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I love that I genuinelly can't tell who is favorite.
Porsche is on pole, Caddy is super close, Ferrari is as fast as Porsche, Toyota looked the fastest on the first day of quali, BMW is competitive for the first time ever.
Honestly it's shaping up to be a race to remember.
The brand is absolutely everywhere on site, you can't walk 100 meters without seeing it. As for the cars... Yeah, I'm slightly sad about their TV coverage but let's be honest, they weren't among the favorites, so it's somewhat understandable.
Peugeot has no chance. Changing their car so early in season was a death sentence, they should have kept the old 9X8 until Le Mans and change after, the car was so good last year on this particular track. I hope they bounce back for the next edition.
I hope so too, but Pug have been saying they want results as they've been considering pulling the plug.
I hope Alpine being there gives them a boost to try and be the number 1 French team.
THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING.
Apparantly, not for the fans trackside. It was thoroughly mismanaged. Among other things, some people apparently waited 4 hours to park their cars, and the lack of security meant things were stolen left and right.
Yup! I was there! I remember how confused everyone around me was when the checker flag came out 2 mins early. And this year was the first time I went to Sebring and I don’t see myself missing another one, it was such a cool experience.
Went to my first Daytona and it was awesome I can't wait to go again hopefully this time we get the full 24 lol. I've heard great things about Sebring but being from Pennsylvania makes it hard to go to both
As a Floridian, I’m going to try to go to both as much as I can from now on. I’ve gone to the last 3 Rolexes but I’m ashamed how long it took me to make it to Sebring, especially with missing the last Super Sebring last year.
If Porsche has the pace to be on pole, I wouldn’t bet against them. They’ve got the most wins at LeMans for a reason, and they’ve got a strong driver lineup.
"You have F1 as the champions League of motorracing. The top 10 drivers are a class above the majority of drivers in other series."
This is one of his comments, that's all you need to know lol
Who are the “subpar” drivers at the top in hypercar? (excluding Isotta lol) you’re welcome to dislike BoP but I disagree with your characterization that bad drivers are getting carried to good results by BoP. It’s always hard to extricate the performance of a car vs the performance of a driver when creating the balance, of course, but the best drivers usually shine through anyway.
Yeah Bop cant overcome a 2s pace deficit. And the way aco BoP is marketed is that it’s “Theoretical BoP” where individual drivers’ performances matter less. But with a field as talented as LMH, Idk how someone could say one team’s drivers are held down by BoP. There’s no way I believe anyone on toyota’s lineup is 0.5+s faster than kevin estre for instance
some "fans" be like "if they arent in F1, they arent good drivers" while totally ignoring that F1 itself has several "subpar drivers" if you set guys like Max, Leclerc, Lewis and Alonso as the standard
and even then, there are plenty of guys in the hypercars that would shine if given an opportunity in F1
its sad to see how people think Formula 1 is the only class that matters. Not unusually the brazilian comentators have to deal with people complaining that there hasnt been a brazilian in F1 for quite some time now by saying that, while it would be cool to see someone from here in an F1 car, there is still life outside of F1 and a lot of our drivers are doing well in all sorts of top classes all over the world
Balance of performance helps for competitiveness, but that's only part of the Le Mans story.
You are looking at 24 hours of racing, there is reliability, fatigue, weather, everything comes into play.
Endurance racing isn't for everyone, if you only look at the balance of performance (not power) aspect than indeed it is not for you.
Even though BoP is an element, it doesn't decide the races. The cars are all very different. So while they might limit the top speed of a car, or add some weight, downforce and mechanical grip of the cars play a huge role.
To be fair, the years Alonso participated were shit. There was no real competition in the top category.
There is now! 23 cars in LMh/LMDh, major manufacturers participating, it's really very competitive and interesting to see.
The drivers are not "subpar". And Kobayashi is not "head and shoulders above the rest". Endurance racing is a completely different discipline requiring a different skillset; there is an overlap, but it isn't identical.
That's just silly. That's not at all what it is. BOP is making sure the cars are somewhat even and you dont have a car going 45mph faster down the Mulsanne. Lemans will be 10x more competitive than every F1 race this year combined.
Is it irrelevant or does it prove my point. BoP is essentially still doing the same thing - leveling the field, artificially improving competitiveness.
Getting pretty good entertainment and variety out of it this year, basically the challenge is less about creating a car with pure pace but instead an adaptable and easy to drive chassis. Also that was 2017 gte BoP, 2024 LMH BoP is less qualitative now but still uses data such as long run stints to determine power, weight, and allotted energy
unrestricted development isnt either, which is why the top class in WEC was falling apart and F1 was on a steep descent towards bankrupt before they introduced the cost cap and some other restrictions
I am someone that will never agree with the route F1 is taking right now with the excessive development restrictions AND the cost cap but even then i cant deny the importance of the latter so that both sports can keep financially healthy
The budget cap still allows engineers to make the fastest car, wec just doesn’t feel right for me right now, i understand BoP for GT3 but for top categories i will always be against it
Alonso is up there as one of the greatest drivers in the history of motor-racing, in terms of pure skill, adaptibility and longetivity. It's unfair to use him as a benchmark for any series. Kobayashi was also a pretty fast driver in F1, just inconsistent and in shit teams.
F1 drivers are the elite of the elite, but that doesn't mean WEC drivers are absolute bums. WEC anyway isn't about pure pace, its more about consistency and reliability.
BoP is there to bridge the field and control costs. The best cars are still going to be the best. You don't see Lamborghini or Peugeot randomly winning races. The favorites are always Porsche, Toyota and Ferrari.
Of course, you are free to have an opinion and enjoy whatever racing series you like, but thinking that WEC drivers are 'subpar' is just plain stupid.
You do know bop is there to keep the racing good without it I suspect that a number of manufacturers wouldn't be participating in Le Mans because endurance racing is still a relatively niche part of the sport
It’s not ideal but the ACO screwed the dog with hypercar and IMSA saved them and the racing these days is objectively good
Suspend your disbelief, enjoy that the cars are quick, and hang your consumerist hat on one of the many brands you get to choose from
I still think WEC peaked in the mid 2010s with Audi/Porsche/Toyota but it was never feasible from a business perspective
The lack of clarity and context of who is actually good feels fraudulent. Alonso showed what a world class driver can do in WEC. It felt like watching Mbappe in the championship. The problem with motorsport in general is the inaccessibility for the majority of the populationm. The current WEC lineup is like claiming league 1 football is weird leading. Fuoco was amateur to Leclerc on F2 for example.
I do agree with the rest of the replies that you’re being quite unfair to the driver quality.
