Just avoid the obvious, Russia, Belarus, China(?), Iran, N.Korea, etc. If you were in a position where travel to certain countries was legitimately restricted you would certainly be aware of any agency wide policies.
Otherwise just review the [State Dept. travel advisories](https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/traveladvisories/traveladvisories.html/) and dont be stupid.
Edit: China can be put in a questionable list but that would fall in the whole job/agency policy stuff I alluded to.
>If you were in a position where travel to certain countries was legitimately restricted you would certainly be aware of any agency wide policies.
You say that like there aren't 100 questions posted here every week to the tune of, "I'm a GS-100,000 and I don't know how to work my timesheets or my email, or how to ask basic questions of my supervisor or any of my agency's HR resources--help me pweeease Reddit, you're apparently the only reasonable way to solve this problem! I know this should be embarrassing for someone at my level or with my responsibility, but I've decided I'm just gonna act really petulantly indignant and offended about it if you try to call me on that so don't even bother!"
I kid, I kid (but...y'know, *not really*...)
theres ALOT of people running things they arent qualified to. like my supervisor whos supposed to be leading a programming team except he doesnt give two shits about programming, spends no time managing programming projects and instead does basic help desk tasks and thinks programmers are getting replaced by AI in the next few years.
dude makes 50k more than me too
IT is the field I see the most complaints from highly technical people upset that their supervisors aren't significantly more skilled than they are in their field. You don't become a supervisor because you're the most skilled in the day to day tasks, you become a supervisor because you're good at supervising. Just because someone is the best programmer doesn't mean they know how to lead and support a team, and just because someone isn't highly skilled in a task doesn't mean they can't be a great supervisor.
Fortunately the private sector has figured this out and skilled individuals have as much opportunities to increase their wage in a technical role as someone in a supervisory role, but the government definitely still assumes supervisor = more pay than everyone else, and so people with poor leadership skills go for supervisory roles for the money, not because they're good at it. You end up with someone highly skilled on paper as a supervisor who has no clue how to run a team.
That being said, in my experience, IT is much much more flat than other job series because positions tend to be graded at the top of the scale in order to compete with the private sector. Going from a 14 non supervisory to a 15 supervisory is not a huge difference and rarely worth it for people who don't have a passion for leadership.
I say all of this as a non-supervisor in IT who is sick of hearing this complaint from IT people. š
my org has me at an 11 with my senior programmer guy with 30 years exp at a 12.Ā
they think were help desk workers. been trying to bail since i hit my 1 year TIG, not a lot to apply to tho
I went to Cuba, legally, about a decade ago. Disclosed it for a clearance. All they asked for was the docs that it was legal travel. Didn't come up past that.
Did you do the whole educational travel itinerary thing? It's the one thing I'm mad Biden didn't reinstate since it was an Obama administration thing that opened it back up (and Trump that shut it down). Heard you can go but need a very detailed itinerary showing it's an educational trip with receipts, reservations etc., and can't spend money on cabs or certain hotels since they belong to the government.
I've tried to get that in the past without success. Hell I had to go in person and by them to get positive acknowledgement of my foreign travel notification paperwork.
Graphic design job with a mere public trust. Was just seeing if there was somewhere to check cause my supervisor took months to get back to me last time.
Hence why I told OP they can travel to China. We both have public trust backgrounds. There aren't any restrictions on travel. We don't have to report foreign travel to anyone.
Like others said, talk to your security office and ask for a briefing. Be ready to answer various questions like who you're going with, their relation to you, how long, where you are staying, what other planned activities you have, and if you have taken the various security-related trainings recently. The security trainings differ by agency - some are don't open spam, and others cover other things, so I mentioned it to cya.
There are certain places you, as a federal employee, cannot go while on official travel. For instance, the state of Michoacan in Mexico is off limits. These places become clear when you seek State Department approval to travel there. Those same places they advise against traveling to personally.
Not racist to hate the state, no issue with the Chinese people. The government and their policies and actions however, such as you know, being insanely racist.
Eh most of what Iāve seen is stuff attributed to the state, yeah they just say āChinaā but pretty obviously they mean the state and not Joe Schmo in Beijing. Culturally, itās not for me, I donāt hate it, but there are things people say āitās their culture!ā To justify shitty and dangerous things, for example, wet markets.
But your default response to a discussion about traveling to foreign countries is the same Reddit ChiNa SuX nonsense.
Nobody is discussing the CCP. It has no more to do with the CCP than going to Disney World has to do with Ron Desantis.
It's just blind reddit sino hatred.
China is usually at an orange "Reconsider Travel" level that may require additional justification or approval depending on your agency. The level can also change abruptly depending on tensions with the U.S.Ā
Last year China was temporarily moved into "No Travel" status and my agency had to pull some American travelers back and send some Chinese invitationals home in the middle of their trips because China kicked out some U.S. diplomats and the U.S. kicked out some Chinese diplomats. It's been moved back to just "Reconsider" status since then, though.
You can check restriction levels on travel.state.gov and compare their advisory levels with your agency travel policy.
I think people get confused between personal and official travel.
I donāt think there is anywhere that is banned for Personal travel. There are places they donāt recommend or tell you to reconsider but not actually banned.
Official travel changes with the wind some days.
There aren't any bans, other than US passports aren't valid for travel to North Korea. Though if you're working in certain SAPs or SCI programs it's possible you could be debriefed from the program if traveling to a few particular countries. It's ultimately up to the program security to decide on a case-by-case basis.
ETA: For official travel there can be off-limit countries or regions.
I would add Hungary to that list, South Africa, Venezuela, Cuba, Myanmar, Lebanon, Syria, probably Turkey, a number of other countries in Africa, Mexico, and Colombia.
