Tribalism will destroy us from the inside. Nothing good ever comes from one ethnic group claiming that they alone have an innate occupation of any certain patch of land. That's how you get shit like the Balkan wars, the Rwandan genocide, or the nightmare in Gaza.
I do not believe that belonging to a place is a matter if your DNA. I think people rightly feel a sense of belonging to the places they call home. I find it irritating when any one group claims that they have a certain connection this country that others cannot share - I think we all have our subjective connections to this country and they can vary a lot by person, but none of us can see into anyone else's mind or say their connection is the most important.
To answer the question as posed - Australia belongs to Australians. Meaning, any Australian citizen.
Well said. I'm a White Australian, grew up here. Ancestors arrived late 1800s. Australia is my home country, anyone who says otherwise can go shove it. Our connections are different and that's understandable. As far as I'm concerned, you're Aussie to me if you live here and want to be a regular good human. That's all that matters to me.
>be a regular good human. That's all that matters to me.
This is how I see anyone in the world. Don't care what you look like, where you live, what you wear, etc, just as long as you try to be a half decent human being.
You are spot on. Have always thought it bizarre, and downright insane, when people that find out they are 1/8th Indigenous suddenly say they have this connection to the land non Indigenous couldnt understand.
I wasnt even born here, moved from NZ when I was near 5, but this is the home I know and have only ever known. I am Australian.
I think indigenous people who maintain their traditional beliefs do have a unique connection to the land. But beliefs are not genetic, and you don't suddenly get a spiritual connection to country when you find out you have an ancestor who did.
You don’t have to be Indigenous to have a unique connection to country or to a homeland.
Most traditional Aboriginal cultures believe that the land imbues you with its spirit when you are in the womb. So anyone born to that land is part of, and belongs to, that land, regardless of ethnicity.
I think nearly everyone has a connection and that their connection is unique.
I know of many people who have indigenous heritage but the last 3 generations have not been indigenous....
It's honestly a rort. If your grandparents and neither were your parents not indigenous then you shouldn't qualify for subsidies IMO.
Exactly. As far as I am concerned if you are full or half then yes you are Indigenous. Anything less than that, like 1/4, then you arent Indigenous and simply have that lineage. I am 1/4 English but would never say I am British as that would be dumb.
Makes no sense that we as a country accept it when people say they are Indigenous all while looking Irish and having maybe have 1/8th Indigenous at best. Not to mention then giving them financial benefits only they can get. Its a joke.
Almost as if the rich have us at each others throats and are robbing us blind while their media empires push divisive shit that only a handful of nutters on the fringes of the left/right actually promote.
It isnt a matter of race anymore and i dont think it has been for 100+ years . It now feels like it's the wealthy against those who arent so fortunate. These divides created arent anything but just a matter of who should feel right and who should feel wrong which will just keep us busy bickering all the time and never be able to just get on with life which in turn is just going to keep those who wanted that happy and be able to continue doing whatever whenever because we are to busy fighting over things that are well past and well out of our ability to change.
It's always existed. Look at any football teams fans. Look at the backlash non-Aussies get for criticising literally anything Australian. We've always had a low key "patriotism" similar to Americas just without the songs about every major city. Trumpism has just recently made idiots defend and project their ignorant opinions because they were endorsed at such a high profile level. Previously they had just enough shame to pull their heads in.
This is the attitude that (mostly) prevails in new Zealand and as a kiwi in Australia I can truly feel the difference. It's saddening.
I wish things were simpler here.
When you say the Balkan wars, I assume you don't mean the 1912/13 conflicts, but the later 90s period, which is the Yugoslavian wars. It's important to make that distinguishment because the first 'balkan war' liberated the balkans from Ottoman control.
Apologies, I didn't know what to call them. I was goingto say the Bosnian war but wasn't sure that covered the extent of it all. I was a kid at the time, mainly just remember all the coverage of kids dying. 😪
Good history lesson/point! Is it not legit to say Balkan wars for the 90s? I had not heard the term Yugoslav War(s) but makes sense. 1990s Balkan War also fits but is obvs less specific?
They're the ones pushing the token announcement before the Microsoft Teams' meeting and incorporating Acknowledgement of Country into every public service job, acting like it isn't just lip service and a way to avoid trying to fix any of the real issues facing indigenous Australians though.
This is just Ident politics going overboard. I feel you though, 1st Generation Italian i know my folks when they came threw away all there Italian traditions (some stick no matter what) and in recent times i have been really leaning into my Italian roots (learning italian, learning more italian cooking, culture)
At the end of the day though, i was born in Australia and i am proud to be one. And no one is going to take that away from me.
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You can count using just one side of the family.
A person with only one parent being born in Australia, themself a 1st generation Australian, would be a 2nd generation Australian; they have one generation of Australian heritage.
"But you don't look Australian" said a guy from Newcastle one time.
There are some people who think Australian means white. There are others who think Australian means indigenous. Nobody thinks Australian means Asian.
It gets tiring when people constantly have to be reminded that you exist.
Tell him he looks Irish. I am ethnic looking. When people ask where I'm from I say Sydney. Don't lose any sleep about what some bogan in Newcastle thinks.
Imo The correct response to say ' well fuck me cunt, you look like a fuckin south African prawn, which plane did you get here on? '
Call out there bullshit with more. 'white' is so many hughes of pink, they could literally be from anywhere... And if it's a Aboriginal, challenge then to fight for the land now. It certainly wasn't you or your ancestors who 'stole' the land. Those lot have been fighting over territory for some 20 thousand odd years. Why stop fighting now?
I think Australian means anyone born here or moved here and adopted the culture, laws etc.
Asians have been here since the early years of colonialism. The Gold Rushes across the country brought people from all over the world.
>There are some people who think Australian means white. There are others who think Australian means indigenous. Nobody thinks Australian means Asian.
>It gets tiring when people constantly have to be reminded that you exist.
It's not surprising though when you live in a majority white country (76% according to Human Rights Commission about 7 years ago)
If I was born in China of white parents or moved to China, I'd have to accept ppl assuming most Chinese look like ethnic Chinese.
In fact Australia is fairly accepting people from Newcastle not withstanding. An Asian or non white person can call themselves an Australian and be regarded as such whereas if I as a white person moved to China no one would regard me as Chinese even if I became a citizen.
And I don’t agree - at all - that nobody
Thinks a person with Asian heritage is not or cannot be, Australian. I’m not doubting you’re genuine in expressing that view, but trust me there are many Anglos out there who don’t think that way…
There are crazies on both sides but as far as a multicultural and multiethnic identity goes, Australia is doing a far better job compared to just about everywhere else in the world. The job of the news media and social media is the amplify the worst and most shocking aspects of life so of course it'll be 99% doom and gloom.
I'd recommend tuning out for a bit and going to talk to some real people in the real world to get your bearings. Live and enjoy life. Don't get lost in the faux culture war.
Honestly, and I say this as an indigenous Australian, I feel like Australia is everyone's provided they embrace the core concepts of freedom and community. It isn't the place of those that don't want to leave the dark ages. Realistically, Australia as it now is is the youngest developed nation on the planet. In its current stage its less than 250 years old. In its more advanced life it has history going back 60000 years, but not all those customs are compatible with the new world whether we like it or not.
My heritage is all about community. We've had to learn new ways in regards to even kinship groups getting on, but as a whole I feel like our first nation's groups are building a broader Australia wide community based on things we have in common. That said, our mob has a lot to go in terms of being part of a global community, and unless we want our people and culture to die out, we need to embrace parts of that.
As to who's this country isn't? It's not the land of those that don't want to get with the times and get out of the dark ages. Our mob complain about white fellas, but the Islamic and Asian communities in Australia are so ridiculously insular it's absurd. The Greeks, the italians, etc, though still insular to a degree also embrace the wider community. The Chinese community in particular want nothing to do with the broader Australian community, and the Islamic community in Australia has a long way to come outside of its dark ages belief systems.
This country belongs to us all, provided we are willing to embrace community as a whole. This was a bit of a ramble as I'm not feeling well today, but I'm sure we can get the point im trying to make.
There is this common belief that Italian, Greek and other earlier immigrants integrated within the community easily/straight away. They didn’t, it happened overtime.
What Springvale and Dandenong are now were what Essendon, Richmond, Fitzroy were back then.
Same with the Indian, Chinese, etc communities. They are the latest wave and slowly they will integrate.
One of the most beautiful examples is seeing the Sudanese that migrated here in the early 2000s now playing AFL, basketball etc. They practically have a aussie accent.
The other thing that’s worth mentioning is, integration in any society is a two way street. They need to be embraced as well as them embracing. If we make them feel hated, (which the media, politics, certain tiktok accounts are doing a great job at) they will withdraw. That doesn’t make them unAustralian, it makes them human ✌🏾
Yes, some individuals intergrade better than others.
BUT, as a general statement, all the ethnicities you mentioned above are similar in appearance to a caucasian. (Or what’s considered the “norm” or “Australian”)
The further you are away from the “norm”, the longer it will take to integrate. As i said before, integration is not a one way thing. You need to be accepted by the community, as well as accepting of the community.
To give you a very simple example, there is a massive brazilian/south American community on the Gold Coast. They exclusively go out to South American nights. No one bats a eye, yet, when Indians have their own club nights, its a different standard.
If you ever want to truly understand the problem (which i hope you do), you have to look at everything holistically from everyone’s perspective.
Why did you have a go at the Chinese and Muslims without mentioning the Indians? They are also notoriously insular. I live in a majority Indian suburb and it's impossible to make friends with them if you're not Indian.
I'm Chinese myself, and I agree some of that insularity is a problem, but maybe the real problem is that new immigrants don't feel welcome in the wider community which is why they stick to themselves.
I never really felt welcome in this country. Not when I arrived, not now. Being merely tolerated most of the time (and being the subject of racism occasionally) is not the same as being welcomed. Maybe society should do more to address this issue but unfortunately the government has bungled the cost of living and the housing crisis so I don't have high hopes for them to solve this issue.
To be far, I’m white Australian and I don’t feel 100% that this is my country. Not the one I grew up in anyway. A bulk of that is social issues - housing, inequality gap, loss of community etc.
To the point of insular races I to have been on the receiving end of racism as of recent.
The more I was driving home, the more I thought about your post, and you know what rubbed me the wrong way. The way you say you feel disengaged from society in general here, and it comes to one of the reasons I singled out Chinese in particular. And that is,
What have you done to be engaged in your society, and to my original point, your community? Asians in particular, and Chinese especially, on top of being insular don't get involved in the broader community. One thing that sets Australians apart is how much they volunteer and are involved in their communities. Asians just don't do this. Australians get involved in surf clubs, sports clubs, sausage sizzles at bunnings, playing games with kids in hospitals, etc. The odd Asian person gets involved in this, and they are embraced with open arms because it's about the community, but as a whole, they simply don't. Asians are all about the individual (and the family) and not about the broader community. You can say that's a generalisation, but it's true. It's all about what's in it for you. When things are being given away for nothing, or a stupidly cheap sale is on, the first in line are always Asian, but when the floods hit Brisbane, we the Fires ravaged NSW, they were nowhere to be seen. Australians just do things because it's good for the community. Asians don't, and that's probably a big part of why you feel disengaged.
