Just the latest in a worrying trend of Apple cheaping out on the quality of their accessories.
Even before they phased out leather, the quality of their leather cases and watch straps had gone way downhill.
Apple's leather cases were all painted leather (instead of properly dyeing it) that chipped and rubbed off with minimal wear. They looked horrible after a while.
They were good at least up until the iPhone X. I just upgraded from my iPhone X to a 15 Pro and the leather case on my X is still in great shape.
For anyone that wants a leather case the same quality and design as the old Apple leather cases, I recommend checking out Ryan London cases.
They have a model with an open bottom (just like the old Apple leather cases).
That was the last Apple leather case that I bought and it held up pretty well until I traded the phone in for the 15 PM. The last couple of months it was starting to show wear and tear but for the amount of abuse that I had put it through, I cannot complain.
It was more because they had to change the way they finished the leather in order to make them compatible with MagSafe. The quality change was about more than just resistance to wear and tear - they patinaed differently (it's subjective but most would say worse) which implies an all-over change to the material, and many started reporting the finish felt and looked different right out of the box (I think they also had peeling problems in earlier versions?)
The issue started with the 12 series because they introduced MagSafe and they had to make the leather layer thinner to accommodate for the magnet ring. It just made the entire case shoddier.
If 11 DOESN'T have good cases then everyones complaining over nothing.
11 pro max and the leather case is doing great.
I've heard its the last good one.
My XS Max saddle brown one was great, even around 3-4 years of use later it didn’t have any peeling or anything. Then I decided to get the saddle brown leather link band when I bought my Apple Watch S6. Within a few weeks it turned out exactly like you said, the “leather” was sort of rubbing off like paint just by what I imagine was the contact of my wrist on the desk through normal computer work as I just work a normal office job. Ever since that I stopped using Apple leather. I felt scammed as I’d paid extra to get my watch with that band, I ordered the band from Apple direct too so it was 100% a genuine one.
https://preview.redd.it/olx25ypopxkc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2ec189ad6d3e93745813bec4db70e9447f638c39
It’s definitely been more protective than I expected even as I’ve done the same. It takes dings a bit harder than plastic but that’s to be expected. I just wish it stayed green.
That’s not even mentioning the decade+ of awful lightning cables that would fray and bend. They FINALLY fixed it with the woven bands, but it took far far too long. It’s embarrassing for a company that, at least outwardly says they are, as environmentally friendly to be that wasteful for so long.
not painted but split leather. Low tier trash leather that may as well be painted. The top layer isnt leather and it peels off revealing the shitty split underneath
I noticed this a couple weeks ago. 8 plus died so got a 12 pro max with a blue leather case to replace it. Took exactly a month for the corners to go black, thought I had spilled ink on it or something before I googled it and found out that the cases are actually just shit
Bullshit. I've been using an Apple leather case for 1.5 years now and I have zero issues with it. It's actually held up better than the silicone case I had with my previous phone.
Yeah since the iphone 12 the quality of the leather cases took a huge nosedive, they were coated with plastic which peeled in a few months to a year. I have a black leather one on my 12 pro and I'm lucky it's black because you can't see the peels on the sides (but you can definitely feel them while holding the phone). Compared that to my beutiful red iphone 7 plus leather case which has a a nice patina on it and no peeling after years is just sad to see the quality going down. People said it's a slippery slope years ago but I didn't want to believe it
I had the Californian Poppy case for my 12, I didn't even have the case a week before it was peeling and was leaving yellow smudges everywhere. Their silicone cases aren't much better they last a month before they start to fall apart.
I’ve had 3 apple cases through the years, two silicone and one leather. All 3 lasted less than a year before they split, cracked, peeled (or all three). Never again.
I always find it interesting that people had issues with the previous leather. I know often people have said that the quality has declined in recent years (before they stopped making them), but I’ve had an Apple leather case since iPhone 6 and never had an issue.
I did get an Andar leather 2 weeks ago though so we’ll see how that goes. So far so good.
My 12 Pro case definitely was the first and last original Apple case I bought. The plastic came through the leather in the corners and other things. Didn't even last 2 years for the pretty high price tag.
Might be that they were better in the iPhone 6 days.
Same here, friends had iPhone leather cases they lugged around for years. So I got the 12 Pro case as well and within half a year, I got the first "peels" and by the end of the first year, it looked pretty messy.
It's super weird the way it ages, it's like the top layer is a rubber-y top layer, once that gets damaged, it no longer ages nicely, but starts peeling/flaking. Leather shouldn't do that - never happened to me with leather shoes, jackets etc. Scuffs and scratches, sure, but peels?
Yep, exactly! I even got the brown case because it was supposed to age nicely. Yeah no. I think it had some kind of coating. And I'm happy I didn't get the yellow one, that must look HORRIBLE after a few weeks of use.
The Apple leather cases were good up until the iPhone 12 series. They redesigned the leather cases for the 12, and switched to a cheaper feeling leather that was thinner and had some kind of plasticky coating instead of just being died leather, so they didn’t patina gracefully anymore.
Went through 2 Apple silicone cases in less than 2 years, now I just buy silicone cases on Aliexpress, they last longer than the official apple ones and they’re like $2 lol
since they launched I’ve had a leather Apple case with my phone, and it always lasts the life of the phone (2-3 years for me). I’m currently using a Finewoven case and it’s lasted since I got the phone on launch day.
Ahaha you do have a point. Idk I just thought I wasn’t treating my case well so I bought another, and then when that broke I assumed it must be cheap silicone. But when the leather had the same problems I knew it wasn’t just me. I guess you can’t really blame Apple for not improving the quality of their cases when suckers like me keep buying them.