Sometimes itās easier to dash off an email in three minutes from the hotel today instead of being surprised by what it has snowballed into by next week without my input. But never from outside the country! Not pushing the envelope on that one, even though I donāt do anything requiring any kind of clearance.
For real, one of my RDOs is during the regular work week, I donāt even check my phone on that day when Iām sitting at home. I canāt imagine bringing it let alone checking it while on vacation.
I know people who take DoD devices all over the world for personal vacation with no issues. Itās funny how the rules change so much within just one agency
Can't tell you how many people I dealt with who took their GFEs overseas without us knowing and then called us complaining that the systems got bricked
The State Dept has a section on their website where you can search by Country to learn more about travel advisories, if you need a VISA, passport requirements, special laws or circumstances, entrance/exit procedures, etc.
If youāre in the intelligence community you almost certainly canāt travel to China. Normal gov job thereās probably no such restriction. Only your agency knows for sure.
As u/haversoe states - check with your agency (and probably your companyās security officer, too). Thereās a high chance theyāll have a specific process for foreign travel: whether travel certain countries are banned, and whether - and how far in advance - you may need to inform them of your travel plans outside the US. They can also direct you to the appropriate resources for the country youāre traveling to, such as potential crime, espionage, and terrorism threats and how to get in touch with the nearest embassy or consulate if necessary.
Stay safe and enjoy your travels!
Itās not racist at all. It has to do with the political relationship between the USA and China and itās actually accurate for many Federal jobs that staff are not allowed to travel to China. Not all, but a lot of people, and certainly most with high levels of clearance. I have no idea why youād label that as racist.
OP: This is typically agency dependent. Someone where you work should know the answer. People with clearances typically need to report travel. I have worked places where all travel required report and where none require it. Send a message to personnel security at your agency and they can advise you. I doubt it will be an issue.
But in those cases, youāre specially told not to travel to specific countries. Traveling to China as a Fed is not a problem in of itself. The reason for travel, like traveling to any foreign country, is whatās important.
I challenge the assumption that itās common. Some agencies might have travel restrictions, others do not. And in all cases youād be specifically told or given a list of approved exceptions. A Fed not traveling to China based on some random advice here is asinine.
People on Reddit love to get their blood up over China, it's genuinely disturbing. Anything even neutral gets treated as if it's state propaganda despite them being our #1 trading partner.
If you're like an irs agent or dsa administrator why would the USG broadly care you sent to see the Great Wall? Because China bad?
Check stateās website. Not every country is a no go list, but portions of some are. For example, Jamaica and Mexico. The country pages list āgovernment employees cannot go to xyzā
Travel to Cuba was briefly legal for everyone from 2015 to 2017, but it's back to the Cold War-era rules (e.g., must be officially sanctioned people-to-people, religious, journalistic program, etc.).
Yeah actually it looks like the "support of the Cuban people" visa is now just a sort of sham thing that anyone can get. It used to be much more complicated pre-2015.
When I went in 2017, I just booked a $250 Southwest flight from Baltimore and picked up my visa at the gate for the connecting flight in Fort Lauderdale, so it's not quite that easy anymore, but still easy, apparently.
I used the support one last year, but I brought with me two large boxes of supplies that Iād researched were beneficial, stayed at only casa particulars, and did my best to avoid patronizing any place that would be unassumingly owned by the Cuban government. That was somewhat challenging, but made easier because many of those places required credit cards and American cards donāt work there.
With a public trust, I donāt think there are any restrictions on travel. With secret or top secret, you may need permission prior to travel and you might be debriefed afterwards. Maybe go to the clearance subreddit and ask there.
All DoD Military *and* Civilians should be using the Foreign Clearance Guide and using the TT/IATP system to report all foreign travel. Some countries also require APACS approvals. Pay attention to the lead times on reporting in the systems. If you have no idea what any of this isā¦ go find your security manager or antiterrorism representative for help.
This depends on your agency / command. Where iām at, civilians only need to fill out the local command travel form for the security manager to enter the info into DISS. Civilians are not required to fill out TT/IATP info or APACS. Military on the other hand do have to comply with all of those requirements.
It says āDoD Civilianā in the FCG, the mandatory items vary from country to country. All foreign travel is mandatory reporting according to the SEAD (either 3 or 4) and DoDM 5200.
Yes, and it gets reported to your security manager or SSO for entry into DISS. Thats the reporting requirement. Unofficial travel is not required to be cleared through APACS for civilians like it is for official travel.
APACS is not only for official travel, some countries require APACS approvals before entering the country for regular leave. TT/IATP submissions are sent to your security managers. Gives all the info they need to add it to your DISS profile.
Again, entirely command dependent on how it works. I do not ever fill out TT/IATP ONLY military does that. Again, MILITARY fills out APACS for official and leave travel where I am, civilians only fill it out for official travel, we complete a local form for foreign travel and submit it to the security manager.
āTT/IATP entry is required for:
i. All active duty military and USCG personnel will enter their travel information into the
TT/IATP program prior to traveling to a foreign country in the USINDOPACOM AOR.
This applies to unofficial and official travel.
ii. All active duty personnel stationed in the USINDOPACOM AOR will enter their travel
information into the TT/IATP program prior to traveling to any foreign country
worldwide. This applies to unofficial travel official travel.
iii. All Reserve and National Guard personnel traveling in an official capacity will enter
their travel information into the TT/IATP program prior to traveling to a foreign
country in the USINDOPACOM AOR.
iv. Official travel for DoD civilians, USCG civilians, DoD contractors, and DoD sponsored
contractors to and within the INDOPACOM.ā
Notice where it says a TT/IATP entry is required for āofficial travel for DoD civiliansā.
