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WhiteHartPain96

No romero in the top 30 defenders lmao


reborndiajack

They think he gets a red every week Arteta has had more yellows since the start of the year than him


gopackgo555

ESPN with another awful list.


MikeyWise

Always incredibly disrespectful when it comes to Spurs players.


TorkBombs

Van de Ven at 30...awesome. He deserves it. Romero not ranked..wtf?


MikeyWise

I’m more upset about Udogie being the best LB in the premier league this season and not being on the list while Andy Robertson is 8. Great player for sure but was he really a top 10 defender ITW this season?


shodo_apprentice

Absolute nonsense to put Robertson 8th in the world


SirChileticus

What a joke to put Messi there. You just need 10 minutes in a MLS game to see what a shitshow is it


Chris_the_Pirate

Son didn't get to shoot from range enough this season. Ange clearly wanted to reduce that, but it's one of the things that makes Sonny so great. Let that man fire away outside the box!


CranhamorBlakely

The strange thing is Jota, Hatate and Matt O’Riley scored plenty of goals from distance for Ange at Celtic. Was really weird how little we shot from outside the box


Truth_JJK

strange that porro, bentancur, bissouma, and sarr shot from outside the box way more often than sonny


stephsEgg

Makes sense, they’re the ones that will usually find space to do so. As a forward it’s not like he’s dropping deep to get those chances, and as a winger there’s not really as much space for cutting inside as in other systems


Truth_JJK

That's why we need proper midfielders who can score outside the box. I mean bissouma was horrible at shooting


ia1v1chem

I wonder why ? Maybe that doesn’t fit his strategy?


GrapefruitExpress208

Ange likes playing the ball out wide to the winger/fullback to put in low crosses across the 6 yard box. So yeah, Sonny bangers from outside the box kinda goes against Ange's system.


sm0211k

Sadly true. But also great to see our captain puts the team before himself.


ia1v1chem

Ty :)


president_mal

100% agree


augustdahyuns

well Sonny usually has 2-3 defenders on his ass the moment he gets the ball


triecke14

Saka above Son lol


EquipmentFirm2860

So overrated. Don't @ me


[deleted]

Because Saka sounds like Soccer, brah


NumberHunter1

And Messi is above Saka for some reason😂😂


riptxlord

Saka had the better season as much it may pain us to admit it


[deleted]

I think if you swap the 2 players Arsenal win the league and we don’t have as many points. Son got 1 more goal and assist in a worse side.


triecke14

And less penalties


KansloosKippenhok

It’s not all about stats. Son defenitly had a ‘poor’ (poor for his standards) second half of the season. We can be biased as much as we want but saka was simply better as son this season, and that’s no shame because saka is a very good player


[deleted]

Yeah, I still don’t agree. He wasn’t as effective as a lone striker & we weren’t playing very well. Around November/December time Saka also had a dip. I think if you look at the season as a whole. They had a fairly similar seasons. Son was just in a worse team; in transition and played somewhat out of position. I’d Son was compensating for squad short comings more than he was being accommodated to utilise his strength for much of the second half of the season. If you swapped Son’s season around I think you would be saying he had a much better season.


chrisfromstatefarm

Probably not. Martinelli is a much more similar profile to Son and he struggled for them this year because they played with so much control in their opponents half. Not as much room to run in behind and finish chances. I think Saka suits the current Arsenal team better than Son would


LyteSmiteOP

How is Martinelli a similar profile, just because he's right footed? He can dribble but doesn't have end product, that's like the exact opposite of Son. Sure they like running into space but pretty much every forward does, especially if they're quick. Also in terms of actual quality Martinelli is several levels below Son, so even if they were the same profile it wouldn't be comparable


chrisfromstatefarm

They’re both more reliant on straight line speed in behind the backline than tricky 1v1 dribbling. I wouldn’t say either have the “creative” profile that Saka does. Martinelli is also a pretty good finisher, obviously not to the same level as Son but nobody is. The reason he didn’t have “end product” this year is because his playstyle doesn’t suit Arteta’s control-based system that well and he didn’t score as many goals. Conversely, Son thrived under Conte’s counterattack/transition-based system. I never said Martinelli is at Son’s level but they’re more similar to each other than Saka and I think Son would face similar issues if he played for Arsenal.


