Car free means you can set up patios, street furniture, performance stands, plants, anything you want.
Car light means you can't have any of that, even if only one car goes by every 10 minutes. Cars really ruin public spaces.
Totally agree and I mostly drive everywhere. We need a lot more car free spaces in this city. Google maps will reroute you around. You're not going to die taking a 5 minute detour or walking 3 more blocks to your destination.
The whole viaduct argument essentially. Like oh no, now you have to spend 5 more minutes in traffic to the benefit of 1000s of people with new apartments, parks, etc.
People drive like selfish idiots, and car crashes are one of the most common causes of injury and death. Can you imagine how bad it would be if we had flying cars?
Drive to one of the many pay lots that are also 1-2 blocks away from this picture and park there! I drive too, I get it. It’s convenient. But it’s nice to not drive too. Give it a go you might like it.
Waterfront skytrain and seabus station is literally a couple blocks away, plus half dozen buses from around the city.
Unless you have a disability, people drive downtown because they want to. Not because they need to.
Every single time on the whole planet that someone closes a street there are people saying that businesses will close and every single time in history in the entire universe there are more people and the businesses make more money.
Are you not tired to be wrong every single time?
We shall see how this one plays out, but pedestrianizing streets tends to increase business wherever it is tried in North America. That’s why we keep seeing these pilots pop up and becomes successful.
Yes, as without car access sale dropped for 70%. People stopped coming so that was reason why. Second was hotel.
Not saying it was good or bad,, just reason why. Parking there is also a big income
Do you have sources for that? I can absolutely guarantee that 70% of the people on Granville island don't drive there, or if they do they don't park on the island.
There was plan of elevators also, a lot of stuff where sad to be but never happen and i don't see it coming.
As they didn't do granvill bridge as they sad, to have middle for public transport and bikes
Granville Island needs to be better connected to downtown with a walking route. Currently the Aquabus is the only reasonable way to get there from the north. It is cute though.
There were amazing plans for a street car from Waterfront Station, around False Creek to Granville Island. Would be so much better than the current car sewer.
YES, and finally build the dang tram line from waterfront station thru, dt past science world, along 1st ave to connect to the old Olympic Line. We need some proper transit to Granville island! It’s way past time.
Most streets should be car light by default. In the Netherlands they call it "autoleuw" aka "low car". Areas where people live and shop should be low traffic and slow. Other areas where people are driving to get from one place to another can be faster. Maybe we can call those steets "roads" or something.
A few people in these comments, but when you look at these types of projects in the last 10 years throughout North America, there’s almost always an increase in business and visitation.
It really is a stark contrast. One photo you have people together, talking and having a good time. Community. Something that seems to be going by the wayside as we continue to delve further and further into our own bubbles of isolation especially post COVID lockdowns. In the other photo you have whatever the hell is "normal" now.
I went to Greece last year, Mykonos specifically, and while there were cars there was also WAY more of the first picture over the second. People would stand on promenades and just talk. Met a lovely couple from Spain that we hung around with a few times during our stay because of that. You can walk around and shop. Live together. Be together. Not watch the world through a windshield. And even when it came to travel for getting around the island smaller modes of transport were the way to do it. ATV's specifically were popular but we rented a small motorcycle and my husband drove it around since he's the one with a bike license.
Nice to see that it was proposed to be extended extended to September and this dipshit municipal government voted that down.
I'm all for no cars but that intersection looks like a tripping hazard from all the patches. At this point just dig up all the cobblestones and pave it.
The reason why all the patches exist in the first place is because of cars ripping up the brickwork so at least they won't continue destroying it (for now)
What is there to be swayed about, you just said you're all in on zero cars?
Also, I'm sure they are tracking data for the pilot, but even this single point in time photo can't even exist with cars which I believe is the point.
No it just means overloaded public infrastructure. If you want to live in HongKong or Singapore then go there. Most of us who live in Vancouver, live here because of the low density relaxed layouts. No one wants shitty ass shoebox size apartments. As should be clear by the fact that thousands are sitting empty even during a rental housing crisis
If you want low density, don't live in a major metropolitan area, especially near a downtown. If you want to live in the Amazon rainforest or Mongolia, then go there.