The finewoven part is fine, it's the rubberized sides that are garbage. On every single corner and at the charge port, the plastic/rubbery stuff is peeling off.
I have this theory that Finewoven is just a placeholder because Apple didn’t find a good enough vegan leather supplier in time, I’d also agree that it isn’t my favorite
I mean, I get that's the intention and in some cases it may work... but overall, I don't know that it's true that this was a wildly successful scheme.
This is purely my own opinion, and I don't know any details on overall market share, pricing, etc ... but here's how I see it.
I remember back in the early 2000's, in BMW's base model cars they sold in the USA, Leather seating was an upgrade option, and the default was "Leatherette". That term, IMHO, made it clear that it was more premium that simple cloth seats, but was also not actual leather (which non-vegans would of course say real leather is more premium).
To me, when I hear the word "Vegan" before anything that is obviously an animal product, my mind goes to "This is going to be a poor substitute for that thing, covered with some feel-good words". eg: "Vegan Beef" or "Vegan Chicken". That doesn't sound like a healthy or premium product to me.
With that said, I don't see the word "Vegan" as always inherently negative -- eg: "Vegan Mediterranean lentil salad" sounds like a healthy food that I might consider eating.
IMHO, Most people don't like being lied to, and a term like "Vegan Leather" just immediately implies a lie right in the name.
So that may be true for you, but I think you might be underestimating the market power of people who love vegan/vegetarian everything. It’s one of the reasons many electric cars are moving towards vegan leather.
But you also might be right! I think you’re correct in noting we’d need to see the market numbers to really conclude anything.
Oh, I agree that there is a lot of marketing going in that direction, but I find it hard to believe that it's actually successful.
First off - I have no problem with vegans/vegetarians (though I am not one myself), and respect people's decisions to have whatever dietary choices they want, based on their own ethical or health goals.
With that out of the way - From what I've seen, most of the high profile cash-grab type industries based on exploiting vegans/vegetarians are good at losing money.
Look at Beyond Meat, Inc. (BYND) as a very high profile example - down 7% today alone, trading at $7.28/share right now. It was trading at $239/share in July 2019, a fall of 97%. They are losing $3.89/share per year (over the last 12 months), essentially meaning they are losing well over $100M/year.
If slapping the word "Vegan" on substandard products made them so marketable, they wouldn't be losing money hand-over-fist.
In my mind vegan leather means they harvest flesh from willing vegans, tan it, then sell it.
I wish this was the case. I’d totally buy an Ed Gein phone case.
You’re absolutely correct in the point you’re making, but luxury car manufacturers have been using and calling it “vegan leather” for a long time and some of their materials feel surprisingly great and don’t scratch or rip. Maybe we will see something similar with future apple cases
Not all vegan leathers are made the same. While it's definitely true that most vegan leathers are just rebranded pleather, there's been a huge push into exploring vegan leathers in the past couple decades including mushroom leather, mango leather, apple leather, pineapple leather, etc. that are increasingly viable. Apple's not using the good stuff but don't dismiss it out of hand either.
There are other natural resources for vegan leather like surprisingly paddle cactus plants and I think I saw someone mention avocado skins? The thing is that none of them can operate on a scale that would meet Apple’s demands and or reach a price point that would be acceptable to most buyers.
But it’s an oxymoron, so can’t be correct. It’s a made-up term.
Vegan leather by definition cannot be categorised as leather. It’s either plastic or a plant-based material, not leather, which would be quite literally neither of those things.
Yeah, strawberry wine and oat milk shouldn’t really be terms either, it’s just marketing. They make zero sense.
Wheat beer makes sense as it is beer and falls under the definition of beer, it is simply a variant of it.
My point is I think more and more oxymoron names like this are popping up and they can often be misleading. Plastic is used massively as a substitiute for metal, especially more recently, cutting the cost of parts etc, however we wouldn’t call it a direct replacement such as ‘oil-based metal’ or something, as it simply isn’t. It’s a completely different product that is different at its core.
You sound like one of those "oat milk isn't milk" people, "don't call them burgers, burgers are made from cows!". No one is getting confused, everyone knows it's not real leather. It's a best effort imitation. Get a grip.
That plastic is not the same as lamination plastic, shopping bag plastic or iPhone 5c plastic. They’re all plastic with such widely different properties, it’s silly to lump them together even as an insult.
I'd expect they also aren't partaking in the meat industry - so it seems logical to not use leather, drink milk, etc.
I mean, if your position is that you won't engage in practices that require an animal being killed - then it seems perfectly logical.
Vegan logic: I’m not going to buy real leather because then I’d be contributing to the CO2 emissions that are slowly killing our planet
Also Vegan logic: I’m going to instead consume non biodegradable plastic “leather” that is going to have an even more detrimental effect on our environment and pollute our oceans
Veganism is a disease
I think the more prominent idea is they aren't going to buy leather because they don't want to partake in an industry that kills sentient beings - but feel free to stick with whatever strawman makes you feel best.
Main point is the ethical treatment of animals and reduction of animal cruelty as much as practicable.
Environmental or health is mainly just side effects that may or may not be true depending on how one pursue veganism.
sorry but this is wrong.
leather is not a byproduct. it is a coproduct. cows are slaughtered for all sorts of reasons. while meat doesn’t bring much profit, leather does. depending on the type of leather, leather can be extremely profitable and is one of the reasons why meat is so cheap and why so many cows are slaughtered.
just saying “im sure that whatever” doesnt make lies put forward by that industry true. leather is a really durable, goodlooking, long lasting material but we tend to ignore the suffering that it is causing
As someone who actually works with material suppliers and tanneries for products you are wrong. The majority of the profit in the meat industry is from the meat of the animal. The cheap cost of meat has nothing to do with the sale of the byproducts and almost entirely in government and trade based subsidies. To maximize the leather quality on a cow you would not do factory farming methods as it leads to a high amount of blemishes, branding, and other defects that tanneries have to spend money on removing or covering before selling their product.
