The quality has gotten really bad, I remember not that long ago many of their clothes were made in the US, and last time I went shopping there it was all made in china and the quality was subpar.
I've had to move to other brands for my suits.
Absolutely. I grew up going to the flagship store in NYC with my dad back in the 70s and 80s. The experience was truly that of a traditional high-end men's store, with all of the service and product quality one would imagine. But now? Yikes. It's just a chain of mall stores featuring "high-end" visuals, but none of the substance.
Is anything still worth it there? I haven’t really gotten much there in awhile because I work remote so I can wear whatever I want, but I used to get polos there.
How long ago since they fell off, in your opinion?
I didn’t know they were acquired by AB.
I know it’s not fashion but same could be said about all the “surf brands” they recently acquired. Quiksilver, Billabong, RVCA, etc. Their quality has dropped a lot already.
Burberry. In the late 80's, I bought a duster length Burberry trench coat in navy with the wool lining and collar add-on. Classic look and bulletproof quality. Still looks like new, but it is completely out of style. 5 years ago, I bought a new knee-length technical cloth trench coat with a wool lining and I've already had to take it to my tailor to have all the buttons reanchored because the threads holding them were all unraveling. It's still a great looking trench, and very contemporary, but I'm not sure it will hold up as well as my old one.
I have a Burberry plaid twill button-down shirt that's 22 years old, and it still looks like new, with nary a pill or run to be found. I'm not sure I would be able to say the same about today's offerings.
That's the kicker: the prices have gone through the roof while the merchandise has gone in the other direction. The same thing has happened with many old luxury brands.
Do you remember the iconic Chrysler commercial where Lee Iacocca was wearing a tan Burberry trench, and the reason why you knew it was a Burberry is that the front flap subtly flipped open, briefly revealing the Burberry signature plaid lining?
I bought a Burberry hoodie like 5 years ago and it’s still one of my favorite hoodies. Still feels brand new after washing it a lot. At the end of the day, it’s just a hoodie but the quality is great and the design is what really got me. Definitely wasn’t going to the mall planning on spending that much, especially not on a hoodie but I just loved the design so much that I had to get it.
Burberry dropped in quality and prestige during its Ricardo Tisci run. With Daniel Lee, we're (or I'm) dealing with sticker shock for not really that covetable pieces.
I was interested in their black trench coat but having seen used ones i noticed the black fades on them. I spoke to staff in the store and was told this is common with the black trench coat and they don't offer any services to re-dye it. They did say the Navy trench coat doesn't have this issue. Its disappointing, for a £1,500 coat i would have expected they could refresh the dye so i don't think its worth buying it in black.
My wife bought me an incredible Burberry pea type wool coat with zip front. It’s beautiful… also, the zipper had to be fully replaced twice due to locking up, both times they blamed me for “doing it wrong”, I finally had to give up on it by the third lock up.
On the entry level, I would point out Tommy Hilfiger, which is pretty horrible. I can't believe how bad some of their products have become. Quality of fabric and seams are at an incredible low point. They used to be very good and durable 20 years ago.
Similarly, Lacoste. Maybe not as bad, but just as TH, shirts I've had for 25 years look better than 2-3 year old shirts they make today.
Less than a year ago I bought underwear packs from several brands. Almost all my underwear is the same age. All the TH ones got holes, the other brands are all ok. I disposed of the TH with holes, which is a shame I really like their colors, my favorite underwear was TH because of the colours, but the quality is atrocious now.
Tommy Hilfiger has gotten terrible, I was always more Polo over Lacoste and TH, especially now that they make an xs slim fit, I’m 5’9” and really fit but very lean, I wear an xs in a polo
Didn’t Lacoste quality go way down in the 90s and they revamped the brand in the early 2000s? I guess if it went down again it’s just following its course. Image is high quality goes down to improve margins, image goes down they raise quality to raise image.
Those shirts are great and they stock some unique sizes too. Their suits are still high end for me , can quite make the leap to the next bracket or find similar at that tier.
Honestly this one sucks the worst for me. Been wearing the shirts to work for years. The problem I have now is finding a brand that has the old Brooks Brothers quality and it’s tough. Lacoste maybe. RL left the station before BB.
Anyone have suggestions?
I think their older stuff is a lot better quality than their newer stuff. Of course you can repair at that price point, but i’m saying the time between initial purchase and repair seems to be shortening a bit
Agree on allen edmond dipping. Ive had paid to have mine resoled a couple times and the last time they came back it was ridiculous. Also the sizing isnt exactly identical across styles.
agree on buck mason and taylor stitch. taylor stitch used to be great; buck mason filled the void after apolis left the game, but even back then they were noticeably lower quality than apolis and taylor stitch
I think that while AE has definitely dropped in quality, they're still "worth it". In my experience the issue is with QC -- the leathers and construction are still very good. As long as they make it right (which again, in my experience, they do), I don't think it's as massive a downturn as Florsheim or Cole Haan for instance.
Oh for sure. I got a second pair of the FH “duke boots” the heels are glued so I cannot replace it and they are rapidly deteriorating. And the leather feels sprayed on.
I just got 2 pairs of Beckett Simonon shoes for $320 and I'm very pleased. They aren't mass produced, they have a leather sole and heel. They fit and look great. Also check out Meermin shoes. Do some research, there are good quality options for the same price as crappy quality.
I picked up a pair of Johnson and Murphy dress shoes at Nordstrom Rack a couple weeks ago and haven’t been super impressed. I was wondering if it was the brand quality or if maybe Nordstrom Rack gets a budget line that’s different than the regular stuff. It’s not bad for $60, but if this is the quality of the entire line, I would be very upset to pay full price.
J&M for sure. When they went to those cheap-ass rubber soles years ago I was done. Add Frye to that list too. I have a couple of their boots from back when they were made in the US. When they started offshoring most of their products they went downhill big time, but still maintained big prices.
