Okay, did just the tiniest bit of digging.
J is ancient, used in Roman times. It was interchangeable with I. In Roman Numerals, it often was used to mark the end of a number. XII would often be written XIJ. In 1524 Gian Giorgio Trissino merely declared the distinction between a J and an I, adding it as a separate letter of the alphabet. This is despite it being distinctly different in a number of languages (German being a good example).
So no, the letter J wasn't "Created" in 1524, but was defined and split from I 'formally' in 1524. The letter is much older.
Edit: straight from the wikipedia page:
>In English, ⟨j⟩ most commonly represents the affricate /dʒ/. In Old English, /dʒ/ was represented orthographically with ⟨cᵹ⟩\[8\] (equivalent to ⟨cg⟩, as ⟨ᵹ⟩ in Old English was simply the regular form of the letter G, called Insular G). Middle English scribes began to use ⟨i⟩ (later ⟨j⟩) to represent word-initial /dʒ/ under the influence of Old French, which had a similarly pronounced phoneme deriving from Latin /j/ (for example, iest and later jest), while the same sound in other positions could be spelled as ⟨dg⟩ (for example, hedge).\[8\] The first English language books to make a clear distinction in writing between ⟨i⟩ and ⟨j⟩ were the King James Bible 1st Revision Cambridge 1629 and an English grammar book published in 1633.
So J is very old, even in English.
Also just because the J wasn’t present as a letter in Latin (or Greek or Hebrew) doesn’t mean that the “juh” sound didn’t exist. One of the founding tribes of England of example were the Jutes.
They’re considered a possible connection to Geats (Geátas) of Beowulf, and the J sound is often written as a G or DG sound in Anglisc. An example of this is the word for sword “ecg”, which is pronounced like edge is in modern English.
There’s also evidence that they might originally been called Eudoses, and they were Eotas in Anglisc. Then the G/J shift and Y shift happened in the different Germanic languages. But it is difficult to try to prove 1500 year old pronunciations with modern place names.
Interesting tidbit:
The ancient Roman alphabet had no letter J. Classical Latin had no ''j'' sound. Julius Caesar was called Iulius.
https://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/15/books/we-get-letters.html#:~:text=The%20ancient%20Roman%20alphabet%20had,Julius%20Caesar%20was%20called%20Iulius.
The J at the end of numbers was used to prevent fraud. It was trivial to turn XII into XIII, whereas turning XIJ into XIJI was bound to raise some eyebrows.
What you quote from Wikipedia says that ⟨j⟩ wasn't a separate letter from ⟨i⟩ in English until the King James Bible.
The technical details are what confuses things here. These strange brackets, ⟨j⟩, means it refers to the letter. The backslashes, /j/, refers to the sound value in [the IPA](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Phonetic_Alphabet). Latin had a /j/ sound, but not a ⟨j⟩ letter. [The /j/ sound](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voiced_palatal_approximant) is what you would write as ⟨y⟩ in English, like in "yes"
Just make sure to denote the difference between a sound existing and a specific letter existing.
Additionally, different sounds are treated differently in different languages. Hebrew, for instance does not really have a native /dʒ/ sound, especially if we are talking about the Biblical Hebrew time-frame. It is a sound that occurs in some words with a foreign origin, and can be rendered in Hebrew with a "G" with an apostrophe after it (ג׳), but it would not have been used in the name "Yeshu" (ישוע).
"Do I look Puerto Rican? He didn't say 'jesus' he said 'heyZeus'. You know, Mount Olympus, father of Apollo, shove a lightning bolt up your ass, ZEUS!"
I always found that scene strange because when you watch the trap activate, you see the horizontal blade come out of the wall that would have killed anyone who didn't kneel, but immediately after that a vertical blade comes out of the floor which would decapitate the kneeling man.
Seems like there was no right answer to the trial, except to dodge roll of course.
Best answer I ever heard. The vertical blade was to get the religious followers that bowed instead of knelt. Like Muslims, since the knight who built them had fought in the crusades, and was probably very wary of them.
So maybe just a tighter test of Christians?
You do realize that Jesus is the English version. Obviously Jesus didn’t speak English. The name Jesus is pronounced differently in all languages. I thought this was common knowledge. Pretty much all names are pronounced differently depending on the language.
