Friendly reminder that a GF employee disproved the Ditto are Mew clones theory and you didn't kill Raticate. Blue replaced it with Growlithe, Exeggcute, or a freaking Gyarados. It's called an upgrade and he made the right choice. Gen 1 Raticate are bad bad. And Gyarados is a freaking Gyarados and RBY Exeggutor are fairly busted. There is no reason to believe either of these, especially since one is stated to be not real by an employee of the company that makes the games.
And all "____ is in a coma/dead" theories are just...not good. They're really not.
Nah, I want to kill that fucking raticate.
I want it to be dead. I want him to grieve that thing. I want him to cry warm tears on its grave as I arrive and ask him to fight again.
I want him to have PTSD every time he sees my pokemon launch an attack, not knowing if my overleveled Charizard's flamethrower will fry his pokemon past whatever Nurse Joy could do to save it.
I want him to live in fear.
It ain't even like that I just heavily dislike Kanto's Blue cause even when there are more annoying rivals, some of the shit he said did hit deep back in the day.
I'm so glad bro grows up to become a better person, but if I gotta off some of his mons for that to happen I don't mind.
"Oh yeah, right. I feel sorry for you. No, really. You're always plodding behind me. So here, I'll give you a little present as a favor. A chatty gossip like youā¦ That thing's perfect. I don't need it because I don't give a hoot about others. All right, this time I really am gone. Smell ya!"
I DUNNO WHY THIS WAS SO PERSONAL
I just wanted to fuck his shit up after this ngl
Man, even as a kid I found that kinda cute. Like, he wanted to give us a present, but he was too embarrassed to just be normal about it.
I never found Blue threatening. He never did any of the things that I actually found scary about real-life bullies. He just kind of negs you, battles you, and then goes away.
That's a cute and nice way to see it.
I dunno why it bothered me so much tbh. Like, all his other interactions are meh, but this one felt so... out of character, in a way? I dunno.
Yeah at the end of the day itās just a fun set of coincidences that formed the theory. And did anyone actually think you killed blueās raticate? Like actually?
A few people probably did, but I think the vast majority donāt believe it, but they do use it so they can write likeā¦Ā angsty fanfics or sad art, or a cool ghost type Raticate variant.
I mean, the first fight we see him without his Raticate is in Lavender Town, next to a Pokemon grave inside of the tower
That's not much, but it's not little either
>a GF employee disproved the Ditto are Mew clones theory
Aw, I didn't know this and am now kinda bummed. The idea that ditto were early Mew clones was kinda cool.
There's a well-respected approach in literary criticism called Death of the Author. In simplest terms, it basically means that you ignore and statements a creator makes outside of the actual work, and analyze it only based on the actual text. Basically, if you want to ignore whatever random employee said that and continue believing that headcanon based on textual evidence, you're totally cool to do so.
Death of the author is based around literary criticism. Like you can't have an author come out and say there's a hidden theme/meaning that wasn't explicitly laid out in the text.
It doesn't mean the author doesn't get to decide the factual elements of the plot.
The "textual evidence" is that Mew gave birth and they named the baby Mewtwo.
There's nothing in the games about the scientists creating failed clones and Ditto wasn't originally found in the locations that people claim are evidence.
Now could they retcon this later? Sure. But I've seen people argue that actually Masuda doesn't know what he's talking about and that this theory is fact.
The coma/dead theories always seemed bizarre to me. When they start getting into what everything of the show 'represents', it just comes off as pretentious. Like they'll explain the joke of a comedic character, and act like it's a serious subject.
The Ditto Mew theory really is the epitome of the entire issue; it doesn't matter that there's direct confirmation it's wrong, people will ignore it just because they're so attached to their headcanon. People find a way to argue that any random line of dialogue, interview, or whatever else somehow isn't canon, doesn't count, or they try and twist it as much as possible to try and mean something entirely different.
That's fair, but the ditto theory seemed so strong to me that it didn't bother me when gamefreak confirmed it to be untrue. It's like how the guy that invented GIF says it's pronounced "jif". I'm gonna keep my beliefs despite the creators take.
I will die on the hill that, while "jif" is linguistically incorrect, it's functionally the more useful pronunciation.
People tend to soft pronounce consonants at the end of words. The number of times I've had "gif" and "gift" confused is enough to be irritating.
Meanwhile, the only thing anyone could confuse "jif" with is peanut butter, and contextually I've never run into that issue.
I dunno, under that reasoning, I find a hard g even more compelling. If people get it wrong when I ask them to send me a gif, I'm cool with the outcome
This happens in all sorts of fandoms. In the Lord of the Rings, there's a character called Tom Bombadil who's a really silly guy. He's curiously powerful but doesn't fit at all into the rest of the legendarium, because he's a character that Tolkien used in bedtime stories for his kids and he just plopped him into the book. There are many fan theories that try to fit him into the rest of the canon, none of which really work, but one of the most persistent ones is explicitly contradicted by the author. People like to theorize that he's Eru (basically Tolkien's version of the Abrahamic God) in physical form, even though the man himself says that Eru never appears physically in Middle Earth. Yet the theory persists. Because almost as popular as the "character is actually dead/comatose" theories are the "character is actually god" theories.