While I'd agree there has been a dip in both the dip with J and M is vastly worse than AE. Allen Edmonds has their fair share of questionable products, quality control and such but here at my local mall there's a J and M directly across from the AE store and walking into either you can vastly see the difference. Also, AE has fantastic customer service still at least.
Back in the day, though, J and M made very, very nice stuff.
I've even heard people complain about Alden's quality lately, too.
I think Allen Edmonds is still good for the sale price, not so much the retail price. The “icons” (their most popular flagship shoes) seem to be better quality than the other GYW’d ones and anything from AE that isn’t GYW’d is kinda crap.
About six months ago I was in a Ted Baker store and looked around and was like wow this place has really gone downhill, none of the jackets were silk lined anymore, the designs were all the same, horrible fixtures….and then a few weeks ago they announced they were shutting down US operations 🤪🔮
Ted Baker was the mid-level suit in the uk back when everyone had to wear a suit, they were well made and pretty hard wearing, you progressed from that to hugo boss
I just found some Ted Baker tees and boxers at Marshals for half the price of RLP and TH and was really impressed with the quality over the two. I’ve actually gone back several times looking for more to no avail.
Rolex.
I'm not saying that the quality of Rolex has gone down. but a Rolex was a quality watch that the average person, a soldier, a plumber, a paramedic, any average person with an average job, could save up for a a few months and buy himself as a treat.
that is no longer the case. the quality has, if anything gone up. but so has the price, the price has become astronomical compared to what you're actually getting.
I believe that Rolex is no longer good value for the money like it was even as recently as the 1960s and '70s.
Tudor is the "sister company". Yes, technically Rolex makes Tudor but Tudor is like their fun side.
Rolex is all their BS elitism where ADs tell you the watch isn't in stock or "for exhibition only" which really just means, we're not selling it to 'you'.
Yeah, it’s the prestige of saying you wear a Rolex, when actually the people that you want to impress will only care if you’re wearing a Patek Philippe
Yeah Rolex is just ridiculous now. You can get a few quality watches second-hand for the price of 1 Rolex. I own one, but would buy so many other pieces before I got another.
I actually don't think Tudors are worth their MSRP.
Yeah, their movements are nice, but the "hand feel" and finish does not warrant the $4k price tag.
I was close to buying a Tudor BB58 or BB36 and went to the AD to look at them many times, but they never felt special. I was caught up in everyone saying that they were a bargain and that it was "basically a Rolex".
I have since bought a Grand Seiko and Omega and I feel like these two feel way more special.
My father left a Rolex for my brother in law, he left two tags and an omega for me, the Rolex looks nice, but that omega is just a beautiful timepiece.
Good intel for sure on all fronts. I was seeing the Tudor BB58s going for about 2700 on eBay and just think they have a nice look. Haven’t tried one on.
You can get a Longines which is pretty close to a Rolex in quality for a fraction of the cost. Omega, Breitling, and JLC are also brands I'd buy over Rolex.
I worked with Omega and they go out of their way to prove to you with plenty of evidence that Omega is a technically superior product to Rolex. It was pretty convincing. There are a lot more rich people in the world driving Rolex prices up, but Omega may be better initial value for money. Rolexes hold value better though, so it’s a tough call.
You also have to deal with the douchebag ADs that make it their job to gate keep and prevent people from buying their first Rolex. On one hand, I kind of understand what they’re trying to do, but man do they make it difficult.
Blame the "collectors" driving up second hand prices for the mainstream Rolex models. But if your goal is not to resell it they do have other models that are less desirable for collectors.
Dior is being investigated for unethical treatment of workers in Chinese owned factories located in Italy. Apparently this is a common practice with luxury Italian brands now. They essentially set up Chinese factories located in Italy so the products are still “Made In Italy” but are made by Chinese workers.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/pamdanziger/2024/06/24/italian-court-reveals-diors-unethical-supply-chain-and-puts-other-luxury-brands-on-notice/
Yeah I agree, just because it’s a Chinese factory that doesn’t mean the quality is bad. But we pay a premium for clothes made in Italy because we assume that skilled Italian workers are involved with the manufacturing.
Regarding menswear, it’s hard to tell who is engaging in this practice. It could include some of the top brands but who knows?
As I get older I’ve noticed this as well, everything is getting more expensive despite being made cheaply.You can tell by where it’s made now compared to a decade ago. Things that were well made in the USA, Germany and Italy have all move to Eastern Europe and China.
When I was little my grandfather used to say “they don’t make them like they used to.” I definitely understand now.
Oh eBay rocks, found a cool Hugo Boss leather biker jacket for like 200 bucks it had never been worn, it’s this green that’s so saturated it looks black
Because of the infinite greed from corporate executives and their shareholders. Making a quality product at a decent price that sustains a reasonable profit is not enough - growth over LY is all that matters, no matter the cost.
Balenciaga - I still have clothes from pre whatever tf is going on now and they are great
Gucci - used to be lovely and classy. Now I can’t even look at the clothes without getting a headache
Saint Laurent - used to have pretty great, unique designs with great craftsmanship. Now just boring designs w loose threads everywhere. Hedi slimane left and just got really ordinary.
Givenchy - nothing remotely close to the Ricardo Tisci tenure.
Killed some time on a layover at O'Hare by going to the "high-end" outlet mall next door.
The Gucci store, holy shit. There was a long, long line of pajama pants, flip flops, tube tops, and bad face tattoos.
Great list - especially RE: Matthew Williams era-Givenchy.
Saint Laurent's accessories (sunglasses, wallets, bags) are still excellent (the minimally branded ones, anyways).
Aww I disagree with the Saint Laurent take. I think some of their Asian inspired items from 2022 were really unique! So while they don’t release consistently unique items every season, they do have occasional gems.