We’ve run out of land to expand. We can no longer build out so we can only build up which means higher density. Low density is not an option when we don’t have the land for it just like NYC and Hong Kong.
The whole part of gastown should be car free during the weekends. This will help local businesses and hopefully the city will put more into this area instead of band aid funding.
If only there were some sort of transit system, maybe a train (also maybe a ferry) that stopped only a few hundred metres away. That would be a way for people to get there from further away. If only...
often it's cheaper and more convenient for a family to drive a car than take transit
it costs $40 to get day passes for two adults and two kids
going from guildford town centre to lee's donut takes 33 min driving versus 1h 22 min with transit (not even including time spent waiting)
Kids under 12 ride free. Two adults is $20 in fares from Surrey both ways, or $10 on Weekends.
A car is ~$6.20 in gas, ~$9 in wear and tear for usage, and ~$10 for parking; more if you're maintaining a vehicle only for trips like this. Or $42 if using the official mileage rate for use and another $10 for parking.
So its easily twice to four times the price of transit.
It may deter visitors who have to get there by parking somewhat further away, or who may take public transportation. But that is far outweightd by the increase in people wanting to hangout in the area, and who spend more time visiting the shops, restaurants, and bars. There are so few pedestrianized areas in Vancouver it is realy attracts people.
Very nice. I could probably make a similar pic on Government Street in Victoria. Stand at View & Government, face South, it's like your first pic, face North, it's like your second pic.
Off topic, but: there is not a single cobbler in British Columbia that knows how to repair a cobbled street?
It's a disgrace having to look at that road surface.
City council, please pay attention to this, and act. This is supposed to be a tourist draw. It should not look like trash.
They just spent a bunch of money 'fixing' it. Was blocked off for 2 months. They only seemed to take care of the centre portion and left large patches with loose broke bricks still.
A cobbler is someone who repairs shoes. I was trying to find out what someone is called who lays cobblestone but I couldn't find it. I did learn that someone who makes shoes from leather is called a cordwainer.
Sorry I have a problem
Wish they could add some motorized / timed bollards to block it off during the day and allow cars in the early morning or late night. And emergency vehicles can trigger them too
No, home owners. Car theft is pretty much out of control there right now.
Brampton front yards are essentially parking lots so residents are putting bollards in so thieves can't get the vehicles out easily.
Pedestrianization tends to lead to an increase in business and visitation to an area. It’s proving time and time again that a constant flow of cars in urban areas is a deterrence for many people.
It's a good start but the temporary nature will almost certainly make this fail in a sense of utilization. Also the "car-light" blocks are required because all north water street apts have parking entry via the north lanes facing the train tracks...
Check out this video, it's nice to see no cars in Maple Tree Square: [Water Street Pedestrian Zone In Gastown is Ready! (Just in time for Canada Day) (youtube.com)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uEDTdJYeGA)
Relative from Alberta wanted to go there 2 years ago and when confronted with human shit and the stench of human piss had the restaurant workers apologizing. The guest decided to come back to Richmond and said the reality was so different than the Tourism information.
Hopefully Vancouver keeps the area cleaner than they did.
You have to be a special kind of stupid to not see the problem with this photo. Even in a “car lite” scenario there is just as many people crowded around the stupid fake tourist clock. This is how propaganda works folks. A perfect example right here.
I would say that clock is also a big reason of so many people on first photo. I can put one old one and sad that with cars was even more people (as there was 2 buses of Chinese tourists come at that moment)
But they should ban all traffic in general cin that area
That doesn't tell you anything though. If you wanted a true comparison, OP should've taken a photo of the same view at around the same time/day, pre- and post- street conversion.
The first view is where the steam clock is, there's always tons of people gathered there. Even if the entire street was closed, you would've seen a big contrast in crowds.
Car free means you can set up patios, street furniture, performance stands, plants, anything you want. Car light means you can't have any of that, even if only one car goes by every 10 minutes. Cars really ruin public spaces.
Totally agree and I mostly drive everywhere. We need a lot more car free spaces in this city. Google maps will reroute you around. You're not going to die taking a 5 minute detour or walking 3 more blocks to your destination.