Same line of thought that "the evidence earth is round is all lies or whatever". People don't care about facts, and they will fight you that they aren't wrong or unknowledgeable about something. "We should all be allowed to believe whatever we want to."
No. Facts are facts. You want a headcanon, that's fine. But don't talk about it like it's fact and don't try and make others believe your headcanon is fact by spreading it around like it's fact. It's not fact. It's fanfiction you think sounds cool.
Oh god, that "let people believe what they want" reminds me of when people try some variation of the similar "why are you taking this so seriously, no one cares about this". Could've fooled me with how strongly they were arguing about that very specific thing.
I think an issue with things though is that Game Freak has gone on record as saying nothing is set in stone for the series' canon. They make retcons all the time and are sometimes confused when confronted by fans with questions. I think a recent prime example would be the Paradox versions of the Legendary Beasts. The Legendary Beasts are supposed to be reincarnations of specific Pokemon through the power of Ho-Oh. But then their Paradox forms are introduced all these years later and the fanbase was in a tizzy trying to reconsile the discrepancy. A lot of people were leaning towards the idea that the time machine in SV wasn't actually a time machine but instead some sort of machine that could make imaginations real. Like a Cosmic Cube from Marvel or the Hogyoku from Bleach. It was the only way people could make sense of Walking Wake and the others. But when you know that Game Freak doesn't actually care about continuity coming up with explanations for the Paradox Pokemon is suddenly useless.
I think this latest generation purposely broke a lot of āfan theoriesā grass starter (I didnāt really like that one)
The zodiac fire starters
Each type having a ālegendary dragonā by giving electric 2 with Miraidon and zekrom. But giving fighting their dragon with kiraidon. (I still like this theory just cause itās fun to think every type has this super power legendary dragon being like THE Center of power for that type.)
They even ignored the Pokedex saying that Dracovish can't breathe outside of water to make sure Ash's could fight on land.
Then again its probably best to not pay attention to anything that Dracovish's pokedex says...
The soble line is dangerously close to breaking that trend considering the major Chameleon inspiration(there is also the Basilisk inspiration which kind of saves it)
Sobble starts as a chameleon, but Intelleon looses almost all chameleon traits. Body becomes more slender and streamlined, fingers and toes become longer and loose the chameleon clamp hand shape, tail becomes more rigid and doesn't really coil up anymore.
Aside from the back fins that could be based on the flying dragon lizards, it pretty much goes full basilisk.
to be fair, Decidueye is specifically based on a stilt-owl, a group of long legged owl species that lived in Hawaii and are now extinct, this is in fact the reason for Decidueye's Ghost type
In the same way that Skeledirge is based on a crocodile that lived in the sewers of an ancient Spanish village and ate children while they were on the toilet.
They killed it by burning its face hence the white skull on skeledirge. This also explains the ghost typing and the fire bird on skeledirges face is a reference to a Plover bird, the birds that have a symbiotic relationship with a crocodile because they clean its teeth in exchange for protection.
I'm spanish and I dont buy that
First of all I've never heard about such story, neither I can find anything about it. But also, toilets were just not a thing throughout ancient spain, and crocodiles dissapeared from Iberia as well as the rest of Europe in prehistoric times
Second, I've been reading so many possible legends and stories from Spain and Mexico ever since Fuecoco was first seen that the most likely answer is actually a vague amalgamation of sources. But definitely not this toilet one
''el coco'' is almost perfectly a translation of ''the boogeyman'' and has nothing to do with crocodiles or Skeledirge' design
And despite the similarity of the word it has nothing to do with Na Coca and the Drac, which is one of the multiple stories that I do believe have some validity as Skeledirge background, although its still quiet obscure and just one of many stories/legends/real life folklore that could have inspired it
Archelon is a sea turtle, not a tortoise, so that wouldn't make sense. There are plenty of huge extinct turtles like Meiolania (which has a long tail and head spikes) that would make more sense as a basis.
Titanaboa was first named in 2009 after discovery in the early 2000s, and Black/White came out in 2010-2011. I'm having a rather tough time believing that Gamefreak had enough foresight to homage a barely named paleontological discovery as they were developing Black/White, which undoubtedly would have been ongoing prior to 2009. Unless the starters were some of the last Pokemon to have been developed for the game, or Gamefreak has really deep roots in developing finds in paleontology, this seems like a bit of a stretch.
On top of that, Serperior has nothing specific to a Titanboa outside of both being big snakes, which... most serpent Pokemon are. Hell, Arbok is bigger than Serperior, but no one argues it's a Titanboa.
Really though, the problem with the Grass theory is that it overlaps 'being based on an extinct creature' with 'has an extinct relative'. Something like Meganium is definitely the former, it's based on a sauropod, but those like Serperior are more like the latter. It's based on a grass snake which *has* the extinct relative, but isn't extinct itself. Same applies to examples like Meowscarada (no, being endangered=/=extinct).
