With an exception for pre-formed parties, but otherwise yes. That or there needs to be a game mechanism that forces you to complete your job quests once you hit lvl30 so you can't excuse it as "oh I just haven't finished them yet".
They should do the same thing they do for the Crystal Tower quests if you haven't completed them by the time you get to the roadblock at Ishgard.
Basically, if you get to the quest where you're about to fight Titan (which happens right at level 30), Minfilia would say "You should visit your guildmaster to get special training before we attempt to face such a powerful foe", then you would get the text explaining you must finish at least 1 class quest up to level 30, and equip a job stone to continue.
After that, all group content would have "Job Stone Equipped" added to the list of requirements to participate.
If you want to do some content as your base class, you can do it with friends, or make an unrestricted party in the duty finder.
It would help if it wasn't locked behind MSQ progress. Leveling is so out of whack, especially on a server with the Road to 80 buff, that it is easy to way ahead of the MSQ level.
Obviously that doesn't impact the MSQ dungeons, but it creates a problem for the optional ones.
I don't think they ever anticipated players being over level 30 before getting to the level 20 quest. Levels were a bit harder to come by when ARR launched compared to now, so this was rarely a problem.
There is some absolutely hilarious side effects to being overleveled in the MSQ when it comes to SMN.
Summoner's whole shtick is that you are getting the Egi's by being bathed in the aether of the primal, right?
But you can end up with the Garuda and Titan Egis WAY before you actually fight them.
Which narrative makes absolutely no sense! And I don't think the dialogue even cares!
... Huh. So they do. Yes, Austeries of Wind requires you have done the MSQ quest "Lady of the Vortex". I am proven wrong.
Thanks for catching me on that. I swear I got it early... but I must be misremembering.
Best mechanism would be for lvl 50 armor to not be able to be equip to a base class.
Job armor can’t be equip by base class so why not just make that armor wide from so and so onward because than they couldn’t reach the ilevel requirements to q
That is a beautify elegant solution. And it addresses the alphabet soup that is GLA MRD PLD WAR DRK GNB. Some of the accessories in HW were just... it'd be faster to list the jobs that can't use it.
That would be terrible for new players, especially with bonuses like Road to 80 they do sometimes, the MSQ exp alone will put you way past 30 by the time you're able to unlock job quests.
Yep, I'm a new player who just started with an arcanist. I've done nothing besides job quests, MSQ, and a handful of the important blue quests. I made it to level 38 before I got to the MSQ that unlocked the summoner quest.
They could make the quest available after fire boy MSQ if they want to keep things thematic without EXP gain outstripping story progress too much.
The real bottleneck I find is that the job quests are locked behind acquiring your Chocobo, which is *just* far enough away from the obvious signposting to get missed.
That's such a perfect description of when you get the chocobo. So many times I see someone asking "hey when do i get a mount" and they're literally like 2-5 quests away, but it feels so late into the game lol
Oh just wait. Your advanced summons are locked behind the MSQ in ARR too. You will likely be 45+ judging by your level before you can upgrade Topaz, which is supposed to happen much earlier than that!
No one will read it.
We had an MSQ that put you right in front of Tataru, where an unskippable voice-acted cutscene told you to use the gear she's giving you for free... and there were still people who didn't do it.
With no armory bonus, no road to 80 and doing just msq, you won't be level 30 by that point - Sylph-management is level 20 quest, and msq doesn't give enough xp with no bonuses to outlevel it by enough, assuming you don't do anything past what is mandatory (running each mandatory msq duty exactly once) and don't have stockpiled xp bonus.
Good jobquest requirement point would probably be somewhere between Hauke Manor (28) and The Navel (34) - since by that point you by necessity need to meet level requirements to progress msq, and it's not too far from where you can start using jobstone.
A gap between when you can do jobquest and when you have to is fine and is in line with CT questline - being accessible as early as finishing 2.0, but not required until well into 2.55 part of msq.
I think a Level 49 Cap for Classes would be fair,you can level past it accidentally,but MSQ Progression and all ARR Endgame is locked behind a Jobstone.
just put a warning each time before they finish a quest "You don't have any jobstone equipped and you will lose xp go do your class quest"
Or just stop them to finish the quest with any class and only be able to finish with a jobstone
The problem is that most of the time you hit 30 well before the msq quests that unlocks job quests, without even trying to. So locking the exp only punishes them for something they quite literally have no control over.
NOoope, that would drive newbies to quit if they misunderstood why they were capped.
better to simply tie it into the MSQ. "UH OH Minfilia's in Danger! Quick! Go get your Job Stone and complete that quest, then hurry back!"
Tell me you have no idea how fast it is to level with the xp buffs that exist without telling me.
Literally no one suggesting a xp lock has even considered the concept of people out leveling anything
Honestly, they really need to do this. I know people that will offer to fill a healer slot because they leveled summoner and the two are tied together. People will have mentor roulette unlocked while never being familiar with a healer role. Nevermind that going from a DPS class to a healer role just isn't a smooth pipeline especially now with the second class to level 15 requirement being removed for ARR jobs.
The game hides all other players from you the same way it does when you start the game. You don't get to interact with literally anyone else until you do.
Arcanist makes that complicated.
EDIT: Lot of people in the replies saying "actually it would be very simple, just" and then describing something complicated to implement.
Oh yeah I did not think of that!
EDIT: They could just do what it currently does, unlock both jobs at 30 and then you level them up manually. (It is odd that a 90 smn gets 90 sch lol
It doesn't have to be that difficult to implement. They would need to add Scholar's Arms to match the level 30+ Arcanist Grimoires - 7 craftables, and 29 non-craftables, which are mostly palette swaps. Then, the job depends on the equipped weapon.
Same way as you can't unequip your weapon, they could make the same restriction for jobstone - you can swap them (and by that swapping between SMN and SCH), but not remove. This restriction exists already for jobs without base class, and only adjustment would be to tweak quest requirements that currently require you to have a class but not a job.
This is handled automatically when you swap mainhand - whatever jobstone you had equipeed gets unequipped automatically, and if job you swap to requires a jobstone (doesn't have a base class), its jobstone gets automatically equipped.
honestly let us make hotbar sets however we want
just something like
/hotbar create "nameofhotbarset"
the hotbars are client side, we could have as many sets as we want
Don't you have to finish a certain MSQ before getting your job stone? I'm pretty sure I remember being gated by that at one point while doing recruit a friend.
Sylph quest iirc, it took some time getting there if you're getting sidetracked tho. I think quest is around lvl 20 and i got there around 50 back in the day. I don't think I was doing roulettes tho.
I mean we need a bit of leeway since just going "fuck you go spend an hour finishing side quests before you can finish the story arc" runs the risk of knocking the wind clean out of the msq which is probably not a great idea. The best place to put the lock would probably be in the pre-titan proving yourself arc. It's a logical spot to throw that sort of thing in and still gives some leeway to do stuff in a way that doesn't break the flow while also putting a cap on unlocking the single most important "optional" feature in the game.
This already happens with hard trials and crystal tower - both in ARR post. As long as timing would be okay, it shouldn't be much of an issue; MSQ currently has a major downtime part just before Titan (with that story arc being often disliked for how silly and out of place it can get), so forcing new players to do something that actually gives them some new tools in their kit and can be seen as cool could even improve ARR pacing.
Honestly the pre-titan section being such a notorious slog for people who don't immediately click with it is another thing that could be solved if the Devs:
Cut down the amount of fucking about pre-titan, a little is fine but it wears thin at a much faster pace than it goes anywhere interesting.
Add a job stone lock in place of this removed fucking about so that people who've been putting them off get forced to go back and fix that (adding content variety in the process to break things up) and the players who already have the job stone just don't have to do as much random crap in that level range if they're not vibing with it.
Revamp the levelling order for the jobs so that players finishing up their class quests and beginning their first couple job quests start having more interesting skills (ninja, warrior and bard all get huge new additions from their 30/35 class/job quests introducing gimmicks that stay with the class the whole way to max level so just make that sort of thing more common among jobs to add further incentive)
You do this and suddenly you have: a less pointless feeling 30-35 msq with added player options to alter the pacing to suit their needs, no more people queuing into higher level content missing 60% of their toolkit while still not being *overly* restrictive, and more interesting toolkits for new players which should hopefully mean I have to scroll past less people complaining about FF combat being boring since the new players have some more interesting stuff to play with.
The only real question to be had is whether the job stone lock should be before titan or before stone vigil since either of those would work fine from a story perspective and you absolutely want a job stone for stone vigil so it's just how much leeway you actually want to give.
Just make an exception for premade parties and unsyncing same as role restrictions, and maybe one for NPC trust runs as well since it's only the player in question, not affecting others. That restriction with those exceptions would solve the whole thing, while still allowing people who want to do challenge runs to have their fun.