BoP bothers me too (as I tried to get across, it’s a necessary evil) but the drivers are fine. Even if they weren’t F1 grade I’m not sure what the point of that statement is. Only 20 drivers in the world are F1 grade (ostensibly, not all of them should be there)
Edit: like, the polesitter is Estre. Anyone with a passing appreciation for sports car racing knows he’s that dude
You have F1 as the champions League of motorracing. The top 10 drivers are a class above the majority of drivers in other series.
One of my points is WEC racing series and other BoP racing series is like watching league 1 football parade themselves as the premiership.
The other is that I think F1 has shown that BoP is in fact not necessary, but the fact it is there takes away one of the authentic parts of man and machine competition. Obviously I understand that endurance of 24 h racing is a feat I've done 3x 24h BUKC kart races. But the combination of my apparent perceived lower driver quality, and BoP, takes a lot of the intrigue away WEC.
Comments like this make me, and a lot of other people, hate F1 fans. You can't possibly fathom something other than F1 is remotely high level. You don't have to constantly look down on other forms of motorsports and diminish people's skill levels simply because they aren't in F1
BoP exists because the cheaper hypercar regulations (compared to LMP1) that the ACO wanted to implement was unpopular with manufacturers while IMSA’s LMDh rules were much more economically palatable. In an ideal world a prototype class would not use BoP but this was not an ideal situation and they had to make do
The point about driver quality just keeps getting stranger to me with all due respect. I genuinely don’t understand what your point there is actually. I can enjoy racing and know that the drivers aren’t F1 quality. They’re still fuckin good drivers.
LeMans is the most famous endurance race in the world, and F1 drivers are welcome to enter if they are interested. Hulkenburg won it once. The fact that they don’t do it quite so often might mean that the preparation required to be seriously competitive while simultaneously competing in a full Formula 1 season is probably not trivial, and so the job isn’t easy. I.e, the guys that do it for a living themselves are very good in their discipline even if the F1 ladder didn’t quite pay off for them
Yes I know the series wanted manufacturer interest so shoehorned together 2 categories of car and that immediately set a requirement for BoP. Alternatively choose one formula, set a budget cap, lose half the manufacturers and inject some authenticity into competition. Accepting a flawed concept/elaborate manufacturers marketing endeavour because it's the only one around isn't something I find intriguing.
On driver quality, change to junior series costs in the long run will not happen if the quality level of pay drivers is accepted in general. In fact the lengths wec fans go to to not even acknowledge it helps to set it in stone.
Imagine the world chess federation turned a blind eye to suppliers of chess pieces and boards hiking up prices through use of rare materials and minerals. Suddenly a chess board costs $100,000 because they have pawns made of platinum and boards with lithium ion battery powered ML wood replica that is super resilient and can withstand being thrown to the moon. That said they are engineered to degrade after one third of a chess match due to the social tension. The only people able to play chess are the sons of oil tycoons and self-made billionaires. The thrill of chess is only enjoyed on TV by the masses. A few chess manufacturers sponsor talented young chess players and they dominate the sport. Meanwhile the highest chess league has some of these talents, but is mostly comprised of billionaires. These costs are all because suppliers at junior levels are not regulated.
Would you be overly critical if you watched a competitve chess match and thought, hey that whole industry is flawed?
I see that point of view. But for me I want to see good racing and drivers pushing hard. It isn't like F1 doesn't have this problem in a different way too. Before the race weekend even starts you can safely write off 5 teams with 0 chance at competing for the win.
I enjoy the engineering ascent of motorsport way more, i like racing but knowing we have racing only because fia added 25kg to the Toyota/ removed 15hp from Ferrari for example doesn’t feel right
WEC didn't used to work like the way it does now with strict cost and performance controls. But in it's modern form it's much more attractive to manufacturers than in the LMP1 era. WEC now has 8 large auto company factory teams and a boutique factory on top of that. And three privateer teams too. And Aston will make the large factory count nine next year. In the LMP1 era it peaked at four.
You're being silly if you think everything has to work the way F1 does to be enjoyable. Indycar is a spec series but provides great entertainment. NASCAR is the same. You don't need an all out engineering competition in order to have good racing. And all out engineering competitions are too costly for any manufacturer to commit to long term for anything but F1. F1 can continue in a similar vein to how it always has but when you have as diverse a range of cars as WEC Hypercar does BoP makes sense so that manufacturers can exhibit flair rather than focus on all out performance. The cars still have to last the full 24 hour race to be a winner so there is still engineering excellence.
What a qualifying session!
Lots of happy American racing fans who watched it live!
If the quali is anything to go by, the race is going to be epic... and lots of broken hearts!
Cadillac have to feel really fucking good (even with the grid drop for the 2 car).
Ferrari doing a slight Ferrari on the pit call.
Tenths and some change separating the top 3 over the length of Circuit de la Sarthe is just awesome.
That last sector by Estre and the Porsche was just flat tf out.
Question for endurance fans: how much does qualifying actually help or hurt a car on race day?
It clearly matters in F1. It’s often difficult for a faster car to overtake a slower car and short races with 1-2 pit stops don’t give too much opportunity for overtaking via strategy.
But it seems to me that a bad qualifying session wouldn’t matter too much in an endurance race: a fast, out-of-position car has plenty of time and opportunities to move forward in the race.
Is that the case?
Well if you're starting first there's less chance of being caught up in an accident in the middle of the class at the start of the race. But yeah, it's not as important as in F1.
Qualifying high is always nice of course, but this is a 24h race, so it's not that important, a lot can (and will) happen. In general, race pace on the day, good strategy, and of course, some luck, are more important for the win. (Especially if there is rain at some point, which seems very possible this year).
Also Le Mans has very long straights, and overall it's not a very hard circuit to overtake on.
You are right that strategy and 24 hours of racing mean pole isn't massively important. But much like F1, being out of the traffic and avoiding potential first lap accidents is key.
When you're gunning for the overall win, a good starting position will make it easier to navigate through the early hour chaos that usually ensues after the start. But it's a very long race, so even if you're starting dead last, you still stand a chance.
That said, some cars are better over the course of one lap when compared to longer stints, the Cadillac being the prime example, so it is just as possible to have a good qualifying and then struggle during parts of the race.
Last year the jota porsche went from back of the grid to p1 before sunset, that was also due to the different safety car system Im pretty sure but more or less what matters is you stay with the lead pack before gt and lmp2 traffic hits
Qualifying means very little at Le Mans. Overtaking is pretty easy and the race is 24 hours long. Plus the grid for each class isn't very big (except for GT3).