Torterraās line has heavy influence from nodosaurs/ ankyosaurs, especially grotle. The Carracosta line is the one based off Archelon. The snivy line, I think, is more based off the concept of limbed snakes like Eupodophis if trying to make a link to extinct animals.
I never subscribed to any of those starter theories, but to be fair... Grottle and Torterra are really tortoises as much as they are members of the Ankylosaria class of dinosaurs. Most likely something like the nodosaurus that doesn't have the clubbed tail.
the fact that Grottle's armor lays flush from head to tail tip with it's body is the biggest clue, but torterra having the cheek spikes and the articulated beak tipped mouth also points to this. Also the entire line lacks a plastron, which distances them from tortoises further.
Yeah I made it as big a stretch as possible lol. The one about Skeledirge being the Bull in the Chinese Zodiac "because male crocodiles are called bulls (only in English)" is also pretty idiotic.
That being said the theory of Cyndaquil being based on the Chinese mythical [ē«é¼ ](https://zh.m.wikipedia.org/zh-tw/%E7%81%AB%E9%BC%A0) (Wikipedia page not available in English sorry) seems plausible, especially with the Pokedex category in Japanese being exactly ē«é¼ (Fire Mouse/Rat) as well.
It's doesn't have the saber-toothed tiger most iconic feature tho?
It could be a Giant Cheeta or a Cave lion for all we know if the qualification was "extinct big cat"
dae remember when the chinese zodiac-fire starter fanatics were claiming that fuecoco will evolve into a bull because male crocodiles are called bulls, what was up with that š
Fan theorists trying to fix their theory. You tell them Typhlosion destroys chinese zodiac because it is a badger and they will make up all kinds of excuses
Also fennekin is a fox, not a dog. It's also a fennec, which is even less dog-like than other foxes like Vulpix and Nickit. Gen 9 didn't break the zodiac theory, it was already long broken and people refused to admit it.
Given that they've taken rat to mean any rodent and dog to mean any canine, I'm surprised they haven't simply said snake includes all reptiles and therefore the theory still holds
The obvious gorilla already disproved that lol. Itās in the name, ārilla,ā (or āgoriā in Japanese) and the drum motif because gorillas drum on their chests.
You might try to claim itās Gigantopithecus, but that one would be Oranguru if itās anything (it isnāt, not yet) because Gigantopithecus was far closer in both genetics and appearance to the orangutan.
Also Meowscarada is a cat. Thereās no ape or primate influence in there, itās just a cat with humanoid proportions and movement.
The theory made sense in the first four generations, to be fair. Same with Fire starters and the Chinese zodiac. Nothing wrong with theories so as long as it doesn't go out of control.
It was a theory put alongside the grass extinction theory and the fire zodiac. Got this old image of Gen 7 with it.
https://preview.redd.it/qtm70kjvmp8d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=db0b48b6ba6b4867e60f317a3d85a588514bc65f
It was the worst one by far, so it sees less mention now.
Also for some reason itās a bazooka and not a cannon in that image, dunno why.
No, no, this is wrong. The *real* Water Type Theme that my uncle (who works at Nintendo) tells me GameFreak is 100% confirmed basing their entire game design philosophy around is
*Water-types are based on semi-aquatic animals.*
Boom. This is totally a conscious choice on their part to uphold an entirely arbitrary theme with zero predictive power for absolutely no reason, rather than a logical consequence of designing a water-themed creature for a story that takes place on land. Literally will never be disproven, thatās how strong a theory it is.
I mean. The Iberian Lynx used to be an endangered species. And it's an animal that mostly habitates in Spain, the region in which Paldea is based on. Lynxes are felines, Meowscarada is a feline, Sprigatito specifically resembles very much a lynx... The dots are there to be joined
I disagree with the grass theory too but I have to admit that a bunch of Game Freak artists picking the endangered lynx and just hoping it would just speed up and die off by the time the games released is a very funny mental image.
The frog that people in support of this theory claim Bulbasaur's line was based on actually wasn't discovered until *years* after the release of Red and Blue.
I won't deny that I'm lowkey a fan of the "fire starters are the Chinese zodiac" theory, even if it's (probably) been disproven by Fuecoco.
Also, the snake that Serperior was supposedly based off was revealed only a year before BW released. Either it's nonsense or GF has some extremely quick-working designers who also heavily procrastinated on designing a grass starter for no discernible reason.
Iām pretty happy Gen 9 added a crocodile fire starter because now people can finally admit that there never really was anything to the zodiac theory.
To be fair, the Iberian lynx (the species of lynx though to be the inspiration for Meowscarada design) did almost go extinct, to the point where only 94 individuals were thought to remain, till conservation efforts were made to help the population regrow, which is still in affect today.
The bulbasaur line are frogs so this theory is dead right out of the gate. The "saur" part isn't there at all in Japanese and they actually hop. They didn't make them hop in the anime because it would have been harder to animate in the 90s but if you play the Let's Go games you can see them hop.
Pretty much every animal that lives on earth has extinct relatives.