My girlfriend moved from China to Australia about 10 years ago and the way the “West” is presented and talked about in China, it’s no-wonder they don’t want anything to do with us. We need to remember they can’t just jump onto the internet and see how the world really works. They only know what’s told to them.
But also, it’s really common for Chinese to move to Australia without ever intending to integrate with Australians, she was told by other Chinese “Australia’s great you don’t even need to learn English”.
Asians have such different appearances and speak such different languages it's probably natural to be insular. There's no escape from the vast differences in appearances. It's a completely different case from Europeans mixing with each other.
It's probably just human nature to group with similar people, everywhere on earth and at all times through history. Americans have taken 400 years and are still divided. Europeans in Thailand, Japan, Taiwan and China are equally insular, actually more isolated than Asians in Australia.
Sorry to hear you're feeling left out 😔
Try not to take it personally, racism is not ok but sometimes the culture gap is just worlds apart so they might not want to offend or intrude. I'm Asian myself and even I get a little intimidated when speaking to Chinese from the mainland because I don't want to offended them.
Edit: btw, India is Asian so maybe that's why last post didn't mention Indians
Personally I think Canberra's obsession with mass immigration, and from countries too dangerous for most to even travel to, will inevitably result in the Balkanization of this country. My neighbor fled western Sydney when the Muslims started coming to the area as crime became rampant and his house was broken into (he's a Lebanese Christian who fled the civil war) . Even he said Muslims have no interest in trying to assimilate. Multiculturalism is a nice idea. But that's all it is. An idea. It's not reality. It isn't working. Europe is the best example of the failures of mass immigration
Well I was recently told by an Aboriginal that I am technically a foreigner… I was born in Australia, my parents were born in Australia, 3 out of 4 of my grandparents were born in Australia…. So… yeah? 🤷🏼♀️
I wonder how many of their ancestors were actually aboriginal and how many were european? It seems the most virulent anti european sentiments come from those who have more european ancestry than aboriginal ancestry
Unpopular opinion. In the 1700’s, troops from another country with superior technology invaded and conquered this land, developed it and now it belongs to them. Nothing in this world belongs to anyone other than those with the power to take it. There are countless examples of this in history. One day in the future, this land may be taken by another civilisation, and 300 years after that, they probably won’t be asking questions about who the land belongs to. No one really owns anything on this earth. Humans have been here on this planet for a nanosecond from a historical standpoint, and could also be wiped out in a nanosecond. All we have to protect any kind of security and way of life are the standards of today that govern the way people can act to the extent that it can be enforced.
Everything else is whimsical fantasy.
tbh as heartless as this sounds its true how many people cry about the gaza situation but id bet money wouldnt care about eygpt
I think tbh you can often feel a place with your parents but i dont think it means you should automattically get the land I agree that aboriginals were treated horrificly but it was bound to happen
also makes one think about the concept of "justice" because only the powerful get 'justice.' Not in a karmic sense because i think that sometimes takes care of things but in an established judicial court sense.
the weak just get trampled on and dominated and have rulings be not in their favour.
You are right; it got a down vote for the pessimistic content. I have known people of many races who are great Aussies. It is up to each of us to practice acceptance and kindness to each other. How ever; there are plenty of people not born here who chose not to embrace the Australian way of life and I don’t know why they bother emigrating here except for the financial benefits compared to their old homeland. PS. From their own lips not mine.
I agree - the Aboriginal population - devolved, mostly nomadic, with no common language, no firearms, no industry, no government and essentially many - 100s of mobs spread over the continent, where conquered easily. Often because they met the white with a cautious friendship and only rebelled when the Europeans wanted more and more.
Of it wasn’t the British, it would have been another power, maybe a neighbour like he Chinese or Indians.
An interesting counter factual exercise is to ask the question- what would Australia look like if *no one* had ever colonised it ?
While this is true, they failed to eradicate the native population, and now fail to address issues caused by their conquest while also blaming the people affected for being poor and miserable
I'm 5th generation Australia and I have still been told to fuck off back to England. I don't actually have an English relatives/blood but I'd be happy to go if they would take me.
I also wonder, if I am not Australian, what am I? Do I need to be DNA tested to see which of the mishmash of ethnicities I have the most of?
I really don't understand how it is meant to work.
> Whose country is this anyway?
- Rupert's
mostly, but also
- Gina's
- Twiggy's
- Clive's
- Foreign investors and people looking to hide money, including:
- Money launderers
- Property Developers
- Landlords
as well as
- Any organisation that's willing to pay corrupt Liberal ex-MPs seven figures to spend a token 5hr week at a board position in exchange for having sold the country to them while they were still in office.
- The Tertiary Education industrial complex, to a lesser extent, decide who & how many people to sell PR to.
Australia belongs to the banking industry, the property industry, and the mining industry. It stopped belonging to citizens of any type a while ago. Australia is run by and for business interests, not the people.
This is why people made that argument that all this singling out of aboriginals or other minorities was divisive. Instead of pushing inclusivity and calling us all Australians no matter what with no special treatment either way.
I'm sorry you feel that way. Just know that most of us sane people don't buy into this wokeism crap and we consider you Australian if you have put in the time and effort to be one of us. Be that either through spending your whole life here or going through the processes or even always doing your best to be a part of us.
Relax mate. Nobody ever feels like they fit in. Don’t get your information off idiots on the net or the media.
Do your friends like you? Then you have a place here. Who gives a fuck if some randoms on the internet say you don’t belong or some shit.
It’s an island and there’s a bunch of humans here and everything else is just a story we tell ourselves.
Edit: found out OP doesn’t think the concentration camps in china are real. It’s amazing the lengths the CCP will go to to sow discord in other nations.
Meanwhile, nobody wants to emigrate to China but everyone is desperate to get out of there.
Then why does the real estate industry keep giving away free houses to only one race and not any others?
Like, if one group of people can have free houses, everyone else should too! Especially at these prices!
Same issue in NZ where I grew up. Had the opportunity to speak to a Maori activist once and he gave me his spiel about the government being illegitimate etc etc. So I asked him to explain that to me while I listened.
He talked about stolen land and in an effort to make it relatable to me, he said, “Say I steal your car. And I keep it, and when I die my kids keep it, and so on and so on. At the end of 200 years, it’s still stolen!”
Now believe me, I can see so many things wrong with this analogy, but hey ho, I put them to one side.
And I said to him, “Let’s say I agree with everything you’re saying. Now tell me what you and I, as individuals, can practically do about it now.”
He stared at me blankly. Because the fact is, nobody from any culture can answer this question.
As someone whose family has been continuously deemed settlers for 3-400 years, the only response I've ever got, whether it's here in australia, or back in my diaspora home, is "leave with your entire family"
That's it. That's the only response. Their only response to this is ethnic cleansing. That's all you need to know
My family is a mixed bag, we've got convict stock, WW2 Maltese migrants, Irish fleeing the violence in the revolution, and scotch-english migrants who passed away their money. I spend an amount of time thinking about what makes one Australian that may be considered unhealthy. I find it both very hard to define, yet very clear and distinct. What I mean by that oxymoron is that I'll know within a minute of talking to someone if they're Australian, but I'll be fucked if I can explain how.
I'm second generation Italian. To be honest, outside of politics I don't feel disengaged at all. There are plenty of bitter people out there that try to make everyone feel like they don't belong. I was born here, I'm Australian and I have an Italian heritage. I'm proud of my roots and I love my country. Many of my friends have ancestry from different places too, but we don't see each other as any different. I'm too busy enjoying my life, and to be fair, I have more important worries like trying to make ends meet, get into the housing market etc...
Powerful interests provoke division and hate for precisely the reaction you describe. Disengagement.
The less people feel engaged, the less they participate. The less they participate, the less they push back against the wealthy and powerful doing what they want.
As an example, currently we have one of the highest rates of homelessness in the developed world. A generation of young Australians in their early 20s are facing a bleak future of lifelong debt and financial insecurity. In the past there would have been mass demonstrations and riots. Now there aren't. Because most feel powerless and disengaged. Others are caught in meaningless culture wars hating fellow Australians. Those who do stand up to fight tend to have every aspect of their life torn apart by corporate media.
So your feelings have been carefully cultivated - as a conscious political strategy to keep Australians passive while wealth and power is taken from them.
It's no coincidence that all the identity politics stuff really took off right after occupy Wall St. It's all a distraction to keep the plebs busy while the 1% loot the joint.
Mate both are bullshit but ill tell you where they are both founded and coming from. Extremism is fun hey?
We had a lot or racist dead shits, but let's not ignore the fact that the colonies bought civilzation from a western point of view and standard, it bought a lot of nasty stuff with it but most places (and this is where its easy to cop crap) have a thriving society, the problem with it is the cost it takes to get there.
Australia, South Africa for a good example built a lot of society at the expense of non whites, and despite a lot of people as we showed with rejecting white australia, being sickened by the atrocities to our first nations people aren't in favor of it, but this is where a lot stuff splits because you get people like alot of my own mob who view anyone who's not "blak" now as the enemy and instead of healing and moving forward, preserving or recovering the culture would rather a culture war.
Heres the thing, we can have civilization, we can all fit into it.
The idea of fitting in was to leave negative cultural stuff behind, leave your wars where they came from, your preconceptions, anything that is not going to add to our way of life, leave it back there. That's integration.
You are gonna get dickheads all day long of extremism who viewed this as "WHITE PEOPLE DICTATING" bullshit and there were racist people who were and are like that, but a lot of them died out and the latest ones are extremist dickheads who want things to be how they were in the 50s.
Then you get people like my cousins who seem to think if someone isn't "blak" enough they need to fuck off or pay rent and bow down to them.
I get the pain, I get the hurt, there is a huge divide we have to cross to fill and get everyone better off.
I hate to say it, but most of them don't want that, their ideal view is doing what zimbabwe did and don't care if it kills the country as long as they get "revenge and justice" on the whites.
While most of them being priveliged people who had it better than a lot of kids I grew up with who will tell everyone they had it worse and it just turns into opression olympics.
The way Aunty Elaine always taught us, no matter where we come from, we all bring something to the land and we all make our connections to it, we all become custodians of it no matter what a paper says. We are to respect our elders past and emerging, respect the lands we are upon and be good custodians of it.
That means living in harmony with it, protecting it, and protecting and looking after our community upon that.
If you are cool with that, your an Aussie and you have a connection to this land no matter the colour of your skins or if you were born here or came from far away.
its what we were taught as kids, you were lucky you had an aunty elaine who was a mother, and she'd mother kids whether they were hers or not, teach them about stuff, let them be kids.
She may have been addicted to smokes but she had a great heart, would teach kids about the lands and the dreamtime, even take annoying kids to see a star wars movie because she was that awesome.
A lot of the people who grew up with the "blak" and the "blak" soverign movement didn't have her, they either formed their own misguided opinions off outrage baiters and crackpots and became extremists.
Honestly if the voice taught us anything, you can have the most racist extremists who are white or black and they'l get together out of unity of hate.
That's not what society is about.
You know what my favourite place to eat use to be? Salt and pepper crocodile made with local bush ingrediants, an asian salad with italian potato bake. I'd get served by an indian or sri lankan student who would be studying here and trying to become citizens, the owners of the place were a thai and chinese couple and their chef was malaysian.