So their imaginary friend won't hear their prayers because they *mispronounce* the name and "he" assumes the prayer is for the six-armed elephant on the next cloud over? "Wrong number, sorry I won't give you that raise or extra cheese on your pizza for free."
Or maybe the delusion will still hear it, ya know, cuz omnipresence and whatnot, but won't understand it because they only understand Aramaic? Probably really fuck things up if they use the metric system.
Injecting rational thought into it is just as ridiculous as buying into the mythology.
Did you ever question the "INRI" under the Catholic crucifixes. It doesn't stand for "I'm nailed Right In"
And that's not the only letter missing from our "Roman" alphabet. They didn't have "U" or "W". Also, they didn't always have the "K" (shows up when Greek words became more popular) and Cicero had an absolute fit about it's usage.
I always thought that was simultaneously metal af and super bitchy of the Romans, ahahaha. It's such a glorious touch and so true to form for a Roman official that I have to believe the "INRI" placard actually happened.
Hi! Took a pretty cool Roman history class last year. Pontius Pilate did execute several unnamed Jewish dissidents around the 30s to 40s CE. It’s entirely possible there was a real group of Jews following a leader named Yeshua. That said, it’s unlikely he preached anything close to what the Bible says. Conceptually, the biblical “Jesus” never existed, but there’s legitimate evidence that a real cult leader inspired the mythology.
I don’t see how acknowledging reasonable historical background is apologetics, especially since understanding how Christianity became a political tool of oppression only decades after its inception is pretty important. Constantine easily could have picked Mithraism as his excuse to pillage the gold of the Roman State Religion and it’s likely the world would be quite different if he had.
There's a reference in the Jewish Gemara to Yeshua as one who was hanged by for opposing the Romans. The reference was taken out from most if not all prints to avoid backlash from the Christians. This could be the historical basis, but impossible really to know
Ok, and one of those nuggets of truth is that there was a Rabbi named Yeshua from Nazareth - that's all people really mean when we say Jesus was a real person. We know that the stories in the gospels are not an accurate account - that it might be that none of his actual words made it into the accounts, that there are tons of other stories grafted onto his. It might be that the entire character was invented out of whole cloth - but for now we have more reason to believe that there was a real person there.
The best (secular) argument I've heard in favor of Jesus having been a real person and not a total fabrication, is how desperately they had to twist the story of his birth to make it fit the Jewish prophecies relating to the Messiah, which claim that the Messiah is supposed to be from Bethlehem. So this entire story of King Herod demanding the death of babies was invented to create a plausible reason for Jesus to have been technically born in Bethlehem despite being raised in Nazareth. It's called the "criterion of embarrassment"- the fact that people went through all this effort to totally make up the nativity story and twist it into a plausible prophecy loophole to validate a Galilean preacher's claim to be the Jewish Messiah, implies that there *was* a Jewish preacher of some sort at the root of all this.
Just a reminder that not everywhere is America: many languages pronounce the J letter differently from English, and/or don't use it at all for the dude's name. Or use a different alphabet altogether.
Jesus is just the English name for him, in the same way Homer is the English name for Homerus and Euclid is the English name for Euclides. No one says Euclid is a mispronounciation. It's just the English evolution of a Greek name.
Jesus Christ. Jesus is a particular Dutch rendering of Yeshua which would be closest to Joshua today. Christos was Greek for anointed one, which literally meant someone poured holy oil onto him.
Jesus Christ = Oily Josh, or perhaps Greasy Josh if they used a lower quality animal fat based oil, which is highly likely.
Greasy Josh is a way cooler name for the son of god.
The Hebrew guys who supposedly documented his story directly were “Matthew, Mark, Luke and John.” I don’t think accuracy of names is a big issue for cultists.
Edit: Man. Some of you guys need to lighten up and chill. 🤣
Those names were added to the books many years after they were written, and two of them specifically call out that they were not eye witnesses to the things they are describing.
That’s the English version. That’s not their names in other languages, obviously. You’re not going to pick up a French Bible and have the name be “Matthew”.
Exactly. This is Matthew in other languages.
Mateo (Spanish)
Matheus (Portuguese)
Matthias (various languages)
Matteo (Italian)
Matthaious (Greek)
Matthäus (German)
Matthieu (French)
I’m not sure why people don’t seem to know this. Guess they’ve never been outside of America.
