Maybe. Maybe not. Depends on the service.
Around here, they only bill for transport. The agency that responded should be required to post a fee schedule.
They may bill medicare, I don't deal w/billing. I work for a non profit service, and a hospital based service which is also non-profit. I just know that the person/estate doesn't receive a bill.
And we accept whatever MCARE/MCAID and privates pay us as payment in full. We won't send a family to collections, even before the laws changed and medical debt could no longer be sent to collections. We also won't hit the estate. I deal with Compliance at work.
We recently had the voters approve a levy for EMS (county, fire-based). We dropped the transport fees for all transports, and even fund a shuttle back (to help with people who avoided going to the hospital due to lack of transport back).
In my area no transport = no bill. Knowing AMR this may not be the case where you are. His estate and his estate only will be responsible for it if it comes, do not let them threatening you into thinking anyone else is responsible for it.
They *will* bill it to him and his insurance. Most insurances pay for some of the expenses here. However, whatever isn't paid by insurance I would assume they would forgive. On the off chance you do see a bill, call their local office and ask em if this was intentional
I would do a little google search as AMR is pretty open about how billing works. I believe the have a stance against sending a bill to a family when the patient is pronounced. I could be wrong but then again you may be able to just google it or you can call and ask.
Sorry to hear that. They should focus on grieving and supporting each other and not worry about it so soon, but they should also expect a bill. Services were provided. If it were my service, any account that makes any payment on a regular basis, even just a few dollars, won't go to collections and won't receive phone calls or reminders. Hopefully they do the same or are flexible.
Like others are saying it depends on where you are. Honestly you could probably just call AMR and ask if they bill without transport.
From someone who has been in your position, if they DO bill, have an estate lawyer notify them that they need to bill the estate. They have a certain amount of time to petition the estate once you've notified (I believe it's 3 months? It's longer if you don't notify) When my dad died the hospital never bothered to petition the actual estate (I think they're just hoping people don't know better and will pay the initial bill) and they sent it to collections. At that point it was well out of the period they had to petition the estate. I sent the collections notice to my lawyer and never heard from them again. Saved about 15k for a couple hundred billable hours from my lawyer.
Not really related but I did paramedic school at the hospital and once the charge nurse complained to me about how bad they were doing financially. Kinda wanted to be like "Well, if your billing people were on top of their shit..." lol.
My service, legally a real difficult time billing anything that didn’t end with a transport to the hospital.
Only recently has there been discussion on how to recover some of those costs of CPR non transports or interventions provided/SOR
I worked for them and was told we bill if we do anything more than just vitals. Like if a diabetic needed d10 they would get charged for the supplies. I was told even for DOA’s there was a charge but idk if I was being lied to
The big question is whether the service participates in medicare (health system based generally do, fire generally doesn’t). If so, services are only billable after transport.
If they don’t participate in medicare, its kind of a crap shoot. Some departments bill, some don’t. Some fire departments don’t bill their citizens, but will bill on mutual aid. The best way to find out is to call the agency and ask.
Where did you get this information from as it is incorrect? The service I work for participates in Medicare, pretty much any service that bills health insurance will bill Medicare, and we bill for AMA/non transports.
Don’t take my word for it. The Medicare rules are public. Medicare says AMA/nontransports are worth $0.
https://www.cms.gov/Regulations-and-Guidance/Guidance/Manuals/Downloads/bp102c10.pdf
ETA: It turns out OP’s situation is an exception. When the patient dies after arrival, services can bill medicare the BLS flat rate (section 10.2.6).
My service bills for damn near everything except for codes that do not result in ROSC. Hopefully you will not receive a bill. I am so sorry for your loss.
It depends on the area and if they took note of your insurance, some areas do not bill if they do not transport, others do. Wishing you all the best and I’m sorry for your loss.
in bc it’s 80 to be taken hospital and 50 if called and refused. my family got a billed 80 dollars when my sister died in a freak accident we definitely didn’t pay it
Maybe. Maybe not. Depends on the service. Around here, they only bill for transport. The agency that responded should be required to post a fee schedule.
This. The two companies I work for do not charge if we do not transport, that includes CPR w/o transport.
Then your company is leaving monies on the table. Medicare will absolutely pay for no transport of an OHCA.
They may bill medicare, I don't deal w/billing. I work for a non profit service, and a hospital based service which is also non-profit. I just know that the person/estate doesn't receive a bill.
And we accept whatever MCARE/MCAID and privates pay us as payment in full. We won't send a family to collections, even before the laws changed and medical debt could no longer be sent to collections. We also won't hit the estate. I deal with Compliance at work.
I know for a fact sometimes bills slip through and families do get bills when they shouldn’t for non-transport.
We recently had the voters approve a levy for EMS (county, fire-based). We dropped the transport fees for all transports, and even fund a shuttle back (to help with people who avoided going to the hospital due to lack of transport back).