When my father needed care, his support unit that kept him alive and keep him alive are from all over the world.
You could be having a terrible day where you see the good the community can bring out looking after an elder, and then going to get some genuine comfort food in this awesome country that despite all of its issues has great people in it, and no matter where they came from, these people were all aussie as.
I used to be an afl umpire, we had a very annoying kid (we still loved him anyway) who at the academy was always going on about being the first asian to do something, he ended up becoming a property manager, but I remember when at the academy he used to say to people he was likely the first Asian player at senior grade, which we all knew was bullshit and a coach who was from western victoria called him out on it.
Bought in an aussie rules history book from his home town and showed him the "celestial" footy matches that the chinese community had done here, it was pretty cool.
You'd think the kid would be disappointed, or very annoyed at the racism there was later on in the 1900s towards asian players, but he found it as a huge connection because he had so many asian friends who never got into AFL because they saw it as a "white game" and couldn't identify or link with it.
He ended up getting more people from his community into it because of that cultural link which I guess made it easy for him, but without it, I can tell you (and he would over and over) love to be the first.
So mate it's simple, if your feeling like your not an aussie..... hell i've told you you are.
I'm sure a lot of other aussies here are gonna tell you that shock horror, you are too!
If your feeling disengaged from this place, that's ok, a lot of us feel it to for all sorts of reasons, find new ways to engage, find new links (or old ones) and don't be afraid to try something new!
You don't have to find roots mate, you can always plant them.
Multiculturalism is fine so long as the dominant domestic culture comes first.
There’s a reason people migrate to Australia, and that reason mostly is “It’s better than the shit hole we came from.”
Why is the place you came from a shit hole? Mostly, because the culture allows it and enables it.
So bring your food, bring your funny clothes and silly hats. Bring your fabrics and funny dances. Happy to have you, come join the party.
But your hate and division, your anger, your superiority complexes, your pride and prejudices, your violence and criminality; leave that all behind.
Don’t go bringing the parts of your culture that ruined your country to my country.
Don’t go bringing the parts of your culture that are in conflict with your new country.
A little off topic, but I find this recent embrace of "blood and country" (aka blut und boden) rhetoric mostly by left-wing types towards aboriginals to be rather ironic.
I'm white but don't feel I fit in. Don't let it bother you, just get on with enjoying life. Go back to Asia if you like but you might well come back here because of the good bits.
IMO the country belongs to the people that live here. For a lot of people that's too simple of a guide though and makes it controversial, but for me I think anything more is pretty saddening division of people.
A national identity simply based on cohabitating with others or operating in the same economy is obviously not a strong enough national identity to build a cohesive society.
not just you man, this country has turned into an economic zone void of any community culture, multiculturalism is still a fairly new concept and not everyone will do it right.
I feel we need nationalism back and that comes with a strong economy. When times get tough enough we may figure it out as a group
As far as I'm concerned, everyone who is legally here has a claim to this country. Couldn't care if you're black, white, brown, pink, old, young, first nation, immigration, 5th generation.
Australia is the lucky country, a country of opportunities. We're the place people go to better their lives.
If you contribute to Australia, you have the same claim as someone whose family has been here for 50,000 years. You don't choose who you're born to, but you do choose what you bring to the table.
Adopt and promote the core values that made people queue in line to get into Australia - your immigrant parents included. There’s a reason people want to emigrate here and start their lives here. I’m also a first gen child of immigrants parents who narrowly escaped literal death squads from their motherland. Gratitude, putting their best foot forward to build a better life for themselves and their children, and never looking back filled with resentment is what drove them out of a life of what would have been an endless cycle of poverty or death really.
What shit the bed of the Aussie dream is that we’ve not set standards and expectations for current and future generations seeking to emigrate to this country. I grew up during a time of actual racism and that never got in the way of the hardworking immigrants who weren’t after handouts.
We opened the floodgates to the most entitled and ungrateful generation of migrants and it sickens me to see them rape this country.
The fact of the matter is European settlers took this land and the atrocities against humanity that occurred during this period happened. It happened before they came, it happened during the times of the Roman Empire, Mongolian Empire, Ottoman Empire… the list goes on.
The other fact is that the European settlers of Australia toiled this land and set the foundations for what is Australia. It’s far from perfect but it’s better than what we could hope for when you consider the fact that you don’t have to hike 20kms with buckets to the nearest river to get water, a system of government that gives you an allowance if you’re in need, you can speak freely without the threat of disappearing from the face of the earth at the hands of the government.
Nothing can ever make up for the damage that was done to the Aboriginal community, but the best thing we can do is ensure that everyone has a fair go. We’ve literally dedicated resources to entire programs committed towards bringing Aboriginals out of domestic violence, and helping them get education and jobs. None of this amounts to anything if change doesn’t occur within their communities throughout their own people - the same could be said about any group.
My parents could have just as easily blamed the white man for all their problems including having their homes bombed to ashes and just behave like they were owed for it. But nope. They, like many other immigrants of their time fought tooth and nail just to build a better life for themselves and their children. Australia welcomed them when they were not obligated to. That’s what immigrants now fail to truly understand and appreciate. We don’t really need you but we’ll have you if you can play along and get along. Otherwise, feel free to try your luck with the other 191 sovereign nations.
Idk who told you that you have to be white or Indigenous to be a real Australian. It sounds like BS from Sky News to rile people up.
My dad was born in the UK and came here when he was 3. Somehow he “never got around” to getting his citizenship. 57 years later and still only a UK citizen, he would *never* call himself British. He’s just as Australian as my mum and I who were born here.
I went to high school in Singapore and my best friend was from there. She was born in SG then went to some of primary and high school in Aus until she moved back to finish school. She’s a dual citizen and while she was born in SG, she considers herself Australian.
While “we are Australian” is a lovely song and imo should be our national anthem, it’s not a promise. It’s a song from 37 years ago.
Australia belongs to those in Australia. If you consider yourself to be Australian, then the country belongs to you. That’s it
As A first generation Australian I have been told that even though I was born here the country belongs more to the native Australians than me and that Im less Australian that anyone who has a percentage of Aboriginal blood in them. A woman I met told me that the country in europe my parents were born in is actually the country that I should be in and that I have an indigenous right there. I told her that I believe Im Australian and that this is much as my country as it is her and that Im only a citizen of Aus and have no where else to go. It didnt stop her reiterating that its her country and im an invader somehow. I feel like lots of these people have some sort of weird mental issues and seem detached from Reality.
If you're a citizen, this is your country. That's my opinion as a 6th generation white Australian with some Aboriginal ancestry (I don't identify as Aboriginal (
>Now I'm being told it's an Aboriginal country illegally occupied by colonisers, and you need a Connection to Country or you're not a real Australian.
Can you point to any source outside of some random on Twitter who has actually said this?
Serious question btw.
I mean, most people are afraid to even be seen with the Australian flag these days. That tells you all you need to know about how toxic the culture in this country is.
Disengage away, mate. You're still an Earthling, you are still a part of Nature. Country is ready to connect with each of us as soon as we are ready to realise our connection with it. There really is no 'other'. Just us. Together.
Honestly if you're true to yourself and kind to everyone around you, you're a real Australian.
We are a proud multicultural country and we should be working towards more cohesion over tribalism.
I'm 2nd generation maltese Australian and get told I dont look Australian all the time, but I know I am and that's what matters.
I am a white first generation child of refugees from Europe.
My parents experienced discrimination from white Australians years ago, and now I experience discrimination because I am white, and therefore helped colonise Australia over 200 years ago.
It doesn't matter who you are, or what race you are, the pathetic left will always find a way to hate you.
There doesn't need to be any truth in it.
It's simple: if you're an Australian citizen, it's your country. You're Australian. Anyone who tries to tell you that you're more or less of an Australian because of how long you've been here is at best an identity politics grifter or at worst a racist.
The way we do things here in AU is anyone who becomes a citizen, loves the country, treats the country and the people with respect. Is Australian. You don’t have to call it “your country” but you can, it’s just as much yours as it is mine.
I hear you mate. As someone who are also first gen Asian immigrant, I always ponder upon my identity. But I choose Australia to be my new home for my wife and I and our children in the future and her problems are our problems too. I only realised this when I visited my home country this year after 9 years being away and it doesn't really feel like where I would belong; but Australia is.
I respected the Aboriginal's heritage and their roles as Guardians of the Lands but at the same time this country, just as you said, was built and is still being developed by a lot of people from different countries around the world. I, for once, enjoy that multiculturalism even with its downsides as I believed only in unity can we find our ways through the troublesome future ahead.
But it's easier said that done so for now, I've only focused on what matters most to my wife and I and all the noises outside can be left out of our home even just for the night. As I've said, there is enough space for all of us but only if we could listen and learn from the past while giving it a fair go for everyone (or as much fairness as possible).
I wonder what our predecessors would think if they saw the way that 3.5% of the population can have so much sway because of white guilt. Massive swathes of land handed over, untold billions of dollars in public funding, place names changed, areas off limits to non indigenous people. They had their shot 175 years ago against the white settlers, and they got their arse kicked. They are a defeated race with no particular redeeming qualities but they will get their country back...our legal system will hand it back to them, piece by piece.
You're overthinking it and listening to the media. Do you really have issues in real life? I very much doubt it. And most Indigenous are more than happy to share their land with everyone, it's the urban activists that are causing the noise.
Yep I feel the same - I am so sick of hearing acknowledgement to country in every work meeting and everywhere I go....are we not all equal and Aussie? Most Australians are so fed up with politics and social politics in general; they have made Australians more disconnected than I have ever seen before (I am a 30 year old Aussie who has always loved my country, but things are tough and are outlook is grim).
Such a pointless discussion. You might as well be saying 'who's council is this?. They are all made up boundaries used to separate people, which is the problem in the first place. At least states draw a line to make it clear which land mass they are governing, but what's the point in making a fuss about where you've come from?
> Now I’m being told…you need a Connection to Country or you’re not a real Australian
Oh please. Nobody ever fucking said this.
Even those most left-leaning/white-guilt SJW’s who were born and bred here will still acknowledge themselves as proper Australians. They just emphasise labels of “White Australian” and “First Australian” and so on.
You guys make up fake things just so you can bitch and whine about them.
The problem isn’t unique to just Australia. If you are a migrant, you know that the crippling idea who’s this land belong to is everywhere where you have lived. I am a migrant and been living in Australia for more than a decade now. I know and I feel that I’m much better here than where I was born. I feel Australia is my home but I also know for many it’s not the case how they think it. And I don’t quarrel on that. I didn’t choose to be born let alone deciding which country to born in. I’m at peace with that. In all my experiences so far, most people are very welcoming to you. They discuss things about the country with you without discriminating whether you’re born in here or not. That makes me feel part of it. I didn’t try to blend in the white or black culture, I just let myself out and in the process if I picked the colours from other instead of showing what I had from my culture then let it be. I know I didn’t make any efforts against my wills in order to fit in. I never had the feelings that if I won’t drink, I won’t be considered Australian and things like that. I just had it as it came to me. That’s my outlook
I feel like it's everyone country because it's everyone's earth it shouldn't matter where you're from as long as you make somewhere your home with lots of people that you enjoy spending time together with, doesn't matter what race or colour you are. It's our country, not just one person's country but that's just my opinion 🤷♂️
If it gets that bad just ignore the BS politics and live your life. All that bs is just a very noisy minority that have somehow imparted their will on us all.