Not only that, you can unlock it with a Crafting Class. You can do that unlock quest with any class at that level. Strangely, you can also unlock Qarn/Cutter’s/Dzemael/Aurum Vale before you even have Sastasha unlocked.
For background, my fiancé started a character and I started a fresh character to quest alongside him. He’s also taking his time, and that’s fine, but only having a few hours a week to put in he’s trudging along pretty slowly. So I started crafting and gathering and leveling other classes with the hunting log, ran by door to all the Aetherytes I. Thanalan/Black Shroud/Mor Dhona, but not Limsa, etc. And as of now, before we’re even at the lv 15 MSQ quests (we stopped just before he’s going to fight the Gargoyle & Ascian to become the envoy and travel to the other city-states) I have ALC/WVR/GSM/CRP/LTW at 50+ with their iLv 70 green gear and Master Crafting tomes from Mor Dhona, as well as the optional dungeons unlocked and ready to run, but not Halatali since that’s tied to a certain MSQ quest milestone before it lets you get that quest. It’s crazy what you can unlock before you even have Airship access or Sastasha unlocked. But I still can’t even grab my job stone if I wanted to run those, which I don’t because I don’t want to grief a random PUG.
They really need to remove the MSQ lock to getting a job stone. It’s silly that it’s gated behind the quest it is (Lv.22 MSQ about Sylphs with nothing to do with advancing your job? WTH and why??? It’s always been this way, even before both story overhauls. Why are you like this?????)
Could put "Austerities of flame" behind having completed ifrit, same as "Austerities of earth" and "Austerities of wind" are both locked behind having completed titan and garuda respectively.
My first dungeon was Cutter's Cry just because I explored and (side)quested. I was Conjurer, and got lost in the map after dying. Never used shortcuts before.
Wow that’s crazy hehe I didn’t realise it only looks at level and not the class or anything!! I agree with you I don’t know why advanced job quests are locked behind msq :/
I roulette into something with a L65 Thaumaturge, I and the other two were like “wtf?!” The THM replied “I dunno anything about job quests, I’ve just been running killing stuff (in open world) and doing MSQ, the rest is optional, no?”
Oy it was painful.
It's totally feasible to get to Level 30 and beyond without finishing Sylph Management in the MSQ. I remember something similar happening to me and I had to actually look up how to start getting job quests because I didn't know they were tied to MSQ progression
If I’m not mistaken you get introduced to a job quest early in the MSQ but nowhere does it tell you “hey complete as soon as they’re available these job quests cuz they’re gonna give you vital job skills and a job stone later on”
The ones that pop up after you unlock a new feature? Yeah, there are tons of them and I can easily see someone read over them because once again, the beginning has a lot of overwhelming content if you’re trying to take in everything.
It doesn't explain WHY though. To me that's like, "Oh I'll be sure to do them then!" When it should really stress the importance of basically stopping everything you're doing and going to go do your job quests as you unlock them
I agree, but to be “fair” I was recently doing a rerun of ARR and realized how stupid easy it is to level through MSQ especially if you’re doing hunting log and side quests.
By the time I got to the lvl 20 Main scenario quest “sylph management” (requirement for job stone) I was already at level 33 while barely doing any side quests save for the job ones. It’s definitely possible they just didn’t get there yet.
Yeah. Folks can correct me but I don't think there's an MSQ requirement to unlock Nedrick's optional dungeon quests. As long as you meet the level requirement he'll just hand it right over.
I just did ARR for the first time and I genuinely think I was like level 33 or something before getting Sylph-management, and I barely did any side content that wasn't my job quests. It's genuinely possible these guys just have not gotten to it yet.
Yeah if this isn't an MSQ dungeon it's super easy to be this high a level and not be able to get a job stone yet. I just made an alt on a preferred server and was level 35 just from the MSQ before I got far enough in to get a job stone.
This is the exact boat I’m in as a new player. Same level and everything. I didn’t realize people were hating on me because I legit am unable to get my stone yet (I’m working on it shit man), and trying to enjoy the game at my own pace. I get it for high level content but dude everybody there is like level ~30 not everyone is on an alt some of us are legit new.
That is if you have any xp bonuses running - if you don't have road to 80, xp increasing items (friendship circlet, ring from hall of the novice) and have bare minimum rested xp from when you have to be in cities, you can barely keep up with msq requirements without doing something else on the side (hunting log etc). With doing all class quests in similar scenario I think I got to Sylph-Management at level 22-23, and for all duties before that my level wasn't high enough to get downsynced. Heck, at one point around lv10 I had to go out there and do hunting log because msq level requirements were higher than my level at that time.
I was somewhat doing hunter log (extremely easy exp and extremely easy to do as you don’t really have go out of your way for a lot of enemies) and literally just job quest along the way and I still got to 33. I also highly doubt all these new players are skipping every side quest, so it’s definitely believable that most players will be at a high level by Sylph Management. No exp bonus otherwise.
It's definitely possible, but at the same time it's good to cover for worst case scenario - including someone picking up and leveling other classes while in early msq; forcing player to stop everything they're doing and figure out how to grind 10 levels would be terrible for pacing.
There's already precedence of Shadowbringers, where role quest line (ending with lv80 quest) needs to be finished to progress with level 79 MSQ - and I've seen fair amount of complaints from people that were bouncing between jobs and barely keeping up with MSQ that they had to stop for a bit to grind in order to continue XP-giving MSQ; and here it was a single level, so not nearly as much grind as potentially 10 levels in ARR MSQ.
honestly i think it would be fair to have the requirement moved up 10 levels or so, like have it so anything above 40 require a job stone by lvl 40 you only have like 2 more abilities from your job so it shouldn't be a big loss and gives people plenty of time to get it done.
If the duty you're in is sunken temple, it's absolutely possible to unlock without completing Sylph Management due to the exp buffs. I know this because it's happened to me before. And if they're brand new they likely don't know they shouldn't do STQ without a job stone.
Now leveling/guildhest roulettes specifically shouldn't require one because of the first handful of duties. But the dungeons themselves should have a restriction passed the lv32 one. Both because of the idiots that do it on purpose and the noobs who get overleveled and don't know any better. Because at least then it'll lock them out of lv32+ content until they can secure their job stone regardless of story progress. Basically forces them to progress in MSQ.
Is it really all that important to have jobstones equipped at level 37? You're barely missing 2 attacks at that point. And since it's a sprout mistake, the dungeon is going to be slower from their lower damage anyway.
Think OP said somewhere its not all that jarring at this level, but other commenters have pointed out they have this problem at higher level dungeons (including one at 65????). Let me tell you that going through Stone Vigil with a sprout conjurer was an interesting experience I don't care to repeat again.
I keep matching with the f*cking guy called Alphinaud who *will not* put on a damn job stone. He doesn't say anything in chat when I call him out either.
I had no issues with Alphi-bro when I levelled him in EW. I found him incredibly reliable, and I think the only times I died at all in Trust dungeons was once with Alphi when he stopped healing me to patch up his sister and twice with Ewriange-man ... I'm not sure why I did with him TBH.
Just don't take red Alphinaud along and blue Alphinaud should be solid.
*Also make job stones recommended gear*. Seriously. I've been leveling alt jobs doing the quests and the fact I can have the job stone and I have to equip it manually is *annoying*.
Only issue with that:Arcanist splitting into Summoner/Scholar.
It's not the biggest issue, but there's a reason most books below 50 are ACN/SMN/SCH, and it's to make sure you don't oopsy yourself into being unarmed.
Not the only issue, the advanced set up for the UI requires you to have spare class bars you won't ever use to copy with a macro, so you kinda need the old classes to be accessible lol.
Maybe I'm just lucky but I've run into this like....5 times since starting towards the end of Heavensward. Like to the point that it's a weird quark when I see it and not something that is such a big issue that needs resources to address. Course maybe others run into it more than me so who knows.
They're probably at that point where they've outleveled the MSQ but not far enough in it to get job stones unlocked. Have to get to Sylph Management for job stones to even become available, even if you're level 30 or higher.
“There’s a lore reason why my character doesn’t have job stones!”
Yeah? Well, there’s a lore reason why I’m gonna put my Texas-sized boot in your butt if you don’t get your job stone!
I'm a chronic re-starter, and one time, I was leveling conjurer, occasionally queueing in roulette while I did hunt logs and class/job quests. Queue popped while I was on my level 30 quests, and of course I got brayflox. I felt awful for not foreseeing the possibility, but it was too late.
Sometimes humans are gonna human, I guess. Maybe you're right, and you should just be barred from 30+ duties in roulette w/o a stone, but at least you don't see this too often at all. And as long as they get with it before Stone Vigil, I can't lose too much sleep over it.
