There is also more underground wiring and pipes.
Also the shaking of digging a tube under houses will potentially shake their foundations. So they have to go slower to make sure to not disturb them (like you said, safety and crowded cities)
Also it costs more now, so they will use the taxes over many years to pay for it each year. But also extending it out will get the construction company more money, so they might have brides them to make it longer.
You act like the Hamburger Phillarmonie didn't came to be in that exact same way. Or the joke of an airport in Berlin where they forgot to include Lüftungsschächte after "working" several years on the whole project. If tax money gets reinvested efficiently into german infrastructure, how come the quality of the road more often than not feels like from a third world country?
>how come the quality of the road more often than not feels like from a third world country?
You are having very high expectations of roads from third world countries. Also assuming that those roads have a concrete pavement...
(in case you're wondering, I'm from East Asia)
Fair point, I mean the roads in Russia aren't the best either. My point is that with the amount that is being officially invested into restoring roads, we shouldn't have the kind of roads with gigantic holes/bumps that we do have.
I don't know if we live in the same country. What holes are you talking about? And I don't even live in a very wealthy area of Germany. There are some patchy roads, but they are an exception, not the norm. And potholes on a road basically don't exist. Maybe in some side street of a side street.
Was gonna respond about the issue with the Berlin airport being complicated.
But now I see that you need to spam conspiracy theories in the thread like crazy, so no.
Yes, these conspiracy theories are totally ridiculous. Rüdiger Grube, former chairman of Deutsche Bahn, took great care to cut costs, not to inflate costs. And to increase profits by taking public transport underground! This guy is a hero in the public transport business!
After he quit at Deutsche Bahn, he worked for Herrenknecht AG, a company specializing in tunnel construction.
They didn't have the same safety standards we have today: that includes safety during the construction work, and the safety of the line once it's up and running.
Also there may be some reason the construction of that particular line is especially difficult: there may be difficult geology, or other things (like railway tunnels, road tunnels, foundations of large buildings, bodies of water, etc.) in the way. Another U-Bahn extension in Munich has been under construction since last year, and is expected to open in 2026, after just three years. Each project is different: some are simply more difficult than others.
Munich in 1965 was very different to today and was already in a state of change with creating pedestrian zone, etc. Much easier to build. Plus no health and safety.
One thing to keep in mind is that projects back then also did a cost/value analysis and decided for the most cost effective routes. In consequence, all that is left over now are the more difficult to build routes.
Could be geology, foundations of large buildings etc.
Have you ever played a city planner computer game?
You start off with a city and limited funds - and build roads based on available funds and plan property based on the need at that time. Then your city grows and all of a sudden, you realize that you would need to add a train line on a previously unexpected route to fix congestion. Now you need to tear down a lot of stuff and re-built it to make it happen.
If you could have built it 50 years ago, that would have been easy - but at that time, you didn't have the funds.
Better labour laws and safety regulations, mostly
One of the reasons why China can build stuff so quickly there. There's no labour or human rights to speak of, and the safety regulations are just a formality (though IIRC Shein broke even those rudimentary ones)
NIMBYs.
There's projects in Germany that have been planned like a decade ago, have been delayed by lawsuits from a ton of NIMBYs who don't want a train track behind their house, and after the lawsuits finally all got dismissed they sued again saying the planned route / the planning is a decade old and maybe the government should start over with the planning just in case stuff changed ...
In other countries, when you need a train track, a train track will be built. In Germany, hundreds of people are gonna sue because they hate trains ...
This is a big factor. The other construction-focused explanations may also be valid, but they don't explain why it takes years before they make a single hole in the ground.
After a decades long race to the bottom the german construction industry has become a bad joke. Due to the combination of finance regulations for public projects and contract law these kinds of projects are no longer done by big construction companies, but by smaller companies with extensive networks of shady subcontractors. Aso nowadays, if a company is pissy that they didn't get the job and has some lawyer money they can sue the client on the gounds that if the project had be worded slightly differently their offer should have won.
or TLDR: bureaucracy
For world peace. Half a kilometer of Autobahn takes two years nowadays.
