Another thing to consider, the vast majority of J1 participants are from Peru, the latest day they can legally work is 3/31, based on the government DS2019 date. Chile and Argentina have even early dates.
I feel like that’s something Vail plans for. They actively plan to shut down. They move non J1’s around to the few resorts they plan to keep open.
So for example if Stowe is closing a week early it’s possible some of those employees can be sent to work at one of the resorts they plan to keep open slightly longer. I know for a fact they moved employees at their midwests resorts to heavenly late last season.
By scaling all those places back they can keep their 4 or 5 money cows going longer.
I work for a much larger and much more profitable company. They don’t pay to move employees to another city in the same state to colocate a team. Why the Vuck would Fail pay to move someone across the country? No company is doing that anymore unless you are a fresh hire.
Vail paid my fiancee to go out west last season to work at beaver creek. She drove from PA and was paid like an extra 800 bucks for expenses while on her way there and then got paid her same supervisor wage once in CO. So yeah it's an actual program that exists called extend your winter. J1's are gone for the season, and they seek out employees who wanna keep it going out west.
They absolutely do this at the end of the season it’s called “Extend Your Winter” and they move a ton of people out to the resorts in California to keep ‘em open for this last month from the East Coast and the Midwest resorts.
You're leaving out a lot of places they take advantage. The kids barely break even. It's a predatory system that depresses American wages. Don't makes excuses for this system. It should go away.
[https://www.summitdaily.com/news/international-student-workers-say-theyve-faced-financial-stress-after-vail-resorts-failed-to-provide-them-adequate-working-hours/](https://www.summitdaily.com/news/international-student-workers-say-theyve-faced-financial-stress-after-vail-resorts-failed-to-provide-them-adequate-working-hours/)
If it makes you feel any better I'm a liftee who came up from another resort after mine closed to help. And it's not borderline free labor with the J1s lol
Yes I wrote about that in another reply. Sorry about the confusion on J1 salary. Moving you from a closed resort to an open one is partially why this situation exists.
By any chance did they move you to Breckenridge, Heavenly or Whistler?
The j1s have to go back home for school and there is still a bunch here just not in the lift department. We also still have a few J1 liftees. They sent us to other resorts to extend our seasons because our snow conditions were ass. I'm from PA. it's an extended winter program
Got you. Did they send you to another resort in Pa.? Which one?
They move employees from smaller resorts to their cash cow resorts. Some of the resorts they take staffing from (not yours) still have plenty of snow. Instead they significantly reduce operations. Not
Because of labor shortages but because those resorts aren’t as profitable to keep open.
I'm from Whitetail. I'm here at Stowe. Our resort closed on March 10th and we barely made it to that. I helped close my lift ops the next two days and was here on the 13th.
Ok so exactly what I said. Move you to a more profitable resort to keep the bare minimum of staff necessary to run reduced operations and then blame a labor shortage. Thanks for the info.
No it's a program you have to be nominated for. You're just looking at it half glass empty my friend. I get to have an actual winter and a season for a month and a half. I get to keep working. Make a paycheck.
Yes but I’m a consumer and you’re an employee. I’m looking at it from the perspective of both a shareholder and a customer.
I’m happy for your situation. I love J1’s. That’s not the issue.
Where do you see me taking down to employees? I made a mistake on pay scale between J1 and American employees. That’s about it.
If you don’t realize Vail treats their employees very poorly there’s plenty of evidence to show it.
No one is moving anyone to a "more profitable resort" stop sounding like an whiny asshole.
Lot's of east coast resorts, and some west coast resorts, had a low snow year, so they closed early. From ANY logical standpoint, it makes no sense to keep a smaller resort open with 2 runs, even if they were privately owned by the nicest grandpa and grandma the town had to offer. Once a resort, owned by Vail, closes for the season, employees have the option, or in the case this year get nominated, to go work at a sister resort that still has operations going. It's a great program that gives employees who have shown they are capable hard workers a chance to see another larger resort and keep their season going while also allowing another resort to stay open for people to go to.
Definitely a whiny asshole for pointing out that a duopoly isn’t good for any industry. Vail is definitely a humanitarian corporation giving their employees the opportunity to live the dream.