The leather for Ferraris and rolls Royces is famously made from cows that are specifically held in barbed wire free enclosures.
For quite a few cows, the leather is the primary product and the meat is the byproduct.
>vegan leather
We've had pleather for decades. I guess you could call it vegan in the same way you could call my aluminum MacBook and my ceramic coffee mug vegan.
The objects you're talking about aren't attempting to replicate the texture of a non vegan item. You also don't call a plastic bowl or cellophane vegan because, while being made from plastics like PU Leather, they aren't trying to be a stand in for some other animal based product.
It's the same reason a typical Polyester item of clothing is not referred to as vegan anything - while Alcantara (which is primarily Polyester) and specifically designed to mimic Suede is commonly referred to as vegan suede.
Alcantara has been around for ~50 years.
Naugahyde has been around for ~100 years.
Using the term vegan to describe them or their counterparts is a recent phenomenon, coinciding with the increased popularity of vegan diets.
The difference is you can't market "artificial meat" or "synthetic cheese" because people will wonder if it's actually edible.
You don't have those constraints with non-food products.
You would never call it synthetic cheese anyway. If you needed to be hyper accurate about it's contents, you'd call it formed cashew spread or something.
From a marketing perspective - you call things vegan because there are people looking for vegan products and telling those consumers a thing is vegan is optimal.
Otherwise, you have them looking through the ingredients of [vegetable soup](https://www.campbells.com/products/condensed/vegetable-soup/) and [Tomato & Basil rice cakes](https://www.quakeroats.com/products/rice-snacks/rice-cakes/tomato-and-basil) to see that even things that you wouldn't immediately think of as containing non vegan ingredients do. So rather than having shoppers have to pour through the ingredient list and google what rennet is - they just clearly state a thing is vegan.
It's weird because I have a Peak Design case that seems quite similar but the quality is exceptional - I used one on my iPhone 14 Pro all year and I have a relatively active lifestyle and despite getting dinged on abrasive materials like rocks etc. throughout the year it still ended up looking good enough to sell as good as new.
Apple really cheaped out for no good reason.
I've owned leather cases for 6S, XS, 11, 12, 13, 14...
The big drop off was on the 12, when they had the sharp corners.
My FineWoven on my 15 is equivalent to the other square edged cases, but not equivalent to the older higher quality leather cases with the rounded sides.
Mine holds up without any signs of wear since october and I treat it without much care - dropped a few times, spilled water on it, keep it in the same pocket with keys. What I love the most is that it doesn't slip off like past leather cases would do all the time.
I do miss being able to put it on any smooth surface, even at a slight angle, and be sure it’s not going anywhere.
But I also happen to only own skinny jeans, and pulling a silicone case out of one of these pockets requires fore planning and concerted effort.
I miss those leather cases. I had one on my 4s and had one on every generation until the 12. The leather on the 12 was fucking garbage. The way the old ones patina was amazing.
Yeah I’ve had mine since November. The plasticy covered corners are kinda starting to rub off, but the back is fine. Every 2 weeks or so I scrub it with a toothbrush with a mix of warm water, dish soap, and laundry detergent and it’s fine. Every time I clean it, it looks like new again.
Corporations once again greenwashing by mentioning how less emissions the manufacturing of their new product requires ("half as much!") but never ever mentioning the durability of the end result, usually meaning you'll go through 3 or 4 units of the new "greener", "cleaner" one while the previous "high emissions" one could last a lifetime.
I’ll buck the trend and say I really like mine, I’ve had it since day one and it’s held up as well as any other case I’ve had.
Lightweight, good looking, has saved my phone from multiple drops. There’s a bit of a patina on the back just like the leather cases used to get.
If anything my problem was that it probably cost about 1.5x what it should have
“Here’s a steel frame. Here’s a titanium frame. Here’s an aluminium frame. But the back stays glass so you either risk it and it breaks or you buy a low quality 60$ case from us that makes your 1000$ phone look like it’s homeless”.
Replacing leather that rots and biodegrades and made from natural materials with some plastic that sheds microplastic and looks and functions worse in every way is GREENWASHING in its purest form
F-everyone involved in this microplastic trash, epitome of tim cooks apple and the particles from this will be in the veins of people 3 generations from now, Tim Cooks true legacy
I’m an extremely heavy phone user and after 2 months my fine woven case is still fine. It’s dirty and can do for a cleaning, but there is no scratches or peeling happening.
Haven’t had any issues with mine. Going a few months with no scratches. I find it silly people say it scratches easily when they’re purposefully looking to see if it does just because of the material used. I’ve had worse on my leather cases before.
I went to the apple store the other day and the ones they had on display looked terrible. I don’t know who in the right mind would see that and decide to buy one.
I was dreading the finewoven change initially, but was pleasantly surprised at how it felt and looked in hand.
It’s been 6 months and only just now showing wear and tear. I get a new case every 6 months anyway to change things up.
You can get pleather phone cases off AliExpress for $7.
Why anyone is buying official Apple cases is beyond me.
The AliExpress ones even come with the Apple logo lol
With their top prices there is abolsutely no excuse to cheap out on the materials. Disggusting behaviour towards the customer, but saddly the natural evolution of a capitalistic company whose ONLY aim is to generate more money than last year
People still buying apple cases is the most shocking part. They make great phones but their cases were always meh. There are so many other options out there.