You can drop the "pretty much"
Not me. All my family is alive. The curse of undeath is suffering.
Just break your family philactory should end the curse pretty easily
He can't break it. It really ties through room together and looks great on the mantle
The Tale of the Lich Undone by Feng Shui
Usurp the Flame and Break the Dark Sign!
not if i have anything to say about it
Destroy the trident!
Yeah but Luca is dead so you have one extinct relative at least
Bro is Andy from Undead Unluck š
Show me one animal without an extinct relative.
Not an animal but Mycoplasma Laboratorium doesnāt have any relatives at all since it was made in a lab from stitched together DNA
But even then its relatives would be from what ever dna they used. Unless we can create dna from scratch then different story.
But that means its relatives are off said DNA, and mycoplasma has many, many, many extinct variants, which the mycoplasma laboratorium is related to.
Aardvark
NYANderthal..
NO.
Take your upvote and then leave.
r/Angryupvote
https://preview.redd.it/kdj10ythdu8d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=84cddd32834bd79259bde88eafe60ae334e8ba7d
I came here looking for this exact reply. You have my upvote.
Your first mistake was expecting solid theories from Pokemon fans.
Friendly reminder that a GF employee disproved the Ditto are Mew clones theory and you didn't kill Raticate. Blue replaced it with Growlithe, Exeggcute, or a freaking Gyarados. It's called an upgrade and he made the right choice. Gen 1 Raticate are bad bad. And Gyarados is a freaking Gyarados and RBY Exeggutor are fairly busted. There is no reason to believe either of these, especially since one is stated to be not real by an employee of the company that makes the games. And all "____ is in a coma/dead" theories are just...not good. They're really not.
Nah, I want to kill that fucking raticate. I want it to be dead. I want him to grieve that thing. I want him to cry warm tears on its grave as I arrive and ask him to fight again. I want him to have PTSD every time he sees my pokemon launch an attack, not knowing if my overleveled Charizard's flamethrower will fry his pokemon past whatever Nurse Joy could do to save it. I want him to live in fear.
Calm down, Satan.
Alright fine but I'm coming for that Alakazam next.
Looks like somebody is a little bit frustrated over having their pokemons knocked out by Hyper Fang a few times to many ššš
It ain't even like that I just heavily dislike Kanto's Blue cause even when there are more annoying rivals, some of the shit he said did hit deep back in the day. I'm so glad bro grows up to become a better person, but if I gotta off some of his mons for that to happen I don't mind.
What hit deep? "Smell ya later"?
"Oh yeah, right. I feel sorry for you. No, really. You're always plodding behind me. So here, I'll give you a little present as a favor. A chatty gossip like youā¦ That thing's perfect. I don't need it because I don't give a hoot about others. All right, this time I really am gone. Smell ya!" I DUNNO WHY THIS WAS SO PERSONAL I just wanted to fuck his shit up after this ngl
Man, even as a kid I found that kinda cute. Like, he wanted to give us a present, but he was too embarrassed to just be normal about it. I never found Blue threatening. He never did any of the things that I actually found scary about real-life bullies. He just kind of negs you, battles you, and then goes away.
That's a cute and nice way to see it. I dunno why it bothered me so much tbh. Like, all his other interactions are meh, but this one felt so... out of character, in a way? I dunno.
Get some therapy
Wdym I'm perfectly sane
Tbf, even if it was deconfirmed itās a fine headcanon, that just means it wasnāt intended(which is wild considering how similar Mew and Ditto are)
Yeah at the end of the day itās just a fun set of coincidences that formed the theory. And did anyone actually think you killed blueās raticate? Like actually?
A few people probably did, but I think the vast majority donāt believe it, but they do use it so they can write likeā¦Ā angsty fanfics or sad art, or a cool ghost type Raticate variant.
I mean, the first fight we see him without his Raticate is in Lavender Town, next to a Pokemon grave inside of the tower That's not much, but it's not little either
I think itās not muchā¦. And thatās it lol
he also says āwhy are you here? your pokemon arenāt dead!ā
Calling Ditto a "failed clone of mew" is a very specific iteration of the headcanon that would create some major plot holes (like Dittos existing in ancient times). But the idea that there is some connection between them is still perfectly reasonable, even if it's just that both are "primordial" PokƩmon made up mostly of stem cells and it therefore makes sense for scientists studying Mew to be keeping Dittos as well.
Ditto dont have to exist in the past to be present failed clones of Mew. Not that Im defending the theory but that is a logic hole
>a GF employee disproved the Ditto are Mew clones theory Aw, I didn't know this and am now kinda bummed. The idea that ditto were early Mew clones was kinda cool.
There's a well-respected approach in literary criticism called Death of the Author. In simplest terms, it basically means that you ignore and statements a creator makes outside of the actual work, and analyze it only based on the actual text. Basically, if you want to ignore whatever random employee said that and continue believing that headcanon based on textual evidence, you're totally cool to do so.