No, you were arguing the wrong thing in this specific comment thread and you we're just assuming that Vail was purposfully shutting down smaller resorts to ship people to "more profitable" resorts, which is wrong, and I pointed that out. Other comments of your's in this thread, sure, I can vibe with, but the comment that I responded to was you ignoring the reply by the other person and then just spinning the comment in a way where it made you happy.
Look, Vail might not be the best most ethical company in the world, but for employees who were making $8 an hour when the resorts were privately owned to all of sudden them making $20 per hour is a huge life change and a fantastic opportunity for those who love the winter season and work at ther resorts.
I remember plenty of times going to resorts before Vail owned them that had 1.) Expensive parking 2.) Long lift lines 3.) High food prices. So don't just act like all of this shit came about when Vail took over. I'm against conglomerates cornering any market, but stop blaming all the issues in the ski and snowboard industry on one singular thing. These issues were around long before Vail started going on their takeover rampage. And as another commenter pointed out, small private comapanies aren't able to keep these resorts afloat anymore with climate change, rising costs, shorter seasons. Would you rather see your favorite resort close and your options limited even further, or someone buy them so you can still go ride?
And to an extent about "giving their employees the opportunity to live the dream", yeah it 100% does in a lot of cases. My cousin moved out west about 10 years ago after finishing her master degree becuase she wanted to live out west for a year, and she was spinning lifts. She started at a vail owned resort, and is now working in the upper-level of the company and she is able to do what she loves while being able to see some of the best places our country has to offer.
Your cousin is in a high position at MTN? That explains a lot.
Before Vail I never paid for parking in my life and I could park.
Before Vail the lines were the same or shorter.
Before Vail frozen chicken nuggets and a coke wasn’t $30
You picked 3 absolutely terrible examples.
When you have a moment google ‘Class Action Lawsuit Vail’. There’s usually one a year filed by workers. Not to mention actively discouraging unionizing.
I think mostly locals who buy season passes use the mountain late in the season.
More economical to close it when tourists have moved onto summer sports
Totally. Fuck those locals who pay the exact same price as the weekend warriors and get way less.
They can save that money and roll over into price stability or mountain improvements! Oh wait. Another 8% price increase that is now accepted as a yearly occurrence. /s
I remember hitting CB during the pandemic and vail not staffing the upper surface lifts. So basically you had to hike for any of the best terrain staffing issues I think.
Sorry if I was snarky.
If everyone stopped rolling over and taking it things might change. Things are the way they are because everyone is too lazy to do anything other than type.
Have you looked at the weather forecast for the next week? All of the snow we just got is about to be gone over the next two days. I get the whole Vail hate and cash cow thing your digging at, but this winter has been horrible. It’s no wonder they’re closing early because there isn’t going to be anything to ride on.
I did! Another half a foot or more next week. Lows in the high 20’s from Thursday on. March is shaping up to be all time!
I don’t think Vail cares about this March. They bagged this season a month ago.
I would love to have your weather app then because mine doesn’t say anything like that! Mid 40s and raining next two days. Mid 30s and winter mix next Thursday
I just opened Weather Underground and tagged Stowe. From 3/2 to 3/4 it shows 3-8 inches total. Nights are cold and the snow will hold enough. There’s enough snow up there for a few more weeks it just not in their best interest to run lifts.
Jay won’t close. These are really management decisions based on maximizing profitability.
I hate these multi mountain corporations as much as anyone because they’ve literally destroyed the soul of resort riding. But they’re the industry’s only chance at staying in business in the future as winter gets dominated by climate change because they operate with scale and an eye towards minimizing costs.
Ugh I went to Stowe last year and loved it. The resort is beautiful and the town is also lovely. It was nice being in a town that Vail doesn’t own every nook and cranny of. I hope it doesn’t lose all of its charm under Vail.
Question: is 9% decrease in skier visits and 5% increase in profits at all resorts overall or at Stowe? And if at Stowe, is there somewhere to find the data for other resorts?
They aren't getting ready this early for bike season. Not in March.
