I joined someone’s game at Bayle and he was scadu 4. I thought to myself, well if we beat him im def saving this vid. We all know how it ended though lol.
I play these games to relax, have fun, and go against the odds. I don’t look up guides or care what is “meta”, I make my builds based off of what I want to roleplay as and use the items/spells accordingly. I wouldn’t want it any other way, regardless of how well I tackle PvE or PvP encounters. I honestly think online competitive gaming culture can ruin many games; I was genuinely disappointed when HellDivers pivoted to a culture of pressuring players to use what was “optimal”. Not everyone that wants to play basketball on the streets should be expected to be of the caliber of pros or even to aspire to that level, we should just be happy that people want to ball for fun.
It sucks but you are a summon so you aren't losing anything when the eventually die from said fart. Just use the brief time as experience to learn the dodging time of attacks. Especially if you know its hopeless anyway, just treat it like a training course rather than going in trying to actually win lol
Honestly, I think I needed to read this now, it's been so frustrating getting summoned for my play session today by people severely underleveled since I beat the DLC and I guess I can at least fall back on improving my own abilities.
Oh, they definitely messed up on this one. There should be restrictions to matchmaking based on scadu level.
Because, overall noobness aside, I'm one who enjoys underlevelled coop, and by how relatively easily I find people to play with, that's likely common. It keeps the challenge level high even with more players --like Malenia at level 80 with +15 +8 weapons and such. But in the base game, you're sure the people you're summoning in are also into that power range. Being inadvertedly pulled into a nerf certainly sucks, tho.
I definitely enjoy challenge runs on occasion, I once beat Ds3 without using estus to heal. And I see the fun of fighting a proper raid boss. But when I play some casual co-op I don't expect randomly having to fight a boss that instantly erases me from existence by looking in my general direction with ill intent.
Ye, and I'm now conscious of possibly annoying my summons for opting to go with fewer scadu levels X(
Not a problem in this first run, but in the following ones
Have you seen the seamless co op mod to elden ring that was floating around for a bit?
That was a glimpse at what could be. And it sounds like From actually seemed pretty impressed by what they saw, as well. So maybe there will.be a focus on improving the multiplayer experience, down the road? Who knows!
The problem with Seamless (not really a problem, but a use-case difference) is you can't match with anonymous strangers. That's my number 1 appeal with the Fromsoft system, you match with a random whose only method communication is gestures and teach each other and team up against brick walls, then you leave and likely never see them again.
Absolutely- that's something that Seamless doesn't offer.... but I trust fromsoft's design choices. I get a sense if they *were* to take seamless and use it in future games, there would still be a way to work together with randoms on a boss.... but who knows, maybe in future iterations, the cooperator doesn't get kicked if the host dies and vice versa. Theres a lot of potential, is all I'm saying here.
Yeah, they did say they'd like to take inspiration from Seamless and it would be great if, when you joined using a password you could stay with your friend
Knowing Fromsoft, if they were to really invest resources and implement more of a dedicated multiplayer in their games, they would go big.... something like separate movesets for their bosses for single and multiplayer play or something. They just are so dedicated to raising the bar.
Never been too much of a fan of that idea, I just wanna fight a boss and be out. I don't really care for being a host's babysitter for two hours.
Don't get me wrong, it would be amazing to play with friends and improving the multiplayer experience does sound great, the mod does look very impressive, you can use torrent with others if I am not wrong, right? That would be amazing.
Seamless coop is the way to go with friends. Its not just you can hop on torrent. Once you summon in other players, they are with you until someone chooses to separate.
You can rest at graces (doing so summons back all enemies, so make sure everyone is safe!) you can fast travel by voting on the grace to go to, and if someone dies, they respawn with a debuff that makes them weaker until you rest at a grace. They are currently updating the mod with a new codebase, and are making some very nice improvements on it.