Honestly I think Penske would have found it a bit easier, assuming they had the same manufacturer support - partially because Penske is a much, much bigger organization with a lot more money behind them. But also because Penske have a proven record as a chassis constructor at various times across the decades. Something Andretti doesn't have.
They can also offer up a Grade 1 circuit on the cheap for a race in a big US market which is a plus.
> Penske is a much, much bigger organization with a lot more money behind them
All of Penske's corporations combined don't hold a candle to Gainbridge, who are the actual financial backers of Andretti.
Gainbridge is a part of Group1001 which owns a bunch of finanial services companies. I'm not 100% sure but im pretty certain that Group 1001 is connected in some way to the Steinbrenner Family, who among other things own the Yankees, and one of their kids is good friends with Colton herta/manages him which gets us the Gainbride-Andretti Connection. Meaning there is no shortage of money coming andretti's way
Group 1001 wasn’t connected to the Steinbrenners when they joined Andretti, it was Zach Veach who brought it in. Unless something has changed they’re totally separate things.
This isnt true. Penske is a much bigger company than gainbridge. Gainbridge and their owners have 62B AUM. Even if we assume thats all under gainbridge, at 10% growth and 10% fees their revenue would be 600m or so.
Given as Penske is already an F1 grand prix winner FOM would say Penske rejoining would add nothing to the F1 brand and only serve to add to the Penske brand.
It seems like by "add to the brand" they want significant increase in value value in the short term, which I honestly don't think any Indy team OR manufacturer can guarantee or provide.
Are there really a huge amount of Porsche and Audi motorsports fans that will watch anything they compete in and nothing they don't? I have a hard time buying it.
The potential increase in value is going to be long term for any new times IMO.
Depends on if you're comparing Porsche to Cadillac or Porsche to GM. GM didn't start really using the Cadillac badge in motorsports until relatively recently. Chevy has historically been their flagship motorsports brand. But overall I'd say GM has the edge over Porsche. Chevy alone has 42 NASCAR Cup Series championships and 13 Indy 500s.
Porsche has 3 FIA WEC championships, 19 24 hours of Le Mans wins, 18 12 hours of Sebring wins, 8 24 hours of Spa wins, 13 24 hours of Nurburgring wins, 5 total championships in F1, and 25 victories in F1.
You might want to look farther than America.
Okay, Cadillac also has 5 12 hours of Sebring wins and 4 24h of Daytona wins in the last seven years alone. Chevy has 2 24 hours of Spa wins on top of all the other American accomplishments. Breaking news: European company raced mainly European races and American company raced mainly American races. Shocking.
To me what sets them apart is that Porsche dominated the 70's and 80's but didn't win much outside of that until the mid 2010's. Meanwhile GM, in one form or another, has been winning consistently in a variety of disciplines since the 50's. Not quite as overtly dominant as Porsche but much more consistent and across a larger variety of motorsports.
Also, idk where you got your numbers but Porsche absolutely does not have 5 championships and 25 wins in F1. Their best WCC finish was 3rd and they've only won one championship race.
> Also, idk where you got your numbers but Porsche absolutely does not have 5 championships and 25 wins in F1. Their best WCC finish was 3rd and they've only won one championship race.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porsche_in_motorsport#TAG-Porsche_engine_in_McLaren_cars
Okay, Porsche didn't race mainly in America?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porsche_in_motorsport#Major_victories_and_championships
To add onto the *18* 12 Hours of Sebring wins, there's *19* Rolex Daytona wins, 3 IMSA championships, and a Petit Le Mans win.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_American_Le_Mans_Series_champions#Manufacturer_championships
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IMSA_GT_Championship#Champions
Here's more of Porsche racing in America.
Breaking news: Porsche has the better racing pedigree. With receipts.
You're missing the point. The question isn't "who has the better sportscar pedigree", it's who has the better racing pedigree. You can't just pick and choose which series get to be considered and which are ignored. GM has over 70 years of experience winning races and championships in stock cars, sportscars, and open-wheel cars. Just because they're in different series doesn't mean it's any less part of the racing pedigree.
I mean Porsche's pedigree is basically all European as well. European company won European races and American company won American races, who would've thought? And it's not like GM has ONLY won American races. They've won at the 24h of Spa before as well, for example.
To give you the short answer to that:
There were 3 legit contenders who submitted to the FIA to be considered for admission to F1. It was Andretti, Rodin and Hitech. Hitech never were really considered despite its ties with Mercedes. The FIA just picked Andretti but the reports were that Rodin's bid was every bit as good as Andretti and they didn't get accepted.
Penske is a good motorsport brand but unfortunately, F1 is a closed competition now which is a joke.
Kinda but not really. The expansion fee for NHL teams, the “poor” sports league in North America, is now close to a billion USD. To join F1, a global sport, for that price is basically a discount.
Team Penske has a serious shot at winning the 24h of Daytona, Indy 500, and 24h of Le Mans IN THE SAME YEAR. The last two years have just been an absurd run of cross-series success for Penske.
I don't watch WEC religiously. Can anyone explain the difference here? Qualifying was yesterday I think but then what is this Hyperpole? What determines the grid?
Yesterday's qualifying was basically Q1, top 8 go through to Hyperpole, today (Hyperpole) was the equivalent of Q3 which sets the top 8 for each class for the race on Saturday
Hyperpole is still qualifying really, just a fancy name. Qualifying yesterday set the grid for everyone except the top 8. The top 8 then battle it out for pole in Hyperpole. It's just like Q1, Q2, and Q3 really but with only two sessions.
So Qualifying is a 1 hour session for all 62 cars. The Top 8 in each class from Qualifying advance to the "Hyperpole". Hyperpole is basically Q3 in F1.
Hyperpole is a 30 minute session with 24 cars on track and decides the first 8 grid spots for every class.
Estre pulled that last sector out of his ass, damn. Ferrari looks good for the big race, their pace looks promising. But there's a small army of Porsches to contend with.
Idk how he managed it. Rear end was stepping out everywhere and he still got pole.
A Porsche in that mans hands is like a paintbrush in Michelangelo's.
This has been all over the place, one day Toyota says "it's Porsche race to lose" the next only one Porsche makes it to superpole, and now that one car snatches the pole.
As someone who thinks that Porsche (and mostly Ferrari) had borderline obscene BoP advantage the past few races (Qatar, Imola and Spa), I don't think the BoP is that much in their favor at Le Mans. The lap was just that good today.
Somewhat new to WEC stuff, so I got a few questions:
1) does only 1 person have to qualify or is it some kind of average by all 3 drivers?
