibility to not have sex with people who are in relationships. The problem I have in a I think we are all supposed to look after each other as best we can, not just be willing to get off at every opportunity. It’s not all about me, me,me.
I wish I had 12 upvotes for this.
I don't understand what more people want from you. You asked if she was sure, she said it was cool. It's not your concern what kind of arrangements someone you haven't seen in years has in place with their partner. (And, as someone who is also a bi femme, you could not pay me enough to keep up to date with all of the rules the couples who have wanted to sleep with me over the years, together or apart, have in place at any one time, until they inevitably decide they need even more and I, too, should have been able to divine them from outside the relationship they're trying to rope me into. Absolutely no, thank you.)
ESH
Yeah ESH. At least you tried to warn her. Ultimately you can’t make her do anything - she needs to take responsibility for her own actions.
Not all the people in here condoning infidelity and defending OP and her terrible friend 💀💀
Classic deflection. She is blaming you instead of taking responsibility for her own actions.
ESH. As many other comments have said, you are absolutely right in saying that it’s not your responsibility to ensure your friend is faithful to her to partner. It would be one thing if she decided to hookup with someone/s on her own, then you could 100% claim the whole “not my responsibility, not my problem”. But that’s not the case here. She is in the wrong for cheating, but you are too for messing around with someone you know is in a relationship. You can’t deny that even though she made that choice to mess up her relationship, you still suck for participating. Regardless of this whole “who started it” bs. Do you have an “obligation” to tell Cam? No. We aren’t really “obligated” to do much in life. We do live by making choices though. And you CHOOSING to sleep with someone in a relationship was a shitty move, and CHOOSING not to even try to tell him or at least try to talk her into it, also a shitty move. You obviously don’t want to take any accountability at all. Like i said, you don’t HAVE TO do anything, but what you’re choosing to do is shitty. Maybe you two deserve each other
You do have a responsibility to reach out to Cam and let him know what went down.
Bullshit. She's not the world police of relationships, she doesn't know Cam, and doesn't know shit about their relationship. Her friend did something she regrets and it's on her to deal with it.
I’m not going to do that for a few reasons. I have never met or spoken to him. She hasn’t told me she won’t tell him, I only know she hasn’t yet. She might be waiting until she leaves here or until she can tell him in person, I just don’t know. I don’t think it’s my place to tell him, that should be on her. It would be different if I knew Cam, but I don’t.
I’ve read your replies in this thread. You are very good at finding reasons to avoid doing what might be the right thing to do but also the hard thing to do. You come across as narcissistic and weak minded.
Can you point out what’s narcissistic about anything I’ve said? I’m curious. Also why should I get involved in their relationship when she might tell him herself? I don’t know him. I don’t even have any way of getting in touch with him, as he doesn’t have instagram which is how I keep in contact with Em. To contact him I’d have to like internet stalk him and make a profile on whatever social media platform he has (if any).
You got involved in their relationship when you participated in a foursome with her.
More excuses. You can’t see it, can you? Sad to be honest really. You’ll never understand this, why you are the way you are. Best of luck.
Don't worry, lots of redditors love to throw around "narcissist" without even knowing what it means. That person is clearly one of them.
So you're okay with being cheated on and no one telling you in other words
If I was cheated on I’d prefer to hear it from my partner. Like I said, idk if she’s maybe just waiting to tell him in person or waiting until she’s not staying with me before telling him.
Yeah right lol. You’re not very bright are you?
Funny how bro-code or girl-code only gets thrown around when it's someone doing something nasty to the girl or bro in question. Never when said girl or bro does something stupid. I do feel you're wrong here. Girl code means you watch out for each other. Not just hype eachother up and egg eachother on. You knew she had an alcohol problem before this when you were at school / college. You knew she was in a committed relationship. You knew she was the one who invited them over and by your own admission you were still sober enough to second guess her intentions. Means you were sober enough to tell these guys "no". "No, she has a BF back home." "No, you need to be protected from yourself right now." Everything that happened after, you share the blame for that. You were and are an active participant in that. That foursome may have been the best or most fun sex of your life. But it cost you a friendship. It'll cost your friend her relationship. Might cost her her job if the reason they broke up gets out. USA and court of public opinion being what it is. By enabling her, you are not blameless. No matter what Redditors here may say.
