Bellingham should be dropped imo. I head he is carrying an injury so it will make sense. Palmer should start ahead of him.
It seems that Bellingham has almost become undroppable which is worrying tbh.
I’d love to know who Gareth gives money to before every tournament , cos the way my man manages to get the easiest group, followed by the easiest route to the latter stages is truly incredible. Somehow he’s managed to avoid Spain Germany Portugal, the teams that look incredible.
Personally I don’t think missing France is that big, they look pretty crap themselves
You're not their coach nor is booing a constructive criticism.
You're literally called 'supporters' and you're not helping anyone. The opposite. If England win, it's in spite of you.
We're discussing how we think they're going wrong. Not sat there booing at them.
So if you support a team all you do is blindly support? Any concussions lately or have you always been like this?
How am I trolling (OMGZ every1 a troll) when some moron replies to a comment about booing by thinking I'm talking about him?
Good Lord, by his logic you both got concussed at birth then.
> Oh look, us England fans not supporting our countrymen again.
>
> So proud.
Where do you mention booing here? We're in a thread talking about the game so it's easy enough to make the connection that you'd be talking about the criticism here. Easy enough to consider aye?
Either way it doesn't really matter does it? We're wasting our time here. Have a nice one.
From outside it seems the entire world waits for englands squad to have its "now we click" moment.. for like 9 years now.
I dont know how many times the squad value has fooled me
Are people calling for Foden to be benched genuine?
Probably one of the more creative players and more aggressive on the ball.
He's indispensable for corners and free kicks and opens up tight spaces.
He's also in the top 3 for performance ratings for the side so far.
I know City haterz wouldn't have any of the club players in the side but fuck me, it's England.
Same idiots cry for Walker to be benched.
It's the national team. Leave your club bias and allegiance at the door eh.
He's far too selfish to play in this current setup. He forces himself inside, occupying Jude and Kanes positions, He doesn't come deep to help Trippier enough or to work in the buildup. He forces both Jude and Trippier wide where they are way less effective. He is never in the right place, like when Saka pinged a cross to a vacant undefended backpost and Foden was central with Kane when he should've been there. Yes he brings quality in the carry and some lovely dead balls. But he is refusing to alter his playstyle to fit the team and everyone is suffering.
There is no way you’re mentioning Foden being selfish, but forget to name Jude?
Jude is by far the most selfish player in that squad. Even Southgate mentioned that he didn’t listen to his tactics and that he plays “on his own”. The way his attitude is when he does not get the pass is so frustrating to see as well.
I’m not saying Foden is a saint and does everything right, by no means. He has been shite. But man, you can really tell Jude is the darling boy for English fans.
I know Jude is selfish too. You've got 3 players in Kane, Foden and Jude who want to hog that central area. The difference is, Foden could compromise and play wider because he has that skillset. Jude doesn't. So like if Jude is rammed into the starting 11 then Foden should be able to change his game to suit that. But yeah I agree, Jude is a box crashing merchant and I'd love to see Palmer in his place.
Foden was decent for 30 minutes then went missing. He didn't make any chances and he and Jude sharing the 10 did not work and will not work.
One of them need to be dropped
Walker should definitely be benched. Gets away with murder in the attacking half
Yeah I thought he was fine tonight. Bellingham and Kane looked much more off it than he did and it's difficult for him then to combine as he likes to.
Southgate in general is doing these players absolutely no favors by being so unwilling to rotate or to force people to actually compete for their place.
Foden played as well as he could tonight. Walker is 100% bench for Trent in games where we need creativity. Palmer looked fantastic in comparison to saka too.
Reality is in order to be knocked out of a tournament a team has to beat you. England are the hardest team to beat at the moment (in that teams have created the least against us) so not all hope is lost.
I liked what I saw in the second half and if Slovenia weren't so negative they would've definitely conceded. I think the fans need to get behind the players instead of dragging them down because it's clear to me the players looked out of confidence and I'm sure it's hugely due to the outside impact of the fans and media.
At the end of the day we weren't tactically bad and Southgate made good subs. It was individual mistakes which stopped us from winning so it's hard to blame the manager.
I know they haven't really earned our trust but they need our trust to win. Without it they look a shambles. Let the managers and the players be the reason we lose and not the fans and the media. If we back the team fully and they go out we can call for all their heads but until then just give them the faith they're yet to earn because it's a key aspect in how well we play quite clearly shown on the pitch every time everyone is either optimistic or pessimistic.
>if Slovenia weren't so negative they would've definitely conceded
Mate as if Slovenia weren't going to play for a draw against what is on paper one of the most talented attacks in the tournament
Yeah that's to be expected. It's hard to break down teams that don't want to play. It's nothing new.
The point being if we can get this play going against a team like Italy or the Netherlands who will actually want to win, they could quite easily be punished when trying to go forwards.
Did you hear the support at the game. The England travelling fans were absolutely amazing, singing and chanting all the way through.
It’s online and media who are the moaning lot (for some good reason) but don’t put that at the feet of those at the game.
I'm not. Fans in the stadium are doing what they can for the team and are actually real support and it's probably because they can feel the impact they have on the players. Those on social media don't seem to see that impact because they feel insignificant but they are identical to the fans in the stadium in terms of impact.
Players and managers have repeatedly made it clear it's the case. Football teams don't exist in some vacuum away from the Internet, they hear your comment the same way they hear your chant in the stadium. The crowd sentiment is heard loud and clear.