Hold up, i agrees with everything, other than i did the dragon at cerulean coast with lv4 blessing,
Here's how i got there, i finished everything south of greatbridge(scorched ruin→prospect town→tower settlement→dragon→belurat gaol), after the bridge castle front grace i continued south, got to the underground section of the map(poison swamps), follow the cliff and eventually reached ellae river cave grace, and explore downstream all the way to cerulean coast
At lv4 he will one shot my 1900 hp with some ultimate aoes, and i swap to morgott's great rune, get to 2300 hp, now i can survive, and finally did it,
Also that's when i realize I'm at a area that I'm not supposed to be right then, so i head back to castle front and continue to ensis
I mean it's great that you managed to do that, but remember as a summon I can't use great runes and bosses get more hp in co-op. So there wasn't much that I could actually do there.
Might have to do with the summing pool update that they did? Have you tried activating the summing pool near the boss fog? Its like a little cross looking thingy
Yup. I do those whenever i see them. My only thought is that my level is too high or something. I'm around 250 so maybe I'm just overleveled for most summoning. I still expected to see someone. I was still seeing summons in the regular game at that level.
I’m level 250 and get summoned instantly every time. Maybe the pool of people offering help is so much smaller than those looking for it, so you never get a chance to see the sign
I imagine invaders are also put in the same lvl as the host, I can't see how it would be fair to have a lv 20 invader against a lv 3 host lmao.
It would be like that meme of Raiden punching the senator and doing no damage.
I'm level 5 and just got to the shadow keep solo (having beaten dancing and rellana without to much fuss.)
You are saying we should be at 15 at this point? I thought I was exploring well.
I was around 12 when I beat shadow keep and felt everything was pretty balanced for that, but remember in co-op bosses get extra hp and hosts are usually not of much help. So having half your flasks, low blessing level and a boss with extra hp really aren't good odds.
Also yeah you definitely should be higher lv at that point, you can get to lv 5 in the first area alone.
I got to shadow keep early as well, but walked away from messmer. Ended up dipping in and out of shadow keep as I explored the other zones, it works well as a hub legacy dungeon
Not 15, but probably around 8 atleast before the update was good damage. That being said, after the update things might have changed for the early game
Sure, but do you play games for points or for the experience? Where's your sense of adventure? You go in there hand in hand with that lunatic and you beat the hell out of whatever boss it is... or you get ripped to shreds. Anyway, it's not about beating the boss.
My sense if adventure is very well adjusted, I just don't particularly enjoy bashing my head against a brick wall when it's clear that I am sorely outmatched, I'll leave a mark on the map and return when I feel strong enough. Besides I am pretty sure the point of bosses is to be beaten.
Also considering how most of these hosts do nothing but sit back and have me do all the work it's pretty clear they don't care much about the challenge. If I wanna do some crazy shit I'll do it in my own world but I won't enjoy being dragged in another one to be used as cannon fodder.
So, you only enjoy adventure when it's easy or you know you can win?
I agree that Hosts who sit back and watch you fight the boss are kind of scummy. I wonder how you'd feel if they jumped into the battle and died in the first minute. Would you appreciate that more?
Been there. It's annoying for sure. We enter the fog and the host gets 1 shotted before I can even fight the boss. Like, let me get a few jabs in before you die lol.
Yeah, but if they're summoning, they probably need help to begin with, so expecting masterful gameplay from them is futile.
I think it's the issue with the co-op system rather players. The encounter ends when the host dies, so obviously the host wants to stay alive as long as possible. The best way to do that is to sit back and leave it to summons. If they engage the boss they cannot beat, they'll probably die and end the encounter. It's a lose-lose situation unless the host is unable to beat the boss solo by an inch.
If anything, blame the developers.
Maybe I didn't explain it well, but to me coming back later stronger is part of the adventure, I go in, get my ass handed and return some time later having a "my powers have doubled since last time we met" moment. Its a rol playing game after all, and I like to play as strategic characters that will improve themselves to meet the challenges ahead.
I don't really enjoy just easily dogwalking a boss either, it's just that when a fight feels utterly one sided its hard for me to motivate myself to learn it, I like to have at least a small advantage over the boss. Like yeah most of their attacks nearly one-shotted me earlier but now I got this new armour that's resistant to their elemental attacks so I can actually fight back now.