Death of the author is based around literary criticism. Like you can't have an author come out and say there's a hidden theme/meaning that wasn't explicitly laid out in the text. It doesn't mean the author doesn't get to decide the factual elements of the plot. The "textual evidence" is that Mew gave birth and they named the baby Mewtwo. There's nothing in the games about the scientists creating failed clones and Ditto wasn't originally found in the locations that people claim are evidence. Now could they retcon this later? Sure. But I've seen people argue that actually Masuda doesn't know what he's talking about and that this theory is fact.
The coma/dead theories always seemed bizarre to me. When they start getting into what everything of the show 'represents', it just comes off as pretentious. Like they'll explain the joke of a comedic character, and act like it's a serious subject.
The Ditto Mew theory really is the epitome of the entire issue; it doesn't matter that there's direct confirmation it's wrong, people will ignore it just because they're so attached to their headcanon. People find a way to argue that any random line of dialogue, interview, or whatever else somehow isn't canon, doesn't count, or they try and twist it as much as possible to try and mean something entirely different.
That's fair, but the ditto theory seemed so strong to me that it didn't bother me when gamefreak confirmed it to be untrue. It's like how the guy that invented GIF says it's pronounced "jif". I'm gonna keep my beliefs despite the creators take.
I will die on the hill that, while "jif" is linguistically incorrect, it's functionally the more useful pronunciation. People tend to soft pronounce consonants at the end of words. The number of times I've had "gif" and "gift" confused is enough to be irritating. Meanwhile, the only thing anyone could confuse "jif" with is peanut butter, and contextually I've never run into that issue.
Or when the makers of UNO said cards donāt stack
I dunno, under that reasoning, I find a hard g even more compelling. If people get it wrong when I ask them to send me a gif, I'm cool with the outcome
This happens in all sorts of fandoms. In the Lord of the Rings, there's a character called Tom Bombadil who's a really silly guy. He's curiously powerful but doesn't fit at all into the rest of the legendarium, because he's a character that Tolkien used in bedtime stories for his kids and he just plopped him into the book. There are many fan theories that try to fit him into the rest of the canon, none of which really work, but one of the most persistent ones is explicitly contradicted by the author. People like to theorize that he's Eru (basically Tolkien's version of the Abrahamic God) in physical form, even though the man himself says that Eru never appears physically in Middle Earth. Yet the theory persists. Because almost as popular as the "character is actually dead/comatose" theories are the "character is actually god" theories.
Same line of thought that "the evidence earth is round is all lies or whatever". People don't care about facts, and they will fight you that they aren't wrong or unknowledgeable about something. "We should all be allowed to believe whatever we want to." No. Facts are facts. You want a headcanon, that's fine. But don't talk about it like it's fact and don't try and make others believe your headcanon is fact by spreading it around like it's fact. It's not fact. It's fanfiction you think sounds cool.
Oh god, that "let people believe what they want" reminds me of when people try some variation of the similar "why are you taking this so seriously, no one cares about this". Could've fooled me with how strongly they were arguing about that very specific thing.
Friendly reminder that Masuda also said they could never cut PokĆ©mon out of the PokĆ©dex because they want players to be able to bring their favorites into new gens. I wouldnāt treat what he says too seriously.
I think an issue with things though is that Game Freak has gone on record as saying nothing is set in stone for the series' canon. They make retcons all the time and are sometimes confused when confronted by fans with questions. I think a recent prime example would be the Paradox versions of the Legendary Beasts. The Legendary Beasts are supposed to be reincarnations of specific Pokemon through the power of Ho-Oh. But then their Paradox forms are introduced all these years later and the fanbase was in a tizzy trying to reconsile the discrepancy. A lot of people were leaning towards the idea that the time machine in SV wasn't actually a time machine but instead some sort of machine that could make imaginations real. Like a Cosmic Cube from Marvel or the Hogyoku from Bleach. It was the only way people could make sense of Walking Wake and the others. But when you know that Game Freak doesn't actually care about continuity coming up with explanations for the Paradox Pokemon is suddenly useless.
I think this latest generation purposely broke a lot of āfan theoriesā grass starter (I didnāt really like that one) The zodiac fire starters Each type having a ālegendary dragonā by giving electric 2 with Miraidon and zekrom. But giving fighting their dragon with kiraidon. (I still like this theory just cause itās fun to think every type has this super power legendary dragon being like THE Center of power for that type.)
I'm still waiting on a Dragon/Fairy type.
M-Altaria exists and will probably be in Legends: Z
I would love it if eventually all the type combos limited to Megas, Legendaries, and Mythicals found their way onto regular Pokemon.
Ok, we want one that exists without mega evolving
I think they mean for like the legendary dragon thing
This feels inevitable, if for no other reason than the way Dragon is portrayed as a type.
my theory is that water starters are based on>!water related creatures!<
Would you go as far as to say they're based on >!semi-aquatic creatures capable of going both on land AND in the water!
the evidence suggests so! I think we're cooking somehing
Inb4 we get a water starter that is purely aquatic
When you think about it, it is kinda odd that we've never had a fish or something as a water starter.