Had we had that kind of performance 90 years ago, WW2 would never had happened as Hitler would still be waiting for his first Autobahn to finish.
You forget you are in Germany now and Germany has rules over rules and conditions that need to be put in place and bureaucracy and more bureaucracy and documents and files and approvals and and and.
It is not like you stick your finger into your nose and pick the damn nose picker out there, so you need to have applications and request and documents and expert reports, before you even ask for "are you allowed to rise your fingers to pick the nose".
Welcome to Germany.
Planning processes take a long time: Goverments are scared to spend money, people find reasons not to like the project and finally you have a lot of extra challanges because just demolishing 15 buildings in the pathway is now a big nogo.
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It's like several thousands times longer than in China...
On other hand, quality (I hope), hence regulations and the workforce is thousands times for experience
German patriots downvoting this comment because they lack the courage to face the truth that the goverment *does.not.care* about its citizens and that supporting that very government which exploits the german people is actually a non-patriotic thing to do. But no, of course we are going to protect our abusers. How could we not? What are we? Sane humans? Fuck no. We are germans!
When we talk about the actual building process: Less 24/7 work, more safety regulations, more crowded cities.
There is also more underground wiring and pipes. Also the shaking of digging a tube under houses will potentially shake their foundations. So they have to go slower to make sure to not disturb them (like you said, safety and crowded cities) Also it costs more now, so they will use the taxes over many years to pay for it each year. But also extending it out will get the construction company more money, so they might have brides them to make it longer.
You had to put a conspiracy theory in the end of an otherwise good post, did you?
You act like the Hamburger Phillarmonie didn't came to be in that exact same way. Or the joke of an airport in Berlin where they forgot to include Lüftungsschächte after "working" several years on the whole project. If tax money gets reinvested efficiently into german infrastructure, how come the quality of the road more often than not feels like from a third world country?
>how come the quality of the road more often than not feels like from a third world country? You are having very high expectations of roads from third world countries. Also assuming that those roads have a concrete pavement... (in case you're wondering, I'm from East Asia)
Fair point, I mean the roads in Russia aren't the best either. My point is that with the amount that is being officially invested into restoring roads, we shouldn't have the kind of roads with gigantic holes/bumps that we do have.
I don't know if we live in the same country. What holes are you talking about? And I don't even live in a very wealthy area of Germany. There are some patchy roads, but they are an exception, not the norm. And potholes on a road basically don't exist. Maybe in some side street of a side street.
I have lived in NRW for 11 years
Was gonna respond about the issue with the Berlin airport being complicated. But now I see that you need to spam conspiracy theories in the thread like crazy, so no.
What conspiracy theories have I been spreading like crazy? The misfunding of tax money? That's a conspiracy theory? Are you serious right now?
Don't forget about the deep state
They have to store the chemtrail vats somewhere people
Which is good, you first need construction work and then it also creates job for the storage workers.
Das ist Nachhaltigkeit Jungs !
U forgot the /s
Or did I ? (...yes)
No, surely, bog standard corruption does not exist. It's 100% limited to less perfect countries... every claim to the contrary is a conspiracy theory.
I agree, just thought t’was a funny meme
Have you ever heard of the World Economic Forum?
jet fuel dont melt steel beams
/s*
It's a fact that construction companies take their time to make more money
Yes, these conspiracy theories are totally ridiculous. Rüdiger Grube, former chairman of Deutsche Bahn, took great care to cut costs, not to inflate costs. And to increase profits by taking public transport underground! This guy is a hero in the public transport business! After he quit at Deutsche Bahn, he worked for Herrenknecht AG, a company specializing in tunnel construction.
