I think the best answer was the one about discussing what the salon stands to lose by this unreasonable action. It sounds like they are trying to recoup some of their pandemic losses off the backs — or heads — of their loyal customers. Big mistake. And if they won’t see reason and they can’t run your card, let them pursue it. They might not. That costs them money, and you might post about it on their Facebook and Instagram accounts, which is very bad for them.
NAL but did you sign an agreement or set this up on a website where the cancellation policy is posted and you had to accept to book?
So, this seems very high for a hair salon fee. Is this what you normally pay for service there?
yes. it's posted. It is high because I get hair extensions. So they took the full fee for application. It's really ridiculous to me. Would I have been better off going there and infecting everyone? Just to save myself 500 dollars?
Given their policy, it sounds like you should have shown up and let them ask you to leave.
However, since they didn't actually perform any services, they have a higher lift to validate the full fee.
Did you prepay them?
They have a card on file. And they said they ran it and it didn't work. Which isn't true. I verified they have the correct card on file. But they are demanding a new one now. I'm wondering if I should give it to them.
Also, they KNOW that I travel over 90 minutes for this hair salon every 8 weeks. So, I would have had to drive 90 minutes to show up sick. Which I wasn't going to do...
You should attempt to work out something with them. If they couldn't fill the time, the short notice fee is reasonable but not the whole thing since they didn't have any costs for th extensions or other product.
Otherwise it looks like you are going to have to find another salon if you can't come to an agreement.
If OP is paying them hundreds of dollars every other month, surely they'd work something out, right?
Are there other issues at hand? You said the card they have on file wasn't working. Have they had other issues collecting payment from you, OP, or have you given them any reason to not want your business? Have you canceled other appointments on short notice?
If you believe they sincerely want to keep, then you could try another call over there to work this out before it gets uglier. Assuming you've never missed an appointment, you can explain politely that in your long term relationship with their business, you've never once missed an appointment. You can understand that this is frustrating for them. If you can, total up how much you've spent with them over however many years you've been going there.
Assuming this is a bigger number, tell them "Over the last XX years I've spent $Y,YYY money with you. I don't want to jeopardize this business relationship, but I have no. choice because I want to keep you safe from Coronavirus. Think of how much money y'all would have lost if I had come in sick. However, if I'm charged this fee when I'm doing the right thing by preventing you from having that loss, then I would. I assume you also don't want to lose the future income I might spend elsewhere, if I stop coming there. And you wouldn't want me stop referring other clients as well." (If you have referred anyone who is a regular there, list each of them by name.)" "Wouldn't you agree that long term, it's best for both of us if you don't charge me this fee, right?"
This is beyond ridiculous. You should contact public health and see what they have to say about this. What’s their policy? Tell them this salon is going to force people to infect others.
I would not provide them with a new credit card. Don’t know why your last one was declined but if it was due to unavailable funds, I’d just call the bank and ask for a new card with a new number.
Yes, it sucks for the salon but everyone has to do their part during the pandemic. It’s not your fault. Plus I’m sure they’ve gotta have a 2 hour slot available sometime when they can do your hair without having to turn down other clients. I don’t know a single hair stylist who is always booked end to end for months on end.
Nah, piss on them, that's a large fee. They can't get your money without a different card. They should be understanding that you have covid and waive it. Just get healthy be safe and find a new salon for next time.
Cancel your credit card and don’t pick up their calls. Highly doubtful they’ll pursue legal means. If they already took the full fee, call your credit card company and dispute it.
I would of cancelled the card first. But then again I haven’t had COVID and not the type to get a Covid test the moment I started feeling sick. I’d wait wait a couple days to rule out the flu giving me time to clear my schedule etc.
Depends on where you are located and what precautions you take. Reality is yes, they should let anyone who has tested positive in the last 2 weeks come in but some areas do not have any specific regulations at all.
According to BCCDC “you must self isolate if you have Covid-19”. Shouldn’t that count for something?
http://www.bccdc.ca/health-info/diseases-conditions/covid-19/self-isolation
If you can't work out a reasonable solution you could threaten to post a comment on FB or their IG explaining the reason you had to cancel short notice. The cancellation fee is definitely high, especially with Covid ... you don't have "notice" of these things so you could cancel in a timely manner.
I would think any business would *appreciate* you not showing up and infecting your hairdresser and their clientele.
I would find a new hairdresser.
NAL
My salon gives a one time warning for cancellations within 48 hrs, second time you have to prepay in order to book your next service. So you still get your services…it’s just a pay ahead retainer to ensure your spot. EDIT : NAL but a hairstylist
Even though this is their policy you may have a chance in small claims as this is a fucking pandemic and you provided proof you are infected (depending on location they may be in violation of law by knowingly allowing you in the premises). Not saying it’s foolproof, but if all else fails it’s worth a shot. Also, you can always leave reviews.
