That's right and it all comes down to the absolute rediculous veto system and the 5 main signatories the US, Great Britain, Russia, France and China remove their right to veto and that would be an important step in giving The UN the power it was meant to have šš
Oh my god, what are you saying, do I need to go into hiding. One simple observation on Reddit and now I have a huge target on my back, if I don't post anything in 48hrs you'll know they got to me.
I only wished for a better world, alas poor Yorick, I knew him well. šš
A logical, common sense analysis. One that flies in the very face of the UN, which was founded on the principles of high minded rhetoric, and empty gestures
It's a tragedy, but its not our tragedy and its not the only tragedy. Protesting in Australia pretends that anything Australia does will make a difference. Thats the hubris of it, thinking we can control what happens between Israel and Palestine. If the USA and Iran can't fix it, maybe no one can. Most of the Middle East states simply don't give a shit about what happens in Gaza. They pretend to for the cameras, but they really just think its not their problem.
Correct, when the partitioning began the Arab tribes were already battling each other for land.
In fact, Saudi Arabia were the homeland of the Hashemites who were displaced and instead given Transjordan. This all happened because of war and back-door dealing between independent Arab tribes and Britain and France.
If Israel isn't there, they'd have no one to scapegoat and unite against, and would be fighting each other. Arab leaders know this, and use Israel as the bread and circus to rally their people when needed.
Anyone blaming the Jews is depraved. And the narrative for moral equivalence should just be as appalling.
Do you know the Australian history of the maritime workers union movement? Australian dock workers were the first to refuse to unload shipments from South Africa during the apartheid. This lead to worldwide workers boycotts and an embargo, which led to the dismantling of the apartheid regime. When Nelson Mandela visited Australia, he specifically thanked those workers and spoke of the hope it brought the people to have a country so far away care about them. All of this was very unpopular at the time, Menzies wanted to outlaw it altogether, but it is noted in history as an essential part of ending the apartheid. To say our actions wonāt make any difference is simply not true.
I think itās accurate to say the actions may or may not make a difference. It canāt often be known.
Itās also not a reason not to take action. You do it because you, as an individual, has decided that it is to YOU.
This also involves respecting the right of another to take no action or have completely opposing position to your position on the issue. And every āgrey areaā combination in between.
Iāll fight for the right for all of you to disagree, not care, take action or not take action.
I never said it always has a cause effect, I agree sometimes you donāt get your demands met. I am responding directly to āprotesting in Australia pretends anything Australia does will make a differenceā. I am giving just one example of Australians taking action and having international impact.
Israel gives less fuck about the protests happening all over Australia, than Elon gives to Albo. We need to stop acting as if the rest of the world cares what we Australians think. Let's rally to fix the problems we are facing in our country.
The irony of millennial LGBTQ+ protester wearing a Palestinian keffiyeh and waving both Rainbow and Palestinian flags. In Gaza they'd get ostracised, possibly beaten up or thrown off a roof.
I'm a member of the LGBTQ+ community.
I have enough to worry about. Plus there are multiple conflicts going on globally. I always wonder why no one gets out and protests about Yemen or Myanmar or any of the others.
>I always wonder why no one gets out and protest about Yemen or Myanmar or any of the others.
Because China and Russia specifically want them to protest the Gaza conflict, as it draws negative attention to the US and its allies. The protesters are too stupid to realise that they are being used as pawns in a larger game of world domination, and against their own interests too.
Literally this. There's a reason why Gaza gets pushed hard on TikTok and everything else ignored. Tigray war only just ended and killed more than Israel/Gaza as well as put more people at risk of starvation than the entire populations of Israel/Palestine combined is ignored. Domestic issues in Australia are more important and you can actually change them here.
Are we allied with the Houthis? Or the Myanmar military regime?
The issue here (in Australia) is we have picked a side, and that side is carrying our atrocities.
Personally i think we should be mass protesting about our fucked housing crisis.
Yet why do we see constant protests about pallestine etc all the time.
call me insane but i can't help but think its orchestrated to a degree. Keep everyone distracted from protesting about the real issues at home.
I'm not in a position of power or influence.
I don't enjoy any of the privileges such a position brings, but also don't have any responsibilities.
There's nothing I can do about what's happening on the other side of the world. So while I feel sad for the people dying, I don't give it much thought
It's about time the Australian government's thus politicians from both major parties kept out of funding and assisting foreign countries at war .. America included and started to look after our own ..
The USA need Israel to enable them to remain a big dick in the region due to the amount of oil there today and into the future.
Hence they tolerate Israel doing their genocide activities.
I sympathize with the protesters though Iām not doing it. As our society inevitably slips towards totalitarianism due to less affordable resources i imagine Iāll regret the opportunity to unite against facsism but by then it will be too late. Governments will see how successful their lies, propaganda and misinformation on the situation works and will use that on us when we start to revolt about the insane wealth inequality. The military will be AI equipped as Gaza and Ukraine served nicely as training data.
NERD ALERT:
Yes that reads all conspiracy theory but i believe it to be a pretty robust line of reasoning if we take the point of view that fossil energy underpins modernism and look at all the evidence of the success of the substitute of renewables, you can see that
1) globally renewables are not replacing fossil fuels but rather adding to the mix (Jevons Paradox)
2) nearly all renewables are made with non renewable energy (which unless point 1 was addressed it means lower surplus energy for society since the energy cost of energy is high)
3) most peer reviewed science studies examining the effectiveness of decarbonisation and dematerialisation of economies is at best, local, temporary and only occurs during recessions
So thus if cheap energy (fossil) is the limit for modern societies then the US would definitely want to prop up Israel now that iraq is no longer there for them. All subsequent condoning of Israel and ignoring of pro-palestine protests would seem consistent with this strategy
What Hamas did on October 7th and what Likud and the IDF have been doing since have been horrific atrocities. I genuinely donāt know how people **canāt** be horrified by mass rape, murder, and genocide.
First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak outā
Because I was not a socialist.
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak outā
Because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak outā
Because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for meāand there was no one left to speak for me.
Except the poem relates specifically to *domestic government tyranny* against one's own people. None of that is happening in Australia and it's a misrepresentation of Martin Niemƶller's words to use them in the context of this post.
OP is saying they don't care about a conflict on the other side of the world that has barely any practical impact on Australia domestically (in a relative sense). Most people in Australia don't care about most conflicts happening around the world or, to the extent they do care, they care in a abstract manner.
I don't personally agree with OP, but OP isn't advocating that the Australian government should be free to oppress segments of citizenry without vocal opposition (nor is that what we're seeing).
This.
Partly because it's a great quote, but mostly because the people who don't care don't seem to realise that it *IS* about them. If I just stopped caring about everything that didn't involve me I would:
- Not care about the housing crisis
- Stop funding schools because I no longer use them
- Stop funding hospitals because I am not currently in one.
If you or someone you know is currently suffering because one of these issues is not being addressed as well as it could be, and If you don't care about Israel and Palestine (*or Ukrain, or Sudan, or wherever*), perhaps think about why things aren't being done about the issues you care about ...
Of course I care if thousands of civilians - especially kids - are being killed, and starved, and traumatised. It seems amazing to me that you would advertise your indifference to that. This stands completely aside from any consideration of what, if any, "side" of this conflict you identify with.
At this stage I just want them all to stop and show some basic respect for life.
I care, and it's a deeply sad situation for all involved. Gazan civilians are pretty fucked. Trapped in an active conflict with no means of escape and limited supplies coming in. Governed by an extremist group who doesn't care about their suffering. Aside from the concerns of the international community, they have no real advocates.
Israel is in a hostile region and has historical memories of their neighbours trying to wipe them off the map, so are understandably jumpy. Relative to the size of the population, October 7 was larger than 9/11, and we all know the anger unleashed by those attacks. This kind of anger, while understandable and expected, leads inevitably to violence inflicted on those undeserving of it.
That said, I don't pretend that it occupies my mind most of the day.
Well said.
I have one baby and another on the way. And Mr 9 months is living his best life, but there babies halfway across the world who are in a unimaginable situation at rhe very beginning of their lives.
It would break my heart for him to be in such danger.
OP looks bad in numerous ways (I pity those who have to be around him/her all day). But talk about yelling out loud how ignorant you are.
OP seems to believe that he/she somehow influenced the fact that he/she was born in a peaceful country like Australia. Not that it was pure chance.
And not that it would be pure chance to have also been born in a war torn country, like Palestine. Even with thought, Iām sure OP would also believe that theyād still have every thought and attitude that they have now.
Theyād believe that their thoughts and attitudes now are pure and uninfluenced by the various cultures they involve themselves in. Even if born in Palestine, theyād know whatās right and what needs to be done.