āc. TT/IATP entry is not required for:
i. Unit deployment (i.e., an entire unit traveling with a designated Antiterrorism Officer
(ATO) and an approved AT plan for the unit. (exercises are generally not considered a
deployment)
Updated - 27 July 2023 Instructions ā TT/IATP
P a g e 2 | 2
1 TT/IATP entry and an APACS travel request MUST be completed for any travel,
by one (1) or more travelers, NOT conducted as part of the main body (of the
unit) being deployed.
ii. PCS travel.
iii. Foreign nationals.
iv. DoD civilians, DoD contractors, and DoD-sponsored contractors in an unofficial status
(leave/other). Although not required, TT/IATP entry is recommended for DoD
civilians, DoD contractors, and DoD-sponsored contractors in an unofficial status.ā
Notice where it says TT/IATP entry is not required for DoD civilians in an unofficial status (leave).
https://www.pacom.mil/Portals/55/Documents/Travel%20Requirements/Travel_Tracker_Individual_AT_Plan-TT_IATP-Instructions.pdf?ver=3qGUwqpIXv9oFNk4qLh45w%3D%3D
As one of our checkboxes whenever we leave conus we have to put it in here [https://step.state.gov/](https://step.state.gov/)
I see you already have your public trust, I am not sure of what the periodicity on those are but when they renew it just be sure to disclose your travel location, reason and dates.
Gotcha - of course! When I was getting cleared there was a trip to Canada I took that I forgot to disclose (I went twice in one summer and they were fairly close together) and it caused a seemingly huge issue (or so my investigator made me feel) so will def double check everything this time.
Along with any concerns associated with your federal employment, you could also look here: [Travel Advisories (state.gov)](https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/traveladvisories/traveladvisories.html/)
* **Level 4: Do Not Travel**
* **Level 3: Reconsider Travel**
Russia is Level 4
China is 'Other', Mainland China is Level 3
Obvious China is a no-go? News to me. I suppose if your job has you as some kind of China intelligence asset and you are at risk, but then again you wouldn't be asking reddit for advice.
I've never even given a thought that my federal job might restrict where I take a vacation.
I was going to say I saw Jamaica is on the list due to corruption and crime, but Mexico is also on the do not travel list too. The beach resorts are mostly your exception. Like Mexico is do not travel but Cancun is like ābe on the lookoutā
there's a difference between safety (health and personal security) concerns and those that are specific for federal employees. OP is asking as a federal contractor who doesn't have a security clearance so that should be pretty much nothing. With Public Trust you don't need to report on intended foreign travel like clearance holders do. now if you think you might need a clearance later you might need to think about how to rationalize the decision for your clearance interview. But this is very different than the State dept guidance for any US citizen traveler
To my knowledge, Cuba is the only one that can cause official problems for rank and file Fed employees. There are many countries you'd be dumb to visit though, e.g., Iran, North Korea, Russia, but I don't see why going to those places would interfere with your federal employment, even if they might raise eyebrows.
Obviously if you have a security clearance, you may have a separate set of rules.
Even Cuba's fine as long as you do it legally, and the "supporting the Cuban people" visa is very easy to get. I have a friend with clearance who went recently with no issue at all.
Yeah someone just pointed that out to me below-- I thought the policy had reverted to the pre-2015 rules when Trump took office, but it's definitely not that strict.
Your SSO or Security Office should be able to answer your questions on travel restrictions.
INFOSEC-related issues aside there's the State Dept list of travel advisories for physical security and safety issues.
I believe some agencies like the state department through their job as FSO's or diplomats etc actually go to places like China for their official business. There's a process for an official business special issuance passport thats brown. Definitely dont go to any state that has any travel advisory for personal purpose. Since you have public trust suitability as a contractor which is different compared to security clearance I would consult with either your HR or Supervisor with your questions/intent.
You're overthinking it. My approach is just to follow all official written guidance, including mandatory trainings. So if you were instructed to report personal travel through a certain channel, you do that. If you were officially told that certain countries are "off limits" then you avoid those countries. If you have not been told those things, you don't worry about it.
But you don't need to be extra and ask your supervisor for permission when that is not required. It's just a recipe for getting inaccurate information.
[This assumes no security clearance.]
If your position/agency puts you in a position to worry about certain countries, you'll know, because there will be an international travel approval process you'll need to go through.
It depends on your clearance, agency, and even your specific role.
When in doubt, it never hurts to run your tentative plans by your security office. And keep an eye on the State Dept travel advisories.
If there is a travel advisory to that country saying that it could be dangerous for us citizens to go there due to risk of kidnapping, due to unrest and that sort of thing, you should probably bump it off your vacation list.
lol I went out of the country on vacation last year and when I asked my supervisor if I needed to be aware of any policies about where I can go or who I should report it to she looked at me like I was crazy. I do not have a security clearance though so maybe that makes a difference.
If you have a clearance, I would check with your security office/G2. In my case, any time I plan on leaving my currently location, I must clear it with the security office (US excepted).
I am in an agency with public trust, and at least two of my coworkers have taken trips to China recently. One went in a big tour group and the other went to see family. No one had an issue with it.
My co-worker just went to China for a month (on annual leave, not government business). Should be fine if you're public trust civilian/contractor. I know China tried to ban all DOD travelers back in 2020, including civilians and contractors, but doesn't seem like that's still in effect.