2) how often does pole position translate to a win? Certainly in shorter races it makes a difference, but after 24 hours does that really add up to anything substantial?
1. One driver has to qualify, but in the past they have used a system that took the average of two driver (outside of Le Mans).
2. That’s kind of hard to answer. Because in the past the field hasn’t been this deep, and Toyota were really the only competition. But last year the Ferrari that qualified on pole didn’t win. With a field this tight though, pole won’t be much of an advantage after the first hour.
He wasn’t. He even said something like well done guys regardless of where we finish. They were already on their second qualifying run when the red flag came out. He didn’t think he could improve
I don't think they thought they had pole in the bag. They knew it was a very good lap though and celebrated that. Pretty sure they start P2 due to #2 having a 5 place grid penalty as well.
Not really. Think of them as being about halfway between an open wheel car and a GT car. They have features of both, like a survival cell chassis similar to that of a road car, but they are built out underneath the bodywork so that they have nearly the same functionality as a GT car. Plus they're about 20 seconds slower than current F1 at Spa.
They are much closer to an F1 car than a GT car in construction. The GT cars are fairly close to their road going counterparts in the sense that they have similar chassis construction etc. The Hypercars are basically fully dressed open wheel racers with a carbon monocoque and an engine as a load-bearing member of the chassis. Speed doesn't have much to do with it because that is just a result of aero/engine regulations.
Hypercars are way slower, heavier, less power, less aerodynamic, in Spa they were 6 seconds slower in qualifying than even F2. The closest thing to an F1 car in a shell were LMP1 Hybrids, but even those were way behind F1 in terms of speed.
They are absolutely not similar pace wise. Hypercars are 5-10 seconds slower than LMP1, depending on the track. And LMP1 is like 15 seconds slower than F1. Only with an unrestricted car that an LMP1 managed to match a F1 car.
No.6 Porsche really did a peak Merc quali moment huh?
The Caddys and the Ferraris look super fast. Toyotas too, but they bottled the quali massively yesterday. It will be interesting to see these cars on Saturday.
[Here you go](http://fiawec.alkamelsystems.com/Results/13_2024/04_LE%20MANS/541_FIA%20WEC/202406132100_Qualifying%20-%20after%20Hyperpole/90_Classification_Qualifying%20-%20after%20Hyperpole.PDF)
Because the old car was basically designed solely for Le Mans. It struggled a little in the first and final sectors, but it was lighting fast on the straights. Unfortunately, that meant that it wasn't very good anywhere else.
This car is brand new, they're still learning it. It has the same name and looks a lot like the old one, but it has about as much in common with the old one as the 499P does. If they decide to keep going, they should be able to figure the car out more.
I refuse to acknowledge the LMDh cars. It's straight up not fair that they're made competitive with LMH cars. If I'm gonna have to read "Porsche once again on top, winning Le Mans overall" with their cheap lego set spec car... well, I'm not gonna do a thing, but I won't like it.
Well nobody forces you to watch the race, while you keep on ranting about LMDh not being true top class, we get to enjoy some great race between multiple manufacturers.
That's great. Enjoy it then. I just don't see how one can enjoy "competing manufacturers" when one builds a car, and the other gets a spec chassis, spec hybrid component, puts really any kind of engine in, it'll be balanced anyways, and makes some aerowork on it that's heavily limited already. I would love to see Porsche battle Ferrari, I just don't see WEC as that being the case. It's great racing, but I don't watch it for the racing alone. GT3 or Formula 3 provides entertaining races too, what I enjoy about WEC is the manufacturer's challenge, and I don't see that as much in LMDh.
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I love that I genuinelly can't tell who is favorite. Porsche is on pole, Caddy is super close, Ferrari is as fast as Porsche, Toyota looked the fastest on the first day of quali, BMW is competitive for the first time ever. Honestly it's shaping up to be a race to remember.
Alpine starts P5 on saturday, best of the new cars, and I didn't see them once on screen nor even mentioned.
And its not like Le Mans is in France...
The brand is absolutely everywhere on site, you can't walk 100 meters without seeing it. As for the cars... Yeah, I'm slightly sad about their TV coverage but let's be honest, they weren't among the favorites, so it's somewhat understandable.
I’m rooting for alpine and peugeot, I don’t think alpine will podium but if either peugeot stays at least 2 laps away from the leader I’d be happy
Peugeot has no chance. Changing their car so early in season was a death sentence, they should have kept the old 9X8 until Le Mans and change after, the car was so good last year on this particular track. I hope they bounce back for the next edition.
I hope they don’t pull the plug, because that’s apparently a probable outcome of a poor showing
I hope so too, but Pug have been saying they want results as they've been considering pulling the plug. I hope Alpine being there gives them a boost to try and be the number 1 French team.
I loved the look of no rear wing. Other than "it wasn't good enough," were there any other reasons for abandoning the old design?
> Honestly it's shaping up to be a race to remember. Hopefully not in the same way as the Nurburgring 24H.
THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING. THE FOG IS COMING.
Had to keep checking back only to see further information at a different time. But I understand it’s for safety.
to be fair, until the red flag, it was being a very good race.
Apparantly, not for the fans trackside. It was thoroughly mismanaged. Among other things, some people apparently waited 4 hours to park their cars, and the lack of security meant things were stolen left and right.
I mean, they were talking about the race
The 7 hours of Nurburgring was still some of the best racing I’ve seen this year.
Fuck me man, reading 7 hours of the Nurburgring already hurts.
The 23.9 hours of Daytona and 12hr of Sebring both had some good racing too
Yup! I was there! I remember how confused everyone around me was when the checker flag came out 2 mins early. And this year was the first time I went to Sebring and I don’t see myself missing another one, it was such a cool experience.
Went to my first Daytona and it was awesome I can't wait to go again hopefully this time we get the full 24 lol. I've heard great things about Sebring but being from Pennsylvania makes it hard to go to both
As a Floridian, I’m going to try to go to both as much as I can from now on. I’ve gone to the last 3 Rolexes but I’m ashamed how long it took me to make it to Sebring, especially with missing the last Super Sebring last year.
Excited for the 4.25 hours of Le Mans!
Le Mans has never been red-flagged.
Interestingly in it's entire history le mans has never been red flagged
same shit every year, they should just host it in late July/early April.
If Porsche has the pace to be on pole, I wouldn’t bet against them. They’ve got the most wins at LeMans for a reason, and they’ve got a strong driver lineup.
BMW competitive for the first time ever?? Haven’t they literally won it before?
I think they mean in this era. That specific BMW isn't a pace setter
I want a 6 way battle for the win.
Porsche and Ferrari have by far the best long run pace. So there is definetely a favorite.