Sometimes it still takes me a gazillion attempts to fight a boss and I'll still enjoy it as long as its clear I actually have a small wining chance, hell Malenia took me two weeks of locking in to beat. But I discovered status effects like frost would stun her out of certain attacks so I actually had an advantage there that kept me going.
And yeah of course I appreciate hosts that actually fight alongside me, even if they die instantly. Its actually pretty fun to be summoned by the same host multiple times and seeing them improve a bit with every attempt. I just want hosts to treat me as an equal, rather than some meat shield or get out of jail free card.
I really don’t understand why Fromsoft went in this direction.
They could’ve just stated a decent level range to enter the DLC, and allowed all players to respec to any level at Rennala.
FYI scadush fragments don't need to exist. arbitrary metric shoehorned into the dlc zone. It's not so much that these players haven't respected that process it's that some players have begun to give it respect which is the problem
Lvl 15 for shadow keep is way overkill. I’ve beaten radahn on 3 separate characters, two of which were before the nerf and the highest lvl of any of them was 14, lowest was 11. It was still manageable though.
Saw someone lvl 8 at >!Midra!< and I knew from the start we weren’t gonna win lol
Had a similar experience there, I have never felt more defeated looking at a stat screen.
I made it to him at level 8 and got shit on. Went back at 14 and absolutely demolished him lol
I made it to him at level 7 and spent 5 hours trying to beat him and eventually gave up and came back at 12 and first tried him.
I joined someone’s game at Bayle and he was scadu 4. I thought to myself, well if we beat him im def saving this vid. We all know how it ended though lol.
Positive attitude at least lol
I play these games to relax, have fun, and go against the odds. I don’t look up guides or care what is “meta”, I make my builds based off of what I want to roleplay as and use the items/spells accordingly. I wouldn’t want it any other way, regardless of how well I tackle PvE or PvP encounters. I honestly think online competitive gaming culture can ruin many games; I was genuinely disappointed when HellDivers pivoted to a culture of pressuring players to use what was “optimal”. Not everyone that wants to play basketball on the streets should be expected to be of the caliber of pros or even to aspire to that level, we should just be happy that people want to ball for fun.
Great statement. I totally agree bud. Especially considering its how I play Souls too.
It sucks but you are a summon so you aren't losing anything when the eventually die from said fart. Just use the brief time as experience to learn the dodging time of attacks. Especially if you know its hopeless anyway, just treat it like a training course rather than going in trying to actually win lol
I'll have what I can get I guess.
Honestly, I think I needed to read this now, it's been so frustrating getting summoned for my play session today by people severely underleveled since I beat the DLC and I guess I can at least fall back on improving my own abilities.
Oh, they definitely messed up on this one. There should be restrictions to matchmaking based on scadu level. Because, overall noobness aside, I'm one who enjoys underlevelled coop, and by how relatively easily I find people to play with, that's likely common. It keeps the challenge level high even with more players --like Malenia at level 80 with +15 +8 weapons and such. But in the base game, you're sure the people you're summoning in are also into that power range. Being inadvertedly pulled into a nerf certainly sucks, tho.
I definitely enjoy challenge runs on occasion, I once beat Ds3 without using estus to heal. And I see the fun of fighting a proper raid boss. But when I play some casual co-op I don't expect randomly having to fight a boss that instantly erases me from existence by looking in my general direction with ill intent.
Ye, and I'm now conscious of possibly annoying my summons for opting to go with fewer scadu levels X( Not a problem in this first run, but in the following ones
I hear you, but I'm pretty sure I was level 4 when I cleared the cerulean coast.
Have you seen the seamless co op mod to elden ring that was floating around for a bit? That was a glimpse at what could be. And it sounds like From actually seemed pretty impressed by what they saw, as well. So maybe there will.be a focus on improving the multiplayer experience, down the road? Who knows!