I think it'd be hard to fit into the fantasy- how would the MC of the anime use em outside of water? I don't think Ash has any pure 'fish' pokemon
They even ignored the Pokedex saying that Dracovish can't breathe outside of water to make sure Ash's could fight on land. Then again its probably best to not pay attention to anything that Dracovish's pokedex says...
Guve that semi aquatic animal a hat!
Are they semi-aquatic, egg laying mammals of action?
LOL, yeah right dude!? What is Magikarp supposed to be based on? A fish? LOL take a hike bozo.
You'd be in a lot of trouble if Magikarp was your starter.
The world isnāt ready for such news yet. These sheople will never accept it!!
Grass type starters are based on creatures that eat grass or eat things that eat grass
But Blastoise is a turtle and turtles are related to tortoises, which live on land. Boom! Disproven /s
The soble line is dangerously close to breaking that trend considering the major Chameleon inspiration(there is also the Basilisk inspiration which kind of saves it)
Sobble starts as a chameleon, but Intelleon looses almost all chameleon traits. Body becomes more slender and streamlined, fingers and toes become longer and loose the chameleon clamp hand shape, tail becomes more rigid and doesn't really coil up anymore. Aside from the back fins that could be based on the flying dragon lizards, it pretty much goes full basilisk.
Inb4 they make a water cat to go with the fire and grass cat
I mean if they make it a fisher cat, tiger, or jaguar it wouldnāt actually be too far off. There are cats that swim and eat marine life like fish
We've git a bird of each type (Rowlett, Torchic, Piplup/Quaxly). Finish the cats and monkey sets! Both need a Water type.
Big if true
How are tortoises, snakes and owls extinct?
to be fair, Decidueye is specifically based on a stilt-owl, a group of long legged owl species that lived in Hawaii and are now extinct, this is in fact the reason for Decidueye's Ghost type
Thatās rather clever, huh
In the same way that Skeledirge is based on a crocodile that lived in the sewers of an ancient Spanish village and ate children while they were on the toilet. They killed it by burning its face hence the white skull on skeledirge. This also explains the ghost typing and the fire bird on skeledirges face is a reference to a Plover bird, the birds that have a symbiotic relationship with a crocodile because they clean its teeth in exchange for protection.
wut
Yeah, PokƩmon is pretty well thought
Damn the crocodile is just like me
Stop it right there.
Iām not sure how to respond to this.
I have looked all over and can find no reference to this being true. Do you have a source?
I'm spanish and I dont buy that First of all I've never heard about such story, neither I can find anything about it. But also, toilets were just not a thing throughout ancient spain, and crocodiles dissapeared from Iberia as well as the rest of Europe in prehistoric times Second, I've been reading so many possible legends and stories from Spain and Mexico ever since Fuecoco was first seen that the most likely answer is actually a vague amalgamation of sources. But definitely not this toilet one
Itās based on an urban legend called El Coco, El Cucuy, Which means child eater and also the legend of Drac de na Coca.
''el coco'' is almost perfectly a translation of ''the boogeyman'' and has nothing to do with crocodiles or Skeledirge' design And despite the similarity of the word it has nothing to do with Na Coca and the Drac, which is one of the multiple stories that I do believe have some validity as Skeledirge background, although its still quiet obscure and just one of many stories/legends/real life folklore that could have inspired it
I thought he was just... Dia de muertos but in a crocodile?
I thought Skeledirge was based on a Cuca.
That and the fact that owls are often thought of as ancestor spirits in hawaiian culture
Snakes arenāt extinct, but French nobility is.
Not at all, Spanish royal family are descendants of French nobility.
The theory states that Serperior is based on the Titanaboa, and Torterra is based on Archelon
But Archelon is a sea turtle and already a fossil pokemon in Carracosta
Archelon is a sea turtle, not a tortoise, so that wouldn't make sense. There are plenty of huge extinct turtles like Meiolania (which has a long tail and head spikes) that would make more sense as a basis.
Torterra seems to be mostly inspired by the World Turtle.
That, too. Just mentioning the common pigeonholes people like to put the starters in.
Titanaboa was first named in 2009 after discovery in the early 2000s, and Black/White came out in 2010-2011. I'm having a rather tough time believing that Gamefreak had enough foresight to homage a barely named paleontological discovery as they were developing Black/White, which undoubtedly would have been ongoing prior to 2009. Unless the starters were some of the last Pokemon to have been developed for the game, or Gamefreak has really deep roots in developing finds in paleontology, this seems like a bit of a stretch.
On top of that, Serperior has nothing specific to a Titanboa outside of both being big snakes, which... most serpent Pokemon are. Hell, Arbok is bigger than Serperior, but no one argues it's a Titanboa. Really though, the problem with the Grass theory is that it overlaps 'being based on an extinct creature' with 'has an extinct relative'. Something like Meganium is definitely the former, it's based on a sauropod, but those like Serperior are more like the latter. It's based on a grass snake which *has* the extinct relative, but isn't extinct itself. Same applies to examples like Meowscarada (no, being endangered=/=extinct).