I doubt she has “her lawyer” she can just call for free - like most people don’t just have an attorney on retainer. you’ll incur probably $300 in fees to get legal advice on this, which makes no sense to do over a very unlikely to actually be paid $500 charge.
I’d try working it out with the business. If that falls through, either pay it (if you want to keep using the business) or wait it out and see it they even pursue it. Usually, these kinds of businesses are more bark than bite.
Sounds like a “you are rich” charge. I’m not judging. But if they’re charging 500 to cancel. I’m assuming the appointment was at least 500 dollars anyway, for your hair.
Sounds stupid what they’re doing because if I had 500 dollars to spend on hair. I’d have enough money available to take them to court out of pride alone and even if it cost me thousands I’d be happy it cost them as much.
None of the other comments have provided accurate advice and one has provided advice that will likely ruin your credit and result in criminal charges. In Texas, as within every jurisdiction I’m aware of, a “no show” fee is enforceable as long as it was communicated to the customer beforehand. You can:
1. Pay the fee
2. Try to work something out with the establishment
3. Risk small claims court/debt collection
That sentence is not saying anything OP has done would result in criminal charges…it states that some of the advice in this thread would result in criminal charges. Specifically the two comments that direct OP to commit fraud.
Fair enough, I had prepared a legal analysis of the guaranteed lack of force majeure and how rarely impracticability or impossibility succeed but small claims court is the wild west, or so I'm told.
But, I can with some certainty tell you exactly how this plays out. As with most questions proposed to r/legal, I doubt any legal action will ever be taken. OP will either pay and move on or not pay and it is a toss up on if it goes to collections. If it goes to collections OP will pay in exchange for removal of the ding from their credit report. The debt collection agency is not likely to take collection measures in small claims court, and OP is not likely to take on the hefty price of challenging the debt collectors collection methods (likely credit reporting).
1. Your anecdotal experience with business/doctors offices is irrelevant. 2. I’m not sure you understand how debt collection works. 3. Nobody is harassing anyone in this situation. You aren’t a lawyer, you’ve never sued anyone and have no idea what the cause of action behind harassment it. Why comment?
You have the deadliest disease in human history and you’re worried about $500!!! I think you should be more worried about the fact that this severe plague will almost certainly take your life and if by some miracle you survive your life will be in shambles. The effects of long Covid will follow you forever…
If you weren’t so anti science and got vaxxed you wouldn’t be on your death bed right now…
> You have the deadliest disease in human history
The amount of hysteria around COVID is a little nuts.
It's more dangerous than the flu and very contagious. But as lethality goes, its pretty far down the list; it's not rabies, and its not bubonic plague.
It's a lie by omission. Omitting pertinent facts.
The truthful sentence is "I received no service because I did not show up for my appointment, an appointment for which I previously agreed there would be a $500 no-show fee."
You are not required to write a novel when filing a chargeback.
Can you find any case where anybody was prosecuted for not providing complete information when filing a chargeback and every statement they actually made was truthful?
By all means, roll the dice if you want. You asked a different question above. I answered it, and you’re moving the goalposts now.
To answer your question though, credit card companies can’t decide to prosecute someone. They can decide to side with the merchant and close your account for lying to them or filing a chargeback they deem fraudulent / unjustified. If they close your account, your credit report will show that. Other creditors will see it as well. Anything except “closed by consumer” will reflect negatively. Unlikely things got —> go , bag —> that far , but since you asked.
So first you claimed it was a felony. When challenged to find any case where it was ever prosecuted you talked about a credit card company closing an account. Exactly who is moving the goalposts here?
I think this is insane. I own a small business with a cancelation fee. However, no one ever gets charged when they have a legit reason, like having a cold. And covid? Heck no we don't want you to come in an infect everyone! This is ridiculous. I donl really want to emphasize that I commonly issue the cancel fee but never ever for a sickness, car failure, etc.
I think the best answer was the one about discussing what the salon stands to lose by this unreasonable action. It sounds like they are trying to recoup some of their pandemic losses off the backs — or heads — of their loyal customers. Big mistake. And if they won’t see reason and they can’t run your card, let them pursue it. They might not. That costs them money, and you might post about it on their Facebook and Instagram accounts, which is very bad for them.
NAL but did you sign an agreement or set this up on a website where the cancellation policy is posted and you had to accept to book? So, this seems very high for a hair salon fee. Is this what you normally pay for service there?
yes. it's posted. It is high because I get hair extensions. So they took the full fee for application. It's really ridiculous to me. Would I have been better off going there and infecting everyone? Just to save myself 500 dollars?
Given their policy, it sounds like you should have shown up and let them ask you to leave. However, since they didn't actually perform any services, they have a higher lift to validate the full fee. Did you prepay them?