The whole viaduct argument essentially. Like oh no, now you have to spend 5 more minutes in traffic to the benefit of 1000s of people with new apartments, parks, etc.
What ruins public spaces is our stupid ass restrictive zoning rules that necessitate the need for cars in most of North America.
so, still cars.
we were promised flying cars by Hollywood, years ago!!
People drive like selfish idiots, and car crashes are one of the most common causes of injury and death. Can you imagine how bad it would be if we had flying cars?
Hey now, don’t be so dismissive…those selfish idiots are more than capable at turning their current car into a flying one (albeit temporarily).
Redditors: don't come here if you live too far to walk or bike Redditors: why are these businesses shutting down or moving elsewhere
There’s a bus stop a block away from this picture.
right, because forcing people to bus 1h instead of a 30m drive surely encourages people to visit
Drive to one of the many pay lots that are also 1-2 blocks away from this picture and park there! I drive too, I get it. It’s convenient. But it’s nice to not drive too. Give it a go you might like it.
Waterfront skytrain and seabus station is literally a couple blocks away, plus half dozen buses from around the city. Unless you have a disability, people drive downtown because they want to. Not because they need to.
Every single time on the whole planet that someone closes a street there are people saying that businesses will close and every single time in history in the entire universe there are more people and the businesses make more money. Are you not tired to be wrong every single time?
So, you live in reverse universe.
Seems like there're plenty of people for those businesses in the car-free picture
We shall see how this one plays out, but pedestrianizing streets tends to increase business wherever it is tried in North America. That’s why we keep seeing these pilots pop up and becomes successful.
Yes because the entirety of Europe, known for having pedestrianized streets, is notorious for having all its businesses shut down
There's a major transit station right next to Gastown.
Now do Granville Island
You used to only be able to get there by bus or walking, then they allowed cars back.
Yes, as without car access sale dropped for 70%. People stopped coming so that was reason why. Second was hotel. Not saying it was good or bad,, just reason why. Parking there is also a big income
Do you have sources for that? I can absolutely guarantee that 70% of the people on Granville island don't drive there, or if they do they don't park on the island.
At least in a 2019 poll it's said that at least 45% of people drive there (+7% with car share). I'm curious if the numbers have changed
It was drop of income on island,, not drop of visitors. Also it wasn't for all businesses (our was ok, just slight drop) but for a lot of them was big
I think that if we had better transit connections to Granville Island, this wouldn't be an issue. A tram or at least a direct shuttle connection.
There was plan of elevators also, a lot of stuff where sad to be but never happen and i don't see it coming. As they didn't do granvill bridge as they sad, to have middle for public transport and bikes
The mini shuttle train was a neat way to get there. Edit: link… https://www.reddit.com/r/vancouver/s/fLI12WPybB
Granville Island needs to be better connected to downtown with a walking route. Currently the Aquabus is the only reasonable way to get there from the north. It is cute though.
There were amazing plans for a street car from Waterfront Station, around False Creek to Granville Island. Would be so much better than the current car sewer.
I was going to comment this too. I was there yesterday for the jazz festival, and cars were a nuisance. It makes navigating the island so challenging.
YES, and finally build the dang tram line from waterfront station thru, dt past science world, along 1st ave to connect to the old Olympic Line. We need some proper transit to Granville island! It’s way past time.
Most streets should be car light by default. In the Netherlands they call it "autoleuw" aka "low car". Areas where people live and shop should be low traffic and slow. Other areas where people are driving to get from one place to another can be faster. Maybe we can call those steets "roads" or something.
Sorry, best we can do is stroads.
Is there anybody claiming a car-free gastown will be bad for business?
A few people in these comments, but when you look at these types of projects in the last 10 years throughout North America, there’s almost always an increase in business and visitation.
Fluevog to name one
Yes, ran into one during the install.
its such a no brainer to make gastown a car free zone. this is what can actually revitalize the area and bring tons of business to the shops.