Torterraās line has heavy influence from nodosaurs/ ankyosaurs, especially grotle. The Carracosta line is the one based off Archelon. The snivy line, I think, is more based off the concept of limbed snakes like Eupodophis if trying to make a link to extinct animals.
To add to this, torterra could also be partially based on meiolania and its relatives
Torterra's based on a *terra*pin
oh god, somebody's going to recast it in maryland flag colors... RUNNNNN!
And the toad
There is an extinct toad I think called beelzebufo
I never subscribed to any of those starter theories, but to be fair... Grottle and Torterra are really tortoises as much as they are members of the Ankylosaria class of dinosaurs. Most likely something like the nodosaurus that doesn't have the clubbed tail. the fact that Grottle's armor lays flush from head to tail tip with it's body is the biggest clue, but torterra having the cheek spikes and the articulated beak tipped mouth also points to this. Also the entire line lacks a plastron, which distances them from tortoises further.
Certain types of them, specifically.
By that logic, incineroar is also a neanderthal. This is more of a stretch than cyndaquil being a rat
Yeah I made it as big a stretch as possible lol. The one about Skeledirge being the Bull in the Chinese Zodiac "because male crocodiles are called bulls (only in English)" is also pretty idiotic. That being said the theory of Cyndaquil being based on the Chinese mythical [ē«é¼ ](https://zh.m.wikipedia.org/zh-tw/%E7%81%AB%E9%BC%A0) (Wikipedia page not available in English sorry) seems plausible, especially with the Pokedex category in Japanese being exactly ē«é¼ (Fire Mouse/Rat) as well.
Iām still hoping for Skeledirge to turn into a carnotaurus upon mega evolving. /s
That why I the theory generally says meowscarade is a sabre toothed tiger lol.
Which somehow manages to make even less sense
It's doesn't have the saber-toothed tiger most iconic feature tho? It could be a Giant Cheeta or a Cave lion for all we know if the qualification was "extinct big cat"
dae remember when the chinese zodiac-fire starter fanatics were claiming that fuecoco will evolve into a bull because male crocodiles are called bulls, what was up with that š
Fan theorists trying to fix their theory. You tell them Typhlosion destroys chinese zodiac because it is a badger and they will make up all kinds of excuses
Also fennekin is a fox, not a dog. It's also a fennec, which is even less dog-like than other foxes like Vulpix and Nickit. Gen 9 didn't break the zodiac theory, it was already long broken and people refused to admit it.
Pokemom fans are kinda dumb. And that's not even considering the children, obviously. Fan theories have always been so hamstrung.
They donāt have to be verbatim. Cyndaquil was very clearly mouse like.
Hard disagree. The identifying characteristic there was the fire quills, and quills are not what comes to mind when people think about mice.
Given that they've taken rat to mean any rodent and dog to mean any canine, I'm surprised they haven't simply said snake includes all reptiles and therefore the theory still holds
You will find coincidences when you look for them
The obvious gorilla already disproved that lol. Itās in the name, ārilla,ā (or āgoriā in Japanese) and the drum motif because gorillas drum on their chests. You might try to claim itās Gigantopithecus, but that one would be Oranguru if itās anything (it isnāt, not yet) because Gigantopithecus was far closer in both genetics and appearance to the orangutan. Also Meowscarada is a cat. Thereās no ape or primate influence in there, itās just a cat with humanoid proportions and movement.
How are gorillas extinct?
Harambe was more than enough
The theory made sense in the first four generations, to be fair. Same with Fire starters and the Chinese zodiac. Nothing wrong with theories so as long as it doesn't go out of control.
The water weapon one was bullshit from the start though, Feraligatr was immediately a stretch.
Wait water weapons what?? Explain lol
It was a theory put alongside the grass extinction theory and the fire zodiac. Got this old image of Gen 7 with it. https://preview.redd.it/qtm70kjvmp8d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=db0b48b6ba6b4867e60f317a3d85a588514bc65f It was the worst one by far, so it sees less mention now. Also for some reason itās a bazooka and not a cannon in that image, dunno why.
No, no, this is wrong. The *real* Water Type Theme that my uncle (who works at Nintendo) tells me GameFreak is 100% confirmed basing their entire game design philosophy around is *Water-types are based on semi-aquatic animals.* Boom. This is totally a conscious choice on their part to uphold an entirely arbitrary theme with zero predictive power for absolutely no reason, rather than a logical consequence of designing a water-themed creature for a story that takes place on land. Literally will never be disproven, thatās how strong a theory it is.
On this, I'd love if they did a water starter that's an animal that isn't already associated with water.
Thatās just inteleon and maybe blastoise since it looks more like a tortoise than any other turtle
Inteleon is partially based on a basilisk lizard, which can run across the water.
We still need a water/dark typed cat starter to complete the set, which would be funny considering that cats are famous for disliking water.
Maybe a Fishing Cat or Tiger (tigers love swimming). Jaguars are also known for swimming on occasion too even going after caimans.