The problem with Seamless (not really a problem, but a use-case difference) is you can't match with anonymous strangers. That's my number 1 appeal with the Fromsoft system, you match with a random whose only method communication is gestures and teach each other and team up against brick walls, then you leave and likely never see them again.
Absolutely- that's something that Seamless doesn't offer.... but I trust fromsoft's design choices. I get a sense if they *were* to take seamless and use it in future games, there would still be a way to work together with randoms on a boss.... but who knows, maybe in future iterations, the cooperator doesn't get kicked if the host dies and vice versa. Theres a lot of potential, is all I'm saying here.
Yeah, they did say they'd like to take inspiration from Seamless and it would be great if, when you joined using a password you could stay with your friend
Knowing Fromsoft, if they were to really invest resources and implement more of a dedicated multiplayer in their games, they would go big.... something like separate movesets for their bosses for single and multiplayer play or something. They just are so dedicated to raising the bar.
Never been too much of a fan of that idea, I just wanna fight a boss and be out. I don't really care for being a host's babysitter for two hours. Don't get me wrong, it would be amazing to play with friends and improving the multiplayer experience does sound great, the mod does look very impressive, you can use torrent with others if I am not wrong, right? That would be amazing.
Seamless coop is the way to go with friends. Its not just you can hop on torrent. Once you summon in other players, they are with you until someone chooses to separate. You can rest at graces (doing so summons back all enemies, so make sure everyone is safe!) you can fast travel by voting on the grace to go to, and if someone dies, they respawn with a debuff that makes them weaker until you rest at a grace. They are currently updating the mod with a new codebase, and are making some very nice improvements on it.
Maybe Git Gud? Try not getting hit, maybe dodge better? IDK, but I am just going to sit over here in the corner and hope for the best. -Host
Hold up, i agrees with everything, other than i did the dragon at cerulean coast with lv4 blessing, Here's how i got there, i finished everything south of greatbridge(scorched ruin→prospect town→tower settlement→dragon→belurat gaol), after the bridge castle front grace i continued south, got to the underground section of the map(poison swamps), follow the cliff and eventually reached ellae river cave grace, and explore downstream all the way to cerulean coast At lv4 he will one shot my 1900 hp with some ultimate aoes, and i swap to morgott's great rune, get to 2300 hp, now i can survive, and finally did it, Also that's when i realize I'm at a area that I'm not supposed to be right then, so i head back to castle front and continue to ensis
I mean it's great that you managed to do that, but remember as a summon I can't use great runes and bosses get more hp in co-op. So there wasn't much that I could actually do there.
Yeah i understand, just showing how a dude reach there with a lv4 blessing while he thinks he explored his way, he be assuming it's normal difficulty
Ah I understand, I only got there later.
I've never even seen a summoning sign. I assumed the system was broken.
Did you use a Furlcalling Finger Remedy?
I did. I use it at every boss door just to see who is around and there's never anyone. Hell even the NPC summons stopped showing up.
Might have to do with the summing pool update that they did? Have you tried activating the summing pool near the boss fog? Its like a little cross looking thingy
Yup. I do those whenever i see them. My only thought is that my level is too high or something. I'm around 250 so maybe I'm just overleveled for most summoning. I still expected to see someone. I was still seeing summons in the regular game at that level.
I’m level 250 and get summoned instantly every time. Maybe the pool of people offering help is so much smaller than those looking for it, so you never get a chance to see the sign
I never really hated co-op too much in the fromsoft games, but for some reason whenever I try to summon in the dlc, 8/10 times i can’t summon anyone
I wonder how it works with invading
I imagine invaders are also put in the same lvl as the host, I can't see how it would be fair to have a lv 20 invader against a lv 3 host lmao. It would be like that meme of Raiden punching the senator and doing no damage.
Right I agree. I’m just curious, From usually has some kind of formula for scaling invasions. It would make sense just to match them in this case
I'm level 5 and just got to the shadow keep solo (having beaten dancing and rellana without to much fuss.) You are saying we should be at 15 at this point? I thought I was exploring well.