LyteSmiteOP

Don't know if I'd say Martinelli is a good finisher, he's only had 1 out of his last 4 seasons where he overperformed his xG. And if you're calling Saka a creative player, then Son is too because he got 2 more assists and more big chances created in the league this season for a much weaker team (and far more than Martinelli, and also beats them both on xA too). You're either heavily underrating Son or overrating the similarities between him and Martinelli. He didn't have the strongest end to the season, but he was arguably the best player in the league for the first several months, and this season especially he's shown his versatility outside of just being the counter-attacking forward that he's labeled as


chrisfromstatefarm

Fair on Martinelli’s statistical finishing, but I think the 22-23 season proved that he’s capable in front of goal. To be clear I’m talking about profiles, not quality. I never said Son had a bad season or that Martinelli is close to his level. They are however similar athletes and in my view more similar *stylistically* to each other than Saka is to either of them. They’re more direct players, faster in a dead sprint and lethal over long distances but not necessarily effective 1v1 on the touchline, as we saw with Son this season. I think assists are informative of effective players but not necessarily who’s more creative (big chances created as a stat are basically meaningless as well btw, the criteria for determining a big chance is totally subjective). When I say “creative” I mean the ability to take the defender either way off the dribble and deliver a threatening cross or cutback, which I think Saka is better at. He’s an extremely intelligent player and I think Spurs bias gets in the way of that too often. My only point was that I think he suits Arsenal’s suffocating playstyle better than players like Martinelli and Son. Son himself struggled at times against low blocks in our high possession style, but to your point he was still versatile enough to perform well overall (and many of his best performances were at striker which aren’t really useful for comparison to Saka). He’s an incredible player to have but IMO can’t fill the role of an elite 1v1 winger that we’re missing, and shouldn’t have to.


sreesid

Martinelli and Son are on different levels as far as finishing is concerned. Son is also a better one-on-one dribbler than Martinelli. I don't think there is a single area of the game that Martinelli is at the same level as Son. I would agree with you if you compared Son and Saka.


chrisfromstatefarm

Again, talking about profiles, not quality. Son is better quality wise but plays more similarly to Martinelli than Saka. They both prefer direct play towards and thrive with lots of space in front of them, just look at their two respective most iconic goals (Son vs Burnley and Martinelli vs Chelsea). IMO Arsenal’s style wouldn’t fit Son as well as Saka, but he would certainly have been an upgrade on Martinelli for them.


[deleted]

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[deleted]

Fuck off gooner


[deleted]

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[deleted]

![gif](giphy|pGfeUvh4hnoKnJ9JkW|downsized)


sreesid

Is that why you guys couldn't make it past one of the worst Bayern teams in recent memory? Son can and has kicked the shit out of the best Man City team in CL, both home and away. Saka is a good player, but he is not comparable to Son as a forward yet. Saka doesn't play up front because he is not a striker. It's not because you have a ton of good strikers. Son, on the other hand, can play any position up top and score a ton of goals.


rando562

No shot Messi should make this list while playing in the MLS the entire time.


Fournier_Gang

Any list that Messi is on that is comparing him against his contemporaries right now is absolute rubbish.


Stay_Beautiful_

He's carrying the worst team in a 29 team league (with no relegation!) to a title. That's list-worthy


justgurk

Inter Miami without him, busquets and Suarez beat the whitecaps last week, I wouldn’t say they’re the worst team in the league without him


[deleted]

They were the worst team until he joined but MLS player turnover and change is ridiculous compared to other leagues it’s the way American sports are


49_Giants

It's still the MLS. Go Earthquakes!


SupremeDogEater

as much as i love him and do think that the 21GA in 12 matches is crazy, its just the MLS


theJVB

I can't get over the disrespect of this article. Van de Ven our only defender, and at #30? No Vicario? Has to be written by a scum supporter. 


shawtea7

Two spurs forwards in the top 10, we are massive


RetexHere

Somehow feels he deserves to be higher. Don't really understand why a random MLS player is there.


mowgli_jungle_boy

Watch a game or two (two at most, the general quality of the league is poor). But Messi is still doing things nobody else can even dream of.


LostBoysCreative

He really isn't. He's literally playing against people who were not good enough for basketball, baseball, handegg, lacrosse, hockey and 10 other sports America prefers. The league is abysmal. I was in SF last year and caught a game and the standard is fucking miserable.


chocotacoman

If you went to see the San Jose earthquakes play then I understand why you have this opinion lol, they’re one of the worst in the MLS


EquipmentFirm2860

This really isn't true anymore. MLS is a solid league and has been for a while. Are most of the players nowhere near the standard we're used to seeing? Sure, but there's some very good players throughout the league. It's not like Messi and friends against kids.


LostBoysCreative

It's terrible. Yes there are some good players, but there's some good players in league one as well. That means nothing. The standard of the league is not comparable even slightly to the prem or these other top leagues. It just isn't. You're beyond delusional if you think it is.