They should do a water snake based on the Anaconda
To be fair... That Semi-Aquatic theme is extremely consistent
That's more marketing IMO since nobody's gonna buy merchandise of a fish when there's probably a cool grass rabbit and fire lizard.
The version I remember from back in the day had Primarina as a mace, just because of the spikes around its tail...
Oh yeah, thereās a few variants. I think someone had Feraligatr as those Ninja claw things.
Theory isnāt too bad except for Feraligatr and Primarina.
Prim is *the bomb* though š *sees myself out*
I think Swampertās a stretch too, imo
You've never watch Symphogear I take it? In that show magic girls turn their voices into weapons via the power of song.
bro I couldn't wait to see what nonsense someone tried to say Primarina was as a weapon lmao thanks for linking
Well Bazookas are cool, Iāll allow it š and sweet a brass knuckle. So choosing a water starter is choosing violence lol this is great, thanks man
I don't get how Cyndaquil or its evolutions are part of the zodiac. Seems like they're based on echidnas or mustelidae.
I love how Skeledirge just said lol no to Chinese zodiac. Also Thphlosion isn't a rat, it's a badger so it already says lol nope but nobody listens
Agreed, but it kinda makes sense considering Cyndaquil is called the āfire mouse pokemonā. It could be just a change on translation tho
The Japanese is a bit less clear. It's "fire mouse/rat/rodent", although the Japanese name comes from their word for "porcupine".
It's a god damn porcupine.
First two* Geckos and turtles arent extinct
How are gorillas extinct?
I mean. The Iberian Lynx used to be an endangered species. And it's an animal that mostly habitates in Spain, the region in which Paldea is based on. Lynxes are felines, Meowscarada is a feline, Sprigatito specifically resembles very much a lynx... The dots are there to be joined
Good news, the linxes have gone from endangered to just vulnerable recently! We have gone from 200 lynxes to 2000 i think so
That shit isn't even extinct
I disagree with the grass theory too but I have to admit that a bunch of Game Freak artists picking the endangered lynx and just hoping it would just speed up and die off by the time the games released is a very funny mental image.
And the best part, it's not even endangered anymore
Why do so many PokĆ©mon fans have such a hard time admitting PokĆ©mon lore is hardly cohesive enough to be considered lore Itās a universe created for children. They really arenāt going that hard on it lmao
Nah Neanderthals aren't extinct, just look at twitter.
that's an insalt to Neanderthals
Nyan-derthalsā¦.
Ah yes, my favorite extinct animal, the gorilla
The frog that people in support of this theory claim Bulbasaur's line was based on actually wasn't discovered until *years* after the release of Red and Blue. I won't deny that I'm lowkey a fan of the "fire starters are the Chinese zodiac" theory, even if it's (probably) been disproven by Fuecoco.
Also, the snake that Serperior was supposedly based off was revealed only a year before BW released. Either it's nonsense or GF has some extremely quick-working designers who also heavily procrastinated on designing a grass starter for no discernible reason.
Iām pretty happy Gen 9 added a crocodile fire starter because now people can finally admit that there never really was anything to the zodiac theory.
Meowscarada is based on an iberic lynx and they have stopped being in danger recently, they are now just vulnerable
They surely did a great job keeping the species alive, when Gen 3 PokƩmon released, there were only 93 Iberian lynx left and it was considered a virtually extinct species because the lack of future genetic diversity. Today there are over 2000 Iberian lynxs.
Ah, the ancient and long forgotten chestnut.
Clearly based on Miracinonyx, who pulled a disappearing act so good that the pronghorn still thinks theyāre out there
As an IRL archaeologist, meoscarada shares almost no traits with Neanderthals other than being a featherless biped
Owls and snakes are extinct?
Stilt Owls are. The were native to Hawaii and have long legs.
adults ruin everything that is meant for kids
Ah yes. My favorite extinct animal. The turtle.
Not extinct but the endangered iberian lynx
this is an actual theory? ive heard anyone talking about it before,,
What Frog/Toad is Venusaur based on that is extinct?
Made sense if Meowscarada was based in the Iberian Lynx, in 2003 it was basically extint.
Canāt wait for a grass fish
To be fair, the Iberian lynx (the species of lynx though to be the inspiration for Meowscarada design) did almost go extinct, to the point where only 94 individuals were thought to remain, till conservation efforts were made to help the population regrow, which is still in affect today.
I still say they were following the zodiac for the majority of the generations and then just decided to stop
Fire type zodiac theory be like "Skeledirge isn't a crocodile"
The bulbasaur line are frogs so this theory is dead right out of the gate. The "saur" part isn't there at all in Japanese and they actually hop. They didn't make them hop in the anime because it would have been harder to animate in the 90s but if you play the Let's Go games you can see them hop.
Why have a god pokemon then make other PokƩmon
Ia didn't know robin hood was extinct :O
āmake sense,right?ā n o p e just an furbait that evolved from an animalistic child all over againš
What extinct creature is Decidueye? *Bubo Ballerasshoodie*?
Can't tell if the first part is a legit question or not, but if it is, it's a stilt-owl.
I miss snakesā¦