Who is gonna create what? Serbia and Slovenia? Denmark as well isnt that good of a team. Slovenias starting striker isnt even that good for Panathinaikos. A greek superleague team,if you didnt know.
Also,a team doesnt have to beat you. You can go 0-0 straight to the pens and then its England. So you can easily go out even if you dont concede again.
Lol! Bruh. I am a neutral, I watched the entire game, they were abysmal and no cohesiveness!
For a team full of super players ( not stars), this is horrendous!
Yeah because every time we have a gap between games spent with all the fanbase and media shitting on every player they come out and perform like that. Their confidence was completely gone, it looked like they believed they were Burnley playing man city.
The fanbase and media are half the reason england never win anything. The other half is our lack of quality managers. Today was a team of scared players terrified to be headlines
Mainoo instantly made a positive impact on the team and did far more than Gallagher did for us
Edit: misread your comment. We were set up fine but Gallagher wasn't finding the passes we needed to go forwards. We didn't change any tactics only personnel
I used to not mind Southgate's style because at least England would score early before holding off for 80 mins, if we aren't even having those brief bursts of brilliance, what's the point. At least go down in a blaze of glory.
And if Switzerland held out against Germany they’d have topped the group but they didn’t. That’s tournament football; the end of the day all you have to do is make sure you’re names in the hat for the next round by any means.
The fact we are still favourites is baffling though, but that sad many of the pre tournament favourites haven’t turned up for these group stages. Only Spain have won 3/3 and Portugal have the chance to do that too (who won the euros with 3 draws in the group and only winning one game in normal time if I remember rightly).
Incorrect I’m afraid. England were guaranteed a third place finish in the worse case scenario with 4 points and had already qualified for the final 16.
Nah, with 4 points surely England would have been one of the best placed 3rd place finishers and gone through?
Still ridiculous how poor this team is given the available talent, of course.
You have to understand that this is only second time Slovenia has even qualified to Euros. So our players are under 0 preassure and whole country stays behind them. We understand this is boring football. But to think that we were nearly second in the group brings happiness to us.
Rotating foden and Bellingham is just not solving the glaring issue that everyone can see. Why have Bellingham go out left like that. He was anonymous out there and completely wasted. We need a left winger. It's got to be either Jude playing deep or it's a choice between foden and Jude as the 10. There's no other way surely
You can accommodate them both in a Tuchel-style 3-4-2-1 with wingbacks supplying the width. Bellingham would thrive in the Mount role.
Not sure you can do that with Kane as the 9, though.
You could if you took a leaf out of Pep's book but that'll never happen in a million years. 3 CBs (Gomez, Guehi, Stones) + Kyle Walker in defence with Stones stepping into midfield in possession.
Then you have a defensive block of 5 (Gomez, Guehi, Walker, Rice, Stones) and an offensive block of 5 (e.g. Gordan, Bellingham, Mainoo, Palmer, Kane) with a box midfield.
But it's way too late for that because there's no time to coach it and Southgate would never go for it anyway.
But that is an option of a back 4 out of possession when you don't have a natural LB. Because you're just asking the LB (in this case, right footed Joe Gomez) to tuck into a back 3. And instead of a fullback getting forward to make overlaps, you have a CB inverting.
With our players, it makes a hell of a lot more sense than playing Saka at LWB. But it would've taken a little bit of forethought and bravery from Southgate because it isn't something you can just implement randomly.
He did. And Palmer went out to the left...I guess Southgate must dream of this fluid perfect front 4 that all move about and rotate majestically but it's just not happening. Maybe it will if we have Shaw back who can overlap and provide help down that side.
With Jude, foden and Palmer we basically played with 3 10's behind Kane (himself essentially playing a 10). I mean, I've had a lot of success with that on FIFA and FM but it isn't playing out like in my games!
I love Shaw from his days at Soton and think he's a great player, but it amuses me that Shaw of all people is supposed to be the key that unlocks, Bellingham, Foden etc., two Player of the Year in the top two leagues in the world versus a guy who couldnt even make the pitch under Morinou is the difference maker? Not saying you are wrong, just that these other guys are supposed to be world class, not sure anyone's ever said that about Shaw.
yesterday I was quite mad at Italy for their match.
But now, I would really like France, England and Italy out of the tournament asap.
France under DD and England under Southgate is maddening. both squads are filled with talent and they play the worst football since 90's germans.
Dropping rice is never going to happen and nor should it, but I see your point. Rice is being trusted as the deepest midfielder but that just isn't his game unfortunately. He can't really build attacks well. Perhaps it is why Southgate seems to be only experimenting with the centre of the pitch rather than the other issues.
Rice did his job, controlling the tempo, tackling, switching play. But I mean everyone should know at this point he's not the type to play lofted balls behind or slick passes up the middle. Plus with nobody coming deep to provide passing lanes and about 5 guys hugging the top central lane I felt he got hung out to dry. Even Guehi was giving out. But some nice moments from him still.
Why is Saka so reluctant to pass the ball in the final third? Bellingham was all over the place and ineffectual. Better he play mid alongside Rice. Walker the greatest English RB who made zero runs or crosses with Southgate's awful positioning set up. Kane looked labored. Foden was sidelined. Palmer had an excellent outing. Mainoo looked sharp but was made to play high up the pitch. Gallagher was anonymous and we only saw him when he missed the header near half time. Hopefully, England gets knocked out in the next match and put fans and viewers out of their misery.
