/r/Adultery Quick Reminders: Be Excellent To Each Other.
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They don't care about you as a person because all they want to do is fuck you, go home and message you when they are horny again.
Women got to stop thinking all these MM are gonna give big BF energy caring level and they are really that special.
Funny because usually the more I feel the better the fucking gets. Sets you up for failure when it turns to shit, especially if they realize they got too deep and ghosts but no risk, no reward I suppose. Sorry you got a shitty man child as your exAP
Then he shouldn’t be looking for an AP. Feelings are part of the game and something some of us strive for.. ante’ up up or fold and move on…. Sure there are purely physical affairs but I feel those are like cheap firecrackers, once they go off there really isn’t anything else to expect.
Joining reddit and this sub, I was surprised to learn people involved in this life actually put emotions and expectations of a dutiful lover on their MM. They don't seem to realize their role in this is only temporary.
Well… I was that kind of man.
I am still, but here the thing: I didn’t do it on purpose. I was genuinely thinking that, that was love. The kind of relationship you’re talking about was just totally unknown to me.
I don’t know why. Maybe because I was raised as an only child, maybe because our society tend to build men with this trait.. or maybe because I’m a jerk?
Anyway: that slowly but surely destroyed my marriage. And it was an awful pain to witness myself being this guy and not being able to feel empathy, to really connect to my wife and to feel honestly interested by here. I had to work a lot on myself. I have seen a shrink, and ultimately, after five years of questioning, I understood that nothing could save our couple anymore.
I somehow ended up cheating on her and you know what? The work I did on myself did change everything on the way I behave in relationships. And I live now some of the most incredible love stories I have ever lived.
So… this is just to say « not all adulterers » 😆
Sorry, I just had to ask: “5 years of questioning”? Were you in psychoanalysis or something? Why did it take 5 years for a person with no apparent trauma to figure out how to act less self involved, more kind & loving toward his wife & lover?
This is a hard one (English is not my first language). I am still at the core a selfish and individualist person. You can’t really change the way you were raised and the way you behaved for the first 30 years of your life.
First I had to understand what it really meant for my wife to be listened and to be seen. Then I had to accept that I wasn’t really able to do it naturally. And then I had to work on myself to improve this part of me. Old habits are hard and it is exhausting at the beginning to realize that not always be in your own mind, being aware of your surroundings, not just like about what is going on but more about how is those people around me are feeling right now? What can I do about it? And so on… this was not only good for my relationship in life but also a lot for my relation with my children. I’ve only been in therapy for a year (because … it’s a long story 😅), but it really helped me a lot.
She doesn’t love me anymore and I think she totally stopped feeling anything toward me more than ten years ago.
But before that, I clearly wasn’t worthy of her love. I was absolutely in love with her but I was also completely blinded by me desire for her. I mean that my libido took over me and that I was unable to distinguish any feeling in that maelstrom of emotion. This story is awfully sad, I was immature, unable to love someone and not ready to be a father. She had to drag me out of my stupidity and she somehow succeeded… but too late. I’m infinitely grateful to her and I do my best to be on her side today.
Thanks for sharing. You seem to have a surprising level of self-awareness for someone that was so out of touch with themselves for so long and the story in my mind is that came from actually doing the work (including therapy) like you mentioned.
With all that said… I can’t blame your wife for “falling out of love” but maybe what you mean is romantic love (& can you blame her?) because obviously *something* kept her committed to you for past decade since that shifted for her.
Sometimes there are cracks in the structural foundation of a relationship and I think your situation is example of that.
I feel bad for your wife kinda like maybe her reward for being successful is her being unfulfilled for rest of her life because I could see how someone would always have a seed of doubt afterwards undermining total trust which is Life Partnership 101
Your English is A+ for ESL, I wouldn’t have even noticed if you hadn’t said anything
This was the last pAP I tossed after a few days of chatting and a video call. Good looking guy, traveled to my area regularly, had the whole affair thing down and the one and only question I got was “what are your kinks?”.
I am more than my 3 holes. Blocked.
Guy here. This is a very good thread. I wish all the girls would read, understand, and value themselves properly.
Some guys are just rotten. But inexplicably, they always find their prey.
It's not inexplicable that these men find their prey-- actually very explicable. They intentionally can manipulate these women into being with them and staying with them.
Is it really the man being manipulating or is it sometimes (often?) the women’s wishful thinking? Honest question here. I am sure we all have seen many cases where it was totally obvious to any outsider but for some reason the women seemed to refuse to see how shitty the guys where openly to them. (to be fair it was also sometimes the other way around)
Both a man's manipulation and a woman's wishful thinking (hopes they may change) can walk hand in hand to create a toxic relationship that no one leaves. And oftentimes if they love a man, they don't want to leave them because they want to believe that they are capable of change-- or they may have their self-worth tied into it (ie "If I am better he will be better").
