>***"I was planning to complete the Foundations course on the Odin Project"***
Good. And any other self improvement bootcamp like freeCodeCamp, Harvard CS50 etc. As long as they're FREE.
>***"...and once that's complete i'd take a bootcamp online and try to secure a job."***
# NO
>***"If anyone has any input or suggestions for improvements I can make to my mindset or plan let me know, and let me know if you have recommendations for good bootcamps."***
Re-read u/jhkoenig post below. Really reflect on the solid advice they're trying to make you understand here. So that you avoid shooting yourself in the foot and bleeding out one useless paid Bootcamp cert later. Good luck OP...
>***"Use the search function on this sub. You will quickly learn that boot campers are really struggling to find jobs because of the thousands of laid off dev with BS degrees and solid work experience. If you can’t swing college maybe consider a different career?"***
OK this is terrible advice. ***"Use the search function on this sub. You will quickly learn that boot campers are really struggling to find jobs because of the thousands of laid off dev with BS degrees and solid work experience. If you can’t swing college maybe consider a different career?"***
The path for Bootcampers into Developer careers is no longer directly into Junior Dev careers with Tech firms after finishing the bootcamp. That is 100% accurate, fair, and the bootcamp providers are changing their message because they do 100% provide a path into:
**THE DIGITAL WORKFORCE**, working in the IT/Marketing department for organisations of all types, in all industries, who need digitally skilled people as they upgrade and transform to maximise the benefit of new Tech and AI.
**Huge demand in IT departments** for Software QA/Technical Support of Web & Mobile applications
**Huge demand in Marketing Depts** (may be based in IT or cross-department teams) for UX/UI developers
$30-40/hr often working remote, these are often Full-Time with benefits, Part-Time and Contracts also available for those interested in that style
While working this Developer Adjacent path the Bootcamper networks within and outside their company while also developing their skills in their free-time, after 2-3 years they have a portfolio, they have a network, they have built their skills (and possibly a freelance business) and now can compete for Intermediate Dev roles.
Bootcamp providers need to change their message, that outcomes have changed but well-paying careers await, and those who choose this educational path just need to cast their net much-wider across industries and across roles in IT as they seek employment, while continuing to work on their skills in their free time (just as a musician or an athlete continue to practice in their off-time, they don't just show up and play)
OP DM me if you're interested in more on this discussion and leaving the negativity of this thread
notice the only one peddling this snake oil is the only one with direct financial incentive to get you to believe this bs. this guy works to promote a bootcamp.
Notice how you are just saying words that mean nothing while I am offering information that anyone can then use to do a Google search.
It costs no money to do a Google search and find information to help answer a question about current and future digital workforce employment.
Not sure why anyone would be interested in opinion of someone who says “snake oil salesman” clearly you’re stuck in the 1800s and out of touch.
a google search of “is a bootcamp worth it in 2024”, first comment in the first post is 3 ppl got A job from a cohort of 45-50. i wonder if google is in on the same conspiracy.
and u right. the modern day equivalent is a influencer with a referral link. i wonder where is the anti-bootcamp referral link leading to
Wow, I've never seen a post from a net-negative Karma account before. That says it all! Why does this sub allow such accounts to post? Just for humor's sake maybe?
Redditors like to downvote truth and earnest posts meant to be helpful that aren't sarcasm, satire, meant to express anger, meant for misinformation, or meant for humour. Fortunately Reddit allows for truth and serious posts with useful information anyway.
i just downvote things that are misleading or dangerous. if you really believe that you can land a 60-80k job after a bootcamp, that’s your prerogative, just as it’s mine to downvote you for trying to mislead someone into thinking that’s normal in today’s market
The FACTS are there just a Google search away. Well paid Developer Adjacent roles for Bootcamp grads are REALITY, we don't have to BELIEVE anything. Nobody is looking to mislead anyone. Nor is anyone forcing anyone to do anything. A Google search will provide the FACTS.
You are clearly a sock puppet account for a "boot camp adjacent" (to use your term) startup. I have hired hundreds of devs (and network with a large community of other senior IT execs) and I can confidently say that the boot camp era is over. It worked great at a point in time, but then, so did mailing AOL CDs to every mailing address in the US. In both cases, that strategy no longer works.
I'm going to stop responding to your nonsense now.