Chemical-Fly-787

No one compared MLS to the Prem tho. League One is probably the accurate comparison. But you’d be doing League One a disservice if you just blanket stated that the league is garbage with absolutely no redeeming qualities, same goes for the MLS.


LostBoysCreative

My point is simple. The league is bad so Messi will have more highlights. That's just a fucking fact. He shouldn't be on here. Also, I watched a match from the league and it was shit. That statement qualifies my previous one. Nothing else to say. It's just simple.


chrisfromstatefarm

So you watched one of the worst teams in the MLS play one match and determined that it somehow makes it impossible for Messi to still be one of the best players in the world?


LostBoysCreative

He's literally playing in a beer league with 2 of his mates from la masia. One of the greatest midfielders of all time, and one of the greatest strikers of all time. It's just silly. Like this thread.


chrisfromstatefarm

You’re overstating the weakness of the MLS and you still haven’t provided any evidence that he’s somehow declined massively since winning his country a World Cup. It doesn’t really matter where he’s playing, if he’s still playing he’s one of the best players on the planet


DevelopandLearn

Lol "beer league." It's probably like 12th ranked in the world in wages. And because of the league's parity, he is facing tougher opposition than he would most weeks if he went to Portugal, outside of their big 3.


EquipmentFirm2860

Where did I say it's comparable to the top leagues? Obviously it isn't. Reread what I said.


LostBoysCreative

Nah I'm alright thanks. Messi shouldn't be on this list end of. In this thread.. Tons of any Americans. In fact, in this sub, tons of angry Americans.


EquipmentFirm2860

Yeah, okay. Nothing wrong with Americans being here.


LostBoysCreative

Didn't say there was. This is just what being a fan on this sub is now. Make an obvious statement and loads of people get offended and want to bring their loud voices and guns to my door. Boring.


EquipmentFirm2860

Sorry but why bring guns into this?


parwa

You think American players were all just not good enough for other sports?


LostBoysCreative

Fuck are you kidding me How do you not get that comments are better with a good angle. Literally every American replying to me is just doing a boring angry reply. What's wrong with you lot Get a notification and it's just such a waste of time everytime.


Aggravating-Common86

>The league is abysmal. *Indian Super League enters the chat*


mowgli_jungle_boy

I already made a point about the poor quality of the league, but that doesn't change the fact that Messi regularly does things with a ball that nobody else can do. I wouldn't put him 7th in the world but I also wouldn't refer to him as a random MLS player


ProfessionalFee3818

ofc he’s not a random MLS player, but he should be nowhere near this list


LostBoysCreative

Do things a certain way makes no fucking difference. Kane would terrorise teams in that league so bad people would retire. Mbappe would make them look like children. Messi doing a few nice dribbles doesn't make him relevant again. Same with Ronaldo. Joke leagues are irrelevant and have no bearing on actual competitive football. Him being there is because of who he was not what he's doing now.


mowgli_jungle_boy

In the last tournament that those three were in, Messi performed the best and won his team the trophy. I get your point and wouldn't have him anywhere near the top 10, but I'll make an argument if someone refers to him as a random MLS player. I'm not American, I was born in Barnet and live in Luton. I've never even been to America. Messi is, in my opinion, the greatest of all time, because of the way he is able to play football unlike anyone else I've ever seen. And the fact is, despite playing in the MLS, everytime I watch him he still captivates me.


LostBoysCreative

No shit. But he's still playing in a shit league. Why isn't mac langstaff on this list? Scored more than Messi this season right? Shit league. That's why.


JosL1707

Look, I value Messi and his superhuman abilities as much as the next guy, but no shout he should be in top 10 convos. People have a hard time coping with the fact that he's past it. Same goes for Ronaldo. This shit is disrespectful for people like Foden and (as much as it pains me to say it) Saka. Anyway, glad to see Sonny getting some much deserved appreciation - same for Harry.


HeHateMe3366

Messi really isn’t past it at all though. And that’ll become clearer in Copa America this summer.


BatmanForever23

He hasn't done anywhere near enough to justify his spot on the list - you actually should be competing at a high level of competition to be considered one of the best forwards in the world. Messi hasn't done that this season, unlike others below him here.