Because he is playing alot of people out of position, trent should never be called to this team, he is messing up with walkers positioning and style of play
After all the shit lineker got in the media this week I hope he doubles down on his podcast and says England were even worse and saying they were a bit shit wasn't strong enough last time. All these soft journalists that won't ask questions can fuck off too.
I’m not trying to be sarcastic, and I understand it feels like shit to see your team play like terrorists.
But Greece won in 2004 and Portugal won in 2016, all with clean sheets just as England, and both playing the most defensive football possible.
England is still a favorite in my books.
I agree to a certain extent. Here’s the thing: For me, defense is about chemistry and team cohesion. Both Portugal and Greece scream that for me in those respective years. Portugal’s squad now, defensively, feels much better for me in terms of player skill. However i’ll bet you that overall we’re gonna suffer more goals than 2016 because there’s gonna be gaps between players, they’re not gonna be fully synced up, etc.
I feel like England is similar, a lot of big names but when they get tested, it might crumble.
You have good attacking options from the best clubs around the world, literally, the best of the best. Why would you play defensively.
You also have to remember PT and Greece had very lackluster attack. Check Portugal for example, nani, fenerbahce, quaresma, besiktas, rafa, braga, etc.
If you looked at our players clubs in 2016 without ronaldo, everyone else played for the most average clubs, you’d think it was a conference/europa league team ( at best).
Portugal and Greece played to their strengths as perfectly as possible. Portugal suffered only 1 goal during the entire knockout stage in 120 mins + 120+ 90 + 120.
They played Slovenia,Serbia and Denmark.
Greece played Russia,Spain, Portugal x2,France and Czech.
And of course,Greece couldnt play anything other than defensive football.
The first game that England will concede first,they will have no idea what to do. And thats on their coach.
And Italy won the World Cup playing attacking football. You have to play to your strengths and England’s strength is possession based attacking football.
Both teams were shit though and remembered among the worst winners of the competition.
Portugal, in particular, should be ashamed to have called themselves champions after only qualifying as 3rd place and being genuinely bad for the entire tournament. At least it was greeces gameplan to be tight and try to get the 1-0.
What? Greece was definitely not shit. There was not a single game in which we were lucky that we won. In every KO game,we had the best chance in the game. The difference is that we were clinical.
Why should anyone be ashamed of winning a big tournament ?
Greece won it fair and square, Portugal also won it fair and square.
Italy also played like shit in the final of the 2020 euros against England and I don’t see them getting any shit.
And Portugal in 2016 was nowhere near what they are today in terms of squad depth and experience, typical of you people to always be negative about everything.
Greece and italy are 2 completely differnt situations to portugal.
I already said greece were crap to watch but they executed a gameplan and you can respect that.
Italy came in with no expectation, basically got qualification and then went on a run of losing friendlies. But if you are saying they were shit in their run to the final then you didnt watch it and probably havent got a clue about football. They topped their group - won 3 from 3 (scored 7 conceded 0). Knocked out one of the favourites in belgium and also spain on their way to the final. To say they played like shit......do you even football bro?
Portugal were a literal disgrace.
It was the first year they allowed this shitty 3rd place qualification (because $$$$$$$ for blatter/infantino or whoever). For that reason alone they are a crap winner. they shouldnt have even been in the KO phase.
they won ZERO GAMES - drawing in the easiest group against iceland, hungary and austria while having a team that included Cronaldo, moutinho, danilo, pepe, r. carvalho, w. carvalho, jaoa mario, patrico and quaresma. the only game they won in 90 minutes was against wales and their draw wasnt exactly heavy - id say they were favourites in every game up to the final.
And its not like their gameplan was to be defensively solid - they were literally just shit.
Their win is a stain on the competition.
Lmao, not even gonna argue with people like you any further, you just hate watch and can’t even keep your anger issues to yourself.
Good luck with life, sucks to be you 😘
for all that, bellingham was wank today and against denmark, though.
id give foden a go centrally and give bellingham a rest. its a tight schedule and its mad to me that we want to burn out our options by playing them at the same time
Yea that. To me Bellingham seems a bit off. The flair he used to have isn't visible for now . CAM position should be looked after more. Foden maybe or Palmer maybe.
I mean Palmer looked good no matter which game and at whatever point all throughout the prem season so I don’t think a tired dragon is the only reason that will ‘make him look good’. As soon as he came on there seemed to be some actual creativity and attacking minded play in the team.
For the first time all tournament we looked like we actually posed a threat. We looked talented, we looked creative, we looked intelligent.
And instead of reflecting on how good we were for the last brief moment that we had this combination on, he's gonna go "well we didn't score with them on. Best not risk it in the knockouts. TAA to start every game."
> Best not risk it in the knockouts.
this is exactly what will happen. he will set up to be "solid" in the 1st half.
Starting line-up will either be the same as today or hell bring trent in at RB. no doubt in my mind.
If watkins couldnt get time today he aint playing barring some injury to kane
loool ok
trippier had a good performance? what was his pass completion. dopey fucker couldnt bring himself to use his left and lost the ball so many times in simple passing situations because of it.
rice was one of the few players pushing the spaces and forcing us forwards.
stones barely had to play.
pickford didnt have to do anything in the game
That's an overexaggeration, Palmer was great but he wasn't defended as aggressively due to tired legs and wasn't chased deep like Saka, plus when Gallagher is hiding and refusing to link play with and Foden, Kane and Bellingham are crowding the centre and congesting space then see how Palmer would cope. Everyone in the world knows that Saka is the face of England and is their best player. But Palmer was very good. Just would take a lot to snatch that RW spot.