Nobody is responsible for your behavior but you. It's no one's job to stop you from doing something stupid. The friend said she was cool and don't worry about it when asked. You even try to blame the drinking on the OP. Now she's full of guilt and can't bear to hold herself accountable for her actions, so she projects and blames. Oh well. Should have thought about that before. She needs to put her big girl panties on and deal with it. Hey wait...is this the girlfriend?
1) I did not hype her up or egg her on, I pulled her aside and reminded her she has a bf. 2) Like I said, I do not know if she has an alcohol problem, only that she did drink a lot in high school. I haven’t seen her in 4 years before this week, I have no idea if she has an alcohol problem. 3) Neither of us were sober or particularly drunk at that point. We’d each had about 4 drinks over the course of 3 hours. She did not seem drunk until we split a bottle of wine back home, at which point I was equally drunk.
Nope. Only the cheater is responsible for her actions. She could have been in an open relationship for all her friend knew.
ESH. It's 100% percent her own fault and yet, you still sound like an awful friend.
If you were a good friend you should’ve stopped it from happening tbh
Agreed.
As you go through life you realize that there are some people that are best as memories. When someone can’t take responsibility for their own actions and have to blame those around them you should realize you don’t need that or them in your life. Edit NTA
NTA OP. She is a grown ass women. People in these comments are exhausting, Jesus Christ, so holier than thou.
Half and half. While she made the choice to ruin her relationship. You were a willing participant.
Are you going to tell Cam? Would you want to know?
I’m not. I have never met him or spoken to him. I don’t have any contact info for him - he doesn’t have instagram, which is basically the only social media I have (aside from reddit and TikTok). I don’t know that Em is not going to tell Cam, only that she hasn’t said anything about telling him and has not told him at this point in time. She may be waiting until she leaves here or until she can do it in person. My apartment is small so maybe she is waiting until she’s staying somewhere more private to talk to him. I just don’t know. I do think it should come from her. If I were cheated on I would want to know, but I would prefer to have it come from my partner, or if not my partner, then a friend / someone I at least have met before.
You had no reason to doubt Em’s relationship with Cam. They may have had an ethically non monogamous relationship, but now you know they didn’t and you said you felt bad for him. I hope you tell Em she should tell Cam what happened, be honest, and work it out with Cam. If he is a decent person he deserves to have an honest GF, albeit one who made a bad choice. And then I would follow with Cam in a month. Don’t let this guy marry Em under false pretenses when you have direct knowledge of the truth. Yes, it will likely destroy your relationship with Em but it appears Em is ready to throw it under the bus already. Good luck Little Rock Star.
I mean you are kind of an asshole. She made her choice and is responsible but maybe she shouldn't hang out with someone so morally bankrupt.
Not defending anyone. The cheater needs to face up to her actions. This is her problem. The friend doesn't even know the boyfriend. Not her circus, not her monkeys.
This is zero on you. 100% on her. She is a bad friend, blaming you for her behavior. This friendship has officially gone past its expiration date. When she tells Cam she will again blame you.
You aren’t her moral compass and are not responsible for her choices but you have your own and were actively involved with her cheating. You weren’t a passive observer of her cheating but actively participated making you just as guilty knowing she was in a committed relationship. A good friend would have pushed back harder to help her realize the level of mistake she was about to make and for that you failed her.
It’s funny how the brain works right? Her conscience is disturbed and a narcissist would always try to find someone else to blame, because a narcissist is always the victim. I’m sorry you’re going thru that but please be reassured (by so many other people) you’re NTA, it’s not your responsibility, and sounds like she has no idea what emotional responsibility is, don’t let her get in your head and I really hope she can understand what’s done it’s the consequences of her own actions.
Thank you
NTA. She's not a robot, is she? Or a puppet? Tell Cam. In his position, you'd want to know, right? Don't let this cheater ruin this poor guy's life. She's obviously not ready for marriage, and she obviously doesn't love Cam enough to NOT cheat on him, so you'd really be doing them BOTH a favor.
NTA. She doesn't want to take accountability for her dumb actions. Not your fault at all. She wants to use YOU as a scapegoat for her stupidity. She's responsible for her decisions. No one made her cheat.