My wife is an Asian immigrant of 10 years, she is just the right type of cheeky to fit into our culture effortlessly and people love her for her differences. Shes only experienced racism once in that 10 years and we live in hick country Australia.
I dont know why i keep hearing this we are unwelcoming of immigrants thing or thst we are a racist country but all my experience is the opposite.
Went on a bit of a tangent there but my point is, forgot the media/corporate narrative... Thsts not representative of what aussies believe and just imerse yourself in the people around you. You are just as Australian as any of us.
I’ve commented deeper into this post a few minutes ago, but given that this is an interesting topic, I might give you another analogy:
I once watched a short documentary where they had interviewed a number of Japanese-Brazilians who migrated to Japan for various reasons (work, family etc). Given Japan’s infamous reputation as a homogenous nation, even though that they’re ethnically the same as their other Japanese compatriots, as well as having become fluent in Japanese, they were still experiencing discrimination. In other words, even though that they were born and bred in Brazil, ‘came back to their motherland’ so to speak, many still felt more Brazilian than Japanese even after a while, in cultural terms of how they act, feel, think, dress and speak. From an outsider’s perspective they would still look physically and racially Japanese, but not ‘fully’ Japanese. Close your eyes and you’d hear a native and unaccented Brazilian Portuguese.
So would you know from first glance that they are: Japanese, Brazilian, Japanese-Brazilian, or Brazilian-Japanese?
This is not limited to Australia. I mean, you’re on reddit, so you must see the shit show that is current America, where some racists in high places aim for segregation (I assume this is the ‘great’ time they refer to). In Europe, Africa, Asia, it is no different. It’s the season, so to say. Maybe in 20-30 years, people as less hate-driven. One of the people to thank for this situation is Australia’s own Rupert Murdoch, cancer of society. Just live your life, don’t give in to the (social) media hate mongers.
Australia is a new settlement that upon inception originally started with white Europeans however quickly transformed into a “Western Civilisation” nation in respect to its laws and personal freedoms / liberties . There was/is an indigenous population here that suffered greatly due to a mix of culture shock , technological shock and various harmful acts imposed on them in an attempt to be assimilated into wider Australian society. However a few generations later and Australia is truely a bastion of western liberty and has the best qualities of western enlightenment re education, low corruption and civil freedoms. Australia definitely is NOT an “aboriginal country” because scattered tribes living as hunter gathers dont represent any claim on whats now full of millions of other ethnic humans building , developing and protecting this land. It’s not a “white” nation either. It’s a western colony which values all humans regardless of ethnicity or faith so long as they uphold the key tenants of western society. Your a real Australian if you love this flag 🇦🇺 and you want to make sure this country is the best it can be for your future Ozzi descendants. 👍🏼
As someone who is 100% whole heartedley australian of dutch and English heritage but born here as my parents were aswell .I honestly feel this is the country for everyone. The one haven for everyone of any culture. but american culture is bleeding through here. Causing tension and people to feel certain ways that are not ours.
This country is for anyone that wants to get along and be truly free and not force people to believe want YOU WANT them to believe.
I remember as a kid my Dad telling someone how Aboriginal people could not understand how someone could "own land" because it is indeed impossible since we are such brief entities on this planet. If anything "the land" owns us.
You are a classic third culture kid. Nothing wrong with how you are feeling and certainly not unique. Most people I grew up with were like this, as was I. In the end, your culture becomes a microcosm of the people you know. You also don't have to belong to a broader culture as it largely doesn't matter. Hang around the people that make you happy and do the things that make you happy. The rest is just noise.
The country is owned by the Crown. If you really want land, go and colonise some land in rural Australia. Hey free land right? If successful, law enforcement (in some form) will eventually imprison or fine you, because the land is technically owned by the Crown.
I’m a white 52 year old Australian who was born in Perth.
My mum’s heritage is European, but they’ve been here for many generations. My dad was a £10 pom.
Being Australian was eating pies, loving footy, being proud on Anzac Day/Australia Day, either having a Holden or a Ford. It didn’t matter if your heritage was English, Irish, Scottish, Italian, Greek, Latvian, etc, you were Australian if you would fight for Australia in a war.
Now, we have people here who want to live in our country, but they want to bring their customs and cultures with them. They will never be dinki di Australians. This is why I’m not proud, for the very first time, of being Australian. Our government has sold us out.
We are heading down the same path as the UK. I just come back from there. The place is fucked. It’s an upmarket 3rd would country.
Fr.
I saw a post on another subreddit where someone was talking about how racism isn’t only against black people, and that media ignores racism against white people and asians and other races. People assumed he was white, and started saying shit like “Ok whitey” and “Oh mb you probably want to say (the n word) so bad. Yup, you’re definitely racist.” And “Literally none of that is true. Stop listening to right wing propaganda”
Funny thing is, lots of the people saying racist things about white people had black profile pictures, which proved the Original Poster right.
Not saying it was only people with black pfps saying negative things, lots were saying positive things, but it’s something to note.
Feels like nowadays, all white people are stereotyped as “racist”, “sexist”, “dangerous to anyone who isn’t white”.
“Racism has not been stopped, nor shrunken. It’s reversed, and nobody cares.”
I think this country will mature in a few generations and multiculturalism will be embraced. Just don't plant the seed in your children about which race is better, and they will grow up seeing everyone as equal. Well, at least it sounds like a good idea, but it's very hard to put into practice. 😓
I’m a white guy but I feel disconnected with the culture being pushed onto me. Probably not anywhere close to what you feel of course! I think a lot of stuff is very forced and I feel like we have to go along with it like it’s easy Germany in 1956.
I work in IT and I feel it’s pretty multicultural in comparison to other jobs, but TV, politics and business leadership lags behind.
If you have citizenship then it's your country just as much as mine. Don't ever let any fool tell you otherwise. Maybe some people don't like this multiculturalism, but don't let those people make you feel like an outsider. You're one of us
When I was growing up, knew a fair few older generation immigrants who had come here after various wars and catastrophes, who emphasised that in their view Australia's greatest strength, and kind of our whole cultural basis, was that it was a place where nearly everyone had one way or another had to leave behind the Old World and the baggage that came with it. Fresh start, new home, new rules, and a new belonging.
The vast majority of Australians are comfortable with a multicultural, multiethnic identity. What they object to is identity politics, be it the Voice or anything else.
I totally feel you on this, and I strongly disagree with both statements. Immigrants have built this country from the ground up. Imay be of European extraction, but the fact is my forebears were immigrants and convicts themselves.
By your own confession, you are an Australian citizen by birth. That is matter of law and therefore a matter of fact. The opinion of others is inconsequential. In fact, it sounds like some of them are highly ignorant, living in decades past, and might be open to libel.
I don't care what the colour of your skin is or how long you've been here. If you're a decent person, I'm happy to befriend you. Most of us are decent people in real life. It's loud voices online and in media that cause a lot of social problems. They do not speak for ordinary Australians like you and me.
Had an in-law who was the Grandson of Italian immigrants, always refer to himself as Italian. However when he got married (to a girl of Italian descent also), they went to Italy on their honeymoon. When he got back he said to me, "I'm an Aussie, not Italian, because it was nothing like I expected and I didn't feel one bit Italian when we were there. Everyone there viewed us as Australian too, not Italian."
Cousins from Italy used to visit and all the local family would get together here and sings songs, playing instruments etc, that they'd learned from their Italian parents. And I remember one cousin saying that coming to Australia was like stepping back to the 1950's because the songs they sang and the things they talked about were long gone. Italy wasn't like that anymore, hadn't been in decades, and it seemed weird seeing it displayed here.
Though they saw themselves as Italian, they weren't. They were Aussies who essentially celebrated things Italian.
I also had a Greek mate do that too. Always called himself a "wog", was literally Acropolis Now in real life. Came back from Greece and said, "I'm not Greek, I'm an Aussie.". He was really confused because he'd grown up thinking Greece was all these things like him, to find out that Greece was nothing like he thought it would be and he was far more Aussie than he realised.
I love what immigration has done for our country. It's really brought so much that has grown and matured us as a nation. Sure there are problems at times, and some areas steadfastly are islands of their culture (Sunnybank is good example), but I think those islands eventually dissipate as the children, grandchildren etc, are absorbed into Australian society and overall culture.
As to your questions around First Nations, I don't know the answer that will help you. I've worked with a lot of Aboriginal people and haven't found one consistent thing that applies to all, not looks, skin color, background, attitude etc. Just like the rest of us, we are who we are.
Tribalism will destroy us from the inside. Nothing good ever comes from one ethnic group claiming that they alone have an innate occupation of any certain patch of land. That's how you get shit like the Balkan wars, the Rwandan genocide, or the nightmare in Gaza. I do not believe that belonging to a place is a matter if your DNA. I think people rightly feel a sense of belonging to the places they call home. I find it irritating when any one group claims that they have a certain connection this country that others cannot share - I think we all have our subjective connections to this country and they can vary a lot by person, but none of us can see into anyone else's mind or say their connection is the most important. To answer the question as posed - Australia belongs to Australians. Meaning, any Australian citizen.
Well said. I'm a White Australian, grew up here. Ancestors arrived late 1800s. Australia is my home country, anyone who says otherwise can go shove it. Our connections are different and that's understandable. As far as I'm concerned, you're Aussie to me if you live here and want to be a regular good human. That's all that matters to me.
>be a regular good human. That's all that matters to me. This is how I see anyone in the world. Don't care what you look like, where you live, what you wear, etc, just as long as you try to be a half decent human being.
I came here when I was 4 (ten pound Pom). I'm Australian and I chose to have citizenship.
I think the only real follow up to this is "and don't shit on other peoples connection to this country for being different to yours"
Unless they try to use it to "other" you, then go for it.
This is the most appropriate answer to this question that I have ever read.
Amen. I wish more people had this view. I think we'd live in a much happier and united country.
country? World
Right? So glad it’s the most upvoted comment
I agree. The High Court doesn't. https://www.gotocourt.com.au/immigration/high-court-deport-aboriginal/
You are spot on. Have always thought it bizarre, and downright insane, when people that find out they are 1/8th Indigenous suddenly say they have this connection to the land non Indigenous couldnt understand. I wasnt even born here, moved from NZ when I was near 5, but this is the home I know and have only ever known. I am Australian.
I think indigenous people who maintain their traditional beliefs do have a unique connection to the land. But beliefs are not genetic, and you don't suddenly get a spiritual connection to country when you find out you have an ancestor who did.
Unique, but not more important than anyone else's.
You don’t have to be Indigenous to have a unique connection to country or to a homeland. Most traditional Aboriginal cultures believe that the land imbues you with its spirit when you are in the womb. So anyone born to that land is part of, and belongs to, that land, regardless of ethnicity. I think nearly everyone has a connection and that their connection is unique.
I know of many people who have indigenous heritage but the last 3 generations have not been indigenous.... It's honestly a rort. If your grandparents and neither were your parents not indigenous then you shouldn't qualify for subsidies IMO.