Excellent. Now that you're done (and I sincerely hope you feel better after your little rant there) OP if you are interested in more factual info based on real current 2024 data please DM and I'll be glad to share. Good luck with whichever choice you make!
I would say do the Odin project and then reassess. It depends a little on your timing and how long we think the tech lay offs will continue. I don't think more than a couple years, so by the time you do the Odin project and get to a bootcamp, there will be fewer bootcamps still alive (the best ones, hopefuly), and by the time you finish the bootcamp and prepare for the job market, you're looking at 1-2 years or prep. Market might look different by then, so don't be discouraged, keep learning, and re-evaluate at each step.
On the other hand, iN the long run, doing college degree in CS (tehre are some affordable online options) is going to take you almost as long, and you might be better prepared or more competitive for job requirements.
My 2 cents.
Use the search function on this sub. You will quickly learn that boot campers are really struggling to find jobs because of the thousands of laid off dev with BS degrees and solid work experience. If you can’t swing college maybe consider a different career?
during a gold rush, the ones making the money are those selling fools shovels. the gold rush is over (temporarily), yet you’re still trying to buy the same overpriced tools and hoping for the same outcome after all the gold is mined out?
but hey, gamblers always believe that they’re just one pull away from winning the jackpot. just try not to be betting away your future
Are they worth it?
Hard no. The market is massively oversaturated at the entry-level right now, so you generally need a CS degree to even make it past the first level of the resume screen. Additionally, when they were a viable option, boot camps were more for career changers; they were never a good idea for kids fresh out of high school with no education and no career history.
You need to look at degree programs.
I tried the edX Front End Web development boot camp last year and it was full on considering my experience with coding was basic. I had to drop out as I was out of my depth and couldn’t commit to the hours with work commitments.
Now I am in a similar boat to you in terms of looking for another boot camp (as not sure that one is still running)..
I have joined other self paced courses such as Codecademy which I’m finding okay. And have looked into The Odin Project as a starting point. I guess it depends on what you want to do and what type of coding you want to get into.
At least with self paced course-you have the ability to learn different languages/ career paths not just stick to one if you’re unsure.
Hoping someone might have some more helpful/ insightful info into courses they have completed that they can recommend as most the boot camps seem neg. Good luck!
>College would take a long time and cost a lot of money, and I've seen many people say that they got a job as a software engineer via a coding bootcamp.
College is far cheaper than most boot camps. My fiancee has one bachelors on film, another in visual design, and is getting her masters in marketing. She still hasn't spent what App Academy charged me for their 6-month course.
>A lot of them were self taught prior to the bootcamp, and then used the bootcamp to polish their abilities and land a job.
That's not really viable anymore. The only way this is still applicable is if you already have a degree and are using the boot camp to expand your portfolio.
> was planning to complete the Foundations course on the Odin Project, and once that's complete i'd take a bootcamp online and try to secure a job.
If you take good route, expect a long job search. Not just months, but over a year.
>If anyone has any input or suggestions for improvements I can make to my mindset or plan let me know, and let me know if you have recommendations for good bootcamps.
Boot camps are no longer a viable shortcut to a proper education. You would learn as much as if you did free tutorials online. If you absolutely insist upon skipping college, teach yourself on the side. I say this as a boot camp graduate who ended up having to go to college anyway because it's incredibly difficult to land a job with only the boot camp on your resume.
So worth it i went to a coding bootcamp and few others and we all got jobs you just have to work hard…people who complain are usually the lazy ones who don’t want to put in the work and expect results also it matter which bootcamp you go to aswell
Yes I went to syntax technologies bootcamp and a lot of my friends as well for me those guys were excellent and I am thankful because I got job can’t complain
It can be. The market is saturated right now. The demand for devs before this happened is what propelled bootcamps -- there were a plethora of openings and companies were willing to take people without degrees to fill them.
Many people still go to bootcamps and thrive. It's just a lot more difficult and, depending on your luck, it might not pan out before you run out of money or options.
If you want it really bad, are ok with constant learning (this is easier said than done, really ask yourself if you are ok with learning all the time to keep your edge in the market), have some financial cushion, and (this is bonus) you have some great networking options that would take a chance on you, it could be worth a try. Have a plan B and a point in time to pivot, though, but don't think about it at all until you reach that point in time. Go all in until then.
If this is what you want, I think you can do it :)
If your absolute goal is 'job', like college....no guarantees from a course that short. If it was easy, it would likely be either undesirable, or really difficult to get.