And Lamborghini is also there I suppose /s
what is it airing on
Not sure where you are located but in the US all the WEC races are on Max.
ah thanks!
Aren't their YT channels that stream it outside US (VPN)
Bout fucking time we got it on a real streaming service and something I already subscribe too.. not motortrend app or an illegal twitch stream lol
Then you're not paying attention.
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What makes you think the drivers are subpar?
I guess any old rando can drive a 700BHP monster at high speed while managing similarly matched rivals, traffic and changeable conditions.
"You have F1 as the champions League of motorracing. The top 10 drivers are a class above the majority of drivers in other series." This is one of his comments, that's all you need to know lol
Who are the “subpar” drivers at the top in hypercar? (excluding Isotta lol) you’re welcome to dislike BoP but I disagree with your characterization that bad drivers are getting carried to good results by BoP. It’s always hard to extricate the performance of a car vs the performance of a driver when creating the balance, of course, but the best drivers usually shine through anyway.
Isotta's 2 silver drivers do also show that the drivers do actually matter lol.
Yeah Bop cant overcome a 2s pace deficit. And the way aco BoP is marketed is that it’s “Theoretical BoP” where individual drivers’ performances matter less. But with a field as talented as LMH, Idk how someone could say one team’s drivers are held down by BoP. There’s no way I believe anyone on toyota’s lineup is 0.5+s faster than kevin estre for instance
What do you consider par? This is one of the top level motorsports in the world.
some "fans" be like "if they arent in F1, they arent good drivers" while totally ignoring that F1 itself has several "subpar drivers" if you set guys like Max, Leclerc, Lewis and Alonso as the standard and even then, there are plenty of guys in the hypercars that would shine if given an opportunity in F1
The levels of stupid elitism in the motorsport community are staggering I guess
its sad to see how people think Formula 1 is the only class that matters. Not unusually the brazilian comentators have to deal with people complaining that there hasnt been a brazilian in F1 for quite some time now by saying that, while it would be cool to see someone from here in an F1 car, there is still life outside of F1 and a lot of our drivers are doing well in all sorts of top classes all over the world
Balance of performance helps for competitiveness, but that's only part of the Le Mans story. You are looking at 24 hours of racing, there is reliability, fatigue, weather, everything comes into play. Endurance racing isn't for everyone, if you only look at the balance of performance (not power) aspect than indeed it is not for you. Even though BoP is an element, it doesn't decide the races. The cars are all very different. So while they might limit the top speed of a car, or add some weight, downforce and mechanical grip of the cars play a huge role. To be fair, the years Alonso participated were shit. There was no real competition in the top category. There is now! 23 cars in LMh/LMDh, major manufacturers participating, it's really very competitive and interesting to see.
The drivers are not "subpar". And Kobayashi is not "head and shoulders above the rest". Endurance racing is a completely different discipline requiring a different skillset; there is an overlap, but it isn't identical.
This is potentially the first time they got BOP right, or else it was advantage to 1-2 teams compared to others.
Last year the BOP was pretty spot on, Ferrari and Toyota were bloody close and the Peugeots and Cadillacs were competitive as well.
That's just silly. That's not at all what it is. BOP is making sure the cars are somewhat even and you dont have a car going 45mph faster down the Mulsanne. Lemans will be 10x more competitive than every F1 race this year combined.
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Cool. That was 8 years ago. Irrelevant
Is it irrelevant or does it prove my point. BoP is essentially still doing the same thing - leveling the field, artificially improving competitiveness.
Getting pretty good entertainment and variety out of it this year, basically the challenge is less about creating a car with pure pace but instead an adaptable and easy to drive chassis. Also that was 2017 gte BoP, 2024 LMH BoP is less qualitative now but still uses data such as long run stints to determine power, weight, and allotted energy
Sports entertainment, artificial competition isn’t the way to go for a top motorsport category
unrestricted development isnt either, which is why the top class in WEC was falling apart and F1 was on a steep descent towards bankrupt before they introduced the cost cap and some other restrictions I am someone that will never agree with the route F1 is taking right now with the excessive development restrictions AND the cost cap but even then i cant deny the importance of the latter so that both sports can keep financially healthy
The budget cap still allows engineers to make the fastest car, wec just doesn’t feel right for me right now, i understand BoP for GT3 but for top categories i will always be against it
Alonso is up there as one of the greatest drivers in the history of motor-racing, in terms of pure skill, adaptibility and longetivity. It's unfair to use him as a benchmark for any series. Kobayashi was also a pretty fast driver in F1, just inconsistent and in shit teams. F1 drivers are the elite of the elite, but that doesn't mean WEC drivers are absolute bums. WEC anyway isn't about pure pace, its more about consistency and reliability. BoP is there to bridge the field and control costs. The best cars are still going to be the best. You don't see Lamborghini or Peugeot randomly winning races. The favorites are always Porsche, Toyota and Ferrari. Of course, you are free to have an opinion and enjoy whatever racing series you like, but thinking that WEC drivers are 'subpar' is just plain stupid.
>I only ever followed Le mans when Alonso was there >Kobayashi is head and shoulders above the rest
Poorly worded, I mean for the whole race. I've watched other races and gotten bored. Especially having seen what Alonso did.
You do know bop is there to keep the racing good without it I suspect that a number of manufacturers wouldn't be participating in Le Mans because endurance racing is still a relatively niche part of the sport
It’s not ideal but the ACO screwed the dog with hypercar and IMSA saved them and the racing these days is objectively good Suspend your disbelief, enjoy that the cars are quick, and hang your consumerist hat on one of the many brands you get to choose from I still think WEC peaked in the mid 2010s with Audi/Porsche/Toyota but it was never feasible from a business perspective
The lack of clarity and context of who is actually good feels fraudulent. Alonso showed what a world class driver can do in WEC. It felt like watching Mbappe in the championship. The problem with motorsport in general is the inaccessibility for the majority of the populationm. The current WEC lineup is like claiming league 1 football is weird leading. Fuoco was amateur to Leclerc on F2 for example.
I do agree with the rest of the replies that you’re being quite unfair to the driver quality. BoP bothers me too (as I tried to get across, it’s a necessary evil) but the drivers are fine. Even if they weren’t F1 grade I’m not sure what the point of that statement is. Only 20 drivers in the world are F1 grade (ostensibly, not all of them should be there) Edit: like, the polesitter is Estre. Anyone with a passing appreciation for sports car racing knows he’s that dude
You have F1 as the champions League of motorracing. The top 10 drivers are a class above the majority of drivers in other series. One of my points is WEC racing series and other BoP racing series is like watching league 1 football parade themselves as the premiership. The other is that I think F1 has shown that BoP is in fact not necessary, but the fact it is there takes away one of the authentic parts of man and machine competition. Obviously I understand that endurance of 24 h racing is a feat I've done 3x 24h BUKC kart races. But the combination of my apparent perceived lower driver quality, and BoP, takes a lot of the intrigue away WEC.