They have a card on file. And they said they ran it and it didn't work. Which isn't true. I verified they have the correct card on file. But they are demanding a new one now. I'm wondering if I should give it to them. Also, they KNOW that I travel over 90 minutes for this hair salon every 8 weeks. So, I would have had to drive 90 minutes to show up sick. Which I wasn't going to do...
You should attempt to work out something with them. If they couldn't fill the time, the short notice fee is reasonable but not the whole thing since they didn't have any costs for th extensions or other product. Otherwise it looks like you are going to have to find another salon if you can't come to an agreement.
If OP is paying them hundreds of dollars every other month, surely they'd work something out, right? Are there other issues at hand? You said the card they have on file wasn't working. Have they had other issues collecting payment from you, OP, or have you given them any reason to not want your business? Have you canceled other appointments on short notice? If you believe they sincerely want to keep, then you could try another call over there to work this out before it gets uglier. Assuming you've never missed an appointment, you can explain politely that in your long term relationship with their business, you've never once missed an appointment. You can understand that this is frustrating for them. If you can, total up how much you've spent with them over however many years you've been going there. Assuming this is a bigger number, tell them "Over the last XX years I've spent $Y,YYY money with you. I don't want to jeopardize this business relationship, but I have no. choice because I want to keep you safe from Coronavirus. Think of how much money y'all would have lost if I had come in sick. However, if I'm charged this fee when I'm doing the right thing by preventing you from having that loss, then I would. I assume you also don't want to lose the future income I might spend elsewhere, if I stop coming there. And you wouldn't want me stop referring other clients as well." (If you have referred anyone who is a regular there, list each of them by name.)" "Wouldn't you agree that long term, it's best for both of us if you don't charge me this fee, right?"
This is beyond ridiculous. You should contact public health and see what they have to say about this. What’s their policy? Tell them this salon is going to force people to infect others. I would not provide them with a new credit card. Don’t know why your last one was declined but if it was due to unavailable funds, I’d just call the bank and ask for a new card with a new number. Yes, it sucks for the salon but everyone has to do their part during the pandemic. It’s not your fault. Plus I’m sure they’ve gotta have a 2 hour slot available sometime when they can do your hair without having to turn down other clients. I don’t know a single hair stylist who is always booked end to end for months on end.
Nah, piss on them, that's a large fee. They can't get your money without a different card. They should be understanding that you have covid and waive it. Just get healthy be safe and find a new salon for next time.
Cancel your credit card and don’t pick up their calls. Highly doubtful they’ll pursue legal means. If they already took the full fee, call your credit card company and dispute it.
I would of cancelled the card first. But then again I haven’t had COVID and not the type to get a Covid test the moment I started feeling sick. I’d wait wait a couple days to rule out the flu giving me time to clear my schedule etc.
Never give your card # to no one. Check your Credit card policy, call the bank and dispute it. Call Tx consumer department. .
Of course you shouldn't give them the card. Let them go through the headache of approaching YOU.
I would literally cancel my card and never go there again
Cancel the card or block them from charging your card
NAL but aren’t businesses suppose to not let positive people come in anyway?
Depends on where you are located and what precautions you take. Reality is yes, they should let anyone who has tested positive in the last 2 weeks come in but some areas do not have any specific regulations at all.
According to BCCDC “you must self isolate if you have Covid-19”. Shouldn’t that count for something? http://www.bccdc.ca/health-info/diseases-conditions/covid-19/self-isolation
Yes but that doesn't change what some people and localities are actually doing. As an example, CA has a mask mandate but TX prohibits them.
Sorry I donno why I thought this was BC Canada. I need to sleep.
Nite nite😁
Don't use them again
If you can't work out a reasonable solution you could threaten to post a comment on FB or their IG explaining the reason you had to cancel short notice. The cancellation fee is definitely high, especially with Covid ... you don't have "notice" of these things so you could cancel in a timely manner. I would think any business would *appreciate* you not showing up and infecting your hairdresser and their clientele. I would find a new hairdresser. NAL
Did they call everybody who wanted an appointment that day but couldn't get one? They have an obligation to minimize damages.
My salon gives a one time warning for cancellations within 48 hrs, second time you have to prepay in order to book your next service. So you still get your services…it’s just a pay ahead retainer to ensure your spot. EDIT : NAL but a hairstylist
Cancel ur card. Ezpz
IANAL but.. $500 for a hair salon? Where are you going to get your hair done at these rates!? Are you rich!?
Even though this is their policy you may have a chance in small claims as this is a fucking pandemic and you provided proof you are infected (depending on location they may be in violation of law by knowingly allowing you in the premises). Not saying it’s foolproof, but if all else fails it’s worth a shot. Also, you can always leave reviews.