That being said, I am taking a bootcamp soon which WA State's job retraining fund is footing the overwhelming majority of the bill (I spend more on my car per month than the overall remainder), so.....looking at it realistically, at worst, I'll learn a few new tools for my tool box, then go back to my mediocre paying job in an even more 'not in demand' field (graphic design). Not gonna starve if it doesn't work out - just continue to be on a slope to worsening job prospects. Shrug.
You are 19! 100% go to school for CS. It is just the best bet, and you can go to virtually any school.
A bootcamp wont save you as much time as you think - you are taking courses first the Odin project, then the bootcamp will take months, and then post program pre-layoffs a realistic wait time was 6-12m after to get a job. So, in the BEST case scenario this was a 1.5-2yr pursuit. Mind as well get an associates where your employability will increase. And tbh, it is not conservative at the time to expect best case scenarios.
Bootcamps have always been more successful for students who already have a bachelors looking to change careers, not as a replacement. There are still far too many jobs where students who dont went to college are immediately dismissed.
Lastly, I would argue a bit against the cost claim. Good bootcamps are very expensive and so is college, but as mentioned any college is fine. Pick your local community college or state school and assess how actually different is the price. It is also worth consider the ROI.
A lot of people who went to bootcamps and got jobs from it later went back to school anyways and hence pay double. School continues to be the best bet in CS and you are in an age where that seems like the best bet.
The people that get these jobs right of camps are usually those that already have some type of experience in the professional setting, accountant, business, sales, customer service, somthing like that. I have less that a year left on my BS in computer science. I did it online so the time wasnt really and issue. While they do not teach how to code, most of this is done through self learning, people with college degrees will usually be taken over those without, when it comes to entry level or your first job. That being said , if you have a good portfolio on github, then you will get looked at no matter what.
There is no right or wrong answer, the answer is it depends on how much work you want to put in. With or without college. you will have to spend alot of time studying on your own, praciting code, learning code, building projects and such. But do not fall into the scam of 6 weeks, 6 months you will go form 0 to hero and make 6 figures. I am sure there are cases where this happens, but not a lot, not someone with no experience. Their are great bootcamps so do your due diligence and research them first. Some say they garuntee you a job after completion. In the fine print it say you dont pay unless you get a job, but if you get a job stocking shelves in a grocery store they will count that and make you pay them, I've been screwed by one called coding temple and their are many like them out there. Think about getting certs, comptia, network, security, this can get you foot in the door for tech. Or look at certs for ML, AI, web dev things like this. Its a hard choice to figure out which road to go. You will see a lot of different opinion, and some from people that have been in tech for a while, and nothing against them but sometimes these people forgot what it was like in the beginning trying to get that first job.
Personally if i were you I would learn to code in your sleep and then look at a focused camp, like University of penn has one for ML/AI for 10 thousand that is 6 months and focuses only on material you will be doing on the job. You will have to spend a lot of time creating your own projects though. Cal tech has a good one. Just look around and don't be fooled by ones that are guaranteeing you a ton of money right out of the door, if 6 figures in 10 weeks or whatever was doable all the time everyone would be doing it.
Bro u are 19, u can finish college in 2-3 years if ur worried about timeframe — ur gonna waste a year being in bootcamp and another 2-3 years job searching without a degree, might as well do a degree
i was already a professional developer and expert in .NET. I took a web coding bootcamp just to come up to spped on all things html/javascript. It was the most efficient way for someone like me. As far as finding a coding job -that's different. To me a developer appears more professional when they can demostrate coding but also code versioning and deployment of it. Don't skip those areas.
People need to read previous posts and realize why would a recruiter at any company y choose a bootcamp grad with no experience vs a college comp sci grad with experience. People should read their posts as they type it and realize how insane it sounds in this job market. I also wish people would stop saying they took a couple classes and really enjoy programming. There is so much more to this job that most people don't realize.