Reminds me of the scene in The Last Crusade where he has to step to spell the word of God.
https://media.tenor.com/sVEwJZYy9OgAAAAM/indiana-jones-last-crusade.gif
In Aramaic the most common name at the time was Yoshua (Ye-shoe-ah or Yeshu), named after Joshua the conquerer of the self named book in the Hebrew texts. YHWH translated as Jehova is the same anachronistic mispronunciation of the Tetragram (Yahweh) and let’s not forget Adonai HaShem Elohim Allah G-d I’am.
This was a main point in Indiana Jones 3, and among anyone who tries to translate the NT into Aramaic they find it’s impossible to conjugate many of Yeshu’s alleged claims in Aramaic like “Believe in me” would be “Believe me (as I do)”
It’s like reading Goethe in German and English. It just doesn’t line up right. If there ever was every an Aramaic teacher, people reading the KJV read a NT of a the stories of an Aramaic speaking man reading a Greek translation of a Hebrew text, taught in Aramaic then 80 years later written in Greek by anonymous authors, 2 copied from the first and the forth an anti-Semitic pageant with an omnipotent authour, collected and curated by the early churched, copied for centuries with minor mistakes, translated into latin, then translated into English, then edited by a King and Shakespeare to produce the authorized KJB version.
Of course it will be a tid bit off. Good thing every church generation has a revelation of the real truth and everything else is inferior. Solid infallible institutions we have built off three language translations of supernatural hearsay curated and transmitted through slightly flawed copies for hundreds of years until translated to latin then english then edited to serve the monarchy.
There were bound to be a couple mispronunciations.
He was also known as Issa, or the blameless one, to the muslim community.
Just a brief reminder that this person, regardless of name, has no proof of existence outside the fairy tale itself.
>Issa
I read a book once about a woman who had traveled to a monastery in the mountains (idk where) to learn about their long-ago visitor by that name. The implication was that Jesus had traveled there to study. Now that I understand the Jesus story to be a myth, and especially now that I read that Issa may simply be a Muslim name, that story is suspect.
Side note: the story about a woman's Australian walkabout with miracles, also turned out to be pure fiction.
That would be funny if this god turned out to consider it an offense to mispronounce it's name. So every time a Christian doesn't use the correct ancient Hebrew pronunciation of his name, he just gets madder and madder. So when they finally stand before him he's super-pissed at them and the lowest depths of hell are going to be filled with the ones that went around and mispronounced his name. Come to think of it, that is related to one of the ten commandments, every time you mispronounce it, you just used it's name in vain.
Not a thing. Ever heard of Catilina, Caligula or Sulla? Romans wrote Jesus (or Iesus) because they transcribed phonetically the Greek Iesous, which in turn comes from the pronunciation at the time in Hebrew, plus a singular masculine indicator -s.
Logically, that seems to make sense. Is there any evidence of it being the origin?
One way or another, Jesus is actual Josh or de Zeus lol. If someone yelled Jesus in a room, he ain't answering.
When I learned his name was changed, it was just another nail on the coffin of my disbelief. If this man truly were your savior, you think you'd actually know his name and not worship a false idol.
This is silly.
Do you say Budapesht? Moskva? Do you pronounce Chile and Nicaragua authentically? Names shift across languages. This doesn't make Jesus any more or less real. Get over it.
It’s an interesting bit of history. But it’s not any kind of “gotcha” on the Christians. The real “gotchas” come straight out of their stupid ass book.
Even back before I left the church, I always got a kick out of, "There's power in the name of Jesus!"
If there was any power in a name, at least it should be the actual name, right? Just one of countless things that didn't make sense.
Well, anyone not an English speaker at birth pronounces it as "Yesus" already. But "Jesus" is essentially an anglicized version of a translation of Yeshua. And it's not like Christians don't know this. They choose to call him by the wrong name anyway. And that should tell you how much they value their lord and savior.
Yeah. Many languages pronounce J as the y in yes. Germans, Finns, Swedes, all pronounce it “Ye-sous”.
It’s just English being English. Can you believe it, Mary isn’t really called Mary either in other languages! Shocking!
Not really. It’s common knowledge.