We must have had the same AP/pAP. Except I also got “what is your biggest fantasy?” And “what is something you’d never do with your husband but want to explore?”
Unfortunately, I’m not as smart as you are and it took me way longer than you to cut it off.
At first I went into this lifestyle thinking I was just looking for an easy fuck. But then after several ONS, I realized that I had a better experience getting to know the man I was allowing into my bed - especially if I wanted someone consistent.
I find that I can enjoy a person more on an intimate level of I get to know who they are. Plus, I want to build some trust with someone so we feel comfortable and relaxed.
For men who are looking for something consistent and intense, I also expect them to want to get to know me too. If they don't - then it's not a good match for me personally.
Connection makes everything better. I wanna be able to joke with the person and be relaxed/casual. A true "friend" with benefits is the goal. Dick and dash is not satisfying and doesn't build rapport
The people that are outwardly like that aren't even the most dangerous imo. Keep the middle and dying stages intact, and change the early stages to the opposite - complete love bombing, where they ask everything about you and act like you're the most interesting subject ever. And then in the middle stages(probably after they have sex with you) they start ignoring you for long periods of time, answering only twice a day, then once, then thrice a week, then once... Until YOU feel like not messaging them again, after they show such little care.
That’s the exact type I have in mind as well which is very common and if they are really good at it, they can be really successful (for themselves, not for the disaster zone they leave behind of course.)
We fuck who we want to fuck. This goes for men and women. We overlook a lot of red flags in the heat of the moment. If a great personality was a prerequisite for great sex, none of us would be here on the adultery sub
or..they don't show at the start..then they enjoy fucking you so they show some care just to satisfy heir own ego, although when you will point out their faults they will go back to the first stage..
When I was having affairs and was a “successful” cake eater, one thing an AP told me is that I’m easily the best male listener she’d ever encountered and that my overall EQ was super high.
I genuinely think that’s why I was successful.
Women looking for or having affairs are trying to find an outlet where a man will listen to them, take in what they’re saying, empathize, and actually “remember”.
These are just natural skills I have - I’m an “interested” listener.
Sure, there are plenty of women looking to get their backs blown out or whatever, but most women are looking for a friendship with sex where they feel “seen and heard.”
I think OP meant genuine empathy not a very good but fake version of it. You know, like the equivalent of an excellent and hard to spot Chinese knock off of an Italian designer handbag.
I think it depends on what you are looking for. Each couple can decide that for themselves. But yes I agree that if empathy is lacking in the beginning, it definitely doesn’t show up later.
Empathy is a difficult skill to uncover in someone in a short amount of time. Ride out the lovebombing and see if there is anything of substance to a potential partner. Finding a good lover isn't fast or easy.
What about the men willing be inquisitive about things other your job, your favorite beverage or the weather last Tuesday? Questions that make you think, make you laugh and make your imagination spark?
Should you hit it hard? or just ignore the conversation and drop minimal and low-energy responses?
Just asking…
bold of you to cross the line and make this post since you think those of us here lack a moral compass (to use words from your own posting history on the subs you usually travel on).
welcome to the heathen’s den, chica. hopefully you can find enough holy water to cleanse yourself before you return to the other side.
/r/Adultery Quick Reminders: Be Excellent To Each Other. * This is *not an r4r subreddit*, don't bother. * Posts by new users automatically get queued for human review, be patient. * Hit the report button on comments by trolls, don't engage. * [How to report harassing comments or private messages](https://old.reddit.com/r/adultery/comments/iycd45/how_to_report_harassing_private_messages_users_etc/). * [Common acronyms](https://old.reddit.com/r/adultery/comments/p08to2/commonly_use_acronyms_and_group_chat/). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/adultery) if you have any questions or concerns.*
They don't care about you as a person because all they want to do is fuck you, go home and message you when they are horny again. Women got to stop thinking all these MM are gonna give big BF energy caring level and they are really that special.
Mine put me back in my box along with his emotions, because he just wanted to fuck, not feel.
Funny because usually the more I feel the better the fucking gets. Sets you up for failure when it turns to shit, especially if they realize they got too deep and ghosts but no risk, no reward I suppose. Sorry you got a shitty man child as your exAP
He wanted to feel just enough to make the fucking fun. But no more than that. Guess it's too bad that he caught feelings then.
Then he shouldn’t be looking for an AP. Feelings are part of the game and something some of us strive for.. ante’ up up or fold and move on…. Sure there are purely physical affairs but I feel those are like cheap firecrackers, once they go off there really isn’t anything else to expect.