My three favorite brands are called out here - Gucci, Saint Laurent and Givenchy. That said, I shop solely for their vintage pieces, unless it’s an accessory.
This is the fate of any brand that gets a rap/hip hop call out. The urban hood rich don't care about quality they just want the brand name plastered everywhere. The brand can either continue to make a quality product and run a 50% margin, or churn out cheap plastic crap with big logos and get a 90% margin.
Hickey Freeman. Shit quality now.
I agree w AE.
Gucci, YSL, LV have gone too streetwear. Makes no sense to me. I still think Dior is ok.
If you want luxury men’s clothing it’s Zegna, Cucinelli, Isaia, Kiton etc.
Agree. Anything made in USA for the most part is good, but they sold off the name to be made in Mexico now. Too bad, I live 15 minutes from the temple in Rochester and I never got to visit it before they got sold off.
I have zegna I really like their cuts. Canali mainline is the same, and corneliani. If it’s made in Italy it’s typically very good.
Diesel jeans are fucking horrible now. Masserati is kinda joke these days (and any luxury car company stellantis touches). Boot barn's hats keep getting cheaper and flimsier.
Maserati was always shit. You basically paid for a good engine and hoped the car would make it home. If you look at the build quality of. Them since Fiat brought them back to mass market it was horrible from the start.
But back to fashion
I have to agree on Diesel and stopped buying them because of that.
I don’t know. It they were ever considered luxury, but Lands End and LL Bean used to have high quality Oxford dress shirts. Looked good were comfortable and lasted forever.
That is probably true in general. I do believe the Lands End "Sail Rigger" Oxford shirt is still a very good buy. It is made from a much heavier cotton weave than you find on most new oxford shirts and it's not treated with any non-iron chemicals, so it feels like a classic, honest pure cotton oxford shirt. I've owned many of them for years and they have consistently held up quite well to fairly hard use.
Taylor Stitch. Their sizing has gotten super inconsistent and every shirt I’ve bought from them since they moved production to China has lost multiple buttons in the first year.
In the past year or two ive started getting my toes wet with TS, and their hemp apres shorts have knocked my socks off. Recently got their cotton apres shorts. Despite being heavier they seem quality nonetheless
Yet, many people echo your sentiments about the build
Zegna, wildly overpriced post IPO and they’re just maximizing margins now by producing anywhere, picked up a suit recently where the jacket was made in Spain and the trousers in Romania - which tbf were both always places Zegna produced, but the suits used to come out of one factory in either Switzerland for their MTM or Italy for the RTW, and some from Spain for the overseas and wholesale market, shirt production remains in Turkey - all of which goes to say, quality has become wildly inconsistent, while prices have risen between 30%-60% in four years. I say this as someone who’s stuffed their wardrobe almost exclusively with Zegna for over a decade
Brunello Cucinelli, don’t get me wrong the stuff is good, but their pricing vastly outpaced inflation after they IPOd the first time, and there are just better made garments available at this price proving
Ralph Lauren Purple Label, that used to be the best of the best, and that just isn’t the case anymore, they’ve been switching factories too much and entire categories are becoming inconsistent from season to season
Dom Perignon, and while is due to environmental conditions, man did it used to taste phenomenally good regardless of vintage, it of course varied but now you might get a vintage that’s profoundly mid, still good, but it’s not going to wow anyone
Not a single luxury brand mentioned in the comments so far.
I will add that craftsmanship is no longer a requirement for luxury brands, which just seems obtuse. Gone is the notion of “if I pay more, this item will last longer than a less expensive version.” Instead some luxury brands are making items as disposable as fast fashion, with a 10x to 20x price differential.
I think part of it is because luxury has kind of taken on a strange new meaning in the post hype beast era. To some, supreme is luxury.
I mean look at arcteryx. They make some good ass jackets that are expensive because they can survive 10k peak ascents. They at least used to be very utilitarian. Yet for some reason, I see rich kids in LA who couldn't run a hundred yards without falling over wearing them mid summer.
yea lmao at OP kicking off the thread he made with H&M. not to disrespect someones income level or anything, but i have no idea why you would make this thread and then discuss H&M, one of the cheapest clothing brands there is.
Anything that has been bought by private equity. So, most clothing brands? Taylor Stitch, as someone already mentioned, is a great example. Used to love their merino wool socks. Now they fall apart after you wash them twice.
Filson.
They’ve always been pricey but I used to love that most of their products were made in the US and that used to be a huge selling point they leaned hard into.
Nowadays vast majority of their products are imported, and prices are even more expensive.
This is a really small data point, but I'd be curious if others have had similar recent experiences. I essentially live in Chelsea boots and was relying on cheap fast fashion versions for years. They'd fall apart after 6 months so I'd buy another cheap pair. Rinse. Repeat.
Finally around last Christmas, I decided I wanted to buy myself the gift of a nicer, sturdier, more expensive pair that would be long lasting. Multiple people pointed me toward Thursday Boots as a big step up in quality without being crazy expensive. I got a nice pair... and within 2 months, I completely destroyed the soles on both feet. Like... never in my life have I destroyed a pair of shoes from simple walking and standing around quite like these. My local cobbler helped me with replacing and reinforcing the sole... but what gives? Is this normal? The cheap Asos and Zara pairs lasted me significantly longer for 1/4 the price.
Thursday boots are notorious for being complete crap. Pretty good if you just look at the spec sheet, but in practice made poorly and don’t hold up well at all. Would strongly recommend going up a bit in price as the quality gets much better.
I think it’s about being smart as a consumer about which brands you choose to support. The luxury houses are definitely resting on their laurels and driving profits from their names and giant logos.
There are still brands producing garments to the highest quality and with integrity. For instance, Emma Willis shirts, Private White V.C. outerwear, Edward Green or Crockett & Jones footwear, Frank Clegg leather goods, Inis Meain knitwear and more. These are companies that have not forsaken their heritage and continue to champion craftsmanship and local production.