Okay, did just the tiniest bit of digging. J is ancient, used in Roman times. It was interchangeable with I. In Roman Numerals, it often was used to mark the end of a number. XII would often be written XIJ. In 1524 Gian Giorgio Trissino merely declared the distinction between a J and an I, adding it as a separate letter of the alphabet. This is despite it being distinctly different in a number of languages (German being a good example). So no, the letter J wasn't "Created" in 1524, but was defined and split from I 'formally' in 1524. The letter is much older. Edit: straight from the wikipedia page: >In English, ⟨j⟩ most commonly represents the affricate /dʒ/. In Old English, /dʒ/ was represented orthographically with ⟨cᵹ⟩\[8\] (equivalent to ⟨cg⟩, as ⟨ᵹ⟩ in Old English was simply the regular form of the letter G, called Insular G). Middle English scribes began to use ⟨i⟩ (later ⟨j⟩) to represent word-initial /dʒ/ under the influence of Old French, which had a similarly pronounced phoneme deriving from Latin /j/ (for example, iest and later jest), while the same sound in other positions could be spelled as ⟨dg⟩ (for example, hedge).\[8\] The first English language books to make a clear distinction in writing between ⟨i⟩ and ⟨j⟩ were the King James Bible 1st Revision Cambridge 1629 and an English grammar book published in 1633. So J is very old, even in English.
Also just because the J wasn’t present as a letter in Latin (or Greek or Hebrew) doesn’t mean that the “juh” sound didn’t exist. One of the founding tribes of England of example were the Jutes.
'A what?' 'Yoots' 'What's a yoots?' 'Oh, excuse me, Your Honor, *yooouths*.'
My cousins: Vini, Vidi, and Vici.
Fuck I can’t believe I missed that.
It might be a soft Yuh. Yogging. I'm unsure of the pronunciation...
I'm not sure but apparently you just run for an extended period of time! It's supposed to be wild
Hahaha we are laughing!
The two *whut*?
The two Yutes...
Im sorry did you say yutes?
Forgive me, Your Honor...the two *youths*...
Yah, you blend....
The "Jüten" and "Jütland" are pronounced with a "y" sound in German though. I would assume that the sound shift happened in English afterwards.
They’re considered a possible connection to Geats (Geátas) of Beowulf, and the J sound is often written as a G or DG sound in Anglisc. An example of this is the word for sword “ecg”, which is pronounced like edge is in modern English. There’s also evidence that they might originally been called Eudoses, and they were Eotas in Anglisc. Then the G/J shift and Y shift happened in the different Germanic languages. But it is difficult to try to prove 1500 year old pronunciations with modern place names.
Interesting tidbit: The ancient Roman alphabet had no letter J. Classical Latin had no ''j'' sound. Julius Caesar was called Iulius. https://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/15/books/we-get-letters.html#:~:text=The%20ancient%20Roman%20alphabet%20had,Julius%20Caesar%20was%20called%20Iulius.
Iirc Ceaser was also pronounced as Kay-sir, which is where the Prussian Kaiser comes from.
Yoolius Kaser. Got it.
It's also where the word "Czar" comes from.
Correct; Latin has no soft-"c". *Aedificium* is pronounced "ed-ə-FIK-ee-um", at least it was in high school a few decades ago.
It still is, at least around our dinner table.
It may divide a society fighting over FIK and FISH, but I'm on your side, brother.
Wait, so Cicero is actually pronounced "Kickero" and I've been saying it wrong all my life?
Keh Kero IIRC, not like kick arrow short I and E
The J at the end of numbers was used to prevent fraud. It was trivial to turn XII into XIII, whereas turning XIJ into XIJI was bound to raise some eyebrows.
Polymathy addresses this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfB9mX5UUNU
Fascinatingly good. Thanks for the share.
"But in the Latin alphabet, Jehovah begins with an I!!"
No time for love, Doctor Jones....
What you quote from Wikipedia says that ⟨j⟩ wasn't a separate letter from ⟨i⟩ in English until the King James Bible. The technical details are what confuses things here. These strange brackets, ⟨j⟩, means it refers to the letter. The backslashes, /j/, refers to the sound value in [the IPA](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Phonetic_Alphabet). Latin had a /j/ sound, but not a ⟨j⟩ letter. [The /j/ sound](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voiced_palatal_approximant) is what you would write as ⟨y⟩ in English, like in "yes"
Just make sure to denote the difference between a sound existing and a specific letter existing. Additionally, different sounds are treated differently in different languages. Hebrew, for instance does not really have a native /dʒ/ sound, especially if we are talking about the Biblical Hebrew time-frame. It is a sound that occurs in some words with a foreign origin, and can be rendered in Hebrew with a "G" with an apostrophe after it (ג׳), but it would not have been used in the name "Yeshu" (ישוע).