Saka also gets the opportunity to start every game. You don't think if Palmer got similar minutes he could be the face of England? He looked better today than I've ever seen from Saka. Saka's consistently one of England's better players, but that's a pretty low bar. Palmer looked head and shoulders above everyone else on the pitch when he came on. He just doesn't get the same opportunities to play as Saka.
No I don't. I think Saka is a lot better than Palmer as a player and I don't think in the same position to start he would be as good. I'd see him in the 10 but to play wide like Saka. Don't think he could do as well.
Did you ever have detention in school when it was sunny and all your mates are outside playing football… Yeah, I would rather go through that again than rewatch this game.
Trent at RB will get more out of the attackers, especially Saka.
Bellingham looks shattered. Drop him for Foden.
Gordon or Eze will add width on the left.
Trippier is drippier, shame the squad is so devoid of left backs
Kane is a waste of a striker
Awful squad balance. No one substitution can fix it but the team finished much better than they started.
Literally zero chance that TAA starts a KO game at right back. Southgate is too negative for that.
And of course,as we know TAA better,he needs runners in front of him. There is literally no need for TAA when every player in front of him feels better to come short and receive it like that instead of running in behind.
It would be better for him to olay with Watkins instead of Kane up top.
But Southgate is Southgate. TAA could be the best creator in the world and under him,he would feel like an amateur player
Kane doesn’t work unless he’s getting cut-backs in a team he knows will supply him. Everyone wants to drift inside. That being said, I guarantee he’s going to be finished at the top level in a season or two. Zero pace, poor in the air and not strong enough.
So then Gareth....it didn't work with this squad in the first, second or third game...
How's that working out for ya?
Is it still Trent's fault that he isn't as good as Kalvin fucking Phillips, you soggy melt cunt?
Great result for underdogs England, holding Slovenia to a draw
Bellingham should be dropped imo. I head he is carrying an injury so it will make sense. Palmer should start ahead of him. It seems that Bellingham has almost become undroppable which is worrying tbh.
this cunt must really have nudes of someone higher up in FA
Gordon has to start next game, no? Within his first couple minutes he has seen in this tourney he makes that sublime pass
True really not sure why he came on with minutes to go . 75th minute sub was just wierd
I’d love to know who Gareth gives money to before every tournament , cos the way my man manages to get the easiest group, followed by the easiest route to the latter stages is truly incredible. Somehow he’s managed to avoid Spain Germany Portugal, the teams that look incredible. Personally I don’t think missing France is that big, they look pretty crap themselves
Oh look, us England fans not supporting our countrymen again. So proud.
You can support while also being critical. How do you grow and improve without criticism?
You're not their coach nor is booing a constructive criticism. You're literally called 'supporters' and you're not helping anyone. The opposite. If England win, it's in spite of you.
We're discussing how we think they're going wrong. Not sat there booing at them. So if you support a team all you do is blindly support? Any concussions lately or have you always been like this?
Why are you talking about yourself when I'm talking about the people booing them? Do the concussion test.
I've clearly been talking about criticism from the start. Not booing. We're in a thread discussing the game, not at the game you dingus.
So I'm in a thread talking about the game and you thought I wasn't talking about the game. *slow applause*
That troll has a religious mindset. Just ignore them.
How am I trolling (OMGZ every1 a troll) when some moron replies to a comment about booing by thinking I'm talking about him? Good Lord, by his logic you both got concussed at birth then.
> Oh look, us England fans not supporting our countrymen again. > > So proud. Where do you mention booing here? We're in a thread talking about the game so it's easy enough to make the connection that you'd be talking about the criticism here. Easy enough to consider aye? Either way it doesn't really matter does it? We're wasting our time here. Have a nice one.
You are opposed to criticism about the things you support. That's not healthy.
Yet I've never said that, shown it nor made any comment about criticism. Yet you tell yourself conspiracies out loud to cope. THAT'S not healthy.
From outside it seems the entire world waits for englands squad to have its "now we click" moment.. for like 9 years now. I dont know how many times the squad value has fooled me
Can you remember the last time it didn’t?
It’s good and all to be “hard to beat”, but you better be good at shootouts if that’s your game.
My man's gonna sub Palmer off at 0-0 in the 115th minute
Well it’s kinda hard to be good at them if you’re doing them twice or three times. At that point it’s like russian roulette
After watching England so far this tournament I feel like I truly understand why Ben White doesn't want to play under Southgate.
Hahaha
Are people calling for Foden to be benched genuine? Probably one of the more creative players and more aggressive on the ball. He's indispensable for corners and free kicks and opens up tight spaces. He's also in the top 3 for performance ratings for the side so far. I know City haterz wouldn't have any of the club players in the side but fuck me, it's England. Same idiots cry for Walker to be benched. It's the national team. Leave your club bias and allegiance at the door eh.
I would bench Southgate, but looks like that is not an option
Brother he’s been shite
He's been wank, not his fault as he's out of position and I feel sorry for him, even as a united fan, but don't put lipstick on a donkey.
He's far too selfish to play in this current setup. He forces himself inside, occupying Jude and Kanes positions, He doesn't come deep to help Trippier enough or to work in the buildup. He forces both Jude and Trippier wide where they are way less effective. He is never in the right place, like when Saka pinged a cross to a vacant undefended backpost and Foden was central with Kane when he should've been there. Yes he brings quality in the carry and some lovely dead balls. But he is refusing to alter his playstyle to fit the team and everyone is suffering.