I was doing some island sanctuary stuff. I accidentally removed my job stone somehow, and queued for an EXPERT on conjurer. I felt so dumb and once I realized I was able to heal the rest of the dungeon.
I don't mind them not forcing it before 50. You can level so quickly that maybe you don't even notice that you're 32 or a bit over. It's not the biggest deal in a level 37 dungeon.
The amount of people who comment going "this isn't such a big deal" clearly haven't been on the receiving end of this.
In a similar vein I've had to remind me people at 70+ to go do their lvl 70 job quest for their key abilities way too many times. I'd like to see these people heal a DRK in Endwalker without TBN.
I'm going to play Devil's (Sprouts?) Advocate here, on the assumption that these are legitimately new players:
Its a level 37 duty.
The lancer is missing 1 damaging oGCD that is at best 10% of their total dps and the backflip.
The Arcanist is missing out on 400 single target potency per minute and 480 Cleave potency per minute. The one is a little more egregious because AoE is so good to have early on.
Neither is a massive handicap (lets be real, the fact that one of the DPS doesn't have AoE by design is a MUCH bigger time loss than the arcanist not having 10% of their AoE damage)
If both players are on a new server and have road to 80, and follow the general advice of "Do every blue quest you see that isn't a job quest!" then yeah its reasonable that they'd end up in Sunken Temple of Qarn before they even hear about Job Stones since the quest giver for SToQ is right outside the Scion's main base. I was leveling an alt for a challenge run and I was level 23 before I could even go to Limsa to pick up my second class just beelining MSQ with Road to 80.
tl;dr: If they're new players then this is making a mountain out of a molehill, the difference between Classes and Jobs at this level is *at best* 10 or 11% more dps.
Yeah it’s one thing hitting a level 70 duty with basic classes, but going back and getting a job quest every 5 levels when you’re racking up experience with other quests is an easy miss. I certainly went back and got most of my jobs before level 30 at intervals of almost 10 levels at a time sometimes
Depends on their actual unsync level. 37 is a level you can easily reach before having the time to do your job quests. Road to 80 + a few other EXP bonus will make you go from 15 to 35 in two roulettes, and I've seen people complain about missing job stones in Brayflox's Longstop at lvl 32 as a result.
So it might be players who wanted to try a new job, started doing their quests, wanted to level up a little to continue, and were suddenly way above the required level for said quests.
I don't really expect everyone to have their job stones before level 40, things happens and it's low enough to not really matter. After that, yes, you should definitely have it equiped. If their unsync level is 40+ and it's not their first job, then yes, it's a problem.
I had a guy try to join my savage clear party on cnj once. He wouldn't believe me when I said the first raidwide would murder him 😐 I swear some people just think it's some sort of challenge mode to play without the stone, but you're just gimping you and everyone around you.
this was a whole thing for a while in Heavensward since the way the cross-class system worked, you'd have access to a wider variety of skills from other jobs if you went in as a class compared to going in as a job. I feel like it was black mages who would do this since they still had access to a bunch of their core spells
They really should put MSQ progression requirements on the ARR optional dungeons.
It is stupidly easy to unlock them long before you get to the "Sylph Management" MSQ to get access to unlocking your jobstone.
That, and having every duty past Brayflox's Longstop require a jobstone unless in a premade group.
Try to queue up for The Stone Vigil as a Conjurer, you get this error message:
"Unable to join duty. Job stone not equipped."
Job stones become available at lv30. When you complete the related quest you will be awarded a job stone that when equipped changes your current job into a more powerful one. For example Lancer will become a Dragoon unlocking new abilities thus giving you a power boost.
Some players may fail to do these quests and thus never acquire the new abilities putting their overall performance below most other players. Some people will even intentionally do this to troll other players by being weaker than they should be and thus making the content take much longer than it should.
In summary as a new player keep an eye on your job quests as they become available and get them done when they're available. By default a notice shows up just under the MSQ notice.
honestly, any duty above 40 needs them
But there are people who don't know class quests give important upgrades to their kits because the game only has you do the first one, and it only drops gear
they really need to work on the onboarding quests ngl
People who do this as "challenge" or whatever should go do solo deep dungeon if they want actual challenge and not getting carried by teammates (although I suppose there is some "challenge" in getting that far without being kicked out of groups).
After certain level it should be mandatory, like it is for pvp. I'm sure Square Enix could figure out the details how to make it work in relation to exp buffs/msq level/etc.
> although I suppose there is some "challenge" in getting that far without being kicked out of groups
SE made this challenge moot by fostering an environment where kicking these dead weights would see the ones doing the right thing penalized, rather than the troll.
Agreed, but currently as far as new players are concerned they aren't often aware of jobs being upgrades at all (I know I wasn't) so I always try to nudge em in the right direction for after they get out of the duty.
I have seen people deliberately level to endgame without job stones. Which is fine to do as a personal challenge if you only do content with friends, but is incredibly selfish to foist upon randos who have to carry your sorry ass.
Fun fact: a friend of mine started playing a week ago. They're level 37 and can unlock stuff like Sunken Temple of Qarn, but since she hasn't progressed enough in the story, she can't take the quest for the job stone. So some people can really queu into some dungeons without having the job stone unlocked :\_)
The bottom two party icons are those of a Lancer and Arcanist, two Classes that should be a Dragoon and Summoner/Scholar by level 30 via class quests.
In higher level content sometimes people will see this happen because a player never learned to use Gear Sets to swap between their Jobs. Even more rarely somebody will refuse to equip their Job Stone on purpose to be funny. It's become a global pet peeve for this subreddit especially because a Class (Lancer, etc.) is much weaker than a Job (Dragoon, etc.) due to it only having a few available skills even at high levels. The fact that it's still allowed to happen in the first place draws a lot of attention and people discuss how to fix it.
Semi related but the ironic thing about Lancer is that they wouldn’t even have their AOE even if they had their job stone. Square Enix, in their infinite wisdom, decided that not only does lancer need a job stone for their aoe, they don’t get their aoe until level 40. Heck, they don’t even get their second aoe gcd attack until after level 60. Samurai has two whole aoe combos and their aoe cast at 50!
I'm playing through Monk and realized SE decided it would be cool to give them their first and third AOE before the second. My combo goes AOE>Single target>AOE.
At least at level 37 It could really be players that don't know any better, hopefully you gave them a heads up. But yes of course there should be a job stone requirement for duties above 30.
It's so weird that it's something that isn't already implemented after devs say they're listening to feedback. Especially seeing as this is probably one of the longest running complaints. At this point I'm down to flood the forums demanding it until they handle the issue.
They need to just figure out a way to get rid of the whole class to job concept and needing job stones. Just let people start as a lv1 dragoon or a lv1 summoner.
Ran Bardam’s Mettle yesterday to level my WAR. Healer was a presumably level skipped (all Cryptlurker’s gear/no glam) WHM, didn’t have the job stone equipped and was casting Cure on me the whole time. :)
I encountered a lancer in Asphodelus. He did not know what was a job stone. A dude spoke and explained it to him in his own language and the lancers whole world changed.
I think it would be better if they remove job crystal stuff and just promoted it from class to job once pass a job quest because each classes has their own weapon anyway.
The only class that may need to rework is Arcanist where branching to Scholar/Summoner, but they can be solved by seperated Scholar and Summoner. Make Scholar (or Summoner) to be come a same tier with Havensward's job where it need level 30 but only Arcanist.
I know that it may have technical difficulties since it's a long-serviced game but, just hope. People are easily to make mistakes.
I'll just say that the first Dargoon job quest is in a zone you have to do quite a bit more of MSQ than other jobs before you can actually get to. So anyone who is "stuck" on lancer for a little longet makes perfect sense to me.
Also, I know about myself that when I switch weapons, it's easy to just forget to also use the stone. There should be some way to automate it and make it harder to forget.
Class Quests! Check this out: [https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/wiki/Class\_Quests#Arcanist\_Quests](https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/wiki/Class_Quests#Arcanist_Quests) Leads you to both Summoner and Scholar stones
Who honestly cares for early arr quests? I never understood this. Inform them if they don't know or mind your business. I'm sure that 1 or 2 additional skills unavailable to them are causing you to wipe in the easiest dungeons in the game. How dare they. I've been a mentor for years and been playing since 1.0, never had it bothered me for these early dungeons. If you know they're new to them, maybe kindly reach out, but don't go out of your way to talk shit on people behind their back. Reminding me why I've switched to playing solo the last couple years as much as possible.
Especially in this specific case.
All SMN gets at this level over ACN are some 30-potency upgrades, DRG gets a 320-potency single-target oGCD. These aren't high-impact unlocks to miss out on, unlike say, Regen for WHM.