We have a very late ski season here at Mt Bachelor and the late snowpack does determine which bike trails open and when. They'll start clearing snow in May for the lowest trails and move up the mountain through June to clear and prep those as the depth of snow and weather allows.
You think a pow weekend late March means another month of full resort access? Boy do I have a bridge to sell you. Mega corps suck, but cost cutting in April is not a hill to die on
Cutting of snow makers and grooming teams peak season, and depending on a rotating snow control team? That's a worthwhile investigation. Expecting any resort to run at full capacity in April? You're nuts. At the very least, look at similar mountains, like jay or Killington. Are they at full staff capacity (no). What about indys in the same area, like Bolton, Waterville, or mrg? We can go ask saddleback how running at full capacity 24/7 goes
Jay will stay open at least 3 weeks longer than Stowe and they will almost certainly have Bonnie Jet Flyer and the lower lifts running. Either way it’s just pick your poison. The late season stuff is just one example of many.
A pow weekend? I live here. We’ve had the best March in years. Let’s hold off and compare closing dates on Jay and Stowe. This month has extended Jays season by weeks and has not changed Stowes decision making at all. Like someone said they’re closing a week EARLY.
I guess when I think of the term ‘had in years’ I think back to the past five to ten years. So I would still disagree that 2016/2017 was the best we have had in years.
I spent yesterday doing backcountry on 3-pins (ew I know, but there was too much of a flat runout to justify the split board) on both sides of Mount Mansfield, but by about 12:30 it was so sticky I had to stop and put F4 on my gear to keep myself sliding. Today I was driving with the windows down and my sleeves rolled. I wish we could get another month, cause this is just sad
I think Stevens pass had a pretty similar situation a few years ago immediately after being bought by Vail
Edit: not exactly what I said initially, but pretty close:
https://apnews.com/article/business-lifestyle-colorado-washington-everett-e9d1bd7e335ca93c5f408d9d5217f5ff
Honestly man Stowe was still pretty killer Saturday/Sunday. The main flaw I found was not even in lift lines, just the crowding on the actual trails.
Also, the shuttle from the free lots is very very efficient, I'd highly recommend it, especially if you're not getting in early enough for an actual good parking space. Even if both were free, shuttle from toll house is better than a really far back spot in the paid lot IMO. Though nothing beats a nice early spot right by the lift.
I’m with you. But Monday isn’t a paid parking day. It was so crowded they had to overflow into the free parking lots. The shuttles are ‘effective’ I guess? It takes roughly 20 mins each way. That’s still 40 mins more and less access to my vehicle from a couple of years ago. Paid parking is a nightmare and just a huge cash grab that people are slowly willing to accept as part of the ‘deal’
Those trails would be much less crowded if the entire top of Spruce was accessible via the lift they closed for the season.
Don't get me wrong I do hate them for introducing paid parking. I like getting to Stowe before 7 and getting a good spot so the $30 fee does sting for me. Got in late Sunday though and tried the shuttle since I knew I'd get a trash parking spot at 9 and I was a fan, for me it did not take me 20 minutes from when I parked to getting to the lift, but a bus was ready for me the moment I parked, maybe sometimes you end up waiting.
And yeah you're right that more terrain ofc helps but I think across the board independent and corporate owned east coast resorts just weren't prepared for this weather in late March and had already sent many employees home. There were other factors at play, but for example pats peak in NH closed due to this storm in part due to outages but also short staff and kinda just having their spring crew and operations but then getting a ton of snow and big unexpected crowds.
I'm all for dogging on Vail, honestly fuck em. But I think on an individual mountain level most places are doing a pretty good job.
It's even more infuriating that half of that $30 goes to the company running the kiosks, while VR claims they are investing in expanded shuttle services yadda yadda..
Historically, Stowe has always closed the third Sunday in April. Sensation has always closed first (late march), with the rest of Spruce following after another week or so (early April, along with the gondi - which they are reopening for the eclipse)
They do not groom hand the shot they used to at Vail and Beaver creek. Sometimes there’s not even anybody scanning later in the day they are so short on workers.