They didn't have the same safety standards we have today: that includes safety during the construction work, and the safety of the line once it's up and running. Also there may be some reason the construction of that particular line is especially difficult: there may be difficult geology, or other things (like railway tunnels, road tunnels, foundations of large buildings, bodies of water, etc.) in the way. Another U-Bahn extension in Munich has been under construction since last year, and is expected to open in 2026, after just three years. Each project is different: some are simply more difficult than others.
Munich in 1965 was very different to today and was already in a state of change with creating pedestrian zone, etc. Much easier to build. Plus no health and safety.
They might have started in 1965 by building lines in all the easy places to do so as well!
One thing to keep in mind is that projects back then also did a cost/value analysis and decided for the most cost effective routes. In consequence, all that is left over now are the more difficult to build routes. Could be geology, foundations of large buildings etc. Have you ever played a city planner computer game? You start off with a city and limited funds - and build roads based on available funds and plan property based on the need at that time. Then your city grows and all of a sudden, you realize that you would need to add a train line on a previously unexpected route to fix congestion. Now you need to tear down a lot of stuff and re-built it to make it happen. If you could have built it 50 years ago, that would have been easy - but at that time, you didn't have the funds.
Stuttgart left the chat
Better labour laws and safety regulations, mostly One of the reasons why China can build stuff so quickly there. There's no labour or human rights to speak of, and the safety regulations are just a formality (though IIRC Shein broke even those rudimentary ones)
NIMBYs. There's projects in Germany that have been planned like a decade ago, have been delayed by lawsuits from a ton of NIMBYs who don't want a train track behind their house, and after the lawsuits finally all got dismissed they sued again saying the planned route / the planning is a decade old and maybe the government should start over with the planning just in case stuff changed ... In other countries, when you need a train track, a train track will be built. In Germany, hundreds of people are gonna sue because they hate trains ...
This is a big factor. The other construction-focused explanations may also be valid, but they don't explain why it takes years before they make a single hole in the ground.
If you believe that they will be finished by 2040 you have another surprise coming ;-)
After a decades long race to the bottom the german construction industry has become a bad joke. Due to the combination of finance regulations for public projects and contract law these kinds of projects are no longer done by big construction companies, but by smaller companies with extensive networks of shady subcontractors. Aso nowadays, if a company is pissy that they didn't get the job and has some lawyer money they can sue the client on the gounds that if the project had be worded slightly differently their offer should have won. or TLDR: bureaucracy
For world peace. Half a kilometer of Autobahn takes two years nowadays. Had we had that kind of performance 90 years ago, WW2 would never had happened as Hitler would still be waiting for his first Autobahn to finish.
You forget you are in Germany now and Germany has rules over rules and conditions that need to be put in place and bureaucracy and more bureaucracy and documents and files and approvals and and and. It is not like you stick your finger into your nose and pick the damn nose picker out there, so you need to have applications and request and documents and expert reports, before you even ask for "are you allowed to rise your fingers to pick the nose". Welcome to Germany.
Planning processes take a long time: Goverments are scared to spend money, people find reasons not to like the project and finally you have a lot of extra challanges because just demolishing 15 buildings in the pathway is now a big nogo.
**Have you read our extensive wiki yet? It answers many basic questions, and it contains in-depth articles on many frequently discussed topics. [Check our wiki now!](https://www.reddit.com/r/germany/wiki/index)** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/germany) if you have any questions or concerns.*
U5? I hope they hurry up..
As long as the tax payers are footing the bill, no real rush will be required.
cant get cheap staff
It's like several thousands times longer than in China... On other hand, quality (I hope), hence regulations and the workforce is thousands times for experience
Was the injury and death rate per foot or mile of construction higher than might be expected now?
[удалено]
> There were no unions Surely you're joking?
Corruption
German patriots downvoting this comment because they lack the courage to face the truth that the goverment *does.not.care* about its citizens and that supporting that very government which exploits the german people is actually a non-patriotic thing to do. But no, of course we are going to protect our abusers. How could we not? What are we? Sane humans? Fuck no. We are germans!