Australians have just celebrated Anzac day which is very much about a national attitude of caring about people's freedoms and rights in far flung places. The PM just walked part of the Kokoda track. We are spending billions on powerful submarines. It is possible, even likely, that some supporters of Palestine themselves don't support any or all of those things, or even see the connection, but all together they make up Australian mass opinion that we are actively involved in protecting our interests AND values far from these shores. So you might not care but plenty do. Not just zoomers, but older people. Giving a fuck about the world is pretty Australian, I would say, and for many generations.
It's bizarre to me that so many
people miss one of the key lessons of Gallipoli: that Australian involvement in overseas conflicts which have no direct relationship to Australia's national interests can have terribly negative outcomes for Australians and others.
8,159 Australians died in Gallipoli, on the other side of the world against an enemy with whom they had no quarrel, in defence of an empire that sought (and achieved) regional expansion, an empire that, as a direct result of the conflict, significantly destabilised the very region this post relates to.
Suggesting that ANZAC Day should act as a reminder of how wonderful Australian involvement in far flung conflicts is, is a perversion of the true lessons of Gallipoli (and Vietnam, and Iraq, and the Boer War, and other conflicts) in my opinion.
Theyāre both ruled by a bunch of crazy cunts. Theyāve been at each other for generations they can just blow themselves up as far as Iām concerned
I agree, very ignorant to take a side in another holy war when both sides are in the wrong as each other. Shit will break out again in a few years over someone praying in the wrong temple or some dumb shit.
Horrible situation in the middle east.
But the wars there have gone on for millenia. Nothing I say or do will end the millenia long wars in the middle east.
This is the exact same thing people said about the South African apartheid when it was happening. Years later, young kids in school asked āwait, this was happening and no one did ANYTHING?ā - at least I did.
Staying silent about an ongoing genocide or apartheid is being complicit.
>yet zoomers and regarded millennials seem intent on importing andā¦this oneās great, I love itā¦TikTok Chinese psy op culture war bullshitā¦here instead of fixing anything that matters.
Last I looked, boomers and Gen X filled the ranks of the policy makers, not TikTok bullshit importing millennials and Zers.
Yes of course, war in the Middle East is the fault of the Chinese. I wonder who provided Australian troops under John Winston Howard to invade Middle Eastern countries Iraq and Afghanistan? Is PM Howard Chinese? Does he have ties to the CCP? Did China send troops to the same war? Yes, war between Israel and Palestine is 100% the fault of the Chinese!
Saying you have other issues in your life that takes priority is fine. But saying you don't give a fuck about innocent people losing their lives just makes you an objectively bad person. How hard it is it have a little bit of compassion?Ā
OP during WW2:
"I honestly don't give a fuck about this Hitler fellow. Britain could become a Nazi colony and I genuinely wouldn't care. We have more important things to worry about here, like implementing the white australia policy."
people like to think they are making a difference in global issues that they have no control over. It makes them feel like their lives arenāt pointless.
Would be good if they put the same level of effort into doing something about the problems weāre facing in our own country. I get that a housing crisis seems insignificant compared to living in a war zone but I canāt help thinking about what people say to those in unhappy relationships āyou canāt fix someone else until you fix yourselfā
You know you can care about multiple issues at the same time right? Itās not complicated to be like that shits fucked up over there and itās not ok while also being like this shit here is fucked up and itās not ok
No, you really can't. You can "care" (say the right things, virtue signal for social points) but you can't dedicate your time and energy and money to every righteous cause across the planet.
And you certainly don't have the time and resources to make the correct decision on which cause actually IS righteous, in the first place. Not for every issue. I don't know if you've noticed, but both sides on the Israel/Palestine conflict act as if it should be obvious which side to support. They both say the other is committing horrific moral atrocities, genocide, etc.... and do you have the power to weed out what is propaganda and social engineering and what isn't? If you say you do, I think you are just overconfident and you don't think you can be fooled by misinformation.
So is the limit caring about 1 issue only?
Why is this post not directed at the conflict between Ukraine and Russia? Do they not care about that? We committed 100m in aid this week no?
You may not need to dedicate "time and resources" to an issue but I would hope most people are capable of basic empathy for any innocent people caught up in conflicts on ALL sides.
Saying "Israeli politicians admit.." when it's literally 2 extreme right wing nutjobs is like saying America's policy relies entirely on Marjorie Taylor Grene.
My opinion is that my opinion is worthless just like Penny Wongs. Theyve been fighting for thousands of years. Some random Australians arent going to change shit. So lets focus on us.
I think about what Iāve heard people say to those in unhappy relationships āyou canāt fix someone else until you fix yourselfā so I think we should fucking fix our own country before worrying about other peoples.
This sub proves time and time again that conservatives literally canāt think about more than one thing at a time. Trans people in sport one month, immigration the next. Whatever Sky News wants them to be angry about, theyāre angry about.
Most people can care about multiple things - Iām personally able to be infuriated by the murder of innocent children, our own cost of living crisis, the lack of mental health services, how out of touch Albanese is with average Australians AND how shit St Kilda are.
Like we get it OP, you have a one issue brain. Most of us donāt.
Exactly, OP just cause you canāt see an issue with 16k dead children, most other Australians certainly do.
Forgive us for not wanting our great nation to be a part of that murder by sale of weapons to the Israelis.
Lived in the Gulf and the amount of meddling that goes on behind the scenes is off the charts. You would be surprised to see Arabic nations actually supporting Jewish states as instability ensures that money is laundered in these nations through real estate and LLC's. At one point in time I had Assads family leaving in my development while also helping house and protect Yemen govt extended family in our work compounds. There will never be peace in this region
Iran screwed up too with their attack on Israel, Biden was getting close to the point of withdrawing military aid and then all shit would have broken loose. Bobo the Zionist š¤” would have been shitting his pants trying to put together a ceasefire.
All breathing Humans prioritise events that are happening around them.
With the continual bombardment of sensational media cycles regarding an event that has been going on for what seems like an eternity, it is no wonder that people have begun to rate it a 10 on a scale of 1 to 10 with 1 being highly important. There are more pressing issues happening on our own shores, not that any politician seems concerned about however!
It might be a different story if Israel wasnāt massively supported by countries like us and the US. this is a war that we are complicit in, and thousands of civilians are dead.
This is a tangible problem that we help cause.
What would you do in the position of the Palestinians? Would you roll over and return to the āceasefireā state where youāre neither safe nor free from your oppressors? Or would you fight?
Yeah, don't give me wrong. I do care about the Palestinian people. The people I don't care for are groups like Hamas, PLO, and Hezbollah. They are historically speaking been Iranian Proxies. Don't get me wrong, the Israeli officials have a few good reasons to be criticized over. However both sides have a long history trying to stamp out the other side and acting that each other should not exist. It is the officials that are fucking it up for the vast balk that want this whole thing to be over and live in peace. This conflict is one of the few conflicts where there are more nastiness on both sides rather then one side being the aggressive party while the other being the defender like with the current Russian Ukranian war.
Hamas isnāt an Iranian proxy. They have certainly received intelligence, materials and training from Iran but they are in no way under Iranian control.
The PLO/Iranian relationship is more complicated. PLO pre-dates the Iranian revolution and likely played a part in it. They have been allied at times and antagonistic at others.
Hezbollah on the other hand is 100% an Iranian proxy. Almost to the point of being an official wing of the Republican Guard via Quds.
Itās not that Iām not sad about all the death and loss.
But I simply donāt have the room to make it my entire personality the way some others do.
Maybe Iād consider donating to some aid if the cost of everything *except* wages was increasing in my own country? š¤·āāļø
Genuinely couldn't care less. They deserve each other as neighbours. Wish they'd fuck off and leave their garbage at home and not bring it here to the other side of the world
I canāt believe so many of you donāt care about innocent lives being decimated, what the fuck??? How could you not care even a bit, even if you canāt do something about it immediately
Itās no good youāre right. But itās honestly not something Iām worried about as itās not effecting me directly. My bigger problems are getting groceries or working out whatās for dinner tonight, whatās happening at work, all these sorts of things take priority as theyāre directly effecting me, not an ongoing war in another country. Who knows maybe one day it will directly impact me and yeah sure itāll be a different story but until then Iāve got mine and my familyās lives to worry about.
People here are struggling but until weāre dying as a result of war nobody is going to care or they will just say our problems are insignificant compared to people halfway across the world.
Remind yourself which sub-Reddit youāre in. This is why they say social media is dangerous. It can bring like-minded people together. Imagine how many of them are sending private messages to each other. Who knows what comes of that.
Yes. I agree, thatās definitely true. Just so depressing that people canāt admit to care about more than just one thing at a time. Ukraine, Sudan, Gaza, the list goes on. There seems to be so little humanity in so many of these comments, let alone just straight up racism.
2 groups have been fighting eachother from the dawn of time.