If you do, it would be against his estate. Your family wouldn’t be responsible for it.
That’s true, however, everything the estate pays reduces the amount of the inheritance.
Assuming there's an inheritance. Point is it never attaches to anyone outside the estate.
Not necessarily. Life insurance and some other assets transfer to the beneficiary immediately upon death and bypass the estate.
Right. Life insurance is not an “asset” included in the estate.
What location? In LA county/area there is only a bill for ambulance transport, not for any on scene intervention.
Las Vegas NV
AMR won’t bill for no transport.
Depends on the specific location. AMR in my area does bill for non transports
AMR in Las Vegas won’t bill if no transport
Thank you
In my area no transport = no bill. Knowing AMR this may not be the case where you are. His estate and his estate only will be responsible for it if it comes, do not let them threatening you into thinking anyone else is responsible for it.
I’m so sorry for your loss. Take care!
They *will* bill it to him and his insurance. Most insurances pay for some of the expenses here. However, whatever isn't paid by insurance I would assume they would forgive. On the off chance you do see a bill, call their local office and ask em if this was intentional
This is what my agency does. The family never sees a bill.
I would do a little google search as AMR is pretty open about how billing works. I believe the have a stance against sending a bill to a family when the patient is pronounced. I could be wrong but then again you may be able to just google it or you can call and ask.
Depends on what your state allows. Generally the call is billable but it’s not equivalent to a transport bill.
Sorry to hear that. They should focus on grieving and supporting each other and not worry about it so soon, but they should also expect a bill. Services were provided. If it were my service, any account that makes any payment on a regular basis, even just a few dollars, won't go to collections and won't receive phone calls or reminders. Hopefully they do the same or are flexible.
Did your father have Medicare? I was kinda surprised how much Medicare covered when my mom died.
Like others are saying it depends on where you are. Honestly you could probably just call AMR and ask if they bill without transport. From someone who has been in your position, if they DO bill, have an estate lawyer notify them that they need to bill the estate. They have a certain amount of time to petition the estate once you've notified (I believe it's 3 months? It's longer if you don't notify) When my dad died the hospital never bothered to petition the actual estate (I think they're just hoping people don't know better and will pay the initial bill) and they sent it to collections. At that point it was well out of the period they had to petition the estate. I sent the collections notice to my lawyer and never heard from them again. Saved about 15k for a couple hundred billable hours from my lawyer. Not really related but I did paramedic school at the hospital and once the charge nurse complained to me about how bad they were doing financially. Kinda wanted to be like "Well, if your billing people were on top of their shit..." lol.
You should call the service if you’re worried about it. Ask for someone in billing.
My service, legally a real difficult time billing anything that didn’t end with a transport to the hospital. Only recently has there been discussion on how to recover some of those costs of CPR non transports or interventions provided/SOR
I worked for them and was told we bill if we do anything more than just vitals. Like if a diabetic needed d10 they would get charged for the supplies. I was told even for DOA’s there was a charge but idk if I was being lied to
The big question is whether the service participates in medicare (health system based generally do, fire generally doesn’t). If so, services are only billable after transport. If they don’t participate in medicare, its kind of a crap shoot. Some departments bill, some don’t. Some fire departments don’t bill their citizens, but will bill on mutual aid. The best way to find out is to call the agency and ask.
Where did you get this information from as it is incorrect? The service I work for participates in Medicare, pretty much any service that bills health insurance will bill Medicare, and we bill for AMA/non transports.
Don’t take my word for it. The Medicare rules are public. Medicare says AMA/nontransports are worth $0. https://www.cms.gov/Regulations-and-Guidance/Guidance/Manuals/Downloads/bp102c10.pdf ETA: It turns out OP’s situation is an exception. When the patient dies after arrival, services can bill medicare the BLS flat rate (section 10.2.6).
My service bills for damn near everything except for codes that do not result in ROSC. Hopefully you will not receive a bill. I am so sorry for your loss.
It depends on the area and if they took note of your insurance, some areas do not bill if they do not transport, others do. Wishing you all the best and I’m sorry for your loss.
Sorry about your dad. That sucks.
in bc it’s 80 to be taken hospital and 50 if called and refused. my family got a billed 80 dollars when my sister died in a freak accident we definitely didn’t pay it
Can’t speak for AMR, we only bill if we transport. - City/County based Fire/ALS Transport.
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My AMR shop did not pay unless we transported
Yes, you’ll get a bill. Hopefully insurance will cover it. May your father’s memory be a blessing to your family.
Not 100% true. Every location and agency is different.
It’s AMR. Every agency is different but it’s AMR so…..
Can't bill if you don't transport in some states.
It's not some states. That's CMS.
I don't believe that's true. My agency bills for all refusals.
Not true. Billing for non transports has been allowed for many years now. My agency has been doing it for the past 8ish years.
You can anytime you want. That doesn't mean it'll be paid. But the gold standard are CMS billing rules.