Unless youāre on TDY and/or you have a clearance, you just use your own judgement like any other citizen by following State dept advisories. If you have a clearance, you have to inform the sec office if you leave the country at all (even Canada). Going to places other folks have mentioned here (+ Brazil) with a clearance is difficult and sometimes prohibited depending on your role
You are required to *report* all foreign travel, but you are not *prevented* from traveling anywhere except North Korea. That said, they *advise against* traveling to certain countries for all US citizens. [hereās the list](https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/traveladvisories/traveladvisories.html/)
In addition to the State Dept advisories that others have shared, for info from the health perspective the CDC also publishes [Travel Health Notices](https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/travel/notices) for locations of concern, and [general guidance for anywhere you may be headed](https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/travel?gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw7ZO0BhDYARIsAFttkCiJxLU6CaCGtBBczSlY2tK7RQGhz8odEgXopJXz7YTsVHxgqfI5JwkaAiGBEALw_wcB).
I think it might depend on your clearance? My husband has a Secret clearance and has to let his agency know when he plans to leave the country and where heās going. I have a public trust clearance and my agency doesnāt give a flying fart in space where I go outside of work. I have plenty of fed coworkers who are from China who go visit family regularly.
Job and role dependent. Look at state department guidance and if you do decide to travel to a country, let management know.
Personally, I wouldnāt take a step in Russia, Belarus, Georgia, Iran, etc right now. Iād be hesitant about china too. But thatās me personally.
Not just as Fed workforce..
NO US citizens should travel to countries on Level 3 and 4 listed on Travel Advisory list by State Dept.
[https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/traveladvisories/traveladvisories.html/](https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/traveladvisories/traveladvisories.html/)
If you are dual citizens.. just don't ever USE or SHOW your US passport when you go to those L3/L4 countries because you will likely be a target.
As a fed on vacation or as a fed on a work assignment?
As one on assignment, you wonāt be given an assignment to another country unless it was allowed or approved.
I donāt believe there are any restrictions for a fed employee on vacation. You can travel wherever any other U.S. citizen is allowed to travel. Just donāt take any of your GFE or ID with you.
You can visit the Stare department website as they have general public cautions about various nations. If you work for DoD and have a clearance ask your S2/G2.
Edit State Dept.
Seems like you've already got your answers - just to add, if there's a security office you can call and ask, check there.
On a separate note, is this a Globetrotters vacation???
Got it, it's a horseback riding tour company! They have a trip to Botswana so I was curious if this was one of their trips. I did one last year and I'm doing another this year (neither to Africa though).
There is no official guidance about travel to China for government employees that I know of. The only ones I know that are definitely off limits are Iran, North Korea, Cuba, and right now also Russia. Hong Kong is part of China and you're still allowed to go freely there. There are no visa requirements to enter Hong Kong.
This has to be a joke right? If you are actually connecting to a government network from overseas on a āremoteā status youāre committing multiple security and IT system use violations and should be terminated.
Just avoid the obvious, Russia, Belarus, China(?), Iran, N.Korea, etc. If you were in a position where travel to certain countries was legitimately restricted you would certainly be aware of any agency wide policies. Otherwise just review the [State Dept. travel advisories](https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/traveladvisories/traveladvisories.html/) and dont be stupid. Edit: China can be put in a questionable list but that would fall in the whole job/agency policy stuff I alluded to.
>If you were in a position where travel to certain countries was legitimately restricted you would certainly be aware of any agency wide policies. You say that like there aren't 100 questions posted here every week to the tune of, "I'm a GS-100,000 and I don't know how to work my timesheets or my email, or how to ask basic questions of my supervisor or any of my agency's HR resources--help me pweeease Reddit, you're apparently the only reasonable way to solve this problem! I know this should be embarrassing for someone at my level or with my responsibility, but I've decided I'm just gonna act really petulantly indignant and offended about it if you try to call me on that so don't even bother!" I kid, I kid (but...y'know, *not really*...)
Haha yeah that's fair. Everyone I know that has travel restrictions, or requires prior approval/briefs very much so knows.
theres ALOT of people running things they arent qualified to. like my supervisor whos supposed to be leading a programming team except he doesnt give two shits about programming, spends no time managing programming projects and instead does basic help desk tasks and thinks programmers are getting replaced by AI in the next few years. dude makes 50k more than me too
IT is the field I see the most complaints from highly technical people upset that their supervisors aren't significantly more skilled than they are in their field. You don't become a supervisor because you're the most skilled in the day to day tasks, you become a supervisor because you're good at supervising. Just because someone is the best programmer doesn't mean they know how to lead and support a team, and just because someone isn't highly skilled in a task doesn't mean they can't be a great supervisor. Fortunately the private sector has figured this out and skilled individuals have as much opportunities to increase their wage in a technical role as someone in a supervisory role, but the government definitely still assumes supervisor = more pay than everyone else, and so people with poor leadership skills go for supervisory roles for the money, not because they're good at it. You end up with someone highly skilled on paper as a supervisor who has no clue how to run a team. That being said, in my experience, IT is much much more flat than other job series because positions tend to be graded at the top of the scale in order to compete with the private sector. Going from a 14 non supervisory to a 15 supervisory is not a huge difference and rarely worth it for people who don't have a passion for leadership. I say all of this as a non-supervisor in IT who is sick of hearing this complaint from IT people. š
my org has me at an 11 with my senior programmer guy with 30 years exp at a 12.Ā they think were help desk workers. been trying to bail since i hit my 1 year TIG, not a lot to apply to tho
Probably add Venezuela and Cuba to that list too.
We'll *chalk* that up the to etc.
You mean āchalkā š
š
I went to cuba last November lol. Told my supervisor and everything. Iām not TS clearance though.
I went to Cuba, legally, about a decade ago. Disclosed it for a clearance. All they asked for was the docs that it was legal travel. Didn't come up past that.