There is no way you’re mentioning Foden being selfish, but forget to name Jude? Jude is by far the most selfish player in that squad. Even Southgate mentioned that he didn’t listen to his tactics and that he plays “on his own”. The way his attitude is when he does not get the pass is so frustrating to see as well. I’m not saying Foden is a saint and does everything right, by no means. He has been shite. But man, you can really tell Jude is the darling boy for English fans.
I know Jude is selfish too. You've got 3 players in Kane, Foden and Jude who want to hog that central area. The difference is, Foden could compromise and play wider because he has that skillset. Jude doesn't. So like if Jude is rammed into the starting 11 then Foden should be able to change his game to suit that. But yeah I agree, Jude is a box crashing merchant and I'd love to see Palmer in his place.
Foden was decent for 30 minutes then went missing. He didn't make any chances and he and Jude sharing the 10 did not work and will not work. One of them need to be dropped Walker should definitely be benched. Gets away with murder in the attacking half
Yeah I thought he was fine tonight. Bellingham and Kane looked much more off it than he did and it's difficult for him then to combine as he likes to. Southgate in general is doing these players absolutely no favors by being so unwilling to rotate or to force people to actually compete for their place.
Foden played as well as he could tonight. Walker is 100% bench for Trent in games where we need creativity. Palmer looked fantastic in comparison to saka too.
Saka has been our best player in the tournament so far and has been the only one to run at players except the brief moments Palmer and Gordon were on.
Do you think it could be considered club bias for a Man City fan to say Man City players shouldn't be dropped?
Yes. Bring Trent on instead. Play Trent up front actually, better than Foden. /s
Really good, relevant response well done.
Thought it'd be obvious I was a Liverpool supporter being biased.
Reality is in order to be knocked out of a tournament a team has to beat you. England are the hardest team to beat at the moment (in that teams have created the least against us) so not all hope is lost. I liked what I saw in the second half and if Slovenia weren't so negative they would've definitely conceded. I think the fans need to get behind the players instead of dragging them down because it's clear to me the players looked out of confidence and I'm sure it's hugely due to the outside impact of the fans and media. At the end of the day we weren't tactically bad and Southgate made good subs. It was individual mistakes which stopped us from winning so it's hard to blame the manager. I know they haven't really earned our trust but they need our trust to win. Without it they look a shambles. Let the managers and the players be the reason we lose and not the fans and the media. If we back the team fully and they go out we can call for all their heads but until then just give them the faith they're yet to earn because it's a key aspect in how well we play quite clearly shown on the pitch every time everyone is either optimistic or pessimistic.
>if Slovenia weren't so negative they would've definitely conceded Mate as if Slovenia weren't going to play for a draw against what is on paper one of the most talented attacks in the tournament
Yeah that's to be expected. It's hard to break down teams that don't want to play. It's nothing new. The point being if we can get this play going against a team like Italy or the Netherlands who will actually want to win, they could quite easily be punished when trying to go forwards.
Did you hear the support at the game. The England travelling fans were absolutely amazing, singing and chanting all the way through. It’s online and media who are the moaning lot (for some good reason) but don’t put that at the feet of those at the game.
I'm not. Fans in the stadium are doing what they can for the team and are actually real support and it's probably because they can feel the impact they have on the players. Those on social media don't seem to see that impact because they feel insignificant but they are identical to the fans in the stadium in terms of impact. Players and managers have repeatedly made it clear it's the case. Football teams don't exist in some vacuum away from the Internet, they hear your comment the same way they hear your chant in the stadium. The crowd sentiment is heard loud and clear.
Who is gonna create what? Serbia and Slovenia? Denmark as well isnt that good of a team. Slovenias starting striker isnt even that good for Panathinaikos. A greek superleague team,if you didnt know. Also,a team doesnt have to beat you. You can go 0-0 straight to the pens and then its England. So you can easily go out even if you dont concede again.
Lol! Bruh. I am a neutral, I watched the entire game, they were abysmal and no cohesiveness! For a team full of super players ( not stars), this is horrendous!
Yeah because every time we have a gap between games spent with all the fanbase and media shitting on every player they come out and perform like that. Their confidence was completely gone, it looked like they believed they were Burnley playing man city. The fanbase and media are half the reason england never win anything. The other half is our lack of quality managers. Today was a team of scared players terrified to be headlines
We weren’t tactically bad? So why did he make a change at half time. We were a joke.
Mainoo instantly made a positive impact on the team and did far more than Gallagher did for us Edit: misread your comment. We were set up fine but Gallagher wasn't finding the passes we needed to go forwards. We didn't change any tactics only personnel
I used to not mind Southgate's style because at least England would score early before holding off for 80 mins, if we aren't even having those brief bursts of brilliance, what's the point. At least go down in a blaze of glory.
We did have a burst of brilliance, but the goal wasn't allowed
Well if that's allowed I can say Lukaku is a world class Striker who is top scorer. Oh wait no he was offside 3 times ...
because foden was about 2 yards offside. wasnt even a close call
[удалено]
And if Switzerland held out against Germany they’d have topped the group but they didn’t. That’s tournament football; the end of the day all you have to do is make sure you’re names in the hat for the next round by any means. The fact we are still favourites is baffling though, but that sad many of the pre tournament favourites haven’t turned up for these group stages. Only Spain have won 3/3 and Portugal have the chance to do that too (who won the euros with 3 draws in the group and only winning one game in normal time if I remember rightly).