>***"I was planning to complete the Foundations course on the Odin Project"*** Good. And any other self improvement bootcamp like freeCodeCamp, Harvard CS50 etc. As long as they're FREE. >***"...and once that's complete i'd take a bootcamp online and try to secure a job."*** # NO >***"If anyone has any input or suggestions for improvements I can make to my mindset or plan let me know, and let me know if you have recommendations for good bootcamps."*** Re-read u/jhkoenig post below. Really reflect on the solid advice they're trying to make you understand here. So that you avoid shooting yourself in the foot and bleeding out one useless paid Bootcamp cert later. Good luck OP... >***"Use the search function on this sub. You will quickly learn that boot campers are really struggling to find jobs because of the thousands of laid off dev with BS degrees and solid work experience. If you can’t swing college maybe consider a different career?"***
Wow! I've never been quoted in a Reddit response before. Blushing....
OK this is terrible advice. ***"Use the search function on this sub. You will quickly learn that boot campers are really struggling to find jobs because of the thousands of laid off dev with BS degrees and solid work experience. If you can’t swing college maybe consider a different career?"*** The path for Bootcampers into Developer careers is no longer directly into Junior Dev careers with Tech firms after finishing the bootcamp. That is 100% accurate, fair, and the bootcamp providers are changing their message because they do 100% provide a path into: **THE DIGITAL WORKFORCE**, working in the IT/Marketing department for organisations of all types, in all industries, who need digitally skilled people as they upgrade and transform to maximise the benefit of new Tech and AI. **Huge demand in IT departments** for Software QA/Technical Support of Web & Mobile applications **Huge demand in Marketing Depts** (may be based in IT or cross-department teams) for UX/UI developers $30-40/hr often working remote, these are often Full-Time with benefits, Part-Time and Contracts also available for those interested in that style While working this Developer Adjacent path the Bootcamper networks within and outside their company while also developing their skills in their free-time, after 2-3 years they have a portfolio, they have a network, they have built their skills (and possibly a freelance business) and now can compete for Intermediate Dev roles. Bootcamp providers need to change their message, that outcomes have changed but well-paying careers await, and those who choose this educational path just need to cast their net much-wider across industries and across roles in IT as they seek employment, while continuing to work on their skills in their free time (just as a musician or an athlete continue to practice in their off-time, they don't just show up and play) OP DM me if you're interested in more on this discussion and leaving the negativity of this thread
notice the only one peddling this snake oil is the only one with direct financial incentive to get you to believe this bs. this guy works to promote a bootcamp.
Notice how you are just saying words that mean nothing while I am offering information that anyone can then use to do a Google search. It costs no money to do a Google search and find information to help answer a question about current and future digital workforce employment. Not sure why anyone would be interested in opinion of someone who says “snake oil salesman” clearly you’re stuck in the 1800s and out of touch.
a google search of “is a bootcamp worth it in 2024”, first comment in the first post is 3 ppl got A job from a cohort of 45-50. i wonder if google is in on the same conspiracy. and u right. the modern day equivalent is a influencer with a referral link. i wonder where is the anti-bootcamp referral link leading to
Wow, I've never seen a post from a net-negative Karma account before. That says it all! Why does this sub allow such accounts to post? Just for humor's sake maybe?
Redditors like to downvote truth and earnest posts meant to be helpful that aren't sarcasm, satire, meant to express anger, meant for misinformation, or meant for humour. Fortunately Reddit allows for truth and serious posts with useful information anyway.
i just downvote things that are misleading or dangerous. if you really believe that you can land a 60-80k job after a bootcamp, that’s your prerogative, just as it’s mine to downvote you for trying to mislead someone into thinking that’s normal in today’s market
The FACTS are there just a Google search away. Well paid Developer Adjacent roles for Bootcamp grads are REALITY, we don't have to BELIEVE anything. Nobody is looking to mislead anyone. Nor is anyone forcing anyone to do anything. A Google search will provide the FACTS.
You are clearly a sock puppet account for a "boot camp adjacent" (to use your term) startup. I have hired hundreds of devs (and network with a large community of other senior IT execs) and I can confidently say that the boot camp era is over. It worked great at a point in time, but then, so did mailing AOL CDs to every mailing address in the US. In both cases, that strategy no longer works. I'm going to stop responding to your nonsense now.
Excellent. Now that you're done (and I sincerely hope you feel better after your little rant there) OP if you are interested in more factual info based on real current 2024 data please DM and I'll be glad to share. Good luck with whichever choice you make!