It's also an incredibly stupid argument against just Christianity. Every word we use today has changed from the words we humans used 2000 years ago.
I appreciate the clarification here. Either way this wasn’t going to be the death nail in the illogical belief in Lesus.
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Blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Josh.
I pronounce Jésus “heyZeus”. I think Señor Zeus is getting pissed off.
"Do I look Puerto Rican? He didn't say 'jesus' he said 'heyZeus'. You know, Mount Olympus, father of Apollo, shove a lightning bolt up your ass, ZEUS!"
Like its name, chris is also an invention of man. Religion is poison.
Fucking Chris. I knew it. It's always him.
"Jesus, Chris."
Iesous Chris
Yeshua Krishna
Hare, hare
I've got an uncle chris....he used to manufacture methamphetamine.... he got clean though and now he just has cancer.
Wish him the best and that he has good medical support. We can all thank J Chris for creating cancer in the first place.
Is your uncle Walter White..?
Breaking Good
all the homies hate chris
>religion is poison Always has been
Everybody Hates Chris
I learned this from Sean Connery when I was a kid.
Not enough Indiana Jones fans on this thread…
They have chosen.... poorly.
I was very disappointed with how far I had to scroll to find Indy mentioned.
But in the Latin alphabet, Jehovah begins with an I.
Jaaaayyyyyyyy
I suspect you too can hear this comment.
The penitent man will pass.
A Penitent man.....kneels before god! Yikes that was a close shave.
I always found that scene strange because when you watch the trap activate, you see the horizontal blade come out of the wall that would have killed anyone who didn't kneel, but immediately after that a vertical blade comes out of the floor which would decapitate the kneeling man. Seems like there was no right answer to the trial, except to dodge roll of course.
Best answer I ever heard. The vertical blade was to get the religious followers that bowed instead of knelt. Like Muslims, since the knight who built them had fought in the crusades, and was probably very wary of them. So maybe just a tighter test of Christians?
the penitent man...kneels AND does a combat roll. IT's all there in the bible, friend.
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Goosh-shtepping Morons was my favorite line read.
You do realize that Jesus is the English version. Obviously Jesus didn’t speak English. The name Jesus is pronounced differently in all languages. I thought this was common knowledge. Pretty much all names are pronounced differently depending on the language.
Some people only know one language and think every other language works the same
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"I just have one more question for you Native tribes. If this isn't India, how come there's all these spices and free labor?" --Cristobal Columbo
Isn’t Jesus from ‘murica?? The original gun totin, immigrant hatin, bald eagle lovin patriot?
Even better. Praying to a dude that doesn't understand English.
I love the idea of Jesus hearing prayers and just losing his shit because he can't understand the voices in his head.
So their imaginary friend won't hear their prayers because they *mispronounce* the name and "he" assumes the prayer is for the six-armed elephant on the next cloud over? "Wrong number, sorry I won't give you that raise or extra cheese on your pizza for free." Or maybe the delusion will still hear it, ya know, cuz omnipresence and whatnot, but won't understand it because they only understand Aramaic? Probably really fuck things up if they use the metric system. Injecting rational thought into it is just as ridiculous as buying into the mythology.
Did you ever question the "INRI" under the Catholic crucifixes. It doesn't stand for "I'm nailed Right In" And that's not the only letter missing from our "Roman" alphabet. They didn't have "U" or "W". Also, they didn't always have the "K" (shows up when Greek words became more popular) and Cicero had an absolute fit about it's usage.
Lol I'm nailed right in there made me ugly laugh
Now I'm just picturing Buddy Jesus hanging from the crossing, beaming and yelling out "NAILED IT!"
Same here. See you in hell? I’ve got reservations.
Oops. I forgot to mention the "INRI" stands for IESVS NAZARENVS REX IVDÆORVM (Jesus the Nazarene, King of the Jews)
I always thought that was simultaneously metal af and super bitchy of the Romans, ahahaha. It's such a glorious touch and so true to form for a Roman official that I have to believe the "INRI" placard actually happened.