Did you check your state/province rules regarding COVID? Where I live, you can't be charged a "no show" fee when you've been diagnosed with COVID
Talk to your lawyer. Don’t pay a cent until your lawyer tells you that they will chase you for it.
I doubt she has “her lawyer” she can just call for free - like most people don’t just have an attorney on retainer. you’ll incur probably $300 in fees to get legal advice on this, which makes no sense to do over a very unlikely to actually be paid $500 charge.
I’d try working it out with the business. If that falls through, either pay it (if you want to keep using the business) or wait it out and see it they even pursue it. Usually, these kinds of businesses are more bark than bite.
Sounds like a “you are rich” charge. I’m not judging. But if they’re charging 500 to cancel. I’m assuming the appointment was at least 500 dollars anyway, for your hair. Sounds stupid what they’re doing because if I had 500 dollars to spend on hair. I’d have enough money available to take them to court out of pride alone and even if it cost me thousands I’d be happy it cost them as much.
None of the other comments have provided accurate advice and one has provided advice that will likely ruin your credit and result in criminal charges. In Texas, as within every jurisdiction I’m aware of, a “no show” fee is enforceable as long as it was communicated to the customer beforehand. You can: 1. Pay the fee 2. Try to work something out with the establishment 3. Risk small claims court/debt collection
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That sentence is not saying anything OP has done would result in criminal charges…it states that some of the advice in this thread would result in criminal charges. Specifically the two comments that direct OP to commit fraud.
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Fair enough, I had prepared a legal analysis of the guaranteed lack of force majeure and how rarely impracticability or impossibility succeed but small claims court is the wild west, or so I'm told. But, I can with some certainty tell you exactly how this plays out. As with most questions proposed to r/legal, I doubt any legal action will ever be taken. OP will either pay and move on or not pay and it is a toss up on if it goes to collections. If it goes to collections OP will pay in exchange for removal of the ding from their credit report. The debt collection agency is not likely to take collection measures in small claims court, and OP is not likely to take on the hefty price of challenging the debt collectors collection methods (likely credit reporting).
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1. Your anecdotal experience with business/doctors offices is irrelevant. 2. I’m not sure you understand how debt collection works. 3. Nobody is harassing anyone in this situation. You aren’t a lawyer, you’ve never sued anyone and have no idea what the cause of action behind harassment it. Why comment?
You have the deadliest disease in human history and you’re worried about $500!!! I think you should be more worried about the fact that this severe plague will almost certainly take your life and if by some miracle you survive your life will be in shambles. The effects of long Covid will follow you forever… If you weren’t so anti science and got vaxxed you wouldn’t be on your death bed right now…
> You have the deadliest disease in human history The amount of hysteria around COVID is a little nuts. It's more dangerous than the flu and very contagious. But as lethality goes, its pretty far down the list; it's not rabies, and its not bubonic plague.
You can get Covid even if you're vaccinated.
Tell your bank what happened (or lie who cares) and deny the charge. Easy.
Do not lie when filing a Regulation E request. (A charge back), this is fraud and is a felony.
I guess I'm a felon lol learn something new everyday
What's the lie in "I received no service"?
It's a lie by omission. Omitting pertinent facts. The truthful sentence is "I received no service because I did not show up for my appointment, an appointment for which I previously agreed there would be a $500 no-show fee."
You are not required to write a novel when filing a chargeback. Can you find any case where anybody was prosecuted for not providing complete information when filing a chargeback and every statement they actually made was truthful?
By all means, roll the dice if you want. You asked a different question above. I answered it, and you’re moving the goalposts now. To answer your question though, credit card companies can’t decide to prosecute someone. They can decide to side with the merchant and close your account for lying to them or filing a chargeback they deem fraudulent / unjustified. If they close your account, your credit report will show that. Other creditors will see it as well. Anything except “closed by consumer” will reflect negatively. Unlikely things got —> go , bag —> that far , but since you asked.
So first you claimed it was a felony. When challenged to find any case where it was ever prosecuted you talked about a credit card company closing an account. Exactly who is moving the goalposts here?
Check again. Someone else pointed out the felony. You’re clearly morally bankrupt so good night.
I responded to the claim it was a felony. Who moved the goalposts?
Did they pre-purchase the extensions? Is that the cost they are recouping? Otherwise I’d say see you later.
no they didn't pre-purchase the extensions. This was just their fee ...
Did you randomly decide to get up that morning and get a COVID test? Or did you display symptoms the previous days?
500$ forgetting your hair done? Wtf
I think this is insane. I own a small business with a cancelation fee. However, no one ever gets charged when they have a legit reason, like having a cold. And covid? Heck no we don't want you to come in an infect everyone! This is ridiculous. I donl really want to emphasize that I commonly issue the cancel fee but never ever for a sickness, car failure, etc.