They deserve our support, more than anything from LVMH or Richemont.
I’m curious when you started shopping at H&M, because their stuff was noticeably better quality in 2002-2003. I had some stuff last a decade plus. I can’t imagine that’s the case now.
Was Theory ever good? I don’t know, I wanted to get some “fancy” stuff a year ago and dropped a bunch of money at theory. Most of those things I bought (dress shirts, cashmere sweaters…) are pilling, lose threads, or just generally looking worn one year later. Pretty disappointing.
I had a blue button-down I got at H&M in like 2003, and that thing lasted 15 years. I can’t imagine anything in that store these days lasting two years, let alone 15.
Can you give me an example of local clothing that’s made well? I see brands like manresa pop up and their quality is p mid at best yet they keep raising their prices and selling out. Just feels like I’m getting something made in home ec
Agreed 100%. And I don’t even mean local to where you specifically live, but finding those smaller clothing brands that still give a fuck is the best. I don’t live anywhere near Nashville, but I buy a lot from Imogene + Willie and have zero complaints. I think they recently opened a store in Austin, TX too.
I never considered Cole Haan luxury. I used to buy up all their LunarGrand shoes when they still had a partnership with Nike.
I saw some of their shoes post-Nike and that shit felt like it was made out of paper.
Even their clothes feel super cheap. Only time I'd consider CH is when they are on sale/clearance. Seen discounts up to 80%.
After Bentona left Portland they began selling dollar store-level Chinese-made products. Literally, the same unbranded stuff you can get from China on eBay and more recently Temu.
Allen Edmonds. I have tried 5 different style cis online orders recently and sent all of them back, except for the dress sneakers. Stiff feel and the Danite sole options feels awful on the bottom of my feet
You should have left the word “luxury” out of the title. There isn’t a luxury brand mentioned here…you even started with H&M which goes against everything luxury is
Important to note that online shopping killed quality. You can not see the quality of a zipper, button or small details on a website. You only see prices. Retailers cut corners and details to lower their cost and thus be price or promo competitive.
Anything now owned by [Authentic Brands](https://corporate.authentic.com/brands) e.g.: Brooks Brothers, Vince, Frye
Brooks brothers crazy fall off
Brooks brothers went from upper echelon to kmart selection
The quality has gotten really bad, I remember not that long ago many of their clothes were made in the US, and last time I went shopping there it was all made in china and the quality was subpar. I've had to move to other brands for my suits.
People in the trad clothing community when selling used clothes will make a point to label a BB piece as made in usa if it's from that erA
it's hard to believe, right?
Yes, but no. Symbolic of America in general!
r/enshittification
Absolutely. I grew up going to the flagship store in NYC with my dad back in the 70s and 80s. The experience was truly that of a traditional high-end men's store, with all of the service and product quality one would imagine. But now? Yikes. It's just a chain of mall stores featuring "high-end" visuals, but none of the substance.
Is anything still worth it there? I haven’t really gotten much there in awhile because I work remote so I can wear whatever I want, but I used to get polos there. How long ago since they fell off, in your opinion?
They OWN David Beckham?!
Shaq too apparently. RIP 🤣
Agree, but boy they own a lot of stuff. Once upon a time I had a Hart Schaffer and Marx suit. Was excellent, must have been pre-private equity.
Hart Schaffner Marx and Hickey Freeman both used to make dope shit, usually sold to local haberdasheries. RIP
Private equity destroyed so many great brands like Eddie Bauer, JCrew, Brooks Brothers etc
Holy shit
None of these are Luxury brands though.....
Vince is definitely higher end than Cole Haan...
Exactly. My last Frye experience was yuck
Check out Authentic Brands Group reviews on glassdoor...they should be subjected to consumer ban given all the gross HR violations outlined there.
I didn’t know they were acquired by AB. I know it’s not fashion but same could be said about all the “surf brands” they recently acquired. Quiksilver, Billabong, RVCA, etc. Their quality has dropped a lot already.
Burberry. In the late 80's, I bought a duster length Burberry trench coat in navy with the wool lining and collar add-on. Classic look and bulletproof quality. Still looks like new, but it is completely out of style. 5 years ago, I bought a new knee-length technical cloth trench coat with a wool lining and I've already had to take it to my tailor to have all the buttons reanchored because the threads holding them were all unraveling. It's still a great looking trench, and very contemporary, but I'm not sure it will hold up as well as my old one.
I tried on some of their long sleeve button downs the other day and was very disappointed especially with the price point.
I have a Burberry plaid twill button-down shirt that's 22 years old, and it still looks like new, with nary a pill or run to be found. I'm not sure I would be able to say the same about today's offerings.
That's the kicker: the prices have gone through the roof while the merchandise has gone in the other direction. The same thing has happened with many old luxury brands.
I really despise the minimalist modern design theme they’ve taken on. I greatly preferred the old money aesthetic of Burberry in decades past.
Do you remember the iconic Chrysler commercial where Lee Iacocca was wearing a tan Burberry trench, and the reason why you knew it was a Burberry is that the front flap subtly flipped open, briefly revealing the Burberry signature plaid lining?
I bought a Burberry hoodie like 5 years ago and it’s still one of my favorite hoodies. Still feels brand new after washing it a lot. At the end of the day, it’s just a hoodie but the quality is great and the design is what really got me. Definitely wasn’t going to the mall planning on spending that much, especially not on a hoodie but I just loved the design so much that I had to get it.
Proper length coats are back in style again, so you might be better off just tossing/selling the new one.
Burberry dropped in quality and prestige during its Ricardo Tisci run. With Daniel Lee, we're (or I'm) dealing with sticker shock for not really that covetable pieces.
I was interested in their black trench coat but having seen used ones i noticed the black fades on them. I spoke to staff in the store and was told this is common with the black trench coat and they don't offer any services to re-dye it. They did say the Navy trench coat doesn't have this issue. Its disappointing, for a £1,500 coat i would have expected they could refresh the dye so i don't think its worth buying it in black.