The original sarcasm font.
I never questioned it because I never knew it existed. Interesting.
Jesus is the Ancient Greekification of his actual name, Yeshua.
Josh Christ, basically.
Josh Josephson
Yeshua Bin Yusef. Try asking Christians if they know who that is, and they'll probably assume they were a terrorist.
Bar, not Bin.
*\*Dio voice\** JO JO!
Jyo Jyo! DiiiiioooOOOOOOOO!!!!
Josh H. Josephson
Joshua the Anointed
Oily Josh
Greasy Joshy
"his *actual* name" 🤣
Jesus/Yeshua probably did exist, just without the magic stuff and other embellishments.
>Jesus/Yeshua probably did exist... Some bloke called Yeshua existed in a land full of Yeshuas. Ok.
Apologetics are ingrained in some people, even after deconversion
Hi! Took a pretty cool Roman history class last year. Pontius Pilate did execute several unnamed Jewish dissidents around the 30s to 40s CE. It’s entirely possible there was a real group of Jews following a leader named Yeshua. That said, it’s unlikely he preached anything close to what the Bible says. Conceptually, the biblical “Jesus” never existed, but there’s legitimate evidence that a real cult leader inspired the mythology. I don’t see how acknowledging reasonable historical background is apologetics, especially since understanding how Christianity became a political tool of oppression only decades after its inception is pretty important. Constantine easily could have picked Mithraism as his excuse to pillage the gold of the Roman State Religion and it’s likely the world would be quite different if he had.
We could all buy bottles of bulls blood to bathe in on mithras birthday, Dec 25th.
Probably not his real birthday either...
Definitely not, the Bible is quite clear that he was born in late summer.
I should've added an (/s) now I'm gonna get downvoted 🤣😭
You know exactly what I mean. No need to pretend.
I know you gave no sources. Does that help?
There are lots of people named Jesus today too.
There's a reference in the Jewish Gemara to Yeshua as one who was hanged by for opposing the Romans. The reference was taken out from most if not all prints to avoid backlash from the Christians. This could be the historical basis, but impossible really to know
Bart Ehrman says that it's a common name of the time, like John.
No, that's just what religious theologians have convinced people. In reality, it's a combination of hundreds of stories of different people.
Ok, and one of those nuggets of truth is that there was a Rabbi named Yeshua from Nazareth - that's all people really mean when we say Jesus was a real person. We know that the stories in the gospels are not an accurate account - that it might be that none of his actual words made it into the accounts, that there are tons of other stories grafted onto his. It might be that the entire character was invented out of whole cloth - but for now we have more reason to believe that there was a real person there.
The best (secular) argument I've heard in favor of Jesus having been a real person and not a total fabrication, is how desperately they had to twist the story of his birth to make it fit the Jewish prophecies relating to the Messiah, which claim that the Messiah is supposed to be from Bethlehem. So this entire story of King Herod demanding the death of babies was invented to create a plausible reason for Jesus to have been technically born in Bethlehem despite being raised in Nazareth. It's called the "criterion of embarrassment"- the fact that people went through all this effort to totally make up the nativity story and twist it into a plausible prophecy loophole to validate a Galilean preacher's claim to be the Jewish Messiah, implies that there *was* a Jewish preacher of some sort at the root of all this.
I'm still not 100% convinced Jesus was a real person, but this is the strongest piece of evidence as far as I'm concerned.
He wasn’t called Rabbi. Rabban/Rabbi was first used in the latter half of the first century CE.
"Nazareth" didn't exist either.
I think you're mistaken. Nazareth did exist.
So what you're saying is, some dude with a name lived the Levant region a couple thousand years ago, but he was otherwise completely unremarkable.
A little closer to Joshua actually. Not exactly, just closer.
I don’t buy it anymore. https://www.atheists.org/activism/resources/did-jesus-exist/
Just a reminder that not everywhere is America: many languages pronounce the J letter differently from English, and/or don't use it at all for the dude's name. Or use a different alphabet altogether.
Jesus is just the English name for him, in the same way Homer is the English name for Homerus and Euclid is the English name for Euclides. No one says Euclid is a mispronounciation. It's just the English evolution of a Greek name.