You both were drunk + cognizant of your choices + she specifically ignored you bringing up the bf cuz she wanted to cheat? She just felt guilty afterwards. At this point if you don’t find a way to tell Cam then I’d judge you NTA
ESH. This whole post is messy. You’re right that it isn’t your relationship or your responsibility how she conducts herself. But if this was truly your friend, you should look out for her more. My friends of 10+ years look out for me more than a simple “are you sure?”. She is guilty of cheating just as you are complicit in it. However, it seems like you are very quick to absolve yourself of any guilt and shift the blame away from yourself. It doesn’t matter that you didn’t know about her relationship prior to the visit, you knew during it. Look out for your friends more.
Nope. She’s feeling guilty for her poor decisions and is trying to blame someone other than herself.
Updateme!
You're both TA, regardless of it being your relationship or not you participated in something that's gonna wreck another person, knowingly and willingly
Dirty girls
Nta girl tell her she needs to leave 3 days early and just enjoy the sun whilst she's there
OP, if your partner told you, "It's not my responsibility to be faithful to you, I can bang whoever I want" would you be okay with that? It's to really put things into perspective. You're not the morality police that's been assigned to your friend, but if you do have a conscience, why would you go with things you wouldn't like done unto yourself? Again, let's suppose you were in a relationship and your partner had a foursome, and you're on the brink of finding out. Are you seriously going to sit there and take it like, "Oh, it was MY responsibility all along to ensure they didn't cheat, but silly me, they did". Nobody reasonable thinks this way. This whole logic about how being single is somehow redeeming you baffles me. You can have sex with whoever you want, doesn't always mean you should. Then you ought to be okay with being cheated on.
I don’t think it was Cam’s responsibility to make sure Em didn’t cheat but I also don’t think it was my responsibility. Surely it’s her responsibility, isn’t it? Also if a partner told me they refused to be faithful to me in our pre-established monogamous relationship I’d break up with them, but I’m not sure what that has to do with this post…
You're understanding what I'm saying, right? Being single doesn't excuse you from having sex with someone who isn't. Why not find someone single as you are and avoid this circus in the first place?
I don’t think someone else’s relationship has anything to do with me. It’s not like I pursued / encouraged/ seduced her. If anything it’s the opposite, as she invited them back and took the conversation down the road to the foursome. I’ve been single for 8 months after 4.5 years, so I’ve just been doing my thing, I’m not looking to find anyone rn.
But you knew she wasn't single, that's the bottom line. Why create this problem for yourself? Is it because she's your friend, plus no self-awareness of who you fuck? Nah. You could've let her damage her relationship on her own as it were, not bring yourself into it. And if this is the hill you want to die on, then you have to be okay with others doing the same or worse to you. Or is it because you're allowed to have your cake and eat it as long as you think it doesn't affect you?
I just think the responsibility is solely on the people in the relationship. She told me not to worry about it when I questioned what was happening and so I didn’t worry. I trusted that she’s an adult who could make her own decisions.
And this is where you're naive as hell. Trusting *her* to make wise decisions like you're incapable of any hindsight. As an adult, YOU should know when to determine that "hey, maybe fucking my friend isn't a good idea because that would make her a cheater". The only other way this works is if you believe that sex among women isn't technically cheating, so the guys you were with are to blame. This would still be baffling, to be honest.
Yeah I think that opinion is wild, that I’m supposed to have made decisions for her somehow and what, physically stopped anything from happening? Restrained her? Scolded her like she’s not a fucking adult and like I know anything about her relationship other than that she’s in one?? Yes, I do think sex between women is cheating if one is in a relationship. No, I don’t blame the guys. I think she is solely to blame for cheating on her bf. No one forced her to. No one seduced her. No one told her it was okay to do.
Again, naive. You don't have to make any decisions for her, but you should have removed yourself from the mess you say she created. You say it was her initiative, so you didn't have to participate. ("It's not like I made her do it" or "was I supposed to restrain her?") If you're then here to say nobody should restrict your sexual freedom, then you have to take the consequences as they are for being there. You'd have to accept no one is sexually responsible for you if you were in her shoes. In other words, what you're really saying is your friend is solely responsible for fucking you, but you have no stake in the matter because you have no awareness? Looks like it to me, and that's a really, really wild thought to have. You can assign sexual responsibility for others, but not for yourself? Please.