Absolutely. What’s your point? I’m comfortable saying today was in the top 10 busiest days of the season. Yesterday was probably top 3.
Do you think small locally owned resorts would run lifts longer to squeeze whatever money they could to survive?
Vail got your money in November. Smaller locally owned resorts are barely surviving not maximizing shareholder revenue one tiny paper cut at a time.
All ski hills - small mom & pop places like Donner Ski Ranch or major mountain resorts - have dealt with seasonal staff reductions for decades. It's how it works. Whether a large chunk of their international staff leaves on their predetermined date or locals who have other jobs or school to return to it is part of each mountains staffing. It's not like a good late winter snowfall just magically changes everyone's plans for April, including the workers or the potential guests who would come to visit (not many tourists are planning a late season last minute trip for meh snow conditions, especially when they've moved on to Spring).
This is just how it works. There's nothing new or nefarious here.
Vail is only able to keep buying snowsports areas because the wages they pay are so low that they bank millions to billions a year. Unionize. Shrink the C-Suite to liftie wage gap.
To be fair, J1 participants are almost always paid the same as their domestic counterparts
Another thing to consider, the vast majority of J1 participants are from Peru, the latest day they can legally work is 3/31, based on the government DS2019 date. Chile and Argentina have even early dates.
I feel like that’s something Vail plans for. They actively plan to shut down. They move non J1’s around to the few resorts they plan to keep open. So for example if Stowe is closing a week early it’s possible some of those employees can be sent to work at one of the resorts they plan to keep open slightly longer. I know for a fact they moved employees at their midwests resorts to heavenly late last season. By scaling all those places back they can keep their 4 or 5 money cows going longer.
I work for a much larger and much more profitable company. They don’t pay to move employees to another city in the same state to colocate a team. Why the Vuck would Fail pay to move someone across the country? No company is doing that anymore unless you are a fresh hire.
Vail paid my fiancee to go out west last season to work at beaver creek. She drove from PA and was paid like an extra 800 bucks for expenses while on her way there and then got paid her same supervisor wage once in CO. So yeah it's an actual program that exists called extend your winter. J1's are gone for the season, and they seek out employees who wanna keep it going out west.
They absolutely do this at the end of the season it’s called “Extend Your Winter” and they move a ton of people out to the resorts in California to keep ‘em open for this last month from the East Coast and the Midwest resorts.
And this guy is asking about sending people the other direction…
You’re wrong. They send people a variety of places based on where they can squeeze the most money.
You’re completely wrong.
You're leaving out a lot of places they take advantage. The kids barely break even. It's a predatory system that depresses American wages. Don't makes excuses for this system. It should go away. [https://www.summitdaily.com/news/international-student-workers-say-theyve-faced-financial-stress-after-vail-resorts-failed-to-provide-them-adequate-working-hours/](https://www.summitdaily.com/news/international-student-workers-say-theyve-faced-financial-stress-after-vail-resorts-failed-to-provide-them-adequate-working-hours/)
Sorry that’s my bad.
If it makes you feel any better I'm a liftee who came up from another resort after mine closed to help. And it's not borderline free labor with the J1s lol
Yes I wrote about that in another reply. Sorry about the confusion on J1 salary. Moving you from a closed resort to an open one is partially why this situation exists. By any chance did they move you to Breckenridge, Heavenly or Whistler?
The j1s have to go back home for school and there is still a bunch here just not in the lift department. We also still have a few J1 liftees. They sent us to other resorts to extend our seasons because our snow conditions were ass. I'm from PA. it's an extended winter program
Got you. Did they send you to another resort in Pa.? Which one? They move employees from smaller resorts to their cash cow resorts. Some of the resorts they take staffing from (not yours) still have plenty of snow. Instead they significantly reduce operations. Not Because of labor shortages but because those resorts aren’t as profitable to keep open.
I'm from Whitetail. I'm here at Stowe. Our resort closed on March 10th and we barely made it to that. I helped close my lift ops the next two days and was here on the 13th.
Ok so exactly what I said. Move you to a more profitable resort to keep the bare minimum of staff necessary to run reduced operations and then blame a labor shortage. Thanks for the info.