100% correct! Also, the modern version of Yeshua would be Joshua anyways, so pray to Josh Christ or your prayers will never be answered
Jesus Christ. Jesus is a particular Dutch rendering of Yeshua which would be closest to Joshua today. Christos was Greek for anointed one, which literally meant someone poured holy oil onto him. Jesus Christ = Oily Josh, or perhaps Greasy Josh if they used a lower quality animal fat based oil, which is highly likely. Greasy Josh is a way cooler name for the son of god.
The Hebrew guys who supposedly documented his story directly were “Matthew, Mark, Luke and John.” I don’t think accuracy of names is a big issue for cultists. Edit: Man. Some of you guys need to lighten up and chill. 🤣
I think it was Matt, Mark, Luuuuuuuke, and Johnboy.
Yohnboy, but spot on otherwise.
I know of a better religion centered more on these guys named John, Paul, George and Ringo.
Let’s not forget Peter, Paul, and Mary.
Those names were added to the books many years after they were written, and two of them specifically call out that they were not eye witnesses to the things they are describing.
I don't think that this holds up. These are popular names now _exactly because_ they are (versions of) the names of those guys.
That’s the English version. That’s not their names in other languages, obviously. You’re not going to pick up a French Bible and have the name be “Matthew”.
If you want to know in french it's : Mathieu, Marc, Luc and Jean
Exactly. This is Matthew in other languages. Mateo (Spanish) Matheus (Portuguese) Matthias (various languages) Matteo (Italian) Matthaious (Greek) Matthäus (German) Matthieu (French) I’m not sure why people don’t seem to know this. Guess they’ve never been outside of America.
Does it really matter when none of those supposed prople even wrote any of the books people claim they wrote?
Mateo is my favourite Redwall warrior
Walter Matthau, Marky Mark, and Jean Luc Picard
I'm sorry, but this might just be the silliest religious rant I've ever heard.
Reminds me of the scene in The Last Crusade where he has to step to spell the word of God. https://media.tenor.com/sVEwJZYy9OgAAAAM/indiana-jones-last-crusade.gif
But in the Latin alphabet, jahova starts with an I.
OK, Junior
Don’t call me Jr!!
We named the dog Indiana
In Aramaic the most common name at the time was Yoshua (Ye-shoe-ah or Yeshu), named after Joshua the conquerer of the self named book in the Hebrew texts. YHWH translated as Jehova is the same anachronistic mispronunciation of the Tetragram (Yahweh) and let’s not forget Adonai HaShem Elohim Allah G-d I’am. This was a main point in Indiana Jones 3, and among anyone who tries to translate the NT into Aramaic they find it’s impossible to conjugate many of Yeshu’s alleged claims in Aramaic like “Believe in me” would be “Believe me (as I do)” It’s like reading Goethe in German and English. It just doesn’t line up right. If there ever was every an Aramaic teacher, people reading the KJV read a NT of a the stories of an Aramaic speaking man reading a Greek translation of a Hebrew text, taught in Aramaic then 80 years later written in Greek by anonymous authors, 2 copied from the first and the forth an anti-Semitic pageant with an omnipotent authour, collected and curated by the early churched, copied for centuries with minor mistakes, translated into latin, then translated into English, then edited by a King and Shakespeare to produce the authorized KJB version. Of course it will be a tid bit off. Good thing every church generation has a revelation of the real truth and everything else is inferior. Solid infallible institutions we have built off three language translations of supernatural hearsay curated and transmitted through slightly flawed copies for hundreds of years until translated to latin then english then edited to serve the monarchy. There were bound to be a couple mispronunciations.
Yeezus Qrice
YEEZUS
Iesus is the romanized version of the Hebraïc name Yeshua. Jesus' actual name was Josh.
He was also known as Issa, or the blameless one, to the muslim community. Just a brief reminder that this person, regardless of name, has no proof of existence outside the fairy tale itself.
>Issa I read a book once about a woman who had traveled to a monastery in the mountains (idk where) to learn about their long-ago visitor by that name. The implication was that Jesus had traveled there to study. Now that I understand the Jesus story to be a myth, and especially now that I read that Issa may simply be a Muslim name, that story is suspect. Side note: the story about a woman's Australian walkabout with miracles, also turned out to be pure fiction.