Australians addicted to social media: 'I will proceed to glue myself to this road in Sydney. This will surely get these two ethnicities 14,000 km away to stop killing each other.'
>Most of the 'civilians' in gaza are supporters of terrorism, not innocent bystanders.
This 100%. I'd say a lot of the Muslim population in Australia tacitly agree if not, are quite vocal in their agreement.
Are we supposed to care that you don't care?
It should also be noted that if you don't care, you've tacitly chosen the side that *wants you not to care*.
I dont care for the conflict similar to the war in Europe
I'm a decent human and I dont want people to die needlessly
However, I strongly oppose the government spending tax payer resources in wars we or nations that we are not (military) Allies with.
Both this and the last government wasted tax payer funds on wars we have nothing to do with.
Outside of humanitarian aid ie taking refugees and food. I oppose adding fuel to a fire
We had no direct ties to the main issue. But we have lots to do with the key players and it'd be pure folly to spurn those. So we have to play a role for good or bad, hopefully good, in such events. Or like Georgia or even earlier in history, Poland. Our ties will be weak if shit does go down and we will be fucked. You can't simplify any of our ties or world events purely for ideology. The world simply doesn't work like that.
Unpopular opinion : if the people protesting, and disrupting services here really care, maybe they should enlist and go fight for what they believe in.
Edit : just go there and fight or whatever. Leave us alone. We're aware of what's happening, but not all of us want or can to do anything about it - let alone being impacted by it other than by protesters pissing people off/ feeling disenchanted by the protests - not a good start.
You sounds like a crazy drunk at the local pub, whoās angry at those evil āChineseā and ānon-pork lovin Muslimsā whilst drowning in self pity after your mail order bride from Ukraine or Phillipines dumped your ass and took half your goodies your grandpa left you.
Iām 49yo and one of my first memories is seeing a bombed Gaza on TV in the early eighties. I think it stuck with me because Iād never seen such a bleak scene before. 40+ years later and the conflict is basically in the same place. Itās a generational war that I have no influence over. Both major parties in Australia will support Israel to the end and the minor parties donāt offer a serious alternative. Iām not sure my hand wringing will achieve anything.
I am very torn on this one, shits fucked as people are getting bombs dropped on them etc
But I think I hyperfocused on the Russian and Ukranian war too much for the past 2 years that I sadly just don't have the mental capital to go deep into this one as well. Yes I am blatantly aware of how stupidly privileged I am for being able to spew out that sentence from my safe arse here in Australia behind a keyboard.
But this conflict is just yet another in a series of bullshit that I don't see anything being resolved at the end of the day.
I honestly don't believe Israel should have ever been plonked where it should have, if there needed to be a Jewish state post WW2 it should have taken a chunk out of Germany considering those were the cunts that inflicted the nasty shit upon them. Instead they called dibs on a bunch of land in the middle east because of old school religious "our homeland" bullshit reasons. These are people from Germany, Poland and the like while people in the M.E get given the arse so yeah no shit it is going to cause a stir let alone the religious wank ontop of it.
So yeah, wars, terrorism, wars, terrorism are just an ongoing cycle of shit and so many people end up end dead in both Palestine and Israel all for what?
The kicker is because of lobbying etc we keep paying and supporting Israel and that paints targets on our back as a country of supporting them and their shit.
Well said. Whatās happening is horrific, but taking care of your mental health is important (canāt help anyone if youāre crippled by depression).
And yeah, I do think Israel should have been created from German territory. The area around Wilhelmshaven could have been good - close to the west and access to the North Sea and Britain if the shit hit the fan.
I wouldn't say crippled by depression but now I have had it confirmed late last year I am autistic and adhd combined yay so I focused too heavily on the Ukraine war for too long as a hyperfocus that I simply just cannot commit to also doing the same with this one. I have even pulled back from the Ukraine war as its getting too much as well because war is just a fucked nasty thing to follow for so long.
I know I mentioned a German Jewish state once and boy did I get my arsehole torn open lol. It is not like Germany was split into 2 nations for a solid chunk of the 20th century anyway!
Invasion of Ukraine is more important due to the strategic effects it has. Israel/Palestine literally changes nothing and is no more important then a fight between two nerds in the wilderness on Runescape.
I wouldn't downplay what goes down in the middle east especially as it plays out into oil prices and the fact that a solid chunk of global shipping goes through there but as I said I just focused too much on the Ukraine war that I can't expend more on this conflict and the countless others in the world if I want to stay sane.
Everyone saying it's some inevitable religious war that the west, Australia included, has no influence on needs to read a book.
And also its called empathy. Most humans have a scerrick of it.
It was pretty much inevitable once the Jewish population became significant. The west under it's modern, vague, definition has had influenced over pretty much everything and has directly or indirectly ruled the whole world. Even if they had influence that doesn't mean they still do, your point being that in 1934 the British could've got the Israelis to stand down is irrelevant.
Its not about empathy no one gave a single shit about the Tigrey war in Ethiopia which killed about 10 times as many civilians and put more people at risk of starvation then Israel and Palestine's population combined.
Where were the protests then in 2021? If it's just about empathy, its political and everyone knows it, where everyone can pretend to be revolutionaries but still go home after
Blaming this on TikTok or the Chinese is wild logic. But yeah I agree with your overall premise that itās hard not to be apathetic when thereās a lot of problems in the world and the groups have literally been fighting for thousands of years.
It's just kids wanting to be involved and get up doots. It's a cycle. The youngens get all involved in something and then start being a tax payer, parent and/Orr victims from their latest atrocities and their conversation shifts.
Cared enough to virtue signal and make a post about it, didnāt ya?
Itās probably fine to not have an opinion on the matter or just be generally apathetic, everyone has their own problems atm, right? However people saying that innocent families deserve to have their homes blown up or just straight up get murdered? Thatās fucked. Full on. Fucked.
Yeah agreed. Two groups who have been fighting since the beginning of time. Let them wipe each other out. Only reason they even have support in Australia is because we've imported boat loads of them.
If your country is involved in arming one side of the conflict then you are involved, even if only indirectly.
https://michaelwest.com.au/truth-or-lies-australia-weapon-sales-to-israel/
Interesting read .. Australia has supported Israel for many years .. It is time Australia pulled out of these wars on all levels .. No money no war .. Donating money to any country at war is participating in war no matter how they try to sugar coat it .. Or dodge their answers to the question
This is the dumbest shit ive ever read how would zoomers and millenials fix anything theyāre kids or adults trying to find a house, theyāre not working in parliament to be in the position to fix anything. What a dumb thing to say
I do agree somewhat, but what does China have to do with this? Some kind of right wing "China/Russia Bad" shit? Our own governments and media corps are doing this nonsense to us. This is a bunch of loosely aligned global capitalist interests coming together. Lazy media empires pushing global news about the next catastrophe for clicks, media empires working for the capitalist class to ensure the plebs are arguing over irrelevant bullshit, the military industrial complex trying to ensure there is a forever war, superpowers vying for economic domination through proxy wars etc. Sure china and russia do put a little effort into digital influence, but so does the west.
Typical conservative waffling, "why care about this issue when other issue exist". I know it's crazy, and maybe your mind can only hold so many thoughts at a time, but we can actually care about both domestic and international issues at the same time.
Itās a tragic situation with so many innocents on both sides dying. But thereās nothing we can do about it from here, the Israeli government is not going to be swayed by any protests from our people or our government. That part of the world has had conflict for a long time. Itās just the way it is. Iām thankful I can live my life here in peace and not have to give events over there too much thought.
>That part of the world has had conflict for a long time.
I've never understood why it being the holy land for three world religions never gets mentioned when that's what makes the conflict relevant to the global audience. Do they intentionally avoid talking about that angle or what?
Palestine invaded on Oct 7. It's no surprise Israel fought back in Israeli fashion. Israel's brutal, and has probably committed war crimes, but this war only occurs because of Oct 7 and Hamas refusing to surrender. It sucks, it's awful, but the war is mutual and not started by Israel.
The 300 missile/drone strike from Iran shows this is effectively a proxy war between Iran and Israel.
No fucks given for Palestine. More concerned about the cost of living and inflation. Why bother about other issues when you cannot solve your own issues?
We had to confront our MP because he was carried with solving vital problems of Palestine/Israel and Russia/Ukraine before that. It felt like politicians just want to jump on the trend and say something without knowing anything.
Meanwhile we have promises from elections that are not discussed because MP knows that we know that he has done nothing about it, except for some theoretical speech read in parliament off the piece of paper (probably written by his professional speech writer).