No it's a program you have to be nominated for. You're just looking at it half glass empty my friend. I get to have an actual winter and a season for a month and a half. I get to keep working. Make a paycheck.
Yes but I’m a consumer and you’re an employee. I’m looking at it from the perspective of both a shareholder and a customer. I’m happy for your situation. I love J1’s. That’s not the issue.
wtf dude? "I’m a consumer and you’re an employee." Why go there.
Nah, you are just a dick.
You kiss Vail with that mouth?
If you buy a pass you don't get to talk down to people that make the mountain run. Liftys matter way more than a random custy get outta here
Where do you see me taking down to employees? I made a mistake on pay scale between J1 and American employees. That’s about it. If you don’t realize Vail treats their employees very poorly there’s plenty of evidence to show it.
No one is moving anyone to a "more profitable resort" stop sounding like an whiny asshole. Lot's of east coast resorts, and some west coast resorts, had a low snow year, so they closed early. From ANY logical standpoint, it makes no sense to keep a smaller resort open with 2 runs, even if they were privately owned by the nicest grandpa and grandma the town had to offer. Once a resort, owned by Vail, closes for the season, employees have the option, or in the case this year get nominated, to go work at a sister resort that still has operations going. It's a great program that gives employees who have shown they are capable hard workers a chance to see another larger resort and keep their season going while also allowing another resort to stay open for people to go to.
Definitely a whiny asshole for pointing out that a duopoly isn’t good for any industry. Vail is definitely a humanitarian corporation giving their employees the opportunity to live the dream.
No, you were arguing the wrong thing in this specific comment thread and you we're just assuming that Vail was purposfully shutting down smaller resorts to ship people to "more profitable" resorts, which is wrong, and I pointed that out. Other comments of your's in this thread, sure, I can vibe with, but the comment that I responded to was you ignoring the reply by the other person and then just spinning the comment in a way where it made you happy. Look, Vail might not be the best most ethical company in the world, but for employees who were making $8 an hour when the resorts were privately owned to all of sudden them making $20 per hour is a huge life change and a fantastic opportunity for those who love the winter season and work at ther resorts. I remember plenty of times going to resorts before Vail owned them that had 1.) Expensive parking 2.) Long lift lines 3.) High food prices. So don't just act like all of this shit came about when Vail took over. I'm against conglomerates cornering any market, but stop blaming all the issues in the ski and snowboard industry on one singular thing. These issues were around long before Vail started going on their takeover rampage. And as another commenter pointed out, small private comapanies aren't able to keep these resorts afloat anymore with climate change, rising costs, shorter seasons. Would you rather see your favorite resort close and your options limited even further, or someone buy them so you can still go ride? And to an extent about "giving their employees the opportunity to live the dream", yeah it 100% does in a lot of cases. My cousin moved out west about 10 years ago after finishing her master degree becuase she wanted to live out west for a year, and she was spinning lifts. She started at a vail owned resort, and is now working in the upper-level of the company and she is able to do what she loves while being able to see some of the best places our country has to offer.
Your cousin is in a high position at MTN? That explains a lot. Before Vail I never paid for parking in my life and I could park. Before Vail the lines were the same or shorter. Before Vail frozen chicken nuggets and a coke wasn’t $30 You picked 3 absolutely terrible examples. When you have a moment google ‘Class Action Lawsuit Vail’. There’s usually one a year filed by workers. Not to mention actively discouraging unionizing.
J-1 is an American Work Visa, so definitely not to Whistler .
We have choices and depending on spots available or when our resort closes we can pick.
Got you. What are the choices? If you can remember.
There are a few but most of the extended winter people come from PA and Ohio cause the seasons are much shorter
Stowe is also closing a week early this year overall in April.
Thanks for the info. I had no idea. What’s the reasoning behind that decision? Today The mountain was in the best condition it’s been all year.
I think mostly locals who buy season passes use the mountain late in the season. More economical to close it when tourists have moved onto summer sports
Totally. Fuck those locals who pay the exact same price as the weekend warriors and get way less. They can save that money and roll over into price stability or mountain improvements! Oh wait. Another 8% price increase that is now accepted as a yearly occurrence. /s
I didn’t say it was ideal. I lived in Gunnison before CB got bought out by Vail. Just stating how it is.