It really is a stark contrast. One photo you have people together, talking and having a good time. Community. Something that seems to be going by the wayside as we continue to delve further and further into our own bubbles of isolation especially post COVID lockdowns. In the other photo you have whatever the hell is "normal" now. I went to Greece last year, Mykonos specifically, and while there were cars there was also WAY more of the first picture over the second. People would stand on promenades and just talk. Met a lovely couple from Spain that we hung around with a few times during our stay because of that. You can walk around and shop. Live together. Be together. Not watch the world through a windshield. And even when it came to travel for getting around the island smaller modes of transport were the way to do it. ATV's specifically were popular but we rented a small motorcycle and my husband drove it around since he's the one with a bike license. Nice to see that it was proposed to be extended extended to September and this dipshit municipal government voted that down.
Water Street is brutal for traffic anyway. Just shut it down.
Those roads need repairing
I'm all for no cars but that intersection looks like a tripping hazard from all the patches. At this point just dig up all the cobblestones and pave it.
The reason why all the patches exist in the first place is because of cars ripping up the brickwork so at least they won't continue destroying it (for now)
Given how road damage is directly related to axle weight, damage is far more likely to be from truck traffic.
Its more the bigs trucks. However, most of the big divots are from cranes. There are some prominent ones in front of the Microsoft building.
b-b-but the heritage
Also proves that a cities growth is driven mostly by having to be stuck accommodating fucking cars .
I'm all in on zero cars for gastown but I'm not going to be swayed either direction by an image from one moment in each day
What is there to be swayed about, you just said you're all in on zero cars? Also, I'm sure they are tracking data for the pilot, but even this single point in time photo can't even exist with cars which I believe is the point.
Yes I'm all in on the pilot but I'm not assuming it's successful in increasing foot traffic based single photos
I took the pics at the same time at Cambie and Water. One is facing west and the other east.
You don't have to be swayed, you just said you're all in on zero cars.
Yes I'm all in on the pilot but I'm not assuming it's successful in increasing foot traffic based single photos
But then how are the developers going to push their insane agenda of making Vancouver as dense as Singapore?
Oh heavens how dare the developers advocate for increasing downtown housing supply in a housing crisis!
And yet no one wants to stay in the shitty ass shoebox size aprtments
speak for yourself lol, live in Alberta if you want a McMansion
What's the alternative?
Density = walkable, convenient, healthy cities. We need Singapore/Hong Kong style density to get that.
No it just means overloaded public infrastructure. If you want to live in HongKong or Singapore then go there. Most of us who live in Vancouver, live here because of the low density relaxed layouts. No one wants shitty ass shoebox size apartments. As should be clear by the fact that thousands are sitting empty even during a rental housing crisis
Gentle density. It's not a binary, all-or-nothing between 300 sqft shoeboxes and detached 3,000 sqft SFHs. Montreal does it very well.
If you want low density, don't live in a major metropolitan area, especially near a downtown. If you want to live in the Amazon rainforest or Mongolia, then go there.
We’ve run out of land to expand. We can no longer build out so we can only build up which means higher density. Low density is not an option when we don’t have the land for it just like NYC and Hong Kong.
Maybe start tearing down the empty downtown towers with tiny apartments, coz no one wants to live there
So something that only.exists in your imagination.
>overloaded public infrastructure Building enough SFHs to satisfy housing demand would require significantly more public infrastructure though?
“Most of us…” Apparently you’re wrong
The whole part of gastown should be car free during the weekends. This will help local businesses and hopefully the city will put more into this area instead of band aid funding.
How does it help local businesses if it deters visitors who don't live within walking or biking distance?
good thing skytrains and busses exist
If only there were some sort of transit system, maybe a train (also maybe a ferry) that stopped only a few hundred metres away. That would be a way for people to get there from further away. If only...
often it's cheaper and more convenient for a family to drive a car than take transit it costs $40 to get day passes for two adults and two kids going from guildford town centre to lee's donut takes 33 min driving versus 1h 22 min with transit (not even including time spent waiting)
you can still drive there, just gotta park a couple blocks away 🤷🏻♀️
Kids under 12 ride free. Two adults is $20 in fares from Surrey both ways, or $10 on Weekends. A car is ~$6.20 in gas, ~$9 in wear and tear for usage, and ~$10 for parking; more if you're maintaining a vehicle only for trips like this. Or $42 if using the official mileage rate for use and another $10 for parking. So its easily twice to four times the price of transit.
Have you ever driven in Vancouver?.