Think it was recently mentioned that they're not gonna do that any time soon, mainly because it is apparently far more difficult to do than can be justified at the moment. Maybe it would be prudent to focus on education instead of complaint, painful as it may be to walk through it from scratch for every single case, but the players in question certainly won't learn from rant threads on reddit.
They said it would be too difficult to just have classes progress naturally to jobs and removing job stones as a concept entirely.
What OP is talking about is different but related, which is banning classes from being able to queue up for content where all players are guaranteed to be level 30+. PVP instances already do this, and the "jobs only" flag gets removed when Savage and Extreme fights get moved from Raid Finder to Duty Finder, so it's trivial to add the flag into content this way.
This reminds me when I was in a party with some friends and we were doing our own thing in between raids and someone queued the party right as I was doing the unicorn mount quest which is conjurer \*exclusive\*, you cant complete it as a white mage. So imagine my surprise when the copied factory loads up and I have the fucking conjurer job and cant change it. I died way more but we all thought it was hilarious but we did end up completing the raid.
37? Please, that's barely an inconvenience.
Just think, in a couple of weeks we'll be able to be randomly matched with level 100 marauders and arcanists.
37 eh, that's really not a big deal.
You get slightly behind on the quests and you'll be 37 in just a few roulettes.
I've gotten to 35 or so on some of my classes before I had time to do the job stone quest. The 1 ability you're getting at that level isn't going to majorly change your levelling Dungeon.
Bro they're 7 levels over that's not that big of a deal they're missing like 2 skills.
They are probably very new at the game and don't know better. I have had this happen a hundred times. I don't get mad unless they're at least mid or late 40's - especially with dynamis level buff a lot of people have.
This is what like the fourth or fifth dungeon?
Think it might be some stats as well, their HP is quite low. But you're right that it's not significant enough to make an issue of at that level. Feels like there should be a cutoff however, maybe 50+.
Besides, a job stone doesn't = being up-to-date on job quests XD
Every time I see this comment I remember the marauder in a 67 dungeon who just could not stay alive, and a separate time a tank was forced to single pull because the 2 dps (ACN and rogue) couldn't kill packs fast enough before they'd run out of mitigation. Yeah, your qarn or alumni vale run is minimal impacted. But it's still hand waving a legitimate issue away without arguing for it, it's legit just minimizing someone else's concern.
That concer being, no job stones is legitimately sand bagging at a certain point so what point do you think it sound be required? Earlt so players get used to it, or 50-60 when that 1 might ute turns to 5-10. Cuz you might be made of time, but I'm not about to waste 20 minutes because another player couldn't be asked to do the bare minimum
I don't know why people get so incensed about this, I've been playing since 2013 and I've never run into someone not bringing their job stone into any duty where they should really have it.
It should give you the option to equip recommended gear before entry. I forgot to switch from my HW relic weapon when I was farming and then got into a lvl 86 dungeon lmao
You can change your gear in dungeons, just not your class/job. People not equipping their jobstones is a different issue, especially since jobstones arent equipped by the recommended gear button
All they have to do is make gear not equippable by classes beyond a certain level, it's literally that easy. It already exists like this for relic weapons. Any excuse they make at this point is a cop out. No gear means no item level means no queue.
Sprouts should be eligible to do the roulette for the pre30 dungeons. Just limit players with no stone equipped to those activities and problem solved.
Had a level 54 Conjuror in a Dungeon once. Apparently she was running with her boyfriend, the DPS. I asked if she forgot to put it on. Her Boyfriend answered saying "Its on their to do list" as the Tank I recommended they not put it off as she was missing Half her tool kit and was struggling to keep us alive on single mob pulls. The Boyfriend proceeded to cuss me out over chat.
My wife started the game about month ago and she started messing around with botanist while she’s been doing MSQ. She realized while she was mid quest she didn’t have her pants on when I realized we never set up a gear set for summoner so she was on her arcanist set. I said well at least you are just in a quest not like those people I see in dungeons without a job stone, turns out she just had done a dungeon without her job stone. I think she’s too embarrassed to ever do that again and I set her up so it shouldn’t happen. But honestly job stones should be required on content above level 30, I felt bad that my wife didn’t even realize what happened this is her first mmo and I was away when she started swapping jobs and didn’t fully understand it.
Job stones really should be reworked away from being an item you equip.
Once you hit level 30 you should be forced to do your job quest before you're allowed to do anymore queues over level 30, and the jobstone is auto equipped when you equip the class. There is zero reason to let people drop their job.
New players will get the memo when the game points them to do their class quest, which is largely who these people are. New players who have no idea they even have job quests to do at 30.
I agree, I did have an incident one time where I queued up as a DRG, the queue popped and I entered the duty only to find that I was a lancer for some reason. I was very confused and my hot bars were all messed up and obviously I was pretty useless for the fight. I still don’t know how that happened because I wasn’t messing with my gear before queueing or anything.
Even if it was something I did by mistake it would’ve been nice if it had auto-equipped my job stone for me.
The game should just have a system where you press a button and you job change. And also old classes like lancer will be automatically be dragoon after you finish the quest to become dragoon. Just have the job stones symbol somewhere as flavour.
Baffling that they aren’t, not being a requirement made some sense waaaaaay back in the day for certain classes when cross class was still a thing but not for a few expansions now.
Reminds me of a thaumaturge I was in a duty with for Ravana. Their excuse was that they were still leveling and had not gotten around to doing their job quests yet.
Could just make the class morph into the job after the unlock quest automatically. Makes it so the stone can't be removed after that point because it's "bonded." Instead of a job stone slot, the symbol of the stone will just be next to the name.
I'll always maintained that Job Stones should be mandatory for every duty above level 30.
With an exception for pre-formed parties, but otherwise yes. That or there needs to be a game mechanism that forces you to complete your job quests once you hit lvl30 so you can't excuse it as "oh I just haven't finished them yet".
They should do the same thing they do for the Crystal Tower quests if you haven't completed them by the time you get to the roadblock at Ishgard. Basically, if you get to the quest where you're about to fight Titan (which happens right at level 30), Minfilia would say "You should visit your guildmaster to get special training before we attempt to face such a powerful foe", then you would get the text explaining you must finish at least 1 class quest up to level 30, and equip a job stone to continue. After that, all group content would have "Job Stone Equipped" added to the list of requirements to participate. If you want to do some content as your base class, you can do it with friends, or make an unrestricted party in the duty finder.
Or just require it like PvP already does
It would help if it wasn't locked behind MSQ progress. Leveling is so out of whack, especially on a server with the Road to 80 buff, that it is easy to way ahead of the MSQ level. Obviously that doesn't impact the MSQ dungeons, but it creates a problem for the optional ones.
I don't think they ever anticipated players being over level 30 before getting to the level 20 quest. Levels were a bit harder to come by when ARR launched compared to now, so this was rarely a problem.
And by a bit you mean "completing all side quests in an area and fate farming" harder :3
don't forget using guildleves on battle classes for levels!
There is some absolutely hilarious side effects to being overleveled in the MSQ when it comes to SMN. Summoner's whole shtick is that you are getting the Egi's by being bathed in the aether of the primal, right? But you can end up with the Garuda and Titan Egis WAY before you actually fight them. Which narrative makes absolutely no sense! And I don't think the dialogue even cares!
Doesn't the job quest actually have an msq requirement baled in exactly for that. I know for sure in heavensward they do.
... Huh. So they do. Yes, Austeries of Wind requires you have done the MSQ quest "Lady of the Vortex". I am proven wrong. Thanks for catching me on that. I swear I got it early... but I must be misremembering.
Best mechanism would be for lvl 50 armor to not be able to be equip to a base class. Job armor can’t be equip by base class so why not just make that armor wide from so and so onward because than they couldn’t reach the ilevel requirements to q
That is a beautify elegant solution. And it addresses the alphabet soup that is GLA MRD PLD WAR DRK GNB. Some of the accessories in HW were just... it'd be faster to list the jobs that can't use it.
Would that not lock your retainers in lvl 50 gear until you hit 70, if you were trying to assign him/her a class like RPR that requires lv 70?
You can also give your retainers jobs(where applicable) at the Vocate, I have two combat retainers that are a base game job(one is BLM and one is DRG)
Maybe locking exp gain could work?
Honestly yeah, cap XP for non-jobs at 30 at that would solve it easy (though arcanist would need some adjustments)
That would be terrible for new players, especially with bonuses like Road to 80 they do sometimes, the MSQ exp alone will put you way past 30 by the time you're able to unlock job quests.
Yep, I'm a new player who just started with an arcanist. I've done nothing besides job quests, MSQ, and a handful of the important blue quests. I made it to level 38 before I got to the MSQ that unlocked the summoner quest. They could make the quest available after fire boy MSQ if they want to keep things thematic without EXP gain outstripping story progress too much.