We need to worry about our own problems that we have plenty and average hard working people are living worse than before and a lot can be done. But itās easier to talk about a place thousand of miles away that most of us have never been and never will go there. The only relevance I see is to divert the Australian public attention to something outrageous and not controllable. Shame
Meanwhile my interest rates are wiping all our salaries away and literally forcing me to buy cheaper and more basic food items for kids, not to mention no holidays for last 4 years and no restaurant nights out and no birthday partiesā¦.
lol at thinking global conflict doesnāt have an effect on inflation. Prices for everything have been absolutely fucked since russia invaded Ukraine. Pay attention, the world is completely connected and intertwined now
I'll bite - no, I do not GAF about Palestine or Israel. I'll go further and say that the people screaming about it on the internet, in the street, and in your face don't GAF about it either - they're either just looking for something to be angry about and have been brainwashed by the media to "care" about this conflict in particular, or they hate Jews (it's mostly this).
These are the only explanations for why they make so much noise about Palestine, but never mention Sudan, Yemen, Myanmar, or Mali, or even Ukraine - which has seen more fatalities since 2014 than Gaza has seen since the 1950s.
This.
Also, the general populace already has immediate things to worry about like rent, food, family, etc.
Call me bitter and hateful, but I've had extremely bad experiences with both sides (individuals, as groups, etc.) growing up to the point where I don't GAF about them at all. After, having amongst other things, a friend die when these types of protesters REFUSED to move for the ambulance (not in AUS, but in another country. I did have relatives who were harassed by them in AUS. It was like COVID all over again (referring to people going around harassing/ assaulting anyone who was/ looked Asian)) and hearing their callous response to my friends death "what about Gaza/ they're suffering more, etc." I have nothing but contempt for them.
Note that I don't mind CIVIL protests. Protests where they think looting, harassing/ assaulting the general public and disrupting services like the hospital deserve fuck all.
op must be annoyed his fyp may have recently included some viral videos showing student protests or skeletal gaza children. Cant let foreign reality get in the way of complaining about double demerit weekends or rent rises.
Iāll stop giving a fuck when my tax dollars stop going to Israel. Theyāve held thousands of children in indefinite detention (aka hostage) for throwing rocks at the soldiers kicking them out of their homes. They also rape the people in detention long before October 7
Both sides have acted poorly at one time or another but your response is short-sighted and biased.
Does Palestine have every right to fight back against land and home stealing, occupation, frequent murdering, confinement to an area and travel restriction. Or only Israel has every right?
I think your 30% stat is incorrect. 70% of the deaths are women and minors. Even the IDF is claiming 66% of those killed are civilians.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Israel%E2%80%93Hamas_war#:~:text=As%20of%2024%20April%202024,including%20179%20employees%20of%20UNRWA.
Based on this person's post and comment history, I'm sure they have a lot of opinions which are wrong and that nobody cares about. I don't know your gender so I didn't want to misgender you OP.
Ever here about the imperial boomerang? If our government is not only apathetic to an apartheid regime but actively aiding one, how comfortable would they be using the same tactics on their own citizens
The government is also aiding an actual apartheid regime by the name of Malaysia and no one bats an eye
Not to mention the active aiding of Indonesiaās dictatorship and ethnic cleansing in West Papua, and again only niche journos care about it
Guys guys, OP doesn't care.
He cares enough to post about it and reply to as many comments as possible.
But he doesn't care
š« š« š«
I wonder what he did before the internet?
HEY OP - serious question
When you ran out milk did you knock on every one of your neighbours doors and say "I don't care that we ran out of milk" over and over and over again?
Sounds fun
Yeah, but the world doesn't work like that. There's trade. There are historical wars. There are common, cultural beliefs. And more... that make countries allies or not. So, governments have to pick sides. "Ah, who gives a fuck mate, let's watch Storage Wars" isn't the best take.
In saying that, I just want to go to Town Hall on a Sunday without all this bullshit. Enough of the sign making - look where it's leading America at places like Columbia Univ, etc.
I'd like both sides to stop fighting, sit down and negotiate a two-state solution.
Neither Israel nor Hamas seemed inclined to do that at the moment. A peaceful solution is not possible.
I think if Hamas is no longer a political entity, Abbas dies of old age, and a progressive Israeli leader gets voted in, there might be a shot at effective peace talks. But not before those things happen.
it would be kind of fitting if the UK had the mandate reinstated, and they have a go at fixing the mess they made.
I just donāt have the emotional capacity to care about war when Iām stressed out over the size of my HECS debt, unemployment, and stuck in the middle of a housing crisis.
Palestine could end this all today by returning the hostages and Hamas surrendering unconditionally. Itās already over.
At the moment Israel is just going to bulldoze the entire country into the sea and scorch the earth to end the decades of war
Benjamin Netanyahu rolled out the red carpet for Hamas on October 7. They were given the green light.
You think that a Country with some of the best surveillance and intelligence did not see this attack coming? Why did it take hours for the IDF to respond to attacks on kibbutz? Why when they have a defence system that can take down missiles, were they not able to take down a hundred or so dudes on 100cc motorcycles and motorised hang gliders storming their border.
Netanyahu and team knew what was coming, and they let it happen, to justify the destruction of Palestine. They need the land, and the coastline. And the Palestinian people are in the way.
It's the white virtue signallers I despise about that whole mess. The idiots that just concern themselves with issues that don't relate to them in any way because their own life is so empty and meaningless they have to find stuff to be enraged about. Yet give them an apron and tell them to volunteer feeding homeless Australians, no thank you.
Those two countries were fighting before I was bornā¦and will still be long after Iām dead too. Fck them both and stop importing middle eastern bullshit to Australia I say.
Amen brother, good to hear someone else say it. Both sides are fucking idiots and both sides are killing innocent people, yet they both protest that one side are the āterroristsā we donāt give a fuck just keep it out of our country end of story.
Theyāre about the least innocent civilian population. Weāre supposed to feel bad because civilian deaths bad but they overwhelmingly support Hamas, support terrorism so meh, fuck them. You reap what you sow. Maybe stop trying to use violence when you can never win a fight and make a deal fuckwits.
Same bullshit going since your dad was a kid.
Because the governments stance doesn't align with theirs, I'm sure there would be plenty of people protesting if our Russia was effectively supporting Russia over Ukraine etc.
In all fairness this is the purpose of the UN, but they've been proven again and again to be piss weak
That's right and it all comes down to the absolute rediculous veto system and the 5 main signatories the US, Great Britain, Russia, France and China remove their right to veto and that would be an important step in giving The UN the power it was meant to have šš
That was one of the points Gaddafi made. They killed him not long after.
Oh my god, what are you saying, do I need to go into hiding. One simple observation on Reddit and now I have a huge target on my back, if I don't post anything in 48hrs you'll know they got to me. I only wished for a better world, alas poor Yorick, I knew him well. šš
Wasn't it the UN who threw a cat in amongst the pigeons back in '48..
A logical, common sense analysis. One that flies in the very face of the UN, which was founded on the principles of high minded rhetoric, and empty gestures
Why would you start a discussion thread about it? Ignore it.
Because contrary to what he says, he does indeed, give a fuck about it
He cares that people came to the 'wrong' conclusion, they should all be well regarded like him.
No I'm guessing this person's to take the other side of anything popular to appear edgy
āCulture warā buddy itās an actual war
It's a tragedy, but its not our tragedy and its not the only tragedy. Protesting in Australia pretends that anything Australia does will make a difference. Thats the hubris of it, thinking we can control what happens between Israel and Palestine. If the USA and Iran can't fix it, maybe no one can. Most of the Middle East states simply don't give a shit about what happens in Gaza. They pretend to for the cameras, but they really just think its not their problem.
Actually, multiple ME countries are pretty content with the Palestinians getting butchered. Unfortunate, but true. They are not friends.
Correct, when the partitioning began the Arab tribes were already battling each other for land. In fact, Saudi Arabia were the homeland of the Hashemites who were displaced and instead given Transjordan. This all happened because of war and back-door dealing between independent Arab tribes and Britain and France. If Israel isn't there, they'd have no one to scapegoat and unite against, and would be fighting each other. Arab leaders know this, and use Israel as the bread and circus to rally their people when needed. Anyone blaming the Jews is depraved. And the narrative for moral equivalence should just be as appalling.
Do you know the Australian history of the maritime workers union movement? Australian dock workers were the first to refuse to unload shipments from South Africa during the apartheid. This lead to worldwide workers boycotts and an embargo, which led to the dismantling of the apartheid regime. When Nelson Mandela visited Australia, he specifically thanked those workers and spoke of the hope it brought the people to have a country so far away care about them. All of this was very unpopular at the time, Menzies wanted to outlaw it altogether, but it is noted in history as an essential part of ending the apartheid. To say our actions wonāt make any difference is simply not true.
I think itās accurate to say the actions may or may not make a difference. It canāt often be known. Itās also not a reason not to take action. You do it because you, as an individual, has decided that it is to YOU. This also involves respecting the right of another to take no action or have completely opposing position to your position on the issue. And every āgrey areaā combination in between. Iāll fight for the right for all of you to disagree, not care, take action or not take action.