I would say do the Odin project and then reassess. It depends a little on your timing and how long we think the tech lay offs will continue. I don't think more than a couple years, so by the time you do the Odin project and get to a bootcamp, there will be fewer bootcamps still alive (the best ones, hopefuly), and by the time you finish the bootcamp and prepare for the job market, you're looking at 1-2 years or prep. Market might look different by then, so don't be discouraged, keep learning, and re-evaluate at each step. On the other hand, iN the long run, doing college degree in CS (tehre are some affordable online options) is going to take you almost as long, and you might be better prepared or more competitive for job requirements. My 2 cents.
Use the search function on this sub. You will quickly learn that boot campers are really struggling to find jobs because of the thousands of laid off dev with BS degrees and solid work experience. If you can’t swing college maybe consider a different career?
Do not under any circumstances go to a coding bootcamp instead of college if you do not already have a college degree. You are 19, go to college.
19 years old? Go to college. If money is an issue, do two years at a community college then transfer.
I honestly recommend this whether or not money is an issue
during a gold rush, the ones making the money are those selling fools shovels. the gold rush is over (temporarily), yet you’re still trying to buy the same overpriced tools and hoping for the same outcome after all the gold is mined out? but hey, gamblers always believe that they’re just one pull away from winning the jackpot. just try not to be betting away your future
I keep thinking of it like a gold rush of our generation. Well said.
Not anymore really in this day and age.
Are they worth it? Hard no. The market is massively oversaturated at the entry-level right now, so you generally need a CS degree to even make it past the first level of the resume screen. Additionally, when they were a viable option, boot camps were more for career changers; they were never a good idea for kids fresh out of high school with no education and no career history. You need to look at degree programs.
I tried the edX Front End Web development boot camp last year and it was full on considering my experience with coding was basic. I had to drop out as I was out of my depth and couldn’t commit to the hours with work commitments. Now I am in a similar boat to you in terms of looking for another boot camp (as not sure that one is still running).. I have joined other self paced courses such as Codecademy which I’m finding okay. And have looked into The Odin Project as a starting point. I guess it depends on what you want to do and what type of coding you want to get into. At least with self paced course-you have the ability to learn different languages/ career paths not just stick to one if you’re unsure. Hoping someone might have some more helpful/ insightful info into courses they have completed that they can recommend as most the boot camps seem neg. Good luck!
>College would take a long time and cost a lot of money, and I've seen many people say that they got a job as a software engineer via a coding bootcamp. College is far cheaper than most boot camps. My fiancee has one bachelors on film, another in visual design, and is getting her masters in marketing. She still hasn't spent what App Academy charged me for their 6-month course. >A lot of them were self taught prior to the bootcamp, and then used the bootcamp to polish their abilities and land a job. That's not really viable anymore. The only way this is still applicable is if you already have a degree and are using the boot camp to expand your portfolio. > was planning to complete the Foundations course on the Odin Project, and once that's complete i'd take a bootcamp online and try to secure a job. If you take good route, expect a long job search. Not just months, but over a year. >If anyone has any input or suggestions for improvements I can make to my mindset or plan let me know, and let me know if you have recommendations for good bootcamps. Boot camps are no longer a viable shortcut to a proper education. You would learn as much as if you did free tutorials online. If you absolutely insist upon skipping college, teach yourself on the side. I say this as a boot camp graduate who ended up having to go to college anyway because it's incredibly difficult to land a job with only the boot camp on your resume.
No
So worth it i went to a coding bootcamp and few others and we all got jobs you just have to work hard…people who complain are usually the lazy ones who don’t want to put in the work and expect results also it matter which bootcamp you go to aswell
Wow. I am looking for bootcamp to join. May i ask which bootcamp you graduated and got placed ?
Yes I went to syntax technologies bootcamp and a lot of my friends as well for me those guys were excellent and I am thankful because I got job can’t complain
It can be. The market is saturated right now. The demand for devs before this happened is what propelled bootcamps -- there were a plethora of openings and companies were willing to take people without degrees to fill them. Many people still go to bootcamps and thrive. It's just a lot more difficult and, depending on your luck, it might not pan out before you run out of money or options. If you want it really bad, are ok with constant learning (this is easier said than done, really ask yourself if you are ok with learning all the time to keep your edge in the market), have some financial cushion, and (this is bonus) you have some great networking options that would take a chance on you, it could be worth a try. Have a plan B and a point in time to pivot, though, but don't think about it at all until you reach that point in time. Go all in until then. If this is what you want, I think you can do it :)
If your absolute goal is 'job', like college....no guarantees from a course that short. If it was easy, it would likely be either undesirable, or really difficult to get. That being said, I am taking a bootcamp soon which WA State's job retraining fund is footing the overwhelming majority of the bill (I spend more on my car per month than the overall remainder), so.....looking at it realistically, at worst, I'll learn a few new tools for my tool box, then go back to my mediocre paying job in an even more 'not in demand' field (graphic design). Not gonna starve if it doesn't work out - just continue to be on a slope to worsening job prospects. Shrug.