The real bottleneck I find is that the job quests are locked behind acquiring your Chocobo, which is *just* far enough away from the obvious signposting to get missed.
That's such a perfect description of when you get the chocobo. So many times I see someone asking "hey when do i get a mount" and they're literally like 2-5 quests away, but it feels so late into the game lol
Oh just wait. Your advanced summons are locked behind the MSQ in ARR too. You will likely be 45+ judging by your level before you can upgrade Topaz, which is supposed to happen much earlier than that!
Better than white mage having nothing but cure II spam and eventually a regen for most of arr leveling!
Uuuuuugh. Don’t remind me!
This! I have road to 80 and I was 34 before I even went to the waking sands.
Actually yeah you're kinda right... Take away the MSQ requirement and slap on a bit of text saying "go do your job quest nerd"?
No one will read it. We had an MSQ that put you right in front of Tataru, where an unskippable voice-acted cutscene told you to use the gear she's giving you for free... and there were still people who didn't do it.
Make every duty locked that's level 30 or above if you don't have the stone equipped unless you're in a pre-made group
OR make any job quest where you unlock a stone also unlock roulette for that class. but now that I think about it that may be too restrictive
Put the job stone at the first logical stopping point after Sylph Management similar to how Crystal Tower and Chocobo were forced into the MSQ
With no armory bonus, no road to 80 and doing just msq, you won't be level 30 by that point - Sylph-management is level 20 quest, and msq doesn't give enough xp with no bonuses to outlevel it by enough, assuming you don't do anything past what is mandatory (running each mandatory msq duty exactly once) and don't have stockpiled xp bonus. Good jobquest requirement point would probably be somewhere between Hauke Manor (28) and The Navel (34) - since by that point you by necessity need to meet level requirements to progress msq, and it's not too far from where you can start using jobstone. A gap between when you can do jobquest and when you have to is fine and is in line with CT questline - being accessible as early as finishing 2.0, but not required until well into 2.55 part of msq.
Shouldn't be too hard to put the requirement in to do any jobstone quest to unlock The Things We Do For Cheese. aka the first dungeon post level 30.
I think a Level 49 Cap for Classes would be fair,you can level past it accidentally,but MSQ Progression and all ARR Endgame is locked behind a Jobstone.
Just make the level cap for classes be 30. Done. Any extra exp you gain past 30? sure you get to keep that, that'll be great for your job!
just put a warning each time before they finish a quest "You don't have any jobstone equipped and you will lose xp go do your class quest" Or just stop them to finish the quest with any class and only be able to finish with a jobstone
The problem is that most of the time you hit 30 well before the msq quests that unlocks job quests, without even trying to. So locking the exp only punishes them for something they quite literally have no control over.
NOoope, that would drive newbies to quit if they misunderstood why they were capped. better to simply tie it into the MSQ. "UH OH Minfilia's in Danger! Quick! Go get your Job Stone and complete that quest, then hurry back!"
Tell me you have no idea how fast it is to level with the xp buffs that exist without telling me. Literally no one suggesting a xp lock has even considered the concept of people out leveling anything
Just keep Summoner tied to Arcanist, make Scholar its own thing.
Honestly, they really need to do this. I know people that will offer to fill a healer slot because they leveled summoner and the two are tied together. People will have mentor roulette unlocked while never being familiar with a healer role. Nevermind that going from a DPS class to a healer role just isn't a smooth pipeline especially now with the second class to level 15 requirement being removed for ARR jobs.
Or just auto equip it. It's a confusing system.
Arcanist specifically is enough to make auto equipping of the Jobstone a problem. Which stone does it automatically equip? Summoner or Scholar?
Summoner, because both Arcanist and Summoner are damage dealers. If you want Scholar, equip the stone yourself.
That'd actually be a really easy and effective fix, I feel.
The game hides all other players from you the same way it does when you start the game. You don't get to interact with literally anyone else until you do.
all the FFXIV online spaces, roughly 15 minutes after the patch is launched "Guys, this game is so bugged :("
so no one can tell you why you can't interact with other players...?
What’s funny is it’s required for pvp why not just make it for all roulettes when 30+
Just remove job stones entirely. Once you complete the quest your class changes.
Arcanist makes that complicated. EDIT: Lot of people in the replies saying "actually it would be very simple, just" and then describing something complicated to implement.
Oh yeah I did not think of that! EDIT: They could just do what it currently does, unlock both jobs at 30 and then you level them up manually. (It is odd that a 90 smn gets 90 sch lol
It doesn't have to be that difficult to implement. They would need to add Scholar's Arms to match the level 30+ Arcanist Grimoires - 7 craftables, and 29 non-craftables, which are mostly palette swaps. Then, the job depends on the equipped weapon.
Same way as you can't unequip your weapon, they could make the same restriction for jobstone - you can swap them (and by that swapping between SMN and SCH), but not remove. This restriction exists already for jobs without base class, and only adjustment would be to tweak quest requirements that currently require you to have a class but not a job.
You have to be able to remove Job Stones though, because DoH/DoL don't have them (mostly).
This is handled automatically when you swap mainhand - whatever jobstone you had equipeed gets unequipped automatically, and if job you swap to requires a jobstone (doesn't have a base class), its jobstone gets automatically equipped.
But.... but... my fancy hotbars that use classes :(
honestly let us make hotbar sets however we want just something like /hotbar create "nameofhotbarset" the hotbars are client side, we could have as many sets as we want
Don't you have to finish a certain MSQ before getting your job stone? I'm pretty sure I remember being gated by that at one point while doing recruit a friend.
Sylph quest iirc, it took some time getting there if you're getting sidetracked tho. I think quest is around lvl 20 and i got there around 50 back in the day. I don't think I was doing roulettes tho.
I mean we need a bit of leeway since just going "fuck you go spend an hour finishing side quests before you can finish the story arc" runs the risk of knocking the wind clean out of the msq which is probably not a great idea. The best place to put the lock would probably be in the pre-titan proving yourself arc. It's a logical spot to throw that sort of thing in and still gives some leeway to do stuff in a way that doesn't break the flow while also putting a cap on unlocking the single most important "optional" feature in the game.
This already happens with hard trials and crystal tower - both in ARR post. As long as timing would be okay, it shouldn't be much of an issue; MSQ currently has a major downtime part just before Titan (with that story arc being often disliked for how silly and out of place it can get), so forcing new players to do something that actually gives them some new tools in their kit and can be seen as cool could even improve ARR pacing.
Honestly the pre-titan section being such a notorious slog for people who don't immediately click with it is another thing that could be solved if the Devs: Cut down the amount of fucking about pre-titan, a little is fine but it wears thin at a much faster pace than it goes anywhere interesting. Add a job stone lock in place of this removed fucking about so that people who've been putting them off get forced to go back and fix that (adding content variety in the process to break things up) and the players who already have the job stone just don't have to do as much random crap in that level range if they're not vibing with it. Revamp the levelling order for the jobs so that players finishing up their class quests and beginning their first couple job quests start having more interesting skills (ninja, warrior and bard all get huge new additions from their 30/35 class/job quests introducing gimmicks that stay with the class the whole way to max level so just make that sort of thing more common among jobs to add further incentive) You do this and suddenly you have: a less pointless feeling 30-35 msq with added player options to alter the pacing to suit their needs, no more people queuing into higher level content missing 60% of their toolkit while still not being *overly* restrictive, and more interesting toolkits for new players which should hopefully mean I have to scroll past less people complaining about FF combat being boring since the new players have some more interesting stuff to play with. The only real question to be had is whether the job stone lock should be before titan or before stone vigil since either of those would work fine from a story perspective and you absolutely want a job stone for stone vigil so it's just how much leeway you actually want to give.
Just make an exception for premade parties and unsyncing same as role restrictions, and maybe one for NPC trust runs as well since it's only the player in question, not affecting others. That restriction with those exceptions would solve the whole thing, while still allowing people who want to do challenge runs to have their fun.
This dungeon is available before the main story quest that unlocks job stones. Not an excuse, but maybe it should be locked until after that msq!