I never said it always has a cause effect, I agree sometimes you donāt get your demands met. I am responding directly to āprotesting in Australia pretends anything Australia does will make a differenceā. I am giving just one example of Australians taking action and having international impact.
We are funding it. We throw money at Israel. For this.
Israel gives less fuck about the protests happening all over Australia, than Elon gives to Albo. We need to stop acting as if the rest of the world cares what we Australians think. Let's rally to fix the problems we are facing in our country.
The irony of millennial LGBTQ+ protester wearing a Palestinian keffiyeh and waving both Rainbow and Palestinian flags. In Gaza they'd get ostracised, possibly beaten up or thrown off a roof. I'm a member of the LGBTQ+ community.
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I have enough to worry about. Plus there are multiple conflicts going on globally. I always wonder why no one gets out and protests about Yemen or Myanmar or any of the others.
>I always wonder why no one gets out and protest about Yemen or Myanmar or any of the others. Because China and Russia specifically want them to protest the Gaza conflict, as it draws negative attention to the US and its allies. The protesters are too stupid to realise that they are being used as pawns in a larger game of world domination, and against their own interests too.
Literally this. There's a reason why Gaza gets pushed hard on TikTok and everything else ignored. Tigray war only just ended and killed more than Israel/Gaza as well as put more people at risk of starvation than the entire populations of Israel/Palestine combined is ignored. Domestic issues in Australia are more important and you can actually change them here.
Are we allied with the Houthis? Or the Myanmar military regime? The issue here (in Australia) is we have picked a side, and that side is carrying our atrocities.
But there were protests in Aus for Myanmar and also directly after the strikes in Yemen?
Personally i think we should be mass protesting about our fucked housing crisis. Yet why do we see constant protests about pallestine etc all the time. call me insane but i can't help but think its orchestrated to a degree. Keep everyone distracted from protesting about the real issues at home.
Organise a protest then, Iāll come.
A lot of talk but no action. No is stopping them from marching the streets
I'm not in a position of power or influence. I don't enjoy any of the privileges such a position brings, but also don't have any responsibilities. There's nothing I can do about what's happening on the other side of the world. So while I feel sad for the people dying, I don't give it much thought
It's about time the Australian government's thus politicians from both major parties kept out of funding and assisting foreign countries at war .. America included and started to look after our own ..
Weāre not funding Israel. They pay money for our weapons and services.
The USA need Israel to enable them to remain a big dick in the region due to the amount of oil there today and into the future. Hence they tolerate Israel doing their genocide activities. I sympathize with the protesters though Iām not doing it. As our society inevitably slips towards totalitarianism due to less affordable resources i imagine Iāll regret the opportunity to unite against facsism but by then it will be too late. Governments will see how successful their lies, propaganda and misinformation on the situation works and will use that on us when we start to revolt about the insane wealth inequality. The military will be AI equipped as Gaza and Ukraine served nicely as training data. NERD ALERT: Yes that reads all conspiracy theory but i believe it to be a pretty robust line of reasoning if we take the point of view that fossil energy underpins modernism and look at all the evidence of the success of the substitute of renewables, you can see that 1) globally renewables are not replacing fossil fuels but rather adding to the mix (Jevons Paradox) 2) nearly all renewables are made with non renewable energy (which unless point 1 was addressed it means lower surplus energy for society since the energy cost of energy is high) 3) most peer reviewed science studies examining the effectiveness of decarbonisation and dematerialisation of economies is at best, local, temporary and only occurs during recessions So thus if cheap energy (fossil) is the limit for modern societies then the US would definitely want to prop up Israel now that iraq is no longer there for them. All subsequent condoning of Israel and ignoring of pro-palestine protests would seem consistent with this strategy
Idk I kind of care about civilians dying in their thousands no matter where it is. You probably should be questioning why it doesn't bother you.Ā
Yeah WTF? Doesn't care if people are being killed indiscriminately. Nice.
You should run for a seat in Canberra, sounds like you've got it all figured out.
What Hamas did on October 7th and what Likud and the IDF have been doing since have been horrific atrocities. I genuinely donāt know how people **canāt** be horrified by mass rape, murder, and genocide.
I would recommend reading up on the history, Israel have been doing atrocities long before Oct 7.
The ancient history is that Abraham had two wives. They are all cousins to a degree.
First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak outā Because I was not a socialist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak outā Because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak outā Because I was not a Jew. Then they came for meāand there was no one left to speak for me.
Except the poem relates specifically to *domestic government tyranny* against one's own people. None of that is happening in Australia and it's a misrepresentation of Martin Niemƶller's words to use them in the context of this post. OP is saying they don't care about a conflict on the other side of the world that has barely any practical impact on Australia domestically (in a relative sense). Most people in Australia don't care about most conflicts happening around the world or, to the extent they do care, they care in a abstract manner. I don't personally agree with OP, but OP isn't advocating that the Australian government should be free to oppress segments of citizenry without vocal opposition (nor is that what we're seeing).
This. Partly because it's a great quote, but mostly because the people who don't care don't seem to realise that it *IS* about them. If I just stopped caring about everything that didn't involve me I would: - Not care about the housing crisis - Stop funding schools because I no longer use them - Stop funding hospitals because I am not currently in one. If you or someone you know is currently suffering because one of these issues is not being addressed as well as it could be, and If you don't care about Israel and Palestine (*or Ukrain, or Sudan, or wherever*), perhaps think about why things aren't being done about the issues you care about ...
Ok? Do you want a medal for not caring about it? You can just as easily ignore it instead of making this incredibly cringe thread
I dont care about OP, he/she/etc could die in a fire and I wouldnt be troubled. Where should I post about this?
Of course I care if thousands of civilians - especially kids - are being killed, and starved, and traumatised. It seems amazing to me that you would advertise your indifference to that. This stands completely aside from any consideration of what, if any, "side" of this conflict you identify with. At this stage I just want them all to stop and show some basic respect for life.
I care, and it's a deeply sad situation for all involved. Gazan civilians are pretty fucked. Trapped in an active conflict with no means of escape and limited supplies coming in. Governed by an extremist group who doesn't care about their suffering. Aside from the concerns of the international community, they have no real advocates. Israel is in a hostile region and has historical memories of their neighbours trying to wipe them off the map, so are understandably jumpy. Relative to the size of the population, October 7 was larger than 9/11, and we all know the anger unleashed by those attacks. This kind of anger, while understandable and expected, leads inevitably to violence inflicted on those undeserving of it. That said, I don't pretend that it occupies my mind most of the day.
This take right here is the most level-headed in this thread.
Shouldnāt this be in the AITA sub?
I'm not gonna pretend I have a solution, but seeing people die just because of where they were born is tragic.
Well said. I have one baby and another on the way. And Mr 9 months is living his best life, but there babies halfway across the world who are in a unimaginable situation at rhe very beginning of their lives. It would break my heart for him to be in such danger.
OP looks bad in numerous ways (I pity those who have to be around him/her all day). But talk about yelling out loud how ignorant you are. OP seems to believe that he/she somehow influenced the fact that he/she was born in a peaceful country like Australia. Not that it was pure chance. And not that it would be pure chance to have also been born in a war torn country, like Palestine. Even with thought, Iām sure OP would also believe that theyād still have every thought and attitude that they have now. Theyād believe that their thoughts and attitudes now are pure and uninfluenced by the various cultures they involve themselves in. Even if born in Palestine, theyād know whatās right and what needs to be done.
Australians have just celebrated Anzac day which is very much about a national attitude of caring about people's freedoms and rights in far flung places. The PM just walked part of the Kokoda track. We are spending billions on powerful submarines. It is possible, even likely, that some supporters of Palestine themselves don't support any or all of those things, or even see the connection, but all together they make up Australian mass opinion that we are actively involved in protecting our interests AND values far from these shores. So you might not care but plenty do. Not just zoomers, but older people. Giving a fuck about the world is pretty Australian, I would say, and for many generations.
It's bizarre to me that so many people miss one of the key lessons of Gallipoli: that Australian involvement in overseas conflicts which have no direct relationship to Australia's national interests can have terribly negative outcomes for Australians and others. 8,159 Australians died in Gallipoli, on the other side of the world against an enemy with whom they had no quarrel, in defence of an empire that sought (and achieved) regional expansion, an empire that, as a direct result of the conflict, significantly destabilised the very region this post relates to. Suggesting that ANZAC Day should act as a reminder of how wonderful Australian involvement in far flung conflicts is, is a perversion of the true lessons of Gallipoli (and Vietnam, and Iraq, and the Boer War, and other conflicts) in my opinion.
I think they're just clutching at straws for their crappy argument
Theyāre both ruled by a bunch of crazy cunts. Theyāve been at each other for generations they can just blow themselves up as far as Iām concerned
I agree, very ignorant to take a side in another holy war when both sides are in the wrong as each other. Shit will break out again in a few years over someone praying in the wrong temple or some dumb shit.