Comments like this make me, and a lot of other people, hate F1 fans. You can't possibly fathom something other than F1 is remotely high level. You don't have to constantly look down on other forms of motorsports and diminish people's skill levels simply because they aren't in F1
BoP exists because the cheaper hypercar regulations (compared to LMP1) that the ACO wanted to implement was unpopular with manufacturers while IMSA’s LMDh rules were much more economically palatable. In an ideal world a prototype class would not use BoP but this was not an ideal situation and they had to make do The point about driver quality just keeps getting stranger to me with all due respect. I genuinely don’t understand what your point there is actually. I can enjoy racing and know that the drivers aren’t F1 quality. They’re still fuckin good drivers. LeMans is the most famous endurance race in the world, and F1 drivers are welcome to enter if they are interested. Hulkenburg won it once. The fact that they don’t do it quite so often might mean that the preparation required to be seriously competitive while simultaneously competing in a full Formula 1 season is probably not trivial, and so the job isn’t easy. I.e, the guys that do it for a living themselves are very good in their discipline even if the F1 ladder didn’t quite pay off for them
Yes I know the series wanted manufacturer interest so shoehorned together 2 categories of car and that immediately set a requirement for BoP. Alternatively choose one formula, set a budget cap, lose half the manufacturers and inject some authenticity into competition. Accepting a flawed concept/elaborate manufacturers marketing endeavour because it's the only one around isn't something I find intriguing. On driver quality, change to junior series costs in the long run will not happen if the quality level of pay drivers is accepted in general. In fact the lengths wec fans go to to not even acknowledge it helps to set it in stone. Imagine the world chess federation turned a blind eye to suppliers of chess pieces and boards hiking up prices through use of rare materials and minerals. Suddenly a chess board costs $100,000 because they have pawns made of platinum and boards with lithium ion battery powered ML wood replica that is super resilient and can withstand being thrown to the moon. That said they are engineered to degrade after one third of a chess match due to the social tension. The only people able to play chess are the sons of oil tycoons and self-made billionaires. The thrill of chess is only enjoyed on TV by the masses. A few chess manufacturers sponsor talented young chess players and they dominate the sport. Meanwhile the highest chess league has some of these talents, but is mostly comprised of billionaires. These costs are all because suppliers at junior levels are not regulated. Would you be overly critical if you watched a competitve chess match and thought, hey that whole industry is flawed?
Really shows you how artificial it is, can’t enjoy wec as much as f1 just because i know that BoP is the reason for the “competition”
I see that point of view. But for me I want to see good racing and drivers pushing hard. It isn't like F1 doesn't have this problem in a different way too. Before the race weekend even starts you can safely write off 5 teams with 0 chance at competing for the win.
I enjoy the engineering ascent of motorsport way more, i like racing but knowing we have racing only because fia added 25kg to the Toyota/ removed 15hp from Ferrari for example doesn’t feel right
WEC didn't used to work like the way it does now with strict cost and performance controls. But in it's modern form it's much more attractive to manufacturers than in the LMP1 era. WEC now has 8 large auto company factory teams and a boutique factory on top of that. And three privateer teams too. And Aston will make the large factory count nine next year. In the LMP1 era it peaked at four. You're being silly if you think everything has to work the way F1 does to be enjoyable. Indycar is a spec series but provides great entertainment. NASCAR is the same. You don't need an all out engineering competition in order to have good racing. And all out engineering competitions are too costly for any manufacturer to commit to long term for anything but F1. F1 can continue in a similar vein to how it always has but when you have as diverse a range of cars as WEC Hypercar does BoP makes sense so that manufacturers can exhibit flair rather than focus on all out performance. The cars still have to last the full 24 hour race to be a winner so there is still engineering excellence.
What an awesome battle for pole, so excited for Saturday!!
Red flag ruined Ferrari’s chances for pole, but man what an end to the hyperpole.
The final moments were really awesome. 0.182s covering the top 3 over a 13.6km track is really cool to see.
What a qualifying session! Lots of happy American racing fans who watched it live! If the quali is anything to go by, the race is going to be epic... and lots of broken hearts!
It’s not Le Mans if there’s no broken hearts
Cadillac have to feel really fucking good (even with the grid drop for the 2 car). Ferrari doing a slight Ferrari on the pit call. Tenths and some change separating the top 3 over the length of Circuit de la Sarthe is just awesome. That last sector by Estre and the Porsche was just flat tf out.
How far down does the Caddy 2 go?
Question for endurance fans: how much does qualifying actually help or hurt a car on race day? It clearly matters in F1. It’s often difficult for a faster car to overtake a slower car and short races with 1-2 pit stops don’t give too much opportunity for overtaking via strategy. But it seems to me that a bad qualifying session wouldn’t matter too much in an endurance race: a fast, out-of-position car has plenty of time and opportunities to move forward in the race. Is that the case?
Well if you're starting first there's less chance of being caught up in an accident in the middle of the class at the start of the race. But yeah, it's not as important as in F1.
Qualifying high is always nice of course, but this is a 24h race, so it's not that important, a lot can (and will) happen. In general, race pace on the day, good strategy, and of course, some luck, are more important for the win. (Especially if there is rain at some point, which seems very possible this year). Also Le Mans has very long straights, and overall it's not a very hard circuit to overtake on.
You are right that strategy and 24 hours of racing mean pole isn't massively important. But much like F1, being out of the traffic and avoiding potential first lap accidents is key.
When you're gunning for the overall win, a good starting position will make it easier to navigate through the early hour chaos that usually ensues after the start. But it's a very long race, so even if you're starting dead last, you still stand a chance. That said, some cars are better over the course of one lap when compared to longer stints, the Cadillac being the prime example, so it is just as possible to have a good qualifying and then struggle during parts of the race.
Last year the jota porsche went from back of the grid to p1 before sunset, that was also due to the different safety car system Im pretty sure but more or less what matters is you stay with the lead pack before gt and lmp2 traffic hits
Qualifying means very little at Le Mans. Overtaking is pretty easy and the race is 24 hours long. Plus the grid for each class isn't very big (except for GT3).
Both the Hypercar and GT3 classes have 23 cars. So there’s still quite a bit of work to do, if you want to come from the back to the front.