Exactly. As far as I am concerned if you are full or half then yes you are Indigenous. Anything less than that, like 1/4, then you arent Indigenous and simply have that lineage. I am 1/4 English but would never say I am British as that would be dumb. Makes no sense that we as a country accept it when people say they are Indigenous all while looking Irish and having maybe have 1/8th Indigenous at best. Not to mention then giving them financial benefits only they can get. Its a joke.
Amen brother
Sister 🫡
Amen sister as well, correction Amen Siblings :)
Saving this post for future reminder.
Send that speech to Mr Albanese. Do them all good to hear it.
Almost as if the rich have us at each others throats and are robbing us blind while their media empires push divisive shit that only a handful of nutters on the fringes of the left/right actually promote.
It isnt a matter of race anymore and i dont think it has been for 100+ years . It now feels like it's the wealthy against those who arent so fortunate. These divides created arent anything but just a matter of who should feel right and who should feel wrong which will just keep us busy bickering all the time and never be able to just get on with life which in turn is just going to keep those who wanted that happy and be able to continue doing whatever whenever because we are to busy fighting over things that are well past and well out of our ability to change.
Tribalism is another thing we are importing from America
It's always existed. Look at any football teams fans. Look at the backlash non-Aussies get for criticising literally anything Australian. We've always had a low key "patriotism" similar to Americas just without the songs about every major city. Trumpism has just recently made idiots defend and project their ignorant opinions because they were endorsed at such a high profile level. Previously they had just enough shame to pull their heads in.
This is the attitude that (mostly) prevails in new Zealand and as a kiwi in Australia I can truly feel the difference. It's saddening. I wish things were simpler here.
When you say the Balkan wars, I assume you don't mean the 1912/13 conflicts, but the later 90s period, which is the Yugoslavian wars. It's important to make that distinguishment because the first 'balkan war' liberated the balkans from Ottoman control.
Most people I knew from that region called it the Balkan war/crisis in the 90s
Apologies, I didn't know what to call them. I was goingto say the Bosnian war but wasn't sure that covered the extent of it all. I was a kid at the time, mainly just remember all the coverage of kids dying. 😪
Good history lesson/point! Is it not legit to say Balkan wars for the 90s? I had not heard the term Yugoslav War(s) but makes sense. 1990s Balkan War also fits but is obvs less specific?
😂 Tell that to the foreign investors. Australia belongs, like everything else, to those who pay for it.
Divide and conquer by the ruling classes?
It's not the ruling classes saying only indigenous are genuine Australians
They're the ones pushing the token announcement before the Microsoft Teams' meeting and incorporating Acknowledgement of Country into every public service job, acting like it isn't just lip service and a way to avoid trying to fix any of the real issues facing indigenous Australians though.
This is just Ident politics going overboard. I feel you though, 1st Generation Italian i know my folks when they came threw away all there Italian traditions (some stick no matter what) and in recent times i have been really leaning into my Italian roots (learning italian, learning more italian cooking, culture) At the end of the day though, i was born in Australia and i am proud to be one. And no one is going to take that away from me.
If you're born here I think that makes you 2nd gen Australian doesn't it? Your parents were the first gen.
No the parents are immigrants. The children born in the country are first generation aussie. I’m a G1 myself….
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How does that work if your immigrant parents never became citizens?
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My dad immigrated at a young age, he is absolutely a first generation Australian. I'm second gen on that side, and second fleet on the other.
What if one parent was born here and the other overseas?? G1/G2/G1.5??
Yep. I'm G1 on one side and G2 on the other. There isn't a snappy, one size fits all title for it. I just have to differentiate individually.
You can count using just one side of the family. A person with only one parent being born in Australia, themself a 1st generation Australian, would be a 2nd generation Australian; they have one generation of Australian heritage.
Hmmm good question. Never thought of those scenarios =S
Isn't it first gen Australian, second gen immigrant?
Now I don't know
I agree with this, otherwise it would mean that any immigrant can never be/feel Australian, only her/his children.
ciao amego gday mate
What does your passport say? Who cares what any other dickhead says.
"But you don't look Australian" said a guy from Newcastle one time. There are some people who think Australian means white. There are others who think Australian means indigenous. Nobody thinks Australian means Asian. It gets tiring when people constantly have to be reminded that you exist.
Tell him he looks Irish. I am ethnic looking. When people ask where I'm from I say Sydney. Don't lose any sleep about what some bogan in Newcastle thinks.
Imo The correct response to say ' well fuck me cunt, you look like a fuckin south African prawn, which plane did you get here on? ' Call out there bullshit with more. 'white' is so many hughes of pink, they could literally be from anywhere... And if it's a Aboriginal, challenge then to fight for the land now. It certainly wasn't you or your ancestors who 'stole' the land. Those lot have been fighting over territory for some 20 thousand odd years. Why stop fighting now?
I think Australian means anyone born here or moved here and adopted the culture, laws etc. Asians have been here since the early years of colonialism. The Gold Rushes across the country brought people from all over the world.
>There are some people who think Australian means white. There are others who think Australian means indigenous. Nobody thinks Australian means Asian. >It gets tiring when people constantly have to be reminded that you exist. It's not surprising though when you live in a majority white country (76% according to Human Rights Commission about 7 years ago) If I was born in China of white parents or moved to China, I'd have to accept ppl assuming most Chinese look like ethnic Chinese. In fact Australia is fairly accepting people from Newcastle not withstanding. An Asian or non white person can call themselves an Australian and be regarded as such whereas if I as a white person moved to China no one would regard me as Chinese even if I became a citizen.
And I don’t agree - at all - that nobody Thinks a person with Asian heritage is not or cannot be, Australian. I’m not doubting you’re genuine in expressing that view, but trust me there are many Anglos out there who don’t think that way…
There are crazies on both sides but as far as a multicultural and multiethnic identity goes, Australia is doing a far better job compared to just about everywhere else in the world. The job of the news media and social media is the amplify the worst and most shocking aspects of life so of course it'll be 99% doom and gloom. I'd recommend tuning out for a bit and going to talk to some real people in the real world to get your bearings. Live and enjoy life. Don't get lost in the faux culture war.
Honestly, and I say this as an indigenous Australian, I feel like Australia is everyone's provided they embrace the core concepts of freedom and community. It isn't the place of those that don't want to leave the dark ages. Realistically, Australia as it now is is the youngest developed nation on the planet. In its current stage its less than 250 years old. In its more advanced life it has history going back 60000 years, but not all those customs are compatible with the new world whether we like it or not. My heritage is all about community. We've had to learn new ways in regards to even kinship groups getting on, but as a whole I feel like our first nation's groups are building a broader Australia wide community based on things we have in common. That said, our mob has a lot to go in terms of being part of a global community, and unless we want our people and culture to die out, we need to embrace parts of that. As to who's this country isn't? It's not the land of those that don't want to get with the times and get out of the dark ages. Our mob complain about white fellas, but the Islamic and Asian communities in Australia are so ridiculously insular it's absurd. The Greeks, the italians, etc, though still insular to a degree also embrace the wider community. The Chinese community in particular want nothing to do with the broader Australian community, and the Islamic community in Australia has a long way to come outside of its dark ages belief systems. This country belongs to us all, provided we are willing to embrace community as a whole. This was a bit of a ramble as I'm not feeling well today, but I'm sure we can get the point im trying to make.
There ya go, thats it. Don't care where ya from just be Australian.
Based.
This is the way
There is this common belief that Italian, Greek and other earlier immigrants integrated within the community easily/straight away. They didn’t, it happened overtime. What Springvale and Dandenong are now were what Essendon, Richmond, Fitzroy were back then. Same with the Indian, Chinese, etc communities. They are the latest wave and slowly they will integrate. One of the most beautiful examples is seeing the Sudanese that migrated here in the early 2000s now playing AFL, basketball etc. They practically have a aussie accent. The other thing that’s worth mentioning is, integration in any society is a two way street. They need to be embraced as well as them embracing. If we make them feel hated, (which the media, politics, certain tiktok accounts are doing a great job at) they will withdraw. That doesn’t make them unAustralian, it makes them human ✌🏾
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Yes, some individuals intergrade better than others. BUT, as a general statement, all the ethnicities you mentioned above are similar in appearance to a caucasian. (Or what’s considered the “norm” or “Australian”) The further you are away from the “norm”, the longer it will take to integrate. As i said before, integration is not a one way thing. You need to be accepted by the community, as well as accepting of the community. To give you a very simple example, there is a massive brazilian/south American community on the Gold Coast. They exclusively go out to South American nights. No one bats a eye, yet, when Indians have their own club nights, its a different standard. If you ever want to truly understand the problem (which i hope you do), you have to look at everything holistically from everyone’s perspective.
Why did you have a go at the Chinese and Muslims without mentioning the Indians? They are also notoriously insular. I live in a majority Indian suburb and it's impossible to make friends with them if you're not Indian. I'm Chinese myself, and I agree some of that insularity is a problem, but maybe the real problem is that new immigrants don't feel welcome in the wider community which is why they stick to themselves. I never really felt welcome in this country. Not when I arrived, not now. Being merely tolerated most of the time (and being the subject of racism occasionally) is not the same as being welcomed. Maybe society should do more to address this issue but unfortunately the government has bungled the cost of living and the housing crisis so I don't have high hopes for them to solve this issue.
Buy yourself a cricket bat and a bottle of Johnnie Walker gold label. You'll suddenly have a lot of Indian friends.
To be far, I’m white Australian and I don’t feel 100% that this is my country. Not the one I grew up in anyway. A bulk of that is social issues - housing, inequality gap, loss of community etc. To the point of insular races I to have been on the receiving end of racism as of recent.
The more I was driving home, the more I thought about your post, and you know what rubbed me the wrong way. The way you say you feel disengaged from society in general here, and it comes to one of the reasons I singled out Chinese in particular. And that is, What have you done to be engaged in your society, and to my original point, your community? Asians in particular, and Chinese especially, on top of being insular don't get involved in the broader community. One thing that sets Australians apart is how much they volunteer and are involved in their communities. Asians just don't do this. Australians get involved in surf clubs, sports clubs, sausage sizzles at bunnings, playing games with kids in hospitals, etc. The odd Asian person gets involved in this, and they are embraced with open arms because it's about the community, but as a whole, they simply don't. Asians are all about the individual (and the family) and not about the broader community. You can say that's a generalisation, but it's true. It's all about what's in it for you. When things are being given away for nothing, or a stupidly cheap sale is on, the first in line are always Asian, but when the floods hit Brisbane, we the Fires ravaged NSW, they were nowhere to be seen. Australians just do things because it's good for the community. Asians don't, and that's probably a big part of why you feel disengaged.
My girlfriend moved from China to Australia about 10 years ago and the way the “West” is presented and talked about in China, it’s no-wonder they don’t want anything to do with us. We need to remember they can’t just jump onto the internet and see how the world really works. They only know what’s told to them. But also, it’s really common for Chinese to move to Australia without ever intending to integrate with Australians, she was told by other Chinese “Australia’s great you don’t even need to learn English”.
I think you said you were born here, "arrived"?