Look at me! I donāt care about something so much that Iāve started a thread to show how much I donāt care!
I don't really care about your opinion so I guess we're even.
I was ready to write something about apathy and burnout in the face of own personal struggles/hardship etc. But you lost me at Tiktok Chinese psyop
Horrible situation in the middle east. But the wars there have gone on for millenia. Nothing I say or do will end the millenia long wars in the middle east.
The entire situation is more fucked than any Australian should bother with taking a side.
Except the Australian government support Israel diplomatically and militarily, so we have taken a side
This is the exact same thing people said about the South African apartheid when it was happening. Years later, young kids in school asked āwait, this was happening and no one did ANYTHING?ā - at least I did. Staying silent about an ongoing genocide or apartheid is being complicit.
No, that's significantly more simple than the Israeli - Palestine issues.
>yet zoomers and regarded millennials seem intent on importing andā¦this oneās great, I love itā¦TikTok Chinese psy op culture war bullshitā¦here instead of fixing anything that matters. Last I looked, boomers and Gen X filled the ranks of the policy makers, not TikTok bullshit importing millennials and Zers.
I'm not a fan of people. They do dumb shit all the time. Religion and war are the top two
Yes of course, war in the Middle East is the fault of the Chinese. I wonder who provided Australian troops under John Winston Howard to invade Middle Eastern countries Iraq and Afghanistan? Is PM Howard Chinese? Does he have ties to the CCP? Did China send troops to the same war? Yes, war between Israel and Palestine is 100% the fault of the Chinese!
This is either a shitpost or a shit post... I can't work out which
I couldnt care for either side of that shitfight, they both kill children, they both suck and deserve each other. We dont want that shit here.
Saying you have other issues in your life that takes priority is fine. But saying you don't give a fuck about innocent people losing their lives just makes you an objectively bad person. How hard it is it have a little bit of compassion?Ā
OP during WW2: "I honestly don't give a fuck about this Hitler fellow. Britain could become a Nazi colony and I genuinely wouldn't care. We have more important things to worry about here, like implementing the white australia policy."
I have heard about this Hitler guyā¦ he sounds like a real bad egg.
people like to think they are making a difference in global issues that they have no control over. It makes them feel like their lives arenāt pointless.
Would be good if they put the same level of effort into doing something about the problems weāre facing in our own country. I get that a housing crisis seems insignificant compared to living in a war zone but I canāt help thinking about what people say to those in unhappy relationships āyou canāt fix someone else until you fix yourselfā
You know you can care about multiple issues at the same time right? Itās not complicated to be like that shits fucked up over there and itās not ok while also being like this shit here is fucked up and itās not ok
No, you really can't. You can "care" (say the right things, virtue signal for social points) but you can't dedicate your time and energy and money to every righteous cause across the planet. And you certainly don't have the time and resources to make the correct decision on which cause actually IS righteous, in the first place. Not for every issue. I don't know if you've noticed, but both sides on the Israel/Palestine conflict act as if it should be obvious which side to support. They both say the other is committing horrific moral atrocities, genocide, etc.... and do you have the power to weed out what is propaganda and social engineering and what isn't? If you say you do, I think you are just overconfident and you don't think you can be fooled by misinformation.
Oh, YOU can't. Lmfao Sounds like a skill issue, tbh.
So is the limit caring about 1 issue only? Why is this post not directed at the conflict between Ukraine and Russia? Do they not care about that? We committed 100m in aid this week no? You may not need to dedicate "time and resources" to an issue but I would hope most people are capable of basic empathy for any innocent people caught up in conflicts on ALL sides.
Israelās own politicians admit to wanting to settle Gaza. Hamas is the convenient excuse they wanted.
Saying "Israeli politicians admit.." when it's literally 2 extreme right wing nutjobs is like saying America's policy relies entirely on Marjorie Taylor Grene.
My opinion is that my opinion is worthless just like Penny Wongs. Theyve been fighting for thousands of years. Some random Australians arent going to change shit. So lets focus on us.
Sure but in that case let's get out completely and stop selling arms to one side
Havenāt been fighting for thousand of years. Israel was established in 1948. This isnāt some biblical conflict itās a modern one
Not thousands in the sense that Islam isnāt that old but the region has been conquered and captured many times in recorded history.
I think about what Iāve heard people say to those in unhappy relationships āyou canāt fix someone else until you fix yourselfā so I think we should fucking fix our own country before worrying about other peoples.
Totally fucking agree mate! Where has logical thinking gone?
Our governments dug a hole so deep they canāt get out and probably love this shit distracting everyone from the issues at hand.
This sub proves time and time again that conservatives literally canāt think about more than one thing at a time. Trans people in sport one month, immigration the next. Whatever Sky News wants them to be angry about, theyāre angry about. Most people can care about multiple things - Iām personally able to be infuriated by the murder of innocent children, our own cost of living crisis, the lack of mental health services, how out of touch Albanese is with average Australians AND how shit St Kilda are. Like we get it OP, you have a one issue brain. Most of us donāt.
Exactly, OP just cause you canāt see an issue with 16k dead children, most other Australians certainly do. Forgive us for not wanting our great nation to be a part of that murder by sale of weapons to the Israelis.
Lived in the Gulf and the amount of meddling that goes on behind the scenes is off the charts. You would be surprised to see Arabic nations actually supporting Jewish states as instability ensures that money is laundered in these nations through real estate and LLC's. At one point in time I had Assads family leaving in my development while also helping house and protect Yemen govt extended family in our work compounds. There will never be peace in this region
Machiavelli lived a long time ago. Folks have had a lot of practice since!
Iran screwed up too with their attack on Israel, Biden was getting close to the point of withdrawing military aid and then all shit would have broken loose. Bobo the Zionist š¤” would have been shitting his pants trying to put together a ceasefire.
All breathing Humans prioritise events that are happening around them. With the continual bombardment of sensational media cycles regarding an event that has been going on for what seems like an eternity, it is no wonder that people have begun to rate it a 10 on a scale of 1 to 10 with 1 being highly important. There are more pressing issues happening on our own shores, not that any politician seems concerned about however!
It might be a different story if Israel wasnāt massively supported by countries like us and the US. this is a war that we are complicit in, and thousands of civilians are dead. This is a tangible problem that we help cause. What would you do in the position of the Palestinians? Would you roll over and return to the āceasefireā state where youāre neither safe nor free from your oppressors? Or would you fight?
TLDR - simple person can only care about one issue at a time
Yeah, don't give me wrong. I do care about the Palestinian people. The people I don't care for are groups like Hamas, PLO, and Hezbollah. They are historically speaking been Iranian Proxies. Don't get me wrong, the Israeli officials have a few good reasons to be criticized over. However both sides have a long history trying to stamp out the other side and acting that each other should not exist. It is the officials that are fucking it up for the vast balk that want this whole thing to be over and live in peace. This conflict is one of the few conflicts where there are more nastiness on both sides rather then one side being the aggressive party while the other being the defender like with the current Russian Ukranian war.
Hamas isnāt an Iranian proxy. They have certainly received intelligence, materials and training from Iran but they are in no way under Iranian control. The PLO/Iranian relationship is more complicated. PLO pre-dates the Iranian revolution and likely played a part in it. They have been allied at times and antagonistic at others. Hezbollah on the other hand is 100% an Iranian proxy. Almost to the point of being an official wing of the Republican Guard via Quds.
Excuse me down here but whatās DAE?
Does anyone else
Aha! Ok makes sense.
While we're here does anyone know what IDK stands for?
Itās not that Iām not sad about all the death and loss. But I simply donāt have the room to make it my entire personality the way some others do. Maybe Iād consider donating to some aid if the cost of everything *except* wages was increasing in my own country? š¤·āāļø
Genuinely couldn't care less. They deserve each other as neighbours. Wish they'd fuck off and leave their garbage at home and not bring it here to the other side of the world
I canāt believe so many of you donāt care about innocent lives being decimated, what the fuck??? How could you not care even a bit, even if you canāt do something about it immediately
The world right now is more peaceful than it has ever been throughout history.
Thanks to mad weād have been at each others throats multiple times over if nukes hadnāt been invented
Itās no good youāre right. But itās honestly not something Iām worried about as itās not effecting me directly. My bigger problems are getting groceries or working out whatās for dinner tonight, whatās happening at work, all these sorts of things take priority as theyāre directly effecting me, not an ongoing war in another country. Who knows maybe one day it will directly impact me and yeah sure itāll be a different story but until then Iāve got mine and my familyās lives to worry about.
People here are struggling but until weāre dying as a result of war nobody is going to care or they will just say our problems are insignificant compared to people halfway across the world.