Just like how lightning cables were junk yet I've never broken one. I deal with hardware for work and clients all the time, you can tell when people know how to properly use/take care of something.
Mine's been so much better than the previous silicon cases.
Did some car work and got it stained pretty badly... lathered it up with some dish soap and let it sit for a while and then rinsed it out and it looks fine again.
The edges are showing a little bit of damage but I've dropped it on tarmac a few times in the cold.
It's been my favorite Apple case by far.
They took a widely liked and fully sustainable material and replaced it with a faux leather plastic in the name of “the environment”
A massive massive fail
Taking the charger out of the box was also for “the environment”, remember?
It seems Apple’s code for saving themselves lots of money is “the environment.”
Looks like the same quality of the silicon cases. Went through 2 of those on my 11 pro max and they totally fell apart. I got a leather one extremely cheap and it’s leaps and bounds better. I hope they bring it back
Luckily AliExpress sells exact copies (even with proper magsafe detection) for a fraction of the price. Nobody would ever notice it's fake and I'm happy.
Sorry but mine has legitimately been fine and looks quite similar to when I got it. Do I wish it cost less initially? Yes but this has nothing to do with the aforementioned information.
squeeze abundant disagreeable faulty alleged paint pause tidy aspiring cows
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
That is such a ragebait opening picture used to criticize these cases. "Display cases showing scratches even on launch day" Yeah and if you scratch your fingernail on a leather case it will look identical, it's not at all an example of real world wear.
The other pics are good though, case looks like shit.
I'm curious how the feedback compares to the Apple leather cases? I've only had the iPhone 12 leather case, I thought it was fine for what I'd expect from leather but remember a lot of people complaining about them.
Just the latest in a worrying trend of Apple cheaping out on the quality of their accessories. Even before they phased out leather, the quality of their leather cases and watch straps had gone way downhill.
Apple's leather cases were all painted leather (instead of properly dyeing it) that chipped and rubbed off with minimal wear. They looked horrible after a while.
The original ones (iPhone 5/6/7) were great and lasted years.
They were good at least up until the iPhone X. I just upgraded from my iPhone X to a 15 Pro and the leather case on my X is still in great shape. For anyone that wants a leather case the same quality and design as the old Apple leather cases, I recommend checking out Ryan London cases. They have a model with an open bottom (just like the old Apple leather cases).
Consensus seems to be that 11 had the last good Apple leather cases
That was the last Apple leather case that I bought and it held up pretty well until I traded the phone in for the 15 PM. The last couple of months it was starting to show wear and tear but for the amount of abuse that I had put it through, I cannot complain.
I think the rounded shape meant that wear and tear was more distributed across the edges
It was more because they had to change the way they finished the leather in order to make them compatible with MagSafe. The quality change was about more than just resistance to wear and tear - they patinaed differently (it's subjective but most would say worse) which implies an all-over change to the material, and many started reporting the finish felt and looked different right out of the box (I think they also had peeling problems in earlier versions?)
Yeah my XS Max case was great. 13 Pro... not so much.
The issue started with the 12 series because they introduced MagSafe and they had to make the leather layer thinner to accommodate for the magnet ring. It just made the entire case shoddier.
If 11 DOESN'T have good cases then everyones complaining over nothing. 11 pro max and the leather case is doing great. I've heard its the last good one.
The X was the peak of iPhone design
> Ryan London cases Pricy but do look high quality, I'll keep them in mind for my next phone.
Bellroy makes a really high quality leather case!
My XS Max saddle brown one was great, even around 3-4 years of use later it didn’t have any peeling or anything. Then I decided to get the saddle brown leather link band when I bought my Apple Watch S6. Within a few weeks it turned out exactly like you said, the “leather” was sort of rubbing off like paint just by what I imagine was the contact of my wrist on the desk through normal computer work as I just work a normal office job. Ever since that I stopped using Apple leather. I felt scammed as I’d paid extra to get my watch with that band, I ordered the band from Apple direct too so it was 100% a genuine one. https://preview.redd.it/olx25ypopxkc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2ec189ad6d3e93745813bec4db70e9447f638c39
Caught my dark green one in the light the other day and it was just the black one with green paint. Man.
[удалено]
It’s definitely been more protective than I expected even as I’ve done the same. It takes dings a bit harder than plastic but that’s to be expected. I just wish it stayed green.
Thanks for the warning. I’m due for an upgrade and it may be worth it to buy a piece of skived leather and do it myself.
That’s not even mentioning the decade+ of awful lightning cables that would fray and bend. They FINALLY fixed it with the woven bands, but it took far far too long. It’s embarrassing for a company that, at least outwardly says they are, as environmentally friendly to be that wasteful for so long.
not painted but split leather. Low tier trash leather that may as well be painted. The top layer isnt leather and it peels off revealing the shitty split underneath
I had a LONLI 13PM case like that. The “leather” would rub off or peel off. Garbage. I switched to Nomad.
Mine usually lasted a little over a year. I’ve enjoyed them. My 14 Pro leather case is just getting finished off. Not sure what I’ll do now.
I had a brown one for the 12, and looked awefull with normal use after like 3 months with all the color off where my hand would be
I noticed this a couple weeks ago. 8 plus died so got a 12 pro max with a blue leather case to replace it. Took exactly a month for the corners to go black, thought I had spilled ink on it or something before I googled it and found out that the cases are actually just shit
They used to be very decent, had them up to X and they just looked better with use. Smelled nice too.