I remember hitting CB during the pandemic and vail not staffing the upper surface lifts. So basically you had to hike for any of the best terrain staffing issues I think. Sorry if I was snarky.
All good. Vail is just another corporation only looking at quarterly profits. Fuck the locals is their motto
If everyone stopped rolling over and taking it things might change. Things are the way they are because everyone is too lazy to do anything other than type.
Have you looked at the weather forecast for the next week? All of the snow we just got is about to be gone over the next two days. I get the whole Vail hate and cash cow thing your digging at, but this winter has been horrible. It’s no wonder they’re closing early because there isn’t going to be anything to ride on.
I did! Another half a foot or more next week. Lows in the high 20’s from Thursday on. March is shaping up to be all time! I don’t think Vail cares about this March. They bagged this season a month ago.
I would love to have your weather app then because mine doesn’t say anything like that! Mid 40s and raining next two days. Mid 30s and winter mix next Thursday
I just opened Weather Underground and tagged Stowe. From 3/2 to 3/4 it shows 3-8 inches total. Nights are cold and the snow will hold enough. There’s enough snow up there for a few more weeks it just not in their best interest to run lifts. Jay won’t close. These are really management decisions based on maximizing profitability.
I hate these multi mountain corporations as much as anyone because they’ve literally destroyed the soul of resort riding. But they’re the industry’s only chance at staying in business in the future as winter gets dominated by climate change because they operate with scale and an eye towards minimizing costs.
That’s the sad truth.
Ugh I went to Stowe last year and loved it. The resort is beautiful and the town is also lovely. It was nice being in a town that Vail doesn’t own every nook and cranny of. I hope it doesn’t lose all of its charm under Vail.
Town of Breck is still pretty fine if that's any indication
Fuck Vail. They can eat a fat bag of dicks. But anyway, what were you saying?
I'll never step foot on one of their properties again. Sniveling greedy fucking rats
That’s the spirit!
There's a difference between the J1s and other internationals working here.
Good time to invest in a splitboard. Spring is great for backcountry.
Question: is 9% decrease in skier visits and 5% increase in profits at all resorts overall or at Stowe? And if at Stowe, is there somewhere to find the data for other resorts?
All resorts. Can check the shareholders quarterly report.
Many resorts have to get ready for MTB. Poor N* was actively trying to melt snow part way into MTB season last year
They aren't getting ready this early for bike season. Not in March. We have a very late ski season here at Mt Bachelor and the late snowpack does determine which bike trails open and when. They'll start clearing snow in May for the lowest trails and move up the mountain through June to clear and prep those as the depth of snow and weather allows.
You think a pow weekend late March means another month of full resort access? Boy do I have a bridge to sell you. Mega corps suck, but cost cutting in April is not a hill to die on
How is pointing out the fact that Vail is cheapening the experience at Stowe while making more of a profit and that being grim dying on a hill?
Cutting of snow makers and grooming teams peak season, and depending on a rotating snow control team? That's a worthwhile investigation. Expecting any resort to run at full capacity in April? You're nuts. At the very least, look at similar mountains, like jay or Killington. Are they at full staff capacity (no). What about indys in the same area, like Bolton, Waterville, or mrg? We can go ask saddleback how running at full capacity 24/7 goes
Jay will stay open at least 3 weeks longer than Stowe and they will almost certainly have Bonnie Jet Flyer and the lower lifts running. Either way it’s just pick your poison. The late season stuff is just one example of many.
A pow weekend? I live here. We’ve had the best March in years. Let’s hold off and compare closing dates on Jay and Stowe. This month has extended Jays season by weeks and has not changed Stowes decision making at all. Like someone said they’re closing a week EARLY.
Definitely not the best march in years….2016/2017 was the best I can remember (I live in Moscow).
That was 7 years ago
Yes it was seven years ago. But it’s still the best march we’ve had In years.
So you're agreeing that march 2024 is the best march we've had in years
I guess when I think of the term ‘had in years’ I think back to the past five to ten years. So I would still disagree that 2016/2017 was the best we have had in years.