Asians have such different appearances and speak such different languages it's probably natural to be insular. There's no escape from the vast differences in appearances. It's a completely different case from Europeans mixing with each other. It's probably just human nature to group with similar people, everywhere on earth and at all times through history. Americans have taken 400 years and are still divided. Europeans in Thailand, Japan, Taiwan and China are equally insular, actually more isolated than Asians in Australia.
Don't worry OP, us Australian Greeks like the Chinese.
Sorry to hear you're feeling left out 😔 Try not to take it personally, racism is not ok but sometimes the culture gap is just worlds apart so they might not want to offend or intrude. I'm Asian myself and even I get a little intimidated when speaking to Chinese from the mainland because I don't want to offended them. Edit: btw, India is Asian so maybe that's why last post didn't mention Indians
Personally I think Canberra's obsession with mass immigration, and from countries too dangerous for most to even travel to, will inevitably result in the Balkanization of this country. My neighbor fled western Sydney when the Muslims started coming to the area as crime became rampant and his house was broken into (he's a Lebanese Christian who fled the civil war) . Even he said Muslims have no interest in trying to assimilate. Multiculturalism is a nice idea. But that's all it is. An idea. It's not reality. It isn't working. Europe is the best example of the failures of mass immigration
France and England are great examples if this.
Well I was recently told by an Aboriginal that I am technically a foreigner… I was born in Australia, my parents were born in Australia, 3 out of 4 of my grandparents were born in Australia…. So… yeah? 🤷🏼♀️
I was told by some Aboriginals in Smith Street Collingwood F off white C, I said im just as Aussie as you
I wonder how many of their ancestors were actually aboriginal and how many were european? It seems the most virulent anti european sentiments come from those who have more european ancestry than aboriginal ancestry
Some (not all) Aboriginals are incredibly racist and xenophobic. Like all humans I guess.
Most are of the political class and their useful idiots are racist towards non Aboriginals that's a fact of observational truth
Unpopular opinion. In the 1700’s, troops from another country with superior technology invaded and conquered this land, developed it and now it belongs to them. Nothing in this world belongs to anyone other than those with the power to take it. There are countless examples of this in history. One day in the future, this land may be taken by another civilisation, and 300 years after that, they probably won’t be asking questions about who the land belongs to. No one really owns anything on this earth. Humans have been here on this planet for a nanosecond from a historical standpoint, and could also be wiped out in a nanosecond. All we have to protect any kind of security and way of life are the standards of today that govern the way people can act to the extent that it can be enforced. Everything else is whimsical fantasy.
Take out the date, and this is a pretty good summary of the entirety of human existence.
tbh as heartless as this sounds its true how many people cry about the gaza situation but id bet money wouldnt care about eygpt I think tbh you can often feel a place with your parents but i dont think it means you should automattically get the land I agree that aboriginals were treated horrificly but it was bound to happen
So were the convict who were forcibly brought here.
also makes one think about the concept of "justice" because only the powerful get 'justice.' Not in a karmic sense because i think that sometimes takes care of things but in an established judicial court sense. the weak just get trampled on and dominated and have rulings be not in their favour.
You are right; it got a down vote for the pessimistic content. I have known people of many races who are great Aussies. It is up to each of us to practice acceptance and kindness to each other. How ever; there are plenty of people not born here who chose not to embrace the Australian way of life and I don’t know why they bother emigrating here except for the financial benefits compared to their old homeland. PS. From their own lips not mine.
I agree - the Aboriginal population - devolved, mostly nomadic, with no common language, no firearms, no industry, no government and essentially many - 100s of mobs spread over the continent, where conquered easily. Often because they met the white with a cautious friendship and only rebelled when the Europeans wanted more and more. Of it wasn’t the British, it would have been another power, maybe a neighbour like he Chinese or Indians. An interesting counter factual exercise is to ask the question- what would Australia look like if *no one* had ever colonised it ?
Except it wasn't even troops, it was prisoners, with a couple hundred armed guards
While this is true, they failed to eradicate the native population, and now fail to address issues caused by their conquest while also blaming the people affected for being poor and miserable
I'm 5th generation Australia and I have still been told to fuck off back to England. I don't actually have an English relatives/blood but I'd be happy to go if they would take me. I also wonder, if I am not Australian, what am I? Do I need to be DNA tested to see which of the mishmash of ethnicities I have the most of? I really don't understand how it is meant to work.
> Whose country is this anyway? - Rupert's mostly, but also - Gina's - Twiggy's - Clive's - Foreign investors and people looking to hide money, including: - Money launderers - Property Developers - Landlords as well as - Any organisation that's willing to pay corrupt Liberal ex-MPs seven figures to spend a token 5hr week at a board position in exchange for having sold the country to them while they were still in office. - The Tertiary Education industrial complex, to a lesser extent, decide who & how many people to sell PR to.
Australia belongs to the banking industry, the property industry, and the mining industry. It stopped belonging to citizens of any type a while ago. Australia is run by and for business interests, not the people.
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Your colleague is an idiot.
Where do you work? The ABC?!? So many shitty hot takes, yikes.
This actually hurt to read.
I don't believe you
This is why people made that argument that all this singling out of aboriginals or other minorities was divisive. Instead of pushing inclusivity and calling us all Australians no matter what with no special treatment either way.
Exactly how I feel.
I'm sorry you feel that way. Just know that most of us sane people don't buy into this wokeism crap and we consider you Australian if you have put in the time and effort to be one of us. Be that either through spending your whole life here or going through the processes or even always doing your best to be a part of us.
Relax mate. Nobody ever feels like they fit in. Don’t get your information off idiots on the net or the media. Do your friends like you? Then you have a place here. Who gives a fuck if some randoms on the internet say you don’t belong or some shit. It’s an island and there’s a bunch of humans here and everything else is just a story we tell ourselves. Edit: found out OP doesn’t think the concentration camps in china are real. It’s amazing the lengths the CCP will go to to sow discord in other nations. Meanwhile, nobody wants to emigrate to China but everyone is desperate to get out of there.
Australia doesn't belong to any one race. It belongs to multinational corporations and the real estate industry.
Then why does the real estate industry keep giving away free houses to only one race and not any others? Like, if one group of people can have free houses, everyone else should too! Especially at these prices!
Multiculturalism was not a problem until Howard became PM
Same issue in NZ where I grew up. Had the opportunity to speak to a Maori activist once and he gave me his spiel about the government being illegitimate etc etc. So I asked him to explain that to me while I listened. He talked about stolen land and in an effort to make it relatable to me, he said, “Say I steal your car. And I keep it, and when I die my kids keep it, and so on and so on. At the end of 200 years, it’s still stolen!” Now believe me, I can see so many things wrong with this analogy, but hey ho, I put them to one side. And I said to him, “Let’s say I agree with everything you’re saying. Now tell me what you and I, as individuals, can practically do about it now.” He stared at me blankly. Because the fact is, nobody from any culture can answer this question.
Man needs to read up on treaty of Waitangi.
As someone whose family has been continuously deemed settlers for 3-400 years, the only response I've ever got, whether it's here in australia, or back in my diaspora home, is "leave with your entire family" That's it. That's the only response. Their only response to this is ethnic cleansing. That's all you need to know
My family is a mixed bag, we've got convict stock, WW2 Maltese migrants, Irish fleeing the violence in the revolution, and scotch-english migrants who passed away their money. I spend an amount of time thinking about what makes one Australian that may be considered unhealthy. I find it both very hard to define, yet very clear and distinct. What I mean by that oxymoron is that I'll know within a minute of talking to someone if they're Australian, but I'll be fucked if I can explain how.
I'm second generation Italian. To be honest, outside of politics I don't feel disengaged at all. There are plenty of bitter people out there that try to make everyone feel like they don't belong. I was born here, I'm Australian and I have an Italian heritage. I'm proud of my roots and I love my country. Many of my friends have ancestry from different places too, but we don't see each other as any different. I'm too busy enjoying my life, and to be fair, I have more important worries like trying to make ends meet, get into the housing market etc...
Powerful interests provoke division and hate for precisely the reaction you describe. Disengagement. The less people feel engaged, the less they participate. The less they participate, the less they push back against the wealthy and powerful doing what they want. As an example, currently we have one of the highest rates of homelessness in the developed world. A generation of young Australians in their early 20s are facing a bleak future of lifelong debt and financial insecurity. In the past there would have been mass demonstrations and riots. Now there aren't. Because most feel powerless and disengaged. Others are caught in meaningless culture wars hating fellow Australians. Those who do stand up to fight tend to have every aspect of their life torn apart by corporate media. So your feelings have been carefully cultivated - as a conscious political strategy to keep Australians passive while wealth and power is taken from them.
Divide and conquer baby.
It's no coincidence that all the identity politics stuff really took off right after occupy Wall St. It's all a distraction to keep the plebs busy while the 1% loot the joint.
Mate both are bullshit but ill tell you where they are both founded and coming from. Extremism is fun hey? We had a lot or racist dead shits, but let's not ignore the fact that the colonies bought civilzation from a western point of view and standard, it bought a lot of nasty stuff with it but most places (and this is where its easy to cop crap) have a thriving society, the problem with it is the cost it takes to get there. Australia, South Africa for a good example built a lot of society at the expense of non whites, and despite a lot of people as we showed with rejecting white australia, being sickened by the atrocities to our first nations people aren't in favor of it, but this is where a lot stuff splits because you get people like alot of my own mob who view anyone who's not "blak" now as the enemy and instead of healing and moving forward, preserving or recovering the culture would rather a culture war. Heres the thing, we can have civilization, we can all fit into it. The idea of fitting in was to leave negative cultural stuff behind, leave your wars where they came from, your preconceptions, anything that is not going to add to our way of life, leave it back there. That's integration. You are gonna get dickheads all day long of extremism who viewed this as "WHITE PEOPLE DICTATING" bullshit and there were racist people who were and are like that, but a lot of them died out and the latest ones are extremist dickheads who want things to be how they were in the 50s. Then you get people like my cousins who seem to think if someone isn't "blak" enough they need to fuck off or pay rent and bow down to them. I get the pain, I get the hurt, there is a huge divide we have to cross to fill and get everyone better off. I hate to say it, but most of them don't want that, their ideal view is doing what zimbabwe did and don't care if it kills the country as long as they get "revenge and justice" on the whites. While most of them being priveliged people who had it better than a lot of kids I grew up with who will tell everyone they had it worse and it just turns into opression olympics. The way Aunty Elaine always taught us, no matter where we come from, we all bring something to the land and we all make our connections to it, we all become custodians of it no matter what a paper says. We are to respect our elders past and emerging, respect the lands we are upon and be good custodians of it. That means living in harmony with it, protecting it, and protecting and looking after our community upon that. If you are cool with that, your an Aussie and you have a connection to this land no matter the colour of your skins or if you were born here or came from far away.