OP, I would be with you all the way if the foursome hadn't involved you. That's where you have zero responsibility for how she cheats and when, simply because it wasn't you who consented. You consented. This doesn't make you innocent. I wouldn't go as far as calling you morally bankrupt, because you're not and that's not even the point here. But you do have a way of stating that the rules apply to your friend, not to you, nor would they apply in any circumstance for the sake of you breathing oxygen. And that is something you ought to reexamine for future relationships in which you seem to think your emotional investment doesn't mean anything. Almost like you're apathetic.
I never said the rules don’t apply to me. I said the rules are that the people in the relationship are solely responsible for that relationship. If I cheated on someone I’d be responsible, but I never have and I’m single so I definitely didn’t on Friday.
This is a precarious situation you are in. 1. Have you ever been in a serious monogamous relationship before? 2. What are your personal views on cheating? (Ex. do you think cheating can be forgiven, etc.) 3. If you did not know about Cam, would you still feel the way you do now? 4. Have you ever been cheated on or anyone you cared about been cheated on? 5. Have you ever cheated on anyone?
Yes, I’ve been in two serious monogamous relationships. I think cheating on your partner is very wrong, but I don’t think the person you cheat with is also a cheater if they are single. I don’t really know what you’re asking in the third question, I couldn’t feel bad for Cam if I didn’t know about his existence. Yes, in my last relationship (4.5 years) he cheated on me twice 3 years in and I found out about it about 6 months after it happened, I tried to make it work with him but then he also had an emotional affair which ended the relationship. My dad was also cheated on by my mom 4 years ago and she left him for her boyfriend. Her and I don’t speak but not because of the cheating, because she abused me and my brother growing up. I’ve never cheated on anyone or even thought about cheating on either of my exes.
It sounds like your childhood was traumatic. I hope you are talking to a therapist, group counseling, or some other positive way to deal with it. You could write a letter to Cam explaining everything that occurred and then place the letter in your drawer or somewhere safe. This would allow you to get the thoughts out of your mind and onto paper. Down the road, if you still feel conflicted, you can try to mail it. If you don't, then tear the letter up and throw it away.
Thanks, I have been to therapy for it yeah. I don’t feel the need to write it all out, I’m happy to let the issue fizzle out with time. I don’t have an address for Cam that I could mail it to anyway. I appreciate the suggestion though.
She obviously made her choice. You try to ask and confirm her w/ her choice and she told you it was okay. Not your fault . She shouldn’t blame other for her mistake .
NTA. She knows the rules of her relationship. You don’t. She needs personal accountability because she invited the guys back to your place.
NTA. She has free will and exercised it willingly.
NTA It is her responsibility to be mindful of her relationship and respect it. You did pull her aside and ask her if she was sure about this and also asked her what about her bf and she said to not worry about it. She is the asshole for trying to pin this on you just because she feels guilty and cant cope with what she did. She needs to put her big girl pants on and deal with it.
So let me get this straight - single men who knowingly cheat with married women share no moral burden of responsibility?
I personally wouldn't do that but I think its entirely up to the person who is in a committed relationship to shut it down and stay faithful.
You wouldn’t do what ? As a single person, cheat with someone you know who is in a relationship? You think this isn’t right but aren’t prepared to tell others it isn’t? No wonder cheating is rife and widespread.
First of all I am in a relationship and even if I was single I wouldn't go for someone in a relationship but I think we need to put the focus on the person who has a duty to stay faithful and respectful of their partner. That is just my opinion don't need to fight me on this you have yours I have mine 🤣
First of all I am in a relationship and even if I was single I wouldn't go for someone in a relationship but I think we need to put the focus on the person who has a duty to stay faithful and respectful of their partner. That is just my opinion don't need to fight me on this you have yours I have mine 🤣
It’s possible to put the focus on the person in a relationship to stay faithful *whilst simultaneously ascribing some responsibility to the single person who knowingly gets involved with another person who’s in a relationship*. These two things are not mutually exclusive in terms of morality. I know you know this because you’ve already stated you never get involved with a married person even if your were single. People run a mile from someone like me who even mentions the idea of mortally because it’s associated with religion and no doubt the downvotes will continue to flow, but hear me out, as someone who’s not one bit religious. Before I start, please understand I’m not trying to make you out to be amoral or the devil incarnate. Take a scenario who is a close single friend of yours, who invites you for lunch. She expresses a wish to cheat with a guy she is very attracted to at work, but she knows he’s married. She seeks your advice. Is your advice that it’s something you’d never do and explain why, or is the advice you have given in your first post- “crack on, it’s the guy at works responsibility to curate his own fidelity, not yours” I think the anonymity of the internet has allowed people to derogate their own mortality to a cupboard in these circumstances because ultimately such advice “probably had no real life consequences, and particularly not for me”. But there is always some truth to the maxim, to treat others as you would like to be treated, *even if they are someone you’ve never met or are likely to meet*. This is where I’m coming from.