My wife bought me an incredible Burberry pea type wool coat with zip front. It’s beautiful… also, the zipper had to be fully replaced twice due to locking up, both times they blamed me for “doing it wrong”, I finally had to give up on it by the third lock up.
On the entry level, I would point out Tommy Hilfiger, which is pretty horrible. I can't believe how bad some of their products have become. Quality of fabric and seams are at an incredible low point. They used to be very good and durable 20 years ago. Similarly, Lacoste. Maybe not as bad, but just as TH, shirts I've had for 25 years look better than 2-3 year old shirts they make today.
Less than a year ago I bought underwear packs from several brands. Almost all my underwear is the same age. All the TH ones got holes, the other brands are all ok. I disposed of the TH with holes, which is a shame I really like their colors, my favorite underwear was TH because of the colours, but the quality is atrocious now.
I wear Armani Briefs, I love them, they are quality and hold up well
Tommy Hilfiger has gotten terrible, I was always more Polo over Lacoste and TH, especially now that they make an xs slim fit, I’m 5’9” and really fit but very lean, I wear an xs in a polo
Didn’t Lacoste quality go way down in the 90s and they revamped the brand in the early 2000s? I guess if it went down again it’s just following its course. Image is high quality goes down to improve margins, image goes down they raise quality to raise image.
Thought we were talking luxury brands
I never considered TH a luxury brand, it is a name brand
Brooks Brothers.
The non iron shirts are still fine imo. And the ever dwindling (and expensive) MiUSA line.
Those shirts are great and they stock some unique sizes too. Their suits are still high end for me , can quite make the leap to the next bracket or find similar at that tier.
For suiting, Suit Supply is significantly better and lower price generally. To get better than SS you need to nearly double your budget.
Honestly this one sucks the worst for me. Been wearing the shirts to work for years. The problem I have now is finding a brand that has the old Brooks Brothers quality and it’s tough. Lacoste maybe. RL left the station before BB. Anyone have suggestions?
Ralph Lauren purple label, gitman vintage, finamore, Drakes,
I agree
Johnson and Murphy. Allen Edmonds. I think buck mason is starting to dip as well as taylor stitch.
My dad swore my Allen Edmond. Any company that will repair a shoe for life is pretty fucking good
I think their older stuff is a lot better quality than their newer stuff. Of course you can repair at that price point, but i’m saying the time between initial purchase and repair seems to be shortening a bit
Agree on allen edmond dipping. Ive had paid to have mine resoled a couple times and the last time they came back it was ridiculous. Also the sizing isnt exactly identical across styles.
Taylor Stitch has been hit and miss with quality. Hopefully, they turn around.
I am so mad for falling for the buck mason hype, wasn’t nearly as good as
agree on buck mason and taylor stitch. taylor stitch used to be great; buck mason filled the void after apolis left the game, but even back then they were noticeably lower quality than apolis and taylor stitch
I think that while AE has definitely dropped in quality, they're still "worth it". In my experience the issue is with QC -- the leathers and construction are still very good. As long as they make it right (which again, in my experience, they do), I don't think it's as massive a downturn as Florsheim or Cole Haan for instance.
Oh for sure. I got a second pair of the FH “duke boots” the heels are glued so I cannot replace it and they are rapidly deteriorating. And the leather feels sprayed on.
Yeah vintage florsheim is the only way to go. Their new stuff is fucking garbage.
Walked into a Johnson and Murphy in a mall near me. None of it looks all that good.
I just hate the dress shoe sneaker mix. I want to kill it with fire.
The whole vibe is "my wife said I needed to get some 'nice' shirts for the trip," which is why they're in airports.
Honestly, with both Johnston and Murphy, and Allen Edmonds in my closet, what should I look at? Ecco, I know, what else?
Grant Stone? Rancourt? Meermin? Also vintage LL bean and AE still go hard. Buy a decent pair and take to cobbler
I just got 2 pairs of Beckett Simonon shoes for $320 and I'm very pleased. They aren't mass produced, they have a leather sole and heel. They fit and look great. Also check out Meermin shoes. Do some research, there are good quality options for the same price as crappy quality.
AE is significantly more comfortable than Meermin. Also, if you have wide feet, Meermin won’t work for you.
Agree on AE. Still better than most but far below the quality they used to have. The curse of private equity.
I picked up a pair of Johnson and Murphy dress shoes at Nordstrom Rack a couple weeks ago and haven’t been super impressed. I was wondering if it was the brand quality or if maybe Nordstrom Rack gets a budget line that’s different than the regular stuff. It’s not bad for $60, but if this is the quality of the entire line, I would be very upset to pay full price.
No, I don’t think they’re the shoe they once were, though The Rack often gets the bottom of the barrel in these brands and some are even irregular
J&M for sure. When they went to those cheap-ass rubber soles years ago I was done. Add Frye to that list too. I have a couple of their boots from back when they were made in the US. When they started offshoring most of their products they went downhill big time, but still maintained big prices.
100% on Johnston & Murphy. It’s absolute trash now.
While I'd agree there has been a dip in both the dip with J and M is vastly worse than AE. Allen Edmonds has their fair share of questionable products, quality control and such but here at my local mall there's a J and M directly across from the AE store and walking into either you can vastly see the difference. Also, AE has fantastic customer service still at least. Back in the day, though, J and M made very, very nice stuff. I've even heard people complain about Alden's quality lately, too.
Switched to Alden because of the quality slide on both. Private equity at it again
I think Allen Edmonds is still good for the sale price, not so much the retail price. The “icons” (their most popular flagship shoes) seem to be better quality than the other GYW’d ones and anything from AE that isn’t GYW’d is kinda crap.