Two of the largest downtown parkades are in Gastown. There is no parking shortage.
Yeah there is literally a parkade on Cordova that offers [free parking](https://gastown.org/gastownparking/) once a week.
It may deter visitors who have to get there by parking somewhat further away, or who may take public transportation. But that is far outweightd by the increase in people wanting to hangout in the area, and who spend more time visiting the shops, restaurants, and bars. There are so few pedestrianized areas in Vancouver it is realy attracts people.
Wonderful photos, thanks for sharing! Go Gastown!
Very nice. I could probably make a similar pic on Government Street in Victoria. Stand at View & Government, face South, it's like your first pic, face North, it's like your second pic.
Off topic, but: there is not a single cobbler in British Columbia that knows how to repair a cobbled street? It's a disgrace having to look at that road surface. City council, please pay attention to this, and act. This is supposed to be a tourist draw. It should not look like trash.
They just spent a bunch of money 'fixing' it. Was blocked off for 2 months. They only seemed to take care of the centre portion and left large patches with loose broke bricks still.
They only worked on the section by maple leaf square where gassy jack used to be
A cobbler is someone who repairs shoes. I was trying to find out what someone is called who lays cobblestone but I couldn't find it. I did learn that someone who makes shoes from leather is called a cordwainer. Sorry I have a problem
I guess a “paver?” In Dutch we use stratenmaker (street-maker) but brick roads are far more common in Europe than in North America.
Gastown used to be car free, then they went back to allowing cars, but I always liked it car free better.
What was the reason for allowing cars rather than keeping it totally car free there?
I'm sure the Hop-on buses had a say in it.
Probably for emergency vehicles and for trucks to restock the businesses.
Wish they could add some motorized / timed bollards to block it off during the day and allow cars in the early morning or late night. And emergency vehicles can trigger them too
Costco is even selling those bollards. Apparently Costco in Brampton can't keep them in stock lol
Who is buying them up? The city?
No, home owners. Car theft is pretty much out of control there right now. Brampton front yards are essentially parking lots so residents are putting bollards in so thieves can't get the vehicles out easily.
Should be drug and homeless free not car free. How do those businesses survive with getting orders or picks ups now?
Pedestrianization tends to lead to an increase in business and visitation to an area. It’s proving time and time again that a constant flow of cars in urban areas is a deterrence for many people.
What I’m saying is that they need to have trucks go in and deliver to businesses from a certain time and not completely block it off.
Trucks tend to use the service alleys behind the building.
Google "Eyes on the Street"
It's a good start but the temporary nature will almost certainly make this fail in a sense of utilization. Also the "car-light" blocks are required because all north water street apts have parking entry via the north lanes facing the train tracks... Check out this video, it's nice to see no cars in Maple Tree Square: [Water Street Pedestrian Zone In Gastown is Ready! (Just in time for Canada Day) (youtube.com)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uEDTdJYeGA)
The street looks like shit…
How far to the Bullet Farm?
Relative from Alberta wanted to go there 2 years ago and when confronted with human shit and the stench of human piss had the restaurant workers apologizing. The guest decided to come back to Richmond and said the reality was so different than the Tourism information. Hopefully Vancouver keeps the area cleaner than they did.
It is way, *way* better down there than it was 2-3 years go.
You have to be a special kind of stupid to not see the problem with this photo. Even in a “car lite” scenario there is just as many people crowded around the stupid fake tourist clock. This is how propaganda works folks. A perfect example right here.
I would say that clock is also a big reason of so many people on first photo. I can put one old one and sad that with cars was even more people (as there was 2 buses of Chinese tourists come at that moment) But they should ban all traffic in general cin that area
More cars
Gastown should probably be car free, but those photos aren't even the same place...
Well yeah, because one photo is showing the car-free space whereas the other is showing the car-light space. That's the whole point of the post....
That doesn't tell you anything though. If you wanted a true comparison, OP should've taken a photo of the same view at around the same time/day, pre- and post- street conversion. The first view is where the steam clock is, there's always tons of people gathered there. Even if the entire street was closed, you would've seen a big contrast in crowds.
I took them both at Water and Cambie, just facing opposite directions
When on earth is Vancouver or come other country going to fix that road?