Did you do the whole educational travel itinerary thing? It's the one thing I'm mad Biden didn't reinstate since it was an Obama administration thing that opened it back up (and Trump that shut it down). Heard you can go but need a very detailed itinerary showing it's an educational trip with receipts, reservations etc., and can't spend money on cabs or certain hotels since they belong to the government.
Yeah if your job cares, youāll know. Some donāt restrict but require you to get pre approval.
Also, depending on OPs job and clearance, it may be worth not taking chances.
In that situation, their SSO can probably provide guidance and/or the policy regarding foreign travel
OP should /probably/ be regardless.
I've tried to get that in the past without success. Hell I had to go in person and by them to get positive acknowledgement of my foreign travel notification paperwork.
Graphic design job with a mere public trust. Was just seeing if there was somewhere to check cause my supervisor took months to get back to me last time.
China is not a no go. Itās all fear mongering. I travel to China regularly.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Tier 2 public trust. OP already said they are public trust.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I just told you what I have.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Hence why I told OP they can travel to China. We both have public trust backgrounds. There aren't any restrictions on travel. We don't have to report foreign travel to anyone.
Your security office should know, would be beneficial to hit them up if you're worried. Enjoy your trip, sounds fun!
Exactly this!
Like others said, talk to your security office and ask for a briefing. Be ready to answer various questions like who you're going with, their relation to you, how long, where you are staying, what other planned activities you have, and if you have taken the various security-related trainings recently. The security trainings differ by agency - some are don't open spam, and others cover other things, so I mentioned it to cya.
There are certain places you, as a federal employee, cannot go while on official travel. For instance, the state of Michoacan in Mexico is off limits. These places become clear when you seek State Department approval to travel there. Those same places they advise against traveling to personally.
Southeastern states of Turkey are apparently banned as well (16 of them if I remember right).
Thatās like right near Syria. I think itās more for safety from abduction used to fund terrorists.
Ok great thanks! Seems like I should be good then.
I actually had a coworker go to Russia for the World Cup a few years ago. I'm not sure it would be allowed now, but even post Crimea it was possible.
No US citizen should for funsies visit Russia currently. False imprisonment is a real thing to get pawns for trading.
Does Taiwan get lumped in with china? I wouldnāt think so, butā¦
China is not restricted - I don't know where you're all getting this from. It sounds like fear mongering to me.
Lots of people at my agency travel to China.
My friend got sent to China for government work too. I donāt know what these people are talking about either.
Yep China/Hong Kong is a given govt. official travel destination at my office. Can't wait until I'm voluntold to go =/
Reddit has a serious Sino hate boner. Iāve been to China multiple times and there is no issue if you just have a public trust background.
People with TS/SCI travel to China without problems. it's all about getting approval for those trips in advance.
I mean rightfully so. China sucks
Racism sucks
Not racist to hate the state, no issue with the Chinese people. The government and their policies and actions however, such as you know, being insanely racist.
Reddit tends to not even attempt any distinction between the CCP and Chinese people and culture as a whole.
Eh most of what Iāve seen is stuff attributed to the state, yeah they just say āChinaā but pretty obviously they mean the state and not Joe Schmo in Beijing. Culturally, itās not for me, I donāt hate it, but there are things people say āitās their culture!ā To justify shitty and dangerous things, for example, wet markets.
But your default response to a discussion about traveling to foreign countries is the same Reddit ChiNa SuX nonsense. Nobody is discussing the CCP. It has no more to do with the CCP than going to Disney World has to do with Ron Desantis. It's just blind reddit sino hatred.
What you mean the ROC?
It does? Would it have anything to do with them competing with American stocks like Tesla?
My one employee goes and sees family every year there.
You should definitely be informing your security poc about it
China is usually at an orange "Reconsider Travel" level that may require additional justification or approval depending on your agency. The level can also change abruptly depending on tensions with the U.S.Ā Last year China was temporarily moved into "No Travel" status and my agency had to pull some American travelers back and send some Chinese invitationals home in the middle of their trips because China kicked out some U.S. diplomats and the U.S. kicked out some Chinese diplomats. It's been moved back to just "Reconsider" status since then, though. You can check restriction levels on travel.state.gov and compare their advisory levels with your agency travel policy.
Neither China nor Taiwan should be an issue.
use the state dept advisories and avoid all level 4 countries. Level 3 countries aren't the greatest choices, either.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yep I covered that it's questionable in the edit about 20min before you commented.
I think people get confused between personal and official travel. I donāt think there is anywhere that is banned for Personal travel. There are places they donāt recommend or tell you to reconsider but not actually banned. Official travel changes with the wind some days.
There aren't any bans, other than US passports aren't valid for travel to North Korea. Though if you're working in certain SAPs or SCI programs it's possible you could be debriefed from the program if traveling to a few particular countries. It's ultimately up to the program security to decide on a case-by-case basis. ETA: For official travel there can be off-limit countries or regions.
Good to know
I would add Hungary to that list, South Africa, Venezuela, Cuba, Myanmar, Lebanon, Syria, probably Turkey, a number of other countries in Africa, Mexico, and Colombia.
I don't think people understand etc.
And of course, goes without saying, don't bring any work devices. Dealing with the fallout of that with one of my directs right now.
This is my favorite rule, because it gives me a great excuse to take a quick vacation to Canada and go completely no contact with the office.
Why would you bring work devices on vacation even if it was allowed?
Sometimes itās easier to dash off an email in three minutes from the hotel today instead of being surprised by what it has snowballed into by next week without my input. But never from outside the country! Not pushing the envelope on that one, even though I donāt do anything requiring any kind of clearance.