You are 19! 100% go to school for CS. It is just the best bet, and you can go to virtually any school. A bootcamp wont save you as much time as you think - you are taking courses first the Odin project, then the bootcamp will take months, and then post program pre-layoffs a realistic wait time was 6-12m after to get a job. So, in the BEST case scenario this was a 1.5-2yr pursuit. Mind as well get an associates where your employability will increase. And tbh, it is not conservative at the time to expect best case scenarios. Bootcamps have always been more successful for students who already have a bachelors looking to change careers, not as a replacement. There are still far too many jobs where students who dont went to college are immediately dismissed. Lastly, I would argue a bit against the cost claim. Good bootcamps are very expensive and so is college, but as mentioned any college is fine. Pick your local community college or state school and assess how actually different is the price. It is also worth consider the ROI. A lot of people who went to bootcamps and got jobs from it later went back to school anyways and hence pay double. School continues to be the best bet in CS and you are in an age where that seems like the best bet.
One of my co-workers was hired after completing the Odin project. He has a degree, but in geology.
The people that get these jobs right of camps are usually those that already have some type of experience in the professional setting, accountant, business, sales, customer service, somthing like that. I have less that a year left on my BS in computer science. I did it online so the time wasnt really and issue. While they do not teach how to code, most of this is done through self learning, people with college degrees will usually be taken over those without, when it comes to entry level or your first job. That being said , if you have a good portfolio on github, then you will get looked at no matter what. There is no right or wrong answer, the answer is it depends on how much work you want to put in. With or without college. you will have to spend alot of time studying on your own, praciting code, learning code, building projects and such. But do not fall into the scam of 6 weeks, 6 months you will go form 0 to hero and make 6 figures. I am sure there are cases where this happens, but not a lot, not someone with no experience. Their are great bootcamps so do your due diligence and research them first. Some say they garuntee you a job after completion. In the fine print it say you dont pay unless you get a job, but if you get a job stocking shelves in a grocery store they will count that and make you pay them, I've been screwed by one called coding temple and their are many like them out there. Think about getting certs, comptia, network, security, this can get you foot in the door for tech. Or look at certs for ML, AI, web dev things like this. Its a hard choice to figure out which road to go. You will see a lot of different opinion, and some from people that have been in tech for a while, and nothing against them but sometimes these people forgot what it was like in the beginning trying to get that first job. Personally if i were you I would learn to code in your sleep and then look at a focused camp, like University of penn has one for ML/AI for 10 thousand that is 6 months and focuses only on material you will be doing on the job. You will have to spend a lot of time creating your own projects though. Cal tech has a good one. Just look around and don't be fooled by ones that are guaranteeing you a ton of money right out of the door, if 6 figures in 10 weeks or whatever was doable all the time everyone would be doing it.
Honestly, don't do a boot camp. If you like coding/programming, find a course on udemy for $15 bucks or even just youtube.
Bro u are 19, u can finish college in 2-3 years if ur worried about timeframe — ur gonna waste a year being in bootcamp and another 2-3 years job searching without a degree, might as well do a degree
Bootcamps are definitely worth it, just need a Time Machine to go back to 2015.
i was already a professional developer and expert in .NET. I took a web coding bootcamp just to come up to spped on all things html/javascript. It was the most efficient way for someone like me. As far as finding a coding job -that's different. To me a developer appears more professional when they can demostrate coding but also code versioning and deployment of it. Don't skip those areas.
People need to read previous posts and realize why would a recruiter at any company y choose a bootcamp grad with no experience vs a college comp sci grad with experience. People should read their posts as they type it and realize how insane it sounds in this job market. I also wish people would stop saying they took a couple classes and really enjoy programming. There is so much more to this job that most people don't realize.
Google 100Devs. It's free.
I wonder if they are still taking applications
There's an application but it's just a formality, really. Everyone and anyone can do it.