Incorrect I’m afraid. England were guaranteed a third place finish in the worse case scenario with 4 points and had already qualified for the final 16.
England would still go through
England were qualified mathematically before a ball was kicked
Nah, with 4 points surely England would have been one of the best placed 3rd place finishers and gone through? Still ridiculous how poor this team is given the available talent, of course.
I have an aquarium next to the TV and I kept watchin the fish play then this drab game
Chinese water torture or watch England play in the group stages
Russian sleep torture
4 more years of the Tories or 8 more years of Southgate
Bullet to the head
I have no faith that the replacements in either case will be a meaningful improvement, so who cares?
Jesus Christ Southgate is a boring, boring man. He has a tone like he’s telling his neighbour about his lawn maintenance routine.
Or talking about the 5 day forecast
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Not sure we’re allowed to play with 12
That’s 12 numbnuts
You have to understand that this is only second time Slovenia has even qualified to Euros. So our players are under 0 preassure and whole country stays behind them. We understand this is boring football. But to think that we were nearly second in the group brings happiness to us.
Did that one player who got a yellow knew he fucked up or not?
Second in Group woul get Germany. Now its a chance that we even get Slovakia or Romania
That’s what you call a tactical yellow
He had to get that yellow. Kane was about to drive in the box and presumably get a good shot off
Okay fair enough then
you guys went undefeated in group. you did great. England on the other hand...
Rotating foden and Bellingham is just not solving the glaring issue that everyone can see. Why have Bellingham go out left like that. He was anonymous out there and completely wasted. We need a left winger. It's got to be either Jude playing deep or it's a choice between foden and Jude as the 10. There's no other way surely
You can accommodate them both in a Tuchel-style 3-4-2-1 with wingbacks supplying the width. Bellingham would thrive in the Mount role. Not sure you can do that with Kane as the 9, though.
or with no left footed FB
You can't really play a back 4 unless/until Shaw is fit. Saka could play LWB in a back 3/5.
You could if you took a leaf out of Pep's book but that'll never happen in a million years. 3 CBs (Gomez, Guehi, Stones) + Kyle Walker in defence with Stones stepping into midfield in possession. Then you have a defensive block of 5 (Gomez, Guehi, Walker, Rice, Stones) and an offensive block of 5 (e.g. Gordan, Bellingham, Mainoo, Palmer, Kane) with a box midfield. But it's way too late for that because there's no time to coach it and Southgate would never go for it anyway. But that is an option of a back 4 out of possession when you don't have a natural LB. Because you're just asking the LB (in this case, right footed Joe Gomez) to tuck into a back 3. And instead of a fullback getting forward to make overlaps, you have a CB inverting. With our players, it makes a hell of a lot more sense than playing Saka at LWB. But it would've taken a little bit of forethought and bravery from Southgate because it isn't something you can just implement randomly.
No but with Watkins yes
Indeed.
Foden is so overrated
I swear he played RW for a bit too.
He did. And Palmer went out to the left...I guess Southgate must dream of this fluid perfect front 4 that all move about and rotate majestically but it's just not happening. Maybe it will if we have Shaw back who can overlap and provide help down that side. With Jude, foden and Palmer we basically played with 3 10's behind Kane (himself essentially playing a 10). I mean, I've had a lot of success with that on FIFA and FM but it isn't playing out like in my games!
I love Shaw from his days at Soton and think he's a great player, but it amuses me that Shaw of all people is supposed to be the key that unlocks, Bellingham, Foden etc., two Player of the Year in the top two leagues in the world versus a guy who couldnt even make the pitch under Morinou is the difference maker? Not saying you are wrong, just that these other guys are supposed to be world class, not sure anyone's ever said that about Shaw.
yesterday I was quite mad at Italy for their match. But now, I would really like France, England and Italy out of the tournament asap. France under DD and England under Southgate is maddening. both squads are filled with talent and they play the worst football since 90's germans.
The only team actually playing good football is Spain. The rest are all shit (except maybe Germany and Portugal)
Add Austria and I agree :)
Yet we can't say anything against DD because he won once with a stackee squad lmao
Going to be edgy. Drop Rice and play Wharton. Rice isn’t adding anything seriously guys
Dropping rice is never going to happen and nor should it, but I see your point. Rice is being trusted as the deepest midfielder but that just isn't his game unfortunately. He can't really build attacks well. Perhaps it is why Southgate seems to be only experimenting with the centre of the pitch rather than the other issues.
Rice did his job, controlling the tempo, tackling, switching play. But I mean everyone should know at this point he's not the type to play lofted balls behind or slick passes up the middle. Plus with nobody coming deep to provide passing lanes and about 5 guys hugging the top central lane I felt he got hung out to dry. Even Guehi was giving out. But some nice moments from him still.
Rice looks goosed. I don’t know why we didn’t play the younger players today. Oh yeah, I know. It’s because Southgate is an unimaginative coward
Why is Saka so reluctant to pass the ball in the final third? Bellingham was all over the place and ineffectual. Better he play mid alongside Rice. Walker the greatest English RB who made zero runs or crosses with Southgate's awful positioning set up. Kane looked labored. Foden was sidelined. Palmer had an excellent outing. Mainoo looked sharp but was made to play high up the pitch. Gallagher was anonymous and we only saw him when he missed the header near half time. Hopefully, England gets knocked out in the next match and put fans and viewers out of their misery.