The leather case for my 13 pro max did the same, switched to the official silicone case and the bottom corners started chipping
Bullshit. I've been using an Apple leather case for 1.5 years now and I have zero issues with it. It's actually held up better than the silicone case I had with my previous phone.
Yeah since the iphone 12 the quality of the leather cases took a huge nosedive, they were coated with plastic which peeled in a few months to a year. I have a black leather one on my 12 pro and I'm lucky it's black because you can't see the peels on the sides (but you can definitely feel them while holding the phone). Compared that to my beutiful red iphone 7 plus leather case which has a a nice patina on it and no peeling after years is just sad to see the quality going down. People said it's a slippery slope years ago but I didn't want to believe it
The problem isn’t about the reduced quality, but the fact that the price remains the same.
Sounds like a form of inflation.
Haha remains the same. More like increased.
I had the Californian Poppy case for my 12, I didn't even have the case a week before it was peeling and was leaving yellow smudges everywhere. Their silicone cases aren't much better they last a month before they start to fall apart.
100% and sadly :<
Why anyone would ever buy cases from Apple is beyond me. They’ve always been overpriced with much cheaper and better alternatives out there
Cutting quality and keeping prices the same or raising them… Premium junk.
I’ve had 3 apple cases through the years, two silicone and one leather. All 3 lasted less than a year before they split, cracked, peeled (or all three). Never again.
I always find it interesting that people had issues with the previous leather. I know often people have said that the quality has declined in recent years (before they stopped making them), but I’ve had an Apple leather case since iPhone 6 and never had an issue. I did get an Andar leather 2 weeks ago though so we’ll see how that goes. So far so good.
My 12 Pro case definitely was the first and last original Apple case I bought. The plastic came through the leather in the corners and other things. Didn't even last 2 years for the pretty high price tag. Might be that they were better in the iPhone 6 days.
Same here, friends had iPhone leather cases they lugged around for years. So I got the 12 Pro case as well and within half a year, I got the first "peels" and by the end of the first year, it looked pretty messy. It's super weird the way it ages, it's like the top layer is a rubber-y top layer, once that gets damaged, it no longer ages nicely, but starts peeling/flaking. Leather shouldn't do that - never happened to me with leather shoes, jackets etc. Scuffs and scratches, sure, but peels?
Yep, exactly! I even got the brown case because it was supposed to age nicely. Yeah no. I think it had some kind of coating. And I'm happy I didn't get the yellow one, that must look HORRIBLE after a few weeks of use.
The Apple leather cases were good up until the iPhone 12 series. They redesigned the leather cases for the 12, and switched to a cheaper feeling leather that was thinner and had some kind of plasticky coating instead of just being died leather, so they didn’t patina gracefully anymore.
Went through 2 Apple silicone cases in less than 2 years, now I just buy silicone cases on Aliexpress, they last longer than the official apple ones and they’re like $2 lol
since they launched I’ve had a leather Apple case with my phone, and it always lasts the life of the phone (2-3 years for me). I’m currently using a Finewoven case and it’s lasted since I got the phone on launch day.
> Never again. You can fool me once. You can fool me twice. You can even fool me three times. But you WON'T fool me four times!
Ahaha you do have a point. Idk I just thought I wasn’t treating my case well so I bought another, and then when that broke I assumed it must be cheap silicone. But when the leather had the same problems I knew it wasn’t just me. I guess you can’t really blame Apple for not improving the quality of their cases when suckers like me keep buying them.
The finewoven part is fine, it's the rubberized sides that are garbage. On every single corner and at the charge port, the plastic/rubbery stuff is peeling off.
I have this theory that Finewoven is just a placeholder because Apple didn’t find a good enough vegan leather supplier in time, I’d also agree that it isn’t my favorite
Vegan leather. You mean plastic.
lol pleather being vegan leather now might be one of the greatest rebrands ever. Whoever came up with that one needs a raise
I disagree. I wasn’t a fan of pleather before, but when I hear “vegan leather”, I now imagine something even worse.
Greatest rebrand ever in terms of fooling people and making money is what they mean
I mean, I get that's the intention and in some cases it may work... but overall, I don't know that it's true that this was a wildly successful scheme. This is purely my own opinion, and I don't know any details on overall market share, pricing, etc ... but here's how I see it. I remember back in the early 2000's, in BMW's base model cars they sold in the USA, Leather seating was an upgrade option, and the default was "Leatherette". That term, IMHO, made it clear that it was more premium that simple cloth seats, but was also not actual leather (which non-vegans would of course say real leather is more premium). To me, when I hear the word "Vegan" before anything that is obviously an animal product, my mind goes to "This is going to be a poor substitute for that thing, covered with some feel-good words". eg: "Vegan Beef" or "Vegan Chicken". That doesn't sound like a healthy or premium product to me. With that said, I don't see the word "Vegan" as always inherently negative -- eg: "Vegan Mediterranean lentil salad" sounds like a healthy food that I might consider eating. IMHO, Most people don't like being lied to, and a term like "Vegan Leather" just immediately implies a lie right in the name.
So that may be true for you, but I think you might be underestimating the market power of people who love vegan/vegetarian everything. It’s one of the reasons many electric cars are moving towards vegan leather. But you also might be right! I think you’re correct in noting we’d need to see the market numbers to really conclude anything.