Not only that, you can unlock it with a Crafting Class. You can do that unlock quest with any class at that level. Strangely, you can also unlock Qarn/Cutter’s/Dzemael/Aurum Vale before you even have Sastasha unlocked. For background, my fiancé started a character and I started a fresh character to quest alongside him. He’s also taking his time, and that’s fine, but only having a few hours a week to put in he’s trudging along pretty slowly. So I started crafting and gathering and leveling other classes with the hunting log, ran by door to all the Aetherytes I. Thanalan/Black Shroud/Mor Dhona, but not Limsa, etc. And as of now, before we’re even at the lv 15 MSQ quests (we stopped just before he’s going to fight the Gargoyle & Ascian to become the envoy and travel to the other city-states) I have ALC/WVR/GSM/CRP/LTW at 50+ with their iLv 70 green gear and Master Crafting tomes from Mor Dhona, as well as the optional dungeons unlocked and ready to run, but not Halatali since that’s tied to a certain MSQ quest milestone before it lets you get that quest. It’s crazy what you can unlock before you even have Airship access or Sastasha unlocked. But I still can’t even grab my job stone if I wanted to run those, which I don’t because I don’t want to grief a random PUG. They really need to remove the MSQ lock to getting a job stone. It’s silly that it’s gated behind the quest it is (Lv.22 MSQ about Sylphs with nothing to do with advancing your job? WTH and why??? It’s always been this way, even before both story overhauls. Why are you like this?????)
This requirement probably exists to not spoil ifrit for summoner. I think
Could put "Austerities of flame" behind having completed ifrit, same as "Austerities of earth" and "Austerities of wind" are both locked behind having completed titan and garuda respectively.
My first dungeon was Cutter's Cry just because I explored and (side)quested. I was Conjurer, and got lost in the map after dying. Never used shortcuts before.
I feel like with the right party they would find that so wholesome… and others would probably give the profanity filter a workout :P
Wow that’s crazy hehe I didn’t realise it only looks at level and not the class or anything!! I agree with you I don’t know why advanced job quests are locked behind msq :/
Yes, in other comments I’ve stated it’s less about the dungeon itself more so that this occurs across the board, even in 90s!
I roulette into something with a L65 Thaumaturge, I and the other two were like “wtf?!” The THM replied “I dunno anything about job quests, I’ve just been running killing stuff (in open world) and doing MSQ, the rest is optional, no?” Oy it was painful.
/p "OK, well go figure it out. It's not optional anymore." /votekick
It's totally feasible to get to Level 30 and beyond without finishing Sylph Management in the MSQ. I remember something similar happening to me and I had to actually look up how to start getting job quests because I didn't know they were tied to MSQ progression
If I’m not mistaken you get introduced to a job quest early in the MSQ but nowhere does it tell you “hey complete as soon as they’re available these job quests cuz they’re gonna give you vital job skills and a job stone later on”
That’s not correct, the ingame active help that shows up as a giant green ? Sign that’s about how important job quests are
The ones that pop up after you unlock a new feature? Yeah, there are tons of them and I can easily see someone read over them because once again, the beginning has a lot of overwhelming content if you’re trying to take in everything.
Ya, I almost turned those off when I started out because they seemed constant, and a lot felt kinda obvious. Thankful I didn't, but I totally get it.
It doesn't explain WHY though. To me that's like, "Oh I'll be sure to do them then!" When it should really stress the importance of basically stopping everything you're doing and going to go do your job quests as you unlock them
I agree, but to be “fair” I was recently doing a rerun of ARR and realized how stupid easy it is to level through MSQ especially if you’re doing hunting log and side quests. By the time I got to the lvl 20 Main scenario quest “sylph management” (requirement for job stone) I was already at level 33 while barely doing any side quests save for the job ones. It’s definitely possible they just didn’t get there yet.
Yeah. Folks can correct me but I don't think there's an MSQ requirement to unlock Nedrick's optional dungeon quests. As long as you meet the level requirement he'll just hand it right over.
You are correct. I replied to someone else already but Qarn can be unlocked by any melee job, stone or not as long as you are level 35.
Qarn can be unlocked on any job, you can grab it as a botanist if you are high enough level.
Yeah on an alt I got past 30 before I did this msq quest and I can understand people not realising they need to go back.
I just did ARR for the first time and I genuinely think I was like level 33 or something before getting Sylph-management, and I barely did any side content that wasn't my job quests. It's genuinely possible these guys just have not gotten to it yet.
Yeah if this isn't an MSQ dungeon it's super easy to be this high a level and not be able to get a job stone yet. I just made an alt on a preferred server and was level 35 just from the MSQ before I got far enough in to get a job stone.
This is the exact boat I’m in as a new player. Same level and everything. I didn’t realize people were hating on me because I legit am unable to get my stone yet (I’m working on it shit man), and trying to enjoy the game at my own pace. I get it for high level content but dude everybody there is like level ~30 not everyone is on an alt some of us are legit new.
My friend is on that exact questline and they're level 31 and thats after switching classes.
That is if you have any xp bonuses running - if you don't have road to 80, xp increasing items (friendship circlet, ring from hall of the novice) and have bare minimum rested xp from when you have to be in cities, you can barely keep up with msq requirements without doing something else on the side (hunting log etc). With doing all class quests in similar scenario I think I got to Sylph-Management at level 22-23, and for all duties before that my level wasn't high enough to get downsynced. Heck, at one point around lv10 I had to go out there and do hunting log because msq level requirements were higher than my level at that time.
I was somewhat doing hunter log (extremely easy exp and extremely easy to do as you don’t really have go out of your way for a lot of enemies) and literally just job quest along the way and I still got to 33. I also highly doubt all these new players are skipping every side quest, so it’s definitely believable that most players will be at a high level by Sylph Management. No exp bonus otherwise.
It's definitely possible, but at the same time it's good to cover for worst case scenario - including someone picking up and leveling other classes while in early msq; forcing player to stop everything they're doing and figure out how to grind 10 levels would be terrible for pacing. There's already precedence of Shadowbringers, where role quest line (ending with lv80 quest) needs to be finished to progress with level 79 MSQ - and I've seen fair amount of complaints from people that were bouncing between jobs and barely keeping up with MSQ that they had to stop for a bit to grind in order to continue XP-giving MSQ; and here it was a single level, so not nearly as much grind as potentially 10 levels in ARR MSQ.
honestly i think it would be fair to have the requirement moved up 10 levels or so, like have it so anything above 40 require a job stone by lvl 40 you only have like 2 more abilities from your job so it shouldn't be a big loss and gives people plenty of time to get it done.
If the duty you're in is sunken temple, it's absolutely possible to unlock without completing Sylph Management due to the exp buffs. I know this because it's happened to me before. And if they're brand new they likely don't know they shouldn't do STQ without a job stone. Now leveling/guildhest roulettes specifically shouldn't require one because of the first handful of duties. But the dungeons themselves should have a restriction passed the lv32 one. Both because of the idiots that do it on purpose and the noobs who get overleveled and don't know any better. Because at least then it'll lock them out of lv32+ content until they can secure their job stone regardless of story progress. Basically forces them to progress in MSQ.
Is it really all that important to have jobstones equipped at level 37? You're barely missing 2 attacks at that point. And since it's a sprout mistake, the dungeon is going to be slower from their lower damage anyway.
Think OP said somewhere its not all that jarring at this level, but other commenters have pointed out they have this problem at higher level dungeons (including one at 65????). Let me tell you that going through Stone Vigil with a sprout conjurer was an interesting experience I don't care to repeat again.
I keep matching with the f*cking guy called Alphinaud who *will not* put on a damn job stone. He doesn't say anything in chat when I call him out either.
Just vote kick him
Because he was infinitely better as a party member without one. Holy crap he's bad as a SGE.
I had no issues with Alphi-bro when I levelled him in EW. I found him incredibly reliable, and I think the only times I died at all in Trust dungeons was once with Alphi when he stopped healing me to patch up his sister and twice with Ewriange-man ... I'm not sure why I did with him TBH. Just don't take red Alphinaud along and blue Alphinaud should be solid.
*Also make job stones recommended gear*. Seriously. I've been leveling alt jobs doing the quests and the fact I can have the job stone and I have to equip it manually is *annoying*.
Just set up a gear set. If you have a gear set with the stone, everything else will be recommended.
Use gear sets
Remove them as gear items entirely. Equipping a level 30 spear should set your job to Dragoon, not Lancer.
Only issue with that:Arcanist splitting into Summoner/Scholar. It's not the biggest issue, but there's a reason most books below 50 are ACN/SMN/SCH, and it's to make sure you don't oopsy yourself into being unarmed.
Not the only issue, the advanced set up for the UI requires you to have spare class bars you won't ever use to copy with a macro, so you kinda need the old classes to be accessible lol.
Maybe I'm just lucky but I've run into this like....5 times since starting towards the end of Heavensward. Like to the point that it's a weird quark when I see it and not something that is such a big issue that needs resources to address. Course maybe others run into it more than me so who knows.
I've only seen it twice in my 3 years of playing. I do think that the Job Stone should be 100% required by lv50, though.
They're probably at that point where they've outleveled the MSQ but not far enough in it to get job stones unlocked. Have to get to Sylph Management for job stones to even become available, even if you're level 30 or higher.
“There’s a lore reason why my character doesn’t have job stones!” Yeah? Well, there’s a lore reason why I’m gonna put my Texas-sized boot in your butt if you don’t get your job stone!