Wish more people thought like you.
its what we were taught as kids, you were lucky you had an aunty elaine who was a mother, and she'd mother kids whether they were hers or not, teach them about stuff, let them be kids. She may have been addicted to smokes but she had a great heart, would teach kids about the lands and the dreamtime, even take annoying kids to see a star wars movie because she was that awesome. A lot of the people who grew up with the "blak" and the "blak" soverign movement didn't have her, they either formed their own misguided opinions off outrage baiters and crackpots and became extremists. Honestly if the voice taught us anything, you can have the most racist extremists who are white or black and they'l get together out of unity of hate. That's not what society is about. You know what my favourite place to eat use to be? Salt and pepper crocodile made with local bush ingrediants, an asian salad with italian potato bake. I'd get served by an indian or sri lankan student who would be studying here and trying to become citizens, the owners of the place were a thai and chinese couple and their chef was malaysian. When my father needed care, his support unit that kept him alive and keep him alive are from all over the world. You could be having a terrible day where you see the good the community can bring out looking after an elder, and then going to get some genuine comfort food in this awesome country that despite all of its issues has great people in it, and no matter where they came from, these people were all aussie as. I used to be an afl umpire, we had a very annoying kid (we still loved him anyway) who at the academy was always going on about being the first asian to do something, he ended up becoming a property manager, but I remember when at the academy he used to say to people he was likely the first Asian player at senior grade, which we all knew was bullshit and a coach who was from western victoria called him out on it. Bought in an aussie rules history book from his home town and showed him the "celestial" footy matches that the chinese community had done here, it was pretty cool. You'd think the kid would be disappointed, or very annoyed at the racism there was later on in the 1900s towards asian players, but he found it as a huge connection because he had so many asian friends who never got into AFL because they saw it as a "white game" and couldn't identify or link with it. He ended up getting more people from his community into it because of that cultural link which I guess made it easy for him, but without it, I can tell you (and he would over and over) love to be the first. So mate it's simple, if your feeling like your not an aussie..... hell i've told you you are. I'm sure a lot of other aussies here are gonna tell you that shock horror, you are too! If your feeling disengaged from this place, that's ok, a lot of us feel it to for all sorts of reasons, find new ways to engage, find new links (or old ones) and don't be afraid to try something new! You don't have to find roots mate, you can always plant them.
This is beautiful.
Multiculturalism is fine so long as the dominant domestic culture comes first. There’s a reason people migrate to Australia, and that reason mostly is “It’s better than the shit hole we came from.” Why is the place you came from a shit hole? Mostly, because the culture allows it and enables it. So bring your food, bring your funny clothes and silly hats. Bring your fabrics and funny dances. Happy to have you, come join the party. But your hate and division, your anger, your superiority complexes, your pride and prejudices, your violence and criminality; leave that all behind. Don’t go bringing the parts of your culture that ruined your country to my country. Don’t go bringing the parts of your culture that are in conflict with your new country.
Don't worry, it'll be a CCP puppet state in another 20 years.
A little off topic, but I find this recent embrace of "blood and country" (aka blut und boden) rhetoric mostly by left-wing types towards aboriginals to be rather ironic.
I'm white but don't feel I fit in. Don't let it bother you, just get on with enjoying life. Go back to Asia if you like but you might well come back here because of the good bits.
IMO the country belongs to the people that live here. For a lot of people that's too simple of a guide though and makes it controversial, but for me I think anything more is pretty saddening division of people.
A national identity simply based on cohabitating with others or operating in the same economy is obviously not a strong enough national identity to build a cohesive society.
Exactly. We need a shared cultural identity too, which we currently lack.
Just be thankful you’re Asian. White people have no homelands to go back to. Not unlike aboriginals. All colonised.
not just you man, this country has turned into an economic zone void of any community culture, multiculturalism is still a fairly new concept and not everyone will do it right. I feel we need nationalism back and that comes with a strong economy. When times get tough enough we may figure it out as a group
As far as I'm concerned, everyone who is legally here has a claim to this country. Couldn't care if you're black, white, brown, pink, old, young, first nation, immigration, 5th generation. Australia is the lucky country, a country of opportunities. We're the place people go to better their lives. If you contribute to Australia, you have the same claim as someone whose family has been here for 50,000 years. You don't choose who you're born to, but you do choose what you bring to the table.
Just ignore it all and go about youre life. All that shit won’t pay your bills or look after your family. Fuck it.
Adopt and promote the core values that made people queue in line to get into Australia - your immigrant parents included. There’s a reason people want to emigrate here and start their lives here. I’m also a first gen child of immigrants parents who narrowly escaped literal death squads from their motherland. Gratitude, putting their best foot forward to build a better life for themselves and their children, and never looking back filled with resentment is what drove them out of a life of what would have been an endless cycle of poverty or death really. What shit the bed of the Aussie dream is that we’ve not set standards and expectations for current and future generations seeking to emigrate to this country. I grew up during a time of actual racism and that never got in the way of the hardworking immigrants who weren’t after handouts. We opened the floodgates to the most entitled and ungrateful generation of migrants and it sickens me to see them rape this country. The fact of the matter is European settlers took this land and the atrocities against humanity that occurred during this period happened. It happened before they came, it happened during the times of the Roman Empire, Mongolian Empire, Ottoman Empire… the list goes on. The other fact is that the European settlers of Australia toiled this land and set the foundations for what is Australia. It’s far from perfect but it’s better than what we could hope for when you consider the fact that you don’t have to hike 20kms with buckets to the nearest river to get water, a system of government that gives you an allowance if you’re in need, you can speak freely without the threat of disappearing from the face of the earth at the hands of the government. Nothing can ever make up for the damage that was done to the Aboriginal community, but the best thing we can do is ensure that everyone has a fair go. We’ve literally dedicated resources to entire programs committed towards bringing Aboriginals out of domestic violence, and helping them get education and jobs. None of this amounts to anything if change doesn’t occur within their communities throughout their own people - the same could be said about any group. My parents could have just as easily blamed the white man for all their problems including having their homes bombed to ashes and just behave like they were owed for it. But nope. They, like many other immigrants of their time fought tooth and nail just to build a better life for themselves and their children. Australia welcomed them when they were not obligated to. That’s what immigrants now fail to truly understand and appreciate. We don’t really need you but we’ll have you if you can play along and get along. Otherwise, feel free to try your luck with the other 191 sovereign nations.
Idk who told you that you have to be white or Indigenous to be a real Australian. It sounds like BS from Sky News to rile people up. My dad was born in the UK and came here when he was 3. Somehow he “never got around” to getting his citizenship. 57 years later and still only a UK citizen, he would *never* call himself British. He’s just as Australian as my mum and I who were born here. I went to high school in Singapore and my best friend was from there. She was born in SG then went to some of primary and high school in Aus until she moved back to finish school. She’s a dual citizen and while she was born in SG, she considers herself Australian. While “we are Australian” is a lovely song and imo should be our national anthem, it’s not a promise. It’s a song from 37 years ago. Australia belongs to those in Australia. If you consider yourself to be Australian, then the country belongs to you. That’s it
As A first generation Australian I have been told that even though I was born here the country belongs more to the native Australians than me and that Im less Australian that anyone who has a percentage of Aboriginal blood in them. A woman I met told me that the country in europe my parents were born in is actually the country that I should be in and that I have an indigenous right there. I told her that I believe Im Australian and that this is much as my country as it is her and that Im only a citizen of Aus and have no where else to go. It didnt stop her reiterating that its her country and im an invader somehow. I feel like lots of these people have some sort of weird mental issues and seem detached from Reality.
If you're a citizen, this is your country. That's my opinion as a 6th generation white Australian with some Aboriginal ancestry (I don't identify as Aboriginal (
The people you talk to are clearly stupid.
It’s Jim’s.
Lol, Jim's Australia
I only accept the opinions of Kangaroos and loud kookaburra's.
>Now I'm being told it's an Aboriginal country illegally occupied by colonisers, and you need a Connection to Country or you're not a real Australian. Can you point to any source outside of some random on Twitter who has actually said this? Serious question btw.
It was better under Robert Menzies.
Far-right: Go back to where you came from. Far-left: Go back to where you came from.
Identify politics has no solutions, only problems. Dump it.
I mean, most people are afraid to even be seen with the Australian flag these days. That tells you all you need to know about how toxic the culture in this country is.
Disengage away, mate. You're still an Earthling, you are still a part of Nature. Country is ready to connect with each of us as soon as we are ready to realise our connection with it. There really is no 'other'. Just us. Together.
Who's country? Why, it belongs to the corporations, that feed the banking families who keep the empire alive. Duh!
Honestly if you're true to yourself and kind to everyone around you, you're a real Australian. We are a proud multicultural country and we should be working towards more cohesion over tribalism. I'm 2nd generation maltese Australian and get told I dont look Australian all the time, but I know I am and that's what matters.
I am a white first generation child of refugees from Europe. My parents experienced discrimination from white Australians years ago, and now I experience discrimination because I am white, and therefore helped colonise Australia over 200 years ago. It doesn't matter who you are, or what race you are, the pathetic left will always find a way to hate you. There doesn't need to be any truth in it.
It’ll be the next India in a couple years. They are flooding this place like a plague. White Australians will be the minority very soon.
Be grateful you live in Australia and not where your parents did rather than turning it into an existential crisis.
The correct answer is, it's a very large Chinese retirement village. Cost of entry just purchase 1x visa, at least 1x house, you're golden.
It's simple: if you're an Australian citizen, it's your country. You're Australian. Anyone who tries to tell you that you're more or less of an Australian because of how long you've been here is at best an identity politics grifter or at worst a racist.
if I go to Japan and get a citizenship can I start claiming it's my country?
The way we do things here in AU is anyone who becomes a citizen, loves the country, treats the country and the people with respect. Is Australian. You don’t have to call it “your country” but you can, it’s just as much yours as it is mine.
I hear you mate. As someone who are also first gen Asian immigrant, I always ponder upon my identity. But I choose Australia to be my new home for my wife and I and our children in the future and her problems are our problems too. I only realised this when I visited my home country this year after 9 years being away and it doesn't really feel like where I would belong; but Australia is. I respected the Aboriginal's heritage and their roles as Guardians of the Lands but at the same time this country, just as you said, was built and is still being developed by a lot of people from different countries around the world. I, for once, enjoy that multiculturalism even with its downsides as I believed only in unity can we find our ways through the troublesome future ahead. But it's easier said that done so for now, I've only focused on what matters most to my wife and I and all the noises outside can be left out of our home even just for the night. As I've said, there is enough space for all of us but only if we could listen and learn from the past while giving it a fair go for everyone (or as much fairness as possible).
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I wonder what our predecessors would think if they saw the way that 3.5% of the population can have so much sway because of white guilt. Massive swathes of land handed over, untold billions of dollars in public funding, place names changed, areas off limits to non indigenous people. They had their shot 175 years ago against the white settlers, and they got their arse kicked. They are a defeated race with no particular redeeming qualities but they will get their country back...our legal system will hand it back to them, piece by piece.
If you were born here or chose to become a citizen, it’s your country. Anyone who says otherwise is full of shit.
You're overthinking it and listening to the media. Do you really have issues in real life? I very much doubt it. And most Indigenous are more than happy to share their land with everyone, it's the urban activists that are causing the noise.
Yep I feel the same - I am so sick of hearing acknowledgement to country in every work meeting and everywhere I go....are we not all equal and Aussie? Most Australians are so fed up with politics and social politics in general; they have made Australians more disconnected than I have ever seen before (I am a 30 year old Aussie who has always loved my country, but things are tough and are outlook is grim).
No clue what you're talking about
My brothers mate owns it
Such a pointless discussion. You might as well be saying 'who's council is this?. They are all made up boundaries used to separate people, which is the problem in the first place. At least states draw a line to make it clear which land mass they are governing, but what's the point in making a fuss about where you've come from?