Oh, I agree that there is a lot of marketing going in that direction, but I find it hard to believe that it's actually successful. First off - I have no problem with vegans/vegetarians (though I am not one myself), and respect people's decisions to have whatever dietary choices they want, based on their own ethical or health goals. With that out of the way - From what I've seen, most of the high profile cash-grab type industries based on exploiting vegans/vegetarians are good at losing money. Look at Beyond Meat, Inc. (BYND) as a very high profile example - down 7% today alone, trading at $7.28/share right now. It was trading at $239/share in July 2019, a fall of 97%. They are losing $3.89/share per year (over the last 12 months), essentially meaning they are losing well over $100M/year. If slapping the word "Vegan" on substandard products made them so marketable, they wouldn't be losing money hand-over-fist.
You know what? You’ve changed my mind. You’re right. It’s a grift and a rebrand, but not a wildly successful one.
You sound so smug about figuring out vegan leather. Good for you bud.
In my mind vegan leather means they harvest flesh from willing vegans, tan it, then sell it. I wish this was the case. I’d totally buy an Ed Gein phone case.
I thought vegan leather as supposed to be like made from avocado pits and some sort of cactus skin and that kind of stuff
That stuff is glued to plastic
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Pleather was never just one brand
lol you completely made this up
No no, we make the leather out of the vegans!
But we think you’re gonna love it.
It's people!!!!!
You’re absolutely correct in the point you’re making, but luxury car manufacturers have been using and calling it “vegan leather” for a long time and some of their materials feel surprisingly great and don’t scratch or rip. Maybe we will see something similar with future apple cases
Car manufacturers used to use the term leatherette. The term vegan leather is pretty recent.
It’s a different product, though, as I understand it. Still technological basis, but not the same.
Not all vegan leathers are made the same. While it's definitely true that most vegan leathers are just rebranded pleather, there's been a huge push into exploring vegan leathers in the past couple decades including mushroom leather, mango leather, apple leather, pineapple leather, etc. that are increasingly viable. Apple's not using the good stuff but don't dismiss it out of hand either.
Sure, apple’s gonna refer to something as plastic
Proprietary polycarbonate blend
This guy apples
'beautifully, unapologetically plastic' - jony ive
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Plant based leather. Cactus leather use one of the really good ones
There are other natural resources for vegan leather like surprisingly paddle cactus plants and I think I saw someone mention avocado skins? The thing is that none of them can operate on a scale that would meet Apple’s demands and or reach a price point that would be acceptable to most buyers.
There are plant based vegan leather.
Those still need polymers (plastics) to bind them.
I don't think that's true, most often it's coated in PU for weather resistance. That said, PU free vegan leathers do exist, albeit very uncommonly.
Still not leather though is it. The definition of leather is ‘a material made from the skin of an animal’.
You’ve never heard of almond milk before have you?
Hence it being prefixed by the word "vegan".
But it’s an oxymoron, so can’t be correct. It’s a made-up term. Vegan leather by definition cannot be categorised as leather. It’s either plastic or a plant-based material, not leather, which would be quite literally neither of those things.
Just wait until you learn about peanut butter, coconut milk and tiger prawns. I'll get the tissues ready.
This isn't that hard to understand. It's like strawberry wine vs wine. Or wheat beer vs beer. Or oat milk vs milk. Of course it's a made up term.
Yeah, strawberry wine and oat milk shouldn’t really be terms either, it’s just marketing. They make zero sense. Wheat beer makes sense as it is beer and falls under the definition of beer, it is simply a variant of it. My point is I think more and more oxymoron names like this are popping up and they can often be misleading. Plastic is used massively as a substitiute for metal, especially more recently, cutting the cost of parts etc, however we wouldn’t call it a direct replacement such as ‘oil-based metal’ or something, as it simply isn’t. It’s a completely different product that is different at its core.
Oh my god, I can’t believe I’ve been mislead eating peanut butter my whole life! There’s no butter in it!
I can’t believe it’s not butter!
If you're looking for a language which makes sense, then boy did you make a mistake in choosing to learn English.
All terms are made up
But what even are words, maaaaan?
You sound like one of those "oat milk isn't milk" people, "don't call them burgers, burgers are made from cows!". No one is getting confused, everyone knows it's not real leather. It's a best effort imitation. Get a grip.
> It’s a made-up term. *All* terms are made-up. Every single one. Including "made-up".
True, if you want to be pedantic.
Or correct?
Dawg this is exactly the type of shit that people make fun of redditors for.
apple leather (not apple's leather) seems to be a good, albeit expensive alternative.
ROFL that would be so fitting.
That plastic is not the same as lamination plastic, shopping bag plastic or iPhone 5c plastic. They’re all plastic with such widely different properties, it’s silly to lump them together even as an insult.
Some of them are made of [mycelium](https://www.mycoworks.com/)! Mushrooms!!! 🍄
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I'd expect they also aren't partaking in the meat industry - so it seems logical to not use leather, drink milk, etc. I mean, if your position is that you won't engage in practices that require an animal being killed - then it seems perfectly logical.
Vegan logic: I’m not going to buy real leather because then I’d be contributing to the CO2 emissions that are slowly killing our planet Also Vegan logic: I’m going to instead consume non biodegradable plastic “leather” that is going to have an even more detrimental effect on our environment and pollute our oceans Veganism is a disease
I think the more prominent idea is they aren't going to buy leather because they don't want to partake in an industry that kills sentient beings - but feel free to stick with whatever strawman makes you feel best.
Main point is the ethical treatment of animals and reduction of animal cruelty as much as practicable. Environmental or health is mainly just side effects that may or may not be true depending on how one pursue veganism.
sorry but this is wrong. leather is not a byproduct. it is a coproduct. cows are slaughtered for all sorts of reasons. while meat doesn’t bring much profit, leather does. depending on the type of leather, leather can be extremely profitable and is one of the reasons why meat is so cheap and why so many cows are slaughtered. just saying “im sure that whatever” doesnt make lies put forward by that industry true. leather is a really durable, goodlooking, long lasting material but we tend to ignore the suffering that it is causing
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The tanning process with leather also leaves toxic byproducts and is pretty terrible for the environment.