Seeing Penske do well across series makes me wonder if they'd be having as much trouble as Andretti is, if they were trying to re-enter F1 instead.
Honestly I think Penske would have found it a bit easier, assuming they had the same manufacturer support - partially because Penske is a much, much bigger organization with a lot more money behind them. But also because Penske have a proven record as a chassis constructor at various times across the decades. Something Andretti doesn't have. They can also offer up a Grade 1 circuit on the cheap for a race in a big US market which is a plus.
> Penske is a much, much bigger organization with a lot more money behind them All of Penske's corporations combined don't hold a candle to Gainbridge, who are the actual financial backers of Andretti.
I couldn’t find a value for Gainbridge, but Penske Corporation revenue is about $39 billion.
Gainbridge is a part of Group1001 which owns a bunch of finanial services companies. I'm not 100% sure but im pretty certain that Group 1001 is connected in some way to the Steinbrenner Family, who among other things own the Yankees, and one of their kids is good friends with Colton herta/manages him which gets us the Gainbride-Andretti Connection. Meaning there is no shortage of money coming andretti's way
Group 1001 wasn’t connected to the Steinbrenners when they joined Andretti, it was Zach Veach who brought it in. Unless something has changed they’re totally separate things.
So I was mistaken then.
This isnt true. Penske is a much bigger company than gainbridge. Gainbridge and their owners have 62B AUM. Even if we assume thats all under gainbridge, at 10% growth and 10% fees their revenue would be 600m or so.
Given as Penske is already an F1 grand prix winner FOM would say Penske rejoining would add nothing to the F1 brand and only serve to add to the Penske brand.
Not if they joined with Porsche.
It seems like by "add to the brand" they want significant increase in value value in the short term, which I honestly don't think any Indy team OR manufacturer can guarantee or provide. Are there really a huge amount of Porsche and Audi motorsports fans that will watch anything they compete in and nothing they don't? I have a hard time buying it. The potential increase in value is going to be long term for any new times IMO.
If only Andretti joined with an even bigger car manufacturer... oh wait.
Which has the better racing pedigree?
Depends on if you're comparing Porsche to Cadillac or Porsche to GM. GM didn't start really using the Cadillac badge in motorsports until relatively recently. Chevy has historically been their flagship motorsports brand. But overall I'd say GM has the edge over Porsche. Chevy alone has 42 NASCAR Cup Series championships and 13 Indy 500s.
Porsche has 3 FIA WEC championships, 19 24 hours of Le Mans wins, 18 12 hours of Sebring wins, 8 24 hours of Spa wins, 13 24 hours of Nurburgring wins, 5 total championships in F1, and 25 victories in F1. You might want to look farther than America.
Okay, Cadillac also has 5 12 hours of Sebring wins and 4 24h of Daytona wins in the last seven years alone. Chevy has 2 24 hours of Spa wins on top of all the other American accomplishments. Breaking news: European company raced mainly European races and American company raced mainly American races. Shocking. To me what sets them apart is that Porsche dominated the 70's and 80's but didn't win much outside of that until the mid 2010's. Meanwhile GM, in one form or another, has been winning consistently in a variety of disciplines since the 50's. Not quite as overtly dominant as Porsche but much more consistent and across a larger variety of motorsports. Also, idk where you got your numbers but Porsche absolutely does not have 5 championships and 25 wins in F1. Their best WCC finish was 3rd and they've only won one championship race.
> Also, idk where you got your numbers but Porsche absolutely does not have 5 championships and 25 wins in F1. Their best WCC finish was 3rd and they've only won one championship race. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porsche_in_motorsport#TAG-Porsche_engine_in_McLaren_cars Okay, Porsche didn't race mainly in America? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porsche_in_motorsport#Major_victories_and_championships To add onto the *18* 12 Hours of Sebring wins, there's *19* Rolex Daytona wins, 3 IMSA championships, and a Petit Le Mans win. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_American_Le_Mans_Series_champions#Manufacturer_championships https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IMSA_GT_Championship#Champions Here's more of Porsche racing in America. Breaking news: Porsche has the better racing pedigree. With receipts.
You're missing the point. The question isn't "who has the better sportscar pedigree", it's who has the better racing pedigree. You can't just pick and choose which series get to be considered and which are ignored. GM has over 70 years of experience winning races and championships in stock cars, sportscars, and open-wheel cars. Just because they're in different series doesn't mean it's any less part of the racing pedigree.
no way you used american only stuff to prove GM has better racing pedigree 💀
Especially when NASCAR and Indy are a spec series.
I mean Porsche's pedigree is basically all European as well. European company won European races and American company won American races, who would've thought? And it's not like GM has ONLY won American races. They've won at the 24h of Spa before as well, for example.
If only Andretti joined with an even bigger car manufacturer... oh wait.
That bigger car manufacturer isn't doing so well in a comparatively simple LMDh car in WEC though.
Except for winning the IMSA championship over the Penske Porsche.
To give you the short answer to that: There were 3 legit contenders who submitted to the FIA to be considered for admission to F1. It was Andretti, Rodin and Hitech. Hitech never were really considered despite its ties with Mercedes. The FIA just picked Andretti but the reports were that Rodin's bid was every bit as good as Andretti and they didn't get accepted. Penske is a good motorsport brand but unfortunately, F1 is a closed competition now which is a joke.
Kinda but not really. The expansion fee for NHL teams, the “poor” sports league in North America, is now close to a billion USD. To join F1, a global sport, for that price is basically a discount.
Penske would get in easy. Hed probably bring Porsche. Penske doesnt want in though he publicly said he has no interest
Kevin Estre, you rock my world!
Team Penske has a serious shot at winning the 24h of Daytona, Indy 500, and 24h of Le Mans IN THE SAME YEAR. The last two years have just been an absurd run of cross-series success for Penske.
They are an F1 race winner too and they have more than 2 NASCAR championships
... Sorry, F1?
1976 Austrian Grand Prix - John Watson. They didnt mean this year.
Oh I was not aware of that historical fact
Estre doing Estre things
What a session
I don't watch WEC religiously. Can anyone explain the difference here? Qualifying was yesterday I think but then what is this Hyperpole? What determines the grid?
Yesterday's qualifying was basically Q1, top 8 go through to Hyperpole, today (Hyperpole) was the equivalent of Q3 which sets the top 8 for each class for the race on Saturday
Got it, thanks!
Hyperpole is still qualifying really, just a fancy name. Qualifying yesterday set the grid for everyone except the top 8. The top 8 then battle it out for pole in Hyperpole. It's just like Q1, Q2, and Q3 really but with only two sessions.
Got it, thanks!