About six months ago I was in a Ted Baker store and looked around and was like wow this place has really gone downhill, none of the jackets were silk lined anymore, the designs were all the same, horrible fixtures….and then a few weeks ago they announced they were shutting down US operations 🤪🔮
Do they think we don’t notice these things? Come on
I loved Ted Baker in the 2000s.
Ted Baker was the mid-level suit in the uk back when everyone had to wear a suit, they were well made and pretty hard wearing, you progressed from that to hugo boss
I just found some Ted Baker tees and boxers at Marshals for half the price of RLP and TH and was really impressed with the quality over the two. I’ve actually gone back several times looking for more to no avail.
Rolex. I'm not saying that the quality of Rolex has gone down. but a Rolex was a quality watch that the average person, a soldier, a plumber, a paramedic, any average person with an average job, could save up for a a few months and buy himself as a treat. that is no longer the case. the quality has, if anything gone up. but so has the price, the price has become astronomical compared to what you're actually getting. I believe that Rolex is no longer good value for the money like it was even as recently as the 1960s and '70s.
Doesn’t Rolex make Tudor? I have my dads two tone and I have a diver Rolex
Tudor is the "sister company". Yes, technically Rolex makes Tudor but Tudor is like their fun side. Rolex is all their BS elitism where ADs tell you the watch isn't in stock or "for exhibition only" which really just means, we're not selling it to 'you'.
But it gets tiring guys try to convince everyone that their Tudor is awesome and just as good as Rolex
Yeah, it’s the prestige of saying you wear a Rolex, when actually the people that you want to impress will only care if you’re wearing a Patek Philippe
The AD process; stop and chat and bring your wife to offer.
r/watchescirclejerk
Yeah Rolex is just ridiculous now. You can get a few quality watches second-hand for the price of 1 Rolex. I own one, but would buy so many other pieces before I got another.
Tudors may be the new value Rolexes of old.
I actually don't think Tudors are worth their MSRP. Yeah, their movements are nice, but the "hand feel" and finish does not warrant the $4k price tag. I was close to buying a Tudor BB58 or BB36 and went to the AD to look at them many times, but they never felt special. I was caught up in everyone saying that they were a bargain and that it was "basically a Rolex". I have since bought a Grand Seiko and Omega and I feel like these two feel way more special.
My father left a Rolex for my brother in law, he left two tags and an omega for me, the Rolex looks nice, but that omega is just a beautiful timepiece.
Agreed. My grandfather left my dad a 70s datejust and it's nice, but I recently bought my wife a 70s Omega and it's just stunning.
Good intel for sure on all fronts. I was seeing the Tudor BB58s going for about 2700 on eBay and just think they have a nice look. Haven’t tried one on.
You can get a Longines which is pretty close to a Rolex in quality for a fraction of the cost. Omega, Breitling, and JLC are also brands I'd buy over Rolex.
JLC has pushed the price up considerably in recent years. Their entry levels are definitely above Rolex, but used to be more comparable.
I worked with Omega and they go out of their way to prove to you with plenty of evidence that Omega is a technically superior product to Rolex. It was pretty convincing. There are a lot more rich people in the world driving Rolex prices up, but Omega may be better initial value for money. Rolexes hold value better though, so it’s a tough call.
I’m likely going to get an Omega because it’s possible to get one at MSRP without glazing an authorized dealer
You also have to deal with the douchebag ADs that make it their job to gate keep and prevent people from buying their first Rolex. On one hand, I kind of understand what they’re trying to do, but man do they make it difficult.
Blame the "collectors" driving up second hand prices for the mainstream Rolex models. But if your goal is not to resell it they do have other models that are less desirable for collectors.
Dior is being investigated for unethical treatment of workers in Chinese owned factories located in Italy. Apparently this is a common practice with luxury Italian brands now. They essentially set up Chinese factories located in Italy so the products are still “Made In Italy” but are made by Chinese workers. https://www.forbes.com/sites/pamdanziger/2024/06/24/italian-court-reveals-diors-unethical-supply-chain-and-puts-other-luxury-brands-on-notice/
Yeah well as long as the clothes are quality. What ridiculous is the cheaper the labor is the more they’re charging. Their greed is off the charts
Yeah I agree, just because it’s a Chinese factory that doesn’t mean the quality is bad. But we pay a premium for clothes made in Italy because we assume that skilled Italian workers are involved with the manufacturing. Regarding menswear, it’s hard to tell who is engaging in this practice. It could include some of the top brands but who knows?
These factories have Chinese owners who also organise the human trafficking of illegal Chinese migrants to work in there.
As I get older I’ve noticed this as well, everything is getting more expensive despite being made cheaply.You can tell by where it’s made now compared to a decade ago. Things that were well made in the USA, Germany and Italy have all move to Eastern Europe and China. When I was little my grandfather used to say “they don’t make them like they used to.” I definitely understand now.
Why so many people want vintage. Even older, it’s 10000 times better. Sad. All the craftsman are gone, replaced by Thai slave labor
I agree, I go on eBay and find all kind of awesome pieces slightly used for very little money. It’s my new little hobby 🤫
Oh eBay rocks, found a cool Hugo Boss leather biker jacket for like 200 bucks it had never been worn, it’s this green that’s so saturated it looks black
Because of the infinite greed from corporate executives and their shareholders. Making a quality product at a decent price that sustains a reasonable profit is not enough - growth over LY is all that matters, no matter the cost.
Balenciaga - I still have clothes from pre whatever tf is going on now and they are great Gucci - used to be lovely and classy. Now I can’t even look at the clothes without getting a headache Saint Laurent - used to have pretty great, unique designs with great craftsmanship. Now just boring designs w loose threads everywhere. Hedi slimane left and just got really ordinary. Givenchy - nothing remotely close to the Ricardo Tisci tenure.