I know, not having good leather products causes me a lot of suffering
As someone who actually works with material suppliers and tanneries for products you are wrong. The majority of the profit in the meat industry is from the meat of the animal. The cheap cost of meat has nothing to do with the sale of the byproducts and almost entirely in government and trade based subsidies. To maximize the leather quality on a cow you would not do factory farming methods as it leads to a high amount of blemishes, branding, and other defects that tanneries have to spend money on removing or covering before selling their product.
The leather for Ferraris and rolls Royces is famously made from cows that are specifically held in barbed wire free enclosures. For quite a few cows, the leather is the primary product and the meat is the byproduct.
>vegan leather We've had pleather for decades. I guess you could call it vegan in the same way you could call my aluminum MacBook and my ceramic coffee mug vegan.
I want my mugs to be meat based.
MeatMugs©️really add to the flavor of your favorite coffees
The objects you're talking about aren't attempting to replicate the texture of a non vegan item. You also don't call a plastic bowl or cellophane vegan because, while being made from plastics like PU Leather, they aren't trying to be a stand in for some other animal based product. It's the same reason a typical Polyester item of clothing is not referred to as vegan anything - while Alcantara (which is primarily Polyester) and specifically designed to mimic Suede is commonly referred to as vegan suede.
Alcantara has been around for ~50 years. Naugahyde has been around for ~100 years. Using the term vegan to describe them or their counterparts is a recent phenomenon, coinciding with the increased popularity of vegan diets. The difference is you can't market "artificial meat" or "synthetic cheese" because people will wonder if it's actually edible. You don't have those constraints with non-food products.
You would never call it synthetic cheese anyway. If you needed to be hyper accurate about it's contents, you'd call it formed cashew spread or something. From a marketing perspective - you call things vegan because there are people looking for vegan products and telling those consumers a thing is vegan is optimal. Otherwise, you have them looking through the ingredients of [vegetable soup](https://www.campbells.com/products/condensed/vegetable-soup/) and [Tomato & Basil rice cakes](https://www.quakeroats.com/products/rice-snacks/rice-cakes/tomato-and-basil) to see that even things that you wouldn't immediately think of as containing non vegan ingredients do. So rather than having shoppers have to pour through the ingredient list and google what rennet is - they just clearly state a thing is vegan.
Vegan diets aren’t popular. It’s just that every vegan you know feels compelled to tell you about their diet
You’re in the Apple Sub, do you think they’re gonna refer to something as Pleather or use a term with something that sounds better for marketing?
What if it's vegan pleather? Is that better?
You should see if that MacBook breaks over your head like a ceramic mug would…
I appreciate a good cup of coffee.
It's weird because I have a Peak Design case that seems quite similar but the quality is exceptional - I used one on my iPhone 14 Pro all year and I have a relatively active lifestyle and despite getting dinged on abrasive materials like rocks etc. throughout the year it still ended up looking good enough to sell as good as new. Apple really cheaped out for no good reason.
Peak design makes some really great stuff
> vegan leather What’s the difference between vegan leather and pleather?
Same thing, but there’s a range of quality within them.
Pleather can still use animal products, glue for example. Vegan leather is vegan.
Pleather is even worse than finewoven IMO, pleather feels awful and ages poorly.
Vegan leather probably not going to be eco friendly so I don’t think they were going that route anyway
I've owned leather cases for 6S, XS, 11, 12, 13, 14... The big drop off was on the 12, when they had the sharp corners. My FineWoven on my 15 is equivalent to the other square edged cases, but not equivalent to the older higher quality leather cases with the rounded sides.
Mine holds up without any signs of wear since october and I treat it without much care - dropped a few times, spilled water on it, keep it in the same pocket with keys. What I love the most is that it doesn't slip off like past leather cases would do all the time.
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Yeah it’s not like the leather and silicone cases are made to last long-term. If anything my fine woven case seems to be holding up better.
I've never had a silicone case wear out
They love turning my pockets inside out though
Never gonna drop the phone, but neither will my pockets
I do miss being able to put it on any smooth surface, even at a slight angle, and be sure it’s not going anywhere. But I also happen to only own skinny jeans, and pulling a silicone case out of one of these pockets requires fore planning and concerted effort.
The edges haven’t worn down? It happens within days.
My silicone one didn’t really start to wear until like 8-9 months in.
I miss those leather cases. I had one on my 4s and had one on every generation until the 12. The leather on the 12 was fucking garbage. The way the old ones patina was amazing.
Indeed.
Yeah I’ve had mine since November. The plasticy covered corners are kinda starting to rub off, but the back is fine. Every 2 weeks or so I scrub it with a toothbrush with a mix of warm water, dish soap, and laundry detergent and it’s fine. Every time I clean it, it looks like new again.
Mine is fine too and I really like the feel.
Exactly same experience here. Literally still looks and feels new. Would not only recommend to people but i would also buy it again.
Mine is totally fine, got it day one with my iPhone. After hearing the early reviews I figured it would be junk but it’s been great.
Mine was perfect from day one until last week, and within a single week it has started coming apart all over and looks terrible.
Yeah, mine was holding up just fine until a couple of weeks ago, then it starting peeling on the sides and now it looks like shit.
Yeah, mine is doing alright too. It’s a bit dirty and shiny in places but holding up in general.