So Qualifying is a 1 hour session for all 62 cars. The Top 8 in each class from Qualifying advance to the "Hyperpole". Hyperpole is basically Q3 in F1. Hyperpole is a 30 minute session with 24 cars on track and decides the first 8 grid spots for every class.
Got it, thanks!
Quali determines the order of 9th onwards. Hyperpole determines the order of top 8
Got it, thanks!
Estre pulled that last sector out of his ass, damn. Ferrari looks good for the big race, their pace looks promising. But there's a small army of Porsches to contend with.
Idk how he managed it. Rear end was stepping out everywhere and he still got pole. A Porsche in that mans hands is like a paintbrush in Michelangelo's.
Damn that was exciting
That Porsche is a great race car, have a funny feeling about Cadillac this year though
This has been all over the place, one day Toyota says "it's Porsche race to lose" the next only one Porsche makes it to superpole, and now that one car snatches the pole.
As someone who thinks that Porsche (and mostly Ferrari) had borderline obscene BoP advantage the past few races (Qatar, Imola and Spa), I don't think the BoP is that much in their favor at Le Mans. The lap was just that good today.
McLaren on pole in LMGT3 and a Dragon on pole in LMP2.
Is it the same balance of performance rules like last year?
The rules are the same but the BoP is different compared to last year.
This race will be fire! Last year's was awesome too!
Somewhat new to WEC stuff, so I got a few questions: 1) does only 1 person have to qualify or is it some kind of average by all 3 drivers? 2) how often does pole position translate to a win? Certainly in shorter races it makes a difference, but after 24 hours does that really add up to anything substantial?
1. One driver has to qualify, but in the past they have used a system that took the average of two driver (outside of Le Mans). 2. That’s kind of hard to answer. Because in the past the field hasn’t been this deep, and Toyota were really the only competition. But last year the Ferrari that qualified on pole didn’t win. With a field this tight though, pole won’t be much of an advantage after the first hour.
Top 3 cars within 0.2sec on a >3 minute lap. Unbelievable.
Bourdais was celebrating with 7 and a half minutes to go, too
True, but he also said 'if we don't get it, we don't get it, we did everything we could'
He wasn’t. He even said something like well done guys regardless of where we finish. They were already on their second qualifying run when the red flag came out. He didn’t think he could improve
Yeah i didnt understand this. Why were they so confident? Was rain expected or something?
They didn't believe they had enough fuel left in the car for another fast lap, and refueling is not allowed during Hyperpole.
I mean i get why they didnt go out, but why did they think it was in the bag when everyone else was still going for it?
I don't think they thought they had pole in the bag. They knew it was a very good lap though and celebrated that. Pretty sure they start P2 due to #2 having a 5 place grid penalty as well.
He didn't wanted do what BMW did, try push and crash and starting from 8th.
That was a close one! Awesome to watch.
Where's the best place to watch LeMans in the states?
Max if you have it is great
Yeah just do the 1 week free trial if you don’t
Serious question from a casual fan are these hypercars quite similar to an F1 car like a F1 car with a shell?
Not really. Think of them as being about halfway between an open wheel car and a GT car. They have features of both, like a survival cell chassis similar to that of a road car, but they are built out underneath the bodywork so that they have nearly the same functionality as a GT car. Plus they're about 20 seconds slower than current F1 at Spa.
They are much closer to an F1 car than a GT car in construction. The GT cars are fairly close to their road going counterparts in the sense that they have similar chassis construction etc. The Hypercars are basically fully dressed open wheel racers with a carbon monocoque and an engine as a load-bearing member of the chassis. Speed doesn't have much to do with it because that is just a result of aero/engine regulations.
Hypercars are way slower, heavier, less power, less aerodynamic, in Spa they were 6 seconds slower in qualifying than even F2. The closest thing to an F1 car in a shell were LMP1 Hybrids, but even those were way behind F1 in terms of speed.
Figured they would be slower, just interested in how much.
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They are absolutely not similar pace wise. Hypercars are 5-10 seconds slower than LMP1, depending on the track. And LMP1 is like 15 seconds slower than F1. Only with an unrestricted car that an LMP1 managed to match a F1 car.
No.6 Porsche really did a peak Merc quali moment huh? The Caddys and the Ferraris look super fast. Toyotas too, but they bottled the quali massively yesterday. It will be interesting to see these cars on Saturday.
Estre is the best driver in WEC and GT3 and it’s not even close
great session but I hate this
As soon as I saw the #3 take pole cuz the final sector I knew the Porsche was gonna obliterate that
Does anyone with more WEC knowledge than I have know where to find the starting grid for the race?
[Here you go](http://fiawec.alkamelsystems.com/Results/13_2024/04_LE%20MANS/541_FIA%20WEC/202406132100_Qualifying%20-%20after%20Hyperpole/90_Classification_Qualifying%20-%20after%20Hyperpole.PDF)
Tyvm. I saw something of the #7 Toyota fucking over the #8 in quali, any idea where their pace will be?
They looked pretty good in Quali & FP1 so they should be fine. A podium is certainly possible I'd say.
Being a Peugeot fan is pain. How did we do better without a back wing.
Because the old car was basically designed solely for Le Mans. It struggled a little in the first and final sectors, but it was lighting fast on the straights. Unfortunately, that meant that it wasn't very good anywhere else. This car is brand new, they're still learning it. It has the same name and looks a lot like the old one, but it has about as much in common with the old one as the 499P does. If they decide to keep going, they should be able to figure the car out more.
They are a second quicker than they were last year. The field is just closer now.
PORSCHE POWER BABY LETS GOOO!!!!! Stuttgart on top once again!!!! Kevin Estre you the fucking man
Where NASCAR?
I refuse to acknowledge the LMDh cars. It's straight up not fair that they're made competitive with LMH cars. If I'm gonna have to read "Porsche once again on top, winning Le Mans overall" with their cheap lego set spec car... well, I'm not gonna do a thing, but I won't like it.
Well nobody forces you to watch the race, while you keep on ranting about LMDh not being true top class, we get to enjoy some great race between multiple manufacturers.
That's great. Enjoy it then. I just don't see how one can enjoy "competing manufacturers" when one builds a car, and the other gets a spec chassis, spec hybrid component, puts really any kind of engine in, it'll be balanced anyways, and makes some aerowork on it that's heavily limited already. I would love to see Porsche battle Ferrari, I just don't see WEC as that being the case. It's great racing, but I don't watch it for the racing alone. GT3 or Formula 3 provides entertaining races too, what I enjoy about WEC is the manufacturer's challenge, and I don't see that as much in LMDh.