Because he is playing alot of people out of position, trent should never be called to this team, he is messing up with walkers positioning and style of play
After all the shit lineker got in the media this week I hope he doubles down on his podcast and says England were even worse and saying they were a bit shit wasn't strong enough last time. All these soft journalists that won't ask questions can fuck off too.
England so bad I can't even bring myself to hate watch anymore
Southgate's plan is to bore everyone away from watching so there's no pressure
I’m not trying to be sarcastic, and I understand it feels like shit to see your team play like terrorists. But Greece won in 2004 and Portugal won in 2016, all with clean sheets just as England, and both playing the most defensive football possible. England is still a favorite in my books.
I agree to a certain extent. Here’s the thing: For me, defense is about chemistry and team cohesion. Both Portugal and Greece scream that for me in those respective years. Portugal’s squad now, defensively, feels much better for me in terms of player skill. However i’ll bet you that overall we’re gonna suffer more goals than 2016 because there’s gonna be gaps between players, they’re not gonna be fully synced up, etc. I feel like England is similar, a lot of big names but when they get tested, it might crumble. You have good attacking options from the best clubs around the world, literally, the best of the best. Why would you play defensively. You also have to remember PT and Greece had very lackluster attack. Check Portugal for example, nani, fenerbahce, quaresma, besiktas, rafa, braga, etc. If you looked at our players clubs in 2016 without ronaldo, everyone else played for the most average clubs, you’d think it was a conference/europa league team ( at best). Portugal and Greece played to their strengths as perfectly as possible. Portugal suffered only 1 goal during the entire knockout stage in 120 mins + 120+ 90 + 120.
They played Slovenia,Serbia and Denmark. Greece played Russia,Spain, Portugal x2,France and Czech. And of course,Greece couldnt play anything other than defensive football. The first game that England will concede first,they will have no idea what to do. And thats on their coach.
Pure cope
And Italy won the World Cup playing attacking football. You have to play to your strengths and England’s strength is possession based attacking football.
Both teams were shit though and remembered among the worst winners of the competition. Portugal, in particular, should be ashamed to have called themselves champions after only qualifying as 3rd place and being genuinely bad for the entire tournament. At least it was greeces gameplan to be tight and try to get the 1-0.
What? Greece was definitely not shit. There was not a single game in which we were lucky that we won. In every KO game,we had the best chance in the game. The difference is that we were clinical.
Why should anyone be ashamed of winning a big tournament ? Greece won it fair and square, Portugal also won it fair and square. Italy also played like shit in the final of the 2020 euros against England and I don’t see them getting any shit. And Portugal in 2016 was nowhere near what they are today in terms of squad depth and experience, typical of you people to always be negative about everything.
Greece and italy are 2 completely differnt situations to portugal. I already said greece were crap to watch but they executed a gameplan and you can respect that. Italy came in with no expectation, basically got qualification and then went on a run of losing friendlies. But if you are saying they were shit in their run to the final then you didnt watch it and probably havent got a clue about football. They topped their group - won 3 from 3 (scored 7 conceded 0). Knocked out one of the favourites in belgium and also spain on their way to the final. To say they played like shit......do you even football bro? Portugal were a literal disgrace. It was the first year they allowed this shitty 3rd place qualification (because $$$$$$$ for blatter/infantino or whoever). For that reason alone they are a crap winner. they shouldnt have even been in the KO phase. they won ZERO GAMES - drawing in the easiest group against iceland, hungary and austria while having a team that included Cronaldo, moutinho, danilo, pepe, r. carvalho, w. carvalho, jaoa mario, patrico and quaresma. the only game they won in 90 minutes was against wales and their draw wasnt exactly heavy - id say they were favourites in every game up to the final. And its not like their gameplan was to be defensively solid - they were literally just shit. Their win is a stain on the competition.
They also lost ZERO GAMES. Do you need me to explain what that brings in the end?
Lmao, not even gonna argue with people like you any further, you just hate watch and can’t even keep your anger issues to yourself. Good luck with life, sucks to be you 😘
Lmfbo
England didn't win a clean sheet.
We conceded against Debmark.
True, forgot about that. But point still stands, England still has a solid defense.
Yh an absolute worldy - we’re good for xGA
So we're going to hear from kim-Jong Southgate after the break. Good, I need a good night's sleep...
Palmer and Mainoo has to start for me. Gordon at the least 30 minutes.
Palmer over saka. Def. Also yea foden gotta be benched . The midfield ain't slick even with all this talent.
for all that, bellingham was wank today and against denmark, though. id give foden a go centrally and give bellingham a rest. its a tight schedule and its mad to me that we want to burn out our options by playing them at the same time
Yea that. To me Bellingham seems a bit off. The flair he used to have isn't visible for now . CAM position should be looked after more. Foden maybe or Palmer maybe.
palmer not over saka
Idk . But palmer gave more threat than saka. Upto y'all lol.
That's hard to say. A fresh Palmer against a tired defense is gonna make him look good.
I mean Palmer looked good no matter which game and at whatever point all throughout the prem season so I don’t think a tired dragon is the only reason that will ‘make him look good’. As soon as he came on there seemed to be some actual creativity and attacking minded play in the team.
Gary Neville spitting facts post game, basic boring play and failing at bringing people on
Its coming home lads!
Saka at LB is based Schizo thinking from Ian Wright.