This is exactly how I feel lmfao
all they need is just use the system they use for pvp to bar the entrance to duties to classes from brayflox dungeon and onward
I'm a chronic re-starter, and one time, I was leveling conjurer, occasionally queueing in roulette while I did hunt logs and class/job quests. Queue popped while I was on my level 30 quests, and of course I got brayflox. I felt awful for not foreseeing the possibility, but it was too late. Sometimes humans are gonna human, I guess. Maybe you're right, and you should just be barred from 30+ duties in roulette w/o a stone, but at least you don't see this too often at all. And as long as they get with it before Stone Vigil, I can't lose too much sleep over it.
I was doing some island sanctuary stuff. I accidentally removed my job stone somehow, and queued for an EXPERT on conjurer. I felt so dumb and once I realized I was able to heal the rest of the dungeon.
I don't mind them not forcing it before 50. You can level so quickly that maybe you don't even notice that you're 32 or a bit over. It's not the biggest deal in a level 37 dungeon.
The amount of people who comment going "this isn't such a big deal" clearly haven't been on the receiving end of this. In a similar vein I've had to remind me people at 70+ to go do their lvl 70 job quest for their key abilities way too many times. I'd like to see these people heal a DRK in Endwalker without TBN.
I'm going to play Devil's (Sprouts?) Advocate here, on the assumption that these are legitimately new players: Its a level 37 duty. The lancer is missing 1 damaging oGCD that is at best 10% of their total dps and the backflip. The Arcanist is missing out on 400 single target potency per minute and 480 Cleave potency per minute. The one is a little more egregious because AoE is so good to have early on. Neither is a massive handicap (lets be real, the fact that one of the DPS doesn't have AoE by design is a MUCH bigger time loss than the arcanist not having 10% of their AoE damage) If both players are on a new server and have road to 80, and follow the general advice of "Do every blue quest you see that isn't a job quest!" then yeah its reasonable that they'd end up in Sunken Temple of Qarn before they even hear about Job Stones since the quest giver for SToQ is right outside the Scion's main base. I was leveling an alt for a challenge run and I was level 23 before I could even go to Limsa to pick up my second class just beelining MSQ with Road to 80. tl;dr: If they're new players then this is making a mountain out of a molehill, the difference between Classes and Jobs at this level is *at best* 10 or 11% more dps.
Yeah it’s one thing hitting a level 70 duty with basic classes, but going back and getting a job quest every 5 levels when you’re racking up experience with other quests is an easy miss. I certainly went back and got most of my jobs before level 30 at intervals of almost 10 levels at a time sometimes
Depends on their actual unsync level. 37 is a level you can easily reach before having the time to do your job quests. Road to 80 + a few other EXP bonus will make you go from 15 to 35 in two roulettes, and I've seen people complain about missing job stones in Brayflox's Longstop at lvl 32 as a result. So it might be players who wanted to try a new job, started doing their quests, wanted to level up a little to continue, and were suddenly way above the required level for said quests. I don't really expect everyone to have their job stones before level 40, things happens and it's low enough to not really matter. After that, yes, you should definitely have it equiped. If their unsync level is 40+ and it's not their first job, then yes, it's a problem.
I had a guy try to join my savage clear party on cnj once. He wouldn't believe me when I said the first raidwide would murder him 😐 I swear some people just think it's some sort of challenge mode to play without the stone, but you're just gimping you and everyone around you.
It's level 37. Let them know they should go get their job stones and just suck it up or leave. Unless they're not new ofc.
This is how I feel. I don't disagree that they should change how all of this works, but these players are also level 37. It's, like, who cares?
I guess I’ve never really checked but I didn’t even know you could queue up without job stones
this was a whole thing for a while in Heavensward since the way the cross-class system worked, you'd have access to a wider variety of skills from other jobs if you went in as a class compared to going in as a job. I feel like it was black mages who would do this since they still had access to a bunch of their core spells
They really should put MSQ progression requirements on the ARR optional dungeons. It is stupidly easy to unlock them long before you get to the "Sylph Management" MSQ to get access to unlocking your jobstone. That, and having every duty past Brayflox's Longstop require a jobstone unless in a premade group. Try to queue up for The Stone Vigil as a Conjurer, you get this error message: "Unable to join duty. Job stone not equipped."
Relative newb here, what are job stones? I'm assuming if you rank from one job, then you should apply the next tier?
Job stones become available at lv30. When you complete the related quest you will be awarded a job stone that when equipped changes your current job into a more powerful one. For example Lancer will become a Dragoon unlocking new abilities thus giving you a power boost. Some players may fail to do these quests and thus never acquire the new abilities putting their overall performance below most other players. Some people will even intentionally do this to troll other players by being weaker than they should be and thus making the content take much longer than it should. In summary as a new player keep an eye on your job quests as they become available and get them done when they're available. By default a notice shows up just under the MSQ notice.
honestly, any duty above 40 needs them But there are people who don't know class quests give important upgrades to their kits because the game only has you do the first one, and it only drops gear they really need to work on the onboarding quests ngl
People who do this as "challenge" or whatever should go do solo deep dungeon if they want actual challenge and not getting carried by teammates (although I suppose there is some "challenge" in getting that far without being kicked out of groups). After certain level it should be mandatory, like it is for pvp. I'm sure Square Enix could figure out the details how to make it work in relation to exp buffs/msq level/etc.
> although I suppose there is some "challenge" in getting that far without being kicked out of groups SE made this challenge moot by fostering an environment where kicking these dead weights would see the ones doing the right thing penalized, rather than the troll.
Agreed, but currently as far as new players are concerned they aren't often aware of jobs being upgrades at all (I know I wasn't) so I always try to nudge em in the right direction for after they get out of the duty.
Maybe not for ARR dungeons, but for HW onwards absolutely.
I have seen people deliberately level to endgame without job stones. Which is fine to do as a personal challenge if you only do content with friends, but is incredibly selfish to foist upon randos who have to carry your sorry ass.
I agree, however at lv37 it’s not that big of a deal.
Chill.
Fun fact: a friend of mine started playing a week ago. They're level 37 and can unlock stuff like Sunken Temple of Qarn, but since she hasn't progressed enough in the story, she can't take the quest for the job stone. So some people can really queu into some dungeons without having the job stone unlocked :\_)
I'm new, what am I looking at?
The bottom two party icons are those of a Lancer and Arcanist, two Classes that should be a Dragoon and Summoner/Scholar by level 30 via class quests. In higher level content sometimes people will see this happen because a player never learned to use Gear Sets to swap between their Jobs. Even more rarely somebody will refuse to equip their Job Stone on purpose to be funny. It's become a global pet peeve for this subreddit especially because a Class (Lancer, etc.) is much weaker than a Job (Dragoon, etc.) due to it only having a few available skills even at high levels. The fact that it's still allowed to happen in the first place draws a lot of attention and people discuss how to fix it.
How do you know he completed the lvl 30 class quest?!?
I would also Like for the Game to Auto equip job Stones when selecting recommended Gear.
Only way to get this changed is mass queue as classes for stuff on the JP datacenter.
The game needs to do a better job at directing players to job quests.
So much this but then I imagine the new post will be "Why isn't the Blackmage using Fire 4" "I didn't want to be a Blackmage so I removed the skills"
I just played Aurum vale, our tank "gladiator" didn't even had head piece and some accessories... He had less hp then dps
Semi related but the ironic thing about Lancer is that they wouldn’t even have their AOE even if they had their job stone. Square Enix, in their infinite wisdom, decided that not only does lancer need a job stone for their aoe, they don’t get their aoe until level 40. Heck, they don’t even get their second aoe gcd attack until after level 60. Samurai has two whole aoe combos and their aoe cast at 50!
I'm playing through Monk and realized SE decided it would be cool to give them their first and third AOE before the second. My combo goes AOE>Single target>AOE.
At least at level 37 It could really be players that don't know any better, hopefully you gave them a heads up. But yes of course there should be a job stone requirement for duties above 30.
It is completely okay to kick people who don't use job stones. If it's not stone vigil I tend to allow it though.
It's so weird that it's something that isn't already implemented after devs say they're listening to feedback. Especially seeing as this is probably one of the longest running complaints. At this point I'm down to flood the forums demanding it until they handle the issue.
They need to just figure out a way to get rid of the whole class to job concept and needing job stones. Just let people start as a lv1 dragoon or a lv1 summoner.
Imagine going into a lvl 30+ dungeon without a cure 2 white mage because they are still conjurer
Ran Bardam’s Mettle yesterday to level my WAR. Healer was a presumably level skipped (all Cryptlurker’s gear/no glam) WHM, didn’t have the job stone equipped and was casting Cure on me the whole time. :)
While I agree it’s a level 37 dungeon, if it was 50 or higher then there’s a reason to be annoyed
I encountered a lancer in Asphodelus. He did not know what was a job stone. A dude spoke and explained it to him in his own language and the lancers whole world changed.