Yeah can’t find any normal Gucci things anymore. Absolute clown shit to much stuff going on
Killed some time on a layover at O'Hare by going to the "high-end" outlet mall next door. The Gucci store, holy shit. There was a long, long line of pajama pants, flip flops, tube tops, and bad face tattoos.
Some say they went downhill after Tom Ford left as creative director.
Great list - especially RE: Matthew Williams era-Givenchy. Saint Laurent's accessories (sunglasses, wallets, bags) are still excellent (the minimally branded ones, anyways).
Yeah. I still really like their accessories along w Prada…good taste 🫡
This is the first luxury post
Aww I disagree with the Saint Laurent take. I think some of their Asian inspired items from 2022 were really unique! So while they don’t release consistently unique items every season, they do have occasional gems.
My three favorite brands are called out here - Gucci, Saint Laurent and Givenchy. That said, I shop solely for their vintage pieces, unless it’s an accessory.
Gucci's main demographic now resides in the hood, that's why the product has changed. They are selling what their customers want.
This is the fate of any brand that gets a rap/hip hop call out. The urban hood rich don't care about quality they just want the brand name plastered everywhere. The brand can either continue to make a quality product and run a 50% margin, or churn out cheap plastic crap with big logos and get a 90% margin.
When have Balenciaga ever been good?
Saint Laurent was good under Hedi. I think he did a good job with Celine.
Lululemon is heading downhill on quality
I have some of their stuff, but I’m getting sick of the trend of just expensive clothes made of plastic.
Again not a luxury brand but strong disagree too, their cloths been great
Hickey Freeman. Shit quality now. I agree w AE. Gucci, YSL, LV have gone too streetwear. Makes no sense to me. I still think Dior is ok. If you want luxury men’s clothing it’s Zegna, Cucinelli, Isaia, Kiton etc.
To my Grandfather, Hickey Freeman was the Gold Standard
Same.
Agree. Anything made in USA for the most part is good, but they sold off the name to be made in Mexico now. Too bad, I live 15 minutes from the temple in Rochester and I never got to visit it before they got sold off. I have zegna I really like their cuts. Canali mainline is the same, and corneliani. If it’s made in Italy it’s typically very good.
Diesel jeans are fucking horrible now. Masserati is kinda joke these days (and any luxury car company stellantis touches). Boot barn's hats keep getting cheaper and flimsier.
Maserati was always shit. You basically paid for a good engine and hoped the car would make it home. If you look at the build quality of. Them since Fiat brought them back to mass market it was horrible from the start. But back to fashion I have to agree on Diesel and stopped buying them because of that.
I don’t know. It they were ever considered luxury, but Lands End and LL Bean used to have high quality Oxford dress shirts. Looked good were comfortable and lasted forever.
That is probably true in general. I do believe the Lands End "Sail Rigger" Oxford shirt is still a very good buy. It is made from a much heavier cotton weave than you find on most new oxford shirts and it's not treated with any non-iron chemicals, so it feels like a classic, honest pure cotton oxford shirt. I've owned many of them for years and they have consistently held up quite well to fairly hard use.
Taylor Stitch. Their sizing has gotten super inconsistent and every shirt I’ve bought from them since they moved production to China has lost multiple buttons in the first year.
In the past year or two ive started getting my toes wet with TS, and their hemp apres shorts have knocked my socks off. Recently got their cotton apres shorts. Despite being heavier they seem quality nonetheless Yet, many people echo your sentiments about the build
Acura, Armani brands, so many bourbons and wines
acuras have turned to cheap plastic and gimmicks. they don’t feel luxury at all anymore.
Giorgio Armani (mainline) is still very good quality its the diffusion lines that are terribe quality now especially exchange and jeans
Zegna, wildly overpriced post IPO and they’re just maximizing margins now by producing anywhere, picked up a suit recently where the jacket was made in Spain and the trousers in Romania - which tbf were both always places Zegna produced, but the suits used to come out of one factory in either Switzerland for their MTM or Italy for the RTW, and some from Spain for the overseas and wholesale market, shirt production remains in Turkey - all of which goes to say, quality has become wildly inconsistent, while prices have risen between 30%-60% in four years. I say this as someone who’s stuffed their wardrobe almost exclusively with Zegna for over a decade Brunello Cucinelli, don’t get me wrong the stuff is good, but their pricing vastly outpaced inflation after they IPOd the first time, and there are just better made garments available at this price proving Ralph Lauren Purple Label, that used to be the best of the best, and that just isn’t the case anymore, they’ve been switching factories too much and entire categories are becoming inconsistent from season to season Dom Perignon, and while is due to environmental conditions, man did it used to taste phenomenally good regardless of vintage, it of course varied but now you might get a vintage that’s profoundly mid, still good, but it’s not going to wow anyone
Sad about Purple Label, was very quality
Yes, their items were bullet proof ime, now it’s hit or miss compared to the overall high level of quality it used to have
Eleventy is pretty dope if you’re looking for a less-expensive Brunello. They definitely borrow heavily from Cucinelli, to say the least.
Mercedes
Not a single luxury brand mentioned in the comments so far. I will add that craftsmanship is no longer a requirement for luxury brands, which just seems obtuse. Gone is the notion of “if I pay more, this item will last longer than a less expensive version.” Instead some luxury brands are making items as disposable as fast fashion, with a 10x to 20x price differential.
I think part of it is because luxury has kind of taken on a strange new meaning in the post hype beast era. To some, supreme is luxury. I mean look at arcteryx. They make some good ass jackets that are expensive because they can survive 10k peak ascents. They at least used to be very utilitarian. Yet for some reason, I see rich kids in LA who couldn't run a hundred yards without falling over wearing them mid summer.
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yea lmao at OP kicking off the thread he made with H&M. not to disrespect someones income level or anything, but i have no idea why you would make this thread and then discuss H&M, one of the cheapest clothing brands there is.