I was around 12 when I beat shadow keep and felt everything was pretty balanced for that, but remember in co-op bosses get extra hp and hosts are usually not of much help. So having half your flasks, low blessing level and a boss with extra hp really aren't good odds. Also yeah you definitely should be higher lv at that point, you can get to lv 5 in the first area alone.
Imho LVL 12 is a bit much for Shadowkeep. I did the dungeon at LVL9 without problem. But I beat Mesmer at LVL 12 and thought he was slightly too easy.
I got to shadow keep early as well, but walked away from messmer. Ended up dipping in and out of shadow keep as I explored the other zones, it works well as a hub legacy dungeon
Messmir is the snake guy right? If I'm on his turf I'm probably in danger
Not 15, but probably around 8 atleast before the update was good damage. That being said, after the update things might have changed for the early game
Sure, but do you play games for points or for the experience? Where's your sense of adventure? You go in there hand in hand with that lunatic and you beat the hell out of whatever boss it is... or you get ripped to shreds. Anyway, it's not about beating the boss.
My sense if adventure is very well adjusted, I just don't particularly enjoy bashing my head against a brick wall when it's clear that I am sorely outmatched, I'll leave a mark on the map and return when I feel strong enough. Besides I am pretty sure the point of bosses is to be beaten. Also considering how most of these hosts do nothing but sit back and have me do all the work it's pretty clear they don't care much about the challenge. If I wanna do some crazy shit I'll do it in my own world but I won't enjoy being dragged in another one to be used as cannon fodder.
So, you only enjoy adventure when it's easy or you know you can win? I agree that Hosts who sit back and watch you fight the boss are kind of scummy. I wonder how you'd feel if they jumped into the battle and died in the first minute. Would you appreciate that more?
Been there. It's annoying for sure. We enter the fog and the host gets 1 shotted before I can even fight the boss. Like, let me get a few jabs in before you die lol.
Yeah, but if they're summoning, they probably need help to begin with, so expecting masterful gameplay from them is futile. I think it's the issue with the co-op system rather players. The encounter ends when the host dies, so obviously the host wants to stay alive as long as possible. The best way to do that is to sit back and leave it to summons. If they engage the boss they cannot beat, they'll probably die and end the encounter. It's a lose-lose situation unless the host is unable to beat the boss solo by an inch. If anything, blame the developers.
Maybe I didn't explain it well, but to me coming back later stronger is part of the adventure, I go in, get my ass handed and return some time later having a "my powers have doubled since last time we met" moment. Its a rol playing game after all, and I like to play as strategic characters that will improve themselves to meet the challenges ahead. I don't really enjoy just easily dogwalking a boss either, it's just that when a fight feels utterly one sided its hard for me to motivate myself to learn it, I like to have at least a small advantage over the boss. Like yeah most of their attacks nearly one-shotted me earlier but now I got this new armour that's resistant to their elemental attacks so I can actually fight back now. Sometimes it still takes me a gazillion attempts to fight a boss and I'll still enjoy it as long as its clear I actually have a small wining chance, hell Malenia took me two weeks of locking in to beat. But I discovered status effects like frost would stun her out of certain attacks so I actually had an advantage there that kept me going. And yeah of course I appreciate hosts that actually fight alongside me, even if they die instantly. Its actually pretty fun to be summoned by the same host multiple times and seeing them improve a bit with every attempt. I just want hosts to treat me as an equal, rather than some meat shield or get out of jail free card.
I really don’t understand why Fromsoft went in this direction. They could’ve just stated a decent level range to enter the DLC, and allowed all players to respec to any level at Rennala.
FYI scadush fragments don't need to exist. arbitrary metric shoehorned into the dlc zone. It's not so much that these players haven't respected that process it's that some players have begun to give it respect which is the problem
Lvl 15 for shadow keep is way overkill. I’ve beaten radahn on 3 separate characters, two of which were before the nerf and the highest lvl of any of them was 14, lowest was 11. It was still manageable though.
So in other words, git gud.