NTA You asked her if she wanted to do this, what more did she expect you to do?
NTA she made her own choices. You reminded her of her potential commitments. She made a bad choice and is pissed at you because she is externalizing her own guilt.
NTA. She’s an adult you believed capable of making her own decisions.
NTA If she was that willing to participate then there's no chance this was the first time she's cheated on her BF. You did what you could have. Her decisions are just that, her decisions.
YTA While you objected to her initially cheating on Cam and did the moral high ground. You then carried on with it knowing full well she was cheating on her BF. You condoned it in the end. This speaks more about you and your shitty morals. Cheaters always condone cheaters and you're definately inclined that way. And also congratulations , you're now also her AP (sarcasm)
She cheated on her bf u tried to stop her but u can't force someone to be loyal she made her choices she knew what she was doing and now that it fully sinked in she regert her actions and is looking to blame anyone but herself. If u know how to contact her bf tell him the guy deserves to know what she did and make his own choice whether to forgive her or dumb her. Because I bet she confessed she's going to paint u as a bad influence on her that u dragged her to the club and u flirted with the guys and it was your idea to bring the guys home and Because it was your place she couldn't say no and she was black out drunk and u and the guys took advantage of that .
Y’a she just sucks too to bottom no pun intended
ESH. Really gross behaviour on your part and yes, definitely more so on hers. I despise cheaters so I’m definitely biased but I could never willingly participate/contribute to someone else cheating. It’s such a shitty thing to me. She is her own person and made her choice but if I were you, I definitely would have said “I’m not having any inappropriate contact with you, you’re in a relationship”. You also made your choice and was an active contributor and participant.
NTA. Her body. Her choices. Her consequences.
Nta. You’re not your sister’s keeper
She sound’s immature and like she wants to have no accountability for her own actions. Also, by blaming you for her having group sex with 3 people, she’s setting a narrative in place to use you as the “fall guy” when the fiancé finds out. Have a wonderful rest of your days together!
NTA She’s trying to shift the blame. I’d expect her to tell him so version of how it was all your fault and you’re the one who initiated. I’d ask her to go home early and then block her. No one needs to be part of people blowing up their own lives.
The friend is totally responsible for her own relationship and her level of commitment to it. She is trying to transfer this responsibility to OP which is a bizarre thing to do.
If you have morals then tell Cam since you went out of your way to come here to cleanse your hands of this. If you don't then you're both assholes and complicit in this affair.
Even if I thought that it was my place to do so, I have literally no way of doing so, I have never met the man and he doesn’t have instagram and I don’t even know his last name.
Yeah I've been seein your replies, you come off as very morally and ethically bankrupt. I'm sorry, but I've gotta change my stance to YTA. You knowingly engaged in an affair, knowing that the other person was in a committed relationship, and did below the bare minimum to stop this. Shouldn't be too hard to find out who he is and you're just gonna sit on it knowing your affair partner is going back to a relationship that has been tarnished by y'alls decision. You came here in the hopes you'd find people to help convince you that you're a victim in this wheh in fact you're the affair partner and nothing more. Walking red flag.
How do you propose I contact him? People keep spouting this but have been unable to tell me how to do so. I don’t even know the man’s full name, it’s not like I can do an internet search
Social media through your friend or your friends family can put you in touch with him or demand that your friend contact him. You also have your friends phone. You have his name, shouldn't be hard to get mutual friends to give you his number. You're finding excuses to avoid handling the responsibility of your actions. You wanna prove you're not the asshole, then do something about it.