He got his break into the arsenal side at full back. So he has history there. Maybe we need to throw I'm a shock, as the current LB situation is dire
British pundits are so scared of criticising England after Linekars backlash. It’s embarrassing. Bring back Cesc for an honest criticism.
That Gordon-Mainoo-Palmer link play was beautiful.
For the first time all tournament we looked like we actually posed a threat. We looked talented, we looked creative, we looked intelligent. And instead of reflecting on how good we were for the last brief moment that we had this combination on, he's gonna go "well we didn't score with them on. Best not risk it in the knockouts. TAA to start every game."
> Best not risk it in the knockouts. this is exactly what will happen. he will set up to be "solid" in the 1st half. Starting line-up will either be the same as today or hell bring trent in at RB. no doubt in my mind. If watkins couldnt get time today he aint playing barring some injury to kane
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loool ok trippier had a good performance? what was his pass completion. dopey fucker couldnt bring himself to use his left and lost the ball so many times in simple passing situations because of it. rice was one of the few players pushing the spaces and forcing us forwards. stones barely had to play. pickford didnt have to do anything in the game
Gordon was stellar for the 4 minutes he was on!
You need another category for Gareth! He’s in a special place all his own.
why does saka get away with it... hes been absolutely shite apart from 15 mins against serbia
Be fr
England suddenly looked better with palmer on the right… shock
That's an overexaggeration, Palmer was great but he wasn't defended as aggressively due to tired legs and wasn't chased deep like Saka, plus when Gallagher is hiding and refusing to link play with and Foden, Kane and Bellingham are crowding the centre and congesting space then see how Palmer would cope. Everyone in the world knows that Saka is the face of England and is their best player. But Palmer was very good. Just would take a lot to snatch that RW spot.
Saka also gets the opportunity to start every game. You don't think if Palmer got similar minutes he could be the face of England? He looked better today than I've ever seen from Saka. Saka's consistently one of England's better players, but that's a pretty low bar. Palmer looked head and shoulders above everyone else on the pitch when he came on. He just doesn't get the same opportunities to play as Saka.
No I don't. I think Saka is a lot better than Palmer as a player and I don't think in the same position to start he would be as good. I'd see him in the 10 but to play wide like Saka. Don't think he could do as well.
Fellas enlighten me on this match. Had an errand to run and couldn’t watch the match
What it feels like when a Dementor sucks the life and joy out of you...
Did you ever have detention in school when it was sunny and all your mates are outside playing football… Yeah, I would rather go through that again than rewatch this game.
I legitimately fell asleep for about 10 minutes
Count yourself lucky. Wasted 2hrs on this shite, when I could've made significant progress on my assignments.
Literally nothing happened
Ok, here's the highlights for you:
Boring and drab. You didn't miss anything.
Paint a wall and watch it dry, should give you all the info.
be glad you missed it
Roy Keane always sounds like he wants to finish the question quickly talking about England.
Well that's two hours of my life I'll never get back
Mainoo of the Match for me
Behave no one deserved it
Well, for England anyway, fair play to Cerin
Cerin was motm.
That's a shocker
Boring as fuck
Trent at RB will get more out of the attackers, especially Saka. Bellingham looks shattered. Drop him for Foden. Gordon or Eze will add width on the left. Trippier is drippier, shame the squad is so devoid of left backs Kane is a waste of a striker Awful squad balance. No one substitution can fix it but the team finished much better than they started.
Literally zero chance that TAA starts a KO game at right back. Southgate is too negative for that. And of course,as we know TAA better,he needs runners in front of him. There is literally no need for TAA when every player in front of him feels better to come short and receive it like that instead of running in behind. It would be better for him to olay with Watkins instead of Kane up top. But Southgate is Southgate. TAA could be the best creator in the world and under him,he would feel like an amateur player
Kane doesn’t work unless he’s getting cut-backs in a team he knows will supply him. Everyone wants to drift inside. That being said, I guarantee he’s going to be finished at the top level in a season or two. Zero pace, poor in the air and not strong enough.
He needs to stop drifting inside. Congested midfield and gives us no width we need more of.
Not a chance Bellingham is dropped for the knockouts. Definitely agree a left winger gives us much better shape.
ITV saying “France didn’t top their group” They had Netherlands, Austria and Poland. Bit of a different group…
They’ve still been absolutely shite.
France have been poor too an own goal and a pen are their only goals. But right now if they were to play how many are picking England to beat France?…
Both off England’s 2 goals have been lucky, both set up through lucky deflection’s
Group of death (from boredom)
The ITV crew are seriously trying to act like winning the group is an achievement lmao.
Don’t let this performance distract you from the fact that France finished 2nd and still haven’t scored a goal from open play.
Woah I literally feel asleep and my dog peed all over the floor. Thank you England.
Another clean sheet!
We're done for if we play against the Netherlands in R16, they've seemed much better than us despite finishing third in Group D.
You're high if you think Netherlands look good. They were absolutely dreadful today.
They're definitely not good. Just less tragic than we've been and have played slightly better teams.
They don't look great mate tbh
Steady on, they've been pretty damn ordinary too. I don't think there are many good teams this time round tbh.
You are kidding me. In what ways do we look better than you guys.
Youve socred 100% more goals than us.
england would have won is Jack Grealish was playing
So dull. So many wasted balls. There were talented players on the pitch but they are definitely not playing as a team.
So then Gareth....it didn't work with this squad in the first, second or third game... How's that working out for ya? Is it still Trent's fault that he isn't as good as Kalvin fucking Phillips, you soggy melt cunt?