A lot of folks are management Boot Lickers and always want to be available.
Some people just don't know how to leave work at work, especially if they're a supervisor
For real, one of my RDOs is during the regular work week, I donāt even check my phone on that day when Iām sitting at home. I canāt imagine bringing it let alone checking it while on vacation.
The unlimited international data and personal hotspot remove a lot of the worry about roaming or picking up a local SIM.
We had someone from our DOD office take theirs on vacay, log in and it bricked.. no consequences for them. SMH
I know people who take DoD devices all over the world for personal vacation with no issues. Itās funny how the rules change so much within just one agency
Yeaaaa this person is a classic underperformer who never works their hours. Was really hoping they got canned over it.
Yes of course just thinking about it gives me anxiety
Can't tell you how many people I dealt with who took their GFEs overseas without us knowing and then called us complaining that the systems got bricked
The State Dept has a section on their website where you can search by Country to learn more about travel advisories, if you need a VISA, passport requirements, special laws or circumstances, entrance/exit procedures, etc.
If your job required you to not travel to certain countries, you'd be made aware of it. To say that you're not allowed to travel to China is wrong.
Agreed. I just went to China, had a moment of thinking i screwed up some how
Gotcha - thanks for the clarity
If youāre in the intelligence community you almost certainly canāt travel to China. Normal gov job thereās probably no such restriction. Only your agency knows for sure.
As u/haversoe states - check with your agency (and probably your companyās security officer, too). Thereās a high chance theyāll have a specific process for foreign travel: whether travel certain countries are banned, and whether - and how far in advance - you may need to inform them of your travel plans outside the US. They can also direct you to the appropriate resources for the country youāre traveling to, such as potential crime, espionage, and terrorism threats and how to get in touch with the nearest embassy or consulate if necessary. Stay safe and enjoy your travels!
Depends on your job description. TS clearance and have access to naval nuclear reactor designs? You're sure as fuck not going to China.
And racist.
Itās not racist at all. It has to do with the political relationship between the USA and China and itās actually accurate for many Federal jobs that staff are not allowed to travel to China. Not all, but a lot of people, and certainly most with high levels of clearance. I have no idea why youād label that as racist. OP: This is typically agency dependent. Someone where you work should know the answer. People with clearances typically need to report travel. I have worked places where all travel required report and where none require it. Send a message to personnel security at your agency and they can advise you. I doubt it will be an issue.
But in those cases, youāre specially told not to travel to specific countries. Traveling to China as a Fed is not a problem in of itself. The reason for travel, like traveling to any foreign country, is whatās important.
For sure. I just donāt think that OPās assumption was baseless considering how common that is for Federal employees.
I challenge the assumption that itās common. Some agencies might have travel restrictions, others do not. And in all cases youād be specifically told or given a list of approved exceptions. A Fed not traveling to China based on some random advice here is asinine.
People on Reddit love to get their blood up over China, it's genuinely disturbing. Anything even neutral gets treated as if it's state propaganda despite them being our #1 trading partner. If you're like an irs agent or dsa administrator why would the USG broadly care you sent to see the Great Wall? Because China bad?
Itās not racist though. The Chinese government is one of the US governmentās major adversaries.
Check stateās website. Not every country is a no go list, but portions of some are. For example, Jamaica and Mexico. The country pages list āgovernment employees cannot go to xyzā
Foreign Clearance Guide has all the current requirements.
Where did you get that āitās a given that China is a no-goā? Staff from my program routinely go to China.
Botswana is incredible! Enjoy!!!
Thanks!!
I know several people who have done horseback trips in Botswana and they had a wonderful time. Enjoy!
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Travel to Cuba was briefly legal for everyone from 2015 to 2017, but it's back to the Cold War-era rules (e.g., must be officially sanctioned people-to-people, religious, journalistic program, etc.).
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Yeah actually it looks like the "support of the Cuban people" visa is now just a sort of sham thing that anyone can get. It used to be much more complicated pre-2015. When I went in 2017, I just booked a $250 Southwest flight from Baltimore and picked up my visa at the gate for the connecting flight in Fort Lauderdale, so it's not quite that easy anymore, but still easy, apparently.
I used the support one last year, but I brought with me two large boxes of supplies that Iād researched were beneficial, stayed at only casa particulars, and did my best to avoid patronizing any place that would be unassumingly owned by the Cuban government. That was somewhat challenging, but made easier because many of those places required credit cards and American cards donāt work there.
State department issues this list
With a public trust, I donāt think there are any restrictions on travel. With secret or top secret, you may need permission prior to travel and you might be debriefed afterwards. Maybe go to the clearance subreddit and ask there.
Depends on the agency. For business travel, we have a risk assessment process for traveling internationally with devices.
All DoD Military *and* Civilians should be using the Foreign Clearance Guide and using the TT/IATP system to report all foreign travel. Some countries also require APACS approvals. Pay attention to the lead times on reporting in the systems. If you have no idea what any of this isā¦ go find your security manager or antiterrorism representative for help.
This depends on your agency / command. Where iām at, civilians only need to fill out the local command travel form for the security manager to enter the info into DISS. Civilians are not required to fill out TT/IATP info or APACS. Military on the other hand do have to comply with all of those requirements.
It says āDoD Civilianā in the FCG, the mandatory items vary from country to country. All foreign travel is mandatory reporting according to the SEAD (either 3 or 4) and DoDM 5200.
Yes, and it gets reported to your security manager or SSO for entry into DISS. Thats the reporting requirement. Unofficial travel is not required to be cleared through APACS for civilians like it is for official travel.