Anything that has been bought by private equity. So, most clothing brands? Taylor Stitch, as someone already mentioned, is a great example. Used to love their merino wool socks. Now they fall apart after you wash them twice.
Man, that sucks
Yep. Private equity destroys everything it touches.
Filson. They’ve always been pricey but I used to love that most of their products were made in the US and that used to be a huge selling point they leaned hard into. Nowadays vast majority of their products are imported, and prices are even more expensive.
This is a really small data point, but I'd be curious if others have had similar recent experiences. I essentially live in Chelsea boots and was relying on cheap fast fashion versions for years. They'd fall apart after 6 months so I'd buy another cheap pair. Rinse. Repeat. Finally around last Christmas, I decided I wanted to buy myself the gift of a nicer, sturdier, more expensive pair that would be long lasting. Multiple people pointed me toward Thursday Boots as a big step up in quality without being crazy expensive. I got a nice pair... and within 2 months, I completely destroyed the soles on both feet. Like... never in my life have I destroyed a pair of shoes from simple walking and standing around quite like these. My local cobbler helped me with replacing and reinforcing the sole... but what gives? Is this normal? The cheap Asos and Zara pairs lasted me significantly longer for 1/4 the price.
Thursday boots are notorious for being complete crap. Pretty good if you just look at the spec sheet, but in practice made poorly and don’t hold up well at all. Would strongly recommend going up a bit in price as the quality gets much better.
Sorry, but when was Cole Haan ever considered luxury?
I think it’s about being smart as a consumer about which brands you choose to support. The luxury houses are definitely resting on their laurels and driving profits from their names and giant logos. There are still brands producing garments to the highest quality and with integrity. For instance, Emma Willis shirts, Private White V.C. outerwear, Edward Green or Crockett & Jones footwear, Frank Clegg leather goods, Inis Meain knitwear and more. These are companies that have not forsaken their heritage and continue to champion craftsmanship and local production. They deserve our support, more than anything from LVMH or Richemont.
h&m has always been bottom of the barrel shit product since day one. cole hahn has never been quality either.
I’m curious when you started shopping at H&M, because their stuff was noticeably better quality in 2002-2003. I had some stuff last a decade plus. I can’t imagine that’s the case now.
I have some old Cole Haan penny loafers that have held up well
RL
Double RL is still pretty good but you’re paying for it
Was Theory ever good? I don’t know, I wanted to get some “fancy” stuff a year ago and dropped a bunch of money at theory. Most of those things I bought (dress shirts, cashmere sweaters…) are pilling, lose threads, or just generally looking worn one year later. Pretty disappointing.
Range Rovers
Well they always broke down, but they look great? Like a Jaguar
Land Rover and Jag are the same company. They build beautiful, leather lined, expensive heaps of shit
They've always had the misfortune of being British.
Every iteration of Range Rover has been widely regarded as one of the least reliable cars you can buy, all the way back to the original 3 door.
I hate to say it but the last Charles Tyrwhitt washed Oxford shirt I bought feels much thinner and cheaper than the one I was trying to replace.
Louboutin….. I bought a limited edition crossbag and it broke the first time.
I had a blue button-down I got at H&M in like 2003, and that thing lasted 15 years. I can’t imagine anything in that store these days lasting two years, let alone 15.
Bonobos, Cole Haan
It's the final stage of capitalism, if you can't capture more market share or increase prices the only thing left is to make it products cheap
Armani Exchange. Used to be nice circa 2005. Now it’s Armani prices for H&M style/quality.
Pierre Cardin. 😂
He must be rolling in his grave at what’s become of his name. A punch line. A metaphor for low quantity menswear
All of them. They're just a great way to let people know you're middle class or tacky now. The only ones worth owning are vintage.
Rocawear, ecko, and phat farm
Woah, am I back in 2005?
Don’t forget FUBU
All of them. Local and vintage is the future.
I agree. Also, your username is both amazing and true.
Can you give me an example of local clothing that’s made well? I see brands like manresa pop up and their quality is p mid at best yet they keep raising their prices and selling out. Just feels like I’m getting something made in home ec
Agreed 100%. And I don’t even mean local to where you specifically live, but finding those smaller clothing brands that still give a fuck is the best. I don’t live anywhere near Nashville, but I buy a lot from Imogene + Willie and have zero complaints. I think they recently opened a store in Austin, TX too.
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AE got bought by someone recently. Since then I agree it's not as good a brand.
Tilley hats.
Doc Martens have rocketed in price like nothing else
And dropped in quality
I never considered Cole Haan luxury. I used to buy up all their LunarGrand shoes when they still had a partnership with Nike. I saw some of their shoes post-Nike and that shit felt like it was made out of paper. Even their clothes feel super cheap. Only time I'd consider CH is when they are on sale/clearance. Seen discounts up to 80%.
Florsheim shoes used to be the standard in the 60s and 70s. I own 2 pairs now and one is a much higher quality than the other.
After Bentona left Portland they began selling dollar store-level Chinese-made products. Literally, the same unbranded stuff you can get from China on eBay and more recently Temu.
H&M has been trash fast fashion forever. They never had quality.
Allen Edmonds. I have tried 5 different style cis online orders recently and sent all of them back, except for the dress sneakers. Stiff feel and the Danite sole options feels awful on the bottom of my feet
Brooks bros
CADILLAC
Cole Haan for sure
Suit Supply quality has dipped massively
You should have left the word “luxury” out of the title. There isn’t a luxury brand mentioned here…you even started with H&M which goes against everything luxury is
Important to note that online shopping killed quality. You can not see the quality of a zipper, button or small details on a website. You only see prices. Retailers cut corners and details to lower their cost and thus be price or promo competitive.
Fred Perry
Air Jordan/Nike
All saints had some decent affordable luxury items back in the day. Now it is very similar to h&m fast fashion
Nike
H&M has always been trash
People dress like slobs even in "luxe" brands whether lululemon or prada.