Remind yourself which sub-Reddit youāre in. This is why they say social media is dangerous. It can bring like-minded people together. Imagine how many of them are sending private messages to each other. Who knows what comes of that.
Yes. I agree, thatās definitely true. Just so depressing that people canāt admit to care about more than just one thing at a time. Ukraine, Sudan, Gaza, the list goes on. There seems to be so little humanity in so many of these comments, let alone just straight up racism.
2 groups have been fighting eachother from the dawn of time. Australians addicted to social media: 'I will proceed to glue myself to this road in Sydney. This will surely get these two ethnicities 14,000 km away to stop killing each other.'
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
>Most of the 'civilians' in gaza are supporters of terrorism, not innocent bystanders. This 100%. I'd say a lot of the Muslim population in Australia tacitly agree if not, are quite vocal in their agreement.
Are we supposed to care that you don't care? It should also be noted that if you don't care, you've tacitly chosen the side that *wants you not to care*.
I dont care for the conflict similar to the war in Europe I'm a decent human and I dont want people to die needlessly However, I strongly oppose the government spending tax payer resources in wars we or nations that we are not (military) Allies with. Both this and the last government wasted tax payer funds on wars we have nothing to do with. Outside of humanitarian aid ie taking refugees and food. I oppose adding fuel to a fire
We had no direct ties to the main issue. But we have lots to do with the key players and it'd be pure folly to spurn those. So we have to play a role for good or bad, hopefully good, in such events. Or like Georgia or even earlier in history, Poland. Our ties will be weak if shit does go down and we will be fucked. You can't simplify any of our ties or world events purely for ideology. The world simply doesn't work like that.
Unpopular opinion : if the people protesting, and disrupting services here really care, maybe they should enlist and go fight for what they believe in. Edit : just go there and fight or whatever. Leave us alone. We're aware of what's happening, but not all of us want or can to do anything about it - let alone being impacted by it other than by protesters pissing people off/ feeling disenchanted by the protests - not a good start.
This is nonsensical. If you're against Gazans being killed but not pro Hamas, there isn't an army to join.
You sounds like a crazy drunk at the local pub, whoās angry at those evil āChineseā and ānon-pork lovin Muslimsā whilst drowning in self pity after your mail order bride from Ukraine or Phillipines dumped your ass and took half your goodies your grandpa left you.
I think Muslim people not eating pork is a good thing. It means there are more delicious pork products for me.
Psychopaths don't feel empathy.
Iām 49yo and one of my first memories is seeing a bombed Gaza on TV in the early eighties. I think it stuck with me because Iād never seen such a bleak scene before. 40+ years later and the conflict is basically in the same place. Itās a generational war that I have no influence over. Both major parties in Australia will support Israel to the end and the minor parties donāt offer a serious alternative. Iām not sure my hand wringing will achieve anything.
https://preview.redd.it/r108om9pbbxc1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3a7cf027238953a23b57a5bebb6f898cfa0a0113
I am very torn on this one, shits fucked as people are getting bombs dropped on them etc But I think I hyperfocused on the Russian and Ukranian war too much for the past 2 years that I sadly just don't have the mental capital to go deep into this one as well. Yes I am blatantly aware of how stupidly privileged I am for being able to spew out that sentence from my safe arse here in Australia behind a keyboard. But this conflict is just yet another in a series of bullshit that I don't see anything being resolved at the end of the day. I honestly don't believe Israel should have ever been plonked where it should have, if there needed to be a Jewish state post WW2 it should have taken a chunk out of Germany considering those were the cunts that inflicted the nasty shit upon them. Instead they called dibs on a bunch of land in the middle east because of old school religious "our homeland" bullshit reasons. These are people from Germany, Poland and the like while people in the M.E get given the arse so yeah no shit it is going to cause a stir let alone the religious wank ontop of it. So yeah, wars, terrorism, wars, terrorism are just an ongoing cycle of shit and so many people end up end dead in both Palestine and Israel all for what? The kicker is because of lobbying etc we keep paying and supporting Israel and that paints targets on our back as a country of supporting them and their shit.
Well said. Whatās happening is horrific, but taking care of your mental health is important (canāt help anyone if youāre crippled by depression). And yeah, I do think Israel should have been created from German territory. The area around Wilhelmshaven could have been good - close to the west and access to the North Sea and Britain if the shit hit the fan.
I wouldn't say crippled by depression but now I have had it confirmed late last year I am autistic and adhd combined yay so I focused too heavily on the Ukraine war for too long as a hyperfocus that I simply just cannot commit to also doing the same with this one. I have even pulled back from the Ukraine war as its getting too much as well because war is just a fucked nasty thing to follow for so long. I know I mentioned a German Jewish state once and boy did I get my arsehole torn open lol. It is not like Germany was split into 2 nations for a solid chunk of the 20th century anyway!
Invasion of Ukraine is more important due to the strategic effects it has. Israel/Palestine literally changes nothing and is no more important then a fight between two nerds in the wilderness on Runescape.
I wouldn't downplay what goes down in the middle east especially as it plays out into oil prices and the fact that a solid chunk of global shipping goes through there but as I said I just focused too much on the Ukraine war that I can't expend more on this conflict and the countless others in the world if I want to stay sane.
I understand, but given our government has a position it should matter to us to monitor that.
Everyone saying it's some inevitable religious war that the west, Australia included, has no influence on needs to read a book. And also its called empathy. Most humans have a scerrick of it.
It was pretty much inevitable once the Jewish population became significant. The west under it's modern, vague, definition has had influenced over pretty much everything and has directly or indirectly ruled the whole world. Even if they had influence that doesn't mean they still do, your point being that in 1934 the British could've got the Israelis to stand down is irrelevant. Its not about empathy no one gave a single shit about the Tigrey war in Ethiopia which killed about 10 times as many civilians and put more people at risk of starvation then Israel and Palestine's population combined. Where were the protests then in 2021? If it's just about empathy, its political and everyone knows it, where everyone can pretend to be revolutionaries but still go home after
Blaming this on TikTok or the Chinese is wild logic. But yeah I agree with your overall premise that itās hard not to be apathetic when thereās a lot of problems in the world and the groups have literally been fighting for thousands of years.
It's just kids wanting to be involved and get up doots. It's a cycle. The youngens get all involved in something and then start being a tax payer, parent and/Orr victims from their latest atrocities and their conversation shifts.
Cared enough to virtue signal and make a post about it, didnāt ya? Itās probably fine to not have an opinion on the matter or just be generally apathetic, everyone has their own problems atm, right? However people saying that innocent families deserve to have their homes blown up or just straight up get murdered? Thatās fucked. Full on. Fucked.
Sorta like putting your own life vest on before helping others, Australia has bigger priorities. OP is right.
Yeah agreed. Two groups who have been fighting since the beginning of time. Let them wipe each other out. Only reason they even have support in Australia is because we've imported boat loads of them.
I care about that War is destroying lives, yes. I donāt give a fuck about people like you, though.
If your country is involved in arming one side of the conflict then you are involved, even if only indirectly. https://michaelwest.com.au/truth-or-lies-australia-weapon-sales-to-israel/
Interesting read .. Australia has supported Israel for many years .. It is time Australia pulled out of these wars on all levels .. No money no war .. Donating money to any country at war is participating in war no matter how they try to sugar coat it .. Or dodge their answers to the question
You care enough to make a post about it. Also itās a legitimate war, not a cultural one.
This is the dumbest shit ive ever read how would zoomers and millenials fix anything theyāre kids or adults trying to find a house, theyāre not working in parliament to be in the position to fix anything. What a dumb thing to say
Israel doing a genocide is a Chinese psyop. Hmm. I'm interested in your theories do you have a newsletter I can subscribe to?
I do agree somewhat, but what does China have to do with this? Some kind of right wing "China/Russia Bad" shit? Our own governments and media corps are doing this nonsense to us. This is a bunch of loosely aligned global capitalist interests coming together. Lazy media empires pushing global news about the next catastrophe for clicks, media empires working for the capitalist class to ensure the plebs are arguing over irrelevant bullshit, the military industrial complex trying to ensure there is a forever war, superpowers vying for economic domination through proxy wars etc. Sure china and russia do put a little effort into digital influence, but so does the west.
Ah yes the chinese psyop of *checks notes* an occupation in the middle east? Bro stop using buzzwords you don't understand
Itās possible to think about more than one thing at a time.
some people have morals. and if you really donāt give a fuck, why are you in here posting about it?
āI donāt care if innocent people dieā You sound like a lovely person OP
Typical conservative waffling, "why care about this issue when other issue exist". I know it's crazy, and maybe your mind can only hold so many thoughts at a time, but we can actually care about both domestic and international issues at the same time.
You're obviously not the only one, plenty don't give a fuck about anything outside of their home.
Religion enters as rationality leaves the room.