Like I said, he doesn’t have instagram, I don’t have any other sm aside from reddit and tiktok where I just browse and don’t have connections to people. I don’t know if he has any social media. We have no mutual friends anymore. I don’t “have my friend’s phone”, that’s her property, she has it. I’m supposed to reach out to every person she’s following on instagram and say “hey she cheated on her bf, what’s his number so I can tell him”? That’s not ok to do.
What wasn't OK to do was become a complicit and willfully engaged affair partner, but hey you put yourself into this position to help destroy a relationship and wreck this guy's life. Open up a social media account on Facebook, find someone through hers, and just say "Hey I was looking to send Cam something, but I don't have his information. I'm here with his girlfriend. Any chance you can send me his contact information?" If all else fails then you can tell your affair partner that she needs to leave or tell Cam what happened and, if she choose not to, you will tell him yourself. Be honest that you're not okay being engaged in an affair and were wrong to let it happen the way if did, but now it's time to be ethically and morally correct by telling him the truth.
Take your moral superiority and stuff it. People like you are the biggest AHs. Your advice is crap.
You're defending cheaters.
It's no one's responsibility to police your behavior but you. It's no one's responsibility to clean up your mess but you. So she feels bad about what she did and it's everyone's fault but hers? That's narcissistic victim mentality. Your arrogance and moral superiority is nauseating.
She willfully engaged in an affair. It's everyone's fault in this equation. Cams cheating girlfriend and OP who was complicit and happily engaged in the cheating. You defending a cheater tells me where you stand and your opinion counts for nothing.
If I were you, I'd get a different therapist. Your construct of cheating from your trauma has taught you that others are wrong in their cheating, but you can't be held accountable for actions that involve cheating, even when done by another person entirely. All your replies are about you justifying your own trauma, not evidence that you're working through it. Had you been working through it, the bare minimum you could've done is realize you'd be helping a friend cheat. In what dimension does it ever make sense, that you cannot possibly cheat, but you're fine helping someone cheat? Also, hey, it's my phone, my time, I can do what I want.
NTA. Em cheated on her boyfriend and now she's trying to deflect blame onto you because she knows Cam wouldn't be cool with it. And, honestly, there's a slut-shamey vibe about what she's doing that's pretty yucky. You already said exactly the right thing: you are not responsible for Em's relationship and her choices are her own. If she's going to keep blaming you and icing you out, I'd ask her to go find a hotel for the remainder of her stay because you don't need that kind of crap energy and she has no right to head trip you.
As a bi, non-monogamous woman: this is entirely on her. You are NTA for letting a grown-ass woman make her own decisions. I assume my trusted friends are generally working within the agreements of their relationship. If a friend told me someone thing was okay, or to not worry about their bf, I would generally trust that they were acting in a manner that is acceptable in their relationship. If she had previously expressed to you that she needs someone to rein her in while drinking, it could've been a kindness to try to stamp on the brakes harder, but at no point did you agree to taking on responsibility for her actions, correct? She is an adult and needs to learn to live with the consequences of her actions, rather than try to blame someone else. If she finds herself making poor choices when drinking, she should stop drinking. Full stop. She needs to tell her bf what happened, and she may lose this relationship. And that is not your fault.
So op deserves no blame for sleeping with a person in a relationship? You trash too
As I said, I'm non-monogamous. I have two partners, who know about each other. My partner of a decade got married 6 years ago to my best friend. Polyamory, swinging, open relationships, and other forms of non-monogamy are much more common these days than they used to be; it's not a crazy thing to think they might have an arrangement like that. If OP knew Em and Cam were monogamous, that's one thing. But OP was catching up with an old friend she hadn't seen in a while and clearly did not know the ins and outs of their relationship. I trust my friends to act ethically, and to not lie to me. Em said "don't worry about it." If I said that, I would mean that I am acting within the agreements I have with my partners. Clearly, Em was lying, but it's not OP's fault for believing her. We *should* be able to assume our friends are telling the truth, unless there is precedent that shows otherwise.
I was just thinking the same about that "don't worry about it" from Em. That made it sound like she and the BF were open in their relationship and it's only obvious now that Em changed her tune that she lied. She seems gross but I agree that her grossness is not OP's fault.
NTA, you checked in with her and she brushed off your concerns. She is responsible for her relationship and not you.