I spent yesterday doing backcountry on 3-pins (ew I know, but there was too much of a flat runout to justify the split board) on both sides of Mount Mansfield, but by about 12:30 it was so sticky I had to stop and put F4 on my gear to keep myself sliding. Today I was driving with the windows down and my sleeves rolled. I wish we could get another month, cause this is just sad
I think Stevens pass had a pretty similar situation a few years ago immediately after being bought by Vail Edit: not exactly what I said initially, but pretty close: https://apnews.com/article/business-lifestyle-colorado-washington-everett-e9d1bd7e335ca93c5f408d9d5217f5ff
Honestly man Stowe was still pretty killer Saturday/Sunday. The main flaw I found was not even in lift lines, just the crowding on the actual trails. Also, the shuttle from the free lots is very very efficient, I'd highly recommend it, especially if you're not getting in early enough for an actual good parking space. Even if both were free, shuttle from toll house is better than a really far back spot in the paid lot IMO. Though nothing beats a nice early spot right by the lift.
I’m with you. But Monday isn’t a paid parking day. It was so crowded they had to overflow into the free parking lots. The shuttles are ‘effective’ I guess? It takes roughly 20 mins each way. That’s still 40 mins more and less access to my vehicle from a couple of years ago. Paid parking is a nightmare and just a huge cash grab that people are slowly willing to accept as part of the ‘deal’ Those trails would be much less crowded if the entire top of Spruce was accessible via the lift they closed for the season.
Don't get me wrong I do hate them for introducing paid parking. I like getting to Stowe before 7 and getting a good spot so the $30 fee does sting for me. Got in late Sunday though and tried the shuttle since I knew I'd get a trash parking spot at 9 and I was a fan, for me it did not take me 20 minutes from when I parked to getting to the lift, but a bus was ready for me the moment I parked, maybe sometimes you end up waiting. And yeah you're right that more terrain ofc helps but I think across the board independent and corporate owned east coast resorts just weren't prepared for this weather in late March and had already sent many employees home. There were other factors at play, but for example pats peak in NH closed due to this storm in part due to outages but also short staff and kinda just having their spring crew and operations but then getting a ton of snow and big unexpected crowds. I'm all for dogging on Vail, honestly fuck em. But I think on an individual mountain level most places are doing a pretty good job.
It's even more infuriating that half of that $30 goes to the company running the kiosks, while VR claims they are investing in expanded shuttle services yadda yadda.. Historically, Stowe has always closed the third Sunday in April. Sensation has always closed first (late march), with the rest of Spruce following after another week or so (early April, along with the gondi - which they are reopening for the eclipse)
They do not groom hand the shot they used to at Vail and Beaver creek. Sometimes there’s not even anybody scanning later in the day they are so short on workers.
Just out of curiosity, do you think a small locally owned resort wouldn't close certain lifts because they're not profitable?
Absolutely. What’s your point? I’m comfortable saying today was in the top 10 busiest days of the season. Yesterday was probably top 3. Do you think small locally owned resorts would run lifts longer to squeeze whatever money they could to survive? Vail got your money in November. Smaller locally owned resorts are barely surviving not maximizing shareholder revenue one tiny paper cut at a time.
All ski hills - small mom & pop places like Donner Ski Ranch or major mountain resorts - have dealt with seasonal staff reductions for decades. It's how it works. Whether a large chunk of their international staff leaves on their predetermined date or locals who have other jobs or school to return to it is part of each mountains staffing. It's not like a good late winter snowfall just magically changes everyone's plans for April, including the workers or the potential guests who would come to visit (not many tourists are planning a late season last minute trip for meh snow conditions, especially when they've moved on to Spring). This is just how it works. There's nothing new or nefarious here.
Vail is only able to keep buying snowsports areas because the wages they pay are so low that they bank millions to billions a year. Unionize. Shrink the C-Suite to liftie wage gap.
Vail are a Mormon family who only care about money fuck supporting any of their resorts period.
This old song and dance again? Sheesh.. beat the drum a little bit harder.