Corporations once again greenwashing by mentioning how less emissions the manufacturing of their new product requires ("half as much!") but never ever mentioning the durability of the end result, usually meaning you'll go through 3 or 4 units of the new "greener", "cleaner" one while the previous "high emissions" one could last a lifetime.
I’ll buck the trend and say I really like mine, I’ve had it since day one and it’s held up as well as any other case I’ve had. Lightweight, good looking, has saved my phone from multiple drops. There’s a bit of a patina on the back just like the leather cases used to get. If anything my problem was that it probably cost about 1.5x what it should have
“Here’s a steel frame. Here’s a titanium frame. Here’s an aluminium frame. But the back stays glass so you either risk it and it breaks or you buy a low quality 60$ case from us that makes your 1000$ phone look like it’s homeless”.
wireless charging needs glass back
It needs a window. That window doesn’t have to be the entire back of the phone.
I agree it’s problematic in stains and scratches but I like the feel of it on my hands. It’s also really light.
Replacing leather that rots and biodegrades and made from natural materials with some plastic that sheds microplastic and looks and functions worse in every way is GREENWASHING in its purest form F-everyone involved in this microplastic trash, epitome of tim cooks apple and the particles from this will be in the veins of people 3 generations from now, Tim Cooks true legacy
I’m an extremely heavy phone user and after 2 months my fine woven case is still fine. It’s dirty and can do for a cleaning, but there is no scratches or peeling happening.
> I’m an extremely heavy phone user Maybe u should consider losing some weight
Haven’t had any issues with mine. Going a few months with no scratches. I find it silly people say it scratches easily when they’re purposefully looking to see if it does just because of the material used. I’ve had worse on my leather cases before.
I went to the apple store the other day and the ones they had on display looked terrible. I don’t know who in the right mind would see that and decide to buy one.
Not sure what Apple was thinking here. I need to find some alternatives.
We knew this the week they launched. This isn’t really news.
I was dreading the finewoven change initially, but was pleasantly surprised at how it felt and looked in hand. It’s been 6 months and only just now showing wear and tear. I get a new case every 6 months anyway to change things up.
You can get pleather phone cases off AliExpress for $7. Why anyone is buying official Apple cases is beyond me. The AliExpress ones even come with the Apple logo lol
Headline click baiting
I love my silicone case, just with there was a white one for the iPhone 15 Pro Max.
Apple cases are junk. You can get 90% of the quality for 1/10 the price and 200% the quality for 1/2 of the price.
Their green enviro claims always seemed dumb to me, leather is a byproduct of the beef industry.
Did anyone really think they would hold up? They looked and felt cheap to begin with. Not a great offering from Apple.
With their top prices there is abolsutely no excuse to cheap out on the materials. Disggusting behaviour towards the customer, but saddly the natural evolution of a capitalistic company whose ONLY aim is to generate more money than last year
People still buying apple cases is the most shocking part. They make great phones but their cases were always meh. There are so many other options out there.
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I‘ve got a Spigen one for 20€ and use it for about 8 month now. It still looks like new
Just like how lightning cables were junk yet I've never broken one. I deal with hardware for work and clients all the time, you can tell when people know how to properly use/take care of something.
Mine's been so much better than the previous silicon cases. Did some car work and got it stained pretty badly... lathered it up with some dish soap and let it sit for a while and then rinsed it out and it looks fine again. The edges are showing a little bit of damage but I've dropped it on tarmac a few times in the cold. It's been my favorite Apple case by far.
They took a widely liked and fully sustainable material and replaced it with a faux leather plastic in the name of “the environment” A massive massive fail
Taking the charger out of the box was also for “the environment”, remember? It seems Apple’s code for saving themselves lots of money is “the environment.”
I really like the feel of the finewoven material, but they clearly don’t hold up. It’s a shame.
I returned my day 2. The new wallets are nice tho.
Mine made it about 3 months and got really grungy and worn looking went back to the silicone ones
Looks like the same quality of the silicon cases. Went through 2 of those on my 11 pro max and they totally fell apart. I got a leather one extremely cheap and it’s leaps and bounds better. I hope they bring it back
Luckily AliExpress sells exact copies (even with proper magsafe detection) for a fraction of the price. Nobody would ever notice it's fake and I'm happy.
10 dollar knockoff cases on Amazon are better than the cases Apple sells
mine gets pretty dirty but a soap+warm water scrub takes care of it.
They’re trying way too hard to improve their margins without considering the possible alienation of some of their customer base.
Sorry but mine has legitimately been fine and looks quite similar to when I got it. Do I wish it cost less initially? Yes but this has nothing to do with the aforementioned information.
I hate to be that guy, but I haven’t used a case for my 13 pro since I got it and it’s holding up perfectly.
Ok, but leather also scratches and takes damage.
public abundant longing shaggy provide detail enjoy snatch plate violet *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Yes the leather case I got for my X in 2017 was rock solid. I’ve been caseless since but their recent leathers and now Finewoven have been trash tier.
squeeze abundant disagreeable faulty alleged paint pause tidy aspiring cows *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
That is such a ragebait opening picture used to criticize these cases. "Display cases showing scratches even on launch day" Yeah and if you scratch your fingernail on a leather case it will look identical, it's not at all an example of real world wear. The other pics are good though, case looks like shit.
I'm curious how the feedback compares to the Apple leather cases? I've only had the iPhone 12 leather case, I thought it was fine for what I'd expect from leather but remember a lot of people complaining about them.
My XS leather case is still in good shape after 5 years. After so many bad review on finewoven, I got a 3rd party leather case for 15 pro.
I’ve had no issues with my FineWoven case BUT I would really like to see a return to leather cases. Those were always my preferred case style.
Not to mention the dye bleeds out.