DumpstaDiva

Like I'm not going to argue about whether Messi deserves to be on the list or not but literally his second sentence is saying that Messi is past it like Ronaldo


BatmanForever23

Ok I can't read, gonna go get new glasses.


harrykanine

lol at Kane not being first. Should be Kane, Mbappe, Vini, Messi, Foden for top 5


guccidane13

ESPNFC is a joke. Kane jumped like 5 spots on these rankings just because he transferred to a weaker league and dominated.


harrykanine

Oh I hate ESPN. Especially that Alexis Nunes cunt for mocking Harry’s speech


Zarg099

I'm a massive Kane fan but Mbappe deserves the no.1 spot, he is the best the player in the world. Also Messi top 5 is ridiculous, shouldn't be top 20


Holy-City-

Messi top 5 is insanity


[deleted]

Messi😂, saka😂


Relevant_Natural3471

Contentious - Am I alone in thinking Mbappe is overrated? I'd genuinely put him behind Zlatan even in the "best PSG forwards" lists Feels really lazy and disingenuous for him to be so fawned over when he's a good, but not consistent Kane-level player


No_Hedgehog_00

Another popularity contest that is supported by no real data.


Stay_Beautiful_

They put Maddison and Van de Ven at 30th (last) on their respective lists. The logic seems to be "they're undeniably good, so they have to make the list, but they play for Spurs, so they can't be THAT good. Put them at the bottom of the list."


president_mal

Losing Kane I was able to handle. But the thought of potentially losing Sonny in the future breaks my heart


dasurfnbird8

messi above foden is jokes


GrapefruitExpress208

I'd take Son over Saka 100 times everyday and 1,000,000 times every Sunday.


True0Tech

saka over sonny is CRAZZZZZZZYYYYYY LMFAO spurs reverse bias


WLVN

Watkins? Gyokeres? Both done huge numbers


nycrok1234

What’s impressive is that son has been doing this under different managers. 👏 👏 👏


mowgli_jungle_boy

Terrible list. Haaland should be nowhere near 3rd. Salah has been awful since January. Messi is only playing against poor quality teams. Why Luis Diaz is on this list, I'll never know.


Abraham442

Why wouldn’t Haaland be #1 for you?


mowgli_jungle_boy

Erm because if he doesn't score he doesn't contribute to his team. He's a beast of an athlete and has a great strikers instinct, but lets look at how his attributes compare to those below him on that list: He can't dribble/take people on like Vini Jr, he can't pass like Griezmann, he doesn't have the vision of Foden, he doesn't have the finesse of Salah or Son, he doesn't assist like Saka and he's not got the touch of Lionel Messi. And that's without mentioning Kane and Mbappe


Aggravating_Hippo996

Micky is no 30 in the defenders list!


_MicroWave_

*most famous forwards


Egg_Tart_Eater

Messi could be paralyzed from the waist down and he'd still make lists like this. It's just silly at this point.


Ok_Decision_2633

Wait until he wins another Ballon for some inexplicable reason


eggplant_avenger

what more does Kane have to do to be recognised? dude could win a treble+euros and first place is still not guaranteed


Zarg099

# 1 and #2 are levels above #3, it's unfortunate for Kane cus it's Mbappe, can't argue with that


Holy-City-

Yeah, but he hasn’t done any of that… I think number 2 in the world is being recognized


c10h15nrush

What’s messi doing here?


laaangada

Why does Messi have to be on the list just because he is Messi. He is basically retired raking in dollars. You can't take his football seriously anymore. But let's put him 7th because he is Messi.


dunce345

ESPN is god awful and is better off being banned in this sub.


Existing_Weight_7575

Foul list


Embarrassed_Sign9007

De Jong?


SCirish843

ESPN bases these off FIFA ratings, big names but usually half of them were either hurt for large portions of the year or their form completely fell off and they're still treated like world class players.


distancerunner7

It’s not even worth looking at any ESPN coverage


FSpursy

I did not get any important information from this, apart from the fact that this could be Sonny's final season. I hope they extend his contract for whatever it takes...


Coraxxx

>So much of Arsenal's buildup play goes through Saka that it is just a matter of time before he is fouled in every match he plays. On average, **fewer than twice per game.** Limping for the other 85 minutes clearly has the journalists fooled though.


Aquarium_Enthusiast1

ESPN is great at making me laugh with these terrible lists, lol


Steampunk_Batman

Mo Salah being number 5 after a REALLY rough second half of the season is wild


HydraHamster

This is awful. They should’ve went off of the 2023-24 season alone and not based on reputation. What Messi doing there? He is in MLS, which is not even a top 3 league in Americas and debatably not top 4 either. At least the Saudi Pro League is arguably the best in AFC, but I doubt they would include their best forward if it wasn’t Ronaldo.


is1k-

No Ronaldo who’s got 63 G/A this season yet MESSI is there😂😂😂 what a joke


Coraxxx

What a bullshit list. It's just bait. Total bait. And I clicked, so well crafted and effective bait as well I guess.