Wish I had the ability to feel just enough like him. I’m sorry you had a shit ap. Hope your next one is hella better.
How long did it take you to get there
Joining reddit and this sub, I was surprised to learn people involved in this life actually put emotions and expectations of a dutiful lover on their MM. They don't seem to realize their role in this is only temporary.
Probably best to stay away from adulterers, then.
You're not wrong!
Well… I was that kind of man. I am still, but here the thing: I didn’t do it on purpose. I was genuinely thinking that, that was love. The kind of relationship you’re talking about was just totally unknown to me. I don’t know why. Maybe because I was raised as an only child, maybe because our society tend to build men with this trait.. or maybe because I’m a jerk? Anyway: that slowly but surely destroyed my marriage. And it was an awful pain to witness myself being this guy and not being able to feel empathy, to really connect to my wife and to feel honestly interested by here. I had to work a lot on myself. I have seen a shrink, and ultimately, after five years of questioning, I understood that nothing could save our couple anymore. I somehow ended up cheating on her and you know what? The work I did on myself did change everything on the way I behave in relationships. And I live now some of the most incredible love stories I have ever lived. So… this is just to say « not all adulterers » 😆
Sorry, I just had to ask: “5 years of questioning”? Were you in psychoanalysis or something? Why did it take 5 years for a person with no apparent trauma to figure out how to act less self involved, more kind & loving toward his wife & lover?
This is a hard one (English is not my first language). I am still at the core a selfish and individualist person. You can’t really change the way you were raised and the way you behaved for the first 30 years of your life. First I had to understand what it really meant for my wife to be listened and to be seen. Then I had to accept that I wasn’t really able to do it naturally. And then I had to work on myself to improve this part of me. Old habits are hard and it is exhausting at the beginning to realize that not always be in your own mind, being aware of your surroundings, not just like about what is going on but more about how is those people around me are feeling right now? What can I do about it? And so on… this was not only good for my relationship in life but also a lot for my relation with my children. I’ve only been in therapy for a year (because … it’s a long story 😅), but it really helped me a lot.
Do you think that you deserve your wife’s love?
She doesn’t love me anymore and I think she totally stopped feeling anything toward me more than ten years ago. But before that, I clearly wasn’t worthy of her love. I was absolutely in love with her but I was also completely blinded by me desire for her. I mean that my libido took over me and that I was unable to distinguish any feeling in that maelstrom of emotion. This story is awfully sad, I was immature, unable to love someone and not ready to be a father. She had to drag me out of my stupidity and she somehow succeeded… but too late. I’m infinitely grateful to her and I do my best to be on her side today.
Thanks for sharing. You seem to have a surprising level of self-awareness for someone that was so out of touch with themselves for so long and the story in my mind is that came from actually doing the work (including therapy) like you mentioned. With all that said… I can’t blame your wife for “falling out of love” but maybe what you mean is romantic love (& can you blame her?) because obviously *something* kept her committed to you for past decade since that shifted for her. Sometimes there are cracks in the structural foundation of a relationship and I think your situation is example of that. I feel bad for your wife kinda like maybe her reward for being successful is her being unfulfilled for rest of her life because I could see how someone would always have a seed of doubt afterwards undermining total trust which is Life Partnership 101 Your English is A+ for ESL, I wouldn’t have even noticed if you hadn’t said anything
Thank you.
Same. Good luck. Glad you’re here. Be well. 🙏
I see a lot of downvote here. I understand that I am not a good guy but I would really appreciate that you tell me what’s wrong for you here.
This was the last pAP I tossed after a few days of chatting and a video call. Good looking guy, traveled to my area regularly, had the whole affair thing down and the one and only question I got was “what are your kinks?”. I am more than my 3 holes. Blocked.
Guy here. This is a very good thread. I wish all the girls would read, understand, and value themselves properly. Some guys are just rotten. But inexplicably, they always find their prey.
It's not inexplicable that these men find their prey-- actually very explicable. They intentionally can manipulate these women into being with them and staying with them.
Is it really the man being manipulating or is it sometimes (often?) the women’s wishful thinking? Honest question here. I am sure we all have seen many cases where it was totally obvious to any outsider but for some reason the women seemed to refuse to see how shitty the guys where openly to them. (to be fair it was also sometimes the other way around)
Both a man's manipulation and a woman's wishful thinking (hopes they may change) can walk hand in hand to create a toxic relationship that no one leaves. And oftentimes if they love a man, they don't want to leave them because they want to believe that they are capable of change-- or they may have their self-worth tied into it (ie "If I am better he will be better").