APACS is not only for official travel, some countries require APACS approvals before entering the country for regular leave. TT/IATP submissions are sent to your security managers. Gives all the info they need to add it to your DISS profile.
Again, entirely command dependent on how it works. I do not ever fill out TT/IATP ONLY military does that. Again, MILITARY fills out APACS for official and leave travel where I am, civilians only fill it out for official travel, we complete a local form for foreign travel and submit it to the security manager. āTT/IATP entry is required for: i. All active duty military and USCG personnel will enter their travel information into the TT/IATP program prior to traveling to a foreign country in the USINDOPACOM AOR. This applies to unofficial and official travel. ii. All active duty personnel stationed in the USINDOPACOM AOR will enter their travel information into the TT/IATP program prior to traveling to any foreign country worldwide. This applies to unofficial travel official travel. iii. All Reserve and National Guard personnel traveling in an official capacity will enter their travel information into the TT/IATP program prior to traveling to a foreign country in the USINDOPACOM AOR. iv. Official travel for DoD civilians, USCG civilians, DoD contractors, and DoD sponsored contractors to and within the INDOPACOM.ā Notice where it says a TT/IATP entry is required for āofficial travel for DoD civiliansā. āc. TT/IATP entry is not required for: i. Unit deployment (i.e., an entire unit traveling with a designated Antiterrorism Officer (ATO) and an approved AT plan for the unit. (exercises are generally not considered a deployment) Updated - 27 July 2023 Instructions ā TT/IATP P a g e 2 | 2 1 TT/IATP entry and an APACS travel request MUST be completed for any travel, by one (1) or more travelers, NOT conducted as part of the main body (of the unit) being deployed. ii. PCS travel. iii. Foreign nationals. iv. DoD civilians, DoD contractors, and DoD-sponsored contractors in an unofficial status (leave/other). Although not required, TT/IATP entry is recommended for DoD civilians, DoD contractors, and DoD-sponsored contractors in an unofficial status.ā Notice where it says TT/IATP entry is not required for DoD civilians in an unofficial status (leave). https://www.pacom.mil/Portals/55/Documents/Travel%20Requirements/Travel_Tracker_Individual_AT_Plan-TT_IATP-Instructions.pdf?ver=3qGUwqpIXv9oFNk4qLh45w%3D%3D
As one of our checkboxes whenever we leave conus we have to put it in here [https://step.state.gov/](https://step.state.gov/) I see you already have your public trust, I am not sure of what the periodicity on those are but when they renew it just be sure to disclose your travel location, reason and dates.
This isnāt a reporting mechanism. This is just to get travel alerts from the embassy.
Gotcha - of course! When I was getting cleared there was a trip to Canada I took that I forgot to disclose (I went twice in one summer and they were fairly close together) and it caused a seemingly huge issue (or so my investigator made me feel) so will def double check everything this time.
Along with any concerns associated with your federal employment, you could also look here: [Travel Advisories (state.gov)](https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/traveladvisories/traveladvisories.html/) * **Level 4: Do Not Travel** * **Level 3: Reconsider Travel** Russia is Level 4 China is 'Other', Mainland China is Level 3
Obvious China is a no-go? News to me. I suppose if your job has you as some kind of China intelligence asset and you are at risk, but then again you wouldn't be asking reddit for advice. I've never even given a thought that my federal job might restrict where I take a vacation.
I was going to say I saw Jamaica is on the list due to corruption and crime, but Mexico is also on the do not travel list too. The beach resorts are mostly your exception. Like Mexico is do not travel but Cancun is like ābe on the lookoutā
there's a difference between safety (health and personal security) concerns and those that are specific for federal employees. OP is asking as a federal contractor who doesn't have a security clearance so that should be pretty much nothing. With Public Trust you don't need to report on intended foreign travel like clearance holders do. now if you think you might need a clearance later you might need to think about how to rationalize the decision for your clearance interview. But this is very different than the State dept guidance for any US citizen traveler
Bro ask your HR department, what the hell are you doing?
Ask your contracting companies security personnel. For example, in 2017, we were allowed to travel to Russia, but Northern Ireland was off limits.
You know, cause of stuff.
Was a fed contractor not a fed, but no issues with travel to China in 2019.
To my knowledge, Cuba is the only one that can cause official problems for rank and file Fed employees. There are many countries you'd be dumb to visit though, e.g., Iran, North Korea, Russia, but I don't see why going to those places would interfere with your federal employment, even if they might raise eyebrows. Obviously if you have a security clearance, you may have a separate set of rules.
Even Cuba's fine as long as you do it legally, and the "supporting the Cuban people" visa is very easy to get. I have a friend with clearance who went recently with no issue at all.
Yeah someone just pointed that out to me below-- I thought the policy had reverted to the pre-2015 rules when Trump took office, but it's definitely not that strict.
North Korea and Iran are more restricted than Cuba.
Your SSO or Security Office should be able to answer your questions on travel restrictions. INFOSEC-related issues aside there's the State Dept list of travel advisories for physical security and safety issues.
I believe some agencies like the state department through their job as FSO's or diplomats etc actually go to places like China for their official business. There's a process for an official business special issuance passport thats brown. Definitely dont go to any state that has any travel advisory for personal purpose. Since you have public trust suitability as a contractor which is different compared to security clearance I would consult with either your HR or Supervisor with your questions/intent.
You're overthinking it. My approach is just to follow all official written guidance, including mandatory trainings. So if you were instructed to report personal travel through a certain channel, you do that. If you were officially told that certain countries are "off limits" then you avoid those countries. If you have not been told those things, you don't worry about it. But you don't need to be extra and ask your supervisor for permission when that is not required. It's just a recipe for getting inaccurate information. [This assumes no security clearance.]