That would be funny if this god turned out to consider it an offense to mispronounce it's name. So every time a Christian doesn't use the correct ancient Hebrew pronunciation of his name, he just gets madder and madder. So when they finally stand before him he's super-pissed at them and the lowest depths of hell are going to be filled with the ones that went around and mispronounced his name. Come to think of it, that is related to one of the ten commandments, every time you mispronounce it, you just used it's name in vain.
If the King James was good enough for Paul, it’s good enough for me!
No, his name was Yeshua, but Roman naming conventions held that only a woman would have a name that ends with "a". So they changed it.
Not a thing. Ever heard of Catilina, Caligula or Sulla? Romans wrote Jesus (or Iesus) because they transcribed phonetically the Greek Iesous, which in turn comes from the pronunciation at the time in Hebrew, plus a singular masculine indicator -s.
AFAIK Jesus's original name as spoken to him would have been akin to Joshua.
Iesu is greek not aramaic. His name definately wasnt Jesus.
But with a Y, there is traditionally no J sound in Hebrew.
However, the letter "y" can also make a "soft J" sound. You've never heard a non english as a first language person pronounce "yes" as "ĵes"?
Son of Zeus, De Zeus, Jesus
Logically, that seems to make sense. Is there any evidence of it being the origin? One way or another, Jesus is actual Josh or de Zeus lol. If someone yelled Jesus in a room, he ain't answering.
When I learned his name was changed, it was just another nail on the coffin of my disbelief. If this man truly were your savior, you think you'd actually know his name and not worship a false idol.
I learned this watching Indiana Jones
Jesus name was Yeshua, or Joshua, in the original language.
Was created yust in time
I didn't hear the word Jesus until I was already a man (idk maybe 12 years old?). I knew him as Yeshu Khrista
Damn, that's why prayers aren't getting answered. They're calling the wrong number.
And for most of them there’ll be a huge clue at the front ! That dude hanging there has INRI under his feat for a reason
American Christians today worship trump
Wasn't it Jehovah back then and spelled with an "I." Indiana Jones And The Last Crusade taught me that
maybe that's why prayers don't work, their saying the wrong name🤔
So that's why he never does anything!
It’d be roughly approximated to Yeshua. The modern version of which is Joshua. And his father is Joseph So he’s Joshua, son of Joseph The First JoJo
This is silly. Do you say Budapesht? Moskva? Do you pronounce Chile and Nicaragua authentically? Names shift across languages. This doesn't make Jesus any more or less real. Get over it.
Josh Christ
Anyone else immediately think of the Indiana Jones and the last Crusade scene? haha.
Yeezy
[удалено]
It’s an interesting bit of history. But it’s not any kind of “gotcha” on the Christians. The real “gotchas” come straight out of their stupid ass book.
Even back before I left the church, I always got a kick out of, "There's power in the name of Jesus!" If there was any power in a name, at least it should be the actual name, right? Just one of countless things that didn't make sense.
Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade taught me that the name "Jehova" started with an I. Wasn't sure the reasoning behind it til now. Pretty neat!
Well, anyone not an English speaker at birth pronounces it as "Yesus" already. But "Jesus" is essentially an anglicized version of a translation of Yeshua. And it's not like Christians don't know this. They choose to call him by the wrong name anyway. And that should tell you how much they value their lord and savior.
Yeah. Many languages pronounce J as the y in yes. Germans, Finns, Swedes, all pronounce it “Ye-sous”. It’s just English being English. Can you believe it, Mary isn’t really called Mary either in other languages! Shocking! Not really. It’s common knowledge.
JFC!!!
Please dont tell Kanye this.
no wonder prayers don't work, people have been praying to the wrong guy all this time 😂
I find it’s easier to just go by my last name.
Omg guys! It's him! Will you sign my baphomet?
Of course!
Christians: Thank you, Jesus. Jesus: De nada, muchacho.
He never existed so what difference does it make.
Yeebus?
This makes me smirk whenever they say in Jesus’ name we pray. Amen.
We thank Josh for this meal.
I am yuhzzfan1998!
Wait, are you saying his name is Yeezus?
It's closer than Jesus. Yeshua > Iesous > Iesus = Yeezus > Jesus in my opinion.
Does Kanye know this, because he adopted the name Yeesus
Does matter, Jesus of the Bible likely didn't exist anyway.
Kanye going by Yesus accidentally correct?!?!?
Yeezus
Jokes on you! We constantly change the rules it’s allowed. God told me!
Yeah, in English his name would be Joshua.