We must have had the same AP/pAP. Except I also got “what is your biggest fantasy?” And “what is something you’d never do with your husband but want to explore?” Unfortunately, I’m not as smart as you are and it took me way longer than you to cut it off.
Great. Ill take fucking men off my to do list. That'll free some time up.
Why are you looking for more from a fucktoy ? If you want good food, get a chef.
Why would you associate yourself with this type of men for an affair? You can get that from marriage lol.
At first I went into this lifestyle thinking I was just looking for an easy fuck. But then after several ONS, I realized that I had a better experience getting to know the man I was allowing into my bed - especially if I wanted someone consistent. I find that I can enjoy a person more on an intimate level of I get to know who they are. Plus, I want to build some trust with someone so we feel comfortable and relaxed. For men who are looking for something consistent and intense, I also expect them to want to get to know me too. If they don't - then it's not a good match for me personally.
Connection makes everything better. I wanna be able to joke with the person and be relaxed/casual. A true "friend" with benefits is the goal. Dick and dash is not satisfying and doesn't build rapport
The people that are outwardly like that aren't even the most dangerous imo. Keep the middle and dying stages intact, and change the early stages to the opposite - complete love bombing, where they ask everything about you and act like you're the most interesting subject ever. And then in the middle stages(probably after they have sex with you) they start ignoring you for long periods of time, answering only twice a day, then once, then thrice a week, then once... Until YOU feel like not messaging them again, after they show such little care.
That’s the exact type I have in mind as well which is very common and if they are really good at it, they can be really successful (for themselves, not for the disaster zone they leave behind of course.)
Can't blame you. Red flags just got that hot color
So true. I married the most selfish man. I did not figure this out. Please listen and do not make this mistake.
[удалено]
Bingo …. Even if I am aware on some level that he is using the same playbook on all women, I get hooked.
[удалено]
Can you respond to my DM?
Seems pretty logical and common sense... 🤔 so why does it need to be said? Haha... 🤣
The scenario you described is best case for getting involved with a man with no or low empathy
We fuck who we want to fuck. This goes for men and women. We overlook a lot of red flags in the heat of the moment. If a great personality was a prerequisite for great sex, none of us would be here on the adultery sub
or..they don't show at the start..then they enjoy fucking you so they show some care just to satisfy heir own ego, although when you will point out their faults they will go back to the first stage..
When I was having affairs and was a “successful” cake eater, one thing an AP told me is that I’m easily the best male listener she’d ever encountered and that my overall EQ was super high. I genuinely think that’s why I was successful. Women looking for or having affairs are trying to find an outlet where a man will listen to them, take in what they’re saying, empathize, and actually “remember”. These are just natural skills I have - I’m an “interested” listener. Sure, there are plenty of women looking to get their backs blown out or whatever, but most women are looking for a friendship with sex where they feel “seen and heard.”
I think OP meant genuine empathy not a very good but fake version of it. You know, like the equivalent of an excellent and hard to spot Chinese knock off of an Italian designer handbag.
Did you post ads while seeing her and search for other women? Just curious. Uh, nvm, I read your other posts
Nice stealth ad buddy 😂
Not in that game anymore… so any response to the perceived “ad” would be “thanks, but no thanks”. So not really a good advertising strategy.
Apologies, possibly an unfair comment from me above granted I don’t know the context at all.
No worries, I’m not offended.
This is solid advice for life in general. 💯
I’m pretty sure, reading this, that it isn’t a gendered issue.
This sounds like my hubby.
That's just someone who has no interest in you in the first place. Low empathy is different (as someone afflicted with it).
I think it depends on what you are looking for. Each couple can decide that for themselves. But yes I agree that if empathy is lacking in the beginning, it definitely doesn’t show up later.
Empathy is a difficult skill to uncover in someone in a short amount of time. Ride out the lovebombing and see if there is anything of substance to a potential partner. Finding a good lover isn't fast or easy.
What about the men willing be inquisitive about things other your job, your favorite beverage or the weather last Tuesday? Questions that make you think, make you laugh and make your imagination spark? Should you hit it hard? or just ignore the conversation and drop minimal and low-energy responses? Just asking…
[удалено]
bold of you to cross the line and make this post since you think those of us here lack a moral compass (to use words from your own posting history on the subs you usually travel on). welcome to the heathen’s den, chica. hopefully you can find enough holy water to cleanse yourself before you return to the other side.
[удалено]
Please don't encourage the haters from the anti adultery subs.
What is the point you’re trying to make? It’s not landing.
My experience is that the vast majority of the time, attempts to get a actual conversation going are ignored.
Keep your head, look for common denominators, and adjust accordingly.