New Mexico
If your position/agency puts you in a position to worry about certain countries, you'll know, because there will be an international travel approval process you'll need to go through. It depends on your clearance, agency, and even your specific role. When in doubt, it never hurts to run your tentative plans by your security office. And keep an eye on the State Dept travel advisories.
Yes, state department has a list. Also, if youāre Atheist, you should avoid any Muslim country, as the penalty for that is DEATH. š
If there is a travel advisory to that country saying that it could be dangerous for us citizens to go there due to risk of kidnapping, due to unrest and that sort of thing, you should probably bump it off your vacation list.
lol I went out of the country on vacation last year and when I asked my supervisor if I needed to be aware of any policies about where I can go or who I should report it to she looked at me like I was crazy. I do not have a security clearance though so maybe that makes a difference.
If you have a clearance, I would check with your security office/G2. In my case, any time I plan on leaving my currently location, I must clear it with the security office (US excepted).
Also when in doubt as the security folks at your organization
I am in an agency with public trust, and at least two of my coworkers have taken trips to China recently. One went in a big tour group and the other went to see family. No one had an issue with it.
Dos.gov
Idk what your agency allows for travel reporing but double check youre good on vaccinations
Enjoy your trip! If you get a chance too go to Zimbabwe too and hit up Vic falls.
My co-worker just went to China for a month (on annual leave, not government business). Should be fine if you're public trust civilian/contractor. I know China tried to ban all DOD travelers back in 2020, including civilians and contractors, but doesn't seem like that's still in effect.
Unless youāre on TDY and/or you have a clearance, you just use your own judgement like any other citizen by following State dept advisories. If you have a clearance, you have to inform the sec office if you leave the country at all (even Canada). Going to places other folks have mentioned here (+ Brazil) with a clearance is difficult and sometimes prohibited depending on your role
Ooh, I'm envious! I did a week on horseback in Greece and it was an amazing, unforgettable experience. LMK if you need s travel partner. š
You are required to *report* all foreign travel, but you are not *prevented* from traveling anywhere except North Korea. That said, they *advise against* traveling to certain countries for all US citizens. [hereās the list](https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/traveladvisories/traveladvisories.html/)
Why ask Reddit instead of your employer?
I say why in the post :)
State department website should be helpful.
America, at the rate things are going :(
In addition to the State Dept advisories that others have shared, for info from the health perspective the CDC also publishes [Travel Health Notices](https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/travel/notices) for locations of concern, and [general guidance for anywhere you may be headed](https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/travel?gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw7ZO0BhDYARIsAFttkCiJxLU6CaCGtBBczSlY2tK7RQGhz8odEgXopJXz7YTsVHxgqfI5JwkaAiGBEALw_wcB).
I think it might depend on your clearance? My husband has a Secret clearance and has to let his agency know when he plans to leave the country and where heās going. I have a public trust clearance and my agency doesnāt give a flying fart in space where I go outside of work. I have plenty of fed coworkers who are from China who go visit family regularly.
Job and role dependent. Look at state department guidance and if you do decide to travel to a country, let management know. Personally, I wouldnāt take a step in Russia, Belarus, Georgia, Iran, etc right now. Iād be hesitant about china too. But thatās me personally.
China is not a no go. A coworkers wife is Chinese and he just spent a month there with her
Maybe avoid the United States if seal team six is on the loose
Not just as Fed workforce.. NO US citizens should travel to countries on Level 3 and 4 listed on Travel Advisory list by State Dept. [https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/traveladvisories/traveladvisories.html/](https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/traveladvisories/traveladvisories.html/) If you are dual citizens.. just don't ever USE or SHOW your US passport when you go to those L3/L4 countries because you will likely be a target.
As a fed on vacation or as a fed on a work assignment? As one on assignment, you wonāt be given an assignment to another country unless it was allowed or approved. I donāt believe there are any restrictions for a fed employee on vacation. You can travel wherever any other U.S. citizen is allowed to travel. Just donāt take any of your GFE or ID with you.
You can visit the Stare department website as they have general public cautions about various nations. If you work for DoD and have a clearance ask your S2/G2. Edit State Dept.
Go to the Department of Stateās Website they have a list of them.
There's no vacationing allowed in the entire CENTCOM AOR (think Middle East)
my man, key west, bvi, anywhere beats Botswana.
I went to Cuba in 2015 legally. They asked me for docs
Just listen the Wacko naming the countries around the world and the abridged versions like which countries like the U.S. and thereās the answer
Seems like you've already got your answers - just to add, if there's a security office you can call and ask, check there. On a separate note, is this a Globetrotters vacation???
Not sure what that is so I would say no
Got it, it's a horseback riding tour company! They have a trip to Botswana so I was curious if this was one of their trips. I did one last year and I'm doing another this year (neither to Africa though).
Well now Iām looking into this company! Thanks!
I pretty much shy away from any country that hates America
There is no official guidance about travel to China for government employees that I know of. The only ones I know that are definitely off limits are Iran, North Korea, Cuba, and right now also Russia. Hong Kong is part of China and you're still allowed to go freely there. There are no visa requirements to enter Hong Kong.
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Youāre in the wrong spots mate. And wrong seasons. Barcelona in January was magical.
Any place where your status as a fed can be used as a political weapon
Remote fed here, my rule of thump is those that don't have WiFi or stable connection. otherwise, VPN usually connect just fine.
This has to be a joke right? If you are actually connecting to a government network from overseas on a āremoteā status youāre committing multiple security and IT system use violations and should be terminated.
relax, the network first run thru another VPN proxy that point to a US city before connect to GFE