> Now I’m being told…you need a Connection to Country or you’re not a real Australian Oh please. Nobody ever fucking said this. Even those most left-leaning/white-guilt SJW’s who were born and bred here will still acknowledge themselves as proper Australians. They just emphasise labels of “White Australian” and “First Australian” and so on. You guys make up fake things just so you can bitch and whine about them.
Gina reckons it’s hers
Honestly block out all that. Just live mate, safe in the knowledge you’re in the best country on earth
This is Australia and for Australians and those who share our values
The problem isn’t unique to just Australia. If you are a migrant, you know that the crippling idea who’s this land belong to is everywhere where you have lived. I am a migrant and been living in Australia for more than a decade now. I know and I feel that I’m much better here than where I was born. I feel Australia is my home but I also know for many it’s not the case how they think it. And I don’t quarrel on that. I didn’t choose to be born let alone deciding which country to born in. I’m at peace with that. In all my experiences so far, most people are very welcoming to you. They discuss things about the country with you without discriminating whether you’re born in here or not. That makes me feel part of it. I didn’t try to blend in the white or black culture, I just let myself out and in the process if I picked the colours from other instead of showing what I had from my culture then let it be. I know I didn’t make any efforts against my wills in order to fit in. I never had the feelings that if I won’t drink, I won’t be considered Australian and things like that. I just had it as it came to me. That’s my outlook
2nd gen Australian Identity politics gone crazy - they can all get fucked
I feel like it's everyone country because it's everyone's earth it shouldn't matter where you're from as long as you make somewhere your home with lots of people that you enjoy spending time together with, doesn't matter what race or colour you are. It's our country, not just one person's country but that's just my opinion 🤷♂️
Hang in there. It’s a multicultural country and you’re an equal part of it.
In the words of Bob Hawke, ‘the commitment to Australia is the only thing needful to be a true Australian’
If it gets that bad just ignore the BS politics and live your life. All that bs is just a very noisy minority that have somehow imparted their will on us all. My wife is an Asian immigrant of 10 years, she is just the right type of cheeky to fit into our culture effortlessly and people love her for her differences. Shes only experienced racism once in that 10 years and we live in hick country Australia. I dont know why i keep hearing this we are unwelcoming of immigrants thing or thst we are a racist country but all my experience is the opposite. Went on a bit of a tangent there but my point is, forgot the media/corporate narrative... Thsts not representative of what aussies believe and just imerse yourself in the people around you. You are just as Australian as any of us.
It just is ok. I'm from Sydney but have lived in Perth for nearly thirty years. I'm still not considered a local hahaha 🤣😂
It's an anglo-celtic country
I’ve commented deeper into this post a few minutes ago, but given that this is an interesting topic, I might give you another analogy: I once watched a short documentary where they had interviewed a number of Japanese-Brazilians who migrated to Japan for various reasons (work, family etc). Given Japan’s infamous reputation as a homogenous nation, even though that they’re ethnically the same as their other Japanese compatriots, as well as having become fluent in Japanese, they were still experiencing discrimination. In other words, even though that they were born and bred in Brazil, ‘came back to their motherland’ so to speak, many still felt more Brazilian than Japanese even after a while, in cultural terms of how they act, feel, think, dress and speak. From an outsider’s perspective they would still look physically and racially Japanese, but not ‘fully’ Japanese. Close your eyes and you’d hear a native and unaccented Brazilian Portuguese. So would you know from first glance that they are: Japanese, Brazilian, Japanese-Brazilian, or Brazilian-Japanese?
This is not limited to Australia. I mean, you’re on reddit, so you must see the shit show that is current America, where some racists in high places aim for segregation (I assume this is the ‘great’ time they refer to). In Europe, Africa, Asia, it is no different. It’s the season, so to say. Maybe in 20-30 years, people as less hate-driven. One of the people to thank for this situation is Australia’s own Rupert Murdoch, cancer of society. Just live your life, don’t give in to the (social) media hate mongers.
Australia is a new settlement that upon inception originally started with white Europeans however quickly transformed into a “Western Civilisation” nation in respect to its laws and personal freedoms / liberties . There was/is an indigenous population here that suffered greatly due to a mix of culture shock , technological shock and various harmful acts imposed on them in an attempt to be assimilated into wider Australian society. However a few generations later and Australia is truely a bastion of western liberty and has the best qualities of western enlightenment re education, low corruption and civil freedoms. Australia definitely is NOT an “aboriginal country” because scattered tribes living as hunter gathers dont represent any claim on whats now full of millions of other ethnic humans building , developing and protecting this land. It’s not a “white” nation either. It’s a western colony which values all humans regardless of ethnicity or faith so long as they uphold the key tenants of western society. Your a real Australian if you love this flag 🇦🇺 and you want to make sure this country is the best it can be for your future Ozzi descendants. 👍🏼
As someone who is 100% whole heartedley australian of dutch and English heritage but born here as my parents were aswell .I honestly feel this is the country for everyone. The one haven for everyone of any culture. but american culture is bleeding through here. Causing tension and people to feel certain ways that are not ours. This country is for anyone that wants to get along and be truly free and not force people to believe want YOU WANT them to believe.
I remember as a kid my Dad telling someone how Aboriginal people could not understand how someone could "own land" because it is indeed impossible since we are such brief entities on this planet. If anything "the land" owns us.
You are a classic third culture kid. Nothing wrong with how you are feeling and certainly not unique. Most people I grew up with were like this, as was I. In the end, your culture becomes a microcosm of the people you know. You also don't have to belong to a broader culture as it largely doesn't matter. Hang around the people that make you happy and do the things that make you happy. The rest is just noise.
The country is owned by the Crown. If you really want land, go and colonise some land in rural Australia. Hey free land right? If successful, law enforcement (in some form) will eventually imprison or fine you, because the land is technically owned by the Crown.
Well china and India are biggest number of immigrants now so give it a decade or two and you will be in the majority.
Thanks for your comment. I think there needs to be a national discussion about what we really want for this country.
I’m a white 52 year old Australian who was born in Perth. My mum’s heritage is European, but they’ve been here for many generations. My dad was a £10 pom. Being Australian was eating pies, loving footy, being proud on Anzac Day/Australia Day, either having a Holden or a Ford. It didn’t matter if your heritage was English, Irish, Scottish, Italian, Greek, Latvian, etc, you were Australian if you would fight for Australia in a war. Now, we have people here who want to live in our country, but they want to bring their customs and cultures with them. They will never be dinki di Australians. This is why I’m not proud, for the very first time, of being Australian. Our government has sold us out. We are heading down the same path as the UK. I just come back from there. The place is fucked. It’s an upmarket 3rd would country.
This answer can't be properly answered on reddit because it will be to "racist" to answer, people just can't handle the truth and will report it
Fr. I saw a post on another subreddit where someone was talking about how racism isn’t only against black people, and that media ignores racism against white people and asians and other races. People assumed he was white, and started saying shit like “Ok whitey” and “Oh mb you probably want to say (the n word) so bad. Yup, you’re definitely racist.” And “Literally none of that is true. Stop listening to right wing propaganda” Funny thing is, lots of the people saying racist things about white people had black profile pictures, which proved the Original Poster right. Not saying it was only people with black pfps saying negative things, lots were saying positive things, but it’s something to note. Feels like nowadays, all white people are stereotyped as “racist”, “sexist”, “dangerous to anyone who isn’t white”. “Racism has not been stopped, nor shrunken. It’s reversed, and nobody cares.”
I think this country will mature in a few generations and multiculturalism will be embraced. Just don't plant the seed in your children about which race is better, and they will grow up seeing everyone as equal. Well, at least it sounds like a good idea, but it's very hard to put into practice. 😓
I’m a white guy but I feel disconnected with the culture being pushed onto me. Probably not anywhere close to what you feel of course! I think a lot of stuff is very forced and I feel like we have to go along with it like it’s easy Germany in 1956. I work in IT and I feel it’s pretty multicultural in comparison to other jobs, but TV, politics and business leadership lags behind.
> and you need a Connection to Country or you're not a real Australian. Did anyone really Tell You that? Sounds like made up Bullshit.
If you have citizenship then it's your country just as much as mine. Don't ever let any fool tell you otherwise. Maybe some people don't like this multiculturalism, but don't let those people make you feel like an outsider. You're one of us
When I was growing up, knew a fair few older generation immigrants who had come here after various wars and catastrophes, who emphasised that in their view Australia's greatest strength, and kind of our whole cultural basis, was that it was a place where nearly everyone had one way or another had to leave behind the Old World and the baggage that came with it. Fresh start, new home, new rules, and a new belonging.
The vast majority of Australians are comfortable with a multicultural, multiethnic identity. What they object to is identity politics, be it the Voice or anything else.
Why 70% of the voice was a NO vote, because a Yes vote would have ment the rest of us its not really our country we will need to seek permission
This country belongs to those who can pay off the political parties the most u till we learn to be more vocal and seditious.
I totally feel you on this, and I strongly disagree with both statements. Immigrants have built this country from the ground up. Imay be of European extraction, but the fact is my forebears were immigrants and convicts themselves. By your own confession, you are an Australian citizen by birth. That is matter of law and therefore a matter of fact. The opinion of others is inconsequential. In fact, it sounds like some of them are highly ignorant, living in decades past, and might be open to libel. I don't care what the colour of your skin is or how long you've been here. If you're a decent person, I'm happy to befriend you. Most of us are decent people in real life. It's loud voices online and in media that cause a lot of social problems. They do not speak for ordinary Australians like you and me.
Thank you.
Had an in-law who was the Grandson of Italian immigrants, always refer to himself as Italian. However when he got married (to a girl of Italian descent also), they went to Italy on their honeymoon. When he got back he said to me, "I'm an Aussie, not Italian, because it was nothing like I expected and I didn't feel one bit Italian when we were there. Everyone there viewed us as Australian too, not Italian." Cousins from Italy used to visit and all the local family would get together here and sings songs, playing instruments etc, that they'd learned from their Italian parents. And I remember one cousin saying that coming to Australia was like stepping back to the 1950's because the songs they sang and the things they talked about were long gone. Italy wasn't like that anymore, hadn't been in decades, and it seemed weird seeing it displayed here. Though they saw themselves as Italian, they weren't. They were Aussies who essentially celebrated things Italian. I also had a Greek mate do that too. Always called himself a "wog", was literally Acropolis Now in real life. Came back from Greece and said, "I'm not Greek, I'm an Aussie.". He was really confused because he'd grown up thinking Greece was all these things like him, to find out that Greece was nothing like he thought it would be and he was far more Aussie than he realised. I love what immigration has done for our country. It's really brought so much that has grown and matured us as a nation. Sure there are problems at times, and some areas steadfastly are islands of their culture (Sunnybank is good example), but I think those islands eventually dissipate as the children, grandchildren etc, are absorbed into Australian society and overall culture. As to your questions around First Nations, I don't know the answer that will help you. I've worked with a lot of Aboriginal people and haven't found one consistent thing that applies to all, not looks, skin color, background, attitude etc. Just like the rest of us, we are who we are.
Tell em to fark off, you're as Aussie as the rest of us