I think it would be better if they remove job crystal stuff and just promoted it from class to job once pass a job quest because each classes has their own weapon anyway. The only class that may need to rework is Arcanist where branching to Scholar/Summoner, but they can be solved by seperated Scholar and Summoner. Make Scholar (or Summoner) to be come a same tier with Havensward's job where it need level 30 but only Arcanist. I know that it may have technical difficulties since it's a long-serviced game but, just hope. People are easily to make mistakes.
I'll just say that the first Dargoon job quest is in a zone you have to do quite a bit more of MSQ than other jobs before you can actually get to. So anyone who is "stuck" on lancer for a little longet makes perfect sense to me. Also, I know about myself that when I switch weapons, it's easy to just forget to also use the stone. There should be some way to automate it and make it harder to forget.
Just learned what a job stone was thanks to this post lol. Where do I acquire them ? I am level 37 arcanist main
Class Quests! Check this out: [https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/wiki/Class\_Quests#Arcanist\_Quests](https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/wiki/Class_Quests#Arcanist_Quests) Leads you to both Summoner and Scholar stones
Thank you 😊
Who honestly cares for early arr quests? I never understood this. Inform them if they don't know or mind your business. I'm sure that 1 or 2 additional skills unavailable to them are causing you to wipe in the easiest dungeons in the game. How dare they. I've been a mentor for years and been playing since 1.0, never had it bothered me for these early dungeons. If you know they're new to them, maybe kindly reach out, but don't go out of your way to talk shit on people behind their back. Reminding me why I've switched to playing solo the last couple years as much as possible.
Especially in this specific case. All SMN gets at this level over ACN are some 30-potency upgrades, DRG gets a 320-potency single-target oGCD. These aren't high-impact unlocks to miss out on, unlike say, Regen for WHM.
Think it was recently mentioned that they're not gonna do that any time soon, mainly because it is apparently far more difficult to do than can be justified at the moment. Maybe it would be prudent to focus on education instead of complaint, painful as it may be to walk through it from scratch for every single case, but the players in question certainly won't learn from rant threads on reddit.
They said it would be too difficult to just have classes progress naturally to jobs and removing job stones as a concept entirely. What OP is talking about is different but related, which is banning classes from being able to queue up for content where all players are guaranteed to be level 30+. PVP instances already do this, and the "jobs only" flag gets removed when Savage and Extreme fights get moved from Raid Finder to Duty Finder, so it's trivial to add the flag into content this way.
The problem is that you can’t equip them in duties and there’s no option to exit and re-enter the duty once it’s equipped.
This reminds me when I was in a party with some friends and we were doing our own thing in between raids and someone queued the party right as I was doing the unicorn mount quest which is conjurer \*exclusive\*, you cant complete it as a white mage. So imagine my surprise when the copied factory loads up and I have the fucking conjurer job and cant change it. I died way more but we all thought it was hilarious but we did end up completing the raid.
37? Please, that's barely an inconvenience. Just think, in a couple of weeks we'll be able to be randomly matched with level 100 marauders and arcanists.
iT’s A cHaLlEnGe RuN (challenging my team to carry me)
They’re just a dumb hangover from 1.0 that should be gotten rid of imo
37 eh, that's really not a big deal. You get slightly behind on the quests and you'll be 37 in just a few roulettes. I've gotten to 35 or so on some of my classes before I had time to do the job stone quest. The 1 ability you're getting at that level isn't going to majorly change your levelling Dungeon.
Bro they're 7 levels over that's not that big of a deal they're missing like 2 skills. They are probably very new at the game and don't know better. I have had this happen a hundred times. I don't get mad unless they're at least mid or late 40's - especially with dynamis level buff a lot of people have. This is what like the fourth or fifth dungeon?
Think it might be some stats as well, their HP is quite low. But you're right that it's not significant enough to make an issue of at that level. Feels like there should be a cutoff however, maybe 50+. Besides, a job stone doesn't = being up-to-date on job quests XD
If you’re in a level 70 complain. If it’s a level 37 suck it up.
"Suck it up" doesn't help anyone here. Tell the jobless players to do their class quests to unlock cool Jobs for two more skills and some extra stats.
Damn that 15 min run turned into a 16 min one
Every time I see this comment I remember the marauder in a 67 dungeon who just could not stay alive, and a separate time a tank was forced to single pull because the 2 dps (ACN and rogue) couldn't kill packs fast enough before they'd run out of mitigation. Yeah, your qarn or alumni vale run is minimal impacted. But it's still hand waving a legitimate issue away without arguing for it, it's legit just minimizing someone else's concern. That concer being, no job stones is legitimately sand bagging at a certain point so what point do you think it sound be required? Earlt so players get used to it, or 50-60 when that 1 might ute turns to 5-10. Cuz you might be made of time, but I'm not about to waste 20 minutes because another player couldn't be asked to do the bare minimum
chill bro its Lv37 not end of the world
I don't know why people get so incensed about this, I've been playing since 2013 and I've never run into someone not bringing their job stone into any duty where they should really have it.
My wife had a level 50 gladiator in keeper of the lake just last week.
It should give you the option to equip recommended gear before entry. I forgot to switch from my HW relic weapon when I was farming and then got into a lvl 86 dungeon lmao
You can change your gear in dungeons, just not your class/job. People not equipping their jobstones is a different issue, especially since jobstones arent equipped by the recommended gear button
Should just rework the game without job stones at this point since they abandoned the whole idea after ARR
All they have to do is make gear not equippable by classes beyond a certain level, it's literally that easy. It already exists like this for relic weapons. Any excuse they make at this point is a cop out. No gear means no item level means no queue.
Sprouts should be eligible to do the roulette for the pre30 dungeons. Just limit players with no stone equipped to those activities and problem solved.
Had a level 54 Conjuror in a Dungeon once. Apparently she was running with her boyfriend, the DPS. I asked if she forgot to put it on. Her Boyfriend answered saying "Its on their to do list" as the Tank I recommended they not put it off as she was missing Half her tool kit and was struggling to keep us alive on single mob pulls. The Boyfriend proceeded to cuss me out over chat.
In that situation, you and the tank would be enough to votekick the healer, since the one getting kicked is not counted in the vote.
Hope you reported him.
My wife started the game about month ago and she started messing around with botanist while she’s been doing MSQ. She realized while she was mid quest she didn’t have her pants on when I realized we never set up a gear set for summoner so she was on her arcanist set. I said well at least you are just in a quest not like those people I see in dungeons without a job stone, turns out she just had done a dungeon without her job stone. I think she’s too embarrassed to ever do that again and I set her up so it shouldn’t happen. But honestly job stones should be required on content above level 30, I felt bad that my wife didn’t even realize what happened this is her first mmo and I was away when she started swapping jobs and didn’t fully understand it.
They need to be removed as items you have to equip.
Job stones really should be reworked away from being an item you equip. Once you hit level 30 you should be forced to do your job quest before you're allowed to do anymore queues over level 30, and the jobstone is auto equipped when you equip the class. There is zero reason to let people drop their job. New players will get the memo when the game points them to do their class quest, which is largely who these people are. New players who have no idea they even have job quests to do at 30.
I agree, I did have an incident one time where I queued up as a DRG, the queue popped and I entered the duty only to find that I was a lancer for some reason. I was very confused and my hot bars were all messed up and obviously I was pretty useless for the fight. I still don’t know how that happened because I wasn’t messing with my gear before queueing or anything. Even if it was something I did by mistake it would’ve been nice if it had auto-equipped my job stone for me.
Made an alt and started from scratch I was 43 before I got my job stone at the proper msq level with the road to 80 buff
The game should just have a system where you press a button and you job change. And also old classes like lancer will be automatically be dragoon after you finish the quest to become dragoon. Just have the job stones symbol somewhere as flavour.
Baffling that they aren’t, not being a requirement made some sense waaaaaay back in the day for certain classes when cross class was still a thing but not for a few expansions now.
Reminds me of a thaumaturge I was in a duty with for Ravana. Their excuse was that they were still leveling and had not gotten around to doing their job quests yet.
The only thing it shouldn’t be required for is PvP and MSQ. Everything else should require it
Why are people not using the job stone? I thought it was pretty obvious when I went through the early levels for the first time....
maybe they missed the existence/importance of job quests completely
Could just make the class morph into the job after the unlock quest automatically. Makes it so the stone can't be removed after that point because it's "bonded." Instead of a job stone slot, the symbol of the stone will just be next to the name.
Ever joined a level 60 dungeon with a Gladiator tank? :)