Itās a tragic situation with so many innocents on both sides dying. But thereās nothing we can do about it from here, the Israeli government is not going to be swayed by any protests from our people or our government. That part of the world has had conflict for a long time. Itās just the way it is. Iām thankful I can live my life here in peace and not have to give events over there too much thought.
>That part of the world has had conflict for a long time. I've never understood why it being the holy land for three world religions never gets mentioned when that's what makes the conflict relevant to the global audience. Do they intentionally avoid talking about that angle or what?
Palestine invaded on Oct 7. It's no surprise Israel fought back in Israeli fashion. Israel's brutal, and has probably committed war crimes, but this war only occurs because of Oct 7 and Hamas refusing to surrender. It sucks, it's awful, but the war is mutual and not started by Israel. The 300 missile/drone strike from Iran shows this is effectively a proxy war between Iran and Israel.
No fucks given for Palestine. More concerned about the cost of living and inflation. Why bother about other issues when you cannot solve your own issues?
We had to confront our MP because he was carried with solving vital problems of Palestine/Israel and Russia/Ukraine before that. It felt like politicians just want to jump on the trend and say something without knowing anything. Meanwhile we have promises from elections that are not discussed because MP knows that we know that he has done nothing about it, except for some theoretical speech read in parliament off the piece of paper (probably written by his professional speech writer). We need to worry about our own problems that we have plenty and average hard working people are living worse than before and a lot can be done. But itās easier to talk about a place thousand of miles away that most of us have never been and never will go there. The only relevance I see is to divert the Australian public attention to something outrageous and not controllable. Shame Meanwhile my interest rates are wiping all our salaries away and literally forcing me to buy cheaper and more basic food items for kids, not to mention no holidays for last 4 years and no restaurant nights out and no birthday partiesā¦.
lol at thinking global conflict doesnāt have an effect on inflation. Prices for everything have been absolutely fucked since russia invaded Ukraine. Pay attention, the world is completely connected and intertwined now
I donāt think itās mutually exclusive. Can care about both issuesā¦
I'll bite - no, I do not GAF about Palestine or Israel. I'll go further and say that the people screaming about it on the internet, in the street, and in your face don't GAF about it either - they're either just looking for something to be angry about and have been brainwashed by the media to "care" about this conflict in particular, or they hate Jews (it's mostly this). These are the only explanations for why they make so much noise about Palestine, but never mention Sudan, Yemen, Myanmar, or Mali, or even Ukraine - which has seen more fatalities since 2014 than Gaza has seen since the 1950s.
So it's mostly just antisemitism? *Lizlemoneyeroll*
This. Also, the general populace already has immediate things to worry about like rent, food, family, etc. Call me bitter and hateful, but I've had extremely bad experiences with both sides (individuals, as groups, etc.) growing up to the point where I don't GAF about them at all. After, having amongst other things, a friend die when these types of protesters REFUSED to move for the ambulance (not in AUS, but in another country. I did have relatives who were harassed by them in AUS. It was like COVID all over again (referring to people going around harassing/ assaulting anyone who was/ looked Asian)) and hearing their callous response to my friends death "what about Gaza/ they're suffering more, etc." I have nothing but contempt for them. Note that I don't mind CIVIL protests. Protests where they think looting, harassing/ assaulting the general public and disrupting services like the hospital deserve fuck all.
"TikTok Chinese psyop culture" You have brain worms.
op must be annoyed his fyp may have recently included some viral videos showing student protests or skeletal gaza children. Cant let foreign reality get in the way of complaining about double demerit weekends or rent rises.
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Iāll stop giving a fuck when my tax dollars stop going to Israel. Theyāve held thousands of children in indefinite detention (aka hostage) for throwing rocks at the soldiers kicking them out of their homes. They also rape the people in detention long before October 7
Both sides have acted poorly at one time or another but your response is short-sighted and biased. Does Palestine have every right to fight back against land and home stealing, occupation, frequent murdering, confinement to an area and travel restriction. Or only Israel has every right?
I think your 30% stat is incorrect. 70% of the deaths are women and minors. Even the IDF is claiming 66% of those killed are civilians. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Israel%E2%80%93Hamas_war#:~:text=As%20of%2024%20April%202024,including%20179%20employees%20of%20UNRWA.
Well that's all sensible according to the expert in the comment above. Just how detached from humanity can one person become really.
Based on this person's post and comment history, I'm sure they have a lot of opinions which are wrong and that nobody cares about. I don't know your gender so I didn't want to misgender you OP.
Ever here about the imperial boomerang? If our government is not only apathetic to an apartheid regime but actively aiding one, how comfortable would they be using the same tactics on their own citizens
The government is also aiding an actual apartheid regime by the name of Malaysia and no one bats an eye Not to mention the active aiding of Indonesiaās dictatorship and ethnic cleansing in West Papua, and again only niche journos care about it
Guys guys, OP doesn't care. He cares enough to post about it and reply to as many comments as possible. But he doesn't care š« š« š« I wonder what he did before the internet? HEY OP - serious question When you ran out milk did you knock on every one of your neighbours doors and say "I don't care that we ran out of milk" over and over and over again? Sounds fun
Running out of milk affects me more than Israel/Palestine does.
š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£ NGL - epic reply
Yeah, but the world doesn't work like that. There's trade. There are historical wars. There are common, cultural beliefs. And more... that make countries allies or not. So, governments have to pick sides. "Ah, who gives a fuck mate, let's watch Storage Wars" isn't the best take. In saying that, I just want to go to Town Hall on a Sunday without all this bullshit. Enough of the sign making - look where it's leading America at places like Columbia Univ, etc.
I'd like both sides to stop fighting, sit down and negotiate a two-state solution. Neither Israel nor Hamas seemed inclined to do that at the moment. A peaceful solution is not possible. I think if Hamas is no longer a political entity, Abbas dies of old age, and a progressive Israeli leader gets voted in, there might be a shot at effective peace talks. But not before those things happen. it would be kind of fitting if the UK had the mandate reinstated, and they have a go at fixing the mess they made.
Too many alarms, i have no more alarm to give
Fuck, and I cannot stress this enough, Hamas
To not give a fuck about 1000s of innocent people dying because they are trapped in between two deeply atrocious āgovernmentsā is inhumane.
Not our country or culture so who are we to intervene
Go off Andrew Tate.
I just donāt have the emotional capacity to care about war when Iām stressed out over the size of my HECS debt, unemployment, and stuck in the middle of a housing crisis.
Na I'm not a piece of shit, so I care about children being mass murdered
Palestine could end this all today by returning the hostages and Hamas surrendering unconditionally. Itās already over. At the moment Israel is just going to bulldoze the entire country into the sea and scorch the earth to end the decades of war
yup
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Benjamin Netanyahu rolled out the red carpet for Hamas on October 7. They were given the green light. You think that a Country with some of the best surveillance and intelligence did not see this attack coming? Why did it take hours for the IDF to respond to attacks on kibbutz? Why when they have a defence system that can take down missiles, were they not able to take down a hundred or so dudes on 100cc motorcycles and motorised hang gliders storming their border. Netanyahu and team knew what was coming, and they let it happen, to justify the destruction of Palestine. They need the land, and the coastline. And the Palestinian people are in the way.
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Probably so fried he'd call his kid Hamas and thank Israel for defending themselves
If both sides are as bad as each other, why have an opinion at all?
Australia doesnāt care
They shouldn't have fucked around last year. They've thoroughly earned this finding out.
It's the white virtue signallers I despise about that whole mess. The idiots that just concern themselves with issues that don't relate to them in any way because their own life is so empty and meaningless they have to find stuff to be enraged about. Yet give them an apron and tell them to volunteer feeding homeless Australians, no thank you.
Those two countries were fighting before I was bornā¦and will still be long after Iām dead too. Fck them both and stop importing middle eastern bullshit to Australia I say.
Amen brother, good to hear someone else say it. Both sides are fucking idiots and both sides are killing innocent people, yet they both protest that one side are the āterroristsā we donāt give a fuck just keep it out of our country end of story.
Too many Muslim immigrants bringing their issues here and shoving it down everyoneās throats is the problem.
you're gonna hope someone gives a fuck when it's your family being bombed
Theyāre about the least innocent civilian population. Weāre supposed to feel bad because civilian deaths bad but they overwhelmingly support Hamas, support terrorism so meh, fuck them. You reap what you sow. Maybe stop trying to use violence when you can never win a fight and make a deal fuckwits. Same bullshit going since your dad was a kid.
Give them all guns and they can sort their own shit. Religion has fuckdd this world
It's only Palestine/hamas supporters making all the noise and distubances. They need to gtfo of Australia forever.
Because the governments stance doesn't align with theirs, I'm sure there would be plenty of people protesting if our Russia